Is Drifting Really Fast and Furious?

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Vin Diesel and the rest of the Fast and Furious family have taught us that drifting is the fastest way around turns, but are they actually wrong? Kyle has the road test on this week's Because Science!
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Because Science every Thursday.
Learn more:
• A WHOLE THESIS ON DRIFTING: stanford.io/2LPocFt
• TIRES AND FRICTION: bit.ly/2MeHRv6
• IMPORTANCE OF KINETIC AND STATIC FRICTION: bit.ly/2AzSAPG
• F1 TIRE PERFORMANCE: bit.ly/2LSy4hC
• STATIC FRICTION: bit.ly/2OynyL3

[@Donut]

Thanks for coming out Kyle! Let's do it again 🙌

[@FlagCutie]

Thanks for letting Kyle Science all over your track!

[@jow_angelow]

RAMCHARGERS!!

[@erbgorre]

for real. you came a great showing there, kyle.

[@leu3368]

Kyle was happy and scare (normal reaction when your going like 200 kph)

[@ClassMRule]

Love your guys' channel, can't wait for the next Up to Speed

[@torbgen]

Drifting is only faster if you hold it long enough to get the blue/gold/purple sparks because you get a speed boost when you straighten out. I thought everyone knew this 🤔🤔

[@junkowl7539]

torbgen you seriously thought that everyone knows it?

[@sorrowfulpup2998]

Exactly, plus he didn't get the launch boost for burning out at the 2 count.

[@nescockk]

torbgen what sparkles! Wtf are you going on about?

[@ararepotato1420]

Yeah, this stuff should be common knowledge. But some people don't know how to drift and get purple sparks, let alone gold ones.

[@krimzonhunt7929]

chicken master Mario cart or sonic all stars transformed. Its a regular mechanic in those games.

[@rylian21]

The only time drifting is faster is on loose surfaces in which you would have to slow down MUCH further in order to maintain static friction, such as dirt, gravel, or snow.

[@bksniperguy]

Or on iroha where the hairpins are so tight that it's just faster to handbrake.

[@WynnofThule]

Drifting is also faster in extremely tight corners and on older cars and tires in low slip angles.

[@nensha5084]

That’s why most rally drivers drift on dirt/gravel/snow and turn normally on pavement

[@nensha5084]

That’s why most rally drivers drift on dirt/gravel/snow and turn normally on pavement

[@acynder1]

It is also an alternative to brake, so you can delay were you start braking before a corner an overtake someone potentially.

[@johneduardalferez2358]

1:15 I remember Itsuki asked Takumi on drifting. Takumi: in a curve... Itsuki: Don't say "curve" it's not cool. Street racers say "corner".

[@christopherruiz6029]

I thought it would be pretty obvious that drifting was indeed slower, like the great drift king Keiichi Tsuchiya once said “I drift not because it is a quicker way around a corner, but it is the most exciting way”

[@calvindibartolo2686]

I was sitting in a mall food court a few years back and overheard a high school kid tell his mom to "drift the van cuz its faster".

[@DarkWolf-qo7qo]

Christopher Ruiz it is faster if you can chain the drifts.

[@calvindibartolo2686]

@@DarkWolf-qo7qo i cant tell if youre trolling

[@DarkWolf-qo7qo]

Calvin DiBartolo im not but i just noticed that first comment lmfao

[@broc_ursal]

Ever seen dirt track racing?

[@iainzombies]

Good maths but you forget to factor in the eurobeats.

[@Tycini1]

+Nep Nep Oh look, what a witty and creative comment.

[@astroboy91210]

hahahahaha

[@astroboy91210]

Nep Nep but hurt..?

[@Kraven-wy9mh]

Factual, scientifically speaking every beat in eurobeat adds +1speed

[@vipbeef2174]

Yes yes

[@NellysaintsSROP]

Even Takumi uses the “gutter move” to have better grip during sharp corners to beat his opponents.

[@Adamu98]

It's not more grip but rather forcing the car into a tighter turn which is faster by using the wheels similar to a slot car has a slot to force it around corners.

[@ezelio]

Even takumi try hard to defeat shinji

[@funnysecksnumber6998]

its also ironic how you NEED to be drifting to do that move on some gutters. as a lot of simracers found out. the amount of slip angle you use is simply determined by the amount of static grip you have + tyre wear (if youre worried about it). except this trick gives you free static grip. so hell yes, that makes drifting advantageous. except here we have this pesky thing called mortality too.

[@michaellawson5442]

How many car enthusiasts are watching this thinking "DUHHHHHHHHHH" lol

[@misterthijsjanthijsjanvdkn9976]

I am

[@thermicdrop2327]

Lol

[@lillyanneserrelio2187]

My boyfriend swears that its the paint job that determines a car's speed. Everyone knows painting flames on your car makes it go faster- even faster then the racing stripe that some Mustangs come with on their high end Shelby model.

[@carlos1308]

Lilly Anne Serrelio make sure he gets many stickers and some big waaaangs in the back

[@daggern15]

I'm more interested in how many car enthusiasts are watching and thinking "WTF? Drifting is waaaaaay faster than driving properly"

[@-undecided-1663]

This episode was really just an excuse to drive and drift in some fast cars, wasn't it Kyle?

[@valiroime]

You say that like it's a bad thing.

[@oraculum3395]

if you say what outlier typed with the voice of a parent that just "knows" better, it doesn't sound as bad :P

[@Utubesuperstar]

Ain’t no shame in that my brother we’d all do it too

[@wiky1492]

watching a drift car completing a normal grip lap is so damn weird

[@slandoraparalex2328]

I was thinking the same thing. I was curious as to how touchy the steering is with the wild steering angles drift cars have.

[@Cheesesalad]

Yeah, I thought the same too. A drift car is literally built different and thrives in a state of controlled chaos, while it doesn't have the necessary stability to put down it's power on an optimal race line, and to get around fast and efficiently. I think it would have been even more apparent that drifting is slower if they had used a "normal" race car or even a road car with enough power, just power sliding. That way the lap times would have been way more apart from each other. Although 3 seconds slower is already an eternity in racing.

[@Gottaculat]

Drifting pros: Looks cool, Kicks up a lot of smoke that could obscure a pursuing car's visibility. Drifting cons: Slower, destroys tires faster, more likely to result in a collision, consumes more gas at higher sustained RPMs which reduces available distance to escape, puts additional wear on the engine, kicks up a lot of smoke that can make you easier to track from aerial pursuers (like a police helicopter). Result: Like shooting from the hip, drifting is best left to the movies. Additional thoughts: A more realistic escape vehicle will look very plain-Jane (like a Honda accord or Toyota Camry painted silver), but be outfitted with better suspension and tires, and possibly a stripped interior and enlarged gas tank. You want to be able to blend into traffic after breaking the police line of sight. You won't do that in a tricked out brightly colored, loud, gas-guzzling sports car that is kicking up smoke. It looks cool, but it's just silly. Also, a get away car must be cheap enough to ditch. Ditching a $150K suped up sports car is just retarded when your goal is a successful heist, as that will eat into your profits considerably more than an $8K used car with about $8K worth of upgrades. It's a lot easier to walk away from $16K than $150K.

