Baldur's Gate 3: Oath Breaking

[@aaronmcguire7712]

I like how the Oathbreaker is presented as not just the "edgy, I'm evil now >:)" option but as an alternative way to still do what's right without being tied to an oath. Sure, you raise the dead and wield shadows, but you can still use that for a good purpose

[@Motleydoll123]

Indeed. Oaths can bind you to potentially do horrendous things(oath of conquest) as well as potentially good deeds. It all depends on your oath you swore before breaking it. Breaking your oath can free you from the obligations, but it can also mark you as one who betrayed another. You have great power and the freedom to wield it as you desire, for good or Ill, but it can be tempting to use the power to serve yourself above all others and hurt people.

[@ImrahilToChaos]

Unless you die at which point you become a death knight and start killing everyone you loved.

[@ricaroanimar6695]

@JamTheBlue well you don't necessarily turn into one. And the question is you'd be evil. Heck this fella over here might be a sort of death knight.

[@ULTRAOutdoorsman]

So the game IS different from Dragon Age in at least one way

[@krise99391]

I was really disapointed when i saw him because i thought he'd just be that edgy bad guy, but i'm happy i was wrong.

[@crowsenpai5625]

4:51 “I wielded the powers of darkness, yet held a candle for those who needed light.” Just goes to show even with the “Evil” paladin subclass, you don’t have to be a monster. It’s like that Reck-It-Ralph line “just because you are badguy, doesn’t mean you have to be a bad guy.”

[@jenmygem]

It was pretty badass ngl

[@hggpi]

Yeah but i like characters that i can relate to... And... the secret side of me I never let you see I keep it caged, but i cant control it So stay away from me, the beast is ugly I feel the rage and i just cant hold it ... i dont think i have to continue

[@Nephi895]

Wow, Oathbreaker is such a bro. He reminds me of skull knight from Berserk.

[@jenmygem]

I SEE IT LOL

[@DVAcme]

My favorite part of all this is that the Oathbreaker doesn't begrudge you if you choose to reclaim your Oath and serve your god once more. He knows firsthand the pain and sorrow of knowing you're unworthy to serve, and sees it as admirable that you want to do better and BE better. It gives a lot of dimension to a class that is usually played on the tabletop by edgelords who want a Paladin's powers without their responsibilities. He's the best type of fallen hero archetype: a man whose conscience did not allow him to follow his lord's path and lives with the consequences of his transgression. Masterful writing.

[@smartyben101]

You can reclaim your oath even after you did something wrong?

[@DVAcme]

@@smartyben101 Yes, as long as if it's not something irredeemably bad. Good gods tend to be forgiving, as long as you don't do something truly monstrous and are legitimately remorseful. You have to usually atone through ritual and through doing some sort of quest to regain your god's favor, though. In the case of 5th Edition, where Paladins are more based on their Oath instead of their alignment, its more forgiving, actually. Back in 3.5, falling from grace as a Paladin was FUCKING ROUGH, you basically became the most useless member of your team until you regained favor.

[@EmeraldDream]

@@smartyben101Apparently 2000 gold will do the trick.

[@DVAcme]

@EmeraldDream Here's the thing: in D&D, there are three currencies, Copper, Silver and Gold. Imagine a Copper is a cent, a Silver is a dollar and a Gold is 10 dollars. 2,000 gold would be $20,000 DOLLARS. That's a SHITTON of money. And, while yeah, in the game you're just throwing money at the problem, in D&D terms, what you're doing is sacrificing an amount of money to your god's church as atonement for your trangression. They likely left the questing part of it out cause it'd be HELLA tedious if you had to quest for atonement every time you transgress in the game. A Paladin without his god's favor is MASSIVELY crippled. No Lay On Hands, no Divine Spellcasting, no Turn Undead, and if you had a heavenly steed, you're hoofing it on foot now. A disgraced Paladin is basically a shitty Fighter.

[@EmeraldDream]

@@DVAcme Dude it's just video game logic to not lock players out of the game. In the TTRPG you have to do something quite significant to redeem yourself in the eyes of your diety to regain your power not just throw some money at it. Also 2000 gold or 20'000$ to regain literally godlike powers after you murdered an innocent or whatever would be a goddammned bargain. I mean what is that? One year in college?

