Assassin's Creed | Haytham vs Shay (Who's The Better Templar?)

[@huyvouc9785]

Shay is the kind of character that have a mix of both Templars and Assassin's characteristics, so...if we're talking about a true Templar, Haytham fits more.

[@65firered]

Haytham does have more well-thought-out ideals and the conviction to completely follow through on them. Shay is more a Templar out of circumstance, most of his ideals came from the Assassins and were merged into his code. Shay does have conflict throughout Rogue about the Templar's ideals and his own while struggling to kill his former friends and allies. I think Haytham better embodies what the Templars believe and stand for, though Shay is one of the better Templars from a moral standpoint.

[@natchu96]

From a moral standpoint, Shay might just one of be one of the better balanced protagonists in the series period. He learned firsthand the dangers in assassin dogma and how they operate, and that control is needed in society for the safety of the people. But he's been with the assassins long enough that he probably does not take templar dogma of absolute control at face value either. And it's true that both groups unchecked are problematic and dangerous. Oppression is bad, but so is unchecked crime and cruelty, and Shay really just wants to protect people that need protection. Whichever organization's methods that may take. He is an assassin hunter, first and foremost, especially the corrupt/dangerous assassins. If the templars he worked with were just as bad he likely would've turned on them all the same. He's one of the bigger inspirations to Juhani Otso Berg, who made it his job in the templar order to kill assassins and corrupt templars alike.

[@ChrisMaxCisneros]

Heck Yeah I agree with this

[@ChrisMaxCisneros]

@@natchu96 agree with this as well

[@harrabi15]

Shay made the assassins in the colonies go instinct, Haytham made the dude who rebuilt the brotherhood.

[@driftydegree5624]

We need more AC Rogue videos it's a really important and interesting story.

[@matuskunik6779]

Agreed

[@driftydegree5624]

@@matuskunik6779 And there's something so unique about the templar weapons and armour that you simply cannot get in any other Assassins Creed.

[@kendrick58211]

​@@driftydegree5624 im telling u, the admiral outfit from ac rogue was the best outfit in the ac games in my opinion,

[@rithik8674]

Epilogue plot is so good

[@helghast_7203]

I love how whenever Haytham is in a competition on this channel, he wins. Not a critiscism (you make good points), I just find it funny.

[@eastsidereviews727]

Seeing Shay's years as a Templar after Rogue is a big reason why I want Ubisoft to do sequels again. We fall in love with these characters and after Ezio, we never see them again.

[@_Parad0x]

Haytham is better at his job, but I personally like Shay and his greater amount of imperfections more.

[@maxuspoint]

Shay is like the Templars personal assassin, that’s all.

[@RaulitoTheAssassin]

Shay would not like the word assassin😂 better said muscle

[@georgeprchal3924]

Maybe they'll have a crossover game: Haytham and Shay's Awesome Adventure.

[@Eddieavina123]

Love your video man and keep up the great work

[@philosotree5876]

"Today, we don red and white colors." But, Assassins also wear red and white.

[@jcaaata7338]

I absolutely agree with basically everything you said. I went into this 50 50 just like you said but also like you said I recognized that between from what weve seen of haytham and shays dedication to the templar order, haytham was more polar whereas shay was trying to protect the innocent, whichever side that be. Totally agree, great video man

[@mrowley7300]

Haytham is a great grandmaster and Shay is a great right hand man

[@Adeline123q]

Shay in the British Uniform, like Monroe's is amazing ngl, also Haythem in many ways, but Shay moraly

[@carlosesquivel5103]

In a way, Haytham is Darth Vader and Shay is his Starkiller.

[@renegade7548]

It was definitely shay. Bested some of the most impressive assassins to date, beaten legendary FLEETS and became a Templar despite him being an assassin made shay one of the best in the order. Also the only reason that he couldn't become a Templar master was because he began as an assassin however his decedent became one.

