Gaslighting Your Fans w/ Dolby ATMOS™

Instead of being a Dolby Artist, I tried to experience ATMOS as a consumer.
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Timestomps:
0:00 - RED ALERT
0:50 - Intro
3:03 - Immersive Audio (In Theory)
9:04 - The ATMOS Business Model
11:15 - I Try an ATMOS Home Theater
17:07 - I Try ATMOS Headphones
21:32 - ATMOS Feels Like a Grift

[@silverXnoise]

I pass all my audio through a high-end DAC before feeding it directly into a wax cylinder so I can get that genuine flapper 1920’s vibe. I wanna hear music the way Thomas Edison *intended* it to be heard.

[@nickcarter4006]

Buys $30,000 Atmos system…. Streams MP3s from a Plex server

[@silverXnoise]

@@nickcarter4006You are really not far from the truth in that…although, I do try to take advantage of Plex’s support for FLAC* files. Plex Amp is easily my favorite music streaming app. Simple, functional, supports my extensive personal library of purchased music from the days before digital distro, and really a beautiful UI. \*My phone *really* wanted to autocorrect this to say “flaccid”.

[@colourbasscolourbassweapon2135]

@@silverXnoise so analog?

[@silverXnoise]

@@colourbasscolourbassweapon2135 Flannelog

[@colourbasscolourbassweapon2135]

@@silverXnoise lol dude

[@N8oRMusic]

Finally my snare can sound shit in 3D

[@EversonBernardes]

And you'll have to spend, like, 3x the amount of time needed to get to it sounding like shit! (mine usually takes anywhere between 2 and 5 hours).

[@SnareGG]

hey!

[@nickcarter4006]

“Almost there….” *sets track to mono* “…PERFECTION”

[@colourbasscolourbassweapon2135]

@@JBATahoe oh god Forget about having a marching band 🤣😂 no cap

[@Chodemunch]

Yes

[@lateAutumn314]

hearing the singer "swirling around your head" must be the dolby atmos equivalence of the 3D movie "this thing flies really close to your face" effect.

[@DragoNate]

I feel like that'd be a very stressful listening experience lmao Like, I wanna listen to music comfortably, not feeling like I'm in the ocean being circled by sharks

[@emporioalnino4670]

I hopped on Tidal with my XM4s to see if this spatial audio thing was legit. I tried both Dolby Atmos and Sony 360 Reality Audio. It's like Benn said, there's sound coming from all directions but it feels incoherent and unnecessary, almost as if it was tacked on after the fact by a corpo. I prefer stereo.

[@MrStillions]

It's fun twice and then gets old. Exactly like 3d movies

[@jassykat]

it doesn't sound like that at all. It sounds cool.

[@LoganT]

@@jassykatRight, it’s not like those “8D immersive audios” on KZbin where they pan the the singing voice left and right. When it’s done right, it feels like you’re in the room with them while they’re recording.

[@sanjacobs6261]

Atmos must be the thousandth time Dolby came up with an actually impressive technology for cinemas, and then completely ruined the brand by sticking the name on all sorts of random consumer products.

[@lohphat]

$ay it ain't $o!

[@rolandmdill]

They don't stick the name on cosumer products, the brands buy the license from Dolby if they think it adds value to their product. You are always free to choose a product with a different feature set mate

[@jn1211]

@@rolandmdill ahhh yes, pedantry totally disproved the op

[@PHIplaytesting]

These consumer electronics companies need some kind of new label to put on their product marketing page. They don't care if it works well or not. And if they don't put that label on their product they know consumers will go and buy the one that has the label.

[@gozutheDJ]

@@jn1211 wow that's not pedantry at all lmao

[@kdaniel1995]

Holy shit, the amount of subscriptions required to use a product YOU ALREADY PAYED FOR is mind-boggling..

[@MutleeIsTheAntiGod]

Corporations are leeches

[@DanielJacksonisbiggerinside]

To be fair, most of the customers for this tech only listen to music on subscription platforms. The only people "paying for" Atmos mixes are people buying special edition Blu-Ray releases, and those work without any stupid subscription fees.

[@colourbasscolourbassweapon2135]

F that shit no cap

[@ThetaReactor]

You'll pay for everything and own nothing.

[@ld32486]

@@ThetaReactor ill pay nothing and own everything because im a filthy pirate lmao

[@94XJ]

I have a 7.2.4 setup and my Atmos movie, music and game experience boils down to 10% "that's awesome!" and 90% "that sounds really unnatural and forced."

[@alexatkin]

Is there any music you actually recommend? I've heard a few 5.1 mixes of music and its always like you said, extremely forced seemingly to show off what they can do, rather than actually add anything to the experience. In fact the only time I've been impressed is using Pro Logic IIz on stereo tracks with exceptionally good dynamic range/sound stage (in other words, very rare), that allows it to perform absolute magic on it for a fully immersive experience.

[@dustinbrueggemann1875]

@@alexatkin Anything that includes a technology just for the sake of using a new technology is always going to sound gimmicky. There's nothing miraculous that 5.1 or any other multi-speaker system does that you couldn't hypothetically do with a set of headphones and a binaural audio engine.

[@jonlaw16]

@@dustinbrueggemann1875 That's simply not true. Headphones may pull all the tricks with your ears but cannot fool your sense of touch. Any concert I've ever been to had a tactile experience where you can feel the vibrations in your clothes or in your seat or in your chest. Speakers can recreate this experience unlike headphones. It's my opinion that 2 speakers in a fully acoustically treated room with the correct balance of absorption, diffusion, and reflective surfaces creates the most immersive audio experience.

[@DJSoulbrother]

​@@alexatkin Randomly "Don't worry be happy" is pretty epic in atmos haha, Fleetwood mack albums, The Queen stuff, UB40's Best Of Labour Of Love album, Bob Marley legend album is great, Jamiroquai - cosmic girl, Chaka's - Ain't nobody, Thriller album, Whitney's dance with somebody is randomly pretty epic also. There is a lot nowadays as understandably producers have become better with the change and gotten over the gimmick side of it.

[@rev.wilkinsonstalesofmyste9027]

@@alexatkin I really like the BluRay copies of the Alan Parsons Project stuff and the DVD-A copies of Stone Temple Pilots "Core", Frank Zappa's Quadiophiliac, and Nine Inch Nails "The Downward Spiral". Those are all pretty solid surround mixed/mastered albums that don't sound incredibly awkward.

[@madenabennett]

I had a client who was an insanely intelligent sound engineer (developed software to tell you where the “problem” was in an aud8torium…wrote books etc). One of my favorite stories though (besides trying to get him to even talk about setting up my bands practice room…like trying to get your nuclear physicist to work on your toaster) was he toured with The Clash as a teenager (among MANY other bands…but the Clash was his favorite…and Ive never been a fan). Bottom line the Clash used to stick expensive equipment in crappy cabinets so fans wouldnt think they were as posh as they were…and is why they sounded better than “advertised” so to speak.

[@riffzifnab9254]

"Shooting a fucking forcefield of ghost speakers is physically impossible." Instant classic.

[@Thesoundmotel]

Should probably be on a t shirt

[@johnchedsey1306]

My housemate totally lost it over that one.

[@Ithirahad]

I guess it's... partially physically impossible? With the exact right reflection/absorption level of materials, a really weird and expensive speaker array that can do strategic cancellation/addition, and a detailed LIDAR scan of the room, maybe you could halfway manage. But yeah, it's scammy advertising. Not going to work in your real-world living room unless maybe you're one of those minimalist influencer types and just got lucky with your wall materials and room geometry.

[@SeanHarlow]

I loved that bit and I want it played on repeat anywhere they sell soundbars. Soundbars are perfectly fine if one wants anywhere from stereo to 3.1 audio that's better than their TV's built in speakers, but will never come close to a real surround system with multiple speakers physically located around the room when listening to actual surround content, no matter what the salesman at Best Buy might claim.

[@daviduribe5897]

& then he wonders why there’s no height effect from his 5.1 setup. He said it himself…

[@StarfiElectronica]

I'm a pro mastering engineer, you just beautifully described what I've been telling a lot of my clients for the last year! I'll send them to hear your report as it's way less sweary than my usual rant!

[@MyouKyuubi]

xD

[@lvciferkaminski]

i laughed so loud i scared my cat!

[@lamentistriangle281]

One of the few practical benefits of atmos is that many albums mixed in atmos has better dynamic range and seems mostly unaffected by the loudness war thing. But unfortunitely, Dolby's decoder on mobile devices (esp. on android + windows) has it's own dynamic range compression which can not be disabled and it sounds bad. A properly encoded bineural track sounds great though.

[@jackielinde7568]

Sooooo... Is DTS any better, or should I just stick with my 13 year old Denon 5.1 Amp and the collection of Bose 301's and 151's I've been using all along? (Actually, budgeting concerns have answered that question for me, as my daughter has an expensive college bill coming up... Guess I'm sticking with the current setup a little while longer.)

[@pellefri]

Haha... I just bookmarked this video for the same purpose, sending to clients wanting masters in Atmos 🙂

[@peenurmobile]

i might be getting it wrong, but i think of the quote "audiophiles don't get their equipment to listen to your music, they get your music to listen to their equipment"

[@bicyclelife7088]

Agreed, they seem to like to talk about their gear more than actually listening to songs.

[@olimphus26]

@@bicyclelife7088 and how do you think we are listening to those songs?

[@evilj]

@@olimphus26 "these songs" are usually benchmark songs or "reference hi-fi tracks" that every audiophile tests their equipment against :)

[@olimphus26]

@@evilj nope, im listening to music in my $10k system right now.

[@evilj]

@@olimphus26 cool, happy that you enjoy it

[@Mazda13bRotary]

In a world where so many people are racing to consume, gatekeep, and defend expensive snake oil products, I found this video refreshing. Thank you.

