The Ethics of Extreme Horror | Splatterpunk Video Essay | mit deutschen Untertiteln

[@bixiewillow]

0:00 Introduction: Eyes of Amber 8:36 Chapter 1: Manhunt -------- 21:11 Preference hedonism / preference utilitarianism 33:57 Chapter 2: Cows 44:29 Conclusion

[@zelokorLocalGodOfChaosAndBread]

oh cool, chapters, however you should probably pin this ngl

[@vvvvia]

I love this video so much, thank you!! You’ve convinced me to add Cows to my reading list. I really recommend checking out Negative Space by B.R. Yeager if you haven’t already. It’s not splatterpunk, but it sure is depressing and has stuck with me.

[@briankai4936]

I don't think there's anything too bad to write about, but I do think the author's intentions matters a LOT. I've read disturbing things that I loved, and disturbing things I've regretted reading, and in both scenarios I can respect the author and the work. What I can't respect is something like the manga Made in Abyss, where the ACTUAL violence and horror of the series pales in comparison to the way some aspects that are not supposed to be horrifying are portrayed. I liked the anime, but I could not read the manga because it felt painfully obvious that the created was a pedophile. The child characters were constantly sexualized, and it was wildly uncomfortable in a real world way as opposed to the clearly fictional violence.

[@madeofmeats]

I hate how right you are about Made in Abyss. I wanna like it so bad because the art direction is so beautiful to me and I love character designs like Nanachi’s, but I cannot ignore the… questionable… way the child characters are portrayed

[@lilalulaberry]

"the sinking feeling of revulsion that had been so exhilarating..." THAT. THAT THAT THAT. ive been journaling off and on for the past few months about that specific feeling. i love hearing people talk about it, i really can't get enough of it. it makes me feel a little better and so much less alone. good video! can't wait for more! i'm excited to see what you make next, regardless of topic!

[@pigcatapult]

Excellent video essay that hits the emotional core of why I enjoy horror that makes me feel things. Half of my brain was riveted to your words, while the other half screamed obsessive-compulsively because your lip piercings both leaning in the same direction bother me more than a fictional character getting their intestines spooled out.

[@bixiewillow]

That is honestly hilarious. I feel like I'm always fixing my piercings but they always end up like that XD

[@Sytheduke]

While I am interested in extreme horror, the things that affect me the most aren't always from the horror genre. There is a part in Cyberpunk 2077 when you get a call that Evelyn Parker committed suicide after she was rescued from being in XBDs, which is the high tech version of snuff films. I think there was just something about the moment I got the call that reminded me of the time I got a call from my ex back in high school that his dad shot himself in the driveway. Everything after that point felt really similar to getting that type of call in real life.I had met his dad about as many times as V met Evelyn in the video game, so I didn't really know his dad very well but I still felt that I knew him enough that it was hard seeing the aftermath of his death. Me and my ex were also talking on the phone when the gunshot happened and heard it, but didn't know what it was at the time. He called me back a little while later with his dog panicking in the background.

[@ahviouslyanarchy9188]

This is great!

[@therealbeanibaby8649]

This video gave voice to a feeling I've become very familiar with and made me feel slightly less crap about my reading habits. I'm so glad this video was recommended to me :)

[@satellite991]

this has genuinely made me reconsider my media consumption! as a child/teenager, I used to exclusively seek out media w/ the darkest, most upsetting stories I could find; extreme traumas, death, torture, misery & tragedy through every line. (except, surprisingly, the only thing I couldn't stomach was gore). it fascinated me. I'd return again & again to the most upsetting parts, horrified & intrigued by what was there. I even wrote pages & pages of short stories on the same topics (which, similar to you, I never shared w/ peers after realizing it was considered 'weird' to write abt that stuff). I was growing up in a pretty rough home situation, too, so it always seemed like those things were correlated. like, I sought out this extremely upsetting media as a escape from my own circumstances. and as I got older, moved out, and started healing, that idea was corroborated by friends & therapists; and I was encouraged to leave behind the 'upsetting' media & find my own interests. except I never did!! I've barely read books or watched movies/tv (hell, I've barely written, either) in YEARS b/c I've never been able to find things that interested me. and I never bothered to dive back into the dark/upsetting stuff b/c I genuinely believed my experience of liking that stuff had been unhealthy. this is the first time I've considered that maybe my interest in that sort of media is just. genuinely preferential ! your explanation of the thrill of pushing your limits, and preference hedonism made me realize that's exactly, spot-on, what I was experiencing when I sought out extreme & upsetting media growing up. it wasn't an escape; I just liked it! and I never realized this b/c we don't often hear the perspective of ppl who enjoy extreme horror this was eye-opening, I'm glad I came across your video!!

