August - Players Ironically Buy Stats Champs Wont Want/ Item Trade-Offs/ Minions Have Gotten WEAKER

[@Frightning]

1:10 The real insight here is that the concepts of synergy between related stats (ex: health+resistances for defense, and AD+AS+Crit or AP+AH+pen or AD+CDR+pen for offense), and that of diminishing marginal utility (+100 AD on someone with 100 AD is a doubling of their AD, give them another +100 and that 2nd +100 is only a 50% increase in their total AD over the 200 they already had) make it so that you want to the strongest combination of synergistic stats you can get for the purpose you are buying them, and that base stats are most effectively leveraged by *related* synergistic stats, not more of the stat in question.

[@sebastiangalger8800]

Like Bel'Veth. She already has the highest attack speed in the game. More attack speed is good, but it'll never be better than more AD

[@mickeynott1456]

that's exactly why i play ap garen

[@itsyourguyskye]

crit soraka ❤️

[@Thezanlynxer]

all champions have 0 base AP which means everyone should build AP

[@Sparlex1]

Then why does Aatrox have high base hp,when you force Aatrox players to build HP to get more healing, while Lethality Aatrox still is stronger.

[@tupacshakur5868]

at this point you should've realised that august just talks for the sake of talking.

[@WoodsRunner]

@@tupacshakur5868cope

[@AnimeFrankReynolds]

does he not have high hp because his out of combat regeneration is low? A character designed around healing in a fight needs to have a health bar that has room to be refilled.

[@clashcrafter]

him having high hp is part of the reason he gets away with building lethality. if he had more resists and less hp, building hp would be more efficient on him. now he's a bit of a unique case cause he heals from his damage, so in a weird way building more damage gives him more effective hp through healing, which would also benefit more from higher resists but not from higher hp.

[@donvitopatata]

​@@clashcrafterhe also has higher hp thanks to having adc levels of hp regen to balance his lifesteal. It enables a bit more wiggle room

[@Derperfier]

5:50 so much for minions being weak, they just ended the last ever LCS series ever! XD

[@hunglee7529]

this is especially true for Thresh in ARAM, he gets to collect all minions souls so without buying any armour you just get 200 naturally at 15 minutes, so you build MR and you are unkillable

[@Frightning]

7:50 Mages *are* actually pretty complete at 1st item, but this is ok because the class reaches peak relative power in midgame (similar to many fighters), so they need to feel pretty complete at 1 item if they going to be able to actually be strong and impactful in the part of the game they're meant to be strong and impactful. They of course, pay for this by not scaling that well into late game compared to classes (and specific champions) that do need multiple items to feel complete.

[@MihaiStelianPricop]

Veigar,aurora,asol, leblanc, malzahar, vex being 3k hp tanks with 100mr and armor and 700ap (yes most of those have scaling in their kits, but i feel like many more mages could be in this list)

[@Frightning]

@@MihaiStelianPricop They also deal basically 0 damage outside of their spells, which have cooldowns (and AP items, somewhat intentionally, have only modest access to AH). Mages have much closer to linear growth in power than, say, marksmen, because they mostly stack AP and get AH/magic pen where they can (so at best, it's cubic scaling, but realistically access to AH and especially magic pen is limited). Meanwhile ADCs can freely build almost whatever combination of AD+AS+crit they want, which is Cubic scaling, and if you include their admittedly limited access to pen, then you're look at 4th power (quartic) scaling. This is why mages are midgame champions, they reach peak relative power (compared to other champions) by 2 items+boots typically.

[@Frightning]

6:00 Here's an easy (but probably *very* impactful) one you could do: Remove the effect that causes minions to deal half damage to champions.

[@seamusrichardson5601]

It probably shouldnt be removed entirely and rather nerfed. Double damage minions would just delete you.

[@dreamergamer9291]

@@seamusrichardson5601 yeah it would make freezing waves pretty much impossible unless you have sustain

[@Frightning]

@@dreamergamer9291 I remember what minion aggro was like without it because iirc, there was a season (or part of one) where minions had roughly current damage output and no half-damage to champs effect. I kinda think it did a lot to limit the potential of matchups to be grossly one-sided because minions were strong initially. Now we tend to have most champs having maybe 1-3 matchups that are almost unplayable if both parties are comparably skilled at piloting their champion and good at the game generally.

