Best Keyboard for developers? - Logitech ERGO K860 Review

A good keyboard is essential to any developer, but what is a good keyboard is a very different concept depending on who you ask. In this video I talk a little bit about my preferences and history with ergonomic keyboards, why they are the best option for me and then unbox and review my latest ergonomic keyboard, the Logitech ERGO K860.
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[@DavidMarshall2]

Thanks for the review, it was very thorough and helpful!

[@rroca]

Thanks, glad you enjoyed it!

[@CarloFloris]

Hi great video! I also bought this keyboard for my Developer job, and now I can't turn back to another keyboard. The first day was a little bit awkward I admit. But once you got it, it is magical. The writing is easy and no more wrist pain, back too. I always bought Logitech devices and this is really recommended if you have to work on pc many hours (but not for gaming). But I disagree to the battery AAA required, because an internal battery it id always decaying in durability, for me obviously. Thanks to you for the review!

[@Mike0193Azul]

Great review thank you! Going to get this over the new mx mechanical keyboards because of how much quieter it is. Along with he mx lift since it's even more quiet than the 3s

[@rroca]

Thanks! Glad I could help, been using this for a little over a year now and love it

[@LuzVerr]

Obrigado pela review!

[@43051806]

many thanks Rodolfo I appreciate your knowledge

[@rroca]

Thanks!! :)

[@mirabilis.development]

Thanks for the review! It helped me with the purchase decision to get one K860 to use through programming. Currently, I am using a mechanical keyboard, I know that some features I will lose (e.g., swap keycaps, reprogram any key with custom firmware, and be able to teardown to clean everything) but I want to go full ergonomic without to expend too much money in a moonlander.

[@rroca]

Glad the video was helpful, hope you enjoy the keyboard, let me know what you think of it after using for a few weeks

[@mirabilis.development]

@@rroca after 2 months of usage, I can share feedback about what I think about the keyboard. The good part is: It is a pretty solid keyboard, I love using it for everything. I noticed less pain at the end of a day of work, and the angle is perfect for long hours of programming/typing. I also noticed a boot in my typing speed, it was more accessible to typing as the layout forces you to alternate the hands on the keys (I went from 30 wpm to 47 wpm) The bad part: I am a Linux user, so there are no Logi Options to customize the default options for the keyboard. Fortunately, the defaults get the job done, but I miss the power to reprogram the functions of some keys. Cleaning the keyboard is harder, as the palm rest does not detach, neither the keys. I am using Compressed Air to do the cleaning. Thanks again for this video; it helped me a lot to decide to buy the keyboard and has been a great partner in my job!

[@RannyeriRodriguesB]

mermão, excelente vídeo! você tá muito de parabéns cara!!! excelente inglês btw

[@tofu_golem]

Like you, I've used almost nothing but ergonomic keyboards since the 1990s. Recently, I switched to those mechanical gaming keyboards because I liked the sensation of typing that roughly duplicated what I remember of 1980s computer keyboards from before the days of membrane keyboards. Plus, the gaming keyboards had RGB lighting (embarrassed). Anyway, I recently figured out that the pain I was getting in my right elbow on shoulder/chest day workouts was caused by my keyboard. This bummed me out because I really liked that keyboard, and just got the macro keys set up like I like them. But nothing is worth getting carpal tunnel syndrome, so I bought a Logitech K860 today, and don't regret it at all. To be honest, I can live without backlighting, as I'm a touch-typist. Backlighting would be nice to have, but strictly speaking, I'm used to not having that on my ergonomic keyboards.

[@rroca]

Oh man, that sucks! The pain issue thing, sad to hear it. Hopefully the new keyboard help with that, I've been tempted before to get a mechanical one but am afraid of this very thing (anytime I use a laptop keyboard for too long I get a bit of fatigue pain on my wrists so, I imagine a regular shaped mechanical keyboard might do the same). About the backlight, it doesn't bother me as well, it's just that for the price I think it should have either a backlight or a rechargeable battery or not be all plastic, it's more of a value thing for the price than missing the feature itself.