[@groozst]

Friend : how to drift? This guy : *explain in the most scientific way Me : slidey slidey smoke

[@zadbxi49]

I need slidey slidey smoke on a T shirt

[@AaronShenghao]

Takumi: oversteer

[@darthflash6994]

Me: (Seeing this explanation) Hyperventilate

[@r3uvsgaming]

Handbrake and send it

[@brokenkage6620]

Theory: The longer Kyle is removed from the void the more his body deteriorates. The smoke we saw was not from the car, rather from Kyle himself

[@thomasfplm]

BrokenKage * Hypnosis

[@attackonhumby]

Like a titan?!?!

[@emmanuelbrioche6582]

To avoid the effects of the 'snap'

[@blukarlieyt1777]

BrokenKage Donut Media.I dont feel soo good *pukes after the drifting*

[@deinonychus1948]

@@blukarlieyt1777 Donut Media: "I am... inevitable!"

[@godsoloved24]

Kyle, aren't you going to answer Groot's corrections? After all, he said, "I am Groot. I am Groot. I am Groot. I am Groot. I am Groot. I am Groot." You can't just brush that off.

[@wildfire862001]

Drifting's initial application was used in downhill racing in an effort to brake as little as possible, thusly maintaining a higher overall speed. I would expect that a drift would be superior in that specific situation rather than grip racing. Granted, I'm no scientist, but this thought occurred to me while watching this video. Great show guys, long time watcher, first time commenter. Keep up the awesome work.

[@RaindropsBleeding]

4:07 >How cool is this thing? It's actually very hot. I see what you did there.

[@lazarnedeljkovic5615]

BleedingRaindrops how do you not see what he does there

[@matrixarsmusicworkshop561]

I didnt wow

[@kennymartin5976]

Kinda disappointed with the lack of Eurobeat.

[@pbfloyd13]

*NANI?!?!*

[@frosty5122]

*KANSEI DORIFTO?!*

[@22jeffstreet11]

Kenny Martin same

[@guppybunz]

Style points, my dude. Style points.

[@aspeck55555]

Drifting is about style not how much speed you have. They're just flexing on each other in fast and the furious

[@petermoger8135]

The Mythbusters had done a test like this, only using a non purpose built drift car, and they were on dirt. They found that the times were roughly the same because in some situations the time lost taking the corner slower was made up because they had less grip to accelerate with, meaning carrying more speed into and out of the corner helped immensely.

[@Will-Woll]

It's also very important to take into account the racing surface. In rally racing, the surface is very loose so the maximum acceleration the rally cars can produce is reduced, placing a higher importance on conserving the velocity you bring into the turn, resulting in some turns being taken in a style similar to drifting. Aaaand lol you mentioned rally anyway. OK KYLE I GUESS I CAN'T BEAT YOU.

[@Painteagle]

Also, being aligned the the straightaway in a rally earlier gives more time to accelerate. I watched a guy gain about half a lap just by getting the correct position while turning using drifting.

[@sharpsied]

Replying just because your pic is Time Wizard.

[@becausescience]

Man, people should really watch the whole video before commenting -- KH

[@Painteagle]

Just trying to catch that first 5 minute notice! :D

[@Will-Woll]

Because Science GOTTA GO FAST

[@DWolfsGaming119]

“Daddy’s gotta science!” You always make me laugh and love science, never ever will I get tired of this show! I hope you get to do this for as long as you want!

[@becausescience]

That's the best praise I can get, thank you! -- KH

[@josephlane1614]

Your wrong about one thing. It might not be as fast but it certainly looks furious.

[@TheSilverSmitih]

How does the radius of the turn affect the time? What about the method of drifting? There's inertia drifing, e-brake drifting, and power sliding to name a few. I'd love to see a vid where you include these into your calculations too

[@dualfluidreactor]

Sounds like you should do a youtube video xd

[@r.d.b8853]

*muffled eurobeat plays in background

[@sonictheporcipine]

I find the lack of Initial D meme disturbing..... *DEJA VU! I'VE JUST BEEN IN THIS PLACE BEFORE!*

[@TheSauceChef]

sonictheporcipine [ *EUROBEAT INTENSIFIES* ]

[@RessG]

My OCD kick in

[@pbfloyd13]

*_NANI!?!?_*

[@killswitchlord2393]

Me as a car guy: oh he’s making a video about drifting Also me: yea i know everything already

[@DarrenbyDesign]

He was making it for people like me who know close to nothing about cars lol

[@MapTes]

Is this what people describe as a funny comment

[@V843v3r]

drifting is slower only on grippy surface, try bringing that car on a rally track and see if drifting is faster or not lol

[@obsidiansands]

Drifting is HELL on tires too. When I saw that loss of control on that second lap coming in, I knew that the tires were shredded even before the driver confirmed it - the friction practically smoked it to bits.

[@Bob5mith]

I wanted to see the tires.

[@obsidiansands]

Me too, those are low racing wheels - there's probably not much left except for the ones closest to the rims. That car will need a full tuneup and some work down there as it was more or less scraping the asphalt when the tires gave way.

[@SRVaintme]

Yep, all that smoke is basically your tyres burning off. Even if drifting was faster you wouldn't get very far in a pursuit.

[@flyte707]

but is dorifting?

[@rytramprophet843]

this is because it wasnt a controlled test. they didnt use drifting tires for the drifting laps. which are harder rubber.

[@sebastianh1458]

