Billions spent on the PBS scheme - Senate Estimates 15.2.24

“I can provide you with aggregate data about rebates provided from the medical companies to the government but they’re covered under commercially confidential deeds for individual medicines.”
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“A court has dismissed an Australian Competition and Consumer Commission appeal in a case in which it alleged Pfizer had used its market power to limit competition for its cholesterol-lowering drug Lipitor.
The ACCC said on Friday it was considering the judgment and remained committed to pursuing cases involving "misuse of market power".
“The ACCC brought this appeal because it was concerned that Pfizer's use of its market position as supplier of the top-selling branded atorvastatin immediately before generic products were able to enter the market harmed the competitive process and therefore consumers," chairman Rod Sims said in a statement.
The drug Lipitor generated annual sales of more than $700 million for Pfizer in Australia before the company's patent expired here in May 2012, the ACCC said when it launched the case against Pfizer in 2014.
The ACCC alleged that Pfizer had offered big discounts and rebates on Lipitor to pharmacies that bought up large quantities of the drug and agreed to limit re-supply of competing generic atorvastatin products.”
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"The most popular type of statin has been atorvastatin, which has the brand name Lipitor. It has topped the list of highest expenditure drugs on the PBS for the last decade, costing Australian taxpayers more than $7 billion in total, which has gone to Pfizer, the company holding its patent.
But the expiry of this patent last year means that Pfizer no longer has an exclusive right to sell atorvastatin; many other firms can now produce equivalent formulations of the drug, which are known as generics.
In most countries, governments have moved to make large savings by using low-cost generics. For a widely used drug such as atorvastatin, generics can cost 95% less than the price of the original drug.
A typical dose of atorvastatin (40 milligrams), which went off patent in many countries last year, now costs just a few dollars a month in England, Sweden and New Zealand. In fact, the generic form of atorvastatin is exclusively provided in New Zealand by Pfizer for around $2 a month.
But wait…
Not in Australia. The pricing agreement with the government specified a reduction of only 16% (to around $50 per month for a 40mg dose) and that this price would fixed for 18 months.
As the price of these drugs internationally is so much lower, generic manufacturers offer large discounts on the wholesale price of the medications to pharmacists. And pharmacists get to pocket the difference.
Each time a script for atorvastatin is dispensed, the government pays $50 to a pharmacist to cover the wholesale cost of the drug. If the pharmacist actually purchases generic atorvastatin for $10, she keeps the extra $40 per script flowing from discounts.
The windfall gains from discounts come on top of the $600,000 (on average) the government pays every pharmacy each year for dispensing medications and other incentives, through its agreement with the Pharmacy Guild."
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While it’s important that people get affordable access to important drugs, when $17 billion of taxpayer funds is spent on the PBS it’s important the price being paid for patented and off label drugs is fully disclosed.
Unfortunately that’s not the case, so the taxpayer gets exploited especially in regard to the cost of off label drugs.
The Health Department should not be covering up how much the taxpayer pays for individual drugs. The secrecy suggests we are being ripped off.
Quotes from:
www.smh.com.au...
theconversatio...
#auspol #australia #pbs #offlabel #pfizer #statins

[@ruperteachells2355]

Thankyou SENATOR GERARD 🤗🤗!! You simply the BEST 🙏🙏! We really APPRECIATE your HONESTY!!

[@wmichaelshiberrassw8604]

It’s amusing watching these public servants handballing the too hard questions to their “colleagues “

[@johnwilson1620]

THESE AMOUNTS ARE HORRIFIC, OUT OF CONTROL WITH NO ACCOUNTABILITY........

[@joepearce3033]

It's their system....pay out a billion dollars.....paper bag comes back with one million. They all do it.... every department.

[@turnyourbacktoit]

​@@joepearce3033 Yessir

[@johnstopford9633]

Senator Rennick your a good man for finding out where TAX money is being wasted. pity there isn't more representatives that actually care instead of being BUMS on SEATS.

[@johnstopford9633]

Just answer the Question. Where is the money being SPENT simple. I think they may need to go back to school to answer these simple questions. There Answers are just not good enough to justify 19 Billion in spending.