[@Allendaleism]

Thankyou Rodolfo, from your review I decided to buy this keyboard. This keyboard is great after a day or two of adaptation (I really hate using left finger to type 'B' at first and still doing typo for 'C V B' until now). I am using this keyboard for programming and CAD design, I would say this keyboard is perfect for programming, but not for CAD. in CAD, you have to use left hand to type shortcut command while right hand is using mouse to point object, so I have to reassign shortcut to make it more comfortable. anyway, I dont regret my purchase 100%, it feels good, premium, and really, really comfortable.

[@rroca]

Thank you!! I'm glad the review was helpful and that you enjoyed the keyboard

[@AndrasEliassen]

Great review! From the title I thought maybe you were going to touch on some more developer-specific things about the keyboard, like maybe the customization options of the software that comes with it, but then again, that would maybe not merely apply to this particular keyboard, so my mistake! I'm definitely going to purchase one of these, as this is the most recommended ergonomic keyboard out there currently (to my knowledge). And I agree that if there was another variant with backlit keys or even RGB, I would definitely go for that option. The batteries I disagree on, because I'd rather switch those to new ones every now and then, instead of having the internal batteries getting too weak over time, and then having to replace the entire keyboard at some point, just because the batteries are no longer functional. Thanks again for the review. Excellent work!

[@rroca]

Hey, so I also prefer not having built in batteries, the comment was just in regards to price, Apple keyboards are aluminum and have a battery and at the time cost $129, this keyboard is plastic and does not have a battery and also used to cost $129, so it was a matter of just comparing the fact that one had better materials and more stuff inside which makes it cost more to make. So, I think Logitech just had a crazy high markup here.

[@rialzito]

Excelente pronúncia e review man! só descobri que era brasileiro pelos comentários, é raro encontrar um brasileiro com uma pronuncia tão boa

[@foyl4e]

Thankyou man! having thoughts about buying it but really come in hand! Could you describe any issues with the programing experiences? anything wrong with typos or macros?

[@rroca]

Thanks Francisco, glad the video was helpful! I can't say anything related to programming specifically, in the beginning I had more than usual typos while writing anything, didn't matter if it was code or an email, but after a few weeks of use it was fine. It's been a few months now and I am completely used to it by now and can write anything without looking at the keyboard and not get any typos.

[@brunoguimaraes4044]

Velho, parabéns pelo vídeo. Também sou dev, estou considerando comprar o k860. Meu mouse também é o mx master 3s. Gostei da análise!

[@rroca]

Muito obrigado Bruno! Espero que o video tenha ajudado na decisão ai de comprar ou não

[@carlossilva-ub4pv]

good review!!

[@rroca]

Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it

[@MrCookysh]

Хороший обзор! Ты рассказал все, что я хотел узнать про эту клавиатуру. Спасибо!

[@rroca]

Рад, что вам понравилось и было полезно!! (Переведено Google)

[@extraordinaryhuman1806]

ingles fino do fino hein cara. Parabens e obrigado pela apresentação

[@rroca]

Muito obrigado!!

[@hberto]

Ótimo vídeo e parabéns pelo inglês! Você recomenda o teclado MS Sculpt? Nunca utilizei teclados ergonômicos, pensei em comprar este que você mostrou, porém vou aguardar a Logitech lançar uma versão sem numpad. Ps.: Para ser utilizado em um Mac.

