Automatic Threading on the Lathe (Locomotive Build)

Instagram: mr_crispin
Dave Ticehurst's KZbin Channel:
/ @daveticehurst4191
In this video I set a Coventry die head to produce threaded studs for my Locomotive Slide Bars. The threads are 6BA and cut in silver steel.
The lathe is a Myford ML7 and the Locomotive under construction is a B1 Springbok in 5" Gauge.

[@anthonycash4609]

Would you give the name and make of the pins that you said was sent to you. I have been looking for a fine line pin that would work on metal. I've seen them on other channels but no one every says who the maker is. Thanks and very good videos.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

They go by the name of 'Pica Ink'

[@anthonycash4609]

@@MrCrispinEnterprises thank you.

[@wlogue]

Thanks and cheers from the U.S.

[@harry8506]

I got two of these tapping heads with an old lathe I purchased, till now I had no idea how they worked, thank you.

[@twotone3070]

Never seen that before, but then there has been no reason for me to have. Really enjoyed it, thank you.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks

[@secretsquirrel6124]

covenrty diehead was made for a capstan lathe worked a lot on them back in the 1990's then things moved on shout out to anyone that worked for or are working for Stainless Steel Fasteners in Chesterfield Derbyshire

[@un-factory]

Your technical skills are top notch. I cheer for you.🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉

[@TBJK07Jeep]

Enjoyed the video. Made me laugh when you said finish watching my video first then head over & see Dave’s. My Monarch 10EE has the 5c hand wheel which isn’t as fast as the quick closer but pretty fast. It is on my list to get geometric die heads.

[@TBJK07Jeep]

Side note, I see I did already watch his Wohlhaupter boring/facing head

[@TheKnacklersWorkshop]

Hello Mr. Crispin, Interesting video regarding the Coventry die head and well done for giving Mr. Ticehurst a shoutout, I really enjoy his channel. Take care. Paul,,

[@stewartross1233]

Quite an ingenious tool. I love how when Engineers require a solution they design it, make it, refine it and use it! So satisfying.

[@somebodyelse6673]

GOOD Engineers do that. The other kind never leave the office and their problematic designs get sent to whichever unfortunate machine shop got the bid on the job.

[@ydonl]

A nice fruit basket full of various interesting issues and mechanisms and procedures! Thanks for that.

[@dougrundell947]

Mr. Crispin, Good shot with the hat, spot on.

[@jimcrichton8028]

Interesting little job. Nice to see that its not always plain sailing even for properly trained folk!

[@adeeponionbrah]

Good to visit with you Mr!

[@phillipyannone3195]

You can never watch too many automatic thread cutting videos. As usual you are mastering the process.

[@tonyatlantis4564]

Allo Mr.Crispin,back in the mists of time when I did my stint on the capstan lathes (in the aircraft industry) I would set the dies by using the set screws to get the dies in the ballpark and use the fine adjust lever to open or close them until a drill shank or pin of the correct root diameter would enter the dies with the slightest of drag.That usually got me very close.Also to set the auto opening position I would pull the diehead forward until it just opened and wedge a piece of packing in the gap at the back.Move the diehead forward until the face of the dies was at the desired opening position and set the relevant stops(s).For small threads that have small thread lengths use a smaller diehead.Hope this may be of some use to you.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks that's useful information

[@stevecallaghan3245]

@@MrCrispinEnterprises Thanks again for a wonderful video. Watching the operation you definately need a capstan. Is there one available for the Myford??

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Yes I believe so

[@localele1]

The smaller die head is the go.Smaller dies and much less bulk to work around. I have been using a 5/16" Die head for years and recently bought a 1/4" Die head off an old machinist which came with many sets of BA threads in both steel and brass grinds. With regard to threading speed I have read old texts where the threads are run at turning speed.It is worth a try to be a bit faster but length of thread is a big factor here as well. I use my heads on both my manual lathes but also an old Hardinge turret lathe so usually slow the speed for threads. A nice video for people to learn a few old tricks.I am still amazed that die heads ever went out of fashion in machining workshops.

[@stuartmccall5474]

@@stevecallaghan3245: Yes Steve, but you trade off your place in heaven for fitting one!

[@edpopelas2844]

Well the only professional advice I have to offer is if you haven’t yet watched all of Mr Crispin’s videos you are missing out on great entertainment with some fantastic education thrown in. I’ll be sure to check out Dave’s channel as well. Cheers!

[@roncartwright4092]

Thank-you Crispin another great video.

[@KevinWoodsWorkshop]

Good to see you back working on your loco.

