The Second Battle For The Chin'toka System

Star Trek Deep Space Nine Season 7 The Changing Face of Evil Episode 170

[@williamjackson6705]

Salome Jens doesn`t get enough praise . Her performance as The Founder is masterful. Her voice is incredible.

[@jaqenhghar2970]

I hope she can reprise the role in some of these Nu Trek series coming out.

[@Enruler]

I was really hoping she'd have a part in Picard Season 3, but alas she did not. Loved to hate her character, she played it well.@@jaqenhghar2970

[@jasongould04]

She’s just not as famous as Louise Fletcher but equally as good

[@crappyatlife]

Imagine being named after lunch meat

[@AllknowingUnknown]

Easily one of my favorites

[@STNeish]

The look on Sisko's face as he's leaving the bridge... clearly he's thinking about the LAST time he saw a scene like that.

[@HacksignKT]

Ah wolf?

[@Aristede]

Sisko is certainly remembering Wolf 359...not just reminiscing about a ship he was fond of.

[@HacksignKT]

@@Aristede ty

[@XX-sp3tt]

Of course the Borg are supposed to be inherently more terrifying because of how utterly IMPERSONAL it all is. You're just raw material to them.

[@lima6638]

@@Aristede They should of played on this and do one final character building for Sisko. Remembering the Saratoga and Defiant like this should of had a major effect on him which they don't use.

[@SheldonAdama17]

On Star Trek, the ship is a character just as much as the people. When Defiant got destroyed it hurt

[@jamieolberding7731]

SheldonAdama17 10 months ago Same here too.

[@Condor-uc2lw]

Apart from Discovery hope that thing gets demollished

[@jamieolberding7731]

@@Condor-uc2lw Nobody dares mention "Star Trek: Discovery!" It's the WORST new Star Trek Show EVER!!!

[@Sovereign01]

@@jamieolberding7731 They said that about Enterprise too! 😂

[@jamieolberding7731]

@@Sovereign01 I really enjoyed watching "Star Trek: Enterprise", which has a lot of really good episodes. It's not as bad as both "Star Trek: Discovery" and "Star Trek: Picard!"

[@KGillis]

I'm betting that the reason the female founder chose not to destroy the escape pods is because she couldn't chance Odo being in one of them. The Breen, of course, wouldn't understand, so she needed to come up with a plausible excuse.

[@danielbyrne5402]

Bad bet, they could have captured the pods if that were the case, she gave her reasoning

[@greyjedi1272]

I'd buy that, those troops were more pissed than anything else.

[@drockjr]

She gave her reasoning. Psy Ops is real

[@Starvino]

@@greyjedi1272 given that over 300 ships were completely demolished in probably a half an hour, probably less given the playout of the show, would definitely send scared troops back. 300 lost in less time than the battle of Wolf 359, and it being obvious that the Dominion COULD have wiped up the survivors, but decided it wasn’t worth the time. She made the right call sans the Cardassians betrayal

[@TheMalchikjae]

I didn't even think of that. Congratulations.

[@scottdavidlowe]

For me, the tone with which Sisko says, "Abandon ship" is acting at it's finest. He knows what he has to do, but it kills him to do it.

[@VNLAGRLLA]

Right..Avery acted this scene with perfection. His inflection is perfect.

[@jamesspring4610]

Agreed. It's the one order Sisko doesn't want to give. Avery Brooks was awesome in this scene.

[@AF-nc2fc]

He gave that order in the pilot episode, too.

[@tdog652041]

Worse order a captain has to issue.

[@Howlrunner82]

2 crewman down. But the doc has no time for them. He has to wait until someone important goes down 🤔😎🤣

[@RurouniKalain]

I mean it was his wife. xD

[@tantantantan3991]

Power of the pussy

[@Gabryal77]

You don't leave your station without permission, he was clearly at a station

[@Peichen01]

KalainsHouse Kira and Julian?

[@Deadpool_64]

@@Peichen01 In real life they were married at the time. The baby she was pregnant with before was his in real life, that's why they always made little inside jokes like Kira yelling at Julian "well you're responsible for this!" Lol.

[@spiritofthewolf15x]

Seeing the Defiant turn to protect her escape pods, even if it was completely by chance always makes me tear up...

[@jamesspring4610]

Shielding her crew so they could get to safety. An honorable death, making sure that history never forgets the name.....Defiant.

[@michaelgreenwood3413]

@@jamesspring4610 The Dominion sure as hell didn't when her Successor shows up.

[@SEMAJH106]

I never thought of that 😭😭😭

[@DavidKnowles0]

That make me wish her successor was something even meaner than the Defiant class. @@michaelgreenwood3413

[@blacktronpavel]

Good catch

[@danielhausser8038]

I just love the Defiant's quantum torpedoes. That Breen ship gets torn in half and the whole picture shakes.

