We Need To Talk About Age of Empires 2.

[@BellularNews]

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[@ArawnOfAnnwn]

@@SirHighsaacNewton Yes how wrong it is for people to expect money for the work they put in...

[@tictacterminator]

No one wants more vertical expansions that wont ever deliver its promises or be maintained you shill Screw the Battle for Greece

[@roxaskinghearts]

age of empire deletes old games and sells new ones so dont trust anything xbox sells because you dont own

[@jeusmarcomascarina4102]

If only blizzard warcraft reforged this year became like this.

[@scrublord09]

To be clear, Microsoft DID try to kill our AoE community multiple times but talented individuals of the community made us our own platform to play on and balance the game. It wasn't until after we kept playing without them for 15 years that they came back.

[@boogie5]

tru tru

[@thargs9184]

AoE 3 was the problem I would say, it told Microsoft that RTS were failing..but the issue was that beside the single player campaign, the game wasnt much

[@alexy2952]

To be fair, WC3 had its custom maps and campaigns made by the community that kept the game alive.

[@Bagginsess]

w3champions hopefully will lead wc3 down that road.

[@d4mephisto]

@@scrublord09 true and real!

[@DiluviumEyesofThunder]

Age of Empires 2, in my opinion, is to strategy games what chess is to board games, not the most flashy or popular, but it's simple and easy to grasp ruleset make it universal, and timeless.

[@cristhianmlr]

I don't know how to chess lmao

[@dennisaskeland5870]

Age and hom3 should be conserved

[@nekhumonta]

Not at all. It's one of the more complex games.

[@bewawolf19]

@@nekhumonta Not really. I'd argue it managed to correctly mixed both simplicity and depth. If you ever read the original Ensemble Studios strategies and secrets companion book, they have a decent blurb describing how from the very beginning they wanted a game that could both facilitate players down to children who might be more focused on making a pretty base with little mechanical knowledge up to high level players who played extremely competently and wanted a challenge. It is just AOE II is one of the rare examples of that being done successfully.

[@wtfduud]

@@cristhianmlr You can learn it in 5 minutes

[@xGoodOldSmurfehx]

This is a bit wrong. Microsoft tried to kill of Age of Empires 2 and it's community several times. The AoE2 community said "No, piss off." every time. Microsoft eventually realised that they were better off continuing and expanding on the game rather than trying to kill it. The Definitive Edition now is nothing like the original version even post-patching. It has been expanded by more than 10 folds. The reason the game is enduring is it's community that refuses to give in to Microsoft's demands over the years. Microsoft knows full and well that they have lost the fight against the AoE2 community and that they are not going to win a fight with them no matter what they do. It's just like the Red Alert 2 community that refuses to die off despite EA's best attempts to kill it off.

[@halofreak1990]

Now, if only EA would see the light and remaster RA2 like they did with C&C and RA1...

[@mattshu]

sorry i haven't been in the know but what are they doing to kill it off

[@DKNguyen3.1415]

@@mattshu And what exactly are they doing to not allow Microsoft to just kill it off? Not buy the game that Microsoft wants to stop selling in the first place?

[@fcmnlop]

@@DKNguyen3.1415 create their own multiplayer platform (Voobly) that also allow pirated version that anyone can get with a few clicks. The platform still exists today.

[@justincronkright5025]

Now, just thanks for passing the buck off to us in AoE III... very nice! Not that I've been there that long, but I actually KIND OF moved from II to III.

[@KruxSmash]

That last bit really hits home. We use to pay for games/content, now we pay for useless skins to maintain the lackluster games we play.

[@shadowninja6689]

Agreed. The last part of the video is exactly why I've been saying for years that I WANT to pay $150+ dollars for good games that I know won't have any micro-transactions or loot boxes to ruin the fun. In my opinion the industry's insistence on sticking with the $60 price point for 3+ decades is exactly why modern video games have become such garbage designed to sell loot boxes and micro-transactions instead of just being a fun game.

[@TheConnoiseurofTheArtofSnort]

Interestingly, there's a lot of talk that age of empires 2 has too much playable civilisations now and it's too overwhelming and complicated for new players. Instead of more dlcs, many people have suggested that regional skins are added to the game so that people can support that way and devs keep doing balance updates

[@missitheachievementhuntres560]

It is why I almost exclusively play indie games. They don’t have loot boxes and try to make the best game they can with a small team. I found so much passion and eye for details in indie games which brought back my love for games.

[@egmccann]

We also used to go to a store and buy a box, and if there had to be a patch, it was a slow download over dialup. If someone had tried to sell "skins" then... heh.

[@ArawnOfAnnwn]

@@TheConnoiseurofTheArtofSnort You don't need any of those DLCs. They're all pure content additions, the game works fine without them.