[@deejaydee1578]

@@Frightning It would be exceedingly hard to balance however because nowadays a lot of the most 'unfun' champs LIKE being in a wave - Irelia, Yasuo, Yone in some regards, Jax, Warwick etc. If minions do more damage than in a big wave on both sides those champs just steamroll the other side

[@Frightning]

@@deejaydee1578 Well, you get creep aggro by damaging a enemy champ with a basic or targetted spell, so those champs if anything will have issues fighting the way they want to because of where they put themselves. I think if anything it would reduce the amount of frustration those champs can generate.

[@zingthegnar]

When/where does August stream? (Id love to talk to him about the game)

[@NightridingDoom]

twitch.tv

[@minutenreis]

Twitch augustuwu, unscheduled afaik and doesn't usually leave vods up

[@tabrakan]

i found out about this when i had the idea to play gnar adc lol. without health items gnar is barely a champion anymore

[@Doublejho]

yeah his hp as a base is on par with yuumi, that's what it takes to balance a ranged character with mobility for toplane (take notes riot games)

[@NightridingDoom]

You are contradicted on zed/zeri part with a bunch of champions: Aatrox, Akali, Sylas being the prime examples.

[@Bladius_]

Sylas and Aatrox are heavy healing based champs, they need different defensive balance to compensate, so not a good comparison.

[@NightridingDoom]

@@Bladius_ It may be that they are healing based, but they also have seriously high base stats. Sylas is on par with sett in terms of his tankyness.

[@riven4121]

@@Bladius_ Sylas at level 18 has the second highest HP in the game

[@MihaiStelianPricop]

Yea akali is ridiculous, she has like highest base hp scaling in the game, she could build hp ap items but does not need to, she basically has no need for energy since her abilities use a small amount and W gives energy back, so high tankyness, high mobility, high dmg and going unselectable gives very little counterplay to that champion, you are better off waiting for the enemy to troll rather than "waiting for the kill opportunity" cause there wont be opportunities at all

[@NightridingDoom]

@@MihaiStelianPricop Sweeping lens. Akalis worst nightmare is sweeping lens as it does detect where she is at, allowing you to use your AoE to kill her. Also, ironicly, kaisa is inredibly powerful against akali, but you do need to build defensively (Wits end rush) and if you miss your W, back off. Sylas though, nothing but keeping your range helps against him.

[@mllhild]

Minions need a percentage buff in damage to champions

[@rascallr7517]

dont understand why there is an anti shield item for ad assassins, I think shields are supposed to be the counter to assassins, so now assassins can counter the counter?

[@chevoyingram9589]

And you think wrong. Armour counters ad assassins are you fucking stupid. You don't even play league do you. Please do everyone a favour and shut the fuck up before you decide to speak

[@idiothead5511]

it makes them waste an item slot, and that doesnt help them assassinate people without shields nearly as much

[@Doublejho]

there should be more antishield options for every role, tbh, people complain about healing but a shield comp is absurd to try and fight

[@RyanReynolds42069]

Why does akali have so much hp if shes known for buying hp items like rocketbelt and riftmaker?

[@Skylark0000]

No one builds riftmaker on akali and rocketbelt is worse than her lichbane build which kinda exactly proves his point? Modern akali has been forced off tank/bruiser builds in favor of raw ap and damage.

[@-sorta]

resistances. thats it.

[@LoLAjax]

Reason why Udyr, Nunu, Sion are bottom ten in base stats. So they are forced to build tank.

[@snakeinabox7220]

Nunu was forced out of ap with actual below adc lv base stats. There is games where nunu + tank item has the same hp as a adc. Sion gets infinite hp , so low base hp doesnt matter . Udyr .... he be vibeing

[@SappyEuphoria]

Honestly I wonder if we go back far enough we could find one point where it could be made “balanced” since yeah now no fucking way I think I have a better chance of getting a teammate who gifts me a skin for carrying them over that happening

[@NightridingDoom]

season 5 it was a possibility. But the reason it was possible was because of the tank meta. Guess what happened? they removed tanks.