Well, to drift wouldn't make you faster, as stated in the video and in @WarlandWriter's comment, but to keep your tires always firmly onto the pavement also isn't the whole answer. In some scenarios, it's actually faster to allow your tires to slide. This may not be called "Drifting", but it's close enough. Even though Rally driving was addressed in the video, the whole story was not told. As gravel and dirt roads deliver a substantially lower friction coefficient compared to asphalt, lap times, or more accurately time per stages, would be significantly slower if the drivers tried to always avoid slipping and sliding. To drift means in this case to carry far more speed through the corners compared to forementioned slip-less driving by allowing the rear to swerve. Another example concerning this is driving on a snowy road. With friction even lower, driving speed is also utterly decreased, making it faster to allow the rear to slide. In non-mathematical terms, a sliding rear is just the rear axle trying to overtake the front as it is traveling with greater cornering speeds as the static friction allows, thus kinetic friction is to be applied. Concerning solid roads, to slide or not to slide is also highly dependend on the vehicle being used. @viperconcept has made a great video treating this topic, here is a link: kzbin.info/www/bejne/goCmfYKfo6aSnNU . The quintessence is that when driving cars with high grip levels, eg. F1, LMP, GT..., it's quicker to utilize a "clean" driving style, so not to drift. On the other hand, cars with low grip are faster when driven "dirty", with a sliding rear. As to why Odi's drifting laps were slower, even though his car clearly wasn't a F1 car, he still used slick, or semi-slick tyres, so tyres with high amounts of grip as compared to road-legal treaded tyres, and used a hard, for racetrack use sutible suspension setup as indicated by rolecage and overall use of the car. High amounts of grip combined with forced sliding of the rear axle meant that drifting times were slower. Higher grip means that Odi had to spend way more energy to get the tyres slipping that he had to sacrifice speed. Had the slide come naturally by an excess of speed, things might have beed different. The problem also lies within that he was having slipping tyres at points on the track where in the first laps he was already comfortably accelerating, thus losing time, which is the MAIN reason why top-level race drivers DON'T drift or powerslide as time spent with slipping wheels means less time being spent on getting faster. This is also the reason why burnout starts are slower than starts where spinning wheels are kept to a minimum. Also, the car's handling is important. When it is stable, so not overly under- or oversteer, there is no point in trying to get the car rotating more than necessary as it's already following nicely the driver's input through the steering wheel. But in the case where the car is overly stable or unstable, so that it either reluctantly turns into the corner or tends to go into a spin, it's better and faster to slide. An understeering car, primarily FWD cars, a quick flick with the steering wheel so to get the back sliding will encourage the car to corner, and also to do it faster. A skidding rear, as found in torquy RWD or rear-focused 4WD cars, can't really be tamed. Avoiding slides means the car will be driven below its limit, so powerslides and slight drifts are to be favoured as the car's full potential can be unlocked, as long as the are coming from the car, not from over-aggressive driver inputs, notably a too far pressed gas pedal. I may not be as eloquent as @WarlandWriter or Kyle with mathematical formulas describing this issue, but I happen to know this to be true from personal driving experience. In conclusion, drifting isn't always faster, while clean driving also isn't faster at every occasion. As in everything in life, a middle ground has to be found. Clean driving is best utilized at high grip levels and/or with a stable car. Drifting, well, not exactly drifting, but sliding is best used, when the overall grip conditions are poor, as in rain, gravel roads, snow etc. or when the car is tending to overdo it in wanting to corner (oversteering) or in a lack thereof (understeering). With a bazillion of factors and circumstances, Kyle, your video isn't giving the whole answer. To drift or not to drift can be a deeply philosophical question, with its answers only fitting one scenario each. P.S.: Dom might actually be faster when drifting, as muscle cars, which his cars clearly are, are prone to be torquy and unwilling to follow a straight path. Powersliding would be better in his case, which is, btw, canon as he does so in the latest installment in Russia with his 2000+ hp monster. ;-) P.P.S.: A great example for a slide-heavy driving style would be Juan-Manuel Fangio, five times F1 world champion in the 50's. He perfected the art to slide around almost every corner whereby all four wheels were pointed straight ahead, giving the appearance in pictures that he drove straight. Somewhat similar was Michael Schumacher's driving style. He kept driving his F1 race cars like they were gokarts from his youth, which resulted in him drifting, though only slight, around corners by a big margin faster tha his opponents. There exist videos on KZbin wherein his telemetry data are compared to his then-teammate Johnny Herbert, detailing exactly his faster corner speeds through Maggots and Becketts at Silverstone. Gerhard Berger, who inherited Schumacher's cockpit with Benetton after the latter's departure to Ferrari , later described how the 1996 car was very unstable, thus helping to achieve a drifting F1 car. And, I mean, 7 world championships speak for themselfes. P.P.P.S.: Whoever finds grammatical errors may keep them. Finders, keepers, after all. :D

[@atigerclaw]

I think this can be dumbed down to a simple statement: "Drifting is faster if your car is going to break away in the turn ANYWAY. Otherwise, holding the line is better." Traction = Power Applied. Power Applied = Speed. No traction, no power, no speed. Honestly, I think drifting is more about maintaining control in difficult turns than speed itself and acts as an alternate form of dynamic braking. After all, every second the wheels spend out of alignment with your velocity vector, they're bleeding energy into the pavement. It's a give-and-take relationship. You can definitely get some benefit from it in the correct turn conditions, but the question is whether that benefit outweighs the performance of holding the line so that power applied goes back in RIGHT on cue. And that's a matter of vehicle, conditions, the turn itself, and experience. If you don't know your vehicle's handling characteristics, and you're doing something like a high speed getaway, trying to drift on purpose is little more than reckless driving. Perhaps even Fatal. Try drifting an SUV with high friction coefficient between tires and surface? That's not a drift, that's a rollover waiting to happen.

[@Bob5mith]

There's a point in the transition from static to kinetic friction that a little slippage creates more friction force than static friction. Some drag racers call it "hazing" the tires. The friction coefficient is slightly lower than static but the tire is spinning faster than it would if it wasn't slipping a little. If you can manage that accelerating through a curve or out of a corner you can get through it quicker than full, showy drifting or not slipping at all. It also tears up tires and you're more likely to lose control.

[@ForzaGAMING101]

Because science: is drifting even fast? Have you not watched formula drift?

[@ralfinodyanu.l647]

Fd is basically sideways drag racing nowadays

[@reecemartin453]

its not drift, its driving in cursive

[@gradywilliams383]

It’s not asking if it’s fast, the video is asking if it’s the fastest way around a circuit.

[@nomercy4521]

@@gradywilliams383 The video asked if it was faster with respect to the Fast and Furious movies. I've only ever seen the 1st three but from what I recall they only drifted during get aways or in extremely curvy high incline or declined areas. For the Tokyo Drift movie they always raced in places like parking garages and mountains. He also stated that professional drivers all agreed that drifting is always slower, but then also stated that it was useful in low traction scenarios, rally.

[@dillonweaver9446]

i get it....because vin diesel voice plays Groot

[@LordBaktor]

That guy didn't know anything about drifting. When you start drifting you have to move the steering wheel left to right until sparks come out of the wheels, then, when the sparks turn blue, you stop drifting and get a super turbo.

[@shadowwsk3507]

Lord Baktor Need for Speed?

[@LordBaktor]

Need for whatnow? I'm talking about the greatest source of reliable information about drifting in existence. Mario Kart.

[@animextreem]

Fuckin cackling

[@ragerasse7616]

YES!

[@johndoe-cw4kg]

Lol Mari kart

[@Templer55]

Are you talking about drifting without mentioning Initial d

[@Integer_Overload]

Templer55 DEJA VUU

[@cammosz3223]

How could he!

[@JasonWW2000]

Most people have never heard of Initial D. Especially outside of Japan. The Fast and Furious movies, on the other hand, are very well known across the world.

[@cammosz3223]

What!!! Have you ever watched a *deja vu* or *running in 90s* meme video?

[@ReikaSensei]

My thoughts exactly but only because the idea and popularity of drifting and how it ended up in Fast and the Furious is because of Initial D. The Japan one was also supposed to be like an homage to Initial D or something. That said the terrain argument Kyle closes with is exactly the point? It's popularized and a big part of Initial D because specifically the terrain the racers in Japan are using in the show, a twisty mountain, apparently works better with drifting than regular driving. It's very specific. Also just for funsies I don't think most people notice the title is Engrish cuz it's probably supposed to be Inertial D for inertial drift, but the two words are spelled the same in katakana so whoops.