[@Matjo7588dk]

AOE2 DE was a success because the players kept the game alive through voobly ( A free browser page used to run AOE2 ) for years. When Microsoft did nothing with it. Then people like T90 Official hosted AOE2 tournaments on Voobly. getting 50.000+ viewers. And AOE2 streams having a healthy viewership as well on average. First Microsoft tried with AOE2 HD. It sucked. And people still used voobly. Then came DE. And this is not an attack on Microsoft. They have done well ( despite the fact they still have not fixed matchmaking or game finding ) But seeing the fans keeping the game alive, and then choosing to step back in. Is good. However. Its all because of Voobly, and the players and caster who ran the game and tournaments, for many years. That is why Age of Empires 2 DE is a success.

[@hippocratesm.d.1543]

Amen to that!

[@questionsimposed]

Amen

[@Aethelhald]

Could you explain why AoE 2 HD sucked? I recall enjoying it quite a lot, but admittedly I only played single player, never multiplayer. I'm not doubting you or looking to start an argument by the way - I genuinely want to know why it failed to win over the AoE 2 community at the time.

[@Matjo7588dk]

@@Aethelhald Sure. First I want to make the note that its not as much as a personal view, but more a general one. Also seen by the fact that the Voobly people/players did not leave voobly to go play HD, the new HD was worse than the old private voobly. Part of that because HD did not really bring anything new. It was mostly just upgrading graphics to HD. Where DE not only upgraded graphics, but also brought new things to the game ( For better or worse I might add, autofarm for once should not be in the game :p ) HD seem like they just took the old game, changed some graphics and then put it out. It was not done with care, or quality. So there was a lot of bugs. And it was super laggy. If you played MP and competitive, it was almost impossible to play. This was the main reason it never gained success. Because what has kept AOE2 alive in the voobly days was ranked games, and the pro scene. And HD could not be used for that really.

[@Aethelhald]

@@Matjo7588dk Fair enough. I guess I can see why it failed then. I'm much more familiar with the failed AoE 1 DE. The one they inexplicably released exclusively on the Microsoft Store, ensuring that most people wouldn't buy it because STEAM is far superior with its workshop. Not to mention that the AI was broken beyond belief, to the point that if you played on a map with any water whatsoever (even a tiny pool) it would make the AI so retarded that it wouldn't even advanced past the first age. And the horrendous pathfinding that took a month to fix. And the overall bizarre decision to leave the atrocious AoE 1 unit collision intact, so armies of more than 2 people would constantly get jammed together and be unable to move as a group.

[@romangeneral23]

This was my first RTS game all the way back in the 90s. Great game...

[@mediumvillain]

not my first but i certainly played the hell out of it

[@XBluDiamondX]

Yeah, I played a lot of 2v2 back in the day when MSN Gaming Zone existed. Fun times. Unfortunately, too many sweaty tryhards kind of made the fun wane for me back then after a number of years, but I enjoyed it .

[@dustinherk8124]

Mine was the first one. the demo specifically, where you start with one wololo boy and nothing else, gotta convert your starting villager to get started. good times. good memories. could only get too the 3rd age though. very good for a demo.

[@rogerwilco2]

I go back to Dune and Warcraft.

[@Aethelhald]

Mine was AoE 1. I think I was around 11. It's what kickstarted a lifelong fascination/obsession with history (especially ancient history). It's so immersive. When you start a new game and you have your three little dudes and a dark world that has to be discovered tile by tile, and the soundtrack "cave" is playing that sounds like a mixture of primitive drums and whoops that sound like noises a party of early hunters would use to signal to one another, man, it felt like I was right there at the dawn of human civilization with them.

[@gishathosaurus6828]

Age of Empires is fucking killing it right now... I just wish they kept the rotting skeletons in the battlefield! I know it's a little nitpick, but it's a small little detail that gives this army game so much immersion. Still, good on them though, wish Blizzard did the same instead of letting Starcraft down on life support

[@oossgl]

I think there is a mod for that, to add more blood, to keep the corpses and/or skeletons

[@Gnollface]

That was really well put, ive never thought about it like that before: ""if you earn money buy selling people skins, then skins will be the thing you optimize around. If you earn money buy selling content, content will be the thing you optimize around."

[@buildinasentry1046]

Age 1 through 3 (including Myth) were my childhood. Having all these wonderful remasters is such a gift. Still play them with my brother and father, alternating games as we see fit.

[@rileydavidson207]

Me and my father played them. We didn't have 1 but I remember playing 2, Mythology, and 3. I remember learning how to play the game by loading into my dad's saves to see what he was doing, to then copy what he was doing in mine.

[@Peglegkickboxer]

I wish EA would put this kind of love into their games. They are sitting on a gold mine of a ton of RTS titles (C&C, C&CRA, simcity, etc). We got something but it's more half ass broken releases.