[@cheeks7050]

Wtf this is an incredibly simple line of questioning and they couldn't answer!

[@tezzawrath9410]

"THEY" don't even understand the question. FFS!

[@davmac6148]

Things have become very complicated. Complexity is often added to hide truths not to be revealed to the people.

[@harleymorrison-q4w]

Got them again. Well done!!

[@masonsmith858]

Amazing!!!!!!!! How incredulous and viciously guarded they are. “Aggregate data…” That is not “itemised” It just shows you what a rort it is! Keep going Gerard. The Public deserves to know HOW and on WHAT tax dollars are being spent

[@VG-cz7yg]

So frustrating to listen to, like pulling teeth. These taxpayer funded, arrogant bureaucrats never give a straight answer, very little transparency as usual.

[@PollyDollyBabe]

😂it’s like a continuous bad tooth 🦷 that never wants to come out 💅 meanwhile back at the ranch. 🙄 they can’t say. Ok 😂

[@louisemusiclover]

Thank you Senator Rennick 👏👏👏

[@marianthewriter6727]

Now they are squirming in their seats. They didn't think anyone had the audacity to question them about the PBS scheme. They must be held accountable. These people think they can do anything and just get away with it. Well, not anymore. Thank you Senator Gerand Rennick. You don't know what this means to we, the Australian people. We are tired of these people thinking they are not accountable to anyone. #investigatethePBSscheme

[@fattyboom8856]

they are and will get away with it" none are ever held to account"

[@drazenmiskovic4952]

They will get away with it as they get away with it all. There's no law for them they set the law.

[@jillbowden9628]

In pocket of pharmaceutical companies. Bring back Barbara O'Neill!

[@everykneeshallbow5719]

Thank you Senator!

[@kingofaikido]

The numbers are all over the show. Corruption is in the wing...billions gone missing.

[@michaelmorgan3421]

I don’t think any of them are sure of what they do,, it would be funny if it wasn’t our money, bloody disgusting

[@dominicgalante9753]

We must vote out Labor liberals greens and teals

[@ianbell4527]

There's money in misery

[@sarahbatsford4791]

Who are profiteering from these poisons and fake drug? Natural medicine is the way to go.

[@stephaniezickgraf9672]

I was just wondering about the annual audit of government spending. Why aren't those figures available from the auditors .

[@aussiemongrel7162]

No accountability

[@captainsensible298]

So 12.5 thousand million AUD on drug subsidies? We're much sicker than I thought, or are we paying through the nose for these products? Thank you Senator for asking these important questions.

[@vivrowe2763]

Take on notice is coming up!

[@dedetudor.]

😖😅 it's getting laughable. I wouldn't be able to keep my cool having been told that so many times. #@!:€÷%\#$@:%:€>:

[@shaneclarence6696]

Not yet he needs a little bit more ranting nonesene....

[@mythscion]

I barely even started the video and I can ALREADY hear the echo of the future responses: "Can I take that on notice?" - meaning, 12 months from now, no-one will have remembered the question.

[@kelstra1997]

Did I hear this correctly? These bureaucrats are refusing to provide information about their purchases to a Member of Parliament because it's 'commercial in confidence'. Does that mean these bureaucrats run the show rather than the government?

[@shaneclarence6696]

The swamp

[@d-munn]

PBS: Pharmaceutical Benevolent Fund ...to itself.

[@Emilia-ps2th]

Thankyou. I wondered what the BS stood for.

[@crouchingwombathiddenquoll5641]

Three and a half $Billion on personal protective equipment... Cui bono ?

[@chriscoghlan692]

Pass the batten so no one hsto account.

[@simmov9489]

Good old commercial in confidence get out of jail free card

[@charlesarmstrong8206]

They jump and deflect to get out of it, such a shame

[@alanweston4524]

Keep grilling them Senator, the cost means nothing to them, they don't care about anything except their cushy jobs and salaries

[@charlesarmstrong8206]

We need much more people asking the type of questions you ask, too much sheep in government not asking the questions we should

[@alwaysright3718]

What pandemic? The 1908 flu pandemic...

