Are You Reading Your Indicator Correctly ???

The needle on a lever type dial indicator is very informative if you know what to look for. This video shows a few examples of what its saying. Take a Look.
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[@nigelleyland166]

Yet another informative and interesting vid, I have one indicator ( I know them as 'Dial Test Indicators' ) I got it as a 17yr old apprentice, it has been looked after and is a quality make, it is still in mint condition, I am as I type a retired 63 yr old, that indicator will out live me and if looked after several future owners. One cannot stress enough, the value of top grade equipment used correctly and looked after, is well worth the initial expense. p,s, I did recently succomb and buy a cheap indicator, why you may ask, their ain't no way pre teen my grandson is using my good tools till he learns how to look after junk stuff LOL

[@cavemansmancave9025]

Got my unloosen fix for the week. Thanks, John

[@cameronmccreary4758]

Drop indicator = travel indicator. I have always used Brown and Sharpe / Tesa and Mitutoya. Great tools.

[@Duckfarmer27]

Glad you are feeling better and sharing that knowledge again. Even though we don't like to, make sure to follow the doc's directions and take care of yourself. Like many say, everything in the world is rubber. Some material just stiffer than others. You have to learn to understand what the test instruments are telling you.

[@nbolin2879]

Thanks for taking the time to share this video Joe. Glad you are feeling better.

[@angelramos-2005]

Good to see you back,Joe.Thank you.

[@bearsrodshop7067]

Great to have you back in front of the board and in the shop. A fun way to entertain and teach my grandson Hunter during his summer break will be to show him how to indicate parts...Thx Joe, super great to have you back up on both feet, and not in pain,,Bear.

[@stuartscott9646]

Welcome back Joe! Good info.

[@richardbennett6053]

Sooo glad to have you back

[@drevil4454]

"What you are gonna do when you encounter these shapes" Me: start up youtube, watch Joe, proceed to do the job.

[@BWTIII]

Joe, so good to have you in the shop and back in front of the board again.

[@jdmccorful]

Thanks for the close up tips on alignment. Good to see next project coming down the line. Be well, thanks for your time.

[@jeraldheise8433]

Welcome back Joe. Good to see you!!! Can’t wait to see the shaper build. Got the kit in my shop. “Let’s do it!”

[@brucewilliams6292]

Great way to head into a weekend; a Joe Pieczynski video. I am glad to hear that you are on the mend!

[@Engineerd3d]

Glad to see you back Joe! Keep on trucking! Best medicine to feel better is to do what you enjoy doing.

[@delstone1919]

Hi Joe, Glad to see you back up and well, perhaps not running but getting there. Missed your videos, they are all great and extremely useful to beginners and old hands alike..

[@kennethnevel3263]

I just found a US General 387 with a lever indicator on eBay and bought it . I think I will like that base better than the other two I have now . Thanks for the information .

[@rodbennett4790]

G'day Joe, thanks for yet another video for the thinker machinist. Your machining topics are on another level.

[@Freetheworldnow]

As always, excellent teachings Joe. Thank you for sharing. God Bless.

[@TheUncleRuckus]

It's nice to see that my assumptions on which surfaces to indicate off were correct in all 4 instances. Great video as always Joe! 👍👍

[@samrodian919]

A lot of food for thought Joe! Thanks for sharing it with us all.

[@brucelott3583]

Glad to see you up and around. At our age, healing is slow, you just learn to patient and don't push it.

[@garyw.elmqurst6272]

Have Missed you, your training is awesome and said in a way that everyone can understand you from the beginner to the journeyman! I understand what you are teaching, so I know your teaching is good. Thank you and God Bless You.

[@jamesdavis8021]

Glad to see you back,Joe. I miss your videos.

[@marksturgis3536]

Glad to hear you are back on your feet.

[@russelldold4827]

A lifetime of wisdom in 22 minutes! Glad to see you're back, Joe.

[@frankward709]

Thanks for the video glad to see you back

[@harlech2]

Welcome back Joe! Glad you are firing on all cylinders again!!

[@joepie221]

6 out of 8, but i'll take it.

[@michaelrandle4128]

Thanks again Joe, something we never really think about until it’s explained, glad your on the mend, going through my own physical problems at the moment, it’s no fun is it. Regards from across the pond

[@TheTacktishion]

Good Lesson....! Glad you are BACK... Looking forward to the Shaper Series....!

[@joepie221]

Me too!