[@Sinnehh]

Honestly T90s youtube channel of random game modes and pros in this game helped keep my eyes on it for years. Got love how his forest nothing video basicly went viral and he became person to show case AoE2 games.

[@grayire]

Agree i found his channel earlier this year and the smallest map series reignited my love for it

[@xrayjohnson6972]

Yeah, T90 deserves a ton of credit IMO. There are tons of people like myself who stumbled into a random T90 video, watched the classics like Blue Coffee and then got back into the game because it looked like fun. The community is also just lovely in general.

[@whuzzzup]

Agreed. In my opinion T90 is responsible for resurrecting the community/game. Yes there were others before him, but he blew up. One day (long before DE) for whatever reason I had this AoE2 video in my recommended videos so I watched it because I played that game when it came out. Needless to say I have been watching his videos ever since and see myself as part of the (wider) community (I don't play multiplayer because it stresses me out too much).

[@ArawnOfAnnwn]

@@whuzzzup T90 wouldn't have been able to do anything if not for the people who kept the game going via Voobly. They're the ones who kept the game going in the first place, for streamers to then make content about.

[@whuzzzup]

​@@ArawnOfAnnwn I agree they kept the game alive, no doubts about that and should definitely be recognized - but I think the big turnaround was T90 blowing up on YT/Twitch. Before that the game was basically a very small niche running under everyone's radar (it's still a niche though of course, but I think you understand what I mean).

[@tzeneth]

That end part just makes me think of all the hidden skins you had to do crazy things to unlock. I remember some fighting game skins being the equivalent of old myths because of how weird they were to unlock and you weren't sure the people were telling the truth.

[@supercyberdigi]

hey! did you know you can unlock nitros oxide in the original crash team racing? you just gotta beat all of his time trials and then use this secret code to play as him... and other lies we were told.

[@grifinorange]

Aoe2 still being big floors me. I love the game i just couldnt have dreamed that a community would crop up around a 25 year old game albeit a heavily updated/modified version of it.

[@nevernerevarine8071]

For those in the back who couldn't hear: SMALL TEAMS, DEFINED SCOPE & REASONABLE EXPECTATIONS!

[@JT-mt6ku]

Its not that companies dont want to hire people passionate about their games its that they dont want to pay them. Everything is outsourced to studios full of unskilled employees pumped out on a conveyer belt who will work grueling hours for next to nothing.

[@elduquecaradura1468]

Imagine Bethesda, Mojang, between others hiring modders (of the bests mods) to improve their bests games like ES Skyrim or Minecraft. Damn, things would skyrocket

[@hutlazzz]

hmm dev studio are generally well paid in 2024 tho

[@Maxarcc]

I just got into this game. There's incredible depth and there are so many unique challenges to overcome. When you play online it will be difficult in the beginning, but try to learn from your mistakes and don't give up! It's such an amazing and rewarding game.

[@YLLPal]

The modder to paid developer pipeline has to be one of the coolest ways to keep a game sincere and fun and keep the community engaged.

[@PierceArner]

13:05 _“If something is free, it means YOU ARE THE PRODUCT.”_ This right here flawlessly captures the deep loathing of everything about the Live Service industry & gacha models worming their way into the games industry. I'm beyond utterly sick of them because it proves that the game is merely a psychologically exploitive monetization model to extract whatever money it can from its userbase, _rather than provide them with something of ACTUAL VALUE._ We're happy to pay for games that treat us and the game property with respect - not one that treat us & the IP as a commodity to be bled dry until our love for the product turns to ash in our mouths (see: Overwatch 2).

[@MoonLitChild]

Yes! And the line about how post-launch resources in games used to go into improving the game, but all that goes to now are cosmetics. The kids these days have no idea. Before cosmetics became the focus, DLC had to stand on its own, it had to improve the over all experience otherwise it wasn't worth our money, in a time when all DLC itself felt innately scammy. Now the game itself sits there in a barely playable state, but you can spend a fortune for all the lipstick you could possibly imagine putting on that pig....

[@Trazynn]

You should talk about Heroes of the Storm. Since the acquisition it has slowly started receiving balance updates again. After years of silence.

[@Trazynn]

It's also still a masterpiece of innovative gameplay and creative ideas. Aged particularly well.

[@tvctaswegia497]

I've restarted playing it casually. The changes are pretty good.

[@Milosz0pl]

damn. I thought it was just dead and stale now you got me interested

[@GozuTenno962]

is it really time for me to dust off my old heroes of the storm account?

[@blackhammer5035]

Dang, I don't need much of an excuse to revisit HotS.

[@foxdeleon]

The captions say Age of Vampires 😅 I'd want to play that too.

[@GegoXaren]

Imagine a poop-post expansion called that? Lots of jokes and humour... "Sparkling Vampires" and "Buff Warewolves".

[@vileluca]

Holy crap imagine an Age game based off gothic horror?

