AT vs ESC / the best vivobarefoot sole for rugged hiking

[@AndrewFolts]

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[@anniwilson2534]

ESC all the way for me. Vivo need to use it on more styles. I’d love a trail running shoe with it (not the Hydra which I couldn’t get the right sizing). Also putting this ESC sole on a waterproof rubber wellington boot for us dog walkers would be awesome.

[@AndrewFolts]

An ESC Wellington would be rad! Trail runners too, although they'd have to make the lugs a bit thinner, since a 9.5mm sole is a little too clunky for running.

[@anniwilson2534]

@@AndrewFoltsyes totally agree!

[@gvarph7212]

I think the AT sole would have been slightly better for me, but I ended up going with the Magna ESC because the leather just felt that much more comfortable

[@AndrewFolts]

Yea, the Magna and Tracker ESC are really comfortable. For rough terrain you can't go wrong with the AT or ESC, just a bit more ground feel vs more protection.

[@melanieavans6072]

I love the michelin soles! I went from wearing platform vans etc. (the thicker the platform, the better!) to barefoot and I can't go back to those narrow toeboxes and few mm drops, but I sometimes miss a little bit of a thicker sole. Especially now in late fall/winter, I find the ESC to be really comfortable but also my feet are not cold. I have yet to try them in some really difficult terrains but for everyday use and light hikes, so far they're my favourite.

[@AndrewFolts]

Yea, there are some days, especially if it's cold+wet, when a thin sole doesn't cut it and it's nice to have some separation. Cheers on making the leap to barefoot! (:

[@jamieorc]

I bought a pair of Magna Forest ESCs recently. They are absolutely amazing shoes. Less ground feel for sure, but wow. I put 3mm Northsole insoles on top of (later under b/c they were a little short) of some Vivo Thermal Insoles I'd replace the others (why on Earth does Vivo put the Thermals in the other Magnas, but not the ESCs???). That combo really increased the warmth and snugness of the shoes. I'm a happy camper. The soles are wonderfully grippy. I was hiking the other day with a friend and she was slipping on some patches of compacted, icy snow and I had no problem. They are much heavier than the FGs of course. I don't consider the FGs useable in the wetter, Winter months here in NM because they just have no real grip in mud and snow and slush. Otherwise, I absolutely love the Magna FGs.

[@AndrewFolts]

Yea, the ESC definitely shines in awful conditions, ha. Like having a pair of monster truck tires for mud and slush. Glad they're working out well for you, and cheers to many more miles of adventures!

[@cristi724]

The ESC is simply amazing, I wish they had more models with it. Tried the AT, wasn't for me, especially for city walking those lugs just hammered my feet.

[@AndrewFolts]

Yea, the ESC does feel like overkill for roads, but the lugs are wider and somehow less noticeable than the AT.

[@grueneauen]

Wow are you disciplined, such a fast reaction to my request. Thank you so much. 😊👊🏻

[@AndrewFolts]

It's nice to be at inbox zero for comments. They pile up very fast if I don't answer right away, ha!

[@ArialTheCat]

Thank you for the comparison! Which one is wider in the toe box?

[@AndrewFolts]

Hey Monica, the ESC is wider.

[@ArialTheCat]

@ Thank you, sadly AT is not for me. ESC is just barely wide enough for me 🥺

[@valdius85]

These shoes are equivalent of the super car for me 😂 I’m not ready yet, for now I’m using Topos. The Vibram MegaGrip is just what is says - mega 😂

[@AndrewFolts]

Love the Megagrip tread, it's so freakin' sticky, ha. Like what Spider-Man would wear if he went backpacking.

[@grueneauen]

So, EXPLORER MID MENS, TRACKER AT (both with the AT Sole), and ESC are here now. My first big issue: The red V-part on the AT sole. On both soles the red V-part is at least 2 mm higher compared to the profile coming after that in the toe section. So the big toe is always pushed away from the ground and I am afraid that causes pains on the long run as well. And I think also using a second insole is a bad hack to compensate this wired construction. Probably this is already the reason for me not to buy AT shoes from them. Sad! 😥

[@AndrewFolts]

Interesting, the red part is def harder, but not any higher in mine. I don't use two insoles, just one wool felt insole. I rarely use Vivo's stock thermal insole, because it's too thick and less flexible. Although the ESC is thicker with less ground feel, it is more smooth.

[@grueneauen]

@ Yes, first time I also thought maybe it’s an production error but then the second pair with the same problem. But it’s just the front of the V that is higher. Strange. 🤔🙄😢 Right, it feels really smooth and comfortable from day one, like no brake in necessary … I just was thinking the ATs are more the swiss army boot version. But the ESCs feel way more natural.