[@willem-dafemme]

Amazing video !! This is a topic that as consumer and creator of challenging, upsetting and/or decidedly transgressive media I have thought about a lot. It was very interesting hearing your takes :))

[@miliz5942]

Wow the algorithm is super polished huh, your video is definitely the kind I find interesting. I'll save it so I can listen to it while darwing

[@ruth540]

Wow, KZbin really called me out through the magical mystery of the algorithm.

[@rfurthegamer3412]

This is a gem that I have discovered. Truly fascinating. I wonder how many subs are old? Or bots, could be a mere 20 or so people who have seen this.

[@northynorth]

Found this, subbed, and loved it. It really encompasses my thoughts and self restriction when it comes to gorey, violent content. I've found them fascinating from childhood, I was also a writer and I was always on an up and down see-saw of feeling a weird sort of catharsis and appreciation for such art, at the same time that I shamed myself for enjoying it in the first place I'm extremely empathetic, I care a lot about people and animals, I'm a nature lover, and I spent most of my life not liking bouquets because of the idea of killing the flowers to receive one But extreme gore and violence (fiction, I must make it clear) has always filled a very specific and important part of me. It makes me morbidly curious, it tears me up and fills me with so much emotion, pain, disgust and sadness, at the same time that it gives me hope, empathy and camaraderie with the people who have created such works I appreciate your video and the short story you've presented to us, Bixie, and I'm excited to see what comes next

[@cannibalgrape9863]

When I played WoW back in 2005, I got into the RP community on a server where the RP community heavily relied fiction more than in-the-moment roleplay. Being an elder edgelord, my character was an anti-human orc with a sort of grimdark style where it was darkly comedic at times but also just dark. I still remember the reaction to a story I wrote. My character was written as the antagonist of the short fiction, the protagonist was a pregnant human and her husband being stalked through a forest while she is close to labour. In the end, my character comes upon them as she gives birth. He kills her (she was already injured and dying, so it was a mercy), but since the child doesn't cry he chooses not to kill it and leaves the father alive, but injured, to take care of the child. So many people said they couldn't finish the story because they were SURE I was going to end the story with him ripping a pregnant woman apart. Without trying, I had created a palpable dread in my readers and their imaginations made the story so much worse than it actually ended up being. For me, this was a high. I've been chasing it ever since.

[@kogure7235]

I am slightly concerned by the fact that KZbin recommended me this out of nowhere, but it definitely fits my media consumption habits. I have some very strong opinions on the subject. Namely, that no art is bad, evil, or immoral to consume, with an exception for real life consent-violating media, out of respect for the victims. If you don't like something, it's simply not made for you to consume, but that doesn't make it bad art. I have no idea what even a single Taylor Swift song sounds like, but I can recognize great beauty in some of the most extreme metal genres, and 30-listiner bands that 99% of the population would probably describe as "power tool noises". That doesn't make either worse art, we're simply different audiences with different tastes. Same goes for any extreme art, no matter how dark the content it contains. No holds barred, especially as far as fiction goes. There are SO many reasons people engage with that kind of media, for a whole variety of reasons, I'm not gonna waste time making a list of them. I've engaged with plenty of dark/"problematic" media, I still am, and of various kinds too. That doesn't include just fiction either, I mean real stuff too. From liveleak-style content to NSBM music. I have an extremely strong moral compass, I'm very left-leaning, and I see no problems with consuming extreme content of that type. It is extreme, violent, dark art, but I still see it as art, and it can be beautiful in its own way. Even if they hate me and I hate them. I also know for a fact that it will not "change me" mentally or morally in any way. Those are claims identical to "video games will cause kids to become violent" arguments, and every single other type of moral panic. Both the political left and right have things they are terrified of this way if you think about it, media that will somehow "corrupt their morals". There are also the incredibly cringy teenage puritan "antis" who are just vehemently against extreme fiction content. And I think it's all BS. I think it's perfectly possible to mentally compartmentalize art as art and not have it affect you in any way. You need to have some kind of a proclivity for violent, extreme acts in order to commit them, you cannot just get "infected" with ideas or descriptions of them. I'm also not a psychopath, some extreme fiction affects me very strongly, to the point where on a couple of occasions I had to take breaks while reading because I had physical anxiety reactions - and I still loved every second of hating the things I was reading. It's simply more intense horror. It's art. There's no way for ANY art to be "wrong". Even if literally not a single person enjoys it - perhaps it just hasn't found the right audience yet.

