Battle of Cuito Cuanavale - 1987

This video shows the truth about what happened in late 1987 in South-East Angola. The video says it all, but the SADF/Unita forces seriously crushed the Communist forces of Cuba/MPLA!
Song: Vyster - Lloyd Ross

[@AxilRod72]

I was there, one of the first in and one of the last out, there are so many videos that claim Cuban victory this one is fact all the way through. Thanks for posting it, I lost friends in Angola, during this operation and others. To all those who deny the SADF victory, you are wrong we cam we saw we kicked ass.

[@hugochristoss324]

Was an officer at Oshikati in Armour at that time-memories

[@Israeliet777]

South Africa then was the best in the world!!!

[@wires2115]

it was 3 operations to kick them asses, Operation Hooper, Packer, Moduler. We(the retired) were called up to help the defence force, Our Regiment (Regiment Groot Karoo)moved from Bloemfontein to 30km outside Bloemfontein (7Div) mobile unit at De brug, where we loaded up, drew all out kit, guns etc... no ammo yet, the whole regiment moved out at night on quiet roads, slept over at the border (Upington), Next morning we did a quick training session, attack a empty field, cmdt Oukamp said :" the boys have still got it, let's move out." Ready to evac 15 minutes, we moved over the border into SWA (Namibia) and kept going to Ruakana, we slept a few hours, meanwhile ,Genie Regiment build us a bridge over the river (Caprivi), we moved at dawn 4 am, 50km into Angola we still had no ammo :), we not scared right, riiight. While 6th bat and the rest were doing some mock up attacks we built fake cannons with poles and old tires in the shona's and got 33 battalion from Cape town area to set up there anti air next to it, Those mig's ruled the airwaves for a few days, Victor Victor the call came through, we hide, shoot at them and wait for another opportunity to shoot them down, Meantime Genie bat were pulling of an act of there own, to focus fire and attention on them at the cross of the Quito river. Genie were busy completing the ambush plan, they used Bulldozers and was pushing a road across the river, (a fake road ) There bulldozers and vehicles took a hell of a beating, brave lad's them boys. Our Artillery shot propaganda notes into the enemies bases with special ammunition, : go home it read, you will be killed, you don't even get paid it read...12 hours later all batteries started an assault on known locations, wiping out a big amount of enemies. Well by now at least we had some 7.62... 5.56 and 12.7 mm rounds.... Wouter van Zyl drove the commanders vehicle (Ratel) they wacked a landmine, he strung the wheel up and they kept moving , saving his whole squad, as 3 hours later that place was crawling with Mpla, nevertheless 32 bat made short work of them, by early morning the reminiscence of what happened lay in the white sand, blood stain and fear, mpla retreated 60km north west, where they were hunted down, then as sudden as it all started for us we were called off, 9 months of bullshit warfare, loosing friends and now... we dump diesel by the ton into the sand, destroy stuff so no one can use it and limped out of Angola to Demob, there we are greeted as Hero's send home with a medal and a pocket knife and i ask myself : " The powers that be at that time, they knew the outcome before we even started, pressured by American sanctions and the world looking down on the South Africa,Pull back or face even more sanctions, Let Mandela go or face even more sanctions." Oh hell lets do it....it is for our country, for our people. ........................................this ended in 1989. But the story does not end there, you see our natives were really struggling for a better life, a better education and the only retaliation they could afford was to burn buildings, schools etc, blow stuff up to a million bits ! how do you defeat a strong enemy? ... break there economy! The rules of war, rule no.1 THERE IS no RULES ! I might be grey today and forget all the details but some things you can not forget, we looked after our people and yes we were poor as well, but we had a roof over our heads, that goes for my fellow black friends a s well, but today what do we have. Now we have a corrupt ANC government promising their comrades houses and property and farms since they took over in 1995, I still have to see one deep freeze, microwave or tv fall from the sky as there government promised them, the big houses they were going to receive turned out to be small tin shacks, some build with commercial bricks and is falling apart. The once working water and electricity lines are now being scavenged to sell off to scrapyards, pumps broken down , some black villages to this day are worse off than before 1995, well done ANC. Roads, highways... destroyed by lack of maintenance, You need a 4x4 really to travel Gauteng, potholes everywhere. But there is hope, a little bit of it... it's all we need. You see once the black people of South Africa realize they have been taken for a ride that is when the cure will come. Julius Malema makes lot's of noise trying to rally the people to side with him, but that will not work, only the stupid ill informed ignorant people will stand by him in hope of a farm or a free house when he get his capitalist Africa, it did not work in any other country and he will fail as well, just like the newly elected president will fail. Last but not least, we the people of Africa is poor, black, white, coloured, call us the rainbow nation, but we are not stupid, ignorant, or hatred infested

[@modisemakokwe4256]

We are sorry that you had to fight in Angola yep we realize this war is beyond Afrikaaners or Swaartmense its a global agenda of the Freemasons on both sides you see there is no race when it comes to the New World Order is either you are a Luceferioun of the New World Order or a got a pic thats what they call us

[@robertporter4501]

Wires, thanks for your honesty. In 1986 and 1987 I read statements from the ANC in exile and could see they were raving Marxist fools and liars, so realized what was coming under their idiotic rule and very sadly left the country.

[@hennievanwyk3810]

That's the truth.

[@Daniel-yr8yc]

Poes

[@Heegooat]

Zimbabwe survived sanctions without war. You forget that the Bantus never spread through war or conquest but by assimilation. The wars happen through warlords sponsored from foreign interest. Even in the DRC war is in a tiny area of north kivu. There will never be all out civil war in bantu land. Even the Rwanda genocide was over pretty fast and was foreign induced. Savimbi was supported for decades by the west and apartheid government. In Mozambique, Qatar is supporting terrorists but mist of the country is moving along. It will take centuries but bantu lands will coalesce into one unit. There has been very few border wars (none) between bantus... Idi amin wasn't one.

[@andre3823]

As an ex SADF soldier, I am sad to say that all this was in vain because today we have savages running around as if there is no law!!!

[@theveldtrekker2550]

Communists now run this country. We won the battle and lost the war. The same way that Zim went, so goes the rest of us. Join the Suidlanders.

[@andre3823]

@@theveldtrekker2550 good idea.

[@peterdejongh428]

Just makes me sad for all our comrades who died for fuck all.

[@dreamdiction]

If the SADF had captured Cuito Cuanavale, what then? What was the point?

[@andre3823]

@@dreamdiction the point was a victory that was necessary at the time but unfortunately the NP had a traitor who was busy with the treason in parliament. In cahoots with NWO!!!

[@despertar777]

These all materials you still can find them in the military museaum in Angola. When I was in primary School I remember visiting there and they show us these all things, even the clothes a South african pilot who unfortunately died in the battle was using. I'm angolan and I wanna tell the truth about Kuito Kuanavale, MPLA+Cuba didn't won this war... Some of true papers about the war just came out in this year 2019.

[@elvinsalas6258]

That is true. My father was there and the story's he told are horrible. He and Al the soldiers with him was so glad that Castro and USSR gave up on the war

[@elvinsalas6258]

Stil proud of him

[@antonferreria1905]

Hi Andre Manuale , thank you for telling the truth.

[@ijwiryimpinduramatwara1004]

They come to defend Angola and they did it. Even Namibia independency acheived because of Cubans and the MPLA. They may loose some batle bat win the war.

[@MegaJohny56]

you fucking did it you really truly did knock them for six and send them back to havana! such feats of arms will never be forgotten, they don't need a flag or a plaque somewhere to commemorate them because they are written in the stars for eternity. Great bit of soldiering!

[@joshuasantiago2316]

This is the most stupid made up story. South Africa lost the battle and the victor's loses are huge compared to South African loses. How could they lose the battle, retreat from Angola and give up Namibia? Lmao

[@vryburgerenkryger5768]

We need soldier like in the good old days Boere krygers wereld klas soldate

[@gregmenego2200]

Salute ✋ I was there in 1974-75.

[@francois8069]

Dankie

[@frankvanbrakel2340]

operasie Savanah ek was ook daar.75 --76 74--75 julle het skoon gemaak.jul hou die wereld record meeste grond gebied in kortste tyd geneem.die israelies 2de met 6daagse oorlog.veels geluk!!!!

[@frankvanbrakel2340]

was jy op n eland

[@umfums]

Kekuya...ever since the war began it was never the intention to invade Angola .since the first ops back in the 70's the SADF went in to Angola ...achieved its goals than pulled out again ,the same is true for the last ops of the war as well.This was a counterinsurgency war, not a conventional war were wars are won by ground conquered.The fall of comunisim back in 1988 caused the war to come to a close .....

[@WilliamRogers]

Putting a spin on facts?

[@paulgladwin1371]

@Trafalgar8766 - excellent video and tribute! One little pointer - the tank and crew shown at 3.36 to 4.42 are actually Rhodesian Army, not South African Army - possibly worth replacing with another picture...

[@natalamakhuva5878]

This is a very pathetic report on the Battle that turned things around for the people of South Africa. Fortunately, the history is no longer only written by the coloniser; it would be very bad indeed!!! Why didn't UNITA take power if the SADF and other international terrorists were as superior as purported in this shameful video? Why did the SADF have to bring back so many trucks with dead bodies? Was it a truck for each of the bodies they claim to have lost? Some of us were detained because we had witnessed the trucks driving in with the bodies and they (apartheid criminals) wanted to keep us quiet!!..

[@nekongovitankanga]

That's right my brother, they think it is like the history of the pyramids in ancient Egypt. We all witnessed what really happened, it was a massive victory for the region, Mandela got released, Namibia got its independence, weakened their support for UNITA, Mobutu got kicked out. Dos Santos and his friends were the winners, period.

