Behringer CAT vs KORG ARP Odyssey: What's the difference?

[@Erdnase23]

This channel has deep content. Also you know that you're not getting a promotion dressed up as review. Much appreciated.

[@mattkaz9604]

You can cross-mod the odyssey. Feed the osc 1 to the sample and hold mixer, then mod osc 2 by the s+h mixer and you have osc 1 modding osc 2. Using that trick you can also use osc 1 as an lfo to mod the filter/ pwm of osc 2 as well.

[@TheSwircle987]

Just got an Odyssey and I've been droolin' over the Cat, so it's nice to know it wouldn't be too redundant to go ahead and adopt a Cat one day. Cheers. ^_^

[@bassnsax]

...And thank you for the idea - I'll use this approach to run the purchase past my wife! 😂😼

[@TheSwircle987]

@@bassnsax haha, know what you mean. If it weren't for me wife, I'd be trying to ride a synth to work. Hahah.

[@phpn99]

You’re the best at this on YT. It’s evident you have a visceral understanding of these machines; it shows in your skill at programming them and talking about them.

[@adastra123]

Dont own any of them , but if they are stolen from you , it was me. Loved the video. The CAT has got my interest now after this video.

[@user-yf2lk5gi7q]

The cat is by far my favorite

[@drsamurai009]

Picked up the Korg Odyssey a few years back, and I used to have The Cat back in the late 80's, early 90's. There are similarities for sure, but having the ability to mix wave forms reminded me a bit of the Roland SH-101. You could mix the waves on each oscillator so almost a dual SH-101. So The Cat has envelopes like an Odyssey and oscillators like an SH-101, more of an ARP/Roland hybrid with a lot of cross mod options. Behringer has done firmware updates on the Model D and Neutrons which made them more solid than on first release, so I may wait until the Sync function is updated. Well I hope it will be. I don't remember my old Cat sync sounding that glitchy. Fix that and I'm sold.

[@levijessegonzalez3629]

you bought a cat?

[@bassnsax]

Initially, I had written off the Cat as being somewhat similar to the Wasp...but after watching all of your Cat demo videos, this synth would be PERFECT for the Sci-Fi soundtrack flair! Cheers!

[@magusreaver]

Purrfect

[@RonCavagnaro]

Funny I'm looking thru here I just got my wasp and cat on its way, and you say it sounds like wasp, hell yeah! Wasp is huge and crazy

[@josephwright5921]

I have the Wasp and the Cat. I think the Wasp is more limited, but it is incredibly ballsy and gritty. The filter is insane and definitely covers Sci Fi territory. I think the Cat can go a gritty, but it can make a wider variety of sweet and soft sounds. I recommend anyone who has these synths pick up some patch collections. The ones at the LFO Store have been half price during Black Friday.

[@sslaytor]

Enjoyed this. Among the things you did not consider though are that the Cat is 1/2 or more smaller, lighter, no keyboard, and has a smaller throw to its sliders due to that smaller size. These affect play-ability beyond the mere similarity in sounds between two 2 oscillator synths!. As an analysis of those aspects this was terrific.

[@stevencohen5116]

Nice review, thanks!!! Had been wondering about these two synths.

[@stefpir]

Thanks for this excellent comparison Starsky ! One thing to say about the Behringer Odyssey is about the added FX. I have read some complains about it but personally I like the fact that this is only mono (funny thing, there is a pingpong delay on the provided presets which is a bit weird in mono ^^). Delay on this thing is very interesting to use (like the delay we have on the Roland SE-02) and we can thank Behringer for the ext input which can pass through those internal effects. I wish they've done that on their Deepmind synth...

[@EannaButler]

The ring-mod filtered sounds on the Arp sounded great, but damn that cross-mod sound on the Cat at 15:04 sounded great. Sidechain the filter on the Cat to a kick, you have the juciest "lead bass" sound... Great vid as ever Starsky! Thanks (y)

[@StephenMcLeod]

Glad I found yer channel. KZbin needs more of us with 'regional accents'. I've always liked Scousers (apologies if you're not actually a Scouser and now deeply offended).

[@StarskyCarr]

Why on earth would anyone be offended by being mistakenly elevated to the heady heights of being a full blooded born and bred scouser 😂😂

[@StephenMcLeod]

@@StarskyCarr I've mortally offended some folks before. Chumps! I always felt like the Scouse and the Glaswegians have a lot in common.