[@byrrnitdown]

I wouldn’t call it extreme horror or splatterpunk, but based on the first 18 minutes of this video, I’d like to recommend the book “The Only Good Indians” by Steven Graham Jones. The review I give to everyone is “this was horror not in the “I’m so scared” way, but in the “my stomach hurts and I want to go home” way.” I think it really hits that impactful, electrifying feeling. Book recommendation aside, I’m really glad this popped up in my recommended! Excited to watch the rest.

[@flexxspectrum1103]

The Only Good Indians was, in my opinion, an absolute masterclass in building tension. Towards the endpoint, when all the moving pieces started to converge, I could feel my palms getting sweaty. SGJ really knows how to deliver a solid horror experience.

[@StrykerMagnum]

That is definitely a title that brings to mind some potential atrocities... Id say I dont even wanna know how dark that could get, but lets be real- I do. *WE* do!

[@retrofuture6786]

Citing Patricia Taxxon I love to see it aaaaaa

[@BlubberingAnarchist]

I dont think any topic is off limits. The only example of media that I think harm might outweigh good is when the author has the wrong intentions. Such as a book that's messages is that pedophilia is good or that racists/bigoted stereotypes are true. Like books and movies can be very powerful. Think of the media that potrayed slaves as "content being slaves". Another example is the movie Hostel halted tourism dramatically in the country it was set in when it came out. That said I dont think media should be censored but artists need to be aware of the power their art can have and use it consciencely. This is not a critique against splatter horror necessarily. In my experience authors in that genre are often very aware of the issues they are covering and handle it correctly. Ive seen more problematic stuff in disney shows tbh

[@thegoblinking279]

Yes, precisely! This discussion is often so frustrating for me because of the HUGE amount of people online who are unwilling to admit that the art they enjoy has the capacity to cause harm. In particular, that the extreme porn they like can be used to victimize others. A lot of these people are survivors so they hate the idea that their behavior could contribute to rape culture, but a lot of people on the other side of this equation, who were directly groomed using these methods, demonstrate that this is, in fact, the case. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with engaging with these things in private, necessarily. But creating public communities oriented around fetishizing rape WILL attract predators, inevitably, and that will be the fault of the people who cultivated these spaces. I get so fed up with people who prioritize their own pleasure over the safety of children. But, again, I do think this is an important conversation to have so we can determine where these boundaries lie, if they exist at all. Trying to shut down the discussion altogether is the only impulse I would call “puritanical”. Fear and discomfort deserve to be analyzed just as much as morbid fascination does, and I think both perspectives are far too quick to shut down one another.

[@StrykerMagnum]

Id argue the only way to keep children safe is an honest and age-appropriate discourse about the dangers in the world. To keep them ignorant is to make them a target. My mother, perhaps, was too keen on imparting a fear of my fellow man in myself, but I am alive and safe- I'll take what good her honesty could give, and present it to society in a way hopefully... Less scarring .. ^^; That has less to do with extreme fiction, but everything to do with the Puritanical, sanitized picture of the world society seems to want to try and sell to children.