[@gregbadger289]

Why is it so difficult to entertain the possibility that the SA forces were the effective victors of this battle but never-the-less were ultimately defeated at a grander, strategic level?

[@iberilop]

At a strategic level? Was this the level where the soviet union collapsed? The cuban economy getting destroyed by their long term backer finally going democratic? The war was won. South africa did not fight angola but the communists. In a strategic viewpoint the enemy was not killed or defeated but just vanished. Communism was the true evil of the time and it was slayed. North korea is the only true relic of an era past.

[@gregbadger289]

Don't see the Apartheid regime around either? So yes I stand by my assertion that at a strategic level they lost.

[@iberilop]

Greg Badger It was a referendum cast like brexit. There was no regime to defeat it serverd it purpose and was displaced by the ANC. To be honest if you look at the way south africa is going at the moment it would have been better off under apartheid. It is basically like isreal getting taken over by the Palestinians. Read up about the EFF and the student protests. It is all a giant mess of communist ideals in a modern and fairly well off wealthy economy where whites are blamed even after 20 years of black rule with the ANC being accused of being run by whites. It is quite and cirus.

[@iberilop]

Okechukwu A. You are kidding right? if we did not have international pressure from the west we would have ended the angolan civil war before cuba could intervene. Do not forget the communists invaded namibia first and they were slaughtered. In the entire war south africa had a small force that destroyed massive parts of the standing and regular forces of the communist in angola. We still have to apologize for the mass graves we left int he wake of our onslaughts. We left thousands in mass graves. Your history is false. South africa in isolation faced the soviet, cuban and angolan communists and defeated them in almost every battle.

[@freedomloverusa3030]

Greg Badger Everyone last at the strategic level!!!!! The cubans spend the soviet help they needed for survival instead of use it for build an independent economy. The Cuban goverment is in freefall sice the soviets collapse. They need other countries help because they dont produce nothing. At the very end, it will be the Angolan War what it lead the Castro's family monarchy to its end in Cuba. And the Soviet Union was even worse than cuba. At the same time they were spendind billions in Afghanistan, founding guerrillas all over the world, and helping Cuba an Viet Nam, and dealing with the concecuencies of Chernobyl. The only real winner at the strategic level was the United States.

[@Trafalgar8766]

@pedrom41 Get your facts straight - this video (as the title shows) is only about the BATTLE of the Cuito Cuanavale, and the war wasn't 10 years long anyways it lasted from 1966 until 1989. Get YOUR facts right.

[@sarkisarki3233]

I'm 66 at this time and proud to have served my country, not apartheid. 1 Parachute Battalion, 74/75 till 83. Still going strong.

[@tjg4654]

General Sanchez was executed for a trail of corruption, not for losing at Cuito Cuanavale. There were many battles in which UNITA and SADF had the upper hand. However, when Castro sent 40,000 to the Cuito Cuanavale region, UNITA and South Africa were clearly defeated on land and in the air. The SADF ran like chickens back to Namibia. The casualty rates were not very high because UNITA forces took the bulk of the deadly attacks. In the end, the Russian Migs out fought the French Mirages in the latter part of the long battle...

[@MrSpringbokfan]

Beating somebody into a coma and then walking away because you didn't want to kill him is different than losing a fight bud.

[@philliprsa]

+tj g. Sorry to say but what your stating here is in NO WAY true at all. The fact that you say that the South Africans "ran like chickens back to Namibia" clearly demonstrate how little you know about the whole campaign. If you just cared to even look at the geographical arena in which this campaign played out you would realise that if any running was done it was done so by the Cubans and the Agolans. It is an established fact of the campaign that the SADF all but annihilated the FAPLA 47th Armuored Brigade in one day ...that is on the 3rd of October 1987. To even talk of the "Battle of Cuito Cuanavale" demonstrates how little one knows about the whole campaign, The decisive battle was on the 3rd of October 1987 at the Lomba River later to be known as The Battle on the Lomba. On that day the SADF's Charlie Squadron , comprising of just twelve 90mm Ratels, all but destroyed the 47th Armoured Brigade of Fapla. This was the decisive battle of the campaign which started on the 4th of August 1987 as Operation Modular. Modular was devoted to stopping the Cuban/Fapla objective of crossing the Lomba river enroute to Mavinga and finally to Jamba. After the defeat at the Battle on the Lomba the Soviets advisors abandoned the Cuban and Fapla forces leaving Fapla with serious leadership problems in the arena. This resulted in a hasty retreat of the remainder of the Cuban/Fapla foces leaving behind millions and millions of dollers of equipment in the ensuing chaos as the leaderless and demoralised Cuban/Fapla forces fled the 120km BACK to Cuito Cuanavale where they were able to have some kind of a regrouping consiting out of what was left of the 16th, 21st, 47th (armoured) and 59th brigrades. Now her comes the uneasy bit. If You care to study a map of the area you would clearly see that to get from the Lomba to Cuito you need to BACKUP 120km North, which means instead of gaining ground and advancing forward the Cuban/Fapla forces had to give up ground and retreat. WHY, if the were indeed sending the SADF running like chickens, would they retreat BACK UP NORTH in order to get to the infamous Cuito Cuanavale when they were 120km SOUTH of Cuito (and so much closer to the Namibian Border) roundabout the beginning of October 1987? The so called Battle of Cuito Cuanavale which played out from November 1987 to the middle of 1988 should never have happened then as the Cuban/Fapla forces would have been way south of Cuito by that time. The truth of Cuito was that it resulted in some kind of a stalemate, MAINLY because the SADF chose it to be so. Because advancing past Cuito Cuanavale would have meant that the SADF supply line would have become pecuriously long and vonurable as in all probabilty the next place to make a stand would have been Menongue. As the objective was to drive the Cuban/Fapla forces back over the Cuito River (and hand defence of the river over to Unita) it can be safely said that for the SADF it was mission accomplished, with the small exception of a small contingent of Fapla troops that manage to hold onto a small patch of land just over the river...mainly due to the area being heavily mined and any attempt to drive them back over the Cuito River would have resulted in losses that could not be justified by the gains it would bring. In fact it was a stated order of the SADF that Cuito should not be taken if force was to be used UNLESS it could fall into the hands of the SADF without a major fight. Like we say in Afrikaans "Die kool was die sous nie die moeite werd nie". To advance past Cuito would also have been problimatic as far as air support was concerned. At Cuito the SADF was operating at it's limits as far as air support was concerned while the Cuban/Fapla forces had the Menongue airstrip relatively close by compared to the SA Airforce that needed to operate out of Rundu hundreds of kilometers to the South. While it is true that the Cuban/Fapla forces had air superiority (due more to the distances involved than by the superiority of the Migs), this superiority NEVER translated to anything usefull on the ground for the Cuban/Fapla forces. The threat of anti-aircraft missiles kept the Migs well above a height to be of any real value in the campaign for the Cubans/Fapla forces. However said air superiority by the Cubans/Fapla forces never stopped the SAAF from carying out daring bombing raids during the conflict. Superb flying by the SAAF pilots involving many a tree top height flights resulted in the SAAF being a far more effective player in the arena that would logially have been the case if all factors were to be considered. The SAAF even manage to keep an almost nightly "airbridge" alive using helicopters. With the odd landing of cargo planes at Mavinga every now and then. On the 15th of March 1988 the cubans/Fapla forces tried to open a second front at Calueque which resluted in several skirmishes. The Calueque dam was eventually bomb by Mig's but just before the bombing 32Bn and SWATF forces manage to stop the Cuban advance in their tracks while inflicting heavy losses on them. In the after math of the bombing SA issued call up instructions for about 140 000 troops, but by this time the Cubans has lost heart in the offensive and backed up, digging in for a retaliating attack form SA which they expected to come. However SA showed restrained and realise that escalting the situation was not in it's long term interest. Knowing that it had the firepower and expertise to overrun the Cubans/Fapla forces it also regocnised that in doing so Russia would be forced to join the campaign to prevent the humiliation of it's Cuban and Angolan allies. Had that happened the USA and Nato countries would also ultimately be drawn into the conflict. I suspect pressure was excerted from both the Russians and Americans on the waring parties to de-escalate the situation on the ground. And with the Cubans and Angolans fighting spirits all but gone it must have come as a welcome relief. On the SA side it too would have been welcomed as escalating the war would result in all kinds of other problems in the region. Russian openly acknowledge that the Cuab/Fapla forces was in no way capable of defeating the SA forces or stopping them if they chose to advace further up into Angola, and with the Soviet Unbion own internal problems on the rise it was left with no option but to force it hand on Cuba to accept a peace treaty and ultimately withdraw it forces all together from Angola. Neither Russia or the USA had the stomach for the "war by proxy" to turn into an outright fight between them. Especially Russia which was in the procces of withdrawing from Afghanistan due to it's failure of securing Afghanistan as a puppet country to Russia. Russia learned the hard way that sending troops to their death in a foreign country ultimately does not go down well within it's own borders. The Cubans had that lesson teach to it by the SADF too and seriously needed a backdoor out of Angola. While slogans can get troops on the plane to foreign countries it is ultimately the bodies that comes back that poses the biggest danger to itself internally. And after the heavy losses it suffered at the hands of the SADF in Angola it was in no mood to up it's body count. Of all the forces invloved only FAPLA, UNITA and SA had a true real interest in the area, while for the Russian, Cubans and any other foreig troops it would be more like "troops for hire" than "survival" that would motivate them. To sum it all up the RETREATING of over 120 km of the Cuban/Fapla forces can in no way be considered a victory of any kind for them...if you can do that then you live in a upside down world. In fact the very fact that they were forced back in their own territory is a testament to the fighting capibiliets of the SADF and UNITA forces and a MAJOR defeat to the Cuban/Fapla forces. If they indeed did chase the South Africans "like chickens back to Namibia" as you claim, it would go down in history as one of the most remarkable chases on record. Because after the "chase" ended they lost about a 120km worth of land...unless of course they were chasing in reverse! I know...I was there.