[@Spectre92ITA]

I invite one and all to turn on auto-generated subtitles and witness the glory of the first 10 seconds of this video. "A spasm grips your chest, strength filters and penis grows within you, Paladin"

[@jenmygem]

High-key something Larian would actually make the narrator say 😂

[@royalelucifer]

Oathbreaker paladins: 🫄

[@alecchristiaen4856]

I personally think that when you bait Minthara to the grove (and subsequently break your oath of the ancients), there should be an option to reclaim it when you side with the tieflings. It'd be baller if Tav could basically pull a Luke Skywalker and go "You failed, Minthara, I am a Paladin!"

[@jenmygem]

FACTS, that would be cool

[@BadatStuff]

Same with Vengeance The way I saw it, baiting the goblins to the grove so you could get the tieflings and druids as reinforcements is just being "smart" Sure my party was strong enough to take out the goblin camp, but logically, it's "safer" to bring in reinforcements to help you out vs them instead. Oath of Vengeance means smiting evil, but not exactly suicidally

[@fishraposo7192]

@@BadatStuff it's the same reason you can't free sasha. You can't cooperate with evil, even if it means turning against it later.

[@Juniper_Rose]

I love that the Oathbreaker isn't even evil. He very clearly swore an oath, but justice was more important than an oath of fealty. It's more three dimensional than "Good is dumb". It's "Sometimes you swear yourself to a cause you can't truly dedicate yourself to. I realized my Lord was a monster, and broke my oath".

[@rigormortis3219]

but ib reality they are evil....they use the powers of darkness and evil to pursue power....how is that NOT evil lol

[@pandemonium2536]

Utilizing Darkness and Evil power doesn't make you inherently evil on it's own. Like lets say a necromancer raises an army of undead to protect their home from being razed by an incoming barbarian force, is the necromancer evil for using necromancy even though said necromancy saved hundreds of people?

[@TheGreenReaper]

@@pandemonium2536They saved hundreds, but doomed thousands to ghastly servitude, and themselves to damnation.

[@Juniper_Rose]

@@rigormortis3219 the oathbreaker themselves points out they swore an oath that asked them to hurt innocent people and refused.

[@Juniper_Rose]

@@TheGreenReaper Actually the souls go on to the afterlife, the bodies are reanimated without a soul!

[@BrknSoul]

Tip: Quickest way to Oathbreak is to say that you're going to help Lae'zel's captors, but then kill them.

[@jasoncarnelian3325]

THANK YOU SO FUCKING MUCH

[@DVAcme]

Yup, you're going back on your word AND killing in a cowardly way.

[@nicksims9659]

So breaking your oath means you basically just get Skull-Knight from Berserk following you around?... Son of a bitch I'm in!

[@UltimaKeyMaster]

It sounds...incredibly badass to know that "breaking your oath" isn't just some mega-punishment to tell a Paladin to stop acting insanely out of character, they simply treat it like a Dark Knight in a Final Fantasy game instead. Fuck, I mean this guy gives me massive Frey vibes, too. Someone who tried to fight for their own justice, cast aside by society for it and said "screw it then, I follow my own path, your opinions and powers be damned." And Frey proves that your Warrior of Light, good as they may be, has that same feeling buried deep down in them as well.

[@BeAsTMoDE528]

frey is you dummy

[@RMD00]

The Dark Knight questline was probably the best of all the job quest lines. Seeing that it wasn't Fray telling off everyone but your own WoL especially after the events of ARR really did it for me. Good on Larian for not making Oathbreaker a "Too dark to ever see the light I am Coldesteele the Oathbreaker. Listen to me crawling in my crawl." but kind of a "Grey Paladin".

[@UltimaKeyMaster]

@@RMD00 Oh hell I just realized it's Fray, not Frey. Frey is the idiot from Forspoken, gaaaaaaaaaah.

[@RMD00]

@@UltimaKeyMaster Or the dragoon from FF9. The much cooler Frey

[@ericandreski3025]

I'm pleasently surprised by the nuance of the Oathbreaker. This is so much more interesting narratively than "I'm evil and edgy now"

[@christoingram]

So you can just say you’re sorry and buy it back - Catholicism confirmed to exist in Faerun.

[@jenmygem]

Lmao this comment

[@TheHippyProductions]

where's the Protestant Knight when you need him?

[@Aeivious]

i like to look at it as the steep price you pay is a testament to your devotion.