[@Handepsilon]

I'm certain that's actually a mod I saw once

[@Synthonym]

​@@vilelucavampires, werewolves, ghosts, zombies.... I'd play the shit out of that

[@mashek331]

There actually is an Age of Vampires mod on Age of Kings Heaven lol. It's suitably creepy, but was designed for the original 1.0c in mind.

[@robhagmeier3405]

"They treated an IP that players love and respect with love and respect." This is one of the greatest and most true things I've ever heard about this game. You summed up the AoE community, the multitude of developers, and the company behind it all in one beautiful, perfect sentence. Amazing video, thank you!

[@Christian_Bagger]

Another bump in the road was: They released AoE1 in the AoE2 client, and even though you had paid for the AoE1 EE that was now dead, you still had to purchase the the same game in the AoE2 client. That didn’t go well with the fan base either, but overall they’ve done great!

[@LMan8787]

Age of Empires II DE is one of the best remasters to date, hands down. I wanted the orginal AoE DE to be just as good, but it wasn't even close. They kept the overall UI and such a little too "true" to the actual original.

[@ArawnOfAnnwn]

Well they wanted to draw in the Vietnamese playerbase of that game, which is huge. But those guys are just too happy with the old game just as it is to be enticed by any kind of remaster.

[@hutlazzz]

diablo 2 remaster sold over 5 milion copies, while Aoe2 about 2.5 to 6.5m. Debatable wich the best definitive-remaster

[@LMan8787]

@ I’ve been playing D2R since its release. Which is one of the other best remasters to date. Along with FFVII. And StarCraft. They’re all the fantastic in terms of execution, which is why I said “one” of the best, not “the” best.

[@crymurogue]

After playing this game 24 years ago for the first time, I decided to try it out again a year ago. Just for nostalgia. This is when I learned that there's actually a very cool community, people are still playing multiplayer and even though a player base is 'low' - you still find a ranked game 1v1 within 2 minutes. I must say, one of the greatest games ever made. Still so fun.

[@westsidermetalhead4997]

Age of Empires 2 and Red Alert 2 were my first RTS games back in the mid 2000s and they taught me what gaming is, how should a quality game and campaign look like, feel like. AoE 2 also introduced me to global history, igniting a spark and thus creating me into the history nerd I am today.

[@ethans2393]

It makes me so happy seeing Age of Empires not just survive, but thrive.

[@poppyrider5541]

'If you're my age you're foolish......' Chefs kiss. I've been playing StarCraft since it came out at the young age off 12. I have physical copies of SC:BW, WOL, HotS and LotV. I have never played Nova. If they released a hard copy it would be sitting on my self with the others.

[@liammc4731]

Man, I heard that as "if you're my age, you're full of sh*t". I had to go back and listen again after I read your comment, but you were right, he definitely said "foolish" lol 😂

[@gnomer87]

I can recommend Nova. It's a good 8 or so hours of traditional campaigning.

[@DarthMalnu]

You gotta give Nova a try. For me it's how sc2 should have felt from the beginning. Really cool ideas in that wee campaign.

[@cromcccxvi3787]

1999 I played this, stopped when I moved and took a new job----- 15yrs ago, I didn't know they still had a community. RTS has always been one of my favorite gendres. I was ranked top 300 global in Red Alert II for awhile

[@WayStedYou]

RA2 is still active too.

[@rp18125]

not only do they still have a community but it's growing, the game got much better and numbers on twitch and youtube are getting bigger and bigger, foreign investment on tournaments and sponsors such as Red Bull are getting in.

[@TheChristOOv]

I think the trouble with Starcraft was that the goal was E-sports. The campaign and upgrading units and everything single player was superb, the best there has ever been in an RTS IMO. But post launch you could essentially replay it on a harder difficulty and try different updrage routes or play multiplayer. And if you don't enjoy playing multiplayer, you were done with quality content. AoE2 has done a really good job at making good campaigns for single player, with an interesting Civ to play multiplayer, if you want that. Plus, they went back and have overhauled the older Civs which were lacking - for free! (In comparison, CA dosen't really go back to old stuff unless that Faction is in an upcoming DLC - leaving parts of the game woefully lackluster, although they are trying to change this)

[@Gideon_Mirage]

Starcraft 1 WAS remade is SC2. This mod is called Mass Recall.

[@scottevensen2615]

Was just gonna post. Mass Recall is a brilliant mod! Brood War is such a fun campaign even 25+ years later, especially with the SC2 upgrades 👍

[@peytoncappelle7688]

It’s a little buggy and has balance issues but imagine if it was given support; it would be phenomenal

[@maynk7096]

My Dad introduced me to AOE 1 back in 2003, I have great early memories with AOE 1, 2 and 3. I'm glad to witness the second wind for the franchise.