[@bauhnguefyische667]

I don’t have either of these two pieces in my kit, though I love the sounds they produce. I came to the same conclusion about them, The Cat has a much fuller Bass sound and the ARP has better ability as a Lead Synth because of the filters. I still prefer the 2600 over the simpler Odyssey. I do like the Cat, so it may find a home in my studio.

[@swayor]

Also the highpass on the odyssey is great for leads.

[@MikeButle]

I was listening to a Bass Station 2 video the other day and I swear I heard the Cat. Have you compared them? I'm not sure if it would be worth making a video over, but I'm debating which one to get now.

[@stevenzeeland9670]

"Don't know what use that has, but it's there" you commented. Ring mod vs. cross mod? Your playing of the Korg Odyssey is exemplary and instructive: you are a professional keyboard player! But some of us rather like and do make use of the quirky weird sounds lurking within this awesome clone of a clone! Thank you.

[@johnrichardson3297]

I didn’t know there was a similarity...

[@StarskyCarr]

Haha... and it turns out there isn’t ;). I never knew about the supposed similarities until I uploaded my unboxing and folks asked for this. I’m glad I did it... because it was fun haha !!

[@marsmediapro]

Another great video- Thank you!

[@stevehunt2125]

That cat playing the major thirds with x-mod sounds very Autobahn :)

[@klstay]

Finally got around to watching this. With the price drop to $199 the cat is even more of a steal now; I have been spending a lot of time with it lately...

[@josephwright5921]

Starsky, have you ever considered making up some patch banks and selling them through the LFO Store? You could have an additional stream of residual income so you could buy more synths, since you have so few! 😊 You seems to have a good grasp on synth architecture and sound design.

[@josephwright5921]

That is one naughty kitty, but the Odyssey seems more sonically diverse in the videos i have seen. The modules by the Big B are going to be highly collectible in their own right once they go out of production

[@LlewynDaviesTheThird]

Great comparison. Thanks

[@HominidInterneticus]

Very useful comparison. Thanks! The x-mod and the sub osc make all the difference on the cat. edit: I bought a cat! (the behr clone, not a real cat :)

[@Shred_The_Weapon]

The two forms of modulation always seemed to remind me of each other and reflect off of each other. Even knowing they aren’t the same, I’m still learning after 20 years how they’re different.

[@jeanfatale]

It's not like the Oddy has ring mod and the Cat cross mod. Just use the Oddy's s/h mixer for FM.

[@Beatamines]

i think the CAT sounds way catter :D

[@KiR_3d]

Technically a cross-mod is pretty easy! It's just a voltage injection going into an oscillator's CV-in point. There is a buffer (a passive amplifier) and few resistors. In RM you need an OTA amplifier (as far as I know this feature) plus some resistors and few capacitors (to power rails). It modulates as VCA basically. More expensive, takes more place.

[@StarskyCarr]

I assumed it was more expensive, form various reviews of kit... and why some don’t have it. Nice to finally have a technical reason :)

[@KiR_3d]

@@StarskyCarr So, my opinion is that CAT is good... only if you need sub-oscillators. The silly mistake in HSync's design makes this synth weird. Yeah, and these pot-sliders... Ugh... Why Behringer just can't go in that solid way as they started with Model D? :-| If you have a free room then probably it's better to take Odyssey and make a pretty simple mod (a small PCB with four buffers via LM224, two will be free to add another mod)... BTW, are you not have Behringer's Odyssey? I remember that you've compared them...

[@fusionistaaaa]

I love the sub mixer and modulation of the cat but I need snappy funky lines too. Many funky demos with the Odyssey but none with the Cat. Can I control filter with the keyboard velocity?

[@StarskyCarr]

You would need something that has CV keyboard out for velocity. You'd then input that to the CV filter in.

[@fusionistaaaa]

@@StarskyCarr I see, I thought the keyboard CV out would affect how the notes on the keyboard, not their velocity, impact their filter. Thanks for the answers and the great videos.