[@mathewmolk2089]

Good show, Joe, Keep um commin' I'm 3 days+++ older then dirt but I learn something new every time. (or is it re-learn things I forgot. Can;t remember which.

[@dennythomas8887]

I'm right there with you Mathew lol

[@samrodian919]

@@dennythomas8887 me too!

[@4GSR]

My first dial indicator holder was a 1-1/2 x 3 x 6" long block of aluminum with a 1/4" rod sticking up on it. Had a Starrett Last Word indicator mounted on it. This was my indicator I used on dad's 9" SBL when I was young green behind the ears! I grew up using a 4-jaw chuck on that lathe, too. No 3-jaw until later years when I bought a 13" lathe back in 1979. Still have the 9" SBL with a 3-jaw in it now along with two other lathes, a 14" and 15". Yeah, I have encountered all those scenarios, too. As always, thanks for sharing, Ken

[@roberthiggins1142]

As always that was a very interesting & informative video & i cant wait tp see the start of the next build.

[@rickhand8228]

Another great video Joe! I'm looking forward to the model shaper.

[@jerseyjoe2684]

Good to see you again, Joe. Glad you are on the mend. Great info in this video for beginners and pros, alike. 👍 🇺🇸 🦅

[@BensWorkshop]

Many thanks for the tips. Good to see you back on your feet!

[@BensWorkshop]

PS, looking forward to the shaper!

[@weevilinabox]

3:41 "Chuck and release" Another easily missed gem, just dropped into the narrative. Thanks, Joe!

[@donniceblakely1075]

Enjoyed it as always boss

[@mikepelelo5657]

Back to school. Thanks Joe!

[@christurley391]

Thanks for the video Joe.

[@chrisburbank6484]

A buddy of mine was not trusting his interapid indicator so he borrows one from the jig grinder operator who jokingly states " don't break it" . Tom mounts the borrowed interapid on a indicol holder in his bridgeport. the indicator was inherited from the jig grinders dad who was also had been a jig grinder operator. Tom finishes his indicating then inexplicably reaches up and flips on the bridgeport which was set to about 1200 rpm. the interrapid and the indicol are instantly turning 1200 rpm , the indicol stretched straight out for like half a second , then the indicol and indicator fly off , slaps into the brick wall about 5 feet behind the bridgeport at like 100 mph. seemed like it just stuck there flat on the wall for half a second then falls and hits the floor . the jig grinder operator sticks his head around the corner of the wall since he works on the other side and heard it hit and sees his indicator laying on the floor. Tom looked like he was going to puke The rest of us are just frozen staring kinda wanting to laugh ,

[@carlopiaia2144]

He's better off getting a Brown &Sharp .0001 indicator they are very responsive, I inherited a inter-rapid indicator an it's brand new and it's so sluggish.

[@lennym1273]

Nice to have you back Joe...

[@joepie221]

Thanks. Feels good to get back to a routine.

[@wallbawden5511]

joe just unreal just the pressure from the chuck man have i got a lot from this one and yes its in my book of tips and tricks from Joe Pieczynski

[@kentuckytrapper780]

Great info Joe, thanks

[@notsonominal]

Looks like things are shaping up!:))

[@RRINTHESHOP]

Nice demo Joe, good to hear you are doing well.

[@joepie221]

Thanks Randy. Still challenging, but I'm getting there.

[@Smallathe]

Fascinating. Thank you so much! Take care and I hope you are doing better!

[@joepie221]

Thank you, I am.

[@toolbox-gua]

Most of your viewers are machinist, I'm not, but we all learn a lot from your lessons. It helps me appreciate a good job or catch a not so good one. Most important, I was not aware of any miss haps to you or your family but glad to hear that all is falling in good place now. Thank You.

[@joepie221]

I had a surgically severed Achilles tendon back in Feb. to support some bone surgery on my right heel. Its a long and painful recovery, but I'm doing extremely well. Thanks.

[@NellsMechanicalManCave]

Brilliant explanation Joe! I fell into an egg shaped hole recently and this video would have saved me so much drama then. Oh, mail is coming your way 😊 Cheers Neil ! Shaper, can't wait 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

[@davidrule1335]

17:00 Never mind Joe I was commenting before watching the hole video. Very good info!

[@cmarano]

A great demo Joe. I wish every apprentice machinist could see this.

[@robertburns2415]

I can't wait to see the shaper series

[@bulletproofpepper2]

Thanks Joe!