[@foxxygradius7858]

I love this. Instead of just punishing you for playing your character "wrong" it offers a way to continue YOUR narrative on YOUR terms. This game has so many lessons in it even for real life DMs.

[@jenmygem]

Facts!

[@realityveil6151]

I have been FURIOUSLY taking notes. Larian gets dnd in a way that I do not. I am learning from their example.

[@dantealighieri3307]

I like how oathbreaker knight is also an oathbreaker and not just the spirit of some random predecessor paladin where they could just take the high horse and lay down judgement but instead levels with you and understood why you did the things you did.

[@velosatractorrex9789]

Fantastic how a helmet can still be made to be so expressive in this engine, the minor body language details go so far

[@robfus]

*me that usually play barbarian or rogue like classes* "wait, you guys got oaths? I just do whatever i want"

[@thrawn323]

I saw the captions on this video and will say only that google has patching they need to do.

[@Karkuzz]

I wast ready for the penis growing within

[@johnnythedark3090]

Ok his armour and VA are still super wierd. I cannot stop thinking about "I AM SCOTTISH" power rangers meme. edit. He even keep growing bigger lol.

[@thevis5465]

How is the VA weird, it's a Scottish accent, people have them...

[@lordofinnistrad8757]

I find myself reminded of Final Fantasy XIV Dark Knights. Using dark magic and powers for good and not being bound to something else.

[@UltimaKeyMaster]

This guy is literally acting like Frey, so I thought the EXACT same thing.

[@garwynrosser8907]

The oath breaking mechanism is harsh as F... I was in a fight against goblins to save a downed npc and my oath broke. The hell?

[@jenmygem]

U might have killed a goblin child perhaps? Lol or maybe it was just a buggy response?

[@emykus7717]

No oath preventing Goblin slaying is an oath worth keeping.

[@Gokenshiba]

We’ll I earned mine, because I attacked some goblins kids who were gonna alarm more.. didn’t realize until after and I was like oops

[@none-of-your-busi-ness]

@@Gokenshiba Paladin with his greatsword currently impaled through a child: hmm, I'm not sure, but, is this somehow morally wrong of me?

[@AlexZebol]

@@emykus7717 what about "slaying" them gobby ladies?😪

[@leoleo1035]

With CC: 'strength filters and penis grows within you'. I'm not sure how to take that

[@jenmygem]

I dunno either but ima write that down 😂

[@sniclops15]

Bro the subtitles right at the beginning of the video are WILD

[@rfc1526]

I really hope when selecting a dialogue as a Paladin of any Oath (aside from Oathbreaker) that it tells you this will violate your oath.

[@jenmygem]

Same here. I hope there's also a way for you to justify ur actions to the skeletor dude too (like a true paladin 😂)

[@rfc1526]

@@jenmygem Perhaps, but the dialogue we have so far, he doesn't judge you.. Nor does it seem he cares if you become an Oathbreaker or return to your Oath.. As long as it is a decision you can live with. If its not out in Launch, I assume someone will make a mod.

[@sirfishalot6782]

I think that should maybe be a mod. Idk, i like the idea of not knowing what consequences my actions have, i like the realism in it. But ofc, i know the pain of picking a dialogue option that is absolutely not what you intended and then ruin your gameplan, so there is that.

[@SH1NK1R01]

yeah over all i agree that there should at least be a parenthesis tag to warn that this option will break your oath. reading the descriptions for the current oaths does clearly state what breaks it though. devotion breaks if you do anything that directly or indirectly leads to the harm or death or innocents. this is determined by your own knowledge. so if you don't know a character is evil and murder them you will break the oath since you willingly murdered what would have been an innocent to your character. oath of ancients is actually the harder one to keep. because it governs nature and the preservation of natural order. so murder and torture often wont break the oath. but necromancy or being friendly with demonic entities breaks the oath. this one is far more vague and why i think they should just add the warning.

[@dovakiin296]

​@@SH1NK1R01 I don't like the oaths are based on the perspective of the paladin, and the shifting of perspectives or a broadening of their understanding is what causes one to become an oathbreaker. At least warlocks knew what they were getting into when they sold their souls.