[@salathesavannah4013]

@@fusionistaaaa sorry I wasn’t very clear. The main keyboard CV out is for pitch, but for velocity you need a velocity CV output as well. I’m trying to think of something that has one tbh. The Minimoog does! But that’s rather expensive :) as these synths weren’t velocity sensitive originally they’ve not been developed with it in mind. I’d have to set them up and double check what is possible (they may be able to use standard MIDI but I don’t think so). The filter CV input allows control of the filter. But in general I’d say no it’s not possible without a more complex setup.

[@fusionistaaaa]

@@salathesavannah4013 It makes sense now. Thank you for clarifying. I can live with that limitation, especially considering the Cat is supposed to replicate a vintage synth and that's how they worked. I can do my qwak qwak velocity sensitive bass sound on my jd-xi or VST which have the Filter Velocity Sensitivity implemented. So don't sweat on it. Your content is truly fantastic for synth lovers. I ordered the Cat. It will be my first synth with no preset and one knob per function. I will then complement it with a Microfreak and then im done, promised! I am still impressed with the JD-Xi a small synth with all the classic Roland drum machines, some juno and jupiter sounds, perfect for 80s, check kzbin.info/www/bejne/n4uTZ2ywfJ59fqs if you have a minute.

[@allyhaze8300]

Thanks for this content. You are making my decision on whch b clone to buy next much simpler.

[@msxwiki]

Yeah... buy both!

[@glenesis]

Right. So I need both 😁 One down; one to go!

[@BillDerBerg]

Like the octave cat clone better than the old Oddysey

[@levijessegonzalez3629]

16:03 you adjusted the ring mod on the odyssey? omg that sounds fantastic. Can that CAT do that sound?

[@Grinchy4376]

Great review! Thanks. How did you connect the MicroKey Air to the Cat?

[@StarskyCarr]

Microkey Air is bluetooth to the laptop, CAT is MIDI to my audio interface (Focusrite Scarlett).

[@Grinchy4376]

Thanks!

[@ElectronicazMusic]

Three cheers for mental synths. HOORAY HOORAY HOORAY!!! 👐 🎶 🎹 ♥

[@GNeuman]

Brilliant review, as ever, Starsky... Just my ten cents worth... I've also got an original Mark III Odyssey and the ring mod compared to the Karp is a lot more aggressive to my ears..not sure if it is the Pratt Reed keybed on the original or the circuit design or a mixture of both but it's defo there and just makes the original that bit more of a beast... Cheers, mike

[@StarskyCarr]

Interesting, I have the pro-one which was essentially a single voice of the Prophet 5, and the FM on that blows away the new Prophet 6. Although they’re not supposed to be the same I wonder why?

[@GNeuman]

@@StarskyCarr ah, well the Prophet 6 is not a one to one copy of the Prophet 5, is it? I've got the Prophet 6 and it sounds a lot more polite to my ears than the Prophet 5 but I've only tried a Prophet 5 very briefly and a long time ago...

[@mauriciomandara5946]

Ring mod on the Karp is digital... You can look that up at the specs on the Arp korg page ... weird

[@ShadeGrauenhaft]

@@mauriciomandara5946 In the 70's, the ARP Odyssey ring mod was also digital. But not digital ring mod like nowadays, digital vintage.

[@johnpaulpatton9786]

Listening to your description of the layout of these two synths made me realize that my MiniBrute 2S has many similarities to both of these.

[@alexmeeres5072]

I noticed that too.

[@Heavy_Distortion]

Both sound better than Pro 3. Sorry if I hurt your feelings.

[@princeandyonane8946]

Who?

[@josephwright5921]

@@princeandyonane8946 The Behringer Haters and DSI Lovers

[@RealityShiftUK]

I’m starting to think the cat might be the best behringer mono synth

[@s3nsec0rruptr80]

Doesn't the wasp have a loopable envelope?

[@StarskyCarr]

Yeah, you’re right. I couldn’t think of one off the top of my head. It’s only an ADR though... as is the second. Unlike the CAT they are quite unique, and don’t appear to be similar to the Odyssey... which is the point I was clumsily trying to get across.

[@Johanthegnarler]

Took me a long time to even consider the CAT because of the overlap with other mono synths. But I'm hearing some tones in recent videos that I'm really digging. May hope for a discounted unit one day.

[@ogasi1798]

did they use their cem3340 in the cat? i do wonder when listening to the sync

[@stevehunt2125]

I wouldn't be surprised. I built a synth with a couple of 3340s in and my sync does that!