[@danielteles]

Cara, eu tenho um Sculpt e caí aqui no vídeo pq estou pensando em trocar por um K860 😅 Eu acho o Sculpt excelente, as teclas tem o melhor travel distance dos teclados que já usei. Tenho o meu desde 2019 (e as pilhas ainda são as mesmas que vieram na caixa). Quando comprei estava usando windows, porém, no meio de 2020 passei a usar mac e aí começou a ficar um pouco mais complicado. Pq meu mac só tem entrada USC-C, o Sculpt só tem conexão wireless e não bluetooth, aí eu preciso usar um dongle para conectar o receptor do teclado ao Mac (até aí tudo bem pq eu já teria que usar para o HDMI também), o problema é que sempre tenho problemas de conexão, imagino que seja a qualidade do dongle, mas não quero ter que ficar comprando vários para fazer esse tipo de teste. Daí estou procurando um teclado que tenha conectividade Bluetooth. Quanto ao restante da integração é bem ok, a tecla WIN vc usa como CMD, ALT vira OPTION e assim por diante, é questão de costume mesmo. O único problema para mim é essa questão da conectividade.

[@rroca]

Opa, tudo bem Helder?! Desculpe a demora na resposta, estava de ferias e só vi hoje, o MS Sculpt é bom, porém ele não é bluetooth, precisa ocupar uma porta USB com dongle wireless dele, o que sinceramente hoje em dia é um passo para trás né?! Tirando isso ele é ótimo mas eu ainda recomendaria o Logitech ao invés do Sculpt, mesmo com numpad, o numpad dele não é grande, não ocupa mto espaço. Espero que ajude

[@hberto]

@@rroca obrigado! encomendei o Logitech ontem, mesmo não utilizando o numpad, acredito que seja um bom produto.

[@hberto]

@@rroca meu logitech chegou essa semana, ainda estou apanhando um pouco para digitar e o tamanho dele me incomoda um pouco, mas é um teclado de excelente qualidade.

[@rroca]

@@hberto Eu demorei uma semana ou duas pra me acostumar também, mas espero que goste!!

[@joaovictoroliveirapereira9395]

Ótimo review Rodolfo, bem explicativo! Acabei de comprar ele para ver se melhorar a ergonomia do meu setup, ainda mais que passo o dia inteiro programando. Juntou a ergonomia com o pro dele ser wireless e não ter teclas pontiagudas que me dão bolhas nos dedos como uns teclados mecânicos que eu usei

[@joaovictoroliveirapereira9395]

Depois dele vou tentar ir atrás do Mouse sem fio Logitech MX Vertical

[@rroca]

Feliz que o review foi útil João! Espero que esteja curtindo. Eu nunca usei o MX vertical mas gosto bastante do MX Master 3 que eu uso

[@PopDiveWithVishal]

I moved from MS sculpt mouse to Logitech Lift, but I still prefer MS sculpt keyboard. If you can stay with the dongle then its great too. For the numpad thing, imo its better to not have a numpad such that your mouse is near to center of keyboard which really improves the ergonomics as you don’t have to reach far for mouse.

[@rroca]

I love the sculpt, but it needing that usb A dongle in a world that's changing to usb c is the problem for me and why I changed first to the surface that was bluetooth, then when I started having problems with that came this one. Quite happy with this one though

[@danieldamacena5197]

Em primeiro lugar, parabéns pelo inglês! Realmente ótimo! Sobre o teclado, essa altura na frente é pra fazer o ângulo de 12 graus no pulso, que, supostamente, é o ângulo perfeito pros pulsos no teclado. Realmente eu acho que ele podia ter algo mais premium, embora o plástico usado nele não seja ruim. Uma coisa que estranhei nele foi o fato do b ser do lado esquerdo. Eu digito com os dedoss, mas sempre digitei o b com a mão direita, então eu tive que me readaptar,rs... Valeu pelo vídeo!

[@rroca]

Obrigado!! Então o lance do angulo era mais questão de costume mesmo pq os da microsoft o angulo é diferente, mas agora que to usando esse faz tempo já to bem acostumado. O lance do plástico, tipo, o plástico em sí é bom, a comparação foi só no sentido que na época pelo menos, um Magic Keyboard extended da Apple que é de alumínio e tem bateria interna custava o mesmo preço então acho que pelo preço ele poderia ter pelo menos uma dessas duas coisas ou ter iluminação nas teclas que o da Apple não tem, mas ser de plástico, sem bateria e sem iluminação cobrando o mesmo valor é que achei pesado. Em relação ao B, se vc contar a quantidade de teclas naquela fileira a partir do shift, são 5 teclas de cada lado, acho que o B fica do lado esquerdo pra manter essa simetria, nos ergonômicos da microsoft o B também é sempre do lado esquerdo.

