BMW R1200GS or Harley Davidson Pan America? Comparison and Review! Real Owner!! 1250 GSA R 4K RIDE

⬇️🚨MERCH🚨⬇️
backdraft-bikes.creator-sprin...
Howdy partner, it's time for the showdown at the OK corral. In this video I'm comparing the ever popular ADV bike segment world leader BMW 1200-1250 GS Adventure and the new arrival of the HD Pan America Special! Wow the BMW GSA has been around for a while HDMC is trying to make a come back with the PAS. Will the pan America stack up to the legend BMW Motorrad? I will go back-and-forth between the two bikes, but I'm pretty solid on my choice so far. Please let me know your thoughts, do you own one of these bikes and what has been your experience? What is it about the R 1250 GSA that everybody goes nuts over? Is the Harley Davidson pan America really the new leader in this tight segment? Let's Go!
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RIDE SAFE

[@mrga660]

Something to note for those considering the Pan America is that you need to understand why are you considering that bike? The Pan America is an excellent choice depending on your situation. I own a Pan America and to me having access to the Harley network and community is import. The BMW network on the other hand where I live is not as lively and did not feel as welcoming tbh and that was the main reason why I picked the Pan America even though the GS is probably the more refined motorcycle. That being said, these small issues concerning the Pan America mentioned in this video to me personally are not that big of a deal given that I was used to owning another Harley and have always looked at my bikes as a canvas that requires refining and personalization. The Pan is a wonderful upgrade over other Harleys if you want to shift from a Luxuy Touring Motorcycle to a Sport Touring Motorcycle and its equally comfortable if not more. Personally out of all the Harleys I think the Pan America is the best value for money. Main adjustments you need will be hard or soft bags plus a GPS or google maps .. other than that the bike is good to go if you are using pavement for the most part. If off road then you’ll need some additional adjustments, maybe tires and grids .. but the bike is not meant for tough off roading unless you are extremely skilled, and those people are probably not the main target audience of the Pan America

[@joeyhonz2226]

You make some good points, but there is also some obvious confirmation bias. After owning many versions of the BMW, and not owning the HD version… The bags are a very valid point and probably the biggest part of the “everyday” usage. After a demo of the HD, both brands have lights that are garbage and need additional lighting, front and rear. BMW’s stock bash plate is equally anemic to the HD. (had replacement is around $325, not $500) But all in all, let’s remember that these bikes are great road bikes with the occasional fire road thrown in, but not serious adventure bikes for 99.99985% of the buyers (yes, I completely made up that number). Good videos though. Thanks for taking the time to put them out.

[@markto3606]

Both are great bikes can't go wrong with either choice. I chose the pan America due to dealer support. I have 3 service departments near my area while the BMW is one hour away.

[@BucktailResearch]

Why would you need to remove all 4 plugs if you dunked the bike? Remove the 2 visible ones and crank the engine over to dry it out. If the inner plugs are still moist they won't be for long once it starts.

[@ScottHomeVideos]

I got a chance to rip around on a pan am special in the Sierra mountains a couple weeks ago, I own a 1200GSA, I’ll tell you the pan am is every bit as capable as a GS, if not more, off road. It’s truly impressive, I really put it through its paces on every type of terrain and it shrugged off everything I threw at it. Deep sand, no problem, lower COG actually makes it easier to recover from when the front wheel knifes in. I still can’t stop thinking about it. The only reason I don’t own one is because it suffers from the same issue as my current bmw, no potato-potato. HD built a Harley for the haters, bravo, but I wish the engine sounded and felt like a Harley. Wind protection on the highway is excellent too, maybe slightly more gusts than my gsa but it’s very comfortable, better than any other touring bikes they make

[@joecampbell9871]

Great, honest review. I think I'll wait a couple of years to see if it improves, or I'll just shop around.

[@Frontireadventures]

I really enjoyed this. I just subscribed. I'm up here in Nova Scotia.

[@jamesthompson6723]

There are quite a few differences ,including the the shift cam, between the 1200 and the 1250. I think it's a bit disingenuous to dismiss these when comparing a 2018 vs the latest 2021 PA . But that's my opinion.

