Beethoven's Chords: A modern harmony songwriting perspective

[@EuphoniaPooch]

That's exactly what I was looking for. Would love to hear more pieces broken down into chord progressions

[@cameronlewis2639]

You can just figure it out. You dont need a video.

[@zorn1745]

@@cameronlewis2639 some people aren’t as experienced in music theory and require explanation so videos help 👍

[@emmettomeara1866]

@@cameronlewis2639 how does one figure it out?

[@Whatismusic123]

@@zorn1745 if you aren't experienced enough for that, you will gain nothing from understanding it.

[@zorn1745]

@@Whatismusic123 so let’s just deny everyone of education because if you aren’t experienced in it already there’s no point trying to understand anything 👍

[@Taterzz]

what i love is how simple concepts can create such beautiful compositions. it's no surprise beethoven was a genius.

[@KazeSenshi2929]

Applause for that pathetique ballad =) Plz do more videos about Beethoven

[@MangoldProject]

I'll try. Applause should be directed at Mr. Barenboim :)

[@Todd63790]

Kaze seshi why don’t you complain to your mum

[@johnneihsial8538]

Though I have tried lots and lots of lessons in youtube I always end up with yours... You are simply great. May God bless you for your kindness...

[@jackdeanda2311]

Your speaking a language I understand!! Your lessons had help me appreciate Beethovens chord progressions here! Thank you!

[@cacauceluque]

Congratulations to the video and to all comments! Please consider creating more videos with classical and romantic composers basis. Thx

[@acwatercolors]

Excellent video, playing and explaination. Some Beethoven chords progression's insight I was look for a long! Thanks

[@bujodrag]

Thank you. I was a rock drummer but can't play drums anymore thanks to multiple sclerosis, since 2017. I am trying to learn music theory, friend gave me keyboard midi controller so I can compose songs for my bands. And, most important, I always considered Beethoven greatest of them all. Even before I discovered drums i had LPs of his piano sonatas and symphonies. And Bach's Brandenburg Concertos

[@quaternion-pi]

Bodacious as in remarkable or extraordinary! Thanks for an extra delightful hour at the piano with rethought ideas to play with.

[@MangoldProject]

That was a pauciloquent yet kind comment ;)

[@DarkForcesStudio]

When you go from guitar to piano this is how you think about music. This is great. Thank you. :)

[@SilloniusAeldarian]

This is so helpfull thank you! Please make another of this

[@MangoldProject]

I've been thinking about doing a Debussy one. Might go ahead and do it! But don't hold your breath ...

[@SilloniusAeldarian]

@@MangoldProject yess!! I already turn on notification for your newest video while i watching your old playlist. Thank you for sharing!

[@mkgtuty]

Good video to watch and listen.

[@wormtownpaul]

This is incredibly valuable, and like others have commented, exactly what I have been looking for. It's very difficult to find this sort of analysis of classical music.

[@dharryg]

Very useful insights. I would love to see more of these "deconstructions" with phrases from Brahms, Liszt, Schubert and Mozart.

[@pogchamp7983]

Dom7 VI chord sounds great and I will try to implement this, nice video!

[@urbinamdm]

Really insightful. Thanks foe posting. It really helps to enjoy Bewthoven"s music writing even more.

[@jokutyyppiullakolta4866]

Bewthoven! Grammar Nazis and music nerds triggered :D

[@VoidloniXaarii]

this was wonderful, i really hope you'll do more such analysis of classical music. It's doable to find jazz related analysis, but I still really love classical music and i'd love to learn more about how/why it worked so well.

[@davelester1985]

Thank you for doing this. Please do more.

[@MiskyWilkshake]

I feel like this whole lesson would have been vastly improved if you at least mentioned the secondary function of most of those chords. 1dom7 doesn't mean a whole lot, but at V7/IV gives you a whole lot more information about how that chord is functioning. Also, you have an error in your analysis: the 6 chord of C would be A-rooted, not F-rooted. TL;DR: I - V7/IV - IV - V7/ii - ii - V7/ii - ii - V7/V - V - V7/V - v - V7 - I - I+ - IV - V7 would make for a much more useful analysis.

[@sandroconforto6035]

MiskyWilkshake yes, that's what i thought too! this way of seeing the harmonic progression is way more enlightening....