[@saphironkindris]

I've said for years that Starcraft 2 should do exactly this with many of it's community projects. There is a pretty decently large but scattered modding community that would benefit greatly from direction and funding imo.

[@joaoteixeira8349]

good luck with that lmao. after League of Legends, Blizzard has tried to have as much control as possible on mods, which pisses the modders off. until they free the editor, sc2 mod scene will never take off properly (like wc3)

[@theeutecticpoint]

15:06- HAHAHAHAHA YES! That is the single best phrasing of that principle that I've yet encountered, well done sir! It's an excellent corollary to "if the game is free then YOU are the product".

[@markumoeder]

Wow, who ever thought that gamers needed to defend their games against Big-Corpo in order to have an un-capitalized, micro-transactional free good time... The age old issue: Step 1: Create a problem... Step 2: Capitalize upon the problem you've created.

[@Madoxbeatbox]

I love AoE2 ever since it got released. When I heard, that people still play it, in 2022 I gave it a shot and I can’t stop playing ranked games ever since! It‘s not flashy, it‘s not with stupid skins and that’s exactly what I love about it. It is fun, I don’t stop learning new strategies even after +1k hours of playing it and the community with all the creators and gamers is simply amazing!

[@knamliss]

I'm usually a lurker, but the rant at least bit of this video is so fucking true. We really are the product in a f2p game. You cooked

[@matthewkeating-od6rl]

The viper!! He is alot of fun to watch as an e sport on KZbin

[@SecurityDivision]

So much memories playing multiplayer AOE on school computers network :) The school allowed us to use computer room when there will be no more classes in there. We used to memorize the hours when last class would finish and wait there to grab a computer and play :)

[@hbarudi]

Nice of your school to let you play the game on school computers...

[@TheAmericanPrometheus]

After having played AoE2 as a little kid, and then rediscovering the game for myself and getting back into it about 15-ish years ago, it cannot be understated just how revolutionary that original Age of Forgotten Empires mod was at the time. Sure there were other mods before it, but adding new civilizations (as opposed to just replacing existing ones) was the big breakthrough that inspired Cysion to begin AoFE, and it drove the hype for the project through the roof.

[@Deoxsen]

As someone who plays Persia mountain royals was pretty decent and gave Persians a good buff making them a good choice in certain game modes

[@zeroyuki92]

Mountain Royals is just a bit overpriced

[@strider8662]

Mountain Royals senarios were amazing tbh. It was just a little overpriced.

[@DuVtrell]

AoE3/DE is a gem that doesn't get the respect it deserves.

[@volcanic_sloth]

it's too unintuitive to really get into and also lacks a tutorial campaign that explains everything well

[@TokurErdem]

3 was garbagw

[@buildinasentry1046]

@@DuVtrell 3 is such a banger. I play the remaster often, fantastic game

[@lettuceman9439]

@@TokurErdemany rts having more than 1 civ or set in the early modern era

[@Silentpoppy]

agreed i really loved 3 xD

[@Alkhalim]

Have to admit, the way people talk about Chronicles: BfG so far feels damn good.

[@R4hdoo07]

Time to re-install Age ov'Empires 2!

[@karnazacss]

As an AoE2 only player and watcher, thank you.

[@alexwild760]

I don't know why recent DLCs are so negatively perceived. I genuinely like Rome, Georgia and Armenia as civs. The AoE1 port was much needed, since the AoE2 engine is 10x better and makes me revisit the original game sometimes. Mountain Royals campaigns are also as good as always. Victors and Vanquished has some tedious, long campaigns but some really fun ones too. Battle for Greece seems so fun to play and I'm a big fan of anachronic gameplay, mixing classical, medieval and almost-modern civs.

[@xbujie_9453]

Bell, you're damn right, gaming should always be about content, not bloody skins.

[@Zeverinsen]

*You're completely right.* When they know they can fool the majority of the consumers, they no longer care. You see it everywhere, from video games to designer bags and cars. They might make things more accessible, but then they also make it more expensive AND of lesser quality than it used to be. They're cutting corners, but if you weren't there to see the corners before they got cut, you'll think that's the norm. Yeah, my old PS2 games might have shit quality in comparison to what we have now, but at least they has quality storytelling and gameplay (for the mad part), and I have them on a physical disc. I paid to own and play a physical product of an expected quality, which is what the transaction used to be. No wonder I don't like buying new games anymore... _I'd rather buy a cartridge for my DS or something at this point._

[@eduardoborges506]

age of empires 2 is the example of, when a game is good, nothing else matters.

[@LeeRenthlei]

Age of Mythology Retold is amazing as well. Microsoft is doing a great job.

[@ugriDnuub]

AoE II is a very special game and it's alive solely because of it's diehard community. I don't play anymore, but I sometimes watch tournaments

[@riekopo7638]

Return of Rome is still missing campaigns and DE is still missing the decaying corpses/skeletons of the original.