[@keiremu]

I love Haytham but Shay would absolutely destroy him in open combat and range combat. Haytham might be smart but I don't think it would be enough to beat Shay

[@ezioauditore6371]

Love both of these characters. Haytham is the most devoted Templar when it comes to ideals and Shay is the most effective Templar when out in the field. During the Colonial Era, Shay was the backbone for the Templars getting shit done and he solo'ed an entire Brotherhood branch by himself. Now who would win in a fight, I would say either Haytham mid diff, or Shay high diff. Though im leaning more towards Haytham since dude has god tier levels of finesse when fighting similar to Arno in Unity.

[@michaeltaylor815]

I always feel that Haytham has that wisdom bonus to him, and I would agree that like you said Shay never had anything on Templar ideologies, I think he agreed to help the Templars mostly because he saw good things that Colonel Monroe did and wanted to follow his footstep

[@robertorodriguez4304]

Shay is better at anything combat related (he also has a granade launcher and the rope dart) and the hidden blade is not effective against him even if taken by surprise aka nullified due to his heightened senses and razor sharp reflex. Shay is a better ship captain as well and the commander of templar fleets across the world. He eliminated the entire colonial brotherhood, liberated New York, NW Atlantic, and the river valley while boosting its economy giving the templars room to operate at ease. He is reportedly operating both America and Europe.

[@BlazerK1914]

Former Assassin vs Former Assassin Haytham: “A duel...” Shay: “...to the Death.”

[@65firered]

Conner: "GIVE ME LEE!"

[@stunna1226]

@@65firered 😭😭

[@RaulitoTheAssassin]

Haytham never ever was an assassin he had assassin training because of is father but he was not ever an official assassin like shay

[@zone6330]

We need the ultimate AC vs AC vid. Which game is Better Unity or Black Flag?

[@zer0fukz790]

The "I'm just kidding Ezio, I would never" and "I'm just kidding Connor" had me on the damn floor

[@shanekossiedowski6410]

Shay because he was trained by assassins and then betrayed his brotherhood, that takes strength

[@michellerahe4853]

This one's a no brainer. I think personally Shay was pretty naive through the whole game. But at the end his arrogance just drove him mad into believing he was on the side of saving the world

[@AlbedoAtoned]

Yeah, Shay jumped the gun, assumed the worst about the Assassin's at the time, and switched sides when he met that templar that seemed to be a genuinely good person. But when he saw the templars doing much the same thing, he didn't think anything of it and doubled down to avoid admitting he picked the wrong side. Sure, some of the assassins seemed to be cartoonishly evil, implying that either they really were going down the wrong path, or much of the info Shay was working with was wrong. But the choice to leave the assassins was made before any of that was shown. And it was made on an incorrect assumption, that Achilles knew what would happen at the start and that they just didn't care. Meanwhile, it is clear throughout the games that the Templars really WOULDN'T care what would happen. Shay comes across as well meaning, but very naive and not particularly smart. He either has double standards, judging the assassins by a different standard to the Templars, or he was blind to what the Templars were doing.

[@crafter7jake874]

hi i love your vids im always hapy when they come out (altough im probably not gonna watch this one bcs of spoilers for rogue) but this is the third comment where im asking/wondering if you are going to make a video about your thoughts about the ac chronicles games and if you want them to make more

[@Novelist1029]

Haytham is a Templar’s Templar this is not even a debate. It would be cool to see what happened with Shay after Rogue though.

[@jonasharrisjr3109]

They should make a wild west assassin's Creed with rdr2 realism Edit Edward kenway versus hytham kenway please

[@Voltage256]

In terms of who more embodies the Templar ideals more then Haytham is the clear winner there bc Shay only betrayed the Assassin's bc they were being dumb and careless even in the end and he clearly didn't want it to come to killing them but they left him no other choice really and I don't think he fully agreed with the way the Templars did things, but in terms of skill for me personally I think Shay would win in a fight but like just barely. I think he'd win by the skin of his teeth

[@idiotproductions3734]

Haythams mom never exsisted,Shays mother never exsisted,Your mom never exsisted

[@Toatekaha]

Great video as always Master Templar.👍🏾

[@JustABegginer]

Hayhtam would never really die by anyone if he didn't let himself be killed by Connor

[@DEADSOUL66]

Shay has an outfit called assassin killer 🥶.