[@drditup]

setting max volume on my phone to hear it through the vacuum cleaner. Yup, probably not the way it was meant to be listened to, but i enjoy music this way.

[@werawerlnwerlnrlnelr]

Roomba™ audio. Sounds 3D already!

[@CricketStyleJ]

You're listening the way the vacuum manufacturer intended.

[@atosdomani5256]

I never expected Atmos music to just be the "7D" versions of songs that trended on youtube for a little while a couple of years ago, with all the instruments just panning around for no reason

[@NithinJune]

“8d 16k ultra quality 4d ulra hdr audio”

[@AverageMichaelJordans]

Those videos were awesome. I'm happy a good chunk of the cool stuff about this is accessible to a bog-standard pair of headphones. I hope it gets another surge of popularity

[@EvillNooB]

how dare you downplay the importance of Crab Rave 8D, i love crabs in my walls kzbin.info/www/bejne/hZnCnXZ4eLaCd7M

[@jfan4reva]

"with all the instruments just panning around for no reason" It's like 3d movies, the producers and directors just can't let it be 3d, they're compelled to have things flying directly into the camera lens whether it's relevant or not, because just seeing things in 3 dimensions would be 'too boring'.

[@Cinnimin]

THIS. most mixers have Pan knobs that let you control how much in the left andor right ear a sound is. if you're doing it live and people move around you can just have 2 microphones too.

[@hikingpete]

The problem that Atmos exists to solve is that the clock is running down on Dolby's other patents.

[@pokepress]

Kind of the corporate version of “publish or perish”.

[@Woozy91]

Completely not true.

[@Snhojbar]

You hit the nail on the head. They ran out of stuff to sell. Nobody needed dolby surround as soon as we were able to run digital multichannel uncompressed audio. Atmos was a hail Mary for them.

[@plankton50]

abolish the patent system!

[@Snhojbar]

@@plankton50Great idea if you have no intellectual property to protect and everything to gain from stealing other people's work. Without patents there is zero intensives for inventing anything or innovating. Let somebody else invent it and just steal that. Why would anyone put their life's work and possibly life savings into coming up with something new that anyone could just take it. All forms of IP Copyright are vital, especially to musicians. You are watching this musician's youtube channel. Benn Jordan wouldn't be able to make a living or make these videos without revenue from IP copyright. I left the 'you dumb ass' off the end of the last sentence to make sure my reply stayed polite.

[@natskar]

Finally someone gets it! Fucking nobody takes me seriously when I say atmos 99.999% of the time is a gimmick. Atmos when done correctly can be incredible for content, but it MUST be produced and sound engineered and have the receiver that can decode it and send the information and then actual physical speakers there to receive that signal. Otherwise you’re kidding yourself that it “sounds better”. I personally have had a much better experience with my 2.0 setup with speakers in the right position (and time alignment if needed) than ANY “atmos” soundbar

[@odw32]

I think as an artist, it's actually a better investment to buy a bunch of

[@dustinbrueggemann1875]

RIP to the eleven people listening on a real setup though. You should definitely mix on the best thing you have available to you because the artifacts from your crappy speakers will hide the artifacts of the song. If you really have to kludge it, mix on your car speakers since that's going to be the nicest set of speakers most people own, and also probably the real most common way people listen to music.

[@sorejack]

@@dustinbrueggemann1875 thier is no such thing as a "real" setup. it's all placebo. and techbro.

[@Hetsu..]

@@dustinbrueggemann1875 If you have a high end source set up, then even the shittiest gear will be transparent enough

[@Erowens98]

Mix on decent Studio monitors. Then tune it later on more accessible setups.

[@David-gp3fd]

i mean all you really need to do is add a little more frequencies or saturation to your low end to make sure its audible by anything without a subwoofer or bass extension

[@Seriouslycantplayguitar]

“Forcefield of Ghost Speakers” 100% describes how i thought Atomos was trying to sell itself working with only a single sound bar.

[@daviduribe5897]

And yet for 5 mins of the video he seems frustrated it’s not working, after just explaining it’s a hoax. Unless that was the joke… but it’s not. That’s his argument, “there was no height experience”… well no shit, you bought a 5.1 setup that was Atmos enabled not a 5.1.2 or 5.1.4 or 7.1.2 or 7.1.4

[@Redhotsmasher]

Haven't those "strange magic box with many small speakers in front of you magically projecting an entire surround sound system around you" systems been a thing since the '00s? Sales pitch didn't seem particularly convincing back then either.

[@daviduribe5897]

@@keithwilliams88 sure, the modern capitalistic “accept or die” & “it’s everywhere” approach is despicable, I was just poking holes in his argument because I believe Atmos will stick around going forward, not as a replacement for stereo, but coexisting as a uniquely appealing alternative to tradition (for various reasons). I’ve invested not even a dollar into Atmos, but if I do I‘ve got to make sure I don’t have any blindness from bias. It could fuck my entire life up. So, I’m always curious to hear other opinions. This video seems like a rather personally-charged take that wasn’t fully thought out. The problems lie elsewhere, let’s say. If you know, you know.

[@benjwgarner]

@@daviduribe5897 That's a bit cryptic. Can you give any hints?

[@noisetheorem]

As a musician who is deaf in one hear, the only way you're going to hear it as I do is if I pan everything right and tell all y'all to just deal. I have considered this, but ultimately decided to just do a simple stereo mix as best I can and get on with my life.

[@AveragePicker]

I once described playing live as being like moving all your equipment across town so you can not hear it, hope you are playing the right thing, having no idea what others are hearing, then taking it all back home and telling yourself that was a success. ....So I've been not quite so sure people actually would want to hear songs like musicians do. Careful what you wish for. But hey, if you want to develop the True Musician Experience Right Channel Noise Codec specially designed for home theater missing half the speakers, and broken monitors that give the true experience...I'm all in with ya. :D

[@noisetheorem]

@@AveragePicker Ya see...I know, pretty much for a fact, my stereo imaging is shit. I spend almost no time on it at all. But people say it sounds fine. What we hear and what non-musicians hear is totally different. They like it...but they can't tell you why they like it. its so subjective as to make any standard meaningless.

[@Maxiamaru]

Fellow deaf artist, I always consider going the hard pan route

[@masterofreality230]

I am not completely def in one ear, but pretty damn close, it happened because I wanted the perfect guitar tone and raised my 1x12 cab to head level on one side.

[@Nawer_Rapter]

Almost same here. I ended up deciding that all releases I'll do will either have almost no steeeo or have a mono alternative mix, just cuz Windows forced mono fucks everything up.

[@cola98765]

Dolby: trying to push some weird speaker setups for decades me: just enjoying movies and games on analog headphones, providing me with more spatial awareness than any consumer speaker I've experienced.

[@pazsion]

most new headphones are digital and produce 3d sound where its an option. even cheap ones

[@cola98765]

​@@pazsion yes... that's why I like analog ones. most music is in stereo... which means that it's either gonna flatten the left-right difference to emulate 2 speakers (which I don't like) or it's gonna fake the effect, getting the surround info from nothing. It's even more pronounced in games. it's easy to make a game work with headphones, and vast majority of them will do it correctly. and unless such headphones would appear as more complex setup on a driver level, a given game can't even send proper info as it only compresses it down to stereo, while the "3d effect" is again faked on headphones themself. bottom line is that ignoring your head movement relative to monitor, headphones have only 2 channels for 2 receptors that are your ears, so a good source is very much enough with them.

[@b1zzler]

😩😩You are precisely the type of person Atmos is targeting - people who don't have the technical know-how to get stereo imaging out of consumer speakers

[@LoneWanderer905]

​@@b1zzler that's bs. You don't even have any idea which headphone buddy is using lol. A ton of headphones can get awesome imaging, especially open-back ones. I run a SHP9500 / HD599 / HD600 (I gotta sell at least one of them tbh) setup with a DAC+AMP setup and they're amazing. Other than that, I have a pair of (probably considered low-end) Edifier MR4s which sound beautiful as well. There's really not a lot of work or need for "technical know-how" when you have a decent set-up my man. I've tried quite a few of these effects and whatever, ATMOS, DTS stuff, everything. None of it sounds good to me, I always end up returning to my basic preferred EQ settings after 1 or 2 days after the novelty wears off.

[@b1zzler]

@@LoneWanderer905 ?… Of course you can get good imaging with headphones. That’s my entire point. The problem is that he says he hasn’t been able to get imaging out of consumer loudspeakers. That’s generally a problem with speaker selection, speaker placement, AVR/DSP selection, and DSP tuning. Most people can’t be bothered to do all that so they throw in the towel and stick to plug and play solutions, which is precisely what headphones are. Atmos is trying to make in-room spatial audio as “plug-and-play” as headphones are so non-technical consumers can get a pretty close approximation to what mastering engineers are hearing in their Genelec/ATC/B&W rooms. That’s what I was getting at. Not that headphones are bad.

[@Xerain]

As the only person I know with any kind of immersive audio (I have mid rang Polk 5.1 set up) I really wish they'd expand the breadth of immersive audio content rather than keep moving the goal posts for the 1 in 1000 people interested in this. It's like they know that with their unsustainable business model based around restrictive licensing will never be main stream, so rather than try for real adoption they keep bleeding the same handful of people until they can't anymore. Listening to music thoughtfully mastered in 5.1 is actually pretty amazing, when you can find it. The problem is there isn't enough of even 5.1 around for most artists to conceive of their music in an immersive way from the beginning.