[@Elver_Galarga_jugo]

Kyle, you also have to remember. The suspension setting on this car are done to make the car more stable while sliding. If you were to have taken the time (not a sensible option) to make sure to optimise the car for grip driving, you would have had to change the springs, change damper valving settings, changed the sway bars (or add one in the case of the front suspension) you would have had a much bigger difference in lap times than just 3 seconds. That car was really unstable during the grip laps, but like.i said, it was set up.to slide and it did that really well.

[@Utubesuperstar]

You’re completely correct

[@gannonb99]

I'm using an example here, I work with a group of guys in short oval track racing, incredible stuff and a great experience to see. When they go around the oval they actual try to slide the corner just a little bit, to keep the car smooth, yes gripping may be faster but in an application such as that it's good because it helps the car rotate around the corner allowing you to push off the inside and glide to the outside of the oval into the straight. This style comes with lots of practice in oval racing, years of technique and learning.

[@diegosanchez894]

If you fall on the street, you were punched by the pavement.

[@WritingKnightsPress]

Diego Sanchez or thrown by gravity

[@diegotejada55]

When _I_ hit the pavement, I'm actually punching it...with my face.

[@diegosanchez894]

Diego Tejada according to Newton's 3rd, we're both right *electric guitar*

[@fordgalaxie3695]

Diego Sanchez *explosion*

[@WarlandWriter]

I had a discussion about drifting with a friend of mine recently, who said that although you can't go as fast drifting in turns, you can make sharper turns, which can turn out quicker if the distance lost is greater than the speed lost. Thus - so she claimed - drifting on a regular race track or on a highway is slower, because it was designed to make regular turns at high speeds. A city has much sharper turns and thus in a city it would be advantageous to drift. However, before she turns up and starts spreading her lies, I wanted to debunk that. First of all: Yes, you do indeed turn your wheels in relative to your centre of mass, and thus the turning radius of your front wheels becomes relatively smaller. However, turning your front wheels in does not allow you to cheat physics by making the centripetal force think that your centre of mass is now actually closer to the centre of your turn. You still need to supply a centripetal force to make your car go around the bend. This force (Fc) is dependent on mass m, velocity v and turning radius R by Fc=m*v^2/R. This means that at a certain velocity, you can't just choose a different R just because you happen to be drifting. Your centre of mass still needs to follow the same path for a given Fc and v. Which brings me to the next point. The limiting factor determining the ratio v^2/R is the maximum centripetal force you can supply. In this case this Fmax is supplied by the frictional force (Ff) of the wheels. Thus, rewriting the formula: Rmin=m*v^2/Ff Ff=mu*Fn=mu*Fg=mu*m*g, thus it is linearly dependent on mu. Thus, Rmin is proportional to v^2/mu. In a drift, mu decreases. Quite drastically, in fact. A quick calculation gave me that at a drift angle (theta) of 5 degrees, mu effectively becomes 10% smaller already. This means that while drifting, your turning radius would become 10% greater in order to maintain the same velocity, or you'd have to slow down by 5% in order to keep a 'normal' turning radius. Since half your wheels are using the kinetic friction, rather than the static friction you can never turn as efficiently as you would in a normal turn. (Which makes sense, as cars are designed to make normal turns.) Lastly, I wanted to address my personal biggest issue with my friend's argumentation: Turning your car sideways to make smaller turns is a terrible idea. I don't believe I have ever seen a car that was wider than it was long. Math. Suppose you have a car with length 2*L and width 2*w. The surface area that would need to be available for you to make a normal turn with radius R would be the area of a circle drawn by the outer edge of your car (R2=R+w) minus the area of a circle drawn by the inner edge of your car (R1=R-w). For a 90 degree turn, that boils down to: A=1/4*pi*R2^2-1/4*pi*R1^2=1/4*pi*((R+w)^2-(R-w)^2)=1/2 pi R w Same thing, now turn your car by an angle theta. R2=R+L*sin(theta)+w*cos(theta), R1=R-L*sin(theta)-w*cos(theta). Filling that in and simplifying gives: A=pi*R*(w*cos(theta)+L*sin(theta)). This means that at a 10 degree angle with a car 2 m wide and 5 m long, you've gained yourself 42 cms on either side, increasing your area by a whopping 184% (to me this seems a bit much, but I can't figure out where it went wrong either, so I'll assume it's correct. Also the fact that the relative increase does not depend on R seems weird to me.). Tl;dr, Sorry for unleashing the mathematical fury of my friendly discussions upon you. The turn you make drifting cannot be faster than a turn made normally because you can't change how your centre of mass behaves, and you will need a lot more space to execute the turn. Because science. (Can I say that or is that copyrighted? I don't know, it just feels like the right thing to say here, under a Because Science video. Hope you don't mind.)

[@BurgundyBurnouts]

Ameteur drifter here. There's a reason drifting was invented in the mountains of Japan and not the streets.

[@o0oshreyes]

okay you have a good point but let me explain in real life. just one imagine you are racing in a parking lot in real life drifting helps a lot for you to maintain the speed because im keeping the revs up and i dont have to downshift more than 2 gears (sometimes dont have to downshift at all) when compared to slowing down for a turn usually means going directly to 2nd or third gear while a good drift can be executed on 5th or 4th gear ( i know this by 7 yrs of experience) so after the turn i dont have to upshift again to get back my to my speed thus saving me time. on track drifting is definitely for fun only since turns are not sharp enough for a drift to be advantageous and yes races in multistory parking is pretty common

[@ConfusedRaccoon]

You lost me as soon as the math came in but I'm pretty sure I'm right in saying, it depends on the surface and vehicle type. For instance, rally cars and gravel. It's usually faster to slide because there is less grip to begin with so turning the entire car to the direction you want to go and using the power of all four wheels is better than just using just the front two.

[@samsmart1595]

I'm just gonna sit here and pretend I have a clue what you just said *ponders spuriously*

[@bahathir_]

WarlandWriter If the road friction is low, such as dirt track, drifting by over steering, to change the cornering angle quicker, and perhaps substitude braking before the corner. As we can see at super motard, or motorcycle racing on ice, where most of the time, drrrrrrifting is seem to be quicker.. IMHO. Thank you, for any feedback. kzbin.info/www/bejne/nYK8ZayNbL-faJI

[@dsmom101]

I think what we here in KY call a state boy slide is about the only applicable use on regular streets. It's sort of drifting/sliding to catch up around corners, especially on gravel or dirt. Not regular or even somewhat tight curves.

[@spinal_capped]

Woah, I was NOT expecting this video to be so in depth. I love the detail you go into in all of your videos, but generally speaking, non-car focused channels can't usually get car stuff correct. You sure as hell did, though. As a lifelong car enthusiast, part-time mechanic, and weekend autocross racer, I can most definitely say that *you absolutely nailed it.* Glad you pointed out the applications of drifting in rally. Really, a greater slip angle on loose surfaces will yield faster times than that same driving style on tarmac/pavement. (And you should really try driving a car with a manual transmission! It's so much more engaging and arguably safer than driving with an automatic!) Great stuff!

[@atrujillo7836]

No mention of initial D anyways drifting isn't about speed it's about not crashing or falling out of mountains

[@MichaelBerthelsen]

Isn't the 'Number' in "VIN Number" unnecessary, since VIN is already 'Vehicle Identification Number'...?