[@tjg4654]

+Phillip Groen / Gen. Arnaldo T. Ochoa Sanchez - that is his full name. Look him up and you will see that he was put to death in Cuba for dealing with drugs. As for the battle, UNITA did not take over Angola with SDF's help and help of the Western world mainly because of the Cubans. If the SDF could have defeated Angola, that army would have to have it ruled by Jonas Savimbi. There in lies the great victory of Angola and Cuba. I have a long chapter on the battle as well. I may post it soon here.

[@tjg4654]

+Phillip Groen This is the true story The Battle of Cuito Cuanavale was coming.The Soviets decided to lead the MPLA (FAPLA) into battle against UNITA. In August of 1987, 6,000 men and 80 tanks departed for Mavinga to oust UNITA from the city. The Cubans warned the Soviets not to attack and that the South Africans would attack them heavily, but they did not listen. When they reached the Lomba River on their way to Mavinga, UNITA and 5,000 South African troops, both heavily equipped with armored vehicles and heavy artillery, were waiting on them. When the MPLA soldierstried to cross the Lomba River between September the 9th and October the 7th, they were virtually obliterated by their enemies. The MPLA lost 1,059 men, 2118 wounded, 61 tanks, 83 armored vehicles, and 20 rocket launchers, including a highly advanced SA-8 anti-aircraft missile system that fell into Western hands for the first time ever. The South Africans loss 17 men, 5 armored vehicles and 41 men were wounded. UNITA’s losses were smaller than the MPLA, but still heavy. In the mist of battle, the Soviets serving as advisors abandoned the MPLA troops wildly retreated back to Cuito Cuanavale that was about 118 miles away. On this retreat many more Angolans lost their lives. The MPLA took up a defensive posture around Cuito Cuanavale and was attacked by UNITA and South Africans in mid-November. The Cuito Cuanavale airfield was badly damaged. South African tanks lined up along the city and bombed away. The Cubans, serving in only a support role at this time, had to remove all of their aircrafts to Menongue for safe keeping, a city about 90 miles west of Cuito Cuanavale. On November 9, South Africa and UNITA attacked another MPLA brigade who had crossed the Lomba River with air strikes, artillery, armored vehicles, and tanks. UNITA participated in the attack as an infantry force. The battle lasted for only 12 hours because the South Africans ran out of bullets and bombs, so they retreated with UNITA after destroying 10 tanks, capturing 3 tanks, and killing 75 men with very little damage done to themselves.On November 11, another MPLA brigade had crossed the Lomba River for some unknown reason and was attacked by the South Africans again. The MPLA fled across the river after losing nine tanks, 300 vehicles, and 131 men. The South African lost four armored vehicles, six men, and 10 soldiers were wounded. They chased the MPLA soldiers until they got tired and returned to the southern side of the Lomba River. On November 25, 1987, the South Africans went after yet another MPLA brigade on the northern side of the Lomba River, but this brigade ran into the dense bush in which the South Africans could not give chase because they could not move their heavy vehicles and artillery through the soft grounds. On November 15, 1987, the Angolan government lost faith in the Soviets and requested additional help from Fidel Castro. Castro sent 15,000 elite troops to Angola. They were transported to Cuito Cuanavale by helicopter along with 200 technicians, advisers, officers, and Special Forces. Cuito Cuanavale was reinforced militarily and the Cubans made arrangements to attack the South Africans west of Cuito Cuanavale in the city of Lubango where they had been held up for eight years. South Africa replaced their troops and reduced them to 2,000 men and provided only 24 tanks for the rest of the operation. On January 2, 1988, the South Africans attacked Cuito Cuanavale by air strikes and artillery, and UNITA attacked by land. The South Africans destroyed the bridge across the Cuito River with a smart bomb. The Cubans and the MPLA pushed back UNITA’s infantry attack. The Cubans built a wooden bridge to replace the destroyed bridge at the Cuito River. They turned the turrets of damaged tanks into fixed field artillery. On January 13, the South Africans attacked a MPLA brigade near the Lomba River with air strikes and artillery bombardments. It lasted for two days before the brigade withdrew from their position. The MPLA soldiers lost seven tanks to destruction, five were captured, 150 men died or were taken as prisoners, and UNITA lost four men and around 20 were wounded. The South Africans had one man wounded and one armored vehicle damaged.When the fight was over, the South Africans retreated because they ran out of bombs, bullets, and supplies. UNITA took over the camp abandoned by the MPLA. However, the MPLA returned to the camp near the Lomba River and took it back. A large number of MPLA and Cuban soldiers were heading to Cuito Cuanavale from Menongue, but they were slowed by the rainy season and mines planted by UNITA.There were more battles in February between the 14th and the 19th, in which the MPLA lost men, 42 Cubans died, and the South Africans lost 8 men with 21 wounded. The Cubans lost 20 tanks and 11 armored vehicles. The South Africans lost no vehicles but had several of them damaged by mines and bombs. The South Africans and UNITA soldiers did not want MPLA troops on the south side of the Lomba River. That was their objective. They failed, but the MPLA paid a heavy price for their victory. By March 23, fresh troops and reinforcements poured into Cuito Cuanavale and the city’s surrounding war zone. The South Africans and UNITA attacked to drive the Cubans and the MPLA back across the Cuito’s bridge constructed by the Cubans. They ran into mines and a thick blanket of bullets and falling bombs, killing a large number of UNITA’S soldiers. The bombs came from artillery and MiG Jets. Their advancement came to a sudden halt and UNITA and the South Africans were pushed southward. The Cubans and the MPLA captured several damaged South African tanks. The South Africans exhausted their supplies and munitions and decided to run from the battle, and UNITA soon followed. For months South African soldiers bombed Cuito Cuanavale and the airstrip from 25 miles away with G5 Howitzer cannons. At the end of August in 1988, the South Africans returned to South West Africa. Before the South Africans departed, 55,000 Cubans came to Angola. Of the 55,000, 40,000 of them were deployed to the south. They brought with them many more MiG jets and the South African Mirage jets were no match for them or the advanced Soviet air defense system in the hands of both the Cubans and the MPLA. Without air superiority, the South African army was no match for the Cubans and the MPLA combined, or the Cubans by themselves. The South Africans stayed out of Angola. The fighting between the MPLA and UNITA continued after the Cubans pulled out of Angola in 1991. They had several ceasefires and an election that was rejected by Jonas Savimbi because he did not win to become president of Angola. Jonas Savimbi, with massive support from the United States, turned Angola into his personal killing field. Atrocities were committed and around 500,000 mines were planted throughout the country which has thus far produced around 89,000 handicapped people, young and old, from their explosive powers when triggered.

[@philliprsa]

+tj g Why should I read anything about Gen. Arnaldo T. Ochoa Sanchez ...I never mentioned him in my post. Frankly I don't give a fib why he was send into eternity by his own people. It WAS NEVER the objective of the SADF to overrun Angola and install UNITA as the new government. The ONLY time that was on the cards was when chaos broke out in Angola after the sudden withdrawel of Portugal. At the request of the USA SA send troops in. Specially after all hell broke loose in SA..When the SADF forces was close to success the USA got cold feet and withdraw it's support for the SADF. Which left them with no choice but to withdraw from Angola. After that SA only supported UNITA in an effort to make the Namibian border more secured. Which at that stage was beinbg terrorized by SWAPO members manly through the use of landmines. Which in turn killed mostly blacks..women and children regardless. There was no way SA could just let this carnage continue left unchecked. The Cubans was "guns for hire" as it incursion in Angola was mostly driven by it's need to pay it's soldiers with foreign money supplied by the Angolans and Russia. They were in dire need ofthis money as back home in Cuba the economy was in dire straits. Taking over Angola was an UNITA aim never a SA objective, in fact all of our action in South Angola was desinged to enhance the border security and the SADF was in no way interested in getting deeper involved in the Angola Civil war other than it's own regional intersts regarding ther border area. The CIA most certainly wass working towards that aim and I would suggest SA would have weclomed it. BUT other than the mid 1970's operation it was NEVER to be an SADF objective to achive a regime chance in Angola by means of intefering directly in the civil conflict there. Obviously SA would covertly support UNITA covertly but with the main aim of having a friendly hand on the other side of the border helping to keep SWAPO at bay reducing the risk of the ever present threat of landmines which killed civilians in most of the cases.

[@modestankadu8220]

it is not true that only the Cubans and, Angolans were weary of the battle of cuito. This report is based on western assertion, as you can not be withdrawing from a war which, you are winning. Again the policy of constructive engagement had failed and, should be named for what, it was; DESTRUCTIVE ENGAGEMENT.