[@tdog652041]

Never noticed that before, kinda gives you the hint as to how powerful those torpedoes were.

[@St_AngusYoung]

Suddenly ships no longer have shields which is very noticeable in a lot of DS9 battle scenes. They're still very well done though.

[@justinchan6594]

@@St_AngusYoung it was too expensive to render shields on alll the ships during the battle scenes so they decided to take them all out and pretend they were there

[@rdubayoo]

I would assume quantum torpedoes are too powerful to be stopped by shields. That is to say, whatever protection shields provide is not nearly enough.

[@cmj0929]

@@justinchan6594 that’s probably why they said the jem’hadar beams could penetrate shields early on so they didn’t have to render them later

[@talkaboutwacky]

The CGI space battles of DS9 STILL look impressive after 20 years

[@johntorrington2672]

30 years ago...

[@keithallver2450]

Watching the mighty Defiant be destroyed was for me one of the saddest moments in Star Trek history.

[@paulm.gilbert1096]

Keith, I've always wondered, if the Dominion found it that easy to defeat the Defiance, what chance would the Defiance have had against the Borg. They adapt then assimilate. See my point?

[@danivarius]

Paul M. Gilbert Defiant, not Defiance

[@martindevon3204]

@@paulm.gilbert1096 the Defiant class ships were intended to attack the Borg in swarms

[@Electricfox]

@@martindevon3204 One thing we never see used is that the front nose of the Defiant is where the torpedoes are stored and it could be fired off as one giant torpedo in an emergency. Obviously in this instance the Breen nailed the ships systems before such a thing could happen (that and it would require making a new model to do ;) )

[@DavidKnowles0]

@@Electricfox I always found that idea absolutely hilarious! I think it was the rapid fired pulse phasers which Starfleet thought would be effective against the borg. a squadron of defiants would be firing thousands of different frequency phasers at the borg every second, making impossible to adapt to the weapon.

[@jdunn813]

The abandon ship alarm gives me chills.

[@CapELarry]

Jeff Dunn It’s terrifying!

[@kieran1845]

RIGHT!? i love it

[@IIISentorIII]

i use this for my SMS incoming sound with a 1 Minute loop and a Repeating timer.

[@ZuluRomeo]

A special klaxon for a dire situation.

[@AshPrimeDCFC]

Holy hell, same! Proper shiver.

[@aaroncalhoun337]

I was stunned about this!. This is an example of why Deep Space 9 was the best Star Trek series.

[@-M0LE]

Aaron Calhoun except VOY was 10x better

[@snakeeyes20a]

Ds9 was the best for me, voy was too formulaic/episodic tng-lite

[@bjornjoseph]

Started slow but aged well

[@ericmorang3903]

Poor Captain Sisko. I believe he was quite fond of that ship.

[@Locktwiste72]

He helped design the thing.

[@DLordSadow]

@Joe Duke Which would have accomplished what exactly? As soon as the Defiant was hit by the Breen Energy Dampening weapon, she was instantly reduced to a defenseless, dead stick.

[@DLordSadow]

@Joe Duke Okay, why? What would that have accomplished? The Defiant still would have ended up disabled and then destroyed by the Breen.

[@jamieolberding7731]

@@Locktwiste72 It was a good tough little ship with a good crew.

[@TheWPhilosopher]

Yeah. Remember last time Weyoun? Sisko came back and won twice as hard. You've just taken his ship away. You know what will happen. The war is lost. If you'd just told the Breen leave the Defiant alone you might have stood a chance.

[@CharlesUrban]

"Nasty weapon you've got there. It'd be a shame if we adapted our ships to render it useless." "[Incomprehensible garbling]" "No, not like the Borg. We do it with style. And you most certainly did _not_ do that with my mother."

[@benlaskowski357]

"Abandon ship": that's an order no sailor on a warship ever wants to hear.

[@michaelmorton5698]

It's an order no Captain wants to issue. To a captain who has to make that call, he or she has failed their crew as well as the ship. Ships are as much characters as the people who crew them.

[@hobomike6935]

can't say the same for the captain of the real-life 2012 cruise ship _Costa Concordia._ what a coward; abandoning his passengers and crew to run to safety himself instead!

[@johnh2118]

Founders didn't realize that human beings are unpredictable when frightened. We can become docile, or as vicious as a 200 pound honey badger!

[@QixTheDS]

John H as Quark put it, “...will become as nasty and as violent as the most bloodthirsty Klingon.”

[@reason4being]

Honey badgers come in that size??

[@Geion]

@@reason4being no

[@ronaldrobertson2332]

"...Don't push the pinkskins to the thin ice!" -Shran

[@ortizmo]

Prelude to Axanar. 👍

[@Frenki94]

2:31 I love how the shot is focused on Sisko as he's getting all the information and seeing that he's gonna have to give an order no Captain wants to give.