[@Horatio-sj2es]

Skeletons are taboo in china so it is likely excluded on purpose

[@FloosWorld_AoE]

@@Horatio-sj2es No, that's not the reason. AoE 2 HD can be still legally purchased in China with no altered visuals. Same with AoE 1 DE that has a classic mode with the old decay.

[@nomcognom2332]

I miss the decay and rotten of the corpses too.

[@jarik7658]

Age rating systems change over time. It could be the case that HD just released before that change of what China allows.

[@FloosWorld_AoE]

@@jarik7658 Skeletons are still in DE's game files, they just used as scenario editor objects now

[@Erometal]

The mobile game that released a few days ago is a super disappointment

[@apollodingo3583]

Aren’t all mobile games disappointing

[@VLarraechea]

That’s not a true Age of Empires game. It’s just a mobile excuse for milking money out of players.

[@Erometal]

Yeah but a lot of mobile games are great. Halls of torment, vampire survivors, brotato ect. mobile games can be so much more than micro transaction riddled crap but they don’t care about that market to care enough. But there are mobile games that are amazing. Just hard to find

[@Erometal]

I’m glad to see it’s getting bad ratings on the App Store

[@MerdaPura]

we don't talk about that "game"

[@Thescott16]

Age 2 was my first game that wasn't a "kids game" (simple gameplay, basic story, often educational, etc.) and holds a special place in my heart. Microsoft's handling of it's Definitive Edition is the reason I stopped "doomsaying" about the Western games industry 5 years ago... And is the reason I was less concerned and not paranoid about their growing monopoly of Western AAA games with the acquisition of Bethesda and Activision. They showed a willingness to put the game and gamers first, and once they figure out that that's what works; they'll apply it to their other projects.

[@MasterJohnam]

AoE2 was some of the best RTS gameplay of any game.

[@cromcccxvi3787]

Absolutely nailed it in the end. Supply v Demand, we should be Demanding Content.... but there is too much $ in people demanding "skins"

[@asifcra7839]

Age of empire players are loyal as fuck. They might shit on it. But they will come back. I spent almost 2k hours in aoe3 de. Purchased dlc hardly ever touched.

[@elduquecaradura1468]

Really? You must be kidding me, I love the italians and americans, also european maps. But specially I adore the maltese, ever since I got them took away from WoL I was expecting to see anything almost as good as them, and I got something better!

[@wrmusic8736]

meanwhile I watched a Factorio Space Age trailer and boy oh boy, that's an expansion pack.

[@mateuszbochynski9806]

@@wrmusic8736 agree! Can’t wait for Space Age!

[@dustinherk8124]

I approve of companies working with the modding community. part of the reason why i love Indie Stone who make project zomboid. most of their expanded game devs, from their original 2 man team came from the Mod developers. I believe a whopping 3 were hired from outside sources. still relatively small at around 26 devs, but most of their hiring comes from the massive modding community. If only EA would get on board with mod community for their C&C franchise and C&C generals, specifically. I do not understand why larger companies DO NOT work with modders, they are the passion project workers. they are the ones who will make remakes and expansions great for the established fan base. they are the ones motivated to develop a fantastic project, instead of a bunch of whipped and beaten game devs who put in 14 hrs a day for a project they were assigned too, over one they actually care about, because they need a paycheck, and have stupid corporate deadlines.

[@tehrickles1447]

I absolutely agree, products should come with a pricetag instead of hidden subscription schemes, but those prices also have to be in line with the up front cost of the product. A $60-$80 game should not be getting story packs that add 5% more content for a quarter of the price of the base game and there should not be cash shops selling broken mods for the price of full games in those games. There also needs to be more transparency in monetization, the different currencies are awful and predatory. I think FTP titles should have to constantly display just how much you've spent on the game in their shops, really show the economic effect they're having.

[@lalakingo7]

Hiring the modding team. That has got to be the smartest thing ever. If Bethesda hired some of the modding teams, everyone would win.

[@TheT0N1c]

The part at the end about paying for content is so true thank you !!

[@GnarledStaff]

I was just listening to music from AoE2 yesterday and telling me old crew we should redownload it. Great timing!

[@Qureas]

A note on WC3. There is a mod team that have remade WC2 campaign in WC3 Reforged. "Warcraft: Chronicles of the Second War"

[@doe6974]

This community, specifically the pros and announcers and youtubers, have kept this game going. Full props to them, T90, Viper, Spirit of the Law, and dozens more.

[@Maldanil]

I'm always so happy when people talk about AoE2. One of the most important games of my childhood, alongside Warcraft III.