[@StarskyCarr]

That’s a good point. I wonder.... :)

[@DestroyER82]

@@StarskyCarr In their product description is written "Authentic reproduction of original CAT SRM II circuitry with matched transistors and JFETs".

[@robertdoom8331]

SRM II was redesigned to use the Curtis oscillators chip to reduce mfg costs.

[@FrankNobelMusic]

wow the Cat is a lot brighter!

[@boogiefunkproductions2368]

For all the Behringer critics this proves synth companies have always been "ripping off" other synth companies.

[@jeanfatale]

And threatening to sue users that mention the copying, ridiculing negative reviewers with the aid of caricatures etc?

[@21gexperiment]

@@jeanfatale probably, if they'd had the internet!

[@jeanfatale]

​@@21gexperiment Well, why would anyone do that, even Behringer? Doesn't seem reasonable, but for some reason, they did it. Don't see why anyone else should, though. Like Octave suing someone who is complaining over their synth being a clone of Arp Oddy and that they should do something new. I really don't see it.

[@21gexperiment]

@@jeanfatale To be honest who cares, it shouldn't be any of our business, the problem these days is everything is over-politicised, and over scrutinised.

[@jeanfatale]

@@21gexperiment If a company threatens to sue you for critizing them, that's everyone's business.

[@eichisama]

Video description is wrong - Behringer CAT vs ARP Odyssey (you wrote Behringer Odyssey vs ARP...)

[@StarskyCarr]

Wow.. and the prize goes to.... :) well spotted thanks.

[@ACIDGREENTECHNO]

so if you`ve had to choose a/b what would you take? odyssey or cat?

[@StarskyCarr]

Hmmm.. :). I really like the faux sequences you can get going on the CAT, but for me the ring mod sells the Odyssey - its more useful.... aargh although the FM is great on the CAT...stop asking daft questions. haha. If there was a full sized keyboard CAT it may well push the Odyssey out.

[@SabcatPrinting]

Great vid thanks. I'm still undecided which one lol. I think space is going to dictate the Cat.

[@emdotambient]

Funny, but when you listen to the raw oscillators on these, the Cat sounds closer to the Oddy than it does to the original Cat (as heard in your other video).

[@Pighood]

CAT all the way

[@ashatur2069]

Oh thx :-D

[@st0rmchild]

Definitely makes sense to compare the two. The original Cat was clearly based on the ARP Odyssey, though it did have some of its own twists. Dave Spiers posted a good overview of the Cat several years ago: kzbin.info/www/bejne/bWjWZJWZn7Rnobc

[@fjfrancois]

👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

[@DaraM73]

Controversial!

[@lundsweden]

The Odyssey is a lot bigger.... just saying!

[@wombra8314]

compare the price

[@StarskyCarr]

No-one needs a demo for that. This is about the synth architecture and the tones they can create.

[@wombra8314]

Starsky Carr lolol thx for being minoritychan not hating on the B. was jk, cool relevant comparison from old times reborn. weird seeing the same discussion again, but with clones.

[@StarskyCarr]

Nice cat. (In your photo) one of mine is in hospital after being knocked over.. fingers crossed, but it’s been a couple of weeks. And yes, weird that I’m comparing 2 1970’s synths that we’re both manufactured in the last few mi the!! I wish I’d have mentioned that!!!

[@wombra8314]

Starsky Carr oh my blesses! i hope he/she can come back home to the fam. 🙏🏼 really sorry to hear. 🥺 (and thank you much, that is wombra, minus some years now)

[@noisynois1670]

la version mini

[@stergiost.6246]

nice comparison but korg is much louder...

[@DerekPower]

It would be a patent infringement, not copyright.

[@StarskyCarr]

yeah I know... realised in the edit but wasn't going to remake it! Sometimes your mouth says stuff..

[@DerekPower]

Starsky Carr Then again, I don’t blame you as you had to deal with copyrights more than patents =]

[@couchcamperTM]

@@DerekPower ;- ) filter sweep in 3, 2, 1...

[@dr.feelicks2051]

Freudian

[@BillDerBerg]

The sync is cleaner on the Oddysey though

[@StarskyCarr]

Yeah, although its similar, the CAT hasn't quite got the same sound.