Twenty-One: Full Stemple and Van Doren Episode

This is the full episode between Herbert Stemple and Charles Van Doren that really brought the quiz shows of the 1950s down.

[@McDuffington]

Question you are looking for is at 10:17

[@Lobothemainman23]

Thanks

[@williamdunphy352]

Rolf Lobker The category is "Movies & Movie Stars".

[@LuisSierra42]

That's exactly how it happens in the movie

[@nevincaulfield]

Forest Hills represent !

[@platosays3721]

Thanx so much for sharing this - I ADORE Quiz Show the movie - this just makes it so much more real. Brilliant footage.

[@reynaldobinuya2339]

The film is "Quiz Show" (1994) directed by Robert Redford. It starred John Turturro who played Herb Stempel and Ralph Fienned in the role of Charles Van Doren. It garnered 4 nominations in the Oscars including Best Picture.

[@bilazaurus2759]

19:28 HE SMEARED! NOT PATTED!

[@otphd]

I love Jack's line..."You had no way of knowing it COULD happen," but of course Stemple did.

[@thoomolong]

Back in the day there were only three channels and people had better attention spans. This wasn't boring to viewers back then.

[@fromthesidelines]

Originally telecast on December 5, 1956.

[@NICKPOFFAUTHOR]

The irony is that the producers were trying to create as much drama as possible for the audience. They certainly had no idea that their (almost) flawless staging would create a moral/legal drama that would still be fascinating over fifty years later.

[@johnojohnovono7666]

Both these people are still alive. Crazy.

[@jmiller297]

This... is... LEGENDARY!

[@GoodTimeCHarley]

"YOU GET ME THAT PANEL SHOW!" --Herb Stemple, 21 (the movie by Robert Redford)

[@cindysloan177]

You can so tell that Herb did NOT want to answer that movie question wrong. The acting is pretty bad. He looked so disgusted while the question was being asked. They should not have done that to him. I don't blame him for being pissed.

[@1punch_man]

Cindy Sloan He was also given the answers also if the movie is correct. So he was also a fraud in on it.

[@bestoluck1]

This may not be interesting to most, but it's a part of history. The many reasons why our lives have become improved, is because we strive to do what is right. Some may not be interested, but think about the wrong things in history. Such as; The Salem Witch trials, American Revolution, Civil war to free the slaves, etc.... Something this small, stopped corruption. And it still exists today. A movie was made about this; "Quiz Show"

[@StormAutoAdventures]

My father who was born in 1941 used to watch this show all the time. I did watch the entire video and thought the show was excellent as always. I've seen quite a few episodes of 21 over the years, but it's been a couple of years since I've last seen one. Thank you for the video! Definitely a like rating from me.

[@stevesand8845]

Chris'sVids79 you realize this episode sprung a huge investigation because the producer wanted a new face so he convinces herb to answer a question wrong and gave the answers to van buren

[@StormAutoAdventures]

Quiz Show is one of my favorite movies of all time. My father told me about everything that went down long before Quiz Show even came out back in the 90's, so I definitely know everything that happened. Even knowing all about it, I still enjoyed watching the few episodes I saw though. That's why I watched this video.

[@roqofort5110]

Interesting, Stemple and Van Doren seem almost opposite to how they're portrayed in the film, Herbie looks quite collected while Charles looks a little nervous and sketchy

[@lilypad797]

I feel so bad for herb. They made him say the wrong answer on easiest question at the time.

[@FreakieFan]

to humiliate him :(

[@SmithCS]

lexi m it's okay because he was given all the correct answers too

[@toffekristoffe]

It's 2018 and Van Doren and Stempel, both born in 1926, are still alive. Someone should set up a meeting...

[@TKO-qj5zx]

People had to have questioned this back then.

[@hamburg1306]

Stemple different than as portrayed in the movie. Much more humble and unassuming. Accepting of his fate and nice gesture with winnings and very cordial with Van Doren. But that doesn't make an exciting picture.

[@VirginiaMoriAlejandra]

tanks for publishing this very interesting. A real prove of how influential we still are is that we fell less pity for the real Van Doren ´cause he wasn´t has cute as Ralph Fiennes.

[@dillysgirl4ever]

They should have cool shows like this on TV nowadays. Love the tough, intellectual questions.

[@anti0918]

They tried that on the first episode of Twenty One, and everyone got 0 points. After that they started rigging the show.

[@mapaps1]

this whole show was rigged, watch the movie Quiz Show

[@SmithCS]

dillysgirl4ever the show was rigged

[@mooncove]

Well, there *is* Jeopardy! The questions are pretty hard but not THIS hard (although I got all the Henry VIII questions right!). But that's about the only really intellectually challenging game show I know of on TV anymore.