[@zachariah1688]

@3:15 to actually skip in- video ad read

[@slykeren8371]

@@zachariah1688 legend

[@micheljolicoeur6094]

Totally agree with your closing statement, it is why if I see a cosmetic only cash shop in a game it is an immediate red flag on the game. There can be exceptions but generally when you see a cosmetic cash shop in a game, there is little to no new content coming and their entire business model is on skins not content.

[@TheBrutaline]

This might interesting if you guys didn't see or read about it. Warcraft 3 received a closed PTR update to version 2.0 a couple of days ago. Considering that the change from old warcraft 3 to reforged changed the version number only by 0.01 or something similarly small they believe or at least want us to believe that the incoming changes will be quite massive. After people found that 2.0 version number in the logs and talked about it Blizzard then immediately pulled the update back from the closed PTR and reversed its state back to what it was before. Maybe something big is coming for warcraft 3 too. Though it's all speculative at this point.

[@jow4video]

Beautiful end conclusion! Very well done video, ser!

[@eppiox]

The point about the late 1990's money vs today got me thinking about how game prices haven't really gone up that much compared to everything else... conversion rate says some of the games I bought in the late 90's would cost about $200 equivalent in todays money.

[@onlywithbuts1781]

The only notes industry likes to take is the ones colored green from everyone's pockets. So happy to see the studio here making good decisions and sweet to see modders getting some love. Literally wish listed this expansion as of now.

[@ethanfreeman1106]

we need more videos like this. showing much needed wins is a breath of fresh air. they serve as great examples of what to follow and what to learn from. ya know what? i've been getting sick of all the news lately around gaming. it's just too much. but this, this was nice.

[@stevensmileyprod]

Blizzard dropping HotS was so so stupid. I miss it getting new content. IT was the best most accessible most fun moba.

[@Naughtylius]

"Small teams, defined scope and reasonable expectations" is the best explanation for why is Age Of Empires 2 so alive currently. And will remain alive for couple of years for sure

[@23plaster]

AoE2 has always been the best RTS on the Market and no matter how neglected it was in the past the community of players never let it die. Microsoft had 2 options let it go on via the fan community or actively get involved and support it. The player base never gave microsoft much of a chance to destroy what AoE is.

[@omegagilgamesh]

"If the game is free, you are the product." That's a much better way than the way I like to out it: "At best, you get what you pay for. If a product is free, you're getting a void that you can do little with but try to fill."

[@Kieran_Martin]

I have been playing games since 2000, my first game was The Sims, and if you were around then like Bellular News said it was different times. The expansion packs for The Sims came in a bundle of 2 and only cost CAD 20. There was a lot of content and the game was really stable. Though things started to change around Sims 2, you got more content, but it was the first time they began to break up the expansion packs into content and expansion packs. Also, the game had issues with bugs which sadly did not give me a great experience with the game, Sims 3 in my opinion is still the best Sims 3 game to date, It had good content though still followed the path of Sims 2 with content packs but you got a fair share. Though the last few years with Sims 4 being added and EA deciding to go all in on a game that the OG players never really took to like myself just shows that these big IPs are losing touch with reality. So I agree fully with what Bellular News said about it being different, and it's not just Sims it happened with other games and is still happening to current games of today. Minecraft has been hiring staff like crazy, and this has been impacting the general feel of the game as ideas get more polluted and mixed, the last livestream was not taken greatly by most of the community and most felt that the biome lacked detail and or reason to go there. I have constantly said to my palls since Microsoft took over that the game will die under their hand, the hard part is people don't take me seriously, though it's good to know that some people in this corner of the internet do have the same take on the industry and how things have been turning out lately. And as someone who has preordered Cities Skylines 2, I honestly feel that inde games are the way to go these days, even if you invest in early access ones often they will have a place to provide feedback and have way better communities than what EA, Rockstart and so on can provide. And support for the inde games is way better too, I spent a month working with Rockstar support getting pinged around the support team and getting asked the same question, Read Dead Redemption 2 kept crashing, after a month I reached out to Nvidia which solved my issue in 2 days through email. So personally even if the game is popular or something I sooner invest in smaller game developers just because they have the heart for their games and are honestly way more community-oriented than major publishers. It's them that will keep the industry going not these big billion-dollar companies. But anyhow just wanted to chime in and say I agree with Bellular News, as a 30-year-old who has been playing since 2000, it's gotten really bad.

[@CatsLilaSalem]

AoE2 is one of those games that is very simple and very complex at the same time, making it interesting and keeping a playerbase active. At some point people started to cover the game on KZbin, and also cover specific systems, and those videos attracted more and more people. The interesting part is that the videos did attract lots of non-players, who really liked the videos about the game. And of course, after some time some of those non-players would start to play helping to make the game more and more popular again

[@exercept-mn7sw]

About the Victors & Vanquished DLC, the 14 or so "enhanced" campaigns that already existed essentially as community mods were made by a user called Filthydelphia - but Filthydelphia is an employee under World's Edge, I think in Forgotten Empires specifically. Not sure if that changes anything, but it's less a case of the devs pilfering community content, and more about employing the talent from modding communities that your video shows pretty well.