[@apr8189]

And you can see and feel Sisko thinking back to what happened at Wolf 359 watching the Saratoga be destroyed by the Borg.

[@lawrencemadsen7148]

Dominion made a pretty bad mistake with their servants. Weyoun suggests destroying the escape pods and she says do the opposite. Rather than fighting it or quietly and begrudgingly obeying, his first instinct is to come up with a logical train of thought that validates her decision. Weyoun doesn't just tolerate her questionable choices: he enables them. It's what he's built to do.

[@akshin1556]

The Changelings created beings who would view them as infallible, never to be questioned - in other words, gods. I suppose that being surrounded by followers who mindlessly view everything you do as perfect is all well and good for a deity ... For a military leader, having subordinates who are incapable of speaking up when you're making bad decisions can be fatal.

[@LightLegion]

​@@akshin1556also fitting their reinforcements got wiped out in the worm hole by actual gods.... Or something close to them in that effect.

[@LuluDZulu]

@@LightLegionlol wiped out in the worm hole by the writers

[@happygimly6061]

One of my favorite scenes of DS9 is in Treachery Faith and the Great River when Odo tries to convince Weyoun that he's not a god by asking what if the founders only programmed him to blindly worship them. Weyoun completely unsettles Odo by simply replying "Of course they did. That's what god's do." The founders never thought that their servants blind unwavering unquestioning faith might actually come back to bite them when those extremely competent soldiers constantly fail to push back against suicidally bad decisions.

[@randomlyentertaining8287]

That but what he said does make sense to some extent.

[@davechurchill8711]

21 years later and this is still great so glad I spent 13.99 at woolys for this.

[@TheBigExclusive]

You can always replace lost ships, and technology. But it is not possible to replace lost life. Sparing the escape pods here was one of the biggest mistakes of the war. The founders thought it would demoralize the enemy, but it had the opposite effect. As we see later, it backfired as the Federation alliance rebuilt their ships, and came back even more determined to win.

[@Lwis]

They also didn't factor in that Klingons and Romulans were present, peoples who are never scared.

[@TheDjbz]

Plus letting those pods go lost them all potential info that could be extracted from high ranking officers. In fact destroying the ships at all was a dumb move as without power they could just beam the crews into space and have a fleet worth of enemy ships to examine and pull apart for spare bits

[@supremeownage8995]

I couldn't agree more. It's later in the series that you hear about the massive manpower issue facing the federation, and it's allies, with ships being mass produced but without any skilled personell to man them. Whereas the Dominion could essentially print people and ships without issue. They missed a big chance here to deal a crippling blow to their enemies. But of course they can't die, main characters have massive plot armour. You're not going to see the entire cast slaughtered in a single episode, especially in these pre-thrones days. :P

[@arcadion448]

Agreed, leaving no survivors would've spread the same amount of fear and deprived the Alliance of leaders like Sisko.

[@Cerbyo]

I think u are forgetting episodes like the ds9 assasin...the rogue soldier who killed his own. Among many other instances in the show where the integrity of the soldiers and hierarchy go batshit crazy after the Breen entered. I dont disagree that it was a mistake, but i dont thinkwe can fairly judge what the ultimate cost/gain ratio ended up being....its probably closer than we think.

[@HellHammerThrash]

I remember after watching the original television broadcast of this episode feeling pretty much dead inside for a span of about a week or so until (spoiler alert) they got the Sao Paulo and started kicking ass again..

[@CharlesUrban]

You felt dead inside because the energy-dampening weapons fried your internals. Then Starfleet Engineering figured out how to keep that from happening.

[@yes4motivation]

@@CharlesUrban it was a klingon that figured it out ....

[@andypetrovich2155]

I felt the same way watching episode. The final four season were so good.

[@Enkarashaddam]

Yeah it was a wild ride back then

[@andypetrovich2155]

I still have my bootleg VHS. I taped every episode starting season three. I even cut out the commercials.

[@jamieolberding7731]

"A step in the right direction." - Female Changeling, 2375 ("The Changing Face of Evil") The Second Battle of Chin'toka marked the entry of the Breen Confederacy into the Dominion War in late-2375, in a counter-attack against the Chin'toka system, a territory of the Cardassian Union held by the forces of the Federation Alliance. Aided by the energy-dampening weapon of the Breen warships, the Dominion inflicted the worst major tactical defeat upon the Federation Alliance; all but one of the 312 allied ships were destroyed in a rapid, but vicious engagement. Though the defeat stunned the Federation Alliance, the Dominion could not follow up on their victory, as the Cardassian Rebellion occurred shortly thereafter, diverting vital Dominion resources from the front-lines.

[@lawrence5584]

It's very reminiscent of World War II, when British-Canadian-American troops made in roads in France. Hitler launched a massive attack that caught the allies completely by surprise. It was a shocking victory, but alas they couldn't maintain that forward momentum.