[@spektrograf]

"If however you are listening to music makes you happy, you are listening to it perfectly." Truer words never spoken. 🏆👍

[@cromagnon305]

I discovered this when I cobbled together a sound system out of spare parts and hooked it up in my tool shed. ❤️

[@robertschnobert9090]

I exclusively use the speaker of my 2015 iPhone SE to listen to music. It's perfect. 🌈 ​@@cromagnon305

[@robertschnobert9090]

​@@cromagnon305I'm sorry, it's a 2016 smartphone, not 2015 haha 🌈

[@chaos.corner]

Sometimes I'll crank a low fidelity youtube music video over laptop speakers just for the joy of hearing the song again and I've already heard it in good quality a thousand times anyway.

[@MiguelMartinez-ui8nl]

"If however you are listening to your music makes you happy, you are listening to it PERFECTLY" Please spread the word, that needs to be understood by more people

[@richgeminitechie5794]

I am absolutely blown away...this "rant" actually justified my impression of any attempt at "immersive" audio.From my first attempt buying Bose Acousstimass speakers system some 30-40 years ago to my present 7.1 Denon AVR and ceiling mounted speakers, that holy grail has yet to be found. In fact, in some ways, it's made listening worse. It not only depends on your gear, etc. but it also depends on specific stations. For example, if I'm listening to an interview of a music celebrity and they change to his/her music, the music gets lost, so I adjust a setting that favors music. It returns to the interview and the audio is so low, I either turn up the volume or got back to settings...sometime both. The moral of the story; good ol' stereo with a subwoofer is good enough for 90% of my listening pleasure without the constant pain in the ass tweaking. Thanks for you brutally honest review.

[@chromatec4311]

ATMOS = Money Making Opportunity for Dolby, Apple, Microsoft etc.. Thank-you Benn for a frank and honest evaluation.

[@TheSteveSteele]

And his pitch to buy a membership to his channel wasn’t? Btw, literally every product released by Dolby, Apple and Microsoft is a money making opportunity.

[@chromatec4311]

True - but not all new tech is successful. Only time will tell if Atmos is a commercial driver or falls by the wayside similar to 3D,

[@TheSteveSteele]

@@chromatec4311 Well, as far as developers of apps for the creation of audio content, DAWs like Pro Tools, Nuendo, Logic Pro, MIR Pro 3D, etc.. they all now support Atmos, (they’ve built in the Atmos renderer and support the large channel formats like 7.1.2, etc. One misconception about Atmos compared to traditional surround formats like 5.1 is that the listener doesn’t have to have the same speaker setup as the creator. Because Atmos uses object instead of channels, the decoder figures out how to place the sounds with the given speaker setup. So, from the creative side, the industry I work in, Atmos has already won. One of my partners just had an Atmos installation done in his studio. We’re composing in Atmos. Personally, I think all surround formats are a pain, although I think Ambisonics and Binarual technologies are fascinating. Many movie theaters, music halls, performance halls, or anywhere there is an installed playback system, they’re all moving to Atmos, at least in the US. There’s other formats like Aura 3D, but the DAWs don’t support it natively. I’m not sure if consumers will buy into it, but with Apple Music supporting Spatial Audio with headphones, I think that will be one of the more bankable markets.

[@wesleybrehm9386]

I should add one other thing. I was genuinely excited about Atmos when I started using it. The idea of making one mix and it sounding good in any speaker setup was tantalizing. That promise is a lie. When we send deliverables to studios, we have to do an Atmos mix, a 7.1 mix, a 5.1 mix, a 2.1 mix (sometimes), and a stereo mix. I thought Atmos would save me time; instead it just made more work for me.

[@drummerdoingstuff5020]

Hey, job security.. nice

[@SioxerNikita]

Like in IT in general.... We have 16 standards, someone makes a universal standard so we can have fewer standards... Now we have 17 standards...

[@caliginousmoira8565]

i thought atmos was just about the height(atmosphere) speakers. 7.1/5.1 were already 'here' i have a linkin park dvd of re:animation that is 5.1....

[@alexatkin]

@@caliginousmoira8565 As mentioned, "in theory" its about letting the final mixes object positioning be handled by the equipment at the end user, so it can more accurately be adapted to the speaker setup and room acoustics. It actually is the first time I managed to get a truly impressive surround experience in my small room, specifically having phantom rears actually works better than real rear speakers - as I was always sat too close to them. This is in spite of a lot of time it being PC games I play which probably are only using Atmos to send a channel-based output to my receiver - but the receiver is doing a better job of recreating those virtual speakers positions. It really shines in movies, particularly UHD Bluray that isn't restricted to the streaming services limited bitrates. Although I do find Atmos usually isn't really flat sounding like streaming services often are for legacy surround mixes vs Bluray. The problem is, you need to have the right equipment to make this work and as mentioned in the video there's lots out there that doesn't have this room calibration (or does it poorly) so is missing out on the entire point of HAVING object positioning handled at the end user. So they end up with a worse experience than a well mastered channel based mix.

[@TankR]

@@SioxerNikita And then every company takes the universal standard, half implements it, changes the serial clock by 2%, makes up some 'im 12 and this is edgy' name for it, and now we have a common low cost device artificially walled in and price inflated with 17^(16+1) standards to decypher. And drivers for every one of them, for every current version of windows, no linux option, and none of the drivers get along with any of the other drivers...... "Here at [insert literally any computer parts manufacturer here], we care about the customer experience..." ...My pimply fuzz covered ass. 🤬

[@beandon24]

By the way, the limit is ACTUALLY 32 channels/objects for any consumer. This is a limitation of data bandwidth over HDMI, you can find it buried deep in the developer docs, but of course this isn’t marketed toward consumers…

[@gambitman7158]

Couldn't that limit technically be expanded upon by HDMI over Ethernet? Obviously it's not a consumer grade upgrade but I presume it's possible? (This is coming from the background of the limitations of DMX512 [Lighting protocol] being worked around through Ethernet transfer rates. I haven't personally delved deep enough into audio docs to know whether or not that'd be possible. (I know a lot of live theaters run audio out of Ethernet for multiple channels, I'm referring directly to Atmos here)

[@MadsterV]

@@gambitman7158can you even differentiate between 32 different sound sources simultaneously in your real environment? Most people will track a couple at most. You switch to the important ones. Mixing can group by distance and importance and stay below (way below) the limit.

[@markjacobs1086]

​@MadsterV I can barely do 2... If there's loud music & someone screams something at me I'll be hearing both with no way to differentiate between the 2... I.E. I'm hearing noise 😂

[@LexusYachtClub]

No but you can differentiate between more than 32 directions in a 3d space.​@@MadsterV

[@nerfinator03]

​​@@gambitman7158hdmi can carry way more raw data than a cat6 cable can, to test cables, we recently had to purchase a new tester that does 48gbps because our old one only did 40. I believe 48 is for 8k video, if i remember correctly, 60fps 4k at 4:4:4 should be 18gbps, this excludes audio! So yeah, ethernet yes, but maybe with 100gbps fiber transceivers in the not too distant future.

[@evan]

Imo Dolby Atmos sounds crazy nice but only if it is ACTUALLY utilised correctly. I’ve heard some awful atmos mixes which feel like you might as well should have not mixed in atmos… but it’s worth it for the good mixes. My setup is with Sonos and I can definitely hear things coming above and behind me like the “bubble” they claim. Sooooo sounds like good atmos just ain’t possible at that cheaper budget. (Also Sonos allow stereo mix or atmos depending on track soo)

[@Brando56894]

Agreed. I have a discrete 5.1.2 system powered by a Marantz NR1609 and it sounds pretty great in movies, everything else is meh. I'm also a bit crazy I guess because I bought all of this originally when I was living in a 450 sq ft Manhattan apartment! I've since upgraded to an 850 sq ft apartment in Miami, the living room is an odd shape though so the speakers stick out/are crammed close together.

[@semibreve]

This level of no nonsense highly technical audio content is what I live for. Great video!

[@Bthelick]

I have 1 foot still in the industry side as a ghost writer, and its getting ridiculous. My gripe is record labels are demanding we spend extra studio sessions prepping atmos stems, at our cost of course, only for the label to then take more of our money (out of the advance) to give it to some upstart that then asks "for screenshots of any reverb settings" so they can produce an atmos mix like wtf. We've had every excuse under the sun including " you can't even get on Apple music without an atmos mix now". And btw, these are pop / edm tracks, its not like they benefit from an immersive sonic experience or have the audience that would appreciate that.

[@MischieviousJirachi]

That's so annoying wtf 😭

[@somethingsoupy]

I'm with ya until your last statement. I would argue edm benefits more than most genres of music through Atmos. Just because you don't understand the culture or music, does not give you right to kick dust on it. Also I suggest you do not speak for an audience you are not part of; you're making assumptions you have no way of substatiating, all in frustration for Dolby Atmos.

[@Bthelick]

@@somethingsoupy speaking of "not having the right to kick dust on it" what on earth gives you the right to assume I don't understand EDM or the culture? It's both by my living and my passion. I've been to all the clubs (most of which sum to mono for good reason), I've taken the drugs, I grew up on rave music in its country of origin the UK, I've engineered, played, written and produced it professionally for over a decade. Instead of making assumptions, all you have to say is "I disagree, here's why" and actually share your opinion on why you think it's a good fit, a debate doesn't have to start by tearing into someone you don't know, just present your counter argument! Having said all that here I'm talking about "pop/EDM" as one genre. I'm talking about commercial chart style tracks with full vocals and a dance beat, not separate genres.