[@stormshockin]

Correct. And anyone who understands VIN doesn't add "Number" after saying VIN.

[@NotHPotter]

Better go punch your PIN number into that ATM machine while you're at it.

[@DedJezter]

Sort of like Machine in ATM... so many idiots.

[@MichaelBerthelsen]

Michael Wade I just enter my PIN into the ATM, you do you, weirdo.😜

[@chaosryans]

People ruined language with the shorthand. Pretty much everything has to do it, and after a while majority of people forget what it means. Ask any kid what msnbc means and if any get it right give them some money.

[@jamesseddon5540]

I’m pretty sure the 240SX LS swapped has a drift angle kit on it

[@joshuabrown1323]

You would be correct it has a wisefab kit on it

[@frozen2ninja]

But did you learn to drive stick though?

[@TopRacer2002]

frozen2ninja you can drift auto as well. You just need loads more power and no L.S.D. (the mechanical part not the drug)

[@Cedrickr]

I don't understand why so many people think stick is so hard to learn, I've taught people to drive stick in just a few HOURS in the past...

[@andersenzheng]

@@TopRacer2002 Although not having LSD (the drug) in the mix would certainly help the drift no mater the gearbox type.

[@philspaghet]

@@TopRacer2002 Doesn't matter, you should still learn

[@philspaghet]

@@Cedrickr It's not the difficulty, it's actually going out and committing

[@Pseudynom]

"How cool is this? It's actually very hot." ^^

[@zxvadcsfbh]

TL:DW. No, most of the time. Drifting is marginally faster if the car you are driving is going to understeer and/or lose speed/traction on that corner anyway. You can retain slightly more speed by drifting around the corner then if you take the corner wide and have to break late. However, with more grip there will never be a time where drifting is going to be better than maintaining traction and speed. Naturally this is why you see people racing offroad using it in races but almost no one on a racetrack use it outside of a drifting event. Personal point. Why is this video only talking about breaking entries? While handbrake entries are common and easy, it's still very easy to just counter steer once you lose traction in the rear wheels anyway (RIP my minispooled R31 and your bent chassis rail). Also: Love the S14 swap on that s-chassis.

[@justsayjay]

Big Red Ball we get it...you're a drifter. :) Haha

[@alexius9072]

and what bout drifting by just hitting the gas? why would you brake when you can hit the "go faster" pedal instead

[@gh0st1976]

@Big Red Ball "Naturally this is why you see people racing offroad using it in races but almost no one on a racetrack use it outside of a drifting event." There you have it. Drifting on a Racetrack is slower. Offroad is a different story. Less grip. Same in a Rally. On a Streettrack the rule is, smooth is fast.

[@johndoe-cw4kg]

It depends on the turn on the track because smaller curves you wouldn't drift anyway but she turning without drifting can require a harder press it the break showing you down and with drifting even on a track it you got the notification you don't lose speed and have a boost to straighten out with at the end of the turn making you faster... Drifting every turn will make you slower but a real drifter knows not to drift every turn anyway

[@animationcrate]

You also have to take into account the wear on the tires if you're drifting. If it's a short race, then sure, MAYBE it might be beneficial if you're good enough, but in a longer race, you're gonna be losing grip and you're gonna be sliding if you go long enough, that or you're gonna need to pit more often

[@metanumia]

*AWESOME* *EPISODE* Thank you Kyle and Odi! I love Because Science and Donut Media so much, this episode was a dream come true! Keep up the great work, all of you! :D

[@jonahbutterfield5792]

Mythbusters tested this and found that it was slower in practice than making a normal turn! Really good episode on both sides! Can't wait to see what you tackle next!

[@tiacho2893]

I think there is only one example where intentional drifting yields a faster result. There is a rally car manoeuvre called the Scandinavian Flick (or a pendulum turn in the US I think) that is performed on a 180˚ or hair pin turn. By breaking and throttling at the same time, the rear wheels of the car have a lower wheel RPM. Steering opposite to the turn while entering and then using the sideways torque the rear of the car follows the arc of a circle with the front wheels act as the centre point of the circle. The car basically swings like a pendulum. While overall speed is not really different, the advantage are that the car is oriented to leave the hair pin turn in a straight line and that a decent engine RPM is maintained. It was good that you brought up rally car drivers but this was also done by prohibition era bootleggers. In this case, it is not a simple speed advantage but utilises the fact that the front wheels steer and the rear wheels apply power (or in the case of AWD, the rear wheels apply greater power). ETA: The sentence should read "the rear wheels of the car have a HIGHER wheel RPM".

[@oramac7237]

That maneuver works for rally cars, yes. But not on pavement. Even on turns like the Grand Hotel Hairpin at Monoco, nobody ever drifts. kzbin.info/www/bejne/e5Wbq5SCnZeKeNk

[@ringlhach]

I can think of another, and that's from a complete stop. You know, like a (presumably sane) driver would normally use at an intersection in a city/street/non-track-or-highway setting.

[@tiacho2893]

ringlhach I think drag racing might not conform to your definition of sane but oversized drag slicks are made with a thin side wall to act like a spring. Also, by distorting, the contact patch is increased resulting in an increase in static friction. This stores some of the tires energy which is released when the speed of the car reaches the point where the car's foreward motion and the resulting tire rotation allows kinetic friction to take over. Like rally driving, these are in no way normal circumstances. Anyone that thinks drifting on a city street has an IQ lower than his car's horsepower by an order of magnitude. No sane person would do this on a public street. Res ipsa loquitur. PS Because using special characters, as in formulae, in annoying in text, I am using coefficient of friction and total friction, both static and kinetic, interchangeably. I know that it is annoying but it is for simplicity.

[@tiacho2893]

Neil Evans I wonder if that is due to the characteristics of the car itself, i.e. power to weight ratio, tire characteristics and longevity (factoring a couple extra tire changes during a race might eat up any time gains). I know that NASCAR racers have four unique tires on every car, i.e. the left are different from the right and the fronts are different from the rears (similar to the unidirectional tires on a Porsche as the rears are larger than the fronts). Though I have never really thought about a really complex system like an F1 car. Racing is about efficiency where drifting is about style. Race car designers would probably prefer to remove paint and decals from the car design as it is dead weight.

[@oramac7237]

commatoes "Racing is about efficiency where drifting is about style." You hit the nail on the head right there. And yes, it absolutely is about the characteristics of the vehicle. Not only tire life (which is a valid point), but suspension setup, engine mapping, weight, and so many other factors combine to make racecars what they are. I made a comment a little bit below about how drift cars specifically set up their suspensions to increase their ability to change from static to kinetic friction. This is entirely opposite of race cars, wherein they do everything in their power to maintain traction (static friction).

[@mikedrop4421]

Gonna have to call you out on this one Kyle. Everyone knows drifting is slower, that's why no actual racing disciplines use it. Obviously you wanted an excuse to rip it up on track. That is something I can respect tho. Edit : I meant tarmac based racing. Obviously rally, ice and snow racing drift to keep momentum.

[@ihuntcheese216]

There are actual racing disciplines that use it. Rally Cross is the main one, there are also drifting leagues out there as well.

