Factorio Smart Trains (No mods)

[@christophertesta8097]

Pretty cool to see logistic train networks can be done 100% vanilla.

[@hellboy19991]

This makes me want to work with trains beyond just "import ore"

[@Taygetea]

its incredibly bizarre watching someone play without alt-mode on all the time

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

I normally play with it on, I had just turned it off to reduce clutter while I was recording, haha.

[@RuliHellion]

This is amazing! I really really love the idea of all trains getting more consistant use! I have been attempting to duplicate this for a good week now and still no luck.

[@leandroclaytonpivovarsky7486]

Man, i almost cried when you set up the system and it actually works how it's suposed to in 13:53. All the logic behind this and the errors that could interfere the funcionality was bypassed. Good job man!

[@doctordoggo5245]

its fuckng beautiful. im 50 hrs to the game and still strugling with my green red and blue circuit.

[@shawnp6653]

As a relatively new player, this makes my head hurt! lol Thanks for sharing Benjamin.

[@datman6266]

Thank you for this improved idea!

[@simpson6700]

A bit over engineered if you ask me. I just have a flip flop at every request station where the train limit is set to 1 if the items fall below a threshold, and set to 0 once the chests are full. The trains also leave the request stations if the train limit signal falls below 1 and they just wait at the provide stations till one of the requesters opens up again.

[@miravlix]

You seem to have implemented the feature that made me quit the game when I failed to do it. We didn't have the station count train system, but I managed to use the train logic on how it choose train stations, to implement a dynamic outpost system, then the dev changed how train choose stations and broke my smart station system. Glad to see some kind of smart station is now possible again. Though you didn't show if you had dynamic outpost stations, so I go out drop a mining outpost and my core base know to start using it automatically, when it runs out the station disable it self and the trains start picking other outpost mining stations. So all I have to do is run around making outpost without changing anything. Having played Early Access, I'm unfortunately to worn out building the starter base over and over, to even get to the train stage. 2000+ hours does not make starting over fun anymore.

[@pasrules]

Yesterday I was thinking of using trains without LTN after playing a fair bit of Soviet Republic: Workers and Resources. Then today I was thinking of your Gauss rifle, only to see this video in my sub feed. Funny coincidence. You should try Pyanodons if you think your logistics solution is worth its salt. How resilient do you think your vanilla LTN is to errors or unloading times creating junk? Another good circuit challenge is to beat the game with one assembler but it does require some mods to recursively process recipes. I can prove it can be done, but it takes too long to video.

[@winter-lb7id]

1:47 - real stamp of mind 6:33 - ctrl C + ctrl V

[@Fillentr]

Currently figuring how to build this on switch. This game is awesome

[@holo4ever]

Any blueprints?

[@Jankoekepannekoek]

One possible improvement: can you make trains go from a provider station to a requester station directly without needing to go to the depot first? It'll increase throughput and save on fuel.

[@haydengroh3767]

I think with this sytem, because the trains are stored at a depot named separatley, a depot station has to be in the route always. To make trains go between provider and requesters directly, and then park at a depot when idle, you would have to rename depot stations the same as every other station. Then work out how to allocate trains purely with circuitry. Would be quite a fun problem to solve

[@minighost244]

i've been coming back to this video for inspiration for several weeks, but i'm just now realizing that you have a "vladimir putin power plant" and "dyatlov's pass" lmfao

[@DSVDSVDSV]

Did you use picker dollies when designing the circuit setups? I found it was a great qol improvement when developing complex circuit stuff (lets you move and rotate combinators and the wires stay attached). I developed a similar setup with a central providing hub, but with a system where requests would consist of mixed resource orders that would only have a train assigned and filled if the resources were available (this was for SE where limiting the number of stations is advantageous and you have all resources arriving from outside via pads or space elevator).

[@jack.eastman]

This is awesome!

[@zippydinocrash]

Bro you gotta upload more vids, I love them

[@jakubkarmowski2416]

Would you be willing to provide save file? I want to learn the logic behind it!!!