[@gamepad3153]

@@lawrence5584 while the USS Enterprise was off dealing with the Son'a in the Baku system.

[@Sovereign01]

That, and the Klingons were able to neutralise it straight away.

[@nopooping]

@@lawrence5584 if you dont mind what was the name of that offensive?

[@Debbiebabe69]

@@nopooping Battle of the Briar Patch (from the film Star Trek Insurrection)

[@blacktronpavel]

Heartbreaking and shocking moment. This hit me almost as hard as the original Enterprise's self-destruction in Star Trek III.

[@ThatElfNerd]

The Defiant was no Enterprise-E, but she was a force to be reckoned with. So when you manage to blow it up, that's a pretty big feat, and also sends a message.

[@davemiller6055]

The Defiant was possibly the most powerful ship in the quadrant. Did you see the episode where Thomas Riker stole it to help the Maquis attack the Cardassians? When Sisko told Dukat, he said: "You're telling me that one of the most powerful warships in the quadrant is in the hands of the maquis"? Dukat was visibly unnerved. Unique weapons and built to fight the Borg. Insanely powerful, especially for its size. The Enterprise-E is no Defiant.

[@ThatElfNerd]

@@davemiller6055 "Unique weapons and built to fight the Borg." Yeah, and after the Defiant was battle-tested, all new ships were given the same technology, INCLUDING the Enterprise-E. And when a Borg fight actually does happen in First Contact, the Defiant is among the ships that got disabled. They would've been destroyed if the Enterprise hadn't swooped in to take over the fleet and destroy the cube.

[@1DerangedWarrior]

@@ThatElfNerd there is a utube vid somewhere i've seen that yas even though without the E showing up it would of ended badly. in the vid it poses the question of just how long was the Defiant in action in First contact. Alot of what is said given the Defiants reason for being built and its capabilities actually makes sense for how long it was actually in that battle.

[@Evil0tto]

@@davemiller6055 It wasn't. It was fast and tough, heavily armed for its size, but it wasn't the most powerful ship by any stretch of the imagination.

[@davemiller6055]

@@Evil0tto Did you read what I wrote? Did you watch the show? Dukat literally said it was one of the most powerful ships in the entire Alpha Quadrant. That includes The Federation, the Romulan Empire, part of the Klingon Empire, the Cardassians and more. It was designed to fight the BORG. The show went out of it's way to let the viewers know the Defiant was one of the most powerful ships in existence. That claim was never made for any Enterprise. Best case scenario for the Enterprise E is that she was maybe equal to the Defiant.

[@SiCwan]

Everyone talks about the battle. But for me, the first 36 seconds as they approach Chin'toka... the looks on their faces... the music... chilling.

[@IMDARKFIRE007]

Absolutely brilliant writing, NO one expected the hero ship to be destroyed in a losing battle (a first in trek history) much less to be bitch slapped. We need these people on Picard. Ds9 knew what was UP with battle sequences, not only in visuals, but in storytelling. And no, Generations does NOT count, they won the battle.

[@jillevans1109]

2:38 love the abandon ship alarm

[@cranbers]

Poor captain sisko, I believe he was rather fond of that ship :) ha.. gall I love this scene. To this day no show has ever been as fun and memorable as star trek DS9.. Here we are on youtube 20+ years later enjoying the masterpiece this show was.

[@scottmatheson3346]

"Your opinion was not solicited" - what I want her to say every time he compliments her.

[@tatianalyulkin410]

How Julian changed. A seasoned tough as nails warrior. Bravo, Doctor Bashier!

[@Foebane72]

The trouble was that, at this point, Sisko became smug, cocky and complacent in his attitude towards the enemy, and it cost him dearly.

[@akshin1556]

I wonder if Avery Brooks was intentionally trying to make Captain Sisko appear overconfident and arrogant at the beginning of this scene. That was definitely how it came across to me. To me, Sisko seemed to be approaching the battle in a slow, measured pace. And not out of caution, not because he was worried that going in too fast or reckless would put his ship and crew in danger. It felt, to me at least, like Sisko was certain that he would win, and he wanted to take it slow to rub it in, and make it clear to one and all that the enemy was doomed to fall.

[@Locktwiste72]

Perhaps this was the reaction the script called for.

[@michaeljaubert1325]

Confidence breeds distraction and that is when one is most vulnerable

[@DavidKnowles0]

By this time they were winning the war. An everyone thought the Breen was a low level threat. Not a power that could single handedly turn the tide of war against all three superpowers in the quadrant.

[@sabiondo1629]

He learned that attack pattern doesn't always work.

[@OrricktheAlien]

Wayun gave the perfect angelic quality to the Vorta that was supposed to be. It made the whole story of them believable

[@tayzonday]

How does gravity work when there’s no main power?

[@Locutus]

Why does the Claxton work, why is there lighting, why are the bridge consoles on? Like you said, main power was off, not auxiliary power.