[@yammyamm8480]

Armored Frontliner, building heavy on Charisma for all those sweet dialogue options which makes him also hit harder, and he gets what is essentialy a Grey Jedi Path? Seems like I'm gonna play the same Character as always, just that this time the game actually accounts for that xD

[@Morzanith]

Rofl...what grows within? Nice CC work....real nice...

[@MuFu23]

Just two more days, and my tadpole-powered Half-Orc Oathbreaker will be unleashed...

[@emykus7717]

My oath broke from killing a Goblin. I've never been so moraly confused in my life since the only good Goblin is a dead Goblin.

[@thisislame2207]

From what I can gather it seems while goblin are indeed bad creatures if you just plainly outright attack them that is where the problem lies in. If they attack you or you declare your attacking them for so n so reason then I think your oath is fine.

[@emykus7717]

@@thisislame2207 Well then, guess me and Old Oathbreaker Knight are gonna be best pals. 😂

[@venom_ross]

If I were to assume the Paladin problem (I haven't actually played one in EA) your oath is to be followed until an aggressor actively chooses to be a danger or has enough dirt after dialogue that would insinuate they are a bad actor. Goblins are cruel, but as a Paladin you need more of a reason to stand against them than just "I'm assuming this band of them is evil"

[@crowsephian6873]

Gaaaaaaablins

[@jacobmosovich]

After taking that oath i would ask "do you wish to pledge yourself as well" and ill point to the 2000 gold pieces he now holds in his hand. Showing him that he ue now has that choice

[@kanaric]

This guy is like Jamie Lannister or something.

[@jenmygem]

LMAO

[@ladymecha8718]

An interesting way to handle Palladian class breaking their oath.

[@Bimon1234567]

I wish they hadn't removed the deity selection for Paladins.

[@mermidion7552]

absolut facts. D&D5e Paladins are weird. and in a tabletop group, very often lazy. these with no gods at the very worse often only suffer the loss of there powers if the DM decides that they broke there oath. in the older edition a DM could also tell them how they have angered they patron god and make the player sweat ,thinking of the possible consequences. xD

[@fefnireindraer144]

Agree. I always pick Waukeen. that way those that destroy crops I destroy them.

[@MayHugger]

If you want your devotion to a god to be a major part of your character and powers, then just play a Cleric.

[@emackenzie]

​@@MayHugger paladins are dnd's version of Holy Knights, their devotion to a deity is in their bones. Honestly, a chosen deity should have been available for everyone regardless of class, and only crucial for those built on that connection like clerics, paladins, and warlocks

[@NihilTruth]

@@emackenzie Not in 5e they aren't.

[@OriginalKasym]

FFXIV Fans: Oh I've seen this before, it's a classic

[@UltimaKeyMaster]

FFIV Fans: Oh, I've seen this in reverse.

[@guyfromdubai]

"A spasm grips your chest, strength filters and penis grows within" Yes

[@martisendrell9305]

CC: "A spasm grips your chest, strength filters and penis grows within you..."

[@jenmygem]

Captions be making their own fanfic

[@mickymcbryan4814]

It reminds me of dark knights vs paladins in FFXIV

[@insideartist3374]

Even in this Universe...Fray Myste is here

[@jinn91]

Basically become the anti hero

[@IDontKnowYouWhoAreYou]

the thumbnail kinda looks like nicholas cage for some reason lol

[@onedepressedgamerm6525]

Nick cage is also a oathbreaker

[@JB-xl2jc]

"I'm gonna steal the Declaration of Oathdependence..."

[@onedepressedgamerm6525]

@@JB-xl2jc that wizard will lead to another wizard

[@boochaca7957]

the closed captions at the beginning tho

[@williammorris249]

So… when I watched the previews of this video with subtitles, it said “penis grows inside”, instead of emptiness

[@omegaquick]

I remeber that I paid a total amount of 8k at the end of the EA to restore my oath XD.

[@jenmygem]

Daaamn!

[@onedepressedgamerm6525]

Who were oathed to

[@omegaquick]

@@onedepressedgamerm6525 Oath of the Ancients

[@Nightraven26]

Maybe the price increases by your level?

[@omegaquick]

@@Nightraven26 No, is 2k each time, but I have repeated this 4 times, sooo XD.

[@Nemnar7]

Wonder if Vengeance is an available oath. Still get misty step, but could operate more in the grey areas, lol.