[@stuarthull5706]

I regularly get 263 miles from a tank of fuel ⛽️ however fuel here is better quality in the uk 🇬🇧 and our gallon is 4.54L. I have an can leave my Pan America weeks at a time no tender and starts first time.

[@dpinedoblog]

I really like your review style - very in depth but to the point. Would really value your analysis on the 1100 Africa Twin. Keep it up!

[@chrischristofis8501]

Trouble with the Africa Twin is they have a standard, and an speced up DCT version which are very different, great bikes but uou have to get yhe high spec version to competer with the BMW and the price creeps close so just get the BMW, but the basic Africa Twin without all the electronics is a good all round bike, as long as uou have cruise control you dknt really need all the rest

[@rodl9706]

That was a great comparison, and it really hit the sweet spots. After everything I have read and watched yours summed it all up. I really wanted a HD but not until they address a bunch of serious issues for everyday riding. So many people talk about the bike going into limp mode and silly issues before a ride, I usually chalk some of those up to just plain inactivity on their bikes and having little experience on letting things sit but honestly there is none of that - its actual problems. I think HD is on the right tract for their brand and I would buy one but I am convinced by your video and other forums that BMW is the one. Sure the dealer network is smaller but I have always been able to find a backwoods repair shop for my older BMW, as a matter of fact it use to be that Harley was like that back in the day.

[@StrengthLabAZ]

Spending time in the Pan Am groups it's more than obvious HD has multiple and common issues with this bike. Dependability is a must in any machine that I buy and the Pan Am has dependability issues. My local HD dealership couldn't even get their new bike to start for me when I requested to hear it; same starting problem as presented in the video (2022 model by the way). For the money BMW all day in this category. HD owner here and a fan of HD but no thanks right now on the Pan Am.

[@coolkatz9012]

Very interesting take on the Pan well done )

[@kennylee1336]

I have the creamsicle orange & white 2021 PanAm Special like you had. It was in the shop here in Vegas for 3 ½ weeks in June and has been there for the past two weeks now in July. Sounds like the issues I had are similar to yours; mine would die within 3 days, if not connected to a trickle charger. During the almost 4 weeks it was in for a front wheel wobble and diagnostic eval for the dying battery issue, it “died” (shocking), so they replaced my battery. They gave it back to me and it wouldn’t start within a day! I used a battery pack to jump it and it started right up. I got stranded at the gym twice, and was fed up, so I took it back. They downloaded the ECU mapping and sent it to Harley, but they’re answer was to re-install bike's the computer software. I really love the ride of this bike, but it’s killing my soul!

[@johnbruce1052]

This is a great and interesting point of view! Funny too. Love the honesty of the review. So many people want to S the D of the Factory without just giving an honest review. I talked to a guy in the parking lot of the Harley dealer about his and he was soooo disappointed. He said he loved the look, ride, and performance of the bike, but he has had so many technical issues go wrong with it that he is ready to lemon law it with them and go back to his GSA. Hopefully they will take the feedback and make it better.

[@harleyman2233]

I have been watching and enjoying your vids and I have to say this one has got me re thinking my choices. I have a 21 Tiger 900 RP which is awesome but I want a bit bigger and more stable adv for the longer road hauls and was really about to pull trigger on the 22 PA. I think I'll go check my local BMW dealer 1st. How confident do you feel about the dealer network support when traveling say cross country try.

[@BackDraftBikes]

I think that BMW has a limited network, not anything like the dealer network HDMC has. That being said...the BMW is well tested and you may not need much support. There is a reason there are so many dealers to stop at for the Harley. Just my 2c

[@usmcshepherdE9]

Great honest review…that’s why I have a Road Glide Special and a BMG R 1250 GSA!!! The power band on the harley is supportive for road riders but off road you need that low end power the BMW provides. The one thing that Harley shines on is dealer support…finding BMW dealer support in the USA is usually limited to one per state in the biggest city…which is annoying.

[@BackDraftBikes]

Well said!

[@angedesireyapi1089]

Please try the BMW K1600 B you will forget definily yourRoad Glide special 😂

[@mattguzzim1744]

Great reivew. Same riding area too.

