If God is Formless, How to Pray? Dualistic Worship in Non-Dualistic Vedanta

Advaita Vedanta teaches that non-dual brahman alone exists, yet its teachers often prescribe dualistic practices like prayer and worship. How can this apparent contradiction be reconciled? How can non-dualists pray at all? To whom do they pray? Q&A series #27
Related video: If Reality is NON-DUAL, Why are there so many GODS in Hinduism? • If Reality is NON-DUAL...
0:00 Introduction - Satyam & Mithya
7:57 One God vs Many Deities
9:20 Brahman vs Ishvara
12:26 How to Worship Formless Ishvara?
15:56 To Anthropomorphize Ishvara
18:48 How to Choose a Deity?
Adi Shankara famously wrote, "brahma satyam, jagan mithya," brahman is satyam, absolutely real. Brahman is the uncreated, unchanging fundamental reality because of which the world exists. Jagat, the world, is mithya, false. Here false means that the world you experience each day is not as real as brahman. Unlike brahman, the world was created and it's constantly changing. More than that, the very existence of the world (vyavaharika satta) depends on brahman (paramarthika satta) as it's underlying substratum (adhishthana).
Shankara never used the word mithya to suggest that the world is merely an illusion or a dream. Vedantic scholars like Shankara don't define mithya as being unreal or illusory. Instead, they define mithya as adhishtana ananyatvam, a state of dependent existence. Like the existence of a pot depends on clay, the existence of the world depends on brahman. And like a pot coexists with clay, but at a lower order of reality, the world of duality coexists with brahman because it is mithya.
If this is understood properly, there's no conflict whatsoever between non-dual brahman and worldly dualities, dualities like worshiper and worshiped, deity and devotee, God and man. All these dualities coexist with brahman, but at a lower order of reality.
Swami Tadatmananda is a traditionally-trained teacher of Advaita Vedanta, meditation, and Sanskrit. For more information, please see: www.arshabodha.org/

[@reliablespokenenglish1660]

The Vedantic thoughts are the first and the last answer to the so many intriguing questions that the humanity is searching for. What is expounded by the Swamiji is categorical and ultimate to the question, what this universe is , and what this life does mean. Salutation you Swami ,for the clarity of your thoughts and the Wisdom that you cherish.

[@thespssp]

Simply brilliant!! A must watch video for all . Thank you and pranaams Swamiji

[@bodiminds6571]

Namaskaram Swami , im really glad that you told the actual meaning of Mithya , otherwise Many Godmen are benefiting these days by making people believe that after death , they will go to some "higher planets" , papa punyam( although in modern day , these are replaced by the judiciary)j , etc etc etc , 9:03 Corrupt organisations like ISKM negate this , thus establishing that they dont know the scriptures and are blindly following their interpretation of another Human 11:37 excellent point sir , even Swami Chinmayananda explains the same using the analogy of a relative / husband/wife vs the photo of them 12:22 Swami , but we dont have evidence of a supreme individual being providing blessings , thus isnt the idea of Brahman more logically inclined and relevant to us than that of a deity 15:53 and some blind believers who dont understand advaita vedanta also spread conspiracy theories like lord shiva lives in the 11th dimension , some miracles , they think people can defy the laws of nature or Brahman 16:44 again a balanced , unbiased explanation , hats off to you Swami 18:41 but the problem arises when Organisations like iskcon try to Abhrahamise things and blindly believe that only their representation of god is true, hence from there , they spread a lot of pseudoscience , it is the first time i actually found a Guru true to his knowledge and logic

[@EmilyMiko]

These were some great questions this week, thank you for sharing!

[@ragaashish33]

Pranam Guruji, wonderful clarity, brilliant explanation.

[@deanyanko3326]

Pranam Swamiji (i) acknowledge Brahman mentally in everything I see and do . Sometimes I make statements that sound dualistic but am nondual. thank you.

[@SaundaryaYogaMarga]

Love your short films ❤. So happy to have come across this channel. So much knowledge shared so generously. Thank you 🙏 the metaphor of the pot and clay doesn't leave room to misunderstanding

[@nancyswanson1362]

Fantastic video, Thank you, Swami T! 🙏

[@chesstime_0720]

great answers! thank you!

[@ramamurthikartik1636]

Absolutely fantastic, clears lot of doubts

[@watersprite333]

Fascinating topics; thank you SwamiJi. 🙏🏼

[@koochithatha7486]

Salutations, Guruji! Thank you so much for the insightful videos. The inclusion of related questions is particularly appealing and useful. I pray for Iswara’s blessings for your continued good health and seva. Om Shanti 🙏🏼

[@AbhinavChaudhary-ll4mh]

Thanks for the video

[@benjamindsouza6736]

Thank you Swamiji! You have the divine gift of expressing complex matters in such a simple & understandable manner! 🙏🤍🙏

[@Rojayzee]

Beautiful explanation of these often confusing concepts. Thank you Swami! 🙏

[@shivendransingh3272]

Excellent and precise explanation. Grateful to guru ji.