[@somethingsoupy]

​@@Bthelick I was not trying to tear you a new one, but I do disagree and believe what you are stating is untrue. It was my opinion, that you did not understand the culture, because what you said is often stated by jaded 50 year old's that mix the same shit every day, be it in post-production or live sound. Obviously, based on your channel, you are part of the community and it was my mistake for making that assumption. I gave you a subscription, your tutorials are very helpful. I hear what you are saying about Pop/EDM, but Pop is just as effective, imo. When I read EDM, I don't think of chart toppers, I think of the guys with 100-10,000 listeners that are pushing the genre to its limits. Apologies for coming off crass, but I think you were being hypocritical as you were attacking a community and people in it. I only sent that same energy back to you. If you had presented that argument and left out the insults, I would have moved on. It was because I saw someone that could not defend themselves, from a person that seemed ignorant in the moment, that I commented. Have a nice day.

[@aaronswede-taillon8373]

@@Bthelick oh and you make some of the best track breakdowns and production tutorials I’ve watched.

[@snakeface5652]

In university, one of my last assignments was to write a song made for atmos. It was an electronic song, and when writing a song specifically for surround, it can be super cool. Things like lazer sounds firing around. If the song was written for stereo though, it just won't be much of an experience. Finished university almost 2 years ago and I haven't been able to listen to that song properly again.

[@drummerdoingstuff5020]

Why? Don’t have Atmos setup?

[@SamuraiGuy]

I'd love to try to actually make a song in Atmos because the songs I have heard in the format are usually rhythm/lead in front, ambient/background in the rear/height, even when a sound is clearly supposed to circle around you.

[@ffsireallydontcare]

Probably the best spatial music experience I've had was Jean-Michel Jarre's Aero, mixed in 5.1 and listened to in my car on a head unit with full surround decoding. Forget the car and road noise (there was plenty), that it was rendered on 4 speakers plus sub, and that I was off-center, the tightness of the timing and the close speakers in the tiny cabin made it immersive. Musically the reason why it worked was because it was JMJ's own vision and not some post-processed "make it sound like it's around you" crap.

[@jvsonyt]

I used to install atmos speakers and clients would always be like "I can't wait to listen to everything in atmos!" and I'd always have to have the "...welllllllllllll..." speech ready

[@goatsonlyrecordingstudio]

22:58 “A solution without a problem” Very well said 🙌🏼

[@Mix3dbyMark]

These are the facts

[@marctestarossa]

Same with head-tracking headphones. What do they do? Where is the problem they want to solve? When I'm watching KZbin and I'm too drunk and the sun hasn't come out yet and I can even barely keep my eyes open, but still want to know where my laptop is? Playing an electric organ on a huge turntable to experience some crazy Leslie effect? Myy hearing ability varies due to my tinnitus so depending on the changing condition I could angle my head a bit while watching TV to equalize sound levels. Maybe you guys got some ideas?

[@glenwaldrop8166]

I would like elevation data when playing games but that would also require floor speakers. It's already impractical. They were doing weird things with QSound back in the day...

[@Woozy91]

No it's not

[@bericadori]

In the world of startups the saying is ”Solution In Search of a Problem” short SISP. 😊

[@Wayne_Robinson]

Thank you for this dose of reality. The funniest part is how the Atmos demo on their website uses a deliberately crap stereo mix of the Marvin Gaye song for comparison. I'm sure it's great for a movie theater but I don't live in one. Edit: To answer your question at the end, even if there were no licensing fee premiums associated with Atmos, it doesn't offer much to me.

[@lowcostfish]

Also, the Dolby Atmos version sounds pretty bad too, just in a more full-bodied way. I actually prefer the crap stereo one.

[@belalugrisi1614]

Saw "One Love" in the theater and thankfully the mix was mostly two channel. The previews were terrible with all that multi-channel crap going on!

[@gn2b445]

the stereo mix they used was very good I don't know what you're talking about

[@dzaxys4643]

As an underground techno producer the majority of the systems in clubs and raves are set up as a single stack with some notable exceptions

[@Hi-levels]

It is often the chems and good techno making a great rave lmao. No body would understand if there was an atmos system

[@user-qo8gs1mp2t]

Thank you for this vid! Was debating on retiring my venerable ProLogic IIx system for a newer Atmos system. Thank you for the least bias review on this platform and showing that while the tech is interesting it is heavily marketing hype and beyond expensive!

[@mvsr990]

When I was a kid I had a "3D sound" audiobook of Stephen King's The Mist on cassette. That was the peak of immersive audio IMO.

[@gorak9000]

some of the "binaural" stuff from the 70's is pretty cool - 2 microphones placed on a "fake head" where the ears would be, and you listen to it on headphones. Pretty sure everything else since then is just a gimmick. I only have 2 ear holes where sound goes in - therefore everything you could possibly hear is captured by 2 microphones placed where your ears would be, and 2 speakers later placed where the microphones were.

[@gregf9160]

I have a digital copy of this. Binaural recording, done right, is astounding.

[@jamescarter3196]

I've heard a really-good version 'The Mist' which was done like a radio play instead of audiobook. Now I'll be looking for that cassette in secondhand stores.

[@Skrenja]

​@@gorak9000 Yeah, but your ears _aren't_ microphones.

[@scytob]

Binaural convolution is awesome for things like audio books, radio plays, etc

[@casaroli]

I’ve got a 5.1.4 system. When the movie is mixed in atmos and when loud objects are on the top channels, it’s awesome. That said, it’s exceedingly rare. With music, there are only a few good atmos mixes out there. Very few albums are composed and mixed with spatial audio in mind.

[@kevofyb]

thats why they get re mixed for atmos with it in mind

[@SoundOfYourDestiny]

Movies are delivered with multichannel streams, and originally mixed with discrete channels for multichannel sound. What music source are you listening to that delivers multichannel audio?

[@casaroli]

@@SoundOfYourDestiny I used to subscribe to Tidal and Qobuz. I don’t remember which one had music in atmos.

[@ChristianIce]

@@kevofyb Those albums were written, arranged, produced, mixed and mastered to be listen to on two speakers. When you mix a record you try to reproduce the live experience. THe band is in front of you, one guitar on a side and the other guitar on the opposite side. Everything in the back is just a distraction. If an artist want to do an "immersive" record it's his call, not Apple's.

[@SoundOfYourDestiny]

@@casaroli Thanks for the reply. I think I was asking which device you were using to stream music that also offered multichannel output (in addition to the service, though, which is interesting info).

[@AaronFrance]

Oh wow. Had no idea you had a youtube channel with this kind of content! Your Flashbulb albums are some of my favourite ever.

[@epmcgee]

I love how Dolby Atmos is being heralded as the right way to listen to music, but the real right way to listen to music is with the performer in front of you. Which will never sound like Dolby Atmos.

[@BigPlasticPlant]

People can barely afford their own home right now, never mind installing a sound system in the living room with a 10ft ceiling that the landlord is about to hike the rent on… I’m glad you talked about this, the amount of micromanagement that goes in to the structure of the sales model makes me think companies like atmos may be fans of the pharmaceutical industry.

[@Bosworth123]

Maybe I should stop getting my boosters.

[@ryankramer]

Atmos is a sound format, not a company.

[@BigPlasticPlant]

@@ryankramer oh thank god you were here to clear that up.

[@ryankramer]

@@BigPlasticPlant It’s only a big deal if you make it one. 🤷🏼‍♂️

[@jamescarter3196]

@@ryankramer It's only a big deal when you start whining about not getting enough credit for stating the obvious

[@odmusicman]

Thank you for validating what I have been screaming for a decade. The first thing I tell people starting and building up in this recording industry is DON'T listen to marketing telling you what you need or KZbinrs getting paid to shill products. You've been added to my exception list, great work.

[@talonsid]

To be fair, it’s possible the artist will make more money by rendering an atmos mix of their stereo mix just to have the “atmos” stamp, and who doesn’t want that?

[@SWATTECHNOLOGIES]

@@talonsid Provided we as studio owners can afford to invest $30-$60K in interface/speaker studio construction upgrades and manage to write that off in depreciation and still come out ahead. Not likely at all.

[@ucantSQ]

I'm not even three minutes in but I just have to say I love this set-up. You're clearly not only intelligent, but compassionate. Thank you!

[@stonethemason12]

Did you mean passionate lol

[@chadkirk925]

I'm an audiophile and a home theater enthusiast. It is IMPOSSIBLE to have a "bubble of sound" unless your room is in the literal shape of a bubble. Acoustics is THE most important thing. There are people with legitimate atmos systems that still don't sound right. You're not going to get there with a soundbar or ceiling reflecting speakers. Even commercial cinemas don't sound like a bubble.

[@Shift4g]

It's a descriptor to provide a visual reference, just like it's impossible to feel like you are in the movie but you get the meaning.

[@dirg3music]

As always, Benn is going to burst someone's bubble and I'm here for it!!

[@GoTeamScotch]

We got front row seats, boys

[@SAerror1]

I'd be happy just to have 5.1 surround sound work reliably on youtube, personally

[@TheChillMelodist]

even if youtube supported 5.1, I doubt that most youtubers would want to spend the time to mix their videos in 5.1. It's a lot more work invovled and for a lot of content on youtube where it's just a personality speaking, it doesn't even make sense to mix in 5 channels.

[@CatFish107]

​@Melodic Fables true, but as a wishful thinking speculation, I'd love to watch a Suzanne Ciani concert in surround. There are some videos where it would be extremely nice.

[@jaccochrysler]

@@CatFish107 Awesome idea. A lot of the classic modular synth stuff is in quad. It would be a dream if YT would be able to handle that.

[@X-3K]

@@TheChillMelodist actually, i'm pretty sure youtube silently added support for 5.1 user generated content a few months ago

[@jordenloves8280]

@@TheChillMelodist isn’t there where ai comes to play?

[@Goodmanperson55]

fun fact about object-based audio. It comes standard with most game engines. If you dig into the settings of a game and find a sound setup option that switches between "headphones" and "speakers", you can essentially get spatial audio with the headphones setting.