[@johnharrison9317]

A brutally honest assessment. Putting a man on the moon was incredible...Pan Am...nahhhh

[@BackDraftBikes]

Correct

[@victoryengineer]

Very nice review. I think much of a head to end is subjective though. No doubt you made the right choice for you. I had a GS1250 and a Pan America Special at the same time but went in the other direction. I much prefer the PAS for every day use, long distance riding as well as basic off road riding. The Pan America Special would have been my choice in all those scenarios but the icing on the cake was this. I was so tired of the incredibly expensive cost of ownership and mandatory (and expensive) service intervals. The fact that the HD dealer network is absolutely vast in North America compared to the very limited BMW dealers also provides peace of mind. Both are great machines and one will always be more suited than the other depending several factors including many of them being subjective.

[@twowheelcagefreeliving.5906]

You missed the height change on at the PAS rear break

[@ipone87]

Great review man ! Thank you ...

[@BackDraftBikes]

Glad you liked it!

[@SCFoster]

Have owned a 2021 Pan America Special and many many BMWs over the years. The rear wheel of the Pan America grenaded on me before the first oil change. The brake assembly came loose and ripped out 1/3 of the spokes. Could have been really bad. Luckily I was on a 35mph road with large grass shoulders when it happened. To the dealer's credit they picked up the bike in under 2 hours and gave me a ride home; the dealership is only 12 miles away. The nearest BMW dealership is 28 miles and that one sucks. I have to go over 50 miles to get decent service. Even so, I'm in the market for a 2024 bike and am heavily leaning towards the R1300GS. All of your points about the HD are valid and it remains to be seen if HD addresses them in the 2024 model. If they don't then for me it's a no brainer to select the BMW.

[@OM-sb2bd]

Wow, you crushed the PA! 😅 Brutal. The “bad stuff” was A LOT.

[@Jay-tu4rs]

any good riding spot tips? I have a tenere 700 live in scarborough often ride up 113 looking for mild to moderate off road

[@BackDraftBikes]

The more west you go the better it gets. 113 is a good spot. Also the back roads of Parsonsfield.

[@Jim-su7en]

Sounds like your really impressed

[@mr.roadking23]

It really scares me to think how close I came to buying a Pan America I bought the Honda Africa twin instead I am so so happy with the Africa twin a BMW dealer was at least 200 miles away

[@BackDraftBikes]

I love the AT!!! I plan on doing a review this spring! Good choice my friend. Pete

[@fasteddie737]

I think you miss that so many people have these type of issues with many brands. My buddy has had several issues that are still not resolved, with his R1250. Meanwhile, at a year of ownership, I had none of the issues you had with your PA. Sometimes, just the luck of the draw. And, as an owner of an '04 KTM 950 Adventure S model, I get a kick out of people thinking the GS is a good off road bike. It's all relative, but glad you're having fun.

[@BackDraftBikes]

thank you for the comment, agreed! Heavy bike for off road

[@chrischristofis8501]

I own a KTM great bike but expensive and more powerful than i need, i am in two minds either to drop down in weight class or switch, I have tried the BMW and am the Pan Am and must report that this reviewer is one of the best on utube, he is 100% correct. Harley need to improve an awful lot to get there but right now BMW and KTM are way, way better. The one win for Harley over the KTM is the dealer network in the US, KTM isnt so good, but again BMW have a good dealer support network. That BMW you have there is the choice for people who know bikes (i started in the early 80's) it is the smart choice, its the best choice, fantastic bike

[@kevincraig8257]

The new GS bkack on black is a work of art I love HD but they have no Idea about ADV bikes

[@BackDraftBikes]

You speak the TRUTH brother

[@twowheelcagefreeliving.5906]

I have the 22’ issues worked out

[@DJPTEXAS]

On US Highways it always felt to me the BMW was revving too high and needed another gear....

[@grandpasmountain]

Wondered how you didn't acknowledge the Tiger. Power windshield and more tech than bmw....140hp and an amazing engine and no gremlins. Wondered why you mentioned lane splitting.....when you're in New England,.... Enjoyed your video editing and dialogue. I lived not too far from you for 30 years and rode year round. Thanks for a good, honest video

[@BackDraftBikes]

I have a test ride coming out with the new 1200, it was fun!