[@joepie221]

Any time!

[@davidberlanny3308]

Interesting to see the theory turned into reality, great demo. I assume it was some form of polymer. Good to see you looking comfortable on your feet!! Good luck from Spain!!

[@dougwood6186]

Thanks Joe very helpful information it will improve my machining I’m sure

[@johnm840]

Nice Video. Great detail

[@kevinh.9068]

Can't wait to see the build of the shaper. You will like that one, it's got alot of T slots and no dovetails. Becareful at the little catch for the gear, I had to make that part twice it's so small.

[@brucewood8046]

Great lesson, glad your injury is healing, and looking forward to the production of the shaper! We used to call it the "2-4" machine in high school circa the early 1960's. Don't ask me to explain why. It can't be exposed to the young and the tender of ear! Woody

[@peteengard9966]

Thanks Joe. Looking forward to the shaper series.

[@joepie221]

You and me both!

[@MichaelMoranGearHead]

Welcome back Joe!

[@joepie221]

Many thanks.

[@mperry9025]

Thanks joe

[@1crazypj]

I made a quick version of the 'Indicol' spindle clamp a few months ago from some 1/2" aluminium plate. (roughed out with hole-saw then change ID on rotary table to get some 'pads to fit mill spindle) 6x1mm thread for a clamp screw and it was done (bit rough but works well) It's way more useful than I would have ever imagined and makes dialing in stuff on mill-drill super easy

[@tobydulanski9480]

One of the biggest challenges is working in a shop with damaged equipment. Damage because of abuse, neglect, inexperienced people, or an incident not reported. All tooling and deserve respect. If you don’t know what something is ask. Great video for upcoming machinists Joe.

[@joepie221]

As much as I was guilty early on, I hate borrowing or loaning precision tools. Its a crap shoot unless you know the person really well. Company tools are always a gamble unless they have supervision.

[@tobydulanski9480]

@@joepie221 when most of us start out we are guilty of a lot of things, because we don’t know any better. Unless you grow up in a shop we all start out ignorant. One the flip side, good people learn from the mistakes they make and try not to repeat the same mistakes. Mistakes is how we learn. Always a pleasure Joe, glad your feeling a bit better.

[@kimber1958]

Great information

[@steveallarton98]

Hi Joe, Good to hear that you are back on two feet, once more ! Before chucking odd-shaped things, it’s often useful to get a feel for a shape with a vernier calliper - measuring the maximum and minimum dimensions at various points will perhaps give you some indication of what to expect - although a lobed polygon can be made to show a consistent diameter, and thus be thought truly circular, but this will reveal itself as soon as the part is in the chuck and tested with the dial test indicator. I guess that you have probably covered it elsewhere, but it might be worth mentioning that the angle of the tip of the DTI, to its plane of movement will induce an error, and it should be as close to perpendicular as reasonable - the tip moves in a arc, and large deflections will create a sine error. Whist most of our use of the DTI is for centring parts, where the deflection tends to zero, it is as well to remember when making actual measurements, for example machining eccentrics - and the use of a drop indicator may give a better accuracy in those cases, as it is not subject to the same error. Kind regards, Steve A.

[@mikeshort4291]

He has a video where he proves that is not the case.

[@steveallarton98]

@@mikeshort4291 Hi Mike, I stand corrected ! Could you give me the link to that video - I must have missed it ! Many thanks, Steve A.

[@paddlefaster]

The part you show that is squished in like a four-leaf clover had me stumped four solid day when I first ran into it. I couldn't imagine what had gone wrong. Now I know, thanks for the video.

[@joepie221]

I think it will bite all new guys at least once.

[@nraynaud]

the 2 centers on the egg-shaped ovalised circle are a very good demonstration of the concept of robustness in control theory. A robust system considers that some values are outliers and try to focus on the others (sometimes it's a bit softer, like "this value is a bit more of an outlier than this one"), while an averaging system will find a happy medium amongst all the values.

[@richardellis3141]

interesting, thanks for the lesson

[@rexmyers991]

3:10 - THERE IT IS. Boy! I have missed your Yogi Berra moments. Oh, and Thanks for the lesson. I DID learn something.

[@joepie221]

More to come!

[@AmateurRedneckWorkshop]

Thanks for the video.