[@celtic889]

Haytham is the better templar but Shay takes a 1v1 between the 2 of em

[@Mr.Monkeyreal7]

Haytham of course

[@jessicastrike5640]

I don’t think Shay should even count as a Templar, we get no content to show he actually agrees with their ideals or way of working. Shay was against the colonial Assassins, but that does not make him a Templar by default as far as I’m concerned he was just allied with them Haytham on the other hand was an excellent representation of a Templar. He truly made me think about the difference between the 2 organisations in his conversations with Connor and his approach to working in the colonies. Haytham is the best Templar in the series for me

[@twinzzlers]

It's canon that he began to believe in the templars

[@zanettabrown4029]

Bro I luv ur videos so much bro Ur my favorite assassin creed content creator

[@garrywilliams8730]

I couldn't pick a winner with this heavyweight contest

[@marcelomoreno7]

Shay would win a fight and he is the one who did the most of the work for the Templars.

[@Bluecreed01]

Shay still believes in the Assassin's and even through his Templar career he still remorses in fighting them

[@godzillazfriction]

that's only in shays 20s after that when searching for the box, he changed and became more ruthless and cold... him killing Charles dorian and showing no remorse and saying how he and the french templars will start another revolution of their own shows how shay changed

[@Bluecreed01]

@@godzillazfriction Well that's true, he still understands them to a point of view and so does Haytham

[@S_Scaling]

Hatham taught everything he needs to know about being a Templar

[@KRishi-ei1zl]

Even i like shay in ac rouge. Haytham is my all time favorite templar if it comes to competition. In Kenway saga Haytham and Edward is only my favorite.

[@samayoubi3408]

Can't decide both have points to their own against each other so I have no idea

[@JoshuaPrime]

"GIVE ME LEE"... I love AC3 so much, don't worry I'm also an Ezio enjoyer 🗿

[@RaulitoTheAssassin]

Haytham is a full templar mind even though a templar kill his father haytham still stay a templar Shay became a templar because of lisbon and more on monroe wend we saw haytham being ruthless shay look disgusted but keep quiet but after year shay became a templar full

[@PL9050]

Drip goes to Shay.

[@tut-4126]

At this point I know the entire story of Rogue without even owning it thanks to youtube videos and spoilers in them sooo... I might as well watch this XD I am sad about it as I feel like Templars idea for an ideal world is definitely a possibility. If left with freedoom on their hands, people will never have peace :/ Thus, my saddness comes from not playing Rogue and now not even having to :(

[@cambread2631]

Imo Shay because he was able to take out several “master” assassins and masters

[@k0ana889]

The only "master" assassins Shay really took down were Le Chasseur and Chevalier who Shay beat decisively in sword combat. Kessegowase was killed by a puckle gun, Adewale was snuck up and killed, Hope was killed while running away and Liam fell to his death. Overall, it shows more of Shay's intellect and tactics which can help kill master assassins.

[@ilonafaint]

@@k0ana889 Did u actually fight with Le Chasseur or do u mean the cut scene after defeating him ? Cause i used to kill him with a granade , so no sword combat there for me :)

[@k0ana889]

@@ilonafaint Shay didn't have the grenade launcher at that time. It was a couple years after Le Chasseur's death, is when he gets the grenade launcher.

[@ilonafaint]

@@k0ana889 omg lol u r right ! i confused him with Chevalier ! The Le Chasseur is killed with a throwing knife ! sorry , my bad :) it's way faster than using sword with him

[@redneck13265]

the father of understanding was Julius Ceaser from origins

[@wolfdown8267]

Shay had a son and grandson who he taught to be Assassin hunters so I’d say his contribution to the Templars at the very LEAST compares if not exceeds what Haytham did.

[@RaulitoTheAssassin]

How you know all this? Is there a book or a comic? Im curious

[@wolf-ks9ho]

Haytham in his old age beat connor. Connor in his phisikel prame guy who beates armyes

[@thegunlikdude]

Fun fact the father of understanding is revealed in origins end

[@pablochiarelli7818]

Master, any update in the who's the best equipped assassin video?