[@NerdysseusYT]

I wish they would release a Primus Trail Knit with the ESC sole.

[@AndrewFolts]

Yea, that would be wild! People seem to really like the ESC, so maybe they will.

[@grahamambridge2856]

Thanks for your reviews. I enjoy them. I could be wrong but tbe AT tread is 4mm rather than 6.5 mm according to the website (unless you mean its 6.5 mm overall for the sole plus tread perhaps?) Just got those black boots today! (u.k.) interestingly my Topo insoles fit on top of the vivo ones almost exactly for more protecton should i need it. 1st pair of vivos....so lets see.....Warm regards, Sheffield, uk.

[@AndrewFolts]

The lugs are 4mm, the midsole is 2.5mm, so it's a total thickness of 6.5mm. Always nice when the insoles fit multiple shoes. Have fun out there!

[@christopherspatz5852]

How about an all-around comparison of the Magna ESC with an approach shoe featuring the Vibram rubber, like the Scarpa Crux?

[@AndrewFolts]

A good one might be the Magna ESC vs Softstar Switchback kzbin.info/www/bejne/r5PTkJpjbd9lrNE, which uses a Vibram Megagrip tread. I'll add that to my list of videos, thanks for the idea!

[@christopherspatz5852]

Thank you for the consideration. Compare them on some long slabs in the Daks or the Gunks.

[@robertsoliz6821]

Are either of these soles better for wet and slippery rocks?

[@AndrewFolts]

I'd say the ESC is a little better of flat, slippery surfaces, and the AT is a little better on muddy hills. But flat/wet rock is tough for any boot, because there's so little texture to grip onto. The Vibram Megagrip tread, like on the Softstar Switchback kzbin.info/www/bejne/r5PTkJpjbd9lrNE is the best for that, but you still have to be careful.

[@kostadinradevski8727]

Hi , can you compare Michelin soles from Vivo and Xero . Which one have a better grip on wet and rocky terrain ( also quality of them )

[@AndrewFolts]

Vivo's Michelin soles are much better, because they have way more flexibility. The Xero's I've tried with a Michelin tread were stiff as a brick and basically unwearable.

[@kostadinradevski8727]

@@AndrewFoltshow about the ground feel it’s a bit painful when you step or sharp rock or not that bad ? Because until now I am using my Salewa wildfire mid boots

[@kostadinradevski8727]

And I hope Vivo gonna make a vegan friendly barefoot with ESC soles , because this is with a real leather

[@AndrewFolts]

@@kostadinradevski8727 Vivo's ESC sole is super protective at 9.5mm. I walk on rocks with a thin 4mm sole no problem, so you should be totally fine in the ESC. You can always add a soft insole for more padding, if needed.

[@kostadinradevski8727]

@@AndrewFolts from where you bought your wool insoles it’s look nice

[@marko-182]

Are Esc waterproof? I am considering Tracker Forest Esc for snow hiking

[@melanieavans6072]

Andrew has a video on them, they're not exactly waterproof but they're okay in puddles.

[@AndrewFolts]

No, just water resistant, although the resistance is high, especially when you keep them treated with leather balsam (beeswax+lanolin), which Vivo sells. bit.ly/3QU7EeV

[@marko-182]

@@AndrewFolts tnx 🙏

[@HokanaMatata]

I wish they made a michelin sole similar to the ESC but with less lug height and more ground feel.

[@AndrewFolts]

Vivo's stock rubber is getting pretty good, IMO. Both my road/casual shoes and mid thickness hiking ones grip maybe 80-90% as well as the ESC, and the flexibility and small lug width actually increases grip, allowing more of the tread to wrap around curved objects. Like the Primus FG, for example. kzbin.info/www/bejne/jWXamp6rprV7kJI

[@atzedevries9563]

I am was actually not that impressed with the ESC soles, especially on wet rock slabs... I think the rubber is still to hard and the lugs to far apart, which results in just less contact area.

[@AndrewFolts]

They've spaced the lugs that way, because they're quite thick and if you put thick lugs close together the shoe begins to feel like a brick. The Free Mudee is a good example of this. Super rugged boot with lots of surface area, but very little flexibility. That also creates a problem for grip, because when the tread won't bend, it can't wrap around curved objects, which actually ends up reducing total surface area. In general it's tough to grip on wet rock slabs, because they're so slick and don't provide much for rubber to grab on to. Better to just use a tread you like overall and be mindful on slippery terrain.