Believe It Or Not 5.12a X Second Ascent | Headpointing in The Gunks

Today we get the second ascent of a bit of an obscurity on the Workout Wall in the Gunks. I talk about contradictory and strange headpointing ethics, the process of breaking a route down over months, climbing over tensioned hooks and eventually trying so hard on the sharp end your hands and feet get covered in blood blisters the next day.
Supported by Arizona Mountaineering Gear arizonamountai...
Listen to The Ground Up Podcast here:
podcasts.apple...
open.spotify.c...
Check out their instagram @listentogroundup

[@mariesidman7905]

If I had 2 belayers I'd just get short-roped twice.

[@okzsub949]

Usually people simply climb on half ropes (doubles) but I guess it's harder to find someone capable of that than recruit two separate people to handle the ropes lol

[@headpointhandbook]

Lmfao I was lucky to not be pulled to my untimely death by any belayers that day. Both did amazing and I really thank them for belaying a lead that intense.

[@chopsjazz1]

You don't have to answer to anyone for your ethics. Live your life, climb your climbs.

[@headpointhandbook]

Yea man, it's all made up. Hoping to talk about my personal style in an interesting and engaging way.

[@okzsub949]

Great send Eric and a bold route for sure! It is my opinion that the style in which you climb a route is secondary to telling the truth as to how you accomplished it. Knee pad to aid the RP? Tell us. Using a coat hanger to fishhook a tiny nut on Diamond in the Rough? Tell us that ;) Pink pointed because you fell the first go and wanted to call it day but got back up the courage to lead with the advantage of time savings not placing gear? Cool with me. Was it fun and challenging? Great job! Arguing over the best style devolves into all these ridiculous and unjustifiable nuances because, after all, what we are doing is absurd anyway. How many people climb the easier second pitch to the top of the cliff to claim the full ascent of the route (as traditionally a route at the Gunks is not a route if it doesn't top out.) Not that you really need to climb the cliff to get to the top, as evidenced by all the casual Sunday hikers up on the Millbrook Ridge Trail enjoying the same view we struggle to, for far less risk! One thing I'd be interested in hearing is your opinion on the protection ratings on these climbs AFTER having the tremendous benefit of hanging around to sus out all the very best, precise gear placements. For example, after Mabrey's FFA on Thumb's Up I commented how it was certainly NOT an X-rated climb considering the gear he was able to plug in. I'd argue it looked PG-13 at best and not even R with the nest of 3 pieces he had at the crux. Fracchia commented that they would keep the rating at X because that is what it would be "to anyone attempting a ground up onsight of the route". Ground up, onsight being (in my opinion) the purest form you can really hope for in the silly game we play out there in the woods, this kind of made sense to me. The official protection rating being X for that reason, yet could be brought down to something safer with careful study of every inch of rock. I wonder what routes out there would still qualify as X under headpoint tactics? Rings of Saturn at Millbrook, likely, and many others there perhaps.

[@headpointhandbook]

Hey Mike, I think you hit it on the head. I hope I don't come off like I'm trying to justify my own style, rather than just explaining the style I like to climb in. It's all meaningless as long as you're honest. Just to avoid any nonsense with my own personal logging of routes, I simply go by guidebook grades and protection ratings. Protection ratings are meant specifically for onsight attempts so you don't get sandbagged into serious injury if you are attempting an onsight. With the elimination of the PG13 grade in the gunks, the "R" grade has become wildly varied, from just-about-G to as-close-to-X-as-possible. Again, just to avoid all the nonsense and nuance of it, I go by the assigned guidebook grade and realize some routes are just more dangerous than others. This goes with the physical difficulty as well, a very select few routes are soft, and most of them are just all over the place. I take the suggested grade and move on. I do find the X-rated routes generally remain X even with headpointing tactics. In terms of Thumbs Up, I'd probably agree, but since the gear is so specific(pre-rigged anchor, red ball nut, invisible brassie and tiny 000s) I think X is a very fair onsight grade for that, but a rare route that headpointing brings the X down considerably. PG13 is probably appropriate. Many of the other X routes I've climbed I would say remain X, even if I have safely fallen on some of them, and that may be by luck. Hit me up let's climb this fall.

[@taitcitarella7062]

Great work! That looks absolutely terrifying!