[@MasterSandman]

@ TayZonday Like Life-support and sparse lighting, gravity is a vital function. Therefore it runs on emergency power for long enough to either fix the problem or escape the vessel.

[@MrStockoHMK]

It’s gravity plating which is a passive module. Basically space magic. It’s the other mentioned issues that need explanation. The Breen energy dampening weapons should have crippled the ship, the whole ship and everything on it, including escape pods which I assume aren’t pushed out by the crew.

[@tayzonday]

@@MrStockoHMK That Klingon ship lost gravity in Star Trek 6 - until it came back on. I guess they hadn’t invented “gravity plating” then.

[@MrStockoHMK]

@@tayzonday maybe Klingon ships aren’t Starfleet ships??? But like is said. Space magic.

[@kevinasay4321]

The casting of the whole series was exceptional 👌

[@barneyrubble4293]

God, the abandon ship klaxon gives me chills every time

[@Zeakthecat]

the "abondon ship" alarm should be the new EAS tone. :P

[@cbltex]

It went from Sisko's Pimp Hand doing it's thing to Abandon Ship in a little over a minute. Epic Beatdown of a showrunner ship, even if they took the shock out of it with an exact replacement soon after.

[@calanon534]

Budget reasons. They also reused tons of stock footage. Personally, I would have replaced it with something else - an Akira, perhaps, or a Saber or Steamrunner, so we could show what those ships could do.

[@CaptainM792]

1:25 The Star Trek equivalent of ion cannon

[@seanwilliams3634]

And there it was. The founders biggest mistake. Letting all those escape pods to go free.

[@danielhaire6677]

It was psychological warfare. Letting people go to tell the story of how easily they were defeated by the new Breen weapons. Demoralize the follow-on enemies before they get a shot off.

[@22espec]

They were conquerors, not genocidal maniacs.

[@peachesrambo4037]

Remember what happened at dunkirk at the beginning of ww2?

[@seanwilliams3634]

@@peachesrambo4037 They all drank tea before the war.

[@peachesrambo4037]

@@seanwilliams3634 true, but Germany let the British troops go home.

[@Nulono]

When has "let the survivors regroup so they can spread fear of our names" _ever_ worked? It's got to be on the Evil Overlord List somewhere not to do that.

[@Bobsmith-xq2pr]

I'd argue that did work, moral got crazy low for star fleet.

[@233Deadman]

There is a counterargument that ensuring no survivor also empowers your enemy. Because then they are a) pissed off with you and b) might decide its now a fight for survival, which makes them fight all the harder. Backing the likes of Klingons and Romulans into a corner like that would be bad enough, but humans, a sepecies that in the Trek universe almost annihilated *ourselves* before discovering warp flight? We'll damn well start throwing rocks if we have to, and starships with tractor beams can throw some very large rocks in the name of mutually assured destruction.

[@TheWPhilosopher]

@@233Deadman heck the Jem'Hadar think they invited suicide dives? We'll show them what a suicide dive is. Though actually due to man power I'm surprised they didn't just invent robo mines to do it. Send one huge ship full of robo mines. Let them explode it which activates the mones to fly out as part of the ",debris" and attach to every single ship in the fleet. 5, 4, 3, 2,1. Boom. At every ship years and fleet station simultaneously. Broadcast. That's was for Chintoka. And we are only at pissed of level 5. You do not want us to get to level 10. So final chance. End this war now or we will do to level 6. You have due to your impressive ship rebuilding two days to respond. Oh on the meantime we do have several fleets left while yours is zero. Oh and a special message for the Breen. *Garbled nonsense* Breen take a step back. Yeah I thought so..so think about it. The terms are fair. You go back to your quadrant. Set up emissaries post for trading as will we and neither of us will traders aside go into each others quadrants. Or you know. You could see level 6? How's your jem'Hadar now your entire naval battalions have been wiped out?

[@stanleylee5358]

It was a classic Mongolian maneuver during their conquest. It works until you have prisoners with plot armor.

[@billybegood466]

Starfleet's problem in the war wasn't people. They had plenty of those. It was ships. Allowing a few hundred survivors to make it back and start spreading their stories of complete and total defeat would be fine because those survivors still didn't have enough ships to crew.

[@duanscott2490]

Everything stops working except for the explosives behind all the bridge's control panels. They work just fine.

[@dphorgan]

DS9 is the best Star Trek.

[@biancabeluga1597]

David Horgan Totally agree!

[@cypheron3030]

Agreed

[@Cerbyo]

There is no best star trek. there's only star trek....and discovery.

[@cypheron3030]

Wow, u are not wrong actually

[@thephantomeagle2]

Yuppers

[@Locktwiste72]

Back in the day I wanted to wrap my fingers around that snivelling Weyoun's throat. A testament to Jeffrey Combs' excellent acting.