[@lee2791]

This is such an interesting topic! Just subscribed and I'm so happy to be your 100th. You are very well spoken. Keep making cool content! :)

[@Taquinqua]

Hey I know this might seem silly with the title, but a specific trigger list (I get it can’t be all encompassing, but with some common triggers) would be really awesome at the beginning of a video like this. I Love horror and fiction that explores the twisted and upsettingly broken taboos, but I also have CPTSD that affects my ability to engage with the content I enjoy without experiencing flashbacks. Just a short title card with a basic breakdown can be really good for gathering/checking in with myself before I engaging in media and I don’t think I’m alone in that

[@mimecrime]

interesting video. i agree that media and art shouldn't be deemed as too outrageous to exist because i hate the general censorship and how everything nowadays aims to be so sanitized. i relate to the story you shared at the beginning about your writing as when i was way younger i'd draw bloody and gorey scenes in my school scrapbooks and feared the teachers would see them (looking back they definitely did cuz i didn't hide them that well LOL) mostly cuz i just thought it was fun. but it freaked my friends out for sure

[@jackr5056]

Loved this video!

[@Branfon]

I really enjoyed this which is the only reason I'm posting a "critique," about it. First, you don't have to imply your own lack of knowlage about something before deferring to someone who has more knowlage. I know you aren't, that's why you made a playlist for me (thank you). I really wish you'd read the excerpt about that magicless asshole because while it was obvious (to me/you) you were being dismissive of something that is inherently a non-issue it could be seen as the same handwaving we get as queers to someone who wasn't already in the know. All that being said I did enjoy this video as a whole as someone who made subversive art as a teen and engages with it as an adult your short story except did grab me. That realization Amber felt as she was handed that glass; that she'd felt connected to someone who clearly was monstrous . . . Was she blinded by love or experiencing a love that blinds? The shooting is horrible, I'm sure, but looking at yourself through those amber eyes . . . Loving someone who could think this was love . . . ? Monstrous. Human.

[@tyraoqvist350]

loved the video and the take you present on the topic! generic comment ik, i swear im not a bot i just wanted to comment something to show you that i liked it, maybe i'll come back with something more interesting once im not on the edge of slumber (considering this topic is something i think about on the daily lol)

[@FEARSICKNESS]

bringing up cows- it's kind of obviously about how both humans and animals are exploited under capitalism. it's about how men encourage each other to reach this nonexistent and unachievable status of true manhood. it's also about isolation and trying to find love and connection under capitalism. i think the nature of the grimy prose and the acts themselves are a perfect example of what you said earlier in the video about how people focus on a horrific thing in a book, rather than what it has to say thematically.

[@nessaarandur7740]

I read Cows and it intrigued me because of how much Stokoe seemed to be saying SOMETHING with all the grossness. I wasn't sure what it was, but immediately picked up High Life to see if Stokoe was a one-hit wonder because I've only heard reviews talking about Cows. I thought High Life was possibly even grosser, probably because it didn't deal with animals (metaphorical or otherwise), but on the people. And the people were horrible, disgusting, terrible. What they did was horrible, disgusting, terrible. But in the same way as with Cows, Stokoe was clearly saying SOMETHING, especially as he shows the differences between the main character and his friend and how differently they process a terrible event they are responsible for. Nothing is so in your face that you feel positively certain just WHAT they were about, just WHAT you're feeling after reading it, but if you take the time to put your feelings into words, you see how interestingly those stories were written, despite all the splatter. The question of where extreme horror stops becoming a medium in which one can explore areas outside the moralistic norm of society - why it's called transgressive fiction - and where it becomes something actually harmful or dangerous is an interesting one. In reading some of the more extreme novels and novellas out there, I think I have found where the line is for me between enjoying transgressive fiction and getting something out of it, and reading something nasty with nothing to say. Aron Beauregard's books are some that I've been disappointed with - just gross for the sake of being gross. Zola was another one that was quite well written but the focus was less on the semi-interesting characters and more on just their nastiness, so I found it "just okay". On the more extreme side where I have no interest in going, a couple of YT reviewers have reviewed a book called Hub, and they seem to share the opinion that it it just straight up CSA p*rn. They felt like they were doing something illegal just reading it. When I compare that to a book like Lolita, which is an amazing work, and I start to find a left and right of arc as to what extreme horror I will enjoy reading. I like books that make me think. I don't want to think about children being SA'ed. I did read Baby in a Blender, and found it to be just gross for the sake of being gross (the title only says the half of it). In contrast, I thought the short story The Chocolateman (I believe there is a longer version I haven't read yet) which includes a limited scene of CSA, was interesting. The SA is not shown in graphic detail, and the twist that follows reveals something about the main character, so it had a purpose and thus felt less gratuitous to me. For the most part, I am finding that Kristopher Triana's books are the most enjoyable, with some honourable mentions to Duncan Rolston's Woom, Tender is the Flesh by Agustina Bazterrica, and Matthew Stokoe's High Life and Cows. I also really enjoyed Maeve Fly by CJ Leede. 👍👍