[@danieldamacena5197]

Realmente, contando a partir do b pra esquerda, são 7 teclas, o mesmo pro lado direito, se contado a partir do n. Sim, eu entedi o ponto da comparação entre os teclados e a construção. Tem toda a razão.

[@RochesterOliveira]

Caraca, nunca que eu ia falar que você é Brasileiro. Mandou bem demais! E ótimo video, essa review me ajudou muito. Abs!

[@rroca]

Muuuuito obrigado! Que bom que o vídeo foi útil! Então, sou sim, só escolhi fazer conteúdo em inglês pra ajudar a treinar e tal, mas sou Brasileiro sim :)

[@RochesterOliveira]

@@rroca mandou bem demais no conteúdo e no idioma. Abs!

[@hugoschmitt1772]

Descobri agora com seu comment. Excelente ingles.

[@kbaeve]

I love this keyboard, use it at work and at home. HOWEVER, I starting to get very annoyed by bluetooth reconnecting so now looking for a USB setup for my desk.

[@rroca]

Sorry to hear that, what computer do you have? Have you tried it with the usb dongle that comes with it? I've been using it for over 2 years now and never had bluetooth / connectivity issues with either of the Macs I paired it to :(

[@anthonyholland8549]

Thanks, great review and I appreciate that you used it for a month before posting. You might be getting some extra views because Mrwhosetheboss has just recommended this keyboard. As a developer who uses a Mac, how are you finding it a year later? Still using it? Thanks.

[@rroca]

Hey! So still using after about 2 years with it with no issues :)

[@libtux6339]

I actually appreciate that the battery isn't built in. That means the keyboard can outlive the battery and it won't be a pain to replace in the future.

[@rroca]

So, I also prefer not having built in batteries, the comment was just in regards to price, Apple keyboards are aluminum and have a battery and at the time cost $129, this keyboard is plastic and does not have a battery and also used to cost $129, so it was a matter of just comparing the fact that one had better materials and more stuff inside which makes it cost more to make. So, I think Logitech just had a crazy high markup here.

[@sheilacb989]

How to do a "screenshot" using the ERGO K860 wireless keyboard that seems to lack a "camera" key (?replaced by a battery key). Note already activated the Microsoft (not Apple) function using "fn + P" upon unboxing. Reply

[@rroca]

On a Mac it's the same cmd + shift + 4 as usual. I haven't used Windows in decades, so not sure how it works there

[@hakier_]

Nice review but for me a Dygma Defy and Dygma Raise 2 are a lot more ergonomic and more productive. I am using Dygma Defy for 4 mouths now and I ❤ it!

[@rroca]

Would love to try it for the feel of them but I really don't vibe with the "gamer keyboard" aesthetics of it unfortunately

[@accesser]

How comfortable would these be when standing at a stand up desk? Different body angle vs sitting

[@rroca]

I have a standing desk, though I have to be honest that I just sit 90% of the time, but I don't find much difference in the typing experience while standing. You can raise it a bit though if you'd like, it has 2 levels of front height aside from the regular height

[@andreduartebueno]

Rodolfo, até hoje tenho meu teclado natural keyboard liteon 6000. Usei um Microsoft elite que tinha algumas teclas muito pequenas. Tive 1 Microsoft natural keyboard 7000. E 3 Microsoft natural keyboard 4000. Os Microsoft são bem ergonômicos mas a durabilidade é baixa. As letras perdem a cor rapidamente. A almofada descasca. Já estragaram. Estou olhando alguns vídeos para ver qual compro. Se este Logitech ergo k860 ou algo como o ergodox ou o monlander. Parabéns pelo vídeo.