[@JasonWW2000]

Hey, he was going to the track anyway, why not make an episode from it? I can't blame him. :-)

[@ThatBoySaucy]

Yeah there are several race disciplines that's use drifting under certain conditions or situations to be faster. Like mike said, rallycross uses is around hairpin turns and loose terrain such as Gravel or dirt to throw the car as fast as it can go in a low grip environment. But also there is Formula Drift professional series and Gymkana. drivers are awarded points for speed and drift angle.

[@mikedrop4421]

mike sommerfield I should have specified tarmac only. Obviously super low traction surfaces are the exception. Snow, ice gravel and such.

[@InfamousArmstrong]

Mike O'Barr Also spaceships, obviously

[@Gottaculat]

"But hey, that's just a theory; a Film Theory! Thanks for watching!" Oh, wait, wrong channel, lol!

[@graphixkillzzz]

i've actually done some gokart drifting on a indoor track. what i found was that if i drift long turns i lose time compared to just turning. but racing is about getting through a turn, then accelerating as fast as you can up to the next turn, then slowing down as fast as u can (with control), to take the next turn as fast as u can. on sharper turns, u can actually drift through the turn faster. however, coming out of the turn and getting down the straight to the next turn is slower because you've lost the friction between the tires and the ground. HOWEVER, er, sometimes you can drift a turn so much faster than slowing down to take it normally, that u have more time to let your tires hook back up with the ground and get up to top speed, orrrr get through the turn faster and maintain high rpm/low friction but carry that speed, at an angle, down a short straight and get into the next turn where u can slow down a bit, let the tires hook up and accelerate down a longer straight faster. drifting every turn would definitely be slower, but drifting some turns should be faster. but the biggest problem is tire wear. if you took tire wear out of the equation, i'm certain that most racers would be drifting certain turns and taking other turns normally in most races. but then they would go through 3 sets of tires to one set by someone not drifting at all. TL;DR: drifting some turns, but not all, would be faster than taking every turn normally. but would be harder on the tires.

[@JSTKSK]

Nope. These are proven facts. Drifting a corner will always be slower than turning correctly.

[@VenomTheCat]

Chuck full of irrelevant Groot reverences but no InitialD references. Fail!

[@travisimmortalis2135]

The Groot references were because Vin Diesel is the voice of Groot.

[@VenomTheCat]

and your point?

[@R3_Live]

Vin Diesel voices Groot, so they aren't irrelevant.

[@VenomTheCat]

Oh yeah those intense dialogs and speeches by groot are so mooving Groot is irrelevant no matter who "voiced" it

[@TheCrash480]

Groot is voiced by an actor who is in the fast and furious movies, the episode is about the fast and furious movies... so how exactly is the reference irrelevant? And what the hell does the quality of Groot's 'speeches' have to do with relevance!?

[@5THR33S]

Dont forget, an absolute essential of street racing is the 32 speed gearbox P.S: You're a very lucky man, that car would have been a joy to cruise in.

[@claudiocuqui6093]

There is one factor that I believe has not been considered: every car has two important curves: torque and horsepower and the peak of these two curves occurs at high revs (in petrol cars). As such, a drifting car could keep the engine in a rev range so as to maximize these two variables, and thus be more efficient than just braking and cornering. Electric cars are a completely different story :). I also think that using drift only in sharp turns will be better than drifting in all corners. Just a thought ;)

[@LeutnantJoker]

Didn't the Mythbusters test this though? I think they also came to the conclusion that even at the best curve for drifting it's at best just as fast and for the majority of curves, especially >90° ones not drifting is much faster. But it's been a while. I think they also mentioned the advantage of not having to re-up the revs. But I also think an expert driver can use the gears to always stay at optimal revs, even decellerating.

[@EccoH_]

Lt_Joker correct. If a driver knows how to heel-toe downshift well, he will most likely be in the optimal gear and in the optimal power band to accelerate out of the corner faster. Most cars that have paddle shifters will automatically blip the throttle to provide that Heel-toe effect. Also drifting is slower because you are wasting more energy and traction by using it to keep you sideways in drift rather than propel you forward as the tire was intended. If you create wheelspin, you inherently lose much of forward grip, in fact it creates less grip than what the tires could originally handle.

[@eduardovillagra5482]

UOOOUUU!! You getting out of the lab/youtubeclass(?) with some serious company and real tests... You are awesome, thanks for that

[@jaspr1999]

I watched a couple of the Fast & Furious movies and have always wondered... What kind of transmission has multiple gears for reverse? They're backing up fast, and they change gears to back up faster?! I don't suppose you could explain that one with science? :-D Kyle, you looked like you had an absolute blast! Thank you for letting us enjoy the trips around the track through your experience!

[@joeywilson3997]

jaspr1999. There are transmissions with multiple reverse gears, however they are mostly found on vehicles such as tanks and large trucks. The cars in Fast and Furious would only have one reverse gear. I think they just tried to make the scene look cooler.

[@jaspr1999]

Joey Wilson, - I agree. When I was watching them do that in the movie I couldn't help but laugh as the lightest low/high gear transmission I know of is over 500 pounds, with additional accouterments adding another 300+ pounds, and way too heavy for a vehicle built for speed. In an interview with Vin Diesel, he said he kept asking about it and kept being told not to worry about it.

[@tylervolk1732]

Mercedes actually has a multiple reverse gear transmission, also they do custom make stuff for these movies just look at the high speed reverse scene from 2 fast 2 furious.

[@travis1984ify]

Mainly, they do it because it looks good cinematically.

[@mikesinistar8834]

They turned their transmission upside down... I thought everyone did that

[@JustinY.]

Deja vu...

[@Sieger1]

I was about to comment that.

[@reddlesm7394]

I just been in this place before

[@Sieger1]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/mqeUZJqiZcZgfKM

[@DeineMuddaHatNen]

this guy

[@Obbsnja]

Hi guy

[@DuhGlitchKing]

Great collaboration with Odi, I really liked the video !

[@straygary130]

nice explanation :D one thing to mention is that more power is needed for drifting than for normal driving. Could you make a video maybe about the efficiency between front, rear and all wheel drive cars on the race track? Most people are stuck with the idea that rwd is better than fwd on the track but is it really so?

[@holyloli69420]

Insert *Initial D* joke here

[@HouseholdWheel]

*Deja vu*

[@williamrogers9918]

HouseholdWheel *never been in this place before*

[@osvaldocortes4598]

N-nani? Kansei dorifto?

[@reddlesm7394]

Nice, daddy’s gotta science

[@inuhaichi666]

Finally! I've been wondering when I'd finally have Kyle thank me for watching!

[@gradywilliams383]

I think the way I heard it explained was that the higher the coefficient of grip is (That is, the total amount of lateral force allowed through the interaction of tires and the surface), the lower the optimal slip angle is. This would explain why rally cars use a high slip angle on gravel, because the road facilitates a very low coefficient. Then you could also look at GT3 cars as a mid point on the spectrum of grip, because in low speed corners for qualifying, when the aero isn’t working as hard, those cars have a relatively small amount of slip angle, but also much more noticeable than an F1 car. I also specified qualifying because running the car with any slip angle heats up the tires like a madman, and most endurance cars avoid going full tilt for just that reason, as the heat makes the overall times much slower.