[@SHADOW848DUCATI]

What company makes the mounts and bags at 6:35? They look good.

[@matthewsimpson4883]

Also wondering

[@matthewsimpson4883]

Phd performance on facebook.. Doesnt look very promising.,

[@candlstudios]

Good points. Feels a little like you should have bought a BMW in the first place. Just for the record, all the bikes are going to the phone based GPS it seems. BMW has on the R1250RT, R18, and K1600. No more dedicated Garmin GPS. I'm sure the GS lines will be there soon. KTM does it already and so does Triumph I believe. In reality I use my phone for maps more than a dedicated GPS anyway so I don't see it as a problem. I do agree the phone based apps are junk. People complain about the BMW app just like people complain about the Harley app. If you notice they aren't allowing Apple Carplay. I think these companies want to control that screen real estate and not give it up to Apple. Car makers are battling with this now as well.

[@BackDraftBikes]

I wish they would do apple car play too! Best to just use the phone or get a Navi.

[@duosable]

How the cars are battling when almost every car produced today has apple and android play.

[@Rover4387]

Yeah I am going to keep my GSA, best bike ever. Tell me what it cant do....

[@jimtisdale6156]

One concern raised on the BMW by some is the height. Which the Harley does try to address. How tall are you and what are your thoughts on the taller BMW vs Harley

[@BackDraftBikes]

6' 4". You can get a low seat, and the factory seat can be lowered or raised as well. I agree, if you are vertically challenged it can be tough with these, but with a low seat in the low position, it isn't too bad. Ride safe!

[@rayjensen4480]

OH MY GOD. I JUST WAS SAYING THAT I WISHED THAT YOU WOULD DO A REVIEW ON THE GSA!! YOU ALREADY DID ONE! A couple of items however: 1) In Florida at least.....your BMW GSA costs over $27,000.00 as equipped ! It ain't cheap. 2) RELIABILITY!! Don't know about the Harley....but BMW's are EXTREMELY EXPENSIVE to maintain and for parts. Even.....oil!

[@BackDraftBikes]

Agreed, but look at the competitors- they are pretty close in price, BMW is a touch more but look at what you get. I agree factory parts are expensive, but again, so is everybody else nowadays. There are lots of online forums with lots of tips for maintaining them on the cheap. Ride safe my bro

[@twowheelcagefreeliving.5906]

Fyi most PAS riders attach the Garmin in the same position as BMW

[@darrenbeeson9213]

Harley is a potential machine…leaves lots of room for add-on and upgrades.

[@SticksAandstonesBozo]

Which one is lower / better for shorter riders ?

[@BackDraftBikes]

Probably the PA special, as it lowers at stops…but the GSA has low seats, and 3 levels of adjustments.

[@SticksAandstonesBozo]

@@BackDraftBikes I discovered shortly after this comment you can get the GS in a factory lowered model plus a lower seat making it the lowest of all the adventure bikes at that point.

[@twowheelcagefreeliving.5906]

100% PAS for 5’8” riders

[@twowheelcagefreeliving.5906]

And you missed the No valve adjustment on PAS. BMW $1500 to adjust everything 15k miles.

[@twowheelcagefreeliving.5906]

@@PeterAngles-ks9fp free at my dealership

[@BlazinBlades]

Unbelievable! Check for bobby traps, assassins in dark allies and raged HD gang members here and there…🤣😝😂 Brutally honest like we like it 👍👍

[@BackDraftBikes]

Thank you! Ride Safe

[@22Royston]

Lets be honest the PA is nothing but a cheap copy of a GS/GSA- lets see where it is in a decade….. Good review.

[@occyman]

Ive owned 5 x R1200 GS (4 water cooled) and 1 x 1250 GS and it’s not correct to say there are only minute changes between 1250 and 1200.

[@BackDraftBikes]

Sorry, didnt mean to offend, per the dealer the only large change between my 18' 1200 and the new ones is the power cam changes. I am sure there are more too. I have the TFT model, so they look very similar to the 2022

[@ranierotravaglini8382]

The 1200 has less hp and less torque. There was changes to the transmission too. Rides much different, why not comparing the hd to the bike you have? Either way, nice review.