[@mkhdnimg]

I remember the algorithm directing me to your channel a while ago. You've become a great Presenter on a series of really interesting topics, delved into with credibilty. I especially enjoyed the one on the Hum sound driving everybody nutz. Respect.

[@tyjuarez]

5.1 was always good enough for movies tbh. I would even say stereo is enough, but just having that extra bandwidth from separating the center and the LFE, plus a little extra "wow" factor from the surround speakers makes the whole thing worthwile

[@collinbeal]

7.2 is as high as I would ever go for cinematic surround sound, and 5.1 for music

[@samuelhildebrandt9074]

​@collinbeal 7.1 requires a specific room and seating layout to properly enjoy, 5.1 can make any audio better in any kind of room with different seating IMO

[@audie-cashstack-uk4881]

​@@samuelhildebrandt9074also 5.1 in smaller rooms allows the same side back effect as 7.1 whitch is only required in larger open spaces as the soundnpasing back and forth isn't separated and flows perfectly well inn5.1 in a average living room

[@belalugrisi1614]

Center channel removes all height perception as compared with stereo. The image shrinks vertically to a narrow band!

[@SamuraiGuy]

I have a 5.1.2 setup just so I could get a taste of every feature without going too crazy. I can confirm that, even in movies with surround sound, the rears and heights are barely used. I think 3.1 is a huge upgrade when watching movies because of the LFE (like you said) and the ability to turn up the center channel to hear dialog better.

[@oldunclemick]

I'll stick to stereo for my creations. In the unlikely event that my music gets into a movie, they'll either want it in stereo (just the same as most music in surround sound movies is still just stereo) or they can pony up for me to make them an exclusive remix at someone else's studio.

[@wendigo2442]

I posted a royalty free track on freesound and it got used in a movie, I even got a credit. You can do it king

[@JZStudiosonline]

I think surround sound music is cool, provided you do it well, but I'm not pretending like it works on a phone or speakers. It's dedicated to a physical surround sound system. I imagine Atmos would be the same, but they ruined it by slapping the label on things like phones, earbuds, laptops, TV screens, etc. that clearly can't actually handle it.

[@BattleAngelSound]

Totally. Even if your music ends up in the movie, it makes no sense to use anything else than stereo. The only exception that could make sense would be a live performance. Otherwise, surround/ambisonic sound effects from the movie + surround/ambisonic music would collide and confuse everyone. "Oh, I can hear explosions behind me, gunshots in front of me and a drummer playing on the right side of the battlefield" :D

[@oldunclemick]

@@BattleAngelSound that would definitely confuse the audience! lol 😂

[@kameoosama]

I feel like if you're gonna go beyond Stereo for music, you should be doing something experimental enough where the positioning of sections is integral to it. Or like the type of ambient music that's trying to immerse you in a specific environment I guess lol. Either way, it's kinda weird to do it on pop music

[@silasfox]

I went speaker shopping with my bother a while ago and I knew those pictures on the boxes with the 3D reflections were crap!! Thanks for your research and detail!!! Super helpful! Helping the community a ton!

[@LDBaha]

When you have a Home Theater and set up Atmos properly it is FREAKING FANTASTIC - it cant be a soundbar. But you are right the entry bar is very high

[@BriManeely]

Thank you, Benn, for always being a resource that I can send to my friends and family when I just don't have the gumption anymore to try to explain why they're being taken advantage of by money-hungry companies

[@EviLFazZ]

LoL... my exact thoughts and already have forwarded this video to several 'family'n'friends 😆

[@noahhonore2022]

I needed this. I'm a mixing engineer and I just figured atmos was where the field of mixing was going next which probably meant mixing in atmos and then downmixing to stereo. Hearing all of this is comforting because dare I say it, I love stereo mixes. I love hearing songs in stereo. Mixing in stereo is hard enough as is. I'm not interested in surround in music. I don't really notice it all that much in theatres either. It'd be nice to have a personal rig for movies but I think stereo is just fine for music. My opinion may change in the future because I know there's the benefit of less distortion. That being said I recall that most atmos remixes and even the stereo downmixes if they start at atmos tend to usually be direct interpretations so that may be why Benn doesn't hear noticeable difference.

[@NakeanWickliff]

Be careful discounting Atmos because of this guys video. It's controversial so gets lots of eyes (not saying this is why he did it). Don't work with the fear of getting left behind but make sure you go expierience a good atmos setup with music somehwere (not a theater...they don't' eq the sound correctly and it's way to fng loud). You may be surprised. It should sound like a stereo mix with a litle icing on the cake at certain times. If it doesn't, it hasn't been set up properly. It's unfortunate this guy hasn't heard a decent atmos setup in his own home. The out of the box stuff doesn't cut it. Just like he wouldn't buy an out of the box complete studio tracking and mixing setup!

[@noahhonore2022]

​@@NakeanWickliff I just think it's more trouble than it's worth depending on where you are in your career. If you start getting requests for atmos mixes then sure, withdraw your overhead and make the switch. There are great DIY atmos rigs out there that more than do the job if cost is a factor. I also don't think stereo is getting left behind. I think stereo is in it's early adoption phase just as much as surround tends to be implemented in home theatres mostly. 2.1 and 2.2 systems need to be widely adopted first. Alot of people are listening to music on soundbars, mono speakers and consumer grade headphones. Part of the job is archiving things right? For alot of us, atmos can wait.

[@NakeanWickliff]

@@noahhonore2022 I completely agree with all of your points. I just don't like that the OP basically said Atmos is garbage, cause it's not. It's a faulse pretense for a correct decision and others shouldn't make the decision because "atmos sucks" (because it doesn't).

[@orbatos]

​@@NakeanWickliff The concept is fine. Yet another proprietary codec that is inferior to open codecs though? *very* unwelcome. Atmos real does not offer anything that couldn't be done before and at such a high price even professionals balk at it. Consider other problems with proprietary tech that ends up defacto standards, it allows for even less consumer control. No thanks.

[@ThoraeJenkins]

Stereo and 2.1 will always be the best ways to listen to music IMO.

[@ivannatinkle]

1:32 Oh man. That show knocked my socks off, I still to this day want to thank you for such an experience.

[@unweoncualquiera2.0]

Love your honesty man!! Your video makes me appreciate even more my traditional 5.1 home theater system. Nice video!

[@clickykbd]

Thanks for saying all the quiet parts out loud... Totally agree. I'm a cinema projectionist... while we don't have ATMOS in our 100+ year old historic theatre, I can see the place for such technologies in cinema experiences, especially with new LED wall screens (that are not transparent, so no channels can be located directly behind them). But as for at home, I still turn vinyl and have a two channel system for music. For films I tend to end up watching them with headphones to not disturb shared wall neighbors. If you want atmos or 7.1 at home for film, fine... but certainly there should be no expectation or hand-forcing for others to master their content for that system.

[@kaitlyn__L]

I miss sound coming from behind the screen in cinemas :(

[@panomaniac5399]

I was a cinema projectionist and enjoyed surround, up to a point. I also worked in a 100+ year old cinema where we had mono+surround. LOL. Hey it worked well, as long as I kept things aligned. Clear dialog and some nice surround effects.

[@asmrengineering3710]

My favorite use of spatial audio is careful binaural convolution panning baked into certain elements of a stereo mix - If you do it right the headphone listener gets a nice spatial expecience of that particular element, while also translating well to speakers and not disappearing in mono.

[@arpaddanos9416]

Is there some place to read or otherwise learn more about what you are describing here? thank you

[@asmrengineering3710]

@@arpaddanos9416 idk offhand but there's a free vst called DearVR Micro that you can play around with! I have to exercise restraint to not overuse it haha - before this I used to use an oculus vst plugin that accomplished the same thing

[@orbatos]

​@@asmrengineering3710 There used to be hardware for this too. I used to have a vinyl demo that was impressive even by modern standards. It was just too expensive and deemed unnecessary at the time.

[@stevenswall]

Do you have an example of a song like this available on Apple music? I have not heard a single song that I have enjoyed with spatial audio on earphones, though I do really enjoy it on my genelec system about half the time if the mastering is good.

[@asmrengineering3710]

​@@stevenswall sure! some tracks I've done this on: Cul-De-Sac by G Brenner at about 3:00 on uses it pretty overtly, as well as some textures in the background of the track Pluperfect Mind by Dear Laika - also various percussive blips from Dog Ears by scuttlefuzz that wiggle in the stereo field - the use of the panning doesn't really call attention to itself (or provide "immersion") but It adds a lively texture that I like a lot, especially when things move around

[@Suzukii-Krypto]

Loved the video, the work, your presentation, candor, and humor. Thanks for what you do.

[@ChristianStout]

I really wish object-based spatial mixing would take off in movies and games. I don't care about having it in music, and I don't care what/whose standard it comes in, but I love spatial audio in games, and in movies I would like the ability to adjust the volumes of voices/music/sfx individually.

[@michaelkonomos]

This is great. I love that you have a contrarian and kind of grumpy vibe going on with things that are good to be grumpy about. Calling out BS is a service to the community. I also love Red Means Recording and Venus Theory for the same reasons.

[@noahhultgren1710]

I tried Atmos years ago and immediately thought of the fact that I have never been to a concert where I was surrounded by musicians instead of them standing in front of me, and I dont think I ever will, what benefit do I receive from the tuba player standing behind my head? On a side note, anyone remember the old quadraphonic systems, like an old version of Atmos from back in the day where you'd use 4 speakers instead of two? That was stupid.

[@TheSteveSteele]

I remember that the Quadraphonic mix of Dark Side of the Moon was the primary demonstration album. Deep Purple’s Machine Head was also released in quadraphonic. Smoke on the Water in quad? If there was ever a song that had no business being mixed in a surround format, that was the song.