[@Angelo-g6l]

I see you mentioned SADF casualties and compared them with all the enemy losses. UNITA was very involved in this battle and they lost an awful amount of troops. Those losses should be added to the SADF loses to get a more fair summary of the battle as UNITA and the SADF were really the same army in Angola

[@eltonmoore681]

This is superb video Trafalgar8766. I as a young history teacher, 25. Continue to seek the truth about our country's past. Which is often very distorted to suit the current regime! What the textbooks state and what really happened are often very contradictory views! Also, the SADF, for fear of persecution & other reasons, have often had to keep quiet regarding the 'Bush War'. So, what the youth are learning today is very one-sided and I try my utmost to teach them the skills of critical thinking

[@ERNESTO-COMENTA]

Hey Elton, I’m from Cuba. I would like to get in touch with you! Please give me an email address to contact you! I don’t write mine here out of security reasons cause I’m Cuba still. This short documentary I’ve just seen has been a huge surprise for me, since in my country the official story tells about the GREAT VICTORY OF THE CUBAN ARMY IN CUITO CUANAVALE BATTLE! I hope to hear from you soon! God bless you very much

[@robertporter4501]

I long ago met a Canadian army officer who told me they had studied this battle while he was at the Royal Military College at Kingston, Ontario. I asked why they would have had particular interest in the battles at Cuito Cuanavale. He told me it was because South Africa with such a small force had achieved so much against a vastly bigger communist army. He said that the SADF had moved its artillery and troops around to the extent that the Russians concluded we had 9,000 soldiers. Like the Muslims, the communists never admit defeat, but at the Lomba River they got smashed. A Canadian missionary doctorwho was based in Angola, told me that following these battle he went down to Cuito to conduct a clinic for tribespeople. He told me: "On the way I passed scores of Russian tanks that looked as if they'd been opened up with a can opener ". So much for communist claims of victory. Our boys did a fantastic job and Nelson Mandela's claims of a communist victory they changed history are just a fat lie.

[@davidblyth5495]

@@robertporter4501 Maj Gen Roland de Vries was the developer of the mobile warfare doctrine used there. The CIA apparently translated his book "Mobiele Oorlogvoering" into English He presented several lectures in Australia where they wanted a mechanised infantry capability They also recruited many Mech Inf commanders

[@GertWallis]

I was an officer at 61 Mech that were stationed with the brigade HQ (Sept - Nov). The SA involvement was initially covert in support of UNITA. This escalated to artillery support until full deployment of 61 Mech and 32 Battalion. South African forces were not allowed to move during the day due to Cuban air cover, our main AA support was from a UNITA platoon (Stinger missiles). During my stay there we (61 Mech) lost 3 men while we defeated a brigade (1400)

[@davehamlyn3097]

Cuito Cuanavale was the name the Russians gave it, it was Battle of Labombo River. The biggest tank battle on African soil since El Alamain. After the Battles one of the camanders in the battle made a statement " God was in this place". One of the commanders asked 250 pasters of HCC in Pretoria to pray and intercede , which they did for a few hours and the rest is history.

[@juansantana8448]

Hahaha, if SF was so successful at defeating Cuba, Angolan regular and the Soviet armament, why is it that it sue for peace - certainly not because that was their idea when the begin the invasion of Angola, therefore, what you are saying it false.

[@nekongovitankanga]

You are right. Kicked out of Angola, run back into South Africa in their dirty pants. Mandela got released, Namibia got its independence, weakened their support to UNITA, Mobutu got kicked out. Dos Santos and his friends were the winners, period.

[@aronitibar2279]

Thanks very much , good , very good answers

[@tonyhill2610]

long live the white troops in the old sad for where ever you are

[@MegaJohny56]

what about the black troops who fought bother side eh

[@cdleon1]

the SADF had only limited objectives, namely, to halt the enemy at Cuito, to prevent its airstrip from being used, and then to retreat. Further action would have undermined negotiations between Cuba, Angola and South Africa, which began in London early in 1988 and continued in May in Brazzaville, Congo, and Cairo, Egypt. By this time, the South African government had already recognised the political change in Russia and the ending of the cold war.00

[@r.j.dunnill1465]

The SADF's strategic objective was to prevent UNITA from being annihilated. The results speak for themselves.

[@graemebartmann7872]

@@r.j.dunnill1465 Has anybody séen Savimbi's house in Huambo.Bombed to shit.And look's just like that 33 years later

[@janfourie4574]

We never did loose. We won descisively, the cubans never stood a chance anyway, we used such a small proportion of our army to defeat multible countries, at the end it was the world that forced us to give it all up to the ANC who f ed centuries of progress up in s few years

[@gratefuldead3750]

Hail to the master race

[@520_metal]

Lol cope

[@WIT_WOLF]

@@520_metal STFU go play csgo in mommys basement kido

[@WIT_WOLF]

@@520_metal you've probably done nothing with you're life but wasting mommys credit card on vbucks so it's disrespectful of you to say that. if you want to have an opinion go fight a war you're self

[@robertporter4501]

Jan, like Nelson Mandela, the Cubans simply lie about a communist 'victory' at Cuito. Instead they got hammered and lost thousands of men. After being released from prison Mandela visited Cuba to thank the Cubans for helping Africans 'beat the boers in Angola'. It was a thorough lie and just nonsense that he wanted to believe. Under his rule South Africa got huge corruption and the highest murder and rape rates in the world, but in North America and Europe he is a hero. Talk about stupid!

[@ernstwiltmann6]

That's how the German Wehrmacht conducted propaganda, you learned that well.

[@grahamnel2437]

Proud to have served 81 - 95

[@paulbaines9125]

I followed this battle in the press in U. K. back then, it was the biggest land battle ever in sub Saharan history. The South African artillery was the best in the world designed by Gerald Bull, the G5 & G6 Rhino with specially designed fuses for longer distances. Thanks for the vid & info time well spent putting together. 👍

[@ruimaques863]

As old fusilier portuguse bull...I was 32th buffeel

[@heinrichshiyaka2182]

Cuito cuanavale was S.A. 's worst flop, Even black kakunya puppets agreed that it was hell on earth. S.A don't wanna accept defeat

[@dougerrohmer]

@@heinrichshiyaka2182 "Chester Crocker, who was the U.S. Assistant Secretary of State for African Affairs during the Reagan Administration, said that: "In some of the bloodiest battles of the entire civil war, a combined force of some 8,000 UNITA fighters and 4,000 SADF troops not only destroyed one FAPLA brigade but badly damaged several others out of a total FAPLA force of some 18,000 engaged in the three-pronged offensive. Estimates of FAPLA losses ranged upward of 4,000 killed and wounded….Large quantities of Soviet equipment were destroyed or fell into UNITA and SADF hands when FAPLA broke into a disorganized retreat... The 1987 military campaign represented a stunning humiliation for the Soviet Union, its arms and its strategy. ... As of mid-November, the UNITA/SADF force had destroyed the Cuito Cuanavale airfield and pinned down thousands of FAPLA's best remaining units clinging onto the town's defensive perimeters."" "A summary of the battle in Krasnaya Zvezda, the official periodical of the Soviet Ministry of Defence, noted that the FAPLA-Cuban coalition had failed to "decisively defeat the enemy" and described the end result as "frankly speaking, an impasse"." If the Soviets say the FAPLA-Cuban force didn't win, then it means they got their arses kicked.

[@kalaharisurfer9605]

@@heinrichshiyaka2182 lol yet Cuba withdrew soon afterwards. How many men did Angola lose? How close did Angola get to their objectives? The facts speak for themselves, regardless of your wild claims.

[@gabrielelia147]

NATO's vs poor black people

[@StormB67]

Having taken part in Moduler, Hooper & Packer from begin to end I would say this video is largely accurate.. It is always good to look back.. But reading some of the comments below.. Agg shame Adrian Perez .. We gave you guys the biggest and baddest hiding and we were such a small fighting group compared to your Cubans.. Face it.. We were a much better armed force. There is no disgrace being beaten.

[@submariner200]

+William Hall-Jones Good job Sir!

[@submariner200]

The South Africans defended Tobruk against Rommel in WW2,The South African General Koenig was in charge of the defenses of Tobruk.

[@submariner200]

Besides Russia is located thousands of miles away from South Africa the same the Cubans are,what the hell were they doing in Africa interfering in Africa's problems?South Africa belongs there the Russians and the Cubans didn't.Oh I forgot that we are living an age were you are forced to be politically correct,otherwise you are wrong.

[@submariner200]

You have to accept and believe anything thrown out there by the leftist if not you are a racist or a fascist well,the commies can commence calling me whatever the hell they want to,The Soviets and the Cubans got their asses kicked in Africa.

[@submariner200]

***** Oh you forgot Cuba also produces dictators.....

[@gregmenego2200]

Today? ...... A disgrace !

[@DeadeyeDamari]

clearly to those that ask valid questions! South Africans often used captured arms to assist in their goals to attack the Cuban occupation in Angola. That been said, instead of asking small impertinent questions, one should focus on the larger picture. In retrospect, the SA government was beset by two forces, one externally, one internally. The onslaught on Cuito Cuanavale was a victory for the SA govt to be more expedient to the end of Apartheid. One has to first take note that the full force of the SA forces were not involved. If it were so, an expected call up up to 400 000 South Africans would have taken place, which would have been the annihilation of Angolan forces and their allies, including Cuba. What is remarkable, and is even taught in military colleges over the world, INCLUDING the Russian Army, is the way the South Africans manipulated their forces. The victory doesn't come in occupying Cuito Caunavaule, it comes from stepping in and stopping a Soviet led offensive many times greater than the force used to decimate them. South African orders were simple... do not occupy Cuito Caunavaule unless it is given without a fight. Only a madman would try attack an enemy ten times it's size that is dug in and awaiting a siege. So, did the Cubans stop a South African advance? yes, They stopped 3000 south africans from over running their positions. Did they win the war? In no way can they say they won the war, not militarily. they were outclassed in every aspect of warfare except air support. And even then, if the South Africans had pushed the issue in their aging Mirages, the outcome would be not much different. Not only was the attacks on Unita repulsed with devastating effect, But the whole offensive was turned on its head. Cuban sympathisers are quick to point out the defenssive actiuons afterwards, but they are slow to point out that their offensive, which was planned methodically beforehand, was routed with enormous cost. Why did the South Africans go to the negotiating table? Simply put, Apartheid had become unaffordable and the heavy losses to the Cubans, ironically, had given the Apartheid regime a way to negotiate what is today a free, and democratic country. South Africa was not overthrown by a revolution... and has the distinction of being the only African country that is led by proper democratic principles. This could be argued , of course by Namibia, which has adopted similar values for true democracy, but the point remains that Cuito Caunavaule was the focal point. That been said, all the actions the Cubans propagated thereafter was a mass of blunders. Not only was their heroic general executed ( in the guise of smuggling drugs) But their whole strategy of feinting with the left and striking with the right (boxers term) came to naught when they sent a force south wards (during peace negotiations i might add) which was intercepted with losses that made the Cuban commanders with draw. There they claimed they destroyed over 200 South African tanks... which is a laugh, because the last time South Africa had over 200 combat tanks was over 30 years ago, and since I am a member of the armored corps, such a a "defeat" would still be ringing in my ears. this never happened and in the end the Cubans went home and there was peace everywhere. if you are a member of the ex-Cuban forces who think otherwise how this would have gone down, i know of at least 10 other people who think otherwise and we would gladly show you a re match how things SHOULD have gone down. Like Pik Botha replied when the Cuban Ambassador threatened to put another 10 000 Cuban troops into Angola... "no matter, we'll just put in another 500 South Africans to counter them". that's how pathetic the Cubans were.