[@DudeinatorMC]

Completely agree! Inversions and voicing are always important to the sound of something, and I think that this would be very helpful in the analysis of the chord progression. Still loved the video, though!

[@pogchamp7983]

He literally shows the exact notes he's playing in the middle of the screen on the initial play through of the chords. But I agree about the secondary dominants for sure.

[@larspetersen7196]

Secondary dominants

[@baronvonskeltal7550]

@@goodcyrus not quite, since the II in the II-V-I is not a dominant 7th chord but instead it's meant to be a subdominant (either minor 7th or half-diminished if the 'I' is a major or minor chord, respectively). What is true, however, is that the root of the II is the same as the root of the V/V

[@richmondoffei4689]

I love this Beethoven's chords modern harmony

[@noukes56]

Amazing...and eye opening... classical music thought of in terms of chord and chords progressions... Well done.. I have always wondered why some students who have studied classical music as children for 5 years or more...seem to be unable to translate their knowledge into pop music,jazz, or personal compositions as adults and so have abandoned the piano.. They don't think in chords but only the cascade of individual notes.. You are one of the best piano teachers on the internet..

[@MangoldProject]

Well, when you study music in a good place such as Julliard you take comprehensive theory lessons even if you only play classical pieces. I assure you those classical players know how to analyze their pieces in terms of harmony and chords extremely well.

[@noukes56]

True..I was thinking more of all the children and young adults who study with a piano teacher in their town or city for five years or so..They learn to read music, play some classical pieces and learn scales--all important tools...but not how to analyze and deconstruct-a great skill that keeps their piano playing alive for a lifetime. That is why your lessons are so valuable and clearly presented. Thanks, again.

[@shelunama8403]

Mary LeVesque Xxx.ndrxubb §exxyfillmsex

[@SH-ry2xi]

I always wondered this

[@michellesickinger1878]

My favorite composer is Beethoven and broken down to put the chords was wonderful.

[@nicolasurricelqui1520]

This is incredible information! would love more of this . thank you

[@petergreen1869]

Brilliant. Many thanks.

[@benjaminmairs9302]

6:25 the ballad version of Beethoven reminds me a lot of "Uninvited" by Alanis Morisette

[@selfiestick1589]

Loved the video! Got a question tho is there a reason "implied C7" is correct or more correct in comparison to "C5" in 2:18? Thanks in advance to anyone who answers~

[@selfiestick1589]

for real, im already really grateful to anyone who answers

[@laaduanaoficial6504]

That was just awesome! Wish I had found this channel before

[@godd226]

This is a really great idea. Thanks

[@Todd63790]

A great lesson well done my friend

[@filipfagerberg5665]

Amazing! I just can't help but like all of your videos regarding classical music! But I'd especially like Chopin, it would be awesome! : )

[@miguelmonforte]

Great! I was searching Bach Prelude chord progressions and come to this!

[@Tonemash]

Thank you, fantastic overview of classical harmony

[@matheushenrique9773]

This piano sounds so good!! Omg!!

[@MangoldProject]

Thanks.

[@JussiTuukkanen]

Thank you for sharing your wealth of wisdom. Would it be possible to see more analysis of classical movements? Very inspirational videos

[@MangoldProject]

Definitely, just need the time to make the videos ...

[@wormtownpaul]

This is great. Are there any books out there, or more videos by you or others, that do the same thing for (lots of) other classical pieces? I can learn so much from this, and I don't understand why this isn't standard in the analysis of classical music. More Beethoven. Some Schubert, Mendelsohn, and Brahms

[@Pedozzi]

I really like these videos, i've been struggling to find good harmonic analyisis of bach, chopin, bethoven pieces and so on, i think they would make for some very good progressions for improvising over, they have something that regular standard jazz and blues chord progressions just don't have, so thanks

[@theacan565]

MangoldProject.......ALWAYS A GREAT JOB!!!!

[@Edwardcage1]

you're amazing man.

[@MangoldProject]

Thanks Edward :)

[@sammysoil77]

Your ballad is awesome

[@WillKriski]

Great stuff. If people didn't notice the lowest bass note of the chord voicings moves down by step or 1/2 step for a nice downward movement. eg Eb Db C Bb Ab G F Eb etc

[@fadyessam338]

that's a great idea to illustrate harmony please keep on....but i think there's a mistake in the fourth chord as the C7 is transposed to A7 not to F7,and please correct me if I'm wrong :D

[@74hz15]

Yeah, 4th chord should be A7

[@lawrencetaylor4101]

Merci beaucoup for this. That was a beautiful ballad.