[@alistairblaire6001]

KZbin recommended this video to me because I just upgraded my living room system to 5.1 surround after stubbornly sticking with 2.1 for the past 20 years

[@Shift4g]

The video should have been titled Dolby Atmos for Music because it has nothing to do with the movie side of it where it works just fine.

[@rayrayy841]

I bought that same Vizio system open box @ Best Buy for $500 and I've been super happy about it. For the size and price its great, but I never expected it to be this amazing "all around you" sound. There are some moments that make me giggle because it sounds so great. Like when all the ships get blown up in Dune Part 1, sounds so damn cool!

[@johnchedsey1306]

If I want an immersive experience for music, I try to go see them play live. Otherwise, I just want a mix that sound good in my car while I'm driving (and dealing with a certain amount of road noise). I hope that's what most artists would be okay with for my listening experience!

[@JustinLesamiz]

Living performances generally use mono audio for everything because they can't predict where each audience member is standing. So, aside from the immersiveness of the venue and crowd, the audio is even less immersive than a stereo mix.

[@johnchedsey1306]

@@JustinLesamiz immersive is the full experience of attending a live show, not just the technical aspects of audio.

[@BartMassey-PO8]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/eZvNpK1nac1_apo

[@LeMicronaut]

@@JustinLesamiz Definitely this, I've found it pretty rare that an artist has their audio nailed at a venue. AC/DC, Foo Fighters, Deadmau5, and Computer Magic (Danz) come to mind of acts where it was actually dialed in very well. Dozens of other performers, many having toured for decades, I thought were generally better served by listening to the albums first so you can counter the imbalances in your head (and a lot of that is just who runs the venue). Live is definitely more for appreciating the artists as people and seeing the fans.

[@BobbysArchive]

@@LeMicronautit depends on the listener, genre, the band, the engineer, venue, there’s a lot of factors that come into play that make a performance. Comparing studio and live is apples and oranges, there’s a lot of people who prefer only studio or only live versions of songs because of how different or close they are. Me personally I’m fine with sacrificing stereo width and fidelity so I could hear a unique version of a song in a room with fans. There wouldn’t be a demand or need for live albums and bootlegs if they weren’t immersive or good

[@arvindhyuvaraj]

As someone who's been in the market for a new sound system, I cannot thank you enough for this video. The last couple of months have been a mental circus of jumping through hoops and realising that in order to get "the perfect sound" for my 4K discs, I'll have to literally change the way my living room is built. That's insane.

[@OZKitchen]

Yes but tbf if you spend too much time looking up "perfect sound" you'll find people saying you have to rebuild your entire house

[@acheleg]

With a home theatre system like this, you would still need to keep an old stereo system to enjoy your favorite music

[@SamuraiGuy]

All I can recommend is getting at least a real 3.1 system. The center channel and sub help a lot, and you don't really need to rearrange your life.

[@webby2275]

​@SamuraiGuy At least get a real receiver. My Denon 1600h can do Atmos, mono, stereo, quad, and basic surround. It's the decision to go with a bespoke solution like a soundbar or home theater in a box that is creating the issue of stereo sound not working well. Not that it's primarily the purchaser at fault here, the marketing for this stuff is manipulative at best. Unfortunately home theater receivers are expensive, but the upside is that you can use any speaker with them and upgrade only some components as desire arises, instead of having to replace it all at once.

[@SamuraiGuy]

@@webby2275 "real" systems are more expensive, but also take more space and time to learn how to pick parts and put them together. I did put together a system fully utilizing a 960h, and I'm glad I did, but when most people don't care to use anything more than their TV speakers, a simple soundbar gets most of the way there. I just want people to get the center channel and sub because they're probably an upgrade most people will appreciate.

[@belalugrisi1614]

Instant sub! Thank you, Benn!

[@mikwells]

I thoroughly enjoy your witty and left-filed style. xxx

[@coatduck]

on one hand, mastering my music for object based systems sounds awesome, I'd love to experience my own music that way, and the idea of being able to move instruments like that sounds great, but on the other hand, visiting friends and realizing that they listen to music on a google home that's in a different room with the volume turned up... I can be pretty confident that even the basic stereo things I do are probably lost with the delivery that 90% of people listen with.

[@peterbronez1188]

I wish stuff was reliably produced at different levels of fidelity. Sure, crank out a hella compressed version for mobile. Maybe make it mono! Then consider an audiophile 2 channel mix, with actual dynamics. Maybe then extend that to an immersive object-based format. I think the reason this doesn’t happen is mostly that the value doesn’t flow back to the artists well enough. There’s a market for those higher fidelity versions, but it’s small and difficult to reach. 😕

[@DaftFader]

I have a similar thought process, and always have since Dolby surround sound first came out for consumer home theater. It would be cool to make music in surround, but it'd only be for me and the random few people who can afford and have a surround set up, and I would NOT want it to be the only way to listen to it, nor it to be forced down peoples throats. I see it as it's own thing, not a replacement for stereo, but something for people with specialized interest in new/exciting audio experiences and money. Not as some standard across the board. Hyper aggressive marketing only works if there's some core level of adoption by a big enough % of the base of stereo listeners, and that just isn't the case. It's hard enough getting people to listen to your music on a decent pair of stereo speakers so they can hear the bass, let alone 24 of them so they can hear sound behind them and above their heads! I've heard someone argue "well Atmos is in Tesla and Mercedes cars now!" and I'm like .. what about "Toyota, Honda, Chevy, Ford, Nissan, Dodge, Mazda..." and all the other more common brands of cars that aren't upmarket and account for the majority of consumer cars? Just because 2 or 3 expensive brands now put these sound systems in their cars doesn't mean it's become widely adopted or normalized in the slightest, nor does it mean it will become so in the future (which was the point they were trying to make). Sure there's a market for it, but it's not big enough to become an overarching standard audio format, when 99% of people will be listening to the folded down 2 speaker version if it did anyway. That's the definition of uneconomic and wasteful, poring so many resources into something that will, for the most part, be completely underutilized in it's intended format. But hey, who'd of thunk Apple would of been at the forefront of ramming something down your throat you don't want or need, to the point of them trying to break/make obsolete something that worked perfectly (stereo) just to force you to buy something most people wont use fully (Atmos wrapped up in Apple spacial audio). At least USB C is cross compatible I suppose, although headphone 3.5mm jacks are still just as useful and haven't gone anywhere, despite their attempt to remove them from existence!

[@burnt-reynolds]

I fucking love you, Benn. Like abstractly, not parasocially or anything.

[@emamusicgeek]

As someone who listens with a basic 2.0 setup, the main thing I've noticed about Atmos mixes is their much more dynamic sound compared to standard album releases, which often suffer from heavy compression due to the loudness war. Admittedly, getting Atmos files and converting them to 2.0 requires some tinkering, but the outcome, for me, is outstanding. That's why, and solely for this reason, I wish more albums would come out in Atmos in the future.

[@ErikTheAndroid]

Absolutely loving the swearing and honesty in this video. Both of those things are extremely rare in the world of audio where most people are just trying to sell you some new scam (AMP/DAC).

[@julianmorrisco]

Here’s a cautionary tale. In about 2003 I converted my studio, basically a glorified home studio with treatment and, at the time, regular work coming in, to 5.1. I’ve done precisely two paid mixes in 5.1 and only one of those ever went into a theatre. I love mixing for surround and listening to it is wonderful. But when I came up in the 80s, the key review of a mix was to dub it onto a cassette and go for a drive and play it on a bog standard factory car audio system. And this was a time when many more people would sit down and actually listen to an album. Earbuds, mobile phones etc have made this type of listening extremely rare. Even the people who say they care about audio quality (I don’t mean audiophiles, those men - I’ve never met a woman who calls herself an audiophile - are lunatics. Green felt markers make your CDs sound better, don’t you know?) anyway, people who care about sound quality often fall for the BS that is Beats headphones. Yes, Beats can sound good. But accurate? Pfffft. And you pay a ton for the name. They are the monster cable of headphones. And they’re headphones. Enough said there. Anyway, I digress. I think this is possibly the 4th or 5th time I’ve been told surround sound, quadrophonic, Atmos, Ambisonic, whatever, is the future of audio and/or music. But stereo remains the majority of listening experiences by so much, the percentage of listens on an immersive or surround system looks like a rounding error. Ok. I, too, love the 4-channel Ambisonic stuff. b-format whatever. It’s a lot of fun. But I’ve never met anyone who could be called anything like a consumer who listens to more than two channels regularly.

[@Slurkz]

Fun fact: Beats was a Monster product before Apple acquired Beats. But maybe I’m kicking open een open door here. Great comment bij the way… 👌🏻

[@trippmoore]

I have a vintage Sansui 5500 receiver and the QS-500 rear channel amp attached to it. I have 15 or so quad encoded LPs, not all of them encoded in QS (the version of quad encoding that Sansui developed). Some are SQ so I can't decode those or the CD-4 encoded ones. So maybe I have 5 QS encoded LPs. I got them not because I was looking for them, but I just came across them at goodwill or where ever. I do have Sly & The Family Stone's greatest hits in quad that I also have a stereo pressing of, and it's a pretty good record. A fun listen even if I'm not a rabid fan, but it's in SQ. Womp womp. As for CD-4, that's supposedly results in the best "real" quad experience because unlike the others which are matrix encodings (not true discrete 4 channel) CD-4 does actually encode the 2 additional discrete channels, but there''s a catch. (We'll ignore that stereo records do not contain a discrete left and right channel, but a left channel and a difference channel from which the right channel comes by applying it to the discrete left channel signal that requires no prossesing or demodulating or matrix mathing to get to the actual signal). The CD-4 signal is modulated to 38khz carrier signal (or something near that), which in itself isn't an issue. Demodulating carrier signals is how we get stereo over the FM frequency band and we all love how that sounds. The problem is that your average stylus is not designed to pick up frequencies that high. They go to 22khz maybe. So you need a special (read expensive) stylus of the finest teeny tiny point of contact that gets down and can pick up those frequencies. Then you need special "ultra low capacitance" phono cables so they don't accidentally filter out that frequency. once you got the very low high frequecy signal in your CD-4 pre-amp then you are set becaus the demodulation process is simple and you've got your 2 rear channels. That is if the 50 year old record still has the high frequency data and it hasn't been "scrubbed" off the grooves by your shity conical stereo stylus/cart that you have tracking at 5gms. I've heard that og dolby pro-logic (a 4 channel surround tech, FL. C. FR. RL and RR are just the same single read hannel) uses the same methods as CD-4 to get it's 4 channel signals, and so it can decode a CD-4 signal (I've heard. Could ne wring an evne so it's only the OG Dolby Pro logic version 1 that might work). I aint spending the $400 for a shibata styus just for Sly.