[@karldietrich4263]

Very cool idea, how does it handle a large number of trains and Stations? My current way of doing it is creating cell blueprints with the number of provider trains included in the blueprint. The provider side of a cell has a hard train limit and the requester side is checking how many train loads are missing and sets the train limit accordingly up to a maximum e.g. 7 train loads are missing but the station has only enough space for 3 trains so the train limit will be at max 3 for this station. The trains schedules are looking similar to this [ITEM] Provider until full -> [ITEM] Requester until empty OR inactive 5s (-> REFUEL Station inactive 2s) Refueling is done by requester chests or if I am not at that stage in the research with central refuel stations, depending on the number of trains in the network. Things I can improve on is the Train Schedule and the Requestor and Refuel Stations, they should have a different condition based on circuits to remove the wait.

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

That's a cool way of doing it, I hadn't really thought of that. I haven't tested my setup with more than 10 or so trains, because a small number of trains are able to handle the demands of a large factory. However, if you adapted this to a HUGE factory, more trains seems to lead to a higher frequency of trains going to the wrong stations. But there are things that can be done to mitigate this, such as increasing the clock frequency of the dispatcher, and designing better intersections that don't trigger the train AI to repath.

[@JB-kn7ig]

I've been messing around with a train network lately, and I keep encountering a situation where my train will apparently "leave" the current stop, but not actually leave ~ (it remains there, but no longer is broadcasting to the network its cargo ) - I think maybe I need to ensure my train limit doesn't just flicker on momentarily when it accepts a train, but man it gets a bit confusing setting up :) Looks like you've figured it mostly out though, good job.

[@mattf2219]

Sanitize your inputs! sounds like you just about got it. Good luck!

[@sagark7703]

Dude any update on coil gun as you said in that video

[@davidwing2081]

Welp, time to overclock my train depot

[@Po-AnChen]

This is amazing.

[@grayhill6728]

Can you achieve the same outcome with basically one decider combinator at each stop? If the requester station has room to take in a resource, it sets the train limit to 0; if a supply statin has enough to fill a train, it sets the train limit to one. Otherwise, train limits are 0. Your setup is super impressive either way. Well done.

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

Thank you! With that proposed setup, I think you would still need resource-specific trains. Otherwise, a train that just filled up at a copper provider station could just end up going to any requestor station with a limit higher than zero. The only way I could see getting around that is if you had a circuit connected to a factory-wide network, that cycled through the various resources, which would trigger the stations with the corresponding resource to hail/dispatch trains.

[@baldorthewizard]

Do you have a copy of your sandbox world with the new stations you could share? I want to dive in a little deeper to how you have this working

[@cliptracer8980]

Nice railgun. What is the chances of mini railgun and what’s the fastest fire rate without burning the system? Can it at least charge way faster?

[@g1eagle]

Do you have a blueprint you can share?

[@ThwartAbyss54]

My first time truly using the train system was on my k2se world and i fell in love with how simple it was once i actually looked at and thought about it. I much prefer to use the vanilla system than use ltn/cybersyn/etc sees depot train tracks *confused screaming* not the circuit network the actual tracks lmao whyyyyy XD

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

Yeah... I couldn't avoid the ugly tracks in the depot. The grid size is based on the range of the roboports, and the depot bays need to be able to fit a 4 car train, so there's nothing I can do to change the rails.

[@ThwartAbyss54]

@@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan i laughed at the bendin depot cars as well lol suffering from robo success

[@erfarkrasnobay]

will you share blueprint?

[@memethief4113]

really questioning the use of yellow inserters and assembler 1s...

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

What I do is create all my blueprints with the lowest-tech components possible so that I can use them earlier in the game, and then use the upgrade tool on various parts of the factory when I need to improve their performance.

[@thomasrefshj9596]

can I get a Blueprints of that

[@poodlecow6525]

Hey this is amazing, would you happen to have a blueprint of the circuitry? Im horrible with circuits but i love this!!

[@Po-AnChen]

I am so curious how you debug your logics? It's ok for people debug in code level, but it must be really hard to debug in within those facotrio logic items

[@ElectroKn]

I'd very like to know how to do the first version was setup, I'm trying to design one myself but I've ran into some problems and my circuit knowledge isn't that great thanks for the video

[@abaddonsinclair978]

the idea seems to take some ideas from Ruspartian(? think I'm spelling it right) did for his 2kspm dw. Did ya get any inspiration from him? Cause I did and I haven't gone back since. Makes trains so much easier.