[@flavio5046]

Thank you for the video, it was very helpfull

[@dliessmgg]

I like how the middle section is just a prolonged 6-2-5-1 progression with some alterations.

[@pedroneves9351]

Wo to you have more of this ?

[@philby8]

Excellent video ! Thanks

[@MajorFay]

Thank u this is awesome idea

[@patriciodasilva7902]

Very interesting but there's an error in the transposed line for the sixth degree which is listed as F7 and should be A7.

[@manofsound2408]

Thoroughly enjoyed this point of view... considering earlier pieces? A Brahms piece and/or Mozart concerto? Thanks.

[@olla-vogala4090]

Bravo, great idea to take a classical composition as example! How about an analysis of Brahms' Op. 117 no.2, or some Bach? (French ouverture, Italian concerto etc.)

[@MangoldProject]

There isn't a single theme that links all of classical music together. I've thought of doing some Bach videos at some point - we'll see if that happens (i.e. if I get the time).

[@urzathehappy72]

pathetique is one of my fav pieces

[@sc1ss0r1ng]

Roger Waters Pathetic

[@guillermopeitton4359]

Great lesson and agree with Toho Central ....do more clasical!!! , you are a really great teacher, thanks a lot !!!!

[@leonleon3773]

brilliant tutorial many thanks

[@seamanjive]

Great vid, lots to work on here...many thx

[@tarikeld11]

This video was so simple and I could understand everything, so I was wondering if there's a video for this theme in the recapitulation.

[@CuchoCanton]

i want more of this

[@yoshi27661]

Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata is great to take chords from.

[@MangoldProject]

It's also not too bad to listen to ;) But yes, Classical music is a great source of inspiration!

[@HenryMcGuinnessGuitar]

John Lennon said he that playing the Moonlight (I assume the slow mvt) backwards gave him the idea for the Beatles song "Because"

[@tmusic99]

Noted LH RH counterpoint movement in B:s version.

[@exapplerrelppaxe7952]

I liked this very much.

[@jubstreet5866]

It’s wonderful ❤🎉

[@ljl451]

At 2:54 you said B dominant 7. Maybe you wanted to say B flat dominant 7? But there is no Bb, so it looks to me a D diminished chord.

[@MangoldProject]

Yeah, I said it incorrectly (too many B's flying around ... ) but the screen shows it correctly.

[@ljl451]

Yes, thanks for your reply.

[@CarlDidur]

4th chord bottom row (transposed to C) should be A7 not F7, i.e the dominant of the chord it leads to - Dmin. This sequence can be seen as a series of modulations w a cadence at the end.

[@alpers2210]

Well thought out

[@phasln777]

Thanks a lot.. I found what I searched for.. 🙏

[@pedrodiniz92]

Beethoven is awesome and you're awesome, too 👏🏻

[@KostyaKanishev]

Typo: fourth F7 in the bottom row should be A7 Also, I'd agree with people noting that it would be helpful to mention secondary dominant in the analysis. Otherwise, great lesson, thank you! Can you do Bach?

[@richmondoffei4689]

Is like you knows my problems and what I want

[@khashe]

Will you be doing tutorials on specific works in the future? Like a tutorial on Nocturne 20 in C sharp minor would be so helpful.

[@MangoldProject]

I probably will, but time will tell. Nothing specific planned for now.

[@kaled9254]

It should be C C7 A7 (!) Dm instead of C C7 F7 Dm.

[@raaron4315]

so sick how the bass moves down

[@abhigyan2619]

Scary progression 😱😱😱

[@ejsra1980]

Excellent!!!

[@juliakmars]

Wow great! Thank you for this video :)

[@kiikat_]

I always think of "How Insensitive", which has the same chord progression to Chopin's Prelude in E Minor.

[@MangoldProject]

There are so many classical pieces that have inspired and could inspire modern music.

[@SamuelPeckman]

I found this very useful thank you very much.Samuel.

[@ravelitschimo]

Pa ba Pa Pam:-) Thank you mister bethoven

[@AggamRahamim-fs2zm]

מדהים שלישראלי יש ערוץ יוטיוב כזה גדול על מוזיקה כל הכבודד

[@MangoldProject]

תודה!