[@wendymontgomery9837]

No matter how many hours of question time that I watch, I continue to be dumbfounded by the ability of those being questioned, to skirt around a clearly defined question.

[@Billydevito]

And of course all that stored PPE is made in China because Australia has offshore all its manufacturing.

[@tonyhanley9458]

These rats always dodge the questions. He’s asking how much, not which type of drugs. I’ll take it on notice. Dodging rhe question as per the standard. Gotta love the way the Senator ensures these rats honest. Always using private agreements as an excuse not to answer fully. Government should not be allowed to do deals under the table & not be held accountable by the people. This is a corporate government acting S a business, not as an elected government of peoples representatives.

[@silversurfer5707]

Straight out money laundering and bribery money, they are all on the take. Should also be considered as treason and conspiracy.

[@Denise-wv6eo]

Yes you are You simply the BEST, We really APPRECIATE your HONESTY God bless you🙏🕊🕊✝💗

[@charlesarmstrong8206]

Every Australian with a vote should watch him and realise how we are played by politicians and 🤡🤡🤡

[@silversurfer5707]

They have obviously rigged the voteing system

[@annesearle5482]

Wages are from 59,000 to 189,000 wow not even accountable

[@ix-Xafra]

There were several cases of counterfeit drugs supplied to public hospitals in NSW a few years back. It was traced back to a dodgy procurement person within NSW Health if I recall...

[@OpinionFactChecker]

I recently qualified for new medication to help treat my genetic heart disease after months of testing. That medication is touted to cost $100,000, that's right one hundred grand for one person for an indeterminate period. I will not be paying that of course, and to be honest, I feel a little guilty!

[@shaneclarence6696]

Don't that's what it is there for... Chin up

[@BeArtch]

Old mate singer appears and behaves awfully suspicious.

[@brendanryan561]

Thanks mate,keep at em

[@wombat949]

DEI in government departments is clearly not working. Regardless of inability to perform a job, these people should still remain responsible and held accountable.

[@surfguy7418]

Yet Australia has run out of saline; there bureaucrats are completely hopeless

[@James-ty9zr]

Pure evil.

[@anngray8224]

Good grief. These amounts are crazy. This is our tax money. No wonder pharmaceutical companies are so rich.

[@irenehodge7972]

Pass the buck

[@Zen-kr3te]

Oooh! I don't know what you mean? They complicate a simple question. Let's pass the question to the next person to try and find the answer. Uuum! Ummm! Let's stall.

[@matt4sure364]

Thanks for your simple question Senator. Would you like to play a game of time wasting, word salad, hot potato? Good, we'll start then.

[@Watching58]

Thank goodness someone is asking that question. Have never seen that before.

[@lightknightgames]

Atrocious This is money laundering

[@andjuju6476]

Pass the parcel, waste time by saying "thank you for the questions that we will not answer".

[@stevejanejamesjassteph5903]

Unbelievable how deep this goes

[@catherinesarah5831]

Thank you Senator Rennick. This is like watching a football game. The question passes the front line until some poor goof ball bureaucrat picks it up & immerses it a gobble-goup of set of figures, some of which are CIC, now pick a number & stick with it. This is what is called grand larceny in corporate. 🙏

[@Emilia-ps2th]

Hm…another ‘confidential’ Scheme.

[@turnyourbacktoit]

This is where the money trail leeds. The gov. Dept.s its rife. The river of incredible money. Multiple family members... And ... EEO policy. The most expensive circus in the world.

[@markwng]

Ah, comercial in confidence. How convenient.

[@Thisisnolongerajoke]

All this rubbish and I can't use a plastic straw

[@jasontaylor8425]

Government sponsor Jackets required. 🤮

[@chrisdeason4904]

Great to see all these working age public servants are a strapping healthy looking example of the intellectual class... fully medicated i presume..