[@joshhumble8020]

Undisputed, I don't know? KTM riders might be laughing

[@rolandomartinez2535]

Dude compare 1250gs vs HD 1250 be fair

[@abigail_mcleod]

and the winner goes tooooooo.... Honda 1100 Africa Twin ! ROFL

[@BackDraftBikes]

Muhahaha!!!

[@flhxri]

It will be fun to see if the Harley refines the pan-america and it becomes better than the GS. I hope that happens just to see the harley haters eat crow.

[@brewswillis7294]

Bmw

[@Birdman953]

Without even watching your “shootout” it’s a no contest! The GeeEss has been around for 40 years. That is 40 years of continuous development and fine tuning. The Pan Am is a newbie that thinks it has all the answers. Not even a reasonable facsimile of a GS, but wannabe plain and simple. Seeing the youtube reactions of riders who have ridden the pan am for about a year now all have the same comment. Continuous faults, poor service from dealers, unknown gremlins that cannot be fixed. The one guy even left his pan am at the Harley dealership and arrived on a new GSA and said, “this is what an adventure bike looks like!”. LMAO!

[@PauloSantos-ue1wl]

😂🤣😂🤣😂

[@MindaugasPA]

I owned a 2018 1200 GS and I can say that this video is misleading. BMW windshield mechanism is prone to breaking and windscreen it self needs aftermarket upgrade to not bend on highway. BMW factory bash plate is made of aluminum foil and need an aftermarket upgrade. BMW engine is inert and you only have some juice in low end of revs and it is out of breath in the end. Thanks to its suspension BMW is very uninformative offroad and you will fall before even knowing that something is wrong. Gearbox on BMW is far from perfect. Harley is a bit raw, but it is more fun more agile and nimble machine.

[@justaskinnyguy9081]

I think someone sold you a broke pan america

[@davidpierce1363]

You obviously are a bmw fan you weren't very good in my opinion even when pointing out things you didn't like on the BMW you still found a way to be complimentary. On the other hand you description of the Harley was full of negativity. Cycle world voted the Pan Am as #1 of all adventure bikes after the initial release of 2021. Harley has made improvements for the 2022 models and I'm sure will continue. I was set to buy the Road king special but after the Pan Am came out I'm sold on it . I grew up riding dirt bikes so I like the features of the Pan Am

[@BackDraftBikes]

Hey not trying to start a fight but...you are wrong. I still own a Harley, and never had a BMW until this bike. Cycleworld did a PAID review of the bike. I actually BOUGHT one. You should read some of the real world comments from owners. You either got a good one, or a really, really bad $25k piece of junk. And HD didn't stand behind it, all the way up the ladder. Completely disgusted with it. Not biased, just very disappointed. BTW, it was the HD Service Manager who said "You need to get rid of this bike"....

[@12345.......]

Did he cover anything he didn't like on the bmw?

[@rso1411]

@@BackDraftBikes I have a Pan America and love it, but everything you said was accurate. I have ridden my PA to Alaska and down into Mexico and am taking it to Sturgis this year. However, with all the "minor" problems (and the fact that corporate Harley is really pissing me off) I am considering a swap to the BMW. If Harley would make just a few changes to the PA, it would not doubt me the best adventure bike on the market.

[@austinmatthews347]

That harley is pig ugly that is enough to keep me out of the harley dealership

[@dmac5497]

The Pan America is a giant turd, a mediocre bike at a premium price with tons of HD dealers to take it to that don't give a rats ass about you nor care or know how to fix the damn thing, I have owned of bikes of various types and brands but I have never been so disappointed and left feeling like a duped idiot like I have with the Pan America, absolutely run away from these piles of hot garbage

[@BackDraftBikes]

Truth

[@dmac5497]

I have since sold mine at a huge loss, and honestly I couldn't be happier walking out in my garage and not seeing the giant pile of trash sitting there anymore! Definitely not my first HD, but Definitely my last!

[@andywiggens1069]

OMG I can't even believe you are comparing the 2, anything Harley is complete garbage....If you like archaic technology then go with the crap Harley calls a motorcycle