[@joepie221]

You bet

[@jeremycable51]

Damn I’m excited

[@pb68slab18]

Lever-type like the legendary Starrett 'Last Word' set that was the last word for us old-school trained toolmakers. While mine is still in use after 44yrs, some of the Brown & Sharpe/TESA 'tenths' indicators get into some difficult places and are very accurate.

[@joepie221]

I still have my last word.

[@Stefan_Boerjesson]

As always, an educational video. Comparing measuring devices for mechanics and electronics I see a similarity. Find out what accuracy You need and buy equipment according to that. Doubled precision costs 4 times as much.... In order to check and calibrate the shop tools a high quality "master" tool "must" be used... When centering things in the independent 4 jaw, checking roundness, it's a relative measurement. As long as there's no backlash, no hysteresis, most indicators ought do to well. Various Y-tubers compare "simple China" tools with the old well reputated dragons, and the difference, if any, is very small. In the long run, "simple China" likely wear out faster ....

[@outsidescrewball]

Interesting lesson…best wishes to completion of your recovery

[@joepie221]

Thanks Chuck. I'm getting there.

[@TAWPTool]

I love these theory videos Joe! Thanks for sharing. I didn’t know you were injured or under the wx. I’ll be in touch

[@joepie221]

Thanks for stopping by Guy. I hope the new shop is coming along nicely.

[@TrPrecisionMachining]

good video joe

[@davidmyhre2720]

Hey Joe Good to see you. Starting to go into withdrawal with no Joe Pie videos. Cool sticker need to get one. Be safe brother see you next time.

[@joepie221]

get me your address. use the contact page on my website.

[@michaelryan6884]

Great lesson....glad you are better...I ran into Covid myself last month...not fun.

[@joepie221]

Hope you're better now.

[@graemebrumfitt6668]

Joe Pie of Advanced Innovations, Austin, Texas. Great to know you is fightin fit Dude or as close as! Interesting lessons here, as always stay safe n well! TFS, GB :) Oh n keep unloosening stuff :) You caught me out there I'd already commented when you threw the ending @ us, was hoping for one of the woodworking machines :( but this will be Awesome to.

[@joepie221]

I really wanted to do the table saw, but I'm sure I'll enjoy what ever model I do.

[@graemebrumfitt6668]

@@joepie221 I'm sure we most definitely will too Joe! GB :)

[@bruceanderson9461]

The Erick Magna Holder is a replacement for the discontinued General 387 indicator holder. It needs a modification to the ball socket to give it the flexibility of the General. It comes in two strengths of magnets. You can find them by googling it. I have no financial interest in it-just a follower of Joe Pie who is one of the best machinist KZbin teachers on the internet!!

[@joepie221]

Many thanks for that.

[@brianevans1946]

Can't wait for the shaper.

[@johnpilagonia5238]

Great video as usual and nice work sneaking in all the "unloosens". LOL

[@tvathome562]

Brilliant, would love more vids on this subject, find centre of lobed shaft in a lathe etc.. No dro to the rescue.. Thanks

[@VenturaSewerInspections]

Thank you for the education. Had no idea you were laid up...hope you recover quickly.

[@joepie221]

I'm ready to get back to normal, but it will be a while. I have to settle for functional at the moment. I'll take it. :)

[@zackjohnson5782]

Unloosen? So is that tightening?

[@joepie221]

No...it's unloosening.

[@Gottenhimfella]

I had a phone call recently from a local machinist who'd encountered a dial test indicator reading when setting up a presumed cylindrical workpiece in his Colchester-look (Asian copy) lathe which had him scratching his head. It was the reverse of the "packing gland" scenario Joe deals with at about 8:00, where the indicator had two highs and two lows per rev. My friend was taking 2 revs to see a single high and a single low, repeating cyclically as usual. Owing to my background in machine tool design I thought I knew straight away what the problem (and the solution) must be, and I was right on this occasion, but before I reveal it, I thought people here might be interested to speculate on possible causes.

[@joepie221]

The 360 degree rotation of the part would reveal all the movement the indicator should see. The part isn't going to change its profile between revs. This has to be a machine or holder issue. I'll think about this for a while, but the solution must be outside any conventional setup I've encountered.

[@bcbloc02]

My Carlton drill has run out that repeats every 3 revolutions. I figure it is a spindle bearing issue. Its really just a drill so the .003" it is out doesn't bother me too much.