[@dreamergamer9291]

@@NightridingDoom tank meta was stupidly wrong because assassins built tank items and one shot you anyway

[@NightridingDoom]

@@dreamergamer9291 And you built tank items and assasins were useless while you still outdps'd them. Banshee was OP alone xd

[@tonyluiscomedy]

Please God someone tell this man how to say the word especially

[@MEnUequals2]

whats the problem? adcs buying tank and being too tanky while doing lots of dmg or adcs buying damage and doing too much damage beeing tanky? if adcs buy tank items instead of adc items, nerf the tank items for adc... titanic on ranged, jaksho 30% dmg reduction for melee and ranged, and weird dual resist bow just have it coming if they are good on carries. except for gnar there isnt even a ranged tank for titanic so katarina with her R and Adcs just get it if its strong enough.

[@MeistroEckhart]

I don't like it. Bruiser should have more base stats than a ADC, doesn't matter why or what august wants. That's just how it should always be

[@BorkBigFrighten2]

"I want the game to be this way, and it doesn't matter why I want the game like this. I just want it like this."

[@MeistroEckhart]

@@BorkBigFrighten2 Teemo should have more base stats than malphite? Than aatrox? Look at them, my guy.

[@BorkBigFrighten2]

@@MeistroEckhart I never said I disagreed with your point. I'm just saying that your argument that you used initially was incredibly faulty.

[@s1stemique]

U def doesnt understand why its like that. Make ADC have poor stat lvl 1 and they ll get all in by a lvl 1 supp in pure 1vs1 every game. Growth IS actually what matters and thats the main diff between bruiser and adc btw.

[@s1stemique]

And i ll add, adc are built to be like 3lvl lower than sololanes AT every point of the game except AT lvl 18 which anyway doesnt matter cause ADC in ultra late game are the only Real carries. Great base stats compensate (a very lil bit) for these absurde exp diff (each lvl worth around 400 golds in stats so almost 1.2k more in stats just for like playing the game)

[@einjharrelraca]

why does zeri have more hp than zed? she doesn't until level 8?? at every point before that zed has more than her? not to mention zed has more armor and mr than her at all points as well. and zed plays the game from a minimum of 925 range for 80% of the game, meanwhile zeri plays the game at 750 range? Oh and zed will always be on average 3 levels above her, so in reality she doesn't have more hp than him until she hits level 18, after sitting 3 levels minimum down on him for the majority of the game before that point. like, there isnt a reason zed should have more hp than zeri to begin with at all. XD the dude has more resistances than her, and outranges her the VAST majority of the time. XD

[@briancomforti3890]

*screams in Pyke Passive*

[@angelfury8182]

Riot doesn't really balance league. They move champs in and out of meta to keep it "new and exciting". However, they do it too often and too extreme. It's hard to main a champ without having it or its items gutted every other patch. I found a new game. Been happy ever since.

[@HakunonKishinami]

this is why i play rell in every role destroy all shield users!

[@dtstar331]

And then there's ASol, who has one of the lowest base hp in the game, one of the lowest base armor in the game and one of the lowest base damage in the game so he has to build full damage to have any impact and dies a sneeze unless he builds actual tank items

[@homyachock]

I mean, this champion is destroying the whole map late game (overreacting, obviously). He should be squishy

[@儀水鏡の妖怪霊]

That's in great part because he was building Liandry's and Rylais, which both have health on them. It's the same rule applied to the trend of building like that.

[@jzzz121]

You talk as if Rylais isn't completely broken on Asol

[@itsyourguyskye]

give that fucker his balls back PLEASE

[@Lodeous]

You don't have to build full damage on asol. He gets plenty from his stacks and his ap ratios aren't good. You need mana, utility, and a % magic pen item late game. He feels pretty tanky with seraphs, rylais, and liandries.