[@laurenjcoates]

DS9 was just so damn amazing

[@emdee7744]

What a great clip! Thanks for posting.

[@patrickfitzpatrick45]

That's another reason Sisko excellent leader....knows when to escape...

[@Elthenar]

He learned the hard way.

[@anthonyescalante3604]

I like Star Trek thank you for capturing the moment I am a new member

[@NateSean]

Weyoun: Humans will spread fear throughout the Federation now that we've destroyed what's important to the. Xindi to the Talosians: Do you want to tell him, or should I?

[@Solitaire001]

Sinestro, leader of the Sinestro Corps which is powered by fear (his thoughts paraphrased by me): Coast City was destroyed once. When we destroy Coast City again it will become a symbol of fear throughout the Universe. No one will ever return. After the Green Lantern Corps (with the help of Earth's heroes) defeats The Sinestro Corps people move into Coast City by the 1,000s, and Coast City becomes known as "The City Without Fear."

[@scottmatheson3346]

Obviously you capture the escape pods, interrogate their crews to determine who will properly spread fear and who is of high value, and let only the former go.

[@---Rin---]

Sparing the escape pods was a critical error in judgement.

[@gordondavis6168]

The Dominion ships have smooth hulls so that nothing will Cling-on.

[@TheMrPeteChannel]

I c wut u did dare!

[@gordondavis6168]

The Breen ships look like the derelict in Alien.

[@darkcoeficient]

Sad sad sad sad sad. I was glad when the Sao Paulo got renamed. Revenge would be had.

[@jamesspring4610]

I always thought the Defiant, in her last few moments, turned her hull to shield the last few escape pods. One final sacrifice to save her crew. She died with honor.

[@Blink_____]

That abandon ship alarm sound straight out of Castlevania SOTN when you kill one of those little floating skulls in the Clock Tower area, just at a different pitch

[@demarcusfaulkner7411]

The noble defiant sacrificing herself one last time for its crew throwing them to safety before being destroyed

[@omega13whitelucario95]

Herself Ships are always referred to as a she

[@demarcusfaulkner7411]

@@omega13whitelucario95 thanks for the correction.

[@omega13whitelucario95]

@@demarcusfaulkner7411 no problem

[@greyofpta5305]

I just noticed that the saucer section of a Nebula class was sheared off and just the drive section was left in the background. 3:33

[@RurouniKalain]

That was in my recommended. How well KZbin knows me, ha ha. Blew me away of course---but yeah, The Female Founder letting them go was a big-ass mistake. BUT, I can see that she was super over-confident and that the tactic she used was the sort of one that she perhaps may have used in the past and whatnot....and it worked wonders. But, not this time. Of course, the Rebellion on Cardassia and such started happening, so that delayed them as well. Good thing the Klingons were able to hold them at bay. Ah memories.

[@CoolsBreeze]

Loved this battle.

[@michealoceallaigh4716]

I wouldn't be surprised if after the war, the Bajoran people requested the scrap metal from the Defiant in order to build a large monument (modern art style) to Sisko on the land he purchased in "Penumbra"

[@dudewatches6125]

Founder: Those troops are full of demoralised officers. Me instead of Weyun: Quite right founder. Commander to fleet, destroy 50% of outgoing escape pods. Prioritize fire on those coming from ships of the following classes, Galaxy, Constitution, and Defiant. Good hunting. Edit: Star Trek is like reverse warhammer. Even their bad guy factions are weirdly moralistic (borg excluded).

[@yaldabaoth2]

You are a dangerous man.

[@2012kreed]

But you would probably have an issue calling the founder your god. ;)

[@edsr164]

You are cruel

[@redomer91]

Finally someone said it. I am always shocked at the lack of cunning those supposed bad guys display. I guess they didn't want to yeet Sisko but god damn is it annoying how they are wasting opportunities.

[@KnightRaymund]

She's pretty stupid when it comes to strategy. She makes the biggest blunders. Weyoun was the real brains.

[@NoJusticeNoPeace]

It annoys me that the Federation never takes off the kid gloves. Think of every weapon, technology, and ally the Federation has made over hundreds of years on all the Star Trek shows and what would happen if they were actually used. Imagine, for example, if the Federation got help from Wesley's nanites and the Hortas to disassemble an entire solar system to construct _millions_ of ships simultaneously, equipped them all with Kelvan engines (which can operate for 300+ years without refueling) and Doomsday Machine antiproton beams, and "crewed" them all with M5 AI. And that's not including all of the various alien races and god-like beings who owe the Federation favours, from the Fesarians to the Douwd. Just once it would be nice if the nerf was removed and we got to see Starfleet really make a show of force.