[@kmanoham]

A masterpiece in explaining Vedanta. Only the best of the best could explain the complex concepts of Vedanta in a straightforward manner and with great eloquence. Thankyou Swamiji.

[@SureshK-lx6cx]

Excellent explanation, as always, swami.

[@PS-vw1vj]

Sir I got answers to many of my philosophical queries today in your explanation.

[@ranjitkulkarni4116]

Excellent video reconciling Advaita nondual Vedanta with dvaita dualist worship. It is true that many non dualist saints were the biggest devotees of God in a form like Adi Shankaracharya himself said Bhaja Govinda. But the explanation about higher and lower order suggests a hierarchy of spiritual perception. The question is do the dualists accept this hierarchy?

[@parasf2984]

Great video

[@user-ub8dh4wp8c]

Thanks, very interesting. I like that freedom.

[@BillSikes.]

Thank you Bindhu 🙏

[@StefanoPeschiulliInstructor]

Thanks so much GuruJi 🕉️ God bless You

[@nitzan505]

Thank you Swamiji for the wisdom you bestow upon us 🙏🏼🌺

[@EliAbramzon]

Wonderful discussion. I wonder if humans can even engage with the absolute formless and transcendent Brhaman, without any relationship to God - Ishvara. It's not human frailty but human nature.

[@amazingcalvin]

Very good video. It helped me to further understand the flexibility of worship in sanatana dharma is not offered by any other way of spiritual life. That you are not limited in your choices. Let's say you consider Krishna as your ishtadev (as in preferred form of god to worship, also can be translated as personal god). Krishna most definitely is portrayed as a male human, while retaining a lot of godly powers of course. That does not mean you are limited to worshipping Krishna only as the male king of Dwaraka or as the naughty and playful child he was during his early years. Your relationship with Krishna need not be as a superior being whom you are subservient to, although that is still a valid approach. You can see Krishna in any number of ways that seems most effective for you. As a friend, as a teacher, as a father, as a mother, as a brother, as a wife, as a son, as a servant, as a king, or even as a subject. All of them are valid as long as you have a deep personal connection with god in the form you prefer. The same goes for any other form of god or goddess that you wish to worship. Be it Shiva, Vishnu, Parvati, Lakshmi, Brahma, Saraswati, Durga, Kali, Ayyapa, Kartikeya, Ganesha etc. God is not always above you and you are not always below. There is no such hierarchy. God already exists everywhere especially within you. Which is why the philosophy of "Aham Brahmasmi" exists. This philosophy is not due to pride or arrogance. On the contrary, after truly recognizing the god within yourself, you will become more humble than anyone else and live your life constantly with this humility and respect in mind till the last moments of your death. This is also why it is pointless to argue over which god or form is the more supreme because all of these gods are simply roles played by the ever lasting Parabrahman, the eternal and formless god beyond which nothing can exist. A person's father is not limited only to being a father of his child. He is also a husband. A son. A grandson. An occupation holder. A devotee (if he is religious). Can you compare the role of this person as a husband to being a son of his parents? No. Because they are completely different roles and require different mindset, behavior and rules. This is also why various different sects exist, most notably Shaivites and Vaishnavites. Do not fall into the trap of seeing your preferred god as superior or inferior to others. Each of them have a reason to exist differently. This is not an ego battle. The moment you bring pride and ego in your spiritual life, you have already lost any progress you might have made till then. Shiva, the cosmic lord of destruction worships Rama, the human avatar of Vishnu. Meanwhile, Rama on earth builds shivling to worship and gain favours and weapons from Shiva. Both of them have absolute and deepest respect and amity towards each other. They also have the Harihara form which is half Vishnu and half Shiva, once again reiterating to devotees of both gods that neither of them are interested in proving to be superior than the other and that worship of one of them automatically means worship of the other. In the Vishnu sahasranama, Shiva once again agrees that just chanting the name of "Rama" is equal to chanting the entire sahasranama stotra and that he himself attains supreme bliss by chanting the name of "Rama". And regarding the male/female division of gods and goddesses, Shiva himself has another form called "Ardhanaarishwara" in which he appears as half Shiva and half Parvati further proving that male or female does not matter. Rama was born on Navami and Krishna was born on Ashtami, both of which are considered inauspicious days in the traditional calendar called the panchang. All these are further efforts by the gods to dispel all superstitions regarding Navami and Ashtami being considered bad days to do anything. If I have said anything wrong, please reply below so I can change it.

[@kanishkajoshi563]

🙏 Thank you Swami ji.

[@shubhamdubey7349]

Spiritual Revolution is the real revolution needed in today's time and surely one day it's seed will be sowed somewhere in the Indian soil.

[@alukuhito]

Thank you, Swami-ji. 🕉

[@VanessaSouza_02]

Thank you, Swami! 💛

[@saralakodukula3123]

🙏🙏🙏 Thank you so much Swamiji!