[@yuhihe]

Next video : does listening to Eurobeat play list make you drive faster?

[@metanumia]

That's just common sense, no need to test that hypothesis! :)

[@Sleepy.Time.]

If drifting was fast F1 cars would not do everything they can to avoid wheel spin

[@designSenji]

because u just cant drift on f1 because u die, the structure of f1 car make that they can go fust, so the forces push on it much hire, than it on normal cars

[@nescockk]

Obviously its not faster🤦 because when you drift! You control your speed which means youre not mashing the throttle going faster

[@sebasmartinsm]

Yea f1 pulls some incredible g forces when they set down on bumps. Truthfully a lot of research went into their tires but those cars are all aerodynamics.

[@TheSupremeDominator]

F1 cars can drift if they want them to. What you mean by they can't I don't know.

[@MrJakel123]

Drifting over uses the rear tyres and in any kind of enduro race they would need to change tyres way too much

[@jort93z]

Obviously it would be faster when driving an 86.

[@NoForksGiven]

So does this apply to video games? Cause in every one I play with vehicles, you have the option to either slow down and turn normally or try to drift around the corner (and slide into a building in most cases)

[@DukeGaGa]

Drifting is faster depending on the situation. It is faster when the traction between the tires and surface of traveling (or what we car guys like to simply call grip) is less than ideal, or when the turning angle is too great that you need to go forward and backwards multiple times to make the turn when not drifting. You already covered all the physics behind it so I will not talk about that, but mostly other parts of why it can be faster in this situation. For the most part, it is better to do a controllable drift in low traction situations, because you can keep your car in a higher gear, if executed correctly you'll end up in a higher gear when exiting the corner thus saving time switching gears, also it is a lot harder to calculate the stopping distance on these type of surfaces, and since you only have a split second to decide what to do, and when to do it, it is easier for the driver to drift and control the slide thus saving time. And about the second situation, I think it speaks for itself, if someone need to turn a 180 around a pole, and stay as close to the pole as possible, you'll have to drift it or you won't be able to make the turn.

[@icenic_wolf]

2 things -- 1) Drifting CAN be just a tiny bit faster, if a) it's power-on drifting as you exit a corner, and b) you don't have to countersteer. 2) Drifting on an off-road course can sometimes be the fastest relatively-safe way around a corner. See also: WRC footage from previous winners. But the rest of the time, you're totally better off not purposefully evoking a drift.

[@icenic_wolf]

But, 1) above is not what most people consider "drifting", although it is a loss of traction while experiencing lateral Gs while your steering wheel is pointed somewhere else.

[@tonycast7754]

Drifting from what I understand it, is a controlled slide. Cars are designed to grip the road and increase the friction to allow grip. When the tire is spinning that grip translates to higher acceleration and speed. When you slide you loose that friction and so retain some amount of speed due to the lack of friction. Think of it like Hydroplaning. Hitting the brakes will only cause your tire to lock up and cause you to loose total control over the vehicle due to lack of friction with the road. It will not slow you down and reestablish the lost connection with the road. The problem I see with drifting over not is that often times to create the "drift event", you have to use the brakes. So already you are slowing yourself down in anticipation of the drift. You are entering the turn slower than if you were just going to grip through it. Without the needed grip of the road, you are no longer able to accelerate back to your prior speed. It takes precious time to regain that control of the vehicle and re-accelerate after you exit the turn. This translates directly to the slower laptimes. You loose a lot of speed drifting due to the use of the brake -- hand or otherwise -- while regaining control over the vehicle. Also the risk to your tires and chances of spinning out as showcased in this video are another good reason why Drifting would not be ideal for an escape.

[@danielclay1378]

Awesome video man. More like this please

[@samueloravec2228]

You + Donut media? Great combo. Nice S13.4 btw

[@MrPSyman3]

Anyone who follows professional racing knows the answer. Even playing a racing video game it's really clear. You're going nowhere sideways. You can't accelerate effectively

[@NitroGTRi]

dude, there's a lot os aspects you're not taking into account.. - there's Specialized tires for drifting; - speed in and out the curve differs in grip and drift; - the suspension set up is different in both sports... and so on, and so forth...

[@yourfavoritejojo5235]

High Voltage RC Blog umm no

[@floww2953]

The suspension set up is different? Take any stock car, take it on a track of your choosing then make a couple laps by drifting and gripping. Grip will always be faster.

[@Redmed427x]

What he's saying is that the drift car Odi is driving is not setup for grip, everything is different, camber, gear setup. It makes a huge difference.. For example, a KZbinr did this exact track with donut media in a Mazda Miata and it was one second slower than Odi's drift car. Odi is a professional driver... He'd be able to go alot faster if he had setup his 240 for a circuit rather than drift.

[@floww2953]

Well yes, that's obvious. I thought he was another one of those people that think drifting is faster, which is just retarded. What I meant by my comment was that you can eliminate all that and make it fair game by taking a completely stock car, grip will always come out on top.

[@thequintessentialgamer7514]

Kyle's out of his habitat! I definitely like this and would love to see more vids with Kyle out in the field proving sciene!

[@bryanlolwtf04]

Drifting:A way of turning corners by sliding the vehicle while maintaining control of it. Invented by Keiichi Tsuchiya aka Drift King. Introduced mainly by Pluspy, Initial D and Fast and Furious (mainly Tokyo Drift). Formula: Great engine sound+great car+great songs(such as Eurobeat)+skill+cup filled with water+manual shifting=drifting Best performed in RWD cars, FWD also suggested but AWD not.

[@isaacthek]

The major advantage of drifting around tight corners is aligning your tires for the straight faster and thus being able to accelerate out of the tight turn quicker, not the drift itself.

[@EclecticFruit]

But we already know the coefficient of kinetic friction is less advantageous to acceleration than the coefficient of static friction... SMH. Drifting is a waste of tires AND TIME when it comes to lap times. That is always true.

[@TopRacer2002]

You are talking about sliding the car not drifting it and also if you do that you run the risk of spinning out at the exit since you will be at the real edge between grip and loss of grip. Drifting would involve a slide just like a rally car which is the worst way around a corner on tarmac.

[@joelhanson1248]

Thank youuuu

[@skullservant8486]

If you want to be fast you need power and grip. If you drift you throw away grip and speed but have more fun and look badass (if you do it right). It's basically impossible to be faster on a lap drifting than normal driving in almost all cases. But that isn't the point of drifting, drifting is *A R T* It's not Fast. But it's Furious.

[@91plm]

CROblazer420 unless you're on a dirt road at 200km/h and have a 30° turn left. You change car position in advance go down to 120km/h,but your car has good position on road and high RPM.

[@skullservant8486]

91plm >in almost all cases

[@GabrielGreedy]

Or when you are going downhill on a tight track... Good luck doing grip in that scenario

[@skullservant8486]

Greedy Raider that's the one I meant while writing my comment *eurobeat intensifies*

[@NinjaBearFilms]

So you’re saying Cars with the “you must learn to turn right to turn left” drifting to win the race was a lie.