[@jenmygem]

It's an available oath in the game, just not in early access

[@rigormortis3219]

na you wanna run oath of the ancients for your oath breaker.... it towers over the rest in power and utility

[@RandomnessCreates]

Yep, running a vengeance oath paladin right now. Just don't do the obvious anti-Vengeance stuff. It's way more easier than the others since it lets you do genocide against evil.

[@UltimaKeyMaster]

Vengeance is a usable Oath, yes.

[@mikewaterfield3599]

Excellent! Paladins must live by the code of their god! I was worried this would not be in here. 5th Ed watered down much of what made D&D. Paladins and priests serve their gods. This is why shadow heart should be a nihilistic B1t(h like a proper Sharin priestess.

[@kiykiy_maitai]

all i can say without spoilers is follow her story :D

[@DVAcme]

The axing of alignments and the changes to Paladin is what I hate the most about 5th Ed. I much prefer how Pathfinder 2nd Ed. handles it, that you have the Champion Superclass, which are knights sworn to a god, and within them, they have different powers and oaths based on the alignment, so the Lawful Good Champion is still the Paladin.

[@mikewaterfield3599]

@@DVAcme yeah, it made no sense to me to axe alignment. It ruins the fundamental differences between demons and devils right off the bat.

[@DVAcme]

@@mikewaterfield3599 The thing I hate the most is that axing alignment completely destroys incentive to roleplay. D&D attracts so many murderhobos and edgelords now. Before, those guys would pick Chaotic Neutral, but the DM could punish their excesses through the alignment system. Now, they can just act retarded with no repercussion.

[@mikewaterfield3599]

@@DVAcme this is where a good DM comes into play. Impose repercussions. First thing I ask someone playing a pardon or priest is what god do you serve, and I pay attention if they are doing crap their deity would not approve of. Cyric does not tolerate acts of kindness after all, and Mystra forbids nothing.

[@gemmafire8628]

Reminds me of Nimona

[@jenmygem]

Just watched that two weeks ago, loved it!

[@marginis]

I keep getting scottish Genji vibes from this guy, and tbh I'm kinda feeling it.

[@MayHugger]

Uhh, Closed Captions, you want to explain? 🤨

[@jenmygem]

KZbin AI writing fanfic

[@VicStrange9]

Man, BG3 isnt exactly my favourite game at all, but this Oathbreaker is indeed way more nuanced and interesting than expected.

[@Skullnaught]

It's literally the Final Fantasy XIV Dark Knight

[@jackdog06]

Making the Oathbreaker Knight Scottish was a fucking masterful decision.

[@kbg-]

Time to RP as Arthas.

[@Straggiz]

Is that Drew McIntyre as the Oathbreaker Knight?

[@biggiecheese2004]

The biggest crime of this game is giving the absolute most insanely drippy armor set ever known to man to a fucking NPC and you can’t even get it yourself

[@jenmygem]

I went cleric for my first campaign and have shadowheart on my team always. Literally dripless because I can't find any good looking medium armor that isn't Justiciar.

[@ARC1701A]

The video subtitles. XD

[@akirais5408]

funnily enough, this video only blows because the "penis growth within" CC on the preview, that shit makes me curious and thinking "WTF is going on here" then quickly proceed to click the video.

[@LuckyLamoura]

Oh they put Frey from ff14 in the game cool

[@DoppelgangerTH]

My thoughts exactly

[@jojoceda]

Break your oath to oathbreaking

[@scotthuffman3462]

They should let you play oathbreaker right from the start. Sure its cool narratively that you can break your oath, but I just wanna use the dark powers right out the gate.

[@UltimaKeyMaster]

I feel like there might be a disconnect between a video game letting you do that and a tabletop game. Any old D&D campaign, you should *absolutely* be allowed to roll an Oathbreaker immediately when you can create infinite lore for your character and detail the reasons they broke their oath before the game even started. For a video game to do it when has this grandiose...rather ironically for me to say come-to-Jesus moment with your oath breaking, it'd be pretty hard to have that same weight if you skipped that entire intro and just *were* one with very little backstory at all except your race/background choices. What I think Larian should do is say that this spirit guy already knows you and would just show up to talk to you after you escape the tutorial ship and be surprised at how much shit you just got yourself into when he looked away for just one day. Maybe even joke that you managed to find far worse trouble than the pain you experienced when you first broke your oath, and you can cleverly re-use the choices presented here of why you broke your oath like he wants to make sure you haven't been tempered too much by the tadpole yet.