[@SuperBushcat]

To all my brothers in arms black & white who fought in this battle on the SADF side know who & what we were really made of . . . as for the wannabes' remember the dead as for we who survived, speak of it in silent tongue . Those who question our morals should question their own before staring at death down the barrel of gun Hence dead men tell no lies as for the living who lived the battles, remember them all to well . . . Politian's and third world countries will always remain just that . . .

[@reiniersanchezgaviero1243]

Hi there Trafalgar 9766 i come from cuba but im now living in the united States,i agree that's was a war in which we never have nothing to do until this day i don't understand why the Cuban government sent to die very youngest cuban man in a war that was just matter of the african people,but i guess that was the way the cold war was in a side United States and in the other the Soviet Union,the both playing around with everyone,one thing for your knowledgement, Arnaldo Ochoa was executed not because what happened in cuito,but because he was guilty for cocaine traffic with Pablo Escobar,they used Cuba as a bridge,planes full of cocaine used to land in Cuban airports (controlled by militaries)

[@Ratbasturd69]

that was a good clip, only thing which is slightly incorrect, we did have heavy equipment there, 14 G5 guns were brought up, we brought up about 6000 rounds for them. The tanks they were using were Olifants not T55's and we had air support alot of the time.

[@useryggfdcc]

My brother was part of the crew of one of those G5 cannons.

[@LeonKotze70]

The Cubans used the T55s.

[@timoteushatupopi596]

The people won the war not the soldiers.

[@janalberthorvath]

So Zuma : jou ma se poes as jy dink of vertel dat die SADF ooit verloor het. Jou ma se poes het verloor toe sy jou uitgedruk het O Ja erk is Jan Albert Horvath working and feeling safe and protected by and in the The Republic of Angola right now.

[@burtonjames7129]

The truth is none of the strategic or operational objectives the South African forces had were attained. They were defeated and had to withdraw. Eventually, Cuito led to the independence of Namibia and the total liberation of Angola and its people.

[@HansViljoen-km2pk]

Where do you get info not true betrayel in sa cov

[@maaifoediedelarey4335]

Long live the real SADF !!!!!!!

[@ka3ax85]

Well, its like this, SADF won many battles but lost the war. MPLA came to power and crushed UNITA

[@augustomundombe829]

VIVA long live MPLA!

[@doppies2001]

South Africa never lost the War. South Africa was sold out. and now it is being destroyed by greedy, self-serving Bastards.

[@antoniocosta4896]

Resultado final da guerra ,O MPLA ganhou a guerra e continua a governar Angola Cuba continua a existir com a sua linha politica e os racistas da SADF foram derrotados e os negros passaram a mandar na sua terra .Por mais voltas que deêm esta é a verdade ,Na guerra não conta muito o numero de mortos ou material destruido .Oque conta é o resultado final.

[@guleiro]

@@doppies2001 Well you are right. The ones leading SA today are incompetent and are destroying the country. Under Apartheid a minority had all the goodies and the native majority was treated like 2nd class citizens. Hard to say wish one is better...

[@Watchthisman]

They won according to who, the politicians, the reality is they fled with their tails between their legs and were given the mercy to leave, in order to prevent more troops from Russia and Cuba which already outnumbered the South Africans, it was very expensive for them to keep throwing money away.

[@pax_praetorian]

despite the regime South Africa was a force to be reckoned with, there was a time when American soldiers were sent here to receive military training. Ironically The Americans "Backed" South Africa during this conflict... yet were never really involved at the time, I've heard Rumors that the only reason they were siding with us, was because they considered the South Africans a threat, just like Russia and so many other countries

[@scheedeescheedee6106]

The fact of why Cuba was in Angola, was not to defend against SA aggression... it was in fact the other way around with Russia leveraging its puppet Allie Cuba into setting up a growing "Communist" military presence and threat in Africa at the height of the "Cold War". Russia at the time was getting more and more involved in the Afghanistan conflict and needed to leave Africa and Angola in the hands of a mainly reluctant Cuba. And keep in mind this was just after Cuba had deployed aggressive nuclear missiles aimed at the US mainland. This blatant Missile threat and subsequent blockade by the US that almost culminated in a global nuclear war. So it was that Communistic aggression and world expansionism was therefore under intense scrutiny by NATO. Note: SA was a member of NATO and therefore an Allie to the West...albeit a very unpopular one (the better of two evils as it were).

[@santar21]

Scheedee Scheedee estamos mesmo a vêr quem lá está em Angola... são os Russos... vocês não falam de história... só de "preconceitos...

[@scheedeescheedee6106]

Prejudices?? Obviously you did not read the OTHER racialist comments in this thread, let alone my comments, which did not contain prejudice...I merely quote unpopular history and facts not Socialist/Marxist fairytale Propaganda.

[@skidoorider66]

I salute every SADF service person I have served with in the SADF, 1985 - 1990.

[@aajad2398]

Vince Van Gogh tell me about the war because this videos are telling me lies

[@mwanykange]

CREDIT GOES TO SWAPO GUERRILLAS

[@mwanykange]

@Goosa Poosa How and by who? Or perhaps you don't know what are you talking about?

[@mwanykange]

@Goosa Poosa Haa Haa I think you know nothing about the war and PLAN, those soldiers who participated in the war from 1966 to 1989 can tell you better.

[@mwanykange]

@Goosa Poosa Botha have to agree because the cause of justice is a none return, and was warned by the CIA to accept because otherwise, we could stop in Pretoria!

[@hugh-martinrouxhugh-martin1382]

ONS SAL LEWE ONS SAL STERWE, ONS VIR JOU SUID AFRIKA!!!

[@gregmenego2200]

Weet nie mooi nou nie. Die plek is nou septies met wat die flappies nou met hierdie mooi land van aanvang nie.

[@FrancoisWelgemoed-s1t]

❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤​@@gregmenego2200

[@gafek67]

Wow the Cubans got badly thrashed here Well done SADF

[@EdgarGonzalez-bw4xs]

You're so stupid that you think maybe Cuba was on the offensive but It wasn't . He only came to defend cuito they defended him, so what beating are you talking about, retard?😂🤡

[@tloutlou2655]

an unita and sa didnt reach objectives bt cuba and mpla reached theirs, swapo is now rulling swa mpla angola .lol apartheid sa fallen .greaty achievement by cuba n mpla,

[@dinodeluca2754]

potch artillery 4 art brigade 41 battery 120mm mortars how i miss those days, i wish i could locate some of those guys

[@dirkshumbadrinkersb4908]

We are still around.....

[@flaviuslupu2532]

* WHERE ARE THE WHITES OF SOUTH-AFRICA !!!! *

[@dandylion18]

The Cubans didn't win a battle against apartheid, they lost a battle for communism.

[@gilbertomartinez8830]

dandylion18 Cuba winer

[@danieroos6675]

Well said 👏👏👏👏

[@jotabe1984]

SADF/Unita objective: to anihilate FAPLA retreating divisions and to capture Cuito Cuanavale's town and airfield FAPLA/Cuban objective: to hold de line and stop the invasor's advance Strategic outcome: FAPLA/Cuban forces achieve their strategic goal while SADF/Unita has to stop the attack. judging a battle by their material/human losses it's just stupid as many many history examples shows

[@adrianvanwyck2818]

If sadf wanted cuito thy would of taken it in ops aplha centuari. But they sent in unita forces not sadf forces.

[@manchiviri]

The real victory of UNITA-SADF forces ocured at the river Lomba and not at Cuito Cuanavale. Cuito Cuanavale was not a battle but a positional defense that both forces (UNITA and SADF could not break. That is the truth. At the end of the conflict the racist had to leave angolan territory, Namibia achieved independence, in South Africa disappear the apartheid regime, the cubans went home, Savimbi was killed and finally the MPLA rules Angola still.

[@alandi640]

+Antonio Moreno im cuban south africa is a great country we should fucking invade angola and take some part of their land for fighting for them without nothing in exchange but now after that stupid war cuba has no money and south african whites are opressed a shitty war

[@contax2010]

Mario Riva USSR East Germany Poland Hungary CZ BG RO all collapsed 1989 - Communist Block was bleeding dry because of Reagan USA 🇺🇸 drove them against wall. THAT IS WHEN South Africa withdrew and changed and released Mandela after ANC lost its international power support !!! Angola 🇦🇴 and Namibia 🇳🇦 were no longer a problem for SA as all worked for peace in SA. Cuito was a Fortress and SA did not want to sacrifice its men just for a „victory“ there, they already damaged FAPLA and Cubans badly at Lomba (Battle of the Lomba) and elsewhere.