[@daybyday3840]

Do more videos about classical music chord progressions or something like that. Plz make a video about a bach fuge. plz.

[@MangoldProject]

Bach is a very interesting guy to try and analyze in terms of modern harmony because he thinks differently. Bach's music is "vertical" while modern music is "horizontal". I'll see what I can do.

[@djchonny]

Damn, you are so good

[@MangoldProject]

Thank you.

[@comwillan]

thank you

[@josephgeorge6055]

Wow....! Great

[@andiirejino1210]

do you ever do any requests on some music? there is this song by Steven Wilson called home invasion and it has some really awesome jazz and funk chords in it on a Rhodes piano. if not it's all good

[@MangoldProject]

Hi Andii. Unfortunately not due to copyright issues on KZbin. :(

[@mwangaza6722]

great!!!

[@KrausKeysGuitar]

Awesome video! I love music inspired by great composers. Jon Lord's music was inspired by Bach, some Ray Manzarek's works were inspired by Chopin. Please make a similar video about Chopin's and Bach's music. Greetings from Poland!

[@MangoldProject]

Will try to :). Don't forget Eric Carmen's All By Myself, inspired by Rachmaninoff ;)

[@MsFlamingFlamer]

How could anyone dislike this?

[@MangoldProject]

Even if I upload a video of ice-skating kittens while curing cancer, I'll still get dislikes. Welcome to KZbin ;)

[@itamarcho]

תודה רבה

[@phazonruler3000]

It would be nice if you made more of these. Maybe focus on Liszt or Chopin pieces as well.

[@benvillasana3062]

Love this please do one like this on chopin

[@MangoldProject]

Which piece?

[@benvillasana3062]

MangoldProject nocturne no.2

[@MangoldProject]

Ok. I'll think about it.

[@curtpiazza1688]

Great ideas! Applying classical progressions! Whets your appetite to study classical analysis! Thanx! I'm experimenting with Pachelbel's Progression. .. I...IV...vi..iii...IV...I...IV...V...

[@800pieds]

Great. I was too lazy to find classical chord progressions myself.

[@dollysinn]

This is where spindly long fingers become useful.

[@petertarsio7168]

As my teacher Robert Goldsand said, follow the harmony.

[@myingratealbinochild4825]

Great !

[@richmondoffei4689]

You're my mentor

[@MangoldProject]

Thanks Richard, I'm glad you find the videos informative.

[@armhan]

Great :) I always do reverse engineering on every kind of music, for me is the best way to learn, especially theory and composition related stuff

[@MangoldProject]

Excellent approach. Reverse engineering is the best way to learn!

[@carlosbalenzuela]

Can you explain how do you apply reverse engineering in music. I do not get the idea. Thanks

[@MangoldProject]

Reverse engineering simply means taking a piece of music, understanding the melody's notes, the chords, and thinking about how the composer chose the notes and chords he/she chose. There are no set rules for doing that.

[@armhan]

I examine the piece with sheet paper in front of me: 1. Structure 2. Tonality and/or tonality changes 3. Harmony (chords) 4. Melody

[@goodcyrus]

It is called "musical analysis." Here's another great video kzbin.info/www/bejne/hJ7QeoGpicxgjNU

[@penguindrum264]

That minor V chord is interesting. I'm guessing it's just a borrowed chord? Or did it temporarily modulate to Bbm because of the secondary dominant that proceeded it? Anyways I'm totally borrowing it.

[@MangoldProject]

It's a borrowed chord, but the question then becomes: why is that particular chord borrowed (and not the other gazillion options)? I view it as some form of delayed resolution. I.e. you're going from 2 to 5 but somewhere between the 2 and the 5 you stick a bunch of "unrelated" chords to throw listener off. If you don't overdo it you can maintain the harmonic continuity while still surprising the listener.

[@MaggaraMarine]

It's really not a borrowed chord in this case. It's part of a chromatically ascending line. Notice how the melody ascends chromatically from C to Eb (C Db D Eb). Actually, the whole thing is an ascending melody and a descending bassline and the chords are just a harmonization of these two lines. So the Bbm chord is a result of a Bb in the bass and a Db in the melody. It's basically a "passing chord" and doesn't really have a clear harmonic function in the progression. Beethoven could have chosen a regular Bb major chord, but then the melody would have had two repeated notes (D's) in it which would make it lack the "flow" of the original melody. Notice how after the three Eb notes in the beginning, the melody keeps moving all the time. So, you have two lines, the bass and the melody, that are moving in the opposite directions. Melody: Eb Eb Eb E F G Ab A Bb C Db D Eb Bass: Eb Db C Bb Ab G F Eb D C Bb Ab G This is really the most important thing about this progression and the reason why these exact chords were chosen. It's more about voice leading than chord functions, really (so in this case the roman numeral/chord function analysis kind of misses the point of the progression).