[@Gottenhimfella]

@@bcbloc02 That is indeed strange. But maybe it was not exactly three revs, but a little over two. With pure rolling elements (eg cylindrical roller bearings) the rollers act like planet gear in an epicyclic gearbox, orbiting at exactly half the speed of the spindle. So (given that it is impossible for all rollers to be exactly the same size) there will be a recurring component of runout which repeats every two revs. If the raceways are relatively uniform in thickness, and one roller is measurablly larger than the others, this component will predominate (as in my friend's case). Although most lathes (including Colchesters) use tapered rollers, so it might seem that the ratio is not exactly twice, in fact the geometry of taper rollers is so arranged that there is not skidding, so it still applies.. Angular contact balls might differ slightly from this perfect case, though, so maybe that's what you've got.

[@binomair9326]

wow amazing micro work on big machines cool all the best

[@davidrule1335]

Joe I beg to differ 15:07 If you unloosened the jaw pressure, how can the bore be round? Wouldn't it be triangular?

[@richardcranium5839]

good info joe. face plate and face clamping on critical soft items would be the way to go???

[@jeffanderson4979]

Sure wish I could find one of those super cool General brand indicator holders. You best lock it up at night :)

[@kmitchl1]

I ran into this issue recently with some TI tube in a four jaw. I don’t have a six jaw so i bored a split sleeve to fit the tube and gripped on the sleeve.

[@joepie221]

Good fix.

[@richardsweet5068]

Seeing is believing with the 3 lobed part. The egg shapes I am well used to seeing in brass clock plates. Once the true centre is found a centre drill is used to open out the hole as it does not deflect as would a twist drill. The hole is the bushed to bring it back to size.

[@carlopiaia2144]

Maintenance drills with a high Helix and shorts flutes, meaning three-quarters of the drill is solid, they work really well in lathe tailstocks.

[@binomair9326]

Uncle Joe how r u..This is big hello from Dubai UAE

[@kurtdietrich5421]

I inherited one of those holders from my grandfather.

[@kensherwin4544]

I was a little surprised that you didn't warn newbies that any DIAMETER of the 3-lobed part will measure close to perfect with a mike, even with a really messed up RADIUS. I was really young when that one bit me where you don't want teeth marks.

[@russkepler]

You'll find this on round ground stock, I've got a stick of 1 1/4 O1 that's lobed .001 out. Took me a while to figure out why it wouldn't go into a 1.250 hole. Only way to check for that lobing is to put it on V blocks and rotate under an indicator or to measure with V mics. Both are sensitive to the V angle and number of lobes.

[@kensherwin4544]

@@russkepler Yep. A hydraulic cylinder rod was what got me.

[@joepie221]

@Ken Sherwin I did an entire video on that topic and didn't feel the need to revisit it. It was the impossible shape video a few months back.

[@James-fs4rn]

👍🏽glad you're feeling better Joe. Thanks for sharing. Would you consider reverse engineering that mag base For reproduction?

[@joepie221]

Yes I would. It has been asked before.

[@davidrule1335]

16:22 I can't believe my eyes.

[@tomherd4179]

Unfortunately I have experienced the pit falls you have described. The lowering of jaw pressure for the final cuts is something that I have tried, but with very limited success: Will have to practice more. I remember that I put a 3 legged sacrificial spider looking 3D printed part in back of a small round thin wall part I was trying to bore out. (With only fair success.) I wonder how this would be done using a CNC machine? I have no CNC equipment, just a passing thought. Thanks for another eye opener!

[@joepie221]

Same way. You can adjust the chuck jaw air pressure for chucking delicate parts.

[@donanderson9269]

“Un-loosened” Must be a texas thing!?!¿

[@joshkandt2271]

I'd recommend Interrapid or Brown and Sharpe. I'd definitely stay away from Mitutoyo.

[@wallbawden5511]

just need more on your choices as i have a Mitutoyo have used it for years and do gun smith work has never let me down i fined it a quality instrument another i have is the Starret

[@michaelboyle1983]

I really like the Brown and Sharpe dial test indicators (finger indicators). I like Starrett dial indicators (like the 1" travel ones). God bless you all! Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. John 3:3 KJV But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. Revelation 21:8 KJV Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: 1 Corinthians 15:1‭-‬4 KJV For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. Romans 3:23‭-‬26 KJV But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement. Romans 5:8‭-‬11 KJV For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. Ephesians 2:8‭-‬9 KJV Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God. Romans 5:1‭-‬2 KJV That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. Romans 10:9‭-‬10 KJV