[@manchiviri]

@@alandi640 That is a fact nobody denies.

[@nekongovitankanga]

Mário Riva, agreed, SADF got kicked out of Angola for the second time, first happened in 1974-75 went into Angola to stop NETO proclaiming independence, fled via Zaïre, run back into South Africa in their dirty pants. Mandela got released, Namibia got its independence, weakened their support for UNITA, Mobutu got kicked out. Dos Santos and his friends were the winners, period.

[@danielbaard4682]

Mac-ngqay. People like you stick your head in the sand and think its night. We felt sorry for you and did the right thing - gave you a vote, even though most blacks in SA were not from SA originally. No way in hell SA lost any war apart from the Boer War. That's just idiotic to think that.

[@chica476]

The bizarre thing about this ordeal was the fact that MK claimed victory, just how they claim victory with their running of the gov't of SA... and look what happened. lol.

[@Trafalgar8766]

Remember what happened at Cuito Cuanavale? Watch the video again the Cubans wanted to kick the SOuth Africans out of Angola and take South-eastern Angola, neither happened!!! The South African objective was to prevent a communist take over of Southern African countries and forced the Cubans out, so why would they agree if they were supposedly crushing South Africa? Throughout the war Cubans had to abandon vehicles, etc. because of the power of the SAAF.

[@ERNESTO-COMENTA]

This has been an amazing surprise for me as Cuban! I did’nt participate in Angola’s war but this battle of Cuito Cuanavale is consider in Cuba to be the Greatest Victory of the Cuban Armay which led to peace negotiations between SA and Angola-Cuba! Gee it’s incredible to see how we have been lied to about this battle! Well, it shouldn’t surprise me cause I know many other ocasions when our government has lied to us!

[@robertporter4501]

Ernesto, thanks for your honesty. Cuba lost at least hundreds of men at Cuito Cuanavale. Afterwards when negotiations started, the U.S. Undersecretary for Africa, Chester Crocker, said that Cuba was shocked by its losses.

[@davroch7620]

@@robertporter4501 😂 OMG Obviously, not everyone agrees with your little propaganda speech. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cuito_Cuanavale

[@johnmurdoch8534]

they didn't lie. SA lost. Period.

[@jack-ch5lr]

@@johnmurdoch8534 like your father list when makimg an idiot like Hi.Where you there ? No then shut up and try and rather deal with illegal immigrants in your country sonny boy

[@colinriddell9553]

Sadly your propoganda at work!

[@derejemegersa3114]

Where are the unita and old south Africa defense force now? They are forgotten history.

[@bradabwana1098]

Thanks cuban and Soviet Union they did not lost Namibia as a colony they lost apartheid in south Africa

[@MmmMmm-qv4en]

Sure, South Africa were force to leave Angola because they win?!! Great logic.

[@mardiffv.8775]

No, peace negotiations; SA foreign minister said to Cuban Riquet: "We both can be winners and end this war. SA will withdraw from Angola under the pretence that SA stopped communism and Cuba can claim victory too and withdraw from Angola". And so the war ended and Namibia was raised.

[@aronitibar2279]

hihihihi

[@tjg4654]

Many people died on the Angolan side. We know that, but all the deaths and destruction was about maintaining Angola's independence. It was maintained. That in itself is victory enough,

[@makara80]

If anyone honestly believes that the Cubans/MPLA were somehow victorious in this campaign (and many dipsh^ts seemingly do) then I’ll bet they must also swallow Castro’s bullshit insistence that Cuban military intervention was an independent, noble act of ‘comradely solidarity’! The irrefutable truth is Cuba deployed substantial military formations in Angola from the mid 1970’s onwards _at the direct behest of Moscow_ . The Soviets wished to consolidate their growing influence in the region, post independence from Portugal, so got their trained puppy Castro to do their dirty work. Pretend otherwise and deny reality all you want comrades!

[@makara80]

​@G L.C Ah but I never said nor intimated South Africa was _outright_ victorious. Not least because it wasn’t. Apartheid South Africa wasn’t _my_ regime either matey! Good grief, is that how your mind works then?: anti Communist _imperialism_ = pro South Africa by default? How tragically myopic. ;)

[@SgtRandom]

as a south african i salute all those who fought in that war o7

[@chrisherz6631]

Hmmm. So why is apartheid today only found in Israel, not South Africa?

[@marckcarbonelloifveteran410]

I am proud of the SA forces that fought communism... a salute from an American!!! Great job!!

[@lwandilemsiza8027]

Aphartheid forces. You should be ashamed that the united states allied with such a regime but allas United States are exactly the same

[@marckcarbonelloifveteran410]

Kamou flage You should ashamed that Cuba paired with the Soviet system, a criminal system that murdered 120 million people. Castro is a murderer and a dictator. Assassinating Cubans for 61 years. That’s very shameful!!

[@marckcarbonelloifveteran410]

@@lwandilemsiza8027 The Cubans were there to grab diamonds for the Soviets. Castro earned 20 millions in diamonds each year from Dos Santos hands.

[@marckcarbonelloifveteran410]

The Cuban system is a corrupt system led by murderers.

[@visigodo1900]

So Trafalgar8766 taking you point of view the dismounting of the apartheid 5 years later and the rise of Nelson Mandela as president was also part of the SA strategy. Sorry, it is difficult for me to believe it.

[@wipneus12345]

The brave soldiers of the SADF, I salute you!!! I enjoyed the video, interesting facts and great song!

[@cowetareserve]

Vyfster intro theme (in case you wanted the song; I heard it here first. Even as a South African.)

[@Toy1er]

Hats off to the brave Cubans who gave their lives to help comrades across the globe. And the many brave Angolans. It's called solidarity. It makes rich imperialists & their bootlicking toadies very upset.

[@raulvernengo]

For God's sake. Minute 6 in the video: apartheid South Africa and "preservation of democratic freedom". You're kidding me, right?

[@Trafalgar8766]

Anyone who has not taken the time to read previous comments - I know the tank crew is Rhodesian, i knew that when I made the video, I know that now, and I will still know it in the future - I used it because it captured the idea of the SADF that I wanted to get across (South Africa did use the same tanks, they were the ones who gave them to Rhodesia) - I have not decided on whether or not to keep it. Thank you.

[@azanianlion]

Good video, except General Sanchez was executed for putting Cuba at risk by allowing drug drops to be carried out by drug lords on Cuban territory &,for that reason he was tried for treason against Cuba and executed on the 13 July 1989.

[@submariner200]

Nice video and a very relaxing music.

[@luiskeya6730]

This video is pretending the SADF won the war But my question is a how loser still in power and the winner desapear VIVA MPLA ANGOLA AVANTE 💪✊✊✊

[@danieroos6675]

Doesn't matter .. We know why the losser is still in power .. The fact still is we, the old SADF shoot them in pieces hahaha and won THAT day 👏👏👏👏 what a humiliation it was for the forces which was against us, who under estimated us .. us the old SADF. We are proud and you have nothing hahaha.

[@Charlesputnam-bn9zy]

General Arnaldo Ochoa Sanchez' s fate tells the truth on the MPLA victory at Cuito Cuanavale

[@Josh93B93]

+Charlie Ochoa was chosen by Defense Minister Raul Castro to become the head of Cuba's Western Army. Since this branch of the military protects Cuba's capital city, Havana, and its top leaders and installations, the position would have made him the third most powerful military figure on the island, after Commander in Chief Fidel Castro and General Raul Castro. What was expected to be a routine background check prior to the announcement of his appointment began to unravel, however, when some close associates accused the revolutionary hero of corruption which included, but was not limited to, the sale of diamonds and ivory from Angola and the misappropriation of weapons in Nicaragua. As the investigation continued, links were found to other military and Ministry of the Interior officials who were engaged in even more serious crimes: taking pay-offs from South American drug-traffickers in exchange for letting them use Cuban territorial waters for drug drops and pick-ups. General Raul Castro, who was very close to Ochoa personally, later said he pleaded with Ochoa on a number of occasions to come clean, reveal everything, so they could move forward. When Ochoa refused to cooperate, on June 12, the Ministry of the Revolutionary Armed Forces announced his arrest and investigation for serious acts of corruption, dishonest use of economic resources, and abetting drug trafficking. Ochoa was put behind bars for a month in west Havana, in the military base named Reloj Club Boinas Rojas. During this time his closest friends and associates continued their attempts to persuade him to cooperate in hopes of ameliorating his sentence. During this same time Patricio and Tony de la Guardia and others were apprehended and charged as well. Ochoa and the others finally went before a Military Honour Court. Their trial, which provided ample evidence of the crimes that were committed, including dates, places, amounts of money and drugs involved, along with the lesser crimes of smuggling diamonds and ivory for sale, was viewed on Cuban television. During the trial none of the defendants claimed that they had not carried out these acts; only that there were "mitigating circumstances"[this quote needs a citation]. At one point Ochoa mused over what had brought him to this point, saying that initially he was trying to help secure weapons and other materials needed for his troops, and then one thing led to another. The Military Court found him guilty of all charges, including the capital offense of treason. Prosecutors had presented evidence that at least one pilot involved in the transfer of drugs had been contracted by the CIA, and argued that if the United States government instead of the Cuban government had discovered and revealed the involvement of high level Cuban military personnel in drug trafficking, that would have provided an excuse for invading Cuba (less than a year later, the US invaded Panama using Noriega's alleged involvement in drug trafficking as the justification). Alternatively, they surmised, if Cuba had gone ahead and appointed General Ochoa as head of the Western Army, the US would have been in a good position to blackmail and control one of the people most responsible for the country's security. Four of the defendants, including Ochoa and Tony de la Guardia, were given death sentences for the crime of treason. The ruling regime claimed that not only had they betrayed the high level of trust in them by the government and people of Cuba, the Court declared, but had placed the entire country in jeopardy by their actions. The death of the traitor was unrelated to the outcome of the conflict.