[@Beanon_]

How does this only have 85 likes, i thought it would be at least 40K

[@smelly-y]

I can't wait to watch this video! I'm commenting now because I'm gonna listen as a drift off to sleep and I want to provide some engagement ❤ I love hearing different perspectives on horror, especially queer perspectives! Love from a queer person from Ireland 🇮🇪 🏳️‍🌈

[@madeofmeats]

Very apt recommendation from KZbin. I recently read The Sluts by Dennis Cooper and American Psycho by Brett Easton Ellis and am currently jonesing for more similarly icky books. I also really enjoy films one could describe as disturbing but typically I shy away from the ones that border on pornographical like Angel’s Melancholy and the Guinea Pig series. I think the discussion and disenchanting of the consumption of extreme horror/media in general is very validating to me. I’m a very quiet and passive person in my day to day life, it upsets me when bugs are harmed let alone other humans. I don’t consume the media I do because it personally titillates me, but because it’s very comforting and cathartic for me to subject myself to horrible things in a controlled environment. The world is a big scary place, especially for people of my stature and social standing, so sometimes it’s nice to be the one in control of my own suffering if even for a little while. Edit: I forgot to mention my pick for media that went too far for me- the film Bully (2001). I couldn’t even finish it, I don’t even remember what scene made me quit either. It was all just too much, it jolted me out of a downward spiral I had found myself in where I was trying to watch the most extreme and disgusting films I could find. That was a bit of a dark time in my life but now I’m through the other side.

[@noahmunoz6697]

I'm going to write this comment in spanish since it's difficult to me to translate my feelings towards this topic. No soy consumidora de horror extremo, pero si me ha dado mucha curiosidad ver ciertos films que tienen fama de provocar shock en su audiencia, para probar hasta cuanto puedo aguantar, como dice el video, probar mis limites. He sido una persona miedosa desde muy pequeña, siendo resguardada por mis figuras adultas como una niña "demasiado delicada" o "demasiado sensible", pero a medida que he experimentado contenido mas gráfico, me hace sentir increíblemente fuerte el poder sobrellevarlo bien en comparación a mis pares. Siempre me ha causado curiosidad el morbo. No haría nada de lo que este tipo de contenido muestra y tampoco es parte de mi moral personal, pero el poder aguantar ver algo así me provoca la fantasía de que si en algún momento llego a ser victima de algo de esa naturaleza, seré capaz de sobrellevarlo y estaré psicológicamente preparada (aunque probablemente no sea verdad)

[@FallingintoAtlantis]

Are you able to adjust the audio? Even with my volume all the way up I'm unable to make out a lot of what youre saying 💔

[@bixiewillow]

First, let me say thanks for the feedback! It's a microphone issue more than anything - for my next video I'll be trying a new mic. I'll tinker with this video a bit to see if I can adjust the levels but I'm not sure how successful it will be

[@ruth540]

You can turn on the captions, it should help.

[@Catnip-gc4yy]

oh yeah the Algorithm cooked with this one 🔥

[@bigtunafan]

Nice chat c:

[@SemicolonExpected]

Really interesting video. Though one critique I have is that the audio is very low and even at 100% it was hard to hear and I had to rely on the captions. If in the future you could volume boost that would be super duper appreciated