[@Ramiovillan]

You should do list of best assassin's gadgets. Least to best.

[@mastersaskashi8654]

“Haytham vs Shay. Who’s the better Templar?” Me: Yes.

[@Slap-dash]

I feel like haytham is a bit overrated as a character. And i feel like Shay is better at fighting even if haytham is good too but haytham tries to much to look cool and fancy while shay is very practical and defensive

[@overknightacention39]

"May The Father of Understanding Guide Us."

[@Tacobuotit0IsCool]

Great vid!

[@brodycaldwell9678]

For me this question's answer is summed up at the end of Rogue's story. Achilles was wrong and Haytham wanted him to die knowing it, but Shay was able to convince the GRAND MASTERY OF THE COLONIAL RITE that it was better for everyone to spare a Master Assassin's life. Otso Berg said it himself, "...There will always be Assassins who are willing to abandon their cause to serve our's. Yet there is no one who embodies this idea better than Shay Cormac..."

[@k0ana889]

Well it turns out Haytham shouldve killed Achilles because Connor literally undid the Templars lol

[@stunna1226]

JUst imagine how much Haytham was in pain after Cornnor hit him on his balls and still stand on his two feet Cornnor played DIRTY

[@johntrevy1]

I don't think Haytham had the outright goal of taking freedom for powers sake, but rather taking it to save humanity from itself. Haytham wasn't the problem, it was those he has under him that were the problem. People have got to stop having this kneejerk reaction to villains and start reading between the lines.

[@1980Shadowwolf]

I dont think Shay could go back to the Assassins even if in this instance he was right. Assassins likely had a KOS order on him. I still dont see Shay living to old age given eventually hed make a mistake and the Assassins would kill him.

[@erencormac3130]

Well he did live a very long age, very wealthy and happy enough to start a family and had assassin killer grandchild btw😏

[@spafieman-wq3bh]

If he chooses haytham then its clear hes bullshittin it cuz he has won in deadliest kenway and edward vs haytham

[@BlendyBoy1117]

can you make a video for which ac has the most interesting outside of the animus story?

[@TortillaTrooper]

Wassup my favorite AC creator.

[@thevigilant6884]

What about El Tiburón vs Shay or Haytham?

[@Templars3664]

Haytham would probably win by shooting him and oversmarting him (just like Edward did). Shay even without guns would demolish him

[@marianamatha9501]

Im the first here also love your vids keep up tbe good work

[@Amfalosa]

i feel like Haytham is the right decision but i wouldnt argue with a Shay fan

[@nivrh8155]

Can you do parkour comparison between AC 3 and unity?

[@xxpizzagodxx494]

Unity>Ac3 parkour

[@spacecadet8212]

Title: The Demon's Awakening FADE IN: EXT. CLOVER KINGDOM - DAY A group of mages are fighting against an army of demons that have invaded the Clover Kingdom. Asta, the main character, is leading the charge with his anti-magic sword. Suddenly, a powerful demon appears in front of him, blocking his path. ASTA (with determination) I won't let you harm anyone else! I'll defeat you and protect everyone! DEMON (laughing) You think you can defeat me? You're nothing compared to the power of the demons. Asta charges at the demon with his sword, but the demon easily blocks his attack and sends him flying. Asta lands on the ground, hurt but not defeated. ASTA (gritting his teeth) I won't give up! I'll keep fighting until the end! Suddenly, a dark energy emanates from Asta's sword, enveloping him in a black aura. The demon looks surprised. DEMON (alarmed) What's happening? That power... it can't be! Asta rises to his feet, his eyes glowing with a black light. ASTA (in a demonic voice) I won't let you harm anyone else! Asta charges at the demon, his speed and strength amplified by the demonic power. He strikes the demon with a powerful blow, sending it flying. The demon crashes into the ground, defeated. ASTA (panting) What... what happened to me? Suddenly, Asta collapses to the ground, unconscious. The other mages rush to his side. YUNO (alarmed) Asta! What's wrong? One of the mages examines Asta and gasps. MAGE (shocked) His body... it's being taken over by a demon! The mages try to awaken Asta, but it's too late. The demon inside him has awakened, and it's taking control of his body. FADE TO BLACK

[@anaspatel6027]

1:01 wait, isn’t Julius Caesar the father of understanding? Please correct me if I’m wrong.