[@user-tf1oo9rj6u]

I'll say that as a gamer, it is sad to me that multi-speaker headphones are a rare nitch thing. I think that could all turn around fast if android or apple advertised bluetooth headphone to stream in 4.1 or 6.1 as a standard feature and got a streaming service on board with it. I'm amazed how many people watch movies on their phone instead of a laptop or tv nearby. They select HD on youtube, so it seems logical to have auto surround sound too.

[@Bozebo]

As a consumer I dipped back from 5.1 to stereo because it was always terribly done over the top in games and film. Half the time you had to manually set it to stereo to actually consume the media, and infact you got better positional audio too because it was actually done right instead of lazily as a gimmick.

[@kaitlyn__L]

You're totally right about it being all guys, and those guys work very hard to ensure it stays a boys' only club. I used to call myself an audiophile, as a teenager who just thought it meant you appreciated good quality speakers and headphones. The Audiophiles laughed me out of online spaces because I hadn't spent £20k on an amp and wasn't putting the special felt marker on my CDs, and I was GASP using the analogue audio out on my CD player. I never called myself an audiophile again even though I do certainly seek out the flattest frequency response curve in headphones and stuff like that - stuff I didn't know about as a teen but certainly was never informed about by those Audiophiles. It's musicians who taught me about all that. Musicians care to distinguish the snake-oil in a way those guys just don't.

[@Bricex17]

Every video. EVERY video you make it fantastic. Even if the title and thumbnail don't get me excited, I know that I won't be disappointed. I appreciate your attitude, methodology, and commitment to honesty and transparency. You keep things interesting with your passion and I'm here for it. Keep up the good work Benn!

[@atbrenthor2792]

Really really great video. I sunk a pile of time and money into atmos for headphones and years later I just listen/watch everything in stereo. A good 2.1 setup or a good set of headphones playing a high bitrate file in stereo always just sounds better to me. Not to mention the hours of fucking around trying to make sure atmos/surround is even working. Everything is mixed for stereo. It's plug and play every time.

[@mezla5455]

I just found your content and I honestly love your dry sense of humor

[@nebula0024]

This video *really* strikes a chord with me. Back in the day, I would use a 5.1 system for my games, and for the most part it would just work. Especially with PC games. Now, finding a 5.1 system or Atmos system that supports HDMI and is actually *affordable* is a real headache. There are SOOOOO many products out there that are complete junk, and even the ones that are "good" don't really compare to what I was using 15 years ago. It all took me completely by surprise when I went looking to buy a new sound system, because I foolishly assumed the surround ecosystem would have become a lot more streamlined and standardized by now. Silly me.

[@JZStudiosonline]

I got a $400 (probably $500 now) Yamaha bundle with an actual 5.1 avr and all 6 speakers. Works really well. Has 4k HDR HDMI and everything. I think Yamaha is the best entry point to actual AVRs, they have the same software as the high end models on the cheaper ones so they have fully fleshed out features.

[@jakedill1304]

So I have a device, that in theory.. will.. in theory.. with many extra steps that have insured it's not been taken out of the plastic.. switch RCA into HDMI.. theoretically... Apparently this is just something that they really don't want you to do LOL.. and I've never used HDMI for anything audio.... Especially as a PC gamer that's always had a sound card where the outputs have always been analog LOL.. like the HDMI thing happened and, it was like cool story bro.. that'll be great if I don't want to hook up speakers and I'm using a TV (which I do, but for displaying purposes, I treat it like a monitor which I wouldn't want to have audio anyways LOL just add more pass-throughs for heaven's sake LOL..) What's really frustrating is I have a near perfect audio setup for to the point where I've set it up in a way that should I wish to improve it I would have to spend significantly more money and as long as I don't hear anything like that.. I'm at the top of where I need to be LOL.. and it was based around the problem of needing to find RCA for surround on my sound card.. No I don't like center channels and I don't like subwoofers.. I don't need them either LOL I have full range floor speakers that each have 12 in woofers.. and if I was going to set up subs, I would have to do a whole bunch of things that I don't want to do LOL when I can get at the very least consistent surround low channels in surround.... and also honestly like center channels are kind of pointless.. if I was doing a 5.1 setup then yeah I would wanta center channel probably because we're talking about midget speakers at that point.. and then yeah I would have to get a sub because it would need to start doing all the sub things to compensate for the fact that the center channel is almost universally going to be limited in range, just on the mixing and never mind the output end... Of course, ghosting the center channel has never been a problem in PC world, as has full range surround never been a problem.. it just does the thing, but that translation is very sad that my production computer, has not so much lacking the DRM handshakes as all of the components in the chain have the DRM handshake of the Dolby and the DTs.. including the receiver.. including the television which is not in the chain and because I don't want to watch my content on a cell phone.. the best way to get quality is to either buy a Blu-ray or torrent a Blu-ray as streaming services don't really provide you with the surround sound on the computer.. or even the 4K or any number of things... One of these days I'm going to set up XP, if I can figure out how to find that 64-bit version that I had always tried to get to work but never could.. and just see if I was just remembering things wrong.. I feel like I I wasn't, but it was because I wasn't looking for it, I wasn't told that it had it I just remembered it having it and I remember it not having it when unreal 3 got really popular.. LOL I just remembered that being jarring having somebody in a house on the floor above me sound like he was behind me.. I was like well that's bad sound design why doesn't it do up and down....lol.

[@DaftFader]

@@jakedill1304 Yeah as someone who mixes and makes tracks, but also games, I use HDMI audio only when I am using my PC for youtube or am not playing a game where I need to listen for footsteps etc, or if I CBA to turn my speakers on, or it's late at night or something. It's useful to not have extra wires, but that's about it really. I had exactly the same experience with DVI+fiber optics digital out to my monitor except it had 2 wires instead of one (it's basically the same thing, HDMI = DVI+digital audio).

[@jamesphillips2285]

HDMI was invented to push HDCP copy protections onto consumer devices. The read single cable AV standard is SDI using industry-standard 50 ohm coax with BNC connectors.

[@DaftFader]

@@jamesphillips2285 HDMI and DVI-D are two standards for the transmission of digital image signals, each with different protocols, but in part the same type of conductor which, among other things, also makes them compatible with each other. The difference is primarily that DVI is a computer monitor standard and not prepared for sound transfer. The DVI protocol is somewhat more sensitive to noise and therefore cannot cope with as long cables as HDMI. HDMI is a newer standard and designed for multimedia transmission and the protocol therefore has more options and control signals than DVI (including things like HDCP).

[@mchirag]

Watching this video before WWDC today, I can't unhear how often apple says "spatial". Appreciate the work you put in!

[@MobiusGT]

im not a fan of apple music but when i tried apple's spacial music on my cheap $500 home theater system i was truly wow'd and even some songs i didn't like before i quite enjoyed.

[@justish9600]

Love how funny you are delivering genuine information

[@elliotmarks06]

I recently saw a really cool video by Steve Mould on the topic of acoustic cameras. By using a bunch of well-placed microphones and clever algorithms, it's possible to accurately visualize where sounds are coming from, as well as how they bounce around and interact with the environment. Watching more of your videos, this topic seemed right up your alley! I'd love to see a video not only on the science behind it, but maybe you could try to make one for yourself!

[@UnthankMusic]

It just occurred to me to check after watching this and it turns out I have an Atmos soundbar on my TV. The clarity of bass frequencies when I'm watching Masterchef is unrivalled.

[@tungtobak]

Do bass sound different than other fish when getting cooked?

[@jordanrodrigues1279]

This is hilarious because bass frequencies cannot have much spatial clarity, it's a physical and physiological limitation that can't be overcome... unless you make your head bigger. 😅

[@metalmanexetreme]

@@tungtobak I heard they sing for their lives

[@metalmanexetreme]

@@jordanrodrigues1279 atmos doesn’t give the bass spatial depth but boosts the low frequency so it sounds more “rumbly”

[@phutureproof]

its all about the bass knowledge

[@Jeff-wb3hh]

Finally, someone telling us the truth about Atmos. I'm a classical music lover and love trying to recreate the live Orchestra Hall sound, since I can't go to concerts. I thought of upgrading to Atmos and buying 4 more speakers for height, front and back. Then I discovered that only one classical release has been done in Atmos and it was artificially recreated from a 1960's 2 channel recording of Karajan conducting the Berlin Philharmonic of Beethoven's symphonies. No thank you. I'll stick with MDG's 2+2+2 almost real sounding 3-D surround recordings on SACD using 6 channels 2 front + 2 front height + 2 rear speakers. Also, SACD's 5.0 (and 5.1) surround is pretty good too, as long as the rear channel speakers are a couple feet above the ear level behind you. I have one chair in the center of my listening room in the sweet spot for me only. Total cost after saving for about 4-years was about $6,000 for a used Denon SACD multi-channel player, used Denon receiver and good set of 7 speakers plus a sub-woofer in 2009. The 7.1 speakers took up 80% of the budget. It took a lot of thinking to make it work right and be able to switch between MDG's 2 + 2 + 2 set-up and a standard 5.1 set-up easily. I really love the way classical music surround sound SACD's sound on my system. I will not be "upgrading" to Atmos!