[@Charlesputnam-bn9zy]

Yeah, so say the false witnesses.

[@Josh93B93]

+Charles putnam1982 just like Ochoa's testimony admitting to the crimes. even though his trial was broadcast on national TV I'm sure it was all just propaganda! If you feel that he was forced into his admission of the crimes, because of a supposed defeat that Castro would want him killed for, then why would he lie on national TV when his best chance of survival would have been exposing the truth to the Cuban people? I'm sorry mate but from a purely analytical stand point the facts just don't add up.

[@submariner200]

+Joshua O'Bryan Ochoa was coerced by Castro. Castro reassured Ochoa during the trial that If he accepted responsibility for the charges of narcotrafficking he was not going to be executed and Ochoa went along with it. The communist tribunal executed Ochoa and four other officers. All of them were working under Fidel Castro's orders.

[@Josh93B93]

+submariner200 Aye, sorry mate, I wasn't aware that a white South African was in Castro's inner circle and had access to what would be deemed (if it was true) beyond top secret information. Still yet, that doesn't explain why he didn't speak out when the verdict came. He was on national TV, if he knew he was about to be killed, he could have spoken out. it very well could have saved his life. You make Castro out to be a bloodthirsty tyrant, while understanding nothing of the determination of the Cuban people, Batista was a tyrant, supported financially and militarily by the US and the UK, he was still forced to flee the country, if the people didn't support Castro, they could have been rid of him back in 91' when the last Russians left.

[@joeskosana6698]

What is strange though is that according to the stats you present, the imperialist forces were supposed to have ermeged overwhelmingly victorious. We all know that they were defeated. If you won, you are sitting with the throphy in the cabinet.

[@adrianvanwyck2818]

Real winners was the USA. They broke Russia and Cuba with 1 south African and unita stone

[@emanuelelavococaala6573]

I regret for every one that had lose his life in this war! I've brothers that never came back home. God protect our Country (Angola)!

[@Ian-mj4pt]

Using vyfster song really brings back memories. Made us men but also damaged alot of people . Kyk voer of Kyk noord en fok voert.

[@Ian-mj4pt]

Skollie and Priester 😅😅I still use that same saying when I'm sukkeling kyk noord en vok voord

[@Trafalgar8766]

Put it simply, South Africa did not want Communism to spread around Southern Africa, so when it was safe that Namibia was not going Communist it was safe to leave. Furthermore, South African Armies did not leave immediately they left a few years later. Furthermore, Cuba also withdrew their troops and retreated from Angola. South Africa could not reveal too much due to the international opposition to the army being in Angola.

[@jack-ch5lr]

Well said

[@Trafalgar8766]

How can I spell this out for you any clearer?!? SAAF Controlled the skies, at the end of the war Cuba did some raids to seemingly end the war on a high, but while those happened they were already withdrawing! SAAF controlled the skies since 1975, and (watch the video) shot down many more Cuban planes. Learn the facts and then get back to me...

[@Ghoulza]

Hi, i have to disagree SA didnt control the skies, it was one of the few examples where an army was able to win battles without control of the skies, we had less planes and they had better anti air, proof of that was the SA8 we captured and gave to the US, well we captured two gave one to the CIA.... we used our air force far better and more effectively we had better pilots and alot of enemy planes where destroyed on the ground... we had recce soldiers far in front who would guide artilery onto the runway as soon as they saw planes trying to take off. we did not have full control of the skies and for most part Angola was a no fly zone. I'll be happy to give you more evidence if you still dont accept this

[@contax2010]

@@Ghoulza that’s correct I heard similar from friend in SA MIlitary Intelligence in 1987 he said that Enemies controlled sky after Communist World sent in massive Arms and Armies. SA had poor Anti-Air Defenses or too few. SA was under world sanctions starved of modern weapons and up against half aggressive communist world with their latest stuff. SADF really was extremely brave to fight against such odds, do so well and hold enemies off the gates to SA. It’s like the Heroes of History - everyone respects a good fighter - only that saved Southern Africa. Just like Ukraine 🇺🇦 today

[@Ghoulza]

@@contax2010 except now we are vilified for having fought against communisim and our current government supports Russia.... funny how things work out

[@reimomunyandi7064]

“Until the lion learned how to write, the story will always glorify the hunter. “ If the battle was won how come the UNITA/SADF didn’t capture the town? It’s was Cuban/MPLA who were stationed at Cuito that is why CIA used the football fields there to estimate the number of Cuban soldier. Video failed to mention the important role played by USA in intelligence gathering for UNITA/SADF?

[@mikehunt3800]

3000 white south african men against 40 000 cubans 100 000 angolans and 1000 russians. That doesnt sound like a fair fight now does it. Cuba and russia should have sent more men.

[@irishboer7124]

lol

[@1jackhb]

well said Jo

[@joshuasantiago2316]

This is the most stupid made up story. South Africa lost the battle and the victor's loses are huge compared to South African loses. How could they lose the battle, retreat from Angola and give up Namibia? Lmao

[@irishboer7124]

You dagos got your greasy asses kicked by the SADF boys.

[@tprdfh51]

Joshua...this battle was one of Castro/Cuba's greatest defeats - you really don't know what you are talkng about. Go on Google Earth and you can still see the rusting hulks of knocked out Cuban tanks where they lie to this day. The SADF "Olliphant" MBT merely replicated the success experienced by the Israelis's when they faced overwhelming odds using the same tank against massed T54/55's during the Yom Kippur war.

[@tjakamonawatataerasmus-see3782]

The Communist Alliance (FAPLA, Cuba, Russia): "Let's take Mavinga and then Jamba". SADF: "Fuck you" *BANG* Communists: "Okey, let's fall back to Cuito Cuanavale and dig in". SADF: "Now you stay right there". Communists: "We won! They didn't take Cuito Cuanavale! We won!" SADF: LOL

[@letnor16ll]

@Trafalgar8766 one question if cuito battle was so successful why did south africa leave namibia? sorry about my bad english

[@jack-ch5lr]

You read false accounts simple

[@AlaskanSinker]

Good day on your question the reason why South Africa left was because of Presidents Ronald Raegan of America that but pressure on South Africa making the war a political stunt not because they lost the war

[@fredflinstone6468]

Is the 'real issue' that corrupt, bankrupt, thuggish and incompetent governments (Apartheid South Africa, Cuba, Soviet Union etc) were using armed conflict as a distraction from their own country's domestic issues in another futile waste of human lives, not to mention the suffering that the Angolan people had to endure!!

[@vladgeo4888]

Here in Russia, when we see the memories of German generals about their numerous victories on the Eastern front - we're saying: oh yes, they always defeated us.. up to the walls of Berlin.. So, what is the result of so-called UNITA's victory?

[@burtonjames7129]

Bravo! These ones here are also trying to rewrite history. None of Unita's or South African strategic and operational objectives were reached.

[@tonyvanderhelm2934]

@@burtonjames7129 and what did the Angolans , Cubans , East Germans and Soviet soldiers achieve ? They saw their asses.

[@sergeyk651]

Americans won all the battles in Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq. Soviets won all the battles in Afghanistan. Russians won all the battles in 1st Chechen war. Israelis won all the battles in Gaza and Lebanon Rhodesians won all the battles in Bush War. South Africans won all the battles in Angola and SWA. Do you see a pattern here? Despite all those armies winning battles, they still withdrew forces and the opposing side took control. South Africans clearly won the war militarily. The damaged inflicted upon the SADF by the Angolans and Cubans was minimal. South Africa was on the cusp of major internal changes due to the leftist liberal traitors in the West and no longer was seen as a useful tool against Communist forces.

[@ktheterkuceder6825]

@@tonyvanderhelm2934 Tbh soviets saw their asses handed to them at the beginning of ww2 and even at their victories they lost more. As for east germans well this wasn't the same army that gave ussr hell up until berlin so.

[@jack-ch5lr]

@@burtonjames7129 neither you father's for creating you

[@duckman0033]

Well this is a whole lot of bullshit. South Africa pulled out of Angola and lost Namibia (and apartheid crumbled). The racist government lost, and the people of southwest Africa won. Trying to rewrite history like this doesn't change these facts.

[@carlreiche4991]

The SADF were a well oiled fighting machine, as well as 32 BTN

[@MultiTuttut]

Oiled in all the wrong places, which is why they got their asses kicked to kingdom come :)

[@augustomundombe829]

Viva China Communist ;) Viva Xi Jinping :)

[@struiswaai]

Go live there and see whether the Chinese like you. hehehe

[@augustomundombe829]

VIVA China Communist the world's economic number one powerhouse ;)

[@augustomundombe829]

hehehe Lol

[@Trafalgar8766]

The dismantling of Apartheid and Mandela (a terrorist) becoming president was a result of the appeaser FW de Klerk looking to appease liberal westerners and communist black african leaders - SA strategy to end communism and keep an African country running well for all ended with de Klerk

[@Trafalgar8766]

Remember this cubanisimo123, the cubans left at the exact same time as when the South Africans left, it wasn't a matter of South Africa being humiliated, it was the other way around, Cuba was finding itself far too stretched in a remote conflict that it clearly wasn't going to win, considering South Africa had one the large majority of the battles in the conflict. End of argument.