[@glennfelpel9785]

Fantastic analysis of the machining process and also the analysis of the set-up and its particulars. Thank you for your efforts and teaching.

[@terrycannon570]

Excellent demonstration. Thanks for bringing us along

[@StuartsShed]

That is a very ingenious tool. I have to admit that with the upcoming need for custom studs for my own stationary engine this tool has some significant appeal.

[@robertling9872]

Great to see your progress.

[@mchiodox69]

Well done...great video

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks

[@bcbloc02]

The smaller the thread the fussier it is. Those model size threads would drive me nuts.

[@MidEngineering]

Very good review/demonstration of the Coventry Die Head . I totally agree with your conclusions at the end of the video, especially regarding ER collets vs 5C ones.

[@ianpendlebury3704]

I have a much smaller Coventry die head and always wondered what those opposing Allen grub screws did...... and now I know! So thanks!

[@MrPossumeyes]

Thanks, Mr Crispin.

[@andrewdolinskiatcarpathian]

Very interesting and informative. Thank you for sharing. 👏👏👍😀

[@petermcneill80]

Really enjoyed the video , Coventry die head is very interesting and a pleasure to watch operate

[@eddjordan2399]

legendary start

[@steveallarton98]

Good morrow Mr Crispin, My weapon of choice for small threads is my little 1/4” Coventry Diehead, which I think that I have mentioned before - I suspect that yours is a bigger model, which might be the reason for some of the problems which you experienced. The 1/4” model will cut threads down to 12 BA ! Recommended cutting speeds are : Tough steels : 5 - 8 ft/min General mild steel work : 10 - 20 ft/min Free cutting bolt steels : 25 - 50 ft/min Cast iron : 8 - 12 ft/min Brass and copper : Speeds as for turning By my reckoning, screwing 6BA on silver steel should be at around 275 rpm. Lubricant should be either soluble oil, or an extreme pressure cutting oil, although I tend to use tapping paste eg. Trefolex, as it stays where you put it ! Should you need it, I have the book of the Coventry Diehead, if you need a copy to refer to . . . Incidentally, there is an arrangement shown in the book which is a combination of the one which you came up with in your earlier presentation, and the one which I described, that I inherited. Kind regards, Steve A.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks for the info

[@retromechanicalengineer]

Very good explanation of the Coventry Die Head. Impressive hat throwing skills too. A true all rounder this Crispin. Best wishes, Dean.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks

[@bostedtap8399]

Happy new Braces Sir. A most discerning video, thanks for sharing. Best regards from the Black Country. John.

[@machiningbasics1729]

They’re Lovely little tool !! I’ve got several that I use occasionally

[@TheDaf95xf]

Evening Mr Crispin 🤠 That was really interesting and love the braces 😁

[@ElmerJFudd-oi9kj]

Very interesting information again Crispin, thank you very much.

[@dreamsteam8272]

Never seen such crazy stuff.... i really like it! Stay healthy !

[@Cookerab]

I have a 1967 South Bend Heavy 10 turret lathe. Came with quite a bit of tooling (mostly Hardinge turret tooling) which can be set to cut and then stop after a set length. Similar to a die head but even just basic turning ops. As a hobbyist, never have done any production or had a need to, but looking for a reason...

[@geoffgreenhalgh3553]

The lever at the back of the die head is for rough and finish (+ and -) It is used for larger threads when lots of meat has to be removed. You should have had it + for the 1st pass and - for the 2nd. the lever is known as a detent handle. If cutting in one pass set it on -. Hope this helps. (Geoff' 49 years as a turner)

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks.

[@peterselby5694]

Doctor Crispin. Now I know that you will know this but the arm chair machinists who watch these channels might not. Dies should be kept sharp states the instructions. Dies for the Coventry dies come in 8 types which is the angle of the top rake designed to cut a range of different materials. Theres S top rake 25 deg for mild steel. AS 25deg for SS. M 12deg cast iron, bronze. AM 12degr High tensile steels 50 -100 tons tensile. M5 top rake 17deg. steel 35-55 tons. AM5 17deg. nickel chrome steel. B. 1deg negative cast brass. 25 deg for aluminum alloys, copper, free cutting MS. Apart from the top rake the throat angle needs to be ground also. Two jigs are needed to regrind the dies ( a separate jig for each size of die head) and of coarse a surface grinder is also needed. All 4 dies need to be ground together as a set. Here in NZ jigs are not easy to come by but having said that a mate of mine came across a set. I believe that die heads were a American invention but other manufacturers have picked up the idea and made many improvements. Certainly a very clever invention.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks for your comment great information

[@kevCarrico]

such a great video - thank you! and the time-lapse footage is wonderful - i’d rather see it than have you leave those sections out.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks

[@richardwhisler528]

Great video. Always learn from you. Thank you. Keep up the great work.