[@Aeivious]

luckily it takes about 30 minutes max to break your oath, just murder hobo the guys keeping lae zale locked up and youre good to go

[@PapaBear816]

I like how you can reclaim your Oath for gold... kind of funny honestly.. how money seems to solve a lot of Moral problems

[@TheHakuryu]

i thought you were mayrina for a second lol.

[@legacian4039]

I multi-classed Shadowheart as a devotion paladin and I'm curious if her story will cause her to break her oath depending on the decisions you make. Would be pretty thematic for her imo.

[@jenmygem]

My friend made Shadowheart a bard paladin, I'll update you if any oaths get broken during her story if you didn't find the info. On another note, vicious mockery on SH is hilarious.

[@FrancisIsNot]

dawg i broke my oath for the fourth time and considering that the third payment is 10k i doubt ill be getting it back lol

[@jenmygem]

Sheeesh

[@TheWastelandLegend]

Closed Captions got some wild stuff going on in those first 10 seconds...

[@MegaRyuki]

He seens similar to a warlock patron

[@xmixaplix]

Me: Oh a Jamie Lannister 🤔😝

[@haukikannel]

Some people are just not suited to be paladins… 😂

[@jenmygem]

It's her first day on the job 😂

[@gamester512]

@@jenmygem And last, apparently! :P

[@churchA.I]

I'll be going oathbreaker on purpose, gimme that sweet ass fuckin aura of hate

[@synchchavet351]

I broke my oath by killing Philomeen after she kept refusing my gracious deal of giving me the entire barrel in exchange for her life. No matter how many times i reloaded there was no way. So as she ran towards her freedom i shot her in the back. Broke my oath, and laughed my ass off.

[@svetlin_dp]

i digress, but i cant help but notice that your character looks like a red-haired mayrina

[@nuclearlefthook5008]

turn on CC.

[@brandonvoice8941]

It was hilarious

[@jenmygem]

it was SUS

[@FelipeVercingetorix]

😂

[@PerritaMalvada]

Activate subtitles for a fun surprise at the start

[@victorcastanet8923]

Someone might wanna double check the subtitles for this, 0:10

[@Spumoon]

How did you unlock Princess Merida from Brave?

[@Planesrifter]

Oh no captions… Why!?!

[@alias234]

>'Protect life and do good things' >Raise villages and slaughter thousands because 'Lord is shiny!' >wake up and realise the truth >Loses good powers and forced to become 'dark' Pally...because 'breaking oath bad!' ...>'Protect life and do good things'

[@rocketdog734]

omg it's fray final fantasy

[@PDilling]

Am I the only one who find it a bit ridiculous that you can pay 2000 gold to get your oath back? XD

[@dododimitrov9657]

w8 how did you break the oath, what did u do?

[@jenmygem]

I turned that girl's husband into a zombie, thus breaking the santicity of life. My character was a Oath of Ancients paladin and they preserve life. (But my character thought they were preserving beauty 😬)

[@ULTRAOutdoorsman]

@@jenmygem Zombies ain't natural dogg

[@UltimaKeyMaster]

@@jenmygemOathbreaker Frankenstein, lmao

[@hunterbrown2001]

I'm pretty sure oath of the crown isn't goimg to be an option.

[@robinhood7293]

Wasn't that just a Solasta thing?

[@Ithiryn]

@@robinhood7293 Nope, thats a standard 5e thing too, I forget what book it's from. Don't think it's going to be in game but it's nice they aknowledge non playable archetypes.

[@thegreyone6666]

Is the voice actor for the Knight Navid Negahban?

[@jenmygem]

Not sure but similar! Can't find any info on it yet

[@dundundada]

how early can you oath break?

[@jenmygem]

After tutorial so I think 20 minutes in?

[@dundundada]

@@jenmygem thanks yo

[@UltimaKeyMaster]

@@dundundadaIf you haven't done it yet: Lie to the tieflings that captured Lae'zel that you'll help them and immediately open fire on them when you're done talking. ...I did that by instinct as a Wizard and it felt *so good.*

[@theyruinedyoutubeagain]

Did you record this underwater what the fuck

[@jenmygem]

I did actually 😭

[@ULTRAOutdoorsman]

Did he break the oath of having a convincing Scottish accent?