[@undertaker3346]

No

[@erencormac3130]

He is

[@highspeedtechnical]

please make video on should you play metal gear solid 5 in 2023 ign review10/10

[@calebdegruise3942]

Can we do Edward kenway vs Jacob Frye

[@child8669]

haytham vs Edward. also you should do double battles like "x" and "x" vs "x" and "x"

[@Goated_diddy1]

Haythem mixed both assasin and templar belief and ideals into his life and understood both sides

[@psgamer-0199]

Am I missing something? Am I stupid? I must be stupid. I recently played AC3 twice and I have played AC3 several times, and never have I gotten the impression that Haytham spares Connor's life. At least not during their last encounter. Each time Master Assessin brings this up, is it about their last encounter? Or about Haytham saving Connor at his execution? I'm confused because I'm and time again Haytham tells Connor that he doesn't really care about his son. Yes, he is curious about him. But ultimately I think it was clear he was very willing to kill Connor at Fort George. He even dies while trying to strangle Connor.

[@guillaumegagne8068]

i like shay cause rogue is my firth ac. i like haytam part oof ac3 but i think the conor plrologue was too long

[@Helldiver_M1]

Shay is more of an enforcer

[@tigga2300]

Haytham was a better Templar, but that doesn't mean that Shay was a bad one. He remained loyal till death once he joined their ranks. As far as achievements go, Shay led the destruction of an entire branch of Assassins that resulted in Haytham building a powerful Templar presence in the North American Colonies. Haytham was a better leader, but Shay was a better Enforcer.

[@sahilvaity3355]

I make my own luck Haytham. 😅

[@user-fr7pb]

bro really said shay has more stealth than haytham bro are you serious look at all haytham has done example... biggening of ac3 any ways rest of vid is good still haytham beats them all.

[@Samuel-it7od]

Which one I should buy Ac Syndicate or Ac Valhalla ??

[@IlyaasRyklief809]

I'm your 1000 viewer btw

[@HusseenYT]

Shay is not a Templar, he is fighting for the creed. While on the other hand, Haytham is a templar. He grew up knowing what the templars is fighting for. As being a templar, Haytham won this. Haytham doesn't have the same creed as connor and edward.

[@YTCProductions]

Haytham imo over shay But in a fight i think shay can beat haytham

[@Truedarkness6478]

Haytham can't climb trees.

[@davidalejandrosantosgarcia5924]

"The father of understanding" is an allegory of Baphomet "The father of the light" who the knights templars supposedly worshipped :)

[@jjs_guides]

shay lol

[@gamikash7499]

shay neggs , and dont forget what weapons they have

[@monstermcface838]

Team Haytham

[@Jax_Random]

You should do far cry primal bs far cry new dawn

[@danny7481]

HI MASTER TEMPLAR 😅

[@masterassassin791]

HI

[@The_DK404]

Wait why is this even a video? Haytham takes the W bcz A) Master Templar is extremely Bias toward Haytham. B) He is like really good? idk i havnt played ac 3 but i know he is good

[@ghostrider3854]

i'm ur biggest fan

[@RaulitoTheAssassin]

Shay

[@LLeafie]

ballin

[@ghostrider3854]

epic video

[@PaynetoTheMax-gg1hu]

Haytham is the definitive templar

[@HarrisonFitzpatrick]

Shay wins in a fight

[@punkdallas1646]

It's really just believing the ideals over doing what's right. Haytham: Assassin moveset (because of Edward) with a Templar mind. (Because of Reginald Birch) Shay: Kinda bad at stealth to the point of the beginning is just a tutorial teaching him. (Then while with the Templars , if memory serves me correctly stealth was important for only a few sequences). Assassin mindset because the Assassins in Rogue were just portrayed as pirates and thugs, Shay just wanted the opposite of that.

[@HariKrishnan-rs3fc]

Haytham 😊

[@kaivos]

Drop check assassin