[@WuddupDok]

Love it!

[@vajkis3482]

overcomplicated and makes issues in megabases when your trains need to always go to depo and increased traffic in that location

[@LexiQnTech]

Bravo Bro

[@SRGfroster]

I guess this is going to put a strain on your CPU when you're in need of a huge amount of trains.... Like my green chip production plant needs 5 trains of resources at the same time most of the time. Because of the slow rate of the dispatching of the trains it would seem to me that this will be the major issue for a megabase. Other than that... cool idea.

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

With this factory layout, rather than having a massive green circuit factory, you would be better off just having several green circuit cells. Also, increasing dispatch speed is just a matter of increasing the clock speed of the depot, and possibly adding another outlet for trains to leave from. But yeah, I can imagine this putting a load on your CPU for a huge factory.

[@knicknacks]

True but i dont think this was meant to be used in a megabase anyway because circuits are just bad for ups That said, i will definitely be usong aomething like this when the expansion comes out on my first playthrough

[@TheMan83554]

That's fantastic. Have you posted the blueprints somewhere? I'd love to pick this apart and tinker.

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

I have not. I'm not against it, I was just trying to work all the kinks out of the newest version before I posted a blueprint book.

[@laugh8574]

I'd also be very interested in looking at the circuitry when/if you do post them 😊 Any thoughts on how many stations/trains this could handle? Is the hub expandable easily?

[@lukaswerner3344]

Have you @BenjaminMarshallScienceMan made any progress i have looked on your dirscord but youldnt find any section for it. I'd love to play around with it

[@mineteam0]

cool, but can it handle large volumes? it seemed a bit slow

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

The speed is determined by the clock speed of the depot, as well as how many trains are able to leave the depot at one time. The clock is just a belt-loop with a fish on it, so you could increase the speed by just upgrading the belt or adding another fish. The clock pauses whenever a train is leaving to avoid backing up the depot and dispatching the wrong train. So a way to make it faster would be to have each side of the depot have its own train outlet, and perhaps two clocks that alternate which side of the depot is deploying a train. You didn't point this out, but as I've said to other people in the comments, it's also possible to make it so the trains dont need to visit the depot after every trip with light modification of the system.

[@ctrlaltdebug]

Circuits are too difficult to maintain. Give me a text box to code in, and a console output!

[@thecarwasherofshangri-la]

If Im understanding correctly you are doing resource pick up -> central train yard with payload -> resource deliver -> back to central train yard empty Why not cut the second step since you know confidently that the trains have to do a pick up and a drop every cycle?

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

I originally was doing it that way, but transporting fluids throws a wrench into that since a train will be left with empty barrels in its cargo after dropping a fluid off. You could certainly remedy this by having separate trains just for fluids, or by returning empty barrels with a separate train or with logistics bots.

[@pazgaz7]

You are limited to one depot I guess. You can’t have two of them scan trains at the same time.

[@Doggoyy1]

SPACE AGE

[@jockeril]

So this is only a show case - so what if someone wants to learn how it actually works, as in - how are it's logic components are setup ?

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

I've had a couple people ask me to send them the save file. I'd be happy to send it to you too. I didn't go into the details of the logic gates just because it would make for a boring video. Like most programming/electronics projects, the final product is simply the combination of hundreds of basic concepts that aren't all that remarkable by themself.

[@joshwilliams1466]

Could I get a copy of the blueprints

[@benjaminlorentsen2546]

veryverylikey

[@mocky7603]

hello! can i have save of this world or prints? it helps me understand that logic please!

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

Yeah, add me on discord or email me and I can attatch the file in a message. Both are listed on my channel.

[@flexime571]

can u share blueprints ?

[@tomoyat1]

Sending each train’s contents on a multiplexed circuit signal by TDMA, and having the requestor stations enable/disable when it receives a signal of interest. Did I get it right? I wonder if it’s possible to multiplex with CSMA so that the number of trains is not limitted by the timeslice length, or is this overkill? Also, awesome music 😃

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

I had to look up what TDMA and CSMA meant, but yeah, that sums it up pretty well! CSMA seems like it would be harder to implement with factorio's circuit mechanics, but if you were going to build multiple depots with lots of trains, I could see it being an advantageous way of going about things.