[@aliceinwonderland7594]

Quick to raise costs for the aged care and here they are crunching billions out. Sickening to watch these paper shufflers. Bravo Sen.Rennick keep pushing them

[@sthnwatch]

Keep chasing them, Sen. Rennick. These "Shiny bums" are having a hard time facing you honestly. They've become too comfortable and somewhat lazy in their bureaucratic careers, lost in "The Canberra bubble" that is our nation's wealthy capital city. Canberra is so out of touch with the real world it dictates to. Keep it real, Sen. Rennick. The whole country is watching you rise, mate. Hold to these principles that drive you, and we'll all rise with you. God bless you and yours!

[@YoutubeCrittic]

The ones in charge are struggling to answer what should be an easy answer. Witch in itself is very telling.

[@namenameson8353]

pbs sucks. theres no economic incentive for doctors not to prescribe, doctors are biased to intervene, leads to overprescription

[@turnyourbacktoit]

What drug was that woman on ?

[@bobgillis1137]

Ask Bad Hair Day.

[@Cuddywuddles]

This channel censors to many comments and it’s not KZbin 👎typical Australian culture

[@Paul-op9oz]

We know who your father is

[@williamscannell7103]

Arrests are inevitable...look at swan's accounts and his friends

[@Watching58]

Interesting

[@neox6439]

They all have dagger eyes on you Senator, Armor of God all the time.

[@davidsimpson3275]

Placebo Party

[@davidsea1482]

It’s not their money they spend, it’s ours!

[@cnrmcdonnell]

He said commerical sensitive information! With taxpayers' money!!!!

[@antonyschwarz8749]

bless this man always in Lord Jesus name xxx Sydney Australia Halleluyah protect guide him and his family at all times !!!

[@jeremiemarin4055]

Secret deals we cant tell you , because the Australian people wouldn't except it . Thats what confidentiality deals means .

[@w00dsywoods56]

They never like answering in simple words, always dancing around the question.

[@streetlight3860]

This is the kind of no-nonsense statesmen Australia desperately needs as PM.

[@ArthurDonnelly-p3e]

When you’re called to a senate inquiry, why is it so difficult for department heads and staff to answer simple questions if you have a handle on your responsibilities. It appears to me, since I’ve taken an extreme interest in government behaviour since they lied to me outright about the bio-weapon, that we have group of over fed, over paid and under qualified personnel in the Public Service. Well trained in ‘I’ll take that under notice’, if that is the standard of behaviour in our Parliament, no wonder the Australian people are being crushed by the Uni-party these past 70 years. We still have 28 parliamentarians who were named in a report regarding p@edo’s and protected for another 70 years. Tell me we’re not screwed by the ‘born to rule’ it’s my turn group of fascists.

[@phredflypogger4425]

I can understand that these people do not necessarily have detailed information at their fingertips but having watched a number of these interviews I find it amazing that government departments often have no means of providing detailed answers about expenditures at all. All of the money seems to go into a melting pot somewhere and nobody can detail where it went. "Commercial in confidence" information should be available to government officials such as senators etc.

[@decafmocha211]

These officials seem like they are gaslighting Senator Rennick. They have this weird tone of voice and can't seem to give a straight answer to his questions.

[@readie10145]

So there is a private system behind vaccine. Rumsfeld is the person I'm looking at then john Hopkins.

[@delystrott718]

Funny is it the labour government thats asked for the like button to not work, they would be worried. Great job Senator, you should be PM

[@PollyDollyBabe]

The list goes on on ! Omg just keeps on. Never ending story. How many shares do these blokes have and what goes with it. It’s obscene.

[@Quantanpie]

I take a PBS medication that is $1700 per month reduced to $30. This medication greatly improves my life, but I do wonder how a pharmaceutical can cost so much..

[@neox6439]

Theyre all a little too comfortable in their positions, makes me sick.

[@geoffreygo1686]

all these for a useless & harmful drug 😒

[@mrgillagorilla]

They must be sacked.

[@silversurfer5707]

Jail for life with hard labour picking up rubbish. sounds much more appropriate

[@mrgillagorilla]

Are they dum or what.

[@mrgillagorilla]

That a joke