[@thevis5465]

I'm from Scotland, it sounds ok to me.

[@christopherg2347]

If you break you Oath for good reasons that is a Redemption Paladin, not an Oathbreaker. Why do people still not get how that part works?

[@positivecayde395]

That is not how it works. Redemption Paladin is an Oath you swear, and it isn't about you redeeming yourself but helping others find Redemption. You break your oath and you're an Oathbreaker. That's always how it worked.

[@AlyssMa7rin]

@@positivecayde395used to you just lost your powers entirely

[@Paradockzz]

YEAH MAYBE IF YOU SWEAR AN OATH OF REDEMPTION AFTERWARD YOU GOOBER

[@20storiesunder]

Nooope, you just made that up

[@centurion7398]

I understand what they are doing from a gameplay perspective but the cost to the world building is just terrible. I guess the horrifying moral complexity of breaking your oath to a god is made all better for the bargain price of 2 skyrim NPCs. After all rules are something only poor Paladins have to worry about.

[@MayHugger]

Paladins don’t get their powers from gods, this is based on 5e.

[@centurion7398]

@@MayHugger I'm pretty familiar with DnD 5e. And yes it is setting specific where anybodies power comes from. If you decide in your setting your Paladin's have to pet a sufficient number of kittens to smite the enemy then so be it. However this setting is Forgotten realms and in every prior piece of material set in those realms Paladins are divine casters so yea they absolutely swear those oaths to the gods. Even if it isn't any one specific god it is sworn to the gods. Not that any of this matters because in world building there are a few ways to do something well and a whole buncha ways to do things poorly. The term "oath" implies that there is a binding contract being made and if the penalty for violating the sacred oath of a holy warrior is 2,000 dollarydinos then your not a holy warrior. Just a privileged prick with the money to burn on a little genocide with divine power here and there. Theoretically you could just swear said oath kill 2,000 people that each had one miserable gold piece to their name and then go get your good guy powers back with your blood soaked coin. That's why in order to be an oathbreaker the book says you must be evil. Because to take divinely granted powers and twist them to selfish ends is an evil act. It's built into the fantasy of the class. Otherwise your just playing an eldritch knight or a ranger or any other kind of half caster half fighter class that gets magic and swords, but with Paladin numbers on your character sheet. If you play a ranger that hates animals and nature and only ever stays in his house inventing gadgets, then why bother with a ranger at all? Same thing with Pally. I'm all for morally complex characters but that moral complexity is made cheap and pointless if the morality system is fucked up irreparably in the process.

[@tyeklund7221]

@@centurion73985e players handbook is based on the Forgotten Realms. If they changed the lore then you don’t have to like it, but that is the lore now. It has been retconned. BG3 has to follow the new lore

[@dermenore7162]

@@centurion7398 I agree with you. I also preferred the version where paladins were linked to a deity (even if I can work with the 5e version) and I would have preferred it if paladins in Forgotten Realms could choose divinity. I also find that paying 2K gold to regain your oath is too easy and not very serious. A fallen paladin should have to do penance through actions. And if he breaks his oath too many times, he should be stuck in an oathbreaker. With maybe one or two warnings before. If resources are an issue to create these penance, then just being stuck in oathbreaker should be better than this 2K gold mechanics. It's nice that Larian made some mechanics about fallen paladin and oathbreaker but like you said the cost in worldbuilding is too heavy.

[@centurion7398]

@@dermenore7162 It's so frustrating because you can see what they were trying to accomplish but were too afraid of pissing off the reddit and twitter hordes to actually get behind.

[@codynoth4183]

It's reasons like this that I think Larian should not be getting the praise people are giving it. Much like the "soulsborne" games with artificial difficult to lure you in, BG3 is the absolute king of save scumming because the game gives you literally no agency as to know what is going to happen based on your decisions. This is extremely apparent in interactions with companions and highly unrealistic as well. I had to dump Gale because, in spite of only using him a handful of times in the party, before getting my based short stack bard, there came a dialogue option where the only two choices were to kick him out permanently or have gay sex with him. It's fucking stupid.

[@UltimaKeyMaster]

I know the companions are more of a contested issue, but I don't think it's hard to figure out how to know what breaks your oath when your oath kinda plainly lays out what your oath is.