[@scitor]

_"If however you're listening to music makes you happy then you are listening to it Perfectly."_ ❤

[@elliotmarks06]

I cannot get over how amazingly made your videos are! I just found your channel, and everything is just executed so perfectly. Everything from the initial idea, scientific explanations, editing, engagement, etc. is done so well. Thanks for these awesome videos, and I'm excited to see more of your stuff in the future!

[@loggedPeriodically]

I really like Atmos as a concept - having ultimate flexibility with mixing and a (theoretically) better listening experience is something I'm all for. What I'm personally not such a fan of, with Dolby's implementation at least, is the proprietary nature of the format. I don't like the idea that I should have to license the way that I distribute my music, that personally doesn't sit right with me. From the little research I've done though, the ADM format (which Atmos uses to hold its data) appears to be open source, so there is some possibility there I suppose. Anyhow, the cost of entry having a system capable of using it professionally seems more than a little bit steep, which is my main reason for sticking to Stereo for now.

[@mk1st]

Agreed. It should really be dedicated to high end "pro" environments, primarily used in theaters, planetariums and billionaires' cigar rooms. At least the producers would know that the equipment being used would be capable of delivering what they are hearing during the mixing/mastering process. Having consumers needing to do so much and shell out money at every step is a sure way to degrade the brand.

[@DaftFader]

I totally agree, It has uses and is a neat idea for a format. Makes surround sound not be limited to just surround systems. But this hyper aggressive marketing and forcing of the consumer to comply or miss out by slowly attempting to push for standard stereo to go into obsolescence is shady AF imo. No wonder Apple has got their mits all over this one.

[@MPaans]

So happy to see you have an Onkyo as well, been very happy with that brand for over 2 decades!

[@DCMedien]

I'm using a 7.2.4 system at home, in a special room, just for that with a 120" canvas. It's absolutely mind-blowing, and i just LOVE it and I'm very thankful for every dolby atmos release out there. That being said, i totally understand why most people won't take this kind of struggle to get something similar at home. Standing 7 speakers perfectly aligned in your living room is a pain in the a** enough. But get 4 ceiling speakers going is another kind of struggle. Cable management is a nightmare, so is the alignment. And even then, you just have one spot in the room to really enjoy it. In my cinema room I used over 100 meters of cable, for the speakers only. Along comes hdmi cables, (expensive) composite cables for the subwoofers, ethernet, toslink cables for some older tech, etc. It's a nightmare. For me, it's perfectly fine, because i love this kind of stuff. But i totally understand anyone who doesn't even want to set up a 5.1 system. Most "normal" people got headaches by just seeing the tons of cables behind my AV reciever.

[@carlkolthoff5402]

Same, but on a budget. Atmos 5.1.2 and 75". Our room is too small to handle a larger display and more speakers anyway. I absolutely love having this room when watching movies, but I never go there to listen to music and I've never tried mixing my own stuff in anything else than old school stereo. Have you found any music mixes where immersive sound adds any value? I'm thinking it could make sense for live recordings of acoustic instruments in a nice sounding room. Perhaps a jazz trio in a lively club or symphony orchestra in a large concert hall. Use it to add the environment, not in-your-face-FX.

[@DCMedien]

@@carlkolthoff5402 Pink Floyd the Dark Side of the Moon, or Mike Oldfield Tubular bells are a prime example for good Atmos Music. Yello also has a special atmos album, and Billy eilish makes some decent tracks. Of course also a matter of your music taste ;)

[@DCMedien]

@@carlkolthoff5402 Pink Floyd the Dark Side of the moon and Mike Oldfield Tubular bells are prime examples for good Atmos Music. Yello also has a special atmos album, and Billy eilish makes some decent tracks in Atmos too. But of course it all depends on your music taste

[@dmoracze]

Great video. I was weak and bought a Klipsch Atmos system. The ceiling reflections didn't come through at all, but I can say that listening to a 5.1 mix of an album where a skilled musician/mix engineer (eg Steven Wilson) actually mixed in 5.1 is a really cool albeit privileged experience.

[@jeanking4686]

I already have a grudge with dolby for taking away true calculated hrtf audio for gaming by aureal, and they're just going further and further with this "virtual speaker" stuff. Edit: yeah sorry, as pointed out by drinklava it was creative labs who bought aureal. But the point still stand that it shows they can trick us with the virtual surround sound.

[@IDrinkLava]

That was creative labs, not Dolby.

[@jeanking4686]

@@IDrinkLava my bad, you're right

[@user-tf1oo9rj6u]

Windows breaking driver compatibility every 6mo is what killed creative. You can only take so many years of having to rewrite and refix stuff you've already sold before it's not worth it anymore.

[@SnackAttack77]

Awesome video, thanks for the brutal honesty, the internet needs more of it. Some of this stuff is excessive as hell. I've got an old Sony Blu-ray/surround 5.1 that's only being used as 2.1 because I'm too lazy to run the rear speakers through my attic.....and I actually really love just having the system run as a 2.1.

[@AdamLMore]

I’m a home theater enthusiast that has a dedicated 7.1.4 setup. I use it 95% of the time for movies and games (and it’s totally true that most games don’t support the height channels). I find your point of it being choke point capitalism is also very accurate. You need very specific equipment and sources to get it to work. There is also a very high (for typical consumer) knowledge bar to get it to all work correctly. That being said, when it’s all setup correctly and you are listening to movies/music/games that are made for it, it’s some of the best media experiences you can have. It’s not really for everyone, at least not yet, but I look forward to the day where atom setups (or other surround setups) are commonplace in cars (where the masses mostly listen to music). I see mastering stuff in atoms (or dts:x) as a form of future proofing for future entertainment systems (and current proofing for enthusiast setups).

[@Tav_cr]

The best video I've seen on KZbin this year. Man, I really loved how hilarious you were while approaching this no reason audio trend. Good job.

[@gmo2932]

Finally someone makes a good video about the current state of atmos (in 2023). I’m in the audio post side and people get really emotional when saying anything negative atmos. But all of this is totally true. This atmos world is currently so similar to the NFT & crytpo bros a few years back. Hype hype and hype to gain some . I also used to work in movie distribution tech, another thing to keep in mind is that Dolby works deals w movie studios, broadcasters and streaming companies to get them to use atmos and make it a marketing gimmick to sell a more expensive subscription. They add it to contracts and comes from higher ups (SVP, CTOs, Head of salsa etc), Because that’s how Dolby rolls, still stuck in the 80s-whisky-sales meetings in Burbank trying to push their next thing. Don’t get me wrong , the actual tech is cool and fun in the proper setting/etc but everything around it is just well, what’s in the video explains it. Oh… you forgot it has to be a specific hdmi cable lol. And so on…

[@SamuraiGuy]

He probably didn't mention the HDMI cable because the HDMI cable doesn't necessarily benefit Dolby. It's just higher bandwidth, and you need it for extremely high resolutions anyways.

[@kunchography3725]

Apple decided for me that my HomePods use exclusively Dolby Atmos. I decided that I am completely happy with it. I don’t want a room filled with speakers so these do the job for me and for what they are I get a good sound field around me. I also do get overhead sound.

[@proksalevente]

I really enjoy the traditional stereo image, thank you very much, mister dolby. I watched the dune movie on my stereo setup, which consists of Kali In8v2's and an SVS PB-1000 Subwoofer in stereo, which could be considered studio equipment, not consumer audio products. I didn't notice the lack of rear speakers, but oh boy did I notice the punch these speakers pack. They have tons of headroom, in my mid sized (15 m2) listening space I would be in pain before the speakers would start to hit their limit. In conclusion, I've leanerd that to get an experience just like in a movie theater, you don't need lots of channels, you just need distortion free spl with a good frequency response on two (or more) speakers and a subwoofer.

[@realSethMeyers]

This video introduced me to your channel and it's fantastic. You have no idea how satisfying it is to finally see someone crystalizing these ideas so eloquently and effectively.

[@TokeBoisen]

This video excellently lays out the many reasons why, even though I've spent way too much time setting up a 5.1.4 system in my living room, and disregarding the fact that all the true hometheater enthusiasts have already started typing out why that won't do, I'll always be happy whenever a mix comes along that justifies it and will just have to appreciate it when it happens because for the most part on most services with most content, I just have a good 5.1 setup, and there's a multitude of other reasons why Atmos and full-bore hometheaters will never be the primary focus for the majority of creators and artists. It just doesn't justify the workload to mix for something 99% will never hear, and if you do that and people don't have the exactly right equipment and setup, you're giving everyone else an inferior experience.

[@SqueakyNeb]

"Sorry if this sounded ranty" HUH? SORRY? Why would you be SORRY, this was PERFECT!

[@ElmerLa]

The first time I heard immersive audio was at Galaxy Studios and it was their format, Auro 3D. It blew me away. Dolby Atmos has yet to impress me on the same level. I fully agree with your assessment of Dolby Atmos-mixed tracks… some random panning and, on a number of tracks I listened to, some extra reverb, I guess to make it sound… spacious? Add in head tracking and it is just an unpleasant experience… I despise those mixes in the early days of stereo where the entire summit was sent only to the left channel along with the vocals and the guitar and bass in the right… why would I want this to happen whenever I turn my head? I want the music to stay in one place - in front of me, like I was at a show, watching the band.