[@aarjukr]

Pranaam swami ji 🙏🙂

[@rajukunjukrishnan472]

Pranam Guruji 🙏

[@Pallasathena-hv4kp]

Pranam, Swami 🙏

[@girishnanoti954]

Pranam Swami ji

[@XYZG-rr3lu]

Thank you 😊 💓

[@dauzac1]

Thank you for sharing your knowledge. What about consulting a qualified Jyotishi , in order to receive an appropriate mantra to connect with your "deity" according to your birthdate and personnal "map of the sky" ? Thank you for your answer

[@kerrydubord5273]

The mind projects, Consciousness reflects, That reflection is That within everything, Outside the minds limitations Is thee reflecting consciousness, Brahma alone reflects all that is a single being of Consciousness.

[@MrArungoswami]

How does Nirgun Brahman bestows qualities in Saguna Brahaman. how do you give something which you dont have

[@axismundi8]

🌸🙏🌸

[@karthikeyannair3876]

❤❤🎉🎉🎉Namaskar

[@rupahegde1]

🙏🙏🙏

[@Nana-Kunwar]

🙏🏻

[@muralitvtv4105]

There is no reality in duality. Hariom Swamiji prostrating in your feet.

[@esneliamunoz5082]

🕉🕉🕉

[@ganeshmungal3251]

People create confusion about Bhagwan and worship and Bhagwan in the form and the formless and the universe. Folks everything is clearly explained in the Bhagaved Gita by Bhagwan Shri Krishna himself.

[@rosinante1016]

Wonderful, but animals do show love - sometimes greater than what we are capable of.

[@user-se3bw8ku8i]

one way or another westerners will come up with answers to god. good. so please tell us what is god, formless or not ?

[@RyanScarlett-jj3tf]

Krshnas tu bhagavan swayam

[@shantibahadoersingh3148]

🙏🏽🇸🇷🙏🏽🇮🇩🙏🏽🇬🇾

[@josephturner7569]

Why pray? Just be kind.

[@Omniverse9]

This seems a lot like placating people who aren't non-dualists, or have not woken up. They will do what they do, creating and praying to all manner of culturally relevant beings and seeing through the lens they have... even to the point of paying lip service to advaita. Maybe they understand nonduality to be the higher, more sophisticated path or see it as a challenging mental exercise. That so many people learn advaita and so few become enlightened shows this. After all... it ISN'T complicated. It is easier than learning about all these "forms" of g-d, various dogmas, practices, rituals, and stories. Advaita can be learned and understood in seconds if you are ready for it. Tolerance for the spiritual comfort food of people who will probably never "get" advaita is fine, and you see this in other non-dual schools of thought as well (Kashmir Shaivism, Taoism, Dzogchen, Panentheism etc.). In fact, many monotheists understand their highest truth to be basically nondual. Kabalists often understand the supreme truth Adonai Echad (The Lord Is One), not merely as there only being one divine being, but that ALL things are this being. The knower, the known and the process of knowing. In every case, praying... to any deity, seems to hamper actually understanding. If you knew all things to be part of you and that you were contiguous with the infinite ground of being... why would you ever bother with prayer. Praise, certainly. Gratitude and awe... sure. But prayer is extremely dualistic and puts the prayer as some grovelling lesser being at the feet of some entirely made up character... just to get something in the illusion that is meaningless. To each their own.

[@gita9282]

The definition of God in abrahamic religions is not the same as Bhagavan. There is no concept of non duality except in Sanatana Dharma. Swamiji please clarify if my understanding is correct.

[@krishnamoorthyvaradarajanv8994]

It's not formless but beyond and pervades It's foolish to define One or many or formless. What We find is available to our sense organs so it's not something commendable...

[@randykrus9562]

I prefer to wish upon a star.

[@AdhiyogaSystem]

God is not formless.

[@vik24oct1991]

Brahman is not a god.

[@AdhiyogaSystem]

@@vik24oct1991 That is only Terminology.

[@AdhiyogaSystem]

@@Ne0Freedom That is what I mean by Terminology. Also, Adi Shankara of Advaita has written commentary on Bhagavadgita. Bhagavadgita states, "ye yatha mam prapadyante tan tatha darshayamyaham". As you approach me, I show you exactly that way, formless or with form.

[@benjamindsouza6736]

That's not what the scriptures say; neither does our own experience! What about the all pervading consciousness we all possess....the consciousness that even science is now acknowledging in every atom??

[@AdhiyogaSystem]

@@benjamindsouza6736 What about the atom? Does atom have a form? How do you know atom? What do you mean by OUR? Who are we and our experience? Do we have a form? You will find the answer is "Yes". Everything has a form and is also a formless.

[@VedicOutlook]

this video is so great. i look at it like: god is formless but i live in form. by appealing to something personified (shiva) I am reaching out with my heart. the heart is where the formless and form meet. so even though god is not really a person or an object of any kind, i can communicate with it through the grace of the holy spirit (the bridge, if you will). ❤