[@swooten722]

Van Doren did know. He knew after his first appearance that the fix was in

[@kalukuan119]

Van Doren is too obvious. I dont think Stemple's mad though.

[@ElevatingNoCo]

just watched quiz Show on Netflix

[@VirginiaMoriAlejandra]

tanks for publishing this very interesting.

[@mushmorant9253]

"This country is run on epidemics, where you been? Price fixing, crooked TV shows, inflated expense accounts. How many honest men you know? Why you separate the saints from the sinners, you're lucky to wind up with Abraham Lincoln. Now I want out of this spread what I put into it, and I say let us dip our bread into some of that gravy while it is still hot." From the motion picture "Hud" (1963)

[@Rlotpir1972]

The 'eggcrate' scoreboard in the 1950's were pretty modern as oppose to the standard eggcrate scoreboards in 1969 to present.

[@samuellees5648]

the basic flaw in this game is that Herb Stempel took a dive.

[@cpodurnell3701]

funny how everything is rigged today in TV. Pawn Stars, those stupid Storage Wars, Ghost Adventures and many more.

[@AdamsOlympia]

Apples to Oranges. It might be a more reasonable comparison if the guys didn't really run a Pawn Shop in real life ... Of course there would be no show if it was just unscripted everyday drudgery at a pawn shop, so they are very selective in who they let come on the show., and brief them beforehand. Thing is, they never CLAIM it doesn't have scripted moments. A more apt comparison would be to other game shows like Jeopardy, in which case I highly doubt any funny business goes on; Way too much risk for little to no reward.

[@iamhungey12345]

Especially wrestling.

[@ryanocerus7853]

Yeah, they're all setups.

[@hamburg1306]

Watched interviews with Stemple and very informative. Says he knew what he was getting into and entire thing was staged. Both players had to be in on fix or would not have known how many points to risk. Makes sense.

[@gayisrave]

Watching this after reading about it makes it fairly obvious it was fixed, Van Doren tried way to hard to act as if he didn't know the answers, it was just completely unnatural

[@symphoniez]

Like if Quiz Show brought you here.

[@beernpizzalover9035]

One of my favorite films!

[@HHSGDFootballJPD]

So here's what I don't understand: if Herb Stemple was told to basically 'throw' the game, why did he answer the next question correctly, force the game into a tie, and potentially have to do the entire thing all over again?

[@secondstring]

That was rigged too. Had to make it dramatic.

[@StormAutoAdventures]

I wasn't doing very much back when this show was popular. Pretty dark times for me... Literally lol :-)

[@requiemforamerica8432]

what made the networks clean up their act is NOT governmental oversight but that they now learned how to make much more interesting shows that can get people hooked without resorting to such an extent of rigging

[@makepeace234]

Forget Geritol.....I'd prefer Vita-meata-vegamin. ( Hic!) 60 years later,& still pushing pills at the public. Thanks for v. interesting video; great movie & fascinating to see the actual incident.

[@rentslave]

Nobody wondered why Stempel could get the difficult parts of a question,but not the easy ones?Enright should have done a better job here.

[@FreakieFan]

he wanted him to lose on an easy question to humiliate him, because he disliked him alot

[@goodolgranite8247]

Shame On Enright, Shame On Him

[@darthstarkiller1912]

I just saw "Quiz Show" on HBO and I thought it was as interesting. Like "All the President's Men", it reminds us that there are scoundrels out there who will do anything for greed and popularity. I feel sorry for Stemple and Van Doren. It was is was a fair competition, they could've led normal lives with integrity.

[@mlc3stooge1]

Hindsight is 20 20 but there is a basic flaw in this game. When players are asked if they want to stop the game -- all a player in a questionable position (like stemple with 16) would have to do is wait a second or two to see if his opponent stopped the game. If not he could be rather certain that the opponent's score is also low. Should have asked them either to write their decision of have a light for yes or no.

[@harrykargenian4887]

I don't think either guy can hear the other. They are both piped in to the studio so the emcee and audience can hear, but not to each other. So waiting wouldn't work.

[@RabinKaja]

I was there !

[@ralphadamo1857]

I need some Zarumin right now after watching this. I'm getting a flare up. Too bad Heb Stemple didn't take some Zarumin and Geritol before playing the game. He might have won. Love that cheesy "suspense" music and those lovely Geritol twins.

[@SC1089]

I love it, no BS manufactured drama that permeates the game shows of today (except Jeopardy). I'd love another show like this, no time wasting, just good, hard trivia questions. Of course I wouldn't want it to be rigged....

[