[@33DavePaton33]

Well done brosive! This was a really well done episode.

[@Kexev]

drifting is faster, as long as you are listening eurobeat

[@Capt.Alron.D]

There is a difference between drift and powerslide. Most fast and furious races feature powerslides. Though powerslides will still be a slow option than proper racing lines they still can be a good way to get your car in perfect position for 90 or crazy 180 degree turns with delayed braking before the turn and early acceleration after. Also fun video to watch nevertheless.

[@Utubesuperstar]

Power sliding is done with awd not rwd

[@Capt.Alron.D]

@@Utubesuperstar it doesn't work like that! You can still drift with a awd cars and still do a power slide with rwd cars.. for example Ken block does drifting with awd cars! The difference is in the style. Mostly a drift is initiated before the apex of the turn and its held for a longer duration. Power slide is initiated mostly after the apex of the turn and its used to get your car to a disired angle.

[@seanperson2032]

1:15 into the video, lemme just ruin this for ya guys. If you are drifting your tires have gone beyond their limit of grip so you are no longer putting the maximum amount of your engines power to the ground, therefore it is not faster. A proper racing turn allows you to accelerate for the last half of the turn.

[@JDBob3]

Sean Person - though there was only a 3sec difference and the driver proposed a quicker lap. There's obviously opportunities where it can be beneficial to slide/drift. Quite disappointed this couldn't be adressed enTIREly..

[@seanperson2032]

3 seconds on a track that takes 1 minute to go around is days in racing time. Yes there are sometimes where it may be advantageous but again if you are racing a proper line and hitting all the corners how you should, you only MIGHT need to drift if you need to pass someone who is slower than you but in your way.

[@seanperson2032]

They were in a purpose built drift car. That is an actual drift racer driving too.

[@JasonWW2000]

I bet if they had set up that drift car like an actual race car it would have gone much more than 3 seconds faster per lap. Some example of the differences would be different rear spring rates, a different rear sway bar, different shock valving and different camber angles front and rear. So for a drift car to go 3 seconds faster (5.5%) per lap not drifting, that is a big difference.

[@Deadly_DoRight]

You guys are also ignoring rally races (dirt courses) where you never really have static friction and it that case drifting is not only faster but necessary to stay on the road at speed

[@johnangelogabo3709]

Yey Donut!!! Possible for a collab episode explaining James' dad through science?

[@chilledandcool3918]

Such a fun episode!😊👍🏾👍🏾

[@DaveLennonCopeland]

Your drift driver looks like Simon Pegg! :)

[@nightcaste]

Tim Roth more than Simon Pegg.

[@scottslaten6664]

I was thinking Simon Pegg too, but I can see the Tim Roth, too

[@joshuahartshorn411]

He's a drifter in Formula Drift. Bad ass driver and a really cool guy to talk to

[@tofugakiraidesu]

Dave Lennon-Copeland That's ODI FUCKIN BACHIK. lol peace

[@gedas3419]

Order 66 bakchis you fool

[@asadstrangelittleman9655]

Fast10YourSearbelts ladies and gentlemen.

[@oscarbogenberger-damsell4047]

A sad, strange little man is this the newest fast movie title

[@opium42069]

Uncle jokes

[@crisagrm9665]

This world needs a "This isn't gonna work, daddy's gotta science" gif of Kyle breaking that cast. Someone please make that.

[@ashtonhenderson6129]

I’m so happy that Odi Bakchis is in this video and is the driver for the vid. THANKS

[@matagatos1]

Drifting is for downhill mountain and rally. Haven't you heard Takumi?

[@firemaker282]

would these numbers change at all depending on the angle of the turn? like taking a wide turn like in your test sure drifting would be slower but what about on sharp u-turns where the driver would have to slow down significantly more to make the turn?

[@lucifer6966]

Dillon Highsmith Sadly no. Even then the grip approach yields superior results as you maintain apex. Maximum speed. Keep in mind any advantage on the track is lost when you factor in tire longevity. It looks cool and is lots of fun to do but there's a reason all high performance cars highly favor apex. Rally is a bit of an exception.

[@ciCCapROSTi]

Lucifer 69 if you had trouble slowing down you might want to drift. That's exactly why rally uses it, their roads are a lot more slippery than f1's rubbery asphalt. They lose traction a lot faster.

[@lucifer6966]

shinarit You clearly didn't read my entire post. Rally is the exception but apex still wins. Slip results in a loss of speed. Always. Designing a car to meet all track conditions is difficult so they compensate by drifting tricky turns. Rally is less about drifting and more about endurance and actually finishing the race. Edit: On a track there is no reason to drift. Even if it was faster you would burn through your tire in a single lap. 2 tops on a decent length track.

[@Shimi433]

I think he explained it in that last part with the graph

[@mariusmglestue1234]

if you're going down a road like Irohazaka (www.google.no/maps/place/1st+Irohazaka/@36.7120573,139.5109434,5462a,35y,38.37t/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x601fa8b144b7a34b:0x71b581f4c7fbd942!8m2!3d36.7452806!4d139.5135355?hl=en) it would be faster to drift, or on a really narrow road with sharp turns.

[@joshuatang8854]

What if you corner in between drift and grip? Would it be faster where you enter the corner at the maximum speed of the corner and then the car rear end slides due to the speed of the entrance but you maintain some grip and exit the corner sliding just a little bit?

[@pratikmaurya7394]

That's some quality content. Enjoyed every second of it(eventhough I'm not a very big fan of car's and stuff).

[@HORRIOR1]

1:41 Without friction you wouldn't be able to MOVE anywhere since you need friction for the tires touching the road, to move you forwards, or backwards.

[@thomasfplm]

HORRIOR, supposing you are at a flat place, without friction, the exhaust of the car would give you a little acceleration.

[@AspLode]

thomasfplm maybe with forced induction you'll gain a little from a forward-facing intake as well!

[@thomasfplm]

AspLode I'm only thinking about you a normal car.

[@luongmaihunggia]

thomasfplm that little acceleration is too small, the car would be moving super slow and it would waste alot of energy too.

[@dudewithlaptop8663]

That was my first thought to

[@ERROR-ne7cd]

You still upset that Thanos killed your brother.

[@Vanishing_]

ERROR - NAME UNIVALIBLE no

[@LuckyTuga13]

I've been drifting for about 10 years now and yeah in a circuit it won't ever be faster, but downhill with a light car is a different story just because drifting allows to take some lines that aren't possible unless you severely lower your speed, so that way the time you'd loose by drifting is more than made up with the more aggressive line taken at a higher speed than grip could provide, also no serious driver would drift every single corner on a race, the mix between the two are what makes the best time

[@Anxiou5Panda]

Kyle holding on to dear life haha. Good job man!

[@silvk1000]

You should have used Initial D as reference

[@RaydeusMX]

Kyle's face is more than worth it.

[@cherrydragon3120]

Raydeus i agree.

[@IWishUWereTacos]

I found your channel via Game Knights, great content Science-Thor!

[@samhaines8228]

yay! because science & Donut Media crossover!!