[@DSVDSVDSV]

@@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan At 1 tick per station, you're looking at 300 stations having 5s latency with TDMA which is still much less than the time it takes for a train to be unloaded so for any realistic purposes TDMA will be sufficient. Plus the cycle can be dynamically altered based on station count with TDMA so there is never unused time in the cycle. CSMA is a fun project - I've mucked around with it but it introduces additional logic everywhere since with TDMA you can kind of just broadcast signals and treat them like regular signals outside of the transmission network, whereas with CSMA suddenly you are sending messages and have to store them in memory everywhere they get received.

[@MrWr99]

So only one train is going at a time?

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

No? The depot cycles through all the parked trains one after another and dispatches any that have somewhere to be.

[@Kawlinz]

Yellow inserters tho...?

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

I just use yellow on low volume train stops, like engines or something.

[@shingshongshamalama]

Have you considered using a signal multiplexer on those demand/supply signals?

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

Do you have an example of what you're talking about? I know what multiplexing is in real world electronics, but I'm not sure what it would look like in factorio.

[@doggfite]

Since they never replied, I will make an informed assumption at what they meant. I think they are referring to the practice of timing signals on circuits in factorio. Like you could potentially add a second constant to the combinator at each station that is T 1 through 60 and then add a clock that runs over the entire circuit and reach station will only transmit when the clock time is equal to their T value. Basically allowing the network to specifically identify the resource or the station with a unique identifier while still being able to have station names be generic. Obviously it's a bit more involved than that lol but it might allow you to improve your reliability if you worked it into your current setup (which is fucking amazing by the way). DoshDoshington talks about a similar setup in his City Block video, I would check it out if you also like to watch factorio content and haven't seen him before. He's very adept with circuit networks.

[@blaster_2220]

This is like ltn but much more simpler i think the nilaus's smart trains are better but this is verry good

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

Oh wow, I hadn't even heard of him. It's cool to see that someone else has done this!

[@evi-vw]

Hi, this is Guinness book of world records. We are contacting you for world record of: “uhhh” in a video.

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

I make these with no script homie, my whole channel is basically just a video diary that other people happen to be able to see.

[@HaleRegales]

Pretty lame to complain about other people's delivery in videos when you don't have any evidence you could do better. The guy is clearly unscripted and manages to explain a complicated build clearly and concisely which should be applauded rather than criticised.

[@HaleRegales]

@@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan You did an excellent job explaining something really quite complex in a meaningful way without a script. Bravo sir!

[@rhueoflandorin]

....and then factorio 2 introduced interrupts and train groups. lol.

[@jamesflames6987]

Amazing.

[@winter-lb7id]

Vladimir Putin Power. certainly

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

I think I had just watched the Chernobyl HBO series, and was tickled at the thought of naming poorly designed nuclear reactors after despots.

[@winter-lb7id]

@@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan this "despot" could organization country that defeat 16 000 sanctions and organization europe war-machine. Real bro???

[@winter-lb7id]

@@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan defeat 16 000 sanctions and organization europe that support Ukraine ? despots ? rly ? ok

[@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan]

Despot is just the first word that came to mind, I really don't have an opinion on most political things.

[@winter-lb7id]

@@BenjaminMarshallScienceMan amazing, my two comments fall =/

[@manveensingh3494]

what you have done is amazing, but just like many factorio KZbin videos you are bad at explaining things in the video. I have watched the video 2 times and still don't understand the concepts properly. there is a method of explaining how things work, you need to understand that and make an improved version of this video. for example, i feel like you have been rambling, you need to put a proper structure to the script and the demo. you need to break your video down in small chunks.

[@g0git]

Great comment, but just like many commentors you are really bad at explaining your criticism. I have read your comment 2 times now and still don't understand the concept properly. There is a method for explaining criticism in a non dog shit fashion, you need to understand that and make an improved version of this comment. For example, I feel that your comment is ranting, you need to actually read the words you are typing and think, is this the best I could do? You should just stop commenting.