[@rroca]

Obrigado! Então, eu não conheço os outros que vc mencionou, mas esse Logitech eu to usando tem pouco mais de um ano já e até hoje fantástico, não tive um problema. Eu gostava bastante do Sculpt da Microsoft, foi o que mais durou (ainda funciona, tá aqui de reserva) mas uma pena que depende de dongle USB-A pra funcionar. Espero que o video tenha ajudado ai com a decisão.

[@duartelucas5746]

Meh... I don't know. I have a bunch of different keyboards. With a MS sculpt, though liking the keys, I miss them a lot. I have a ducky sf with silent reds and love to type on it (the key caps feel like home) but is kind of tall. I also have a low profile redragon tkl and feel kind of annoyed by the noise. Ordered a kinesis freestyle2 with the supports and everything from a french reseller and hope that it is the best of both worlds.

[@slavaslava9763]

Thanks! now I'm going to change my microsoft sculpt keyboard to logitech

[@rroca]

I love the sculpt, but it needing that usb A dongle in a world that's changing to usb c is the problem for me and why I changed first to the surface that was bluetooth, then when I started having problems with that came this one. Quite happy with it though

[@felipejose485]

Qualidade impecavel

[@rroca]

Muito obrigado Felipe!

[@RockTheCage55]

You don't have much of an accent for being located in Brazil. Your english is pretty good. I have had all the keyboards you have had. The lite-on, the ms ergonomic 4000, & MS Sculpt. My experience with the ms keyboards is the opposite of yours. For me the MS Sculpt was a piece of junk. Broke in about 6 months for me. My ergonomic 4000 has been a tank for me (its actually what i'm using now). What i don't like about it is of course it being a USB only & with primarily being a mac user you have to remap the keys. I'd rather have something that works natively with macs. The K860 is on sale on Amazon so i decided to order it. Even being on sale its WAYYYYY to expensive for a keyboard. Thats my biggest issue with the keyboard without having it. I'm going to love not having to have a cable (or receiver) anymore. I have a logitech mouse which i'm using bluetooth & it works perfectly.

[@rroca]

Thanks! I've lived in the US for a bit over a year, that helped with the English I guess, haha Interesting to know about the different experience with the MS Keyboards, my Sculpt still works and is my backup right now, the 4000 I would plug in and it wouldn't even respond after a while, no lights, nothing. I'm really enjoying the K860, I agree that it's pricey but it's about the same I paid for the Microsoft Surface Ergonomic which was also bluetooth, but this one seems way better, no connection issues, full Mac support and seems sturdier and I'm betting it will last longer so, at least it's a better deal I think and unfortunately we don't have a lot of options to choose from when it comes to ergonomic keyboards. I really wish Apple would make one with Touch ID, aluminum, integrated battery, but we'll never see that, gotta take what we can get I guess.

[@supertwang]

TLDR; Keycap kettering wears off fast under heavy use -- do not buy if you need labels on your keys. I've been coding all day for years. I have been through so many keyboards it isn't funny, trying to find the right ergonomics and feel to keep my hands and wrists fresh and my fingers light, quick and accurate. I love the feel of this keyboard, but the keycap letters faded to uselessness in about a month of serious use... a real drag for such a pricy keyboard. I'm -mostly- a touch typer, but the odd time I need to hunt for a key, the keycaps issue is a deal-breaker for me. Next up, I'm going to try out a Keychron q13 pro, alice layout. Hope this helps.