[@etienne2315]

I can't wait to play the battle for Greeks dlc I love these long campaign stories like they also had in Aom.

[@GnarledStaff]

AoE1 was my first RTS game. AoE2 was my first civ builder. If you stay on standard difficulty and only play against bots its a pretty fun town/civ builder. Not saying its not a great RTS game too, but it wasn’t until years later that I realized half of the appeal was that I really enjoyed civ/ town builders. The other half was tower defense! Never quite found the game that merges those 2 aspects properly but I still go back and play AoE sometimes.

[@unlearningify]

"And it god damn matters." Truer words have not been spoken.

[@AlamRigotti]

Nice to see well produced videos about aoe2.

[@lupusabanglespenna]

THIS!!! ALL OF THIS!!! SAY MORE ABOUT IT!!!

[@axiezimmah]

The art that "somehow looks modern and classic" is probably because that's how we remember it to look like. They didn't change the style, they just upgraded it to match modern resolutions and screens. So it has all the nostalgia but just more crisp

[@SeannWiliamScott]

Thank you for the good clip, Bell! It's refreshing to see you talk about AoE. I also enjoyed your little rant towards the end about the greediness of AAA corporations centering around selling skin models. Cheers, mate :)

[@peterbertilsson6753]

T90 is such a huge reason the game is where it is today

[@Barboron]

Optimising around skins is why we will never have good games anymore because while there will be studios or independent game creators that want to do something good for the gaming community, powerhoues like EA and Ubisoft have the resources to work on graphics. I like to refer back to MGS1, by today's standard, the original graphics obviously aren't great but the game stands up based on gameplay and story even by today's standard.

[@axiezimmah]

The last bit is the most important part. This is also the reason why Star Citizen will likely never release a full product. They're monetizing off the ship concept sales. When they finish developing they won't sell ships. So it's better to always dangle the carrot with new ships and new features. Actually releasing the product will lose them money.

[@torontokid2727]

I think the AoE2 community is the best for any game. Not because of the numbers but because of the tenure, the dedication to keep it alive with voobly when microsoft couldn't be bothered. The game also feels really well balanced if you want to play competitively and is also great to team up with a friend and stomp 6 AI.

[@Spetnaz23]

Chronicle projet potential is insane, I love the way they choose to split creative "unorthodox" content and base game without isolating them from each other. The first Chronicle DLC isn't there yet and I'm already impatient to see the next one as I can see already where this can lead, rome, egypt, gauls, etc. Maybe even some story we've already seen, like genghis khan, in a Chronicle way to tell us the thing, or the 100 year war between french and brits. Imagine some post medieval gunpowder style content with let's say...AoE3 timestamp civ...In AoE2 engine

[@Bottle-OBill]

I feel like we're slowly watching Bellular fill the space in games journalism left by Total Biscuit

[@Drekwulf]

Really could feel the frustration and love at the end there.

[@dashvash5440]

Rare feel good story. Modders (especially those that make huge mods) are so passionate about the game they're modding and they do it for themselves, the community, and the game. It's super cool. It's always gross when companies try to attack or exploit modders/mods. Sonic Mania was also created by fans, at Segas direction, and was really well done. It was recieved with a ton of positivity. Edit: stealing community made maps or mods and then selling them is just disgusting. Buying the content and working with creators is such a no brainer. Edit 2: my beloved StarCraft 2, i live watching the tournaments with friends. Wish they grew it better but i believe it's where the quote about a horse cosmetic making more money.

[@The-Autistic-Strategist]

I was 3 when AOE2 released. I have no memory of ever not having played it… it is woven into my very psyche! I am still a big fan… I remember playing lan skirmish with my dad and little sis… good times… We still do the occasional co-op… I’m also a halo fan (but only the Bungie games, and halo wars 1&2)

[@951258tike22]

Shoutout to Voobly for truly keeping the online aspect alive during the "dark ages"

[@taddybear4244]

I typically won't buy games with microtransactions and don't think I play any free games currently because I want to unlock things naturally. And I consider any DLC to be part of the total cost of the game, so it could be discounted 95% but if there are also fifteen full price DLC items listed on steam, I won't buy it if the full cost of everything goes up by more than double.

[@JaggerNaught]

If a game is free, I'm less likely to play. Preach!

[@torri776]

I've seen a lot of people mention that Triple A game devs and Movie Studios are out of touch with their fandoms, and that the best course of action for these studios to take is to get players/fans directly involved in their projects. It's hard to believe, actually. Dare I say that this alone will usher in a new age of entertainment, which is good because so many games and movies have been stale and boring for so long.

[@dsmania]

All in for the last conclusion. Kudos.