[@headpointhandbook]

It was horrendous lol

[@stephenhanselmann3443]

seeing a video of how the holds are and pro sits is really awesome, you dont get that content very often. Keep it up!

[@headpointhandbook]

Thanks! All of our films include this, check them out!

[@yawningdog9894]

Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality Open your eyes, look up to the skies and see I'm just a poor boy, I need no sympathy Because I'm easy come, easy go Little high, little low Any way the wind blows doesn't really matter to me, to me Mama, just killed a man Put a gun against his head, pulled my trigger, now he's dead Mama, life had just begun But now I've gone and thrown it all away Mama, ooh, didn't mean to make you cry If I'm not back again this time tomorrow Carry on, carry on as if nothing really matters Too late, my time has come Sends shivers down my spine, body's aching all the time Goodbye, everybody, I've got to go Gotta leave you all behind and face the truth Mama, ooh (any way the wind blows) I don't wanna die I sometimes wish I'd never been born at all I see a little silhouetto of a man Scaramouche, Scaramouche, will you do the Fandango? Thunderbolt and lightning, very, very frightening me (Galileo) Galileo, (Galileo) Galileo, Galileo Figaro, magnifico But I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me He's just a poor boy from a poor family Spare him his life from this monstrosity Easy come, easy go, will you let me go? بِسْمِ ٱللَّٰهِ No, we will not let you go (let him go) بِسْمِ ٱللَّٰهِ We will not let you go (let him go) بِسْمِ ٱللَّٰهِ We will not let you go (let me go) Will not let you go (let me go) Will not let you go (never, never, never, never let me go) No, no, no, no, no, no, no Oh, mamma mia, mamma mia

[@taitcitarella7062]

You talked about how you like to complete areas, how much of the trapps as a whole would you say you’ve done, and do you think you’d be able to complete a guidebook? I went there for the first time last weekend and walked the half an hour out to arrow and high e with my jaw on the floor the whole way , gawking at with 200+ feet of cliff on my left that never seemed to stop. It seemed like there was enough climbing for many lifetimes!

[@philipvondra5010]

vVry cool congrats ! it looks like a great line. I need to try it. Like the double ropes, I think you fell it would have a better pull angle on the gear.

[@headpointhandbook]

Junk through the low stuff but the mid crux is at least worth a TR rip!

[@3000SethG]

Congrats on that it looks truly frightening at the crux and the crux does seem to be independent so it is legit- when I was next to you in April while you were working this, it seemed like such a waste of time to me because literally for the first half it seems like you can just reach over to the holds on To Be or Not to Be. Seemed like such a squeeze job even for the Gunks… but watching this it does look like a cool thing I will never never do. Also is the Number Two you place the same one as ToBe? Couldn’t quite tell from the vid.

[@headpointhandbook]

The real hero that day was you gearing up for To Be, the king line. This route is junk and fairly contrived through the bottom, but the mid crux and up is very sick and worth doing at least on TR if you're over there again. A lot of fun! I think it does actually rank as the most dangerous route I've ever climbed, so I definitely wouldn't recommend leading it. Yes, it is the same #2, it sits slightly higher than the #3 and gave me an extra foot of comfort. The best link-up on this wall would probably be low To Be, into mid Believe, into high To Be crux, for the most sustained and coolest mash up of cruxes.

[@DanA-bt7dr]

Hell yeah new HH!

[@headpointhandbook]

Hell yea! More to come.

[@DanA-bt7dr]

@@headpointhandbook Looking forward to it. I'm pretty much all caught up. I actually also just finished the whole podcast episode on my drive. I love nerding out about gear, but I'm also from bouldering origins and I'm a big Moonboard fan. I strongly believe that bouldering/board climbing is essential to becoming a strong trad climber. I loved the stories on the episode, but was hoping to hear more about your training. KZbin doesn't really need anymore training content though!

[@johnsullivan873]

you cant just take the #3 out and plug it back in, because that would mean you would be carrying less weight on your harness, and therefore would be aid?

[@maybesomaybenot]

yea bro its for sure aid cant do that if u want the send! in all seriousness tho sick vid nice work getting this thing and appreciate the acknowledgement that ethics and styles have some level of just being contrived and personal and I dig your style!

[@headpointhandbook]

Hey, it's so stupid, but yea, it matters to me to carry all the gear. I wouldn't call it aid, just a redpoint with a minor asterisk haha