[@daveticehurst4191]

Great outcome Crispin. Glad the dies fitted your holder. I suspect the crash happened because you did not lock the tailstock quill, and as you moved it to and fro your hand caught the handwheel and turned it a bit each time. Thanks for the shout out, up to the time of writing this 220 new subscribers in 12 hours. Thanks again much appreciated. Have you wired up and tested the Dumore toolpost grinder yet ? I see you got some good tips about using the Coventry Diehead. Regards from Australia

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Glad to help you out. Cheers.

[@dinxsy8069]

I've now realised it's been 6 years since the initial Loco build video when i first viewed, in shock to be honest how the years have gone by.

[@chucksterock]

Cool, another gadget that I'll be wanting. Great presentation as always!

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks

[@jonsworkshop]

Well done Crispin, we will make an auto operator out of you yet lol. Good results for your 1st attempt, your lessons learned are common, I have stuffed many a die box into the spindle face during set up. Even more fun in the confined space of a multi-spindle auto!! Cheers, Jon

[@peterfitzpatrick7032]

Mr. Crispin, I have a Myford tailstock lever attachment (tailstock feed handwheel removed) for my ML7 & it has an integral adjustable stop... this means in your 6BA machining process , the screw only has to pull the floating tailstock shaft until it hits the stop...as opposed to the weight & friction of dragging the whole tailstock itself .... 🤗 From the Emerald Isle 😎👍☘️🍺

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Nice to have!

[@jmkramer872]

I once put a Geometric die head in a collet in the spindle, put the work piece in the tail stock and made a long piece of threaded stock in one go. I had to push the tail stock at the right rate to keep the die head from opening as Geometrics will open with a push or a pull. And at the screw machine shop I worked at in California we called them chasers.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks for the info

[@samshublom8761]

As if you knew what I was up to, this video appeared at the most opportune moment for me. I am about to make a batch of studs for a traction engine project I have started and have been wondering if I could remember anything about the Landis Geometric die head I have had in a drawer for the past 30 years. An excellent tutorial. Glad to se the braces are holding up. Cheers.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

They are first class. I'm very great full. Good luck with your studs.

[@canalboating]

Very interesting, I got some of those die inserts in a box of bits that came with some old tools I bought, never knew what they were or were used for. Looking forward to you getting your lathe chuck sorted and seeing the locomotive back

[@stevecallaghan3245]

canalboating I am the same as you. I inherited 5 die inserts with MT2 tails and didnt know what they were or how to use them. Good on Mr Crispin

[@Andre-pe9mm]

Very enjoyable video 👍

[@douglasbollinger8678]

Great video! I have two Geometric die heads (different sizes) and it's interesting to see how they differ from their English Coventry cousins. For one, the threading bits have a scroll section cut on the bottom and they are called chasers over here. The smaller head has an optional (easier) trip mechanism that you would have appreciated for your application. Looking forward to the continuation of the engine build!

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Interesting

[@jimfairbanks6544]

Excellent as always, see if you can find what's called projection dies. The dies protrude out the front of die head. Not familiar with your brand, but are available for the geometric die heads, good luck.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks for the info

[@devmeistersuperprecision4155]

I really enjoyed the video on how the die head works. Are you going to keep the Myford as a small lathe? The Harrison seems a bit large for smaller parts.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Yes the two together are ideal

[@sidwainhouse]

You'll get the Myford purists hunting you down for using the back gear as a spindle lock... 🤣🤣🤣

[@encorespod2135]

Man, I gotta get me a set of holsters for my braces.... Well I've got a 3d printer... TO THE CAD CAVE!

[@CraigLYoung]

Thanks for sharing 👍

[@talha3346]

Your voice sounds vintage, love your videos btw, I'm a mechanical engineering student tho

[@GazVDS]

Great video, does your tail stock not have the small thumb lever to stop it retracting? That would help with setting the tailstock and the length required. Keep up the good work Mr Crispin and thank you for the videos. Gaz

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Yes indeed. I think it was during the re-setting process for Op2 that it moved.