[@SH-ry2xi]

MaggaraMarine excellent response

[@jihhwood]

Thoughtful and well done. Thank you. However, two matters remain unclear in my mind. What do you mean when you describe a chord as "implied" -- as in when you said of the sixth chord in the progression (your words): "This is an implied C dominant 7 because there isn't a major . . . ." I do some composing and I think I've run into this problem. Can you help by shedding some light on the matter? Also, although you reference voicing, I cannot fathom how you arrived at the voicing you chose to use. Sounded great, but how did you decide on the voicing? Thanks again for posting.

[@MangoldProject]

1. Implied: lacking some of the notes that your mind makes up for. For example, suppose I play C and G. is this a C major (C E G) or C minor (C Eb G)? No way of saying, but if your entire song is full of minor chords, it's implied it's a C minor chord. So preceding chords, key, etc ... can all help imply a chord (i.e. "suggest" to the listener's mind how to fill in the missing notes). 2. Are you talking about the example at the end? Then there is no simple answer. Voicing is a whole different story and I have many many videos on the channel to help with suggestions. As for Beethoven's progression, I just played the same notes Beethoven wrote down, sans arpeggios :).

[@jihhwood]

Both of your responses are helpful. The "implied" concept makes sense, especially as you've explained its "contextual" meaning. The voicing are no mystery now, though I realize that in composing my ear (and my heart) are my compasses. No simple rules to follow -- thank goodness! . Thank you!

[@jihhwood]

My wife was classically trained as a pianist, but is absolutely at sea when I ask her to identify the chords she's playing. My days as a guitarist have been a help to me --and Assaf's strategy of "dissecting" and identifying the chords is familiar to me..... As to the voicing of chords -- that is, in the end, a matter of letting the ear and the heart guide the pen! Thanks for your response.

[@sc1ss0r1ng]

MangoldProject Did Beethoven play this arpeggiated? Btw, awesome video man, I'm learning this progression right now and It's slowly coming together, but It's not easy. (Only a beginner player)

[@MaggaraMarine]

Why it functions as a C7 is because of the surrounding context. It's some kind of a C chord in between two Fm chords. And because C is the dominant of F, the most likely explanation for the chord is that it's a C7 chord. Functionally speaking, this chord isn't really important - it's more of a passing chord between the two Fm chords. I mean, you first have an Fm chord in the first inversion and then in the root position and between these chords the bass descends stepwise (Ab->G->F). Similarly, the melody ascends stepwise (F->G->Ab). You could see the G both in the bass and the melody as a passing tone that just gets its own chord. Whenever you have this kind of a bassline and melody (so you have two similar chords that just change the inversion and you have one chord between them with a bass that moves stepwise), the middle chord is usually a dominant chord. Let's try this with another melody, for example: Melody: C D E Bass: E D C The C and E are harmonized with a C major chord. The D in the bass and the melody would most likely be harmonized with the dominant of C major, so G7. In the context of the original progression, you could look at the Fm as functioning as a temporary tonic. So you are basically moving between tonic and dominant. There's another instance where basically the same thing happens, and that's Bb F7 Bbm. The melody goes like Bb C Db (->D) and the bass goes like D C Bb (so again, you are changing from first inversion Bb chord to root position Bb chord, but in this case it just changes from major to minor). In this case you have two Bb chords and an F chord between them that is again the dominant of Bb. So again, you could look at Bb as a temporary tonic and you are basically just moving between tonic and dominant.

[@aandretrain5089]

This is wonderful and very informative.

[@parlomur7515]

Very good. Maybe you know The prélude Op 18 of Cesar Franck ( transcription H Bauer ).

[@MangoldProject]

Unfortunately not. Fortunately now I do :)

[@soroosha]

Are you saying that Beethoven thought of the song as individual notes? I highly doubt that lol All musicians think of notes as groups like words in sentences