[@2012kreed]

These are more than likely, just opening... diplomacy... moves.. In other YT videos, there is talk of how section 31 would have used, other tactics to win. Example: The guardian of the city on the edge of forever, to change the timeline and/or simply delete the dominion from existence... if stuff got real ;)

[@thiagodeandrade7081]

To be fair, it is less about "kid gloves" and more about the creative team not wanting to bring all that confusing things, like how travelling back to 1960's were a common occurence to Kirk and implications (how do you police that? Do Klingons had this technology? If they hadn't, how could theyneven be a threat to the Federstion, ?). Trek always had little use for continuinity. Every week, the Federation would discover a universe-changing species, planet, weapon, technique, natural phenomenon and... do not with or about it. Yes, DS9 could show more about the "dirty tricks" the Federation probably should be deploying, but except for Section 31 virus and Sisko' ploy to get Romulan support, we never saw any of it. Probably beczuse itmeas not where the creative team would want to take us.

[@NoJusticeNoPeace]

+Thiago de Andrade To use your specific example of time travel, the writers _did_ eventually address the logical questions which arise by creating a time travel authority which polices the time stream. And you see the result: it opened fresh avenues of narrative for the writers to explore and added to the rich lore of Star Trek. Even if the reason Starfleet doesn't use the Kelvan engines is really because it would make the show boring, they could at least have a comment about how, for example, transwarp was developed from it. Or they could mention that the Fesarians were destroyed by the Borg. Or that Wesley's nanites have become xenophobic and unwilling to work with other races. Still, it would be nice if just occasionally we got to see Starfleet pull something out of their back pockets when their backs are to the wall which shows just how tough the Federation _could_ be if they weren't pulling their punches. Like n the middle of the Dominion war, a couple of Galaxy-class starships arrive with the Doomsday Machine in tractor and set it loose amidst the enemy ships. Or an enemy commander just suddenly disappears in mid-threat without explanation and we cut to a scene of Sisko quietly hiding a Tantalus Device in his office wall.

[@meleardil]

It is similar to european civilisation. It is very popular at these days to call for its destruction on all ocasions, call it intolerant, racist, imperialist, while this is the most forgiving and free society ever existed. Those who screem at it, and belittle itcompletely forget that those countries held the power to destroy the whole planet within hours in the last 50 years.

[@NoJusticeNoPeace]

+meleardil Please bugger off and take your MAGA hat with you.

[@Gendo.]

After playing thousands of hours of Elite Dangerous, the evacuation of the Defiant had alot more emotional weight to it. The relationship between humans and vehicles/machines does run very deep. We keep them working, and they give us speed and flight.

[@Sovereign01]

There's that VFX gaffe on the Breen ship between the first and second Quantum Torpedo volleys.

[@rbrtpongo]

Reminds me when we sometimes have those fire drills in schools when sisko said abandon ship the sould was like that

[@Naccene]

Weyoun (sees Defiant destroyed) Baulkhead! I needed that!

[@jaysinha0]

It was great to see the Federation, Klingon and Romulan fleets working together.

THIS is why the Phased Cloak from ST: TNG was a critical must in fighting against Alpha, Delta, and Gamma Quadrant enemies. The phased cloak alone makes short work of the Jem Hadar.

[@Insertnamehere3000]

Every time I turn on a new pc build I have that “main computer is offline, everything is offline” moment

[@robertusaugustus2003]

What you don’t see in the footage is the lone Unggoy clinging to the hull of every Breen ship, plasma pistol clutched tightly and screaming

[@Brando501st]

It seems that if they kept that new weapon a secret and destroyed all those escape pods, they could've won the war.

[@wstage]

They really could’ve had another season of epic Dominion War showdown!

[@gungeek4230]

This was the founder’s biggest mistake. She allowed some of the best Star fleet officers to escape those same officers aided Star Fleet in ultimately defeating the Dominion. They also provided Star Fleet intel on the Breen’s new weapon.

[@user-vf6vs8vo4u]

I like how Silko is threatening to give in to ...despair? Sentimentality? and O'Brian is just "nah sir time to bug out, we aint going down with the ship"

[@rapliberationarmy089]

I have never seen a space battle this big ever in Star trek

[@Varekai0723]

Sacrifice of Angels is an even bigger battle.

[@antoniofernandez7075]

Which ship class is that one in the upper left corner 01:06?

[@squidman22]

I always forget how formidable the Defiant was! Small ship. Big guns/torpedos

[@jordancobb509]

The abandon ship alarm sounds mechanical. Makes sense if the computers are down.

[@pergatory_a]

ok so DOPE !!!!!!!!!!! once in a blue moon old radio aka pods cast

[@TheWPhilosopher]

This was the moment the Dominion won Chintoka but lost the war. Sisko and his Pimp Hand was never going to let them get away with taking the Defiant down. Weyoun's gloat was misplaced. He shoulda killed Sisko in his pod while he had the chance.