[@jotabe1984]

oh, yes, Apartheid victory was so stunning they lost power for good. The Angolan fate had a lot more to do with the USSR and eastern front collapse than the strategic outcome on the war

[@adrianvanwyck2818]

@@jotabe1984 apartheid ended 5years after this battle by global pressure and ultimately a national vote. Not by this battle

[@johanschreuder5006]

This is rather one side point of view. The reality was way more complicated than this.

[@nzenzenyini19]

apparently no UNITA dead then.

[@jesuscid8589]

Soy cubano y estuve en Angola ,creo que estos datos son mentiras,en el principio de la batalla de Cuito los cubanos no estuvimos presentes ,cuandi se le puso mala la cosa a los Angolanos ,tuvimos que intervenir y paramos el avance Sudafricano.Ya teniamos superioridad area .Si ustedes ganaron la batalla ,porque no entraron victorios en Cuito y en la capital de Angola.?

[@derickmostert6874]

My father has a photo album with all his military photos in it from when he server with the SADF. And inside is a photo he wasnt supposed to take but he took the photo anyway. But it was a captured Soviet missile launcher that was captured from the battle.

[@laantsino1394]

This is lies. SDF lost this battle massively. This is the fight that made them retreat. Ofcoz there was casualties on both sides but SDF was worse and retreated.

[@telecoms4u]

Hillarious, I don't need to read any military books, I was there. I was stationed at 61 Mechanised Battalion near the Angolan border for about 6 months during my national service and went in some years later with Regiment President Steyn, my citizen force unit.

[@bradabwana1098]

At cuito cuanaval South Africa army defeated together with unita most of South Africa war planes brought down by Cuban .

[@submariner200]

Nice video and a very relaxing music.

[@submariner200]

sabertooth kr Se robo tambien la historia que cuenta el video o no?

[@Kekuya]

Hello Guys...... I do not wanna sound intrusive or even rude.... But I you guys wont the Cuito Cuanavale Battle, why you do your army retread, afterwards ??? And started that process of leaving the Namibia and finishing we the apartheid .... Its was not suppose to be other way around ??? Can some one clarify me please, I am a bit confuse ! Thanks in advance !

[@AlaskanSinker]

It was of American politics that was put on South Africa to withdraw and to let Nelson Mandela out of jail if you go and do some research on both sides of the border you will learn the truth about how and why it all started but America (CIA) is a big part of the beginning and end thank you

[@lilbrothaaa]

Woah! This is exactly how Germany won World War 1 and 2! x-D

[@scheedeescheedee6106]

Nazi Germany did in fact deliver a resounding defeat to Poland and France and a beating to most of the "Allied countries...it was only when reluctant America and its gigantic industrial wealth and man power entered the war (thanks to Japan's attack on Pearl Harbor), together with Germany's ill advised invasion of Russia (its ex ally by the way), that the writing was thankfully on the wall. If not for those fortunate interventions...who knows what world we may be residing in now...

[@watgaanhieraan]

Germany did not win and their country was invaded by the Allies neither Namibia or South Africa were invaded the conflict ground into a stalemate their was no victory for either side.

[@scheedeescheedee6106]

You are quite correct...and thats the difference between a battle and a war... and as well as the difference between a strike force and an invasion force.

[@jpm1151]

***** When your forces invade another country and eventually have to withdraw and leave the floor to

[@Juan777Olivier]

Jpm Then the SADF won since they could of won. Not only did they achieve the objects they set out to achieve they also could of taken the entire Angola.

[@911Sala]

The brave, courageous and valiant people of the SADF who risked their lives for the preservation of South Africa and the...wait for it..."DEMOCRATIC FREEDOM FOR WHICH IT STOOD"...lol, moenie KAK praat nie man!!!

[@nekongovitankanga]

Nda nena mbwa nfuta

[@maaifoediedelarey4335]

Vonk off !!

[@PL-up5ig]

The Stats are so wrong in this video, the FAPLA loses are presented as Cuban loses and the Unita loses were not included in the video. Also, SA loss 3 aircrafts, no only one. The Cuban and SA loses in soldiers were the same.

[@martinh231]

Ha Ha Ha you are misinformed we did not shoot our generals afterwards what a way to thank him for winning a war you claimed

[@PL-up5ig]

@@martinh231 You are the one misinformed the general that got in trouble was due to his involvement with narcotraffic. And was during the period that Panama was invaded by US. Castro was fearful of getting invaded also and punished the generals to safe face. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnaldo_Ochoa

[@PL-up5ig]

@@martinh231 Additionally, you people like to count together the Cuban and MPLA casualties, count separately SA and UNITA. People that are sure about their win don't cheat with the numbers.

[@redword2007]

Cuba Si! Non-racial South Africa Si!

[@sakeustulongasakeus1521]

Somehow sided truth. I can't see why the editor/producer couldn't mention other equal strikes from the opponents. e.g. When the Cuban shot down the water pipeline that supplied water to Calueque? Or the damage that they did to the bridge cutting down the supplier of materials to SADF which left them trapped in the battle until signed a ceasefire......Come on man, get real

[@MrSpringbokfan]

Wow we killed all of them, but I guess shooting a pipeline of water was good enough. Haha. Bet the ANC want that water now huh?

[@philliprsa]

+Sakeus Tulonga Sakeus I would suggest that BEFORE you comment you actually READ some articles on the issue at hand. Because if you did you would know that the Calueque dam that was bomb by the Cubans was in the west of the theathre of operations (And by the way while the dam and bridge was bomb the SA forces could still cross the border at will), while the bridge that the SADF used to get to Cuito Cuanavale was 600km to the west of it and was NEVER bombed!..So so much for your "trap" theory. If indeed the SADF was trapped as you claim then I must be HOUDINI as I PERSONALLY crossed over said border coming down from Cuito and going back up there again during the campaign. What's more I even managed to do that twice by helicopter too! Guess what...each and every time I pulled this stunt I never once saw a Fapla or Cuban soldier within hundreds of miles of the bridge at Rundu. And clearly you have NO knowledge of how an army operates. Believe it or not one of the first things they considered is that as the campaign unfolds the enemy would most definantly blow up any and all bridges they can lay their hands on in order to slow down any advancing forces..its the nature of the beast. And as that goat in Little Red Ridinghood says they "COME PREPARED"..they bring their own bridges along which they can erect in an extremely short time. And the crossing at Rundu was just such a bridge. If you seriously want to talk about forces being trapped by damaged bridges then I suggest you look at the contingent of FAPLA forces that was trapped at Cuito due to the bridge being shot out by the G5's of the SADF. Which left then unable to move any heavy equipment over the bridge to the other side of the Cuito River.

[@briantrend1263]

+Sakeus Tulonga Sakeus U are a complete idiot!

[@Josh93B93]

+brian No, YOU are a complete idiot, at least he understands how to use the English language.

[@sarelmalan8729]

I cant see this happening again now with the new defense force.

[@hannahblazewick4269]

If you look at photographs of the 32nd Battalion of the South African Armed Forces all our carrying AK-47 it was quite common for South African soldiers to have AK-47. Besides Belgian rifles and the rand rifle built in South Africa

[@submariner200]

+Hannah Blazewick The AK is reliable but at long distances they are not known for their accuracy.

[@hannahblazewick4269]

submariner200 YES ??

[@hannahblazewick4269]

THE AVENGER Yes I agree with what you wrote. It was not very accurate. But surely was sturdy and durable

[@johanhammes6832]

Rand rifle !?!

[@janvandermerwe4649]

R1

[@ruaidhridevalera5582]

Who ever did that documentary is a liar the Cubans mate the mplas mate the Russians mate won that battle mate also the war mate

[@eltessy]

General A Ochoa was the one in charge of Cuban troops at Cuito-Cuanavale. Do you think Castro killed Ochoa because Castro considered Ochoa responsible for lost the battle of Cuito?

[@robert8552]

Indeed. The Russians had told Cuba on numerous occasions that they could not win the war. In fact sophisticated Russian weapons systems (like the SAM8 - never seen elsewhere) were falling into the hands of South Africans. The fact that Castro was conducting the war via telephone from Cuba, says how much faith he had in his generals. I don't know why anyone is doubting these facts, they're all documented.

[@iberilop]

You do not win a major battle and get executed for drug trafficking even in communist hellholes.

[@iberilop]

The Problem is that no one believes anything of the trail was fair or correct. communism has never been trustworthy. stalin, castro , pol pot , moa regularly had anyone they did not like/trust/support killed. With so much blood on the hands of communism and the proof of all those executed with no fair trail by the dictators why would you ever believe anything that regime states as fact?

[@iberilop]

***** We won the war. Russia, cuba, china were all hell holes under comunism. Capitalism brought china into the modern world. Reshaped russia and cuba still is a hellhole. I can go to my shop in my capitalist country and buy a months supply of groceries for less than a weeks pay. I drive a nice new luxury sedan and my electronics are great my samsung phone... intel pc.... all capitalism. and I am just lower middle class. sorry it is just how it is my friend.

[@iberilop]

***** dude lol my family were russians that fled the communist regime in the 80's for south africa. It is a sad derogatory existence. Communism makes it's leaders wealthy and the rest are just worker ants with the same rights. You fight for state or you die. you eat what state provide or you die. you don't like what state or glorious leader does? You die. No trail No voice I don't give a fuck what you heard about communism or what a utopia it creates. Stalin massacred the muslims in euraisa and repalced them with white russians. hundreds of thousands of people vanished in cuba that were pro west. Millions starved to death in the soviet union because they wanted to force collective farms. Peasants ate their dead to survive. The chinse red revolution killed millions and destroyed the chinese economy. only now with the whitch over to capitalism did china start to see wealth again. under communism you get lead. Either you follow or you get the lead injected into your skull. Then we get to pol pot. Force marching millions to their deaths. gulags forced labour starvation DEATH.