[@ElMuelio]

Is it just the camera playing tricks, or is the silver steel bent/wobbling at 13:25? Very interesting method of doing batch work though, it's possibly something I'll get into in the future for making fasteners for restoring classic bikes. Since I started machining things I've come to realise how badly the standard A2 stainless allen head bolts are actually formed. They don't look right at all next to all the spacers and bits/bobs I've made for the rest of the bike I'm currently restoring.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Yes I think it's not the straitest silver steel but the length to diameter ratio doesn't help. Not a problem really as the length to diameter ratio allows it to flex to the centre of the cutting teeth.

[@chrisstephens6673]

Although you can obviously get 6BA chasers for that die head, there is a smaller version that might be more suitable. The smaller sizes dont have the rough and finish lever as it is not needed. Generally i would have set yours up to size with the lever in the finish position, that way if it moves, like your tailstock, it will only cut oversize and not ruin the job by going undersize . Somewhere i have the Coventry grinding fixture for the dies, i must remember to leave it to you in my will, but dont hold your breath i hope for a couple of years yet.😉

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Very interesting. And I hope you do!!

[@shipto]

Regarding the ROUGH/FINISH lever it should ideally be set in position before setting the diehead moving it while engaged will wear the detent pin and/or the shoe quicker.

[@vicscott7872]

Try and get the/a Coventry Diehead Book, many series.. Great Book by the way

[@billshiff2060]

20:43 The ER's could also be fitted with an internal stop if a willing man finds a way and they wouldn't have the draw in problem 5c has since the stopper won't move as the collet draws in, but they also have a propensity to collect chips between the nut face and the collet that fall in when you loosen them. They are really designed to be disassembled and cleaned after each tightening as should be done for tooling.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Yes I thought about getting a soft MT2 centre and then facing and drilling it to take a road diameter suitable for behind collet stops. Would be quite a faf to set though as you wouldn't be able to get at the adjustments once you have the collet in.

[@UncleKennysPlace]

My ER40 #3mt mounted collet holder has a stop. Of course, it hasn't a through-hole!

[@ronwilken5219]

Mr C, I use ER 25 collets and 5C collets. Because I have a 5C spindex, chuck etc., I made myself a 5C to ER 25 adapter the rear of which is internally and externally threaded like a 5C collet. This enables me to put the 5C depth stop into the rear of the ER 25 adapter and use the ER 25 collets. The front end of the depth control rod needs to be drilled and tapped so that a smaller depth control rod can be installed that will pass through the rear of the ER 25 collet to contact the material you're trying to machine, in your case, thread. Hope this is clear enough. It makes sense to me but I wrote it and I know what I mean if you understand what I'm trying to say. That Coventry head is an interesting contraption. If available today probably cost a fortune. Regards from Canada's banana belt. 🤞🤔🇬🇧🍌🇺🇦🕊️🇨🇦👍

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Good idea with the stop. Cheers.

[@علیاطاعتی-ط3د]

جالب بود سپاس کاش زبان شمارو متوجه میشدم

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

I'm not quite sure what that means but thanks!

[@glennmoreland6457]

I've an old Herbert No.4 turret lathe that runs off flat belts from a lineshaft.....I've got some Coventry dieheads for it and roller boxes etc... It has 4 gears and a high/low clutch giving 8 speeds... Instant forward/reverse with a mid position brake... I've seen old photoplates of munitions girls using these Herbert No.4's during WW1 Ever heard of a "polygon box" Mr. Crispin...? 🇬🇧😐

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

No not heard of a polygon box!

[@glennmoreland6457]

@@MrCrispinEnterprises It'll generate square, hexagonal and polygon ends on shafts using a turret lathe... A British invention made by a company called "Chatwin"... It'll generate 1000s of components rapidly...

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Very interesting

[@derwissenskiosk8041]

Lookings nicely mate! :O

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks

[@willslow7291]

very nicely done, only played with a Coventry die head once and it didn't go at all well! may well have another crack at it one day if needs must. (that was at work, ended up with a standard die winding in and out, got rather tedious I can tell you that much) One could of done with the myford capstan accessories, lever operated collet chuck, cut off slide, carriage turret and bed stops would of sped the process up(setting up might of been a bit time consuming though!) or at least the lever operated tailstock attachment would of been good as that has a stop built in and the tailstock could of been left locked to the bed. Still got there in the end, William (Has Richard been in contact about a manual for your Dormer model 53 tool and cutter grinder?)