[@jackiemartling]

Salome Jens also played the creator alien in TNG episode "The Chase"

[@personman8607]

When they destroyed the defiant I could not believe the breen would have such a energy dampening of such power that the federation would not be aware of it since the breen have existed in the Star Trek Universe at least since Star Trek :Generations when commander Riker mentions them during the observatory mission when they find the dead romulans.

[@trunksbriefs6359]

Sadly it's noted that that Star Fleet knew very little of the Breen in both TNG and in DS9

[@SultanFilm]

They had a tendency not to make survivors if people entered their space. The Klingons lost a whole fleet without anyone coming back to tell the tale. As well as they just kept to themselves

[@ernestmarshall2098]

Federation knew about Breen. They knew Klingons lost entire fleet. Never heard from again. Federation don't like wars. This why they didn't build Warships until the Dominion War started.

[@Asghaad]

@@ernestmarshall2098 "Si vis pacem, para bellum" true then, true now and will remain true as long as life will exist...

[@DrewSavo]

This takes the No.2 spot in my all time favorite ‘Abandon Ship’ moments. No.1 is reserved for Mass Effect 2: Shepards sacrifice to rescue Joker.

[@Jarsia]

Joker tried so hard to save that ship

[@chrisbingley]

Kirk abandoning the refitted Enterprise with the self-destruct armed in Search for Spock is the best 'Abandon Ship' moment.

[@andromedafan]

I personally would have added, Sisko prying the Dedication plaque off the bulkhead before leaving the bridge to the scene.

[@davidreilly9456]

Sisko has had a quite a number ships shot out from under him, hasn't he?😅

[@bunnygirl95]

"All those escapepods, so small, so vulnerable... I'll order their destruction immediately"... Weyoun can be so sinister :S

[@damenwhelan3236]

I always wonder at what point bashir actor was told he was playing a changling. He was so cold and matter of fact during the dominion war that with the knowledge of his being a double agent, it's hard to overlook.

[@nittany272]

It’s such a common TV trope to have a certain sense of cockiness from the protagonist right before disaster strikes. Avery played it so well here.

[@BasicShapes]

Star Trek: Villains have a very clear psychological motive for sparing enemy escape pods. Star Wars: Look, an escape pod! Shoot it? Nah, hold your unlimited space-laser-fire, there's no life forms aboard...

[@michaelmartinez5217]

That's movie quality camera work in the beginning

[@ryanyarbrough1343]

Never understood why the writers put Kira at the ops/helm station instead of Nog in this episode. After all, it was his position on the Defiant.

[@Rodshark75]

Senior, most experienced officer in the position they would be of most use. He was in a non-essential, but important back up station in case he was needed.

[@quoniam426]

@@Rodshark75 Nog is not that good of a pilot to begin with he's a nice engineer on the other hand.

[@CuriousMind477]

The one thing that always bothered me is how people are obviously getting hurt, but Bashir is on the bridge instead of being in sickbay. In this scene they showed two crew getting knocked down by exploding consoles and he didn't move until Kira got hurt. Still one of my favorite scenes for just the pure tension

[@oldtwinsna8347]

Have to agree, no idea why Bashir is on the bridge during a red alert situation. He should be in sick bay. It was a small sick bay but being a physician he should be there to triage the injured. I can imagine there being massive injuries from plasma and radiation exposure in the lower decks, these folks are screaming in agony yet Bashir doesn't care.

[@kobra6660]

Q needs to add that to the rulebook rule 1 dont provoke the borg rule 2 leave the breen alone

[@CronoTime]

Anyone else get full of emotions when it looks like the Defiant turned to take the shot ment for the escape pods?

[@Enkarashaddam]

3:28 like a stab in the heart for me

[@md_aufgebenistkeineoption]

What i never noticed, that in the back of the destroyed defiant you can see a destroyed Galaxy class.

[@OptimusSledge]

Sisko: Attack pattern delta! Kira, under her breath: Well, duh!

[@amit790]

DS9’s Kobayashi Maru Captain Sisko’s no-win scenario

[@christopherg2347]

This was as much a Battle as Wolf 359. Which is a funny coincidence, because Sisko was there as well!

[@nizarific001]

By the prophets, I miss true Trek.

[@013pieter]

I have my hopes on "Picard".

[@nizarific001]

@@013pieter don't.

[@admiralsquatbar127]

What's your definition of "true" Trek.

[@013pieter]

@@nizarific001 Why not?

[@nizarific001]

@@admiralsquatbar127 for me it's the vision of a future that inspires hope. That humanity can aspire to be better, and that we will one day explore the stars.

[@kenp7814]

With that weapon the Breen should be the dominant force.

[@drakeevans8042]

Well as powerful as there weapons are the federation finds a weeknes in it all so the breen were very isolationist to the point that the only wars they fought were defensive they never left there border

[@ShannonCarter55]

And if Damar hadn't gone rogue like he did, perhaps the Dominion would've won the war.