[@rroca]

Wow, that is very strange... I'm sad you had that experience, but that is not my experience at all, I've had this keyboard for about 2 and a half years now (took me a long time to post the video after getting it), I use it everyday for development, heavy use and the keycap lettering is all here, I mean, like new, no wearing on them whatsoever. Aside from a bit of staining on the palm rest fabric and some wear signs on the space bars, the rest of the keyboard still looks like new

[@jorgensenabrahamson6479]

And the answer for the main question? it was "best keyboard for developers".. you didn't answer but it seems it is a Big YES after seeing your review, can you confirm? Thanks

[@rroca]

The exact title and thumbnail for the video came to be after the video had been recorded and edited, that's why I don't spell it out in it, but you are right to infer from the content that the answer is yes, with a few asterisks. I think in terms of what's the best keyboard for the health of your hands, this is one of the best for sure, the fact that split keyboards are better than regular ones to avoid RSI is something that can be measured objectively. But keyboards are also as much of a subjective personal preference as anything so, if you are a developer who likes mechanical keyboards and don't like split ergonomic keyboards, it won't feel like the best option for you

[@jorgensenabrahamson6479]

​@@rroca I've never used a mechanical keyboard so I can't say but what I can say now is that Ergo K860 is a very good option. Writing right now this comment using it =) Bought it yesterday. Thanks for your kind comment. That was a quick answer.

[@rroca]

@@jorgensenabrahamson6479 I'm glad you found the video helpful and that you liked the keyboard. Mine is almost a year old at this point and still rock solid and looking almost like new :)

[@ThePigmeos]

what chair do u have

[@rroca]

Hey! It's this chair - dt3.com.br/produtos/cadeira-office-dt3-iryna1/?variant=433027232 It's a Brazilian brand, though I think they buy it from China, slap their logo on it and resell, maybe you can find a similar rebrand like that where you live or buy straight from Alibaba

[@a-mb9373]

where is the windows button?

[@rroca]

Take a look at 6:24 in the video, there is a close up on it, it says "start" instead of having the windows logo, but that key works as option on the Mac and Windows button on Windows

[@dessso4463]

I had ergonomic keyboard in 2002-2003 and I thought that it's not actual anymore. I don't think that it's necessary at all. I use Apple Magic Keyboard 2 with numpad and it's just flat and low-profile keyboard. And it's all I need to feel normal for long work on this keyboard,

[@rroca]

Glad that the Apple keyboards work well for you, I wish I could use it to get one with Touch ID, but my wrists hurt using those after a while, ergo keyboards are still the way to go for my case

[@tedoyle61]

I have it. If Logitech would just stop with their own f key setups, they would be perfect. Sometimes, it loses it config and I can't even get into my bios to fix things. So, I've sidelined it. I'm sick of the stoopid custom non-general, default key assignments.

[@rroca]

Interesting. I'm using it with a Mac and the defaults of it seems to map just right with Apple's defaults so, never noticed a problem in that regard

[@cricque3091]

Sorry but the only ones that last me 2-3 years are the microsoft ones, the logitech ergo lasts me 4 to 6 months ... And I type quite alot of code each day. Microsoft Sculpt with the separate keypart is very good. The natural ergo is wired but hard to find these days. But they beat the logitech crap by miles

[@rroca]

Interesting, but not my experience at all. I've had this same keyboard for over 2 years now and it still works like new. The sculpt was amazing and I still have it here as a backup but in a world of usb c needing that dongle is not ideal. The only keyboards that broke on me were the microsoft surface ergonomic and the natural 4000, something like, definitely more problems with Microsoft than Logitech so far here.

[@oldCoinBr]

The guy looks like a gringo, talks like a gringo and then..What!?!?!?? BRAZIL!!! Tamo junto!

[@rroca]

Hahahaha... 🙌🏼

[@crasheba1533]

4:23 You didn't even touch it and it already knew it feels like a good keyboard? Biased much? hahah

[@NorthSea-xb7jk]

all these"ergo' kbrds are super uncomfortable to type

[@HerrBert1000]

No, they aren't. Tbf you need time to get used to it like you do if you start using keyboards at all.

[@pe6649]

@north sea, thear aren’t; You don’ get the point. They are primarily made for people who can write blindly with 10 fingers. So probably not for you. And you use them not for fun, but to prevent pain, if you are typing much.

[@jaassil]

Whats *WRONG* with your lef middle finger?? 🤨🤨🤨