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Thanks and I'll double check

[@estebanfranco5246]

Buen día sr me gusta su página pero no hablo inglés no podría por favor traducirlo con su títulos en español gracias por compartir Saludos desde México

[@melgross]

That problem with the pull off spring tension is why I use push off for small heads with small screws with my Geometric heads. Just remember that when using 5-C collets that you must have the exact size collet for whatever is going into it. ER collets allow some compression to the next smaller size as the way they’re made allows for parallel shrinking of the inside diameter. But 5-C collets close the inner diameter at an angle if smaller work is put into it, causing some wobble in that work. If you over tension the collet to get that wobble out, or to try to get it tight enough, eventually you will damage the collet and deform it permanently.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Yes those are all good points

[@carlwilson1772]

That was very interesting and very informative. I have seen books that show using Coventry Die head die elements held in a tool holder and used as a thread chaser for generating threads, instead of single pointing. Do you have any experience of this?

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

No I don't but sounds like an interesting idea.

[@carlwilson1772]

@@MrCrispinEnterprises I have seen the method described in a book by Harold Hall.

[@dtec30]

Well now I know what the gadget is that dad got and how to use it

[@alstonofalltrades3142]

Straight away I went to shift click to open "Dave's Channel" so it's in my tabs for later and don't forget, it's not in your description. or pinned message. my only complaint ever on this channel hehe

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

I thought it was in my description

[@dermotkelly2289]

Good video. Are these only really meant to be for small batch work?

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

No these are for mass production but really designed for a different type of turning machine.

[@chrislee7817]

I have one of those tapping heads but no dies, will have to look for some wonder if the dimensions are standard betweenmanufacturers. Thanks for the tutorial though very helpful. On the topic of collets when I finally bit the bullet and bought a lathe I went for a Hardinge HLV with the 5c collet chuck built into the nose very happy with it. I understand that Hardinge invented the 5c collet, is that true ?

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

No idea!

[@chrisbaker3844]

I don’t have die holder but I do have 4 sets of dies, are the all the same size or do they vary by manufacturer

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

No they are different sizes. This is a 1/2" die head and takes 1/2" dies.

[@PenninkJacob]

❤❤❤👍👍👍👍 more more more !!!!!!

[@Mexmanix]

What are those long nose pens you showed called, & where can you get them?

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

I'll look in the morning for you

[@g.tucker8682]

Pica-Ink Indelible Pens. Made in Germany. In North America the best online source is Lee Valley, very good service.

[@neiladcock8382]

Needless to say, I'm bitterly disappointed by the non show of your siblings toothbrush. I feel that there was an ample cameo role for thread lubrication. And speaking of cameo roles, are you the new machining Bobby Ball?

[@terrytopliss9506]

👍👍

[@talha3346]

I was wondering what degree or experience Rolls Royce demand as a machinist post. Maybe you could give some advice.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Just an Apprenticeship in machining normally

[@Watchyn_Yarwood]

22:20 You are missing 4 wrenches on your wall! Definitely not a Mr. Crispin display. Let's get those wrenches located and back in their proper places.

[@Blue.4t2]

⭐🙂👍

[@rupert5390]

Another fantastic tutorial - can you give us Dave tyshurst chAnnel

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

It should be in the video description!

[@RobB_VK6ES]

seems like a clamped stop ring would eliminate the tailstock variability. The modern polo shirt totally killed your '40s persona :)

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

That's my work wear from work!

[@BensWorkshop]

Interesting. Mind you I suppose the fact that the manufacturer calls it a die head suggests that they call the parts dies....

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Yes it's exactly as I thought

[@BensWorkshop]

@@MrCrispinEnterprises Doesn't mean someone else might call the cutters chasers...

[@splinky99]

In the states they are called chasers, and that’s called a Geometric Die Head!

[@guy_b]

I can't say what I understood you to mean with all that innuendo, because possibly my mind is in the gutter. However if you alluded to what I imagined then all I can say is that besides being a genius, you're also bloody naughty 😉

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

I'm not sure what your referring to!

[@MarkATrombley]

Are there any sane motives or are they all loco?

[@colinbrewhaha]

Hello!

[@MrShobar]

The Mills Brothers at 14:50.

[@Rustinox]

Happens to all of us. I suppose there are days with and days wthout.

[@splinky99]

You should check out trainman4602. His you tube channel features some truly wonderful old Hardinge analog production lathes!!

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Don't worry I've seen loads of his videos! Very good.

[@jerrypeal653]

3 missing wrenches on the wall , so disappointing lol

[@gvet47]

I have not seen your video in a while you must have wash the grease off your upper lip.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

I lost my moustache in a grinding accident

[@gvet47]

@@MrCrispinEnterprises 🤣

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

It happened in the video 'Machining a clamping sleeve'

[@gvet47]

@@MrCrispinEnterprises Not sure why I did not get a notice of that video. Maybe censored from view in the US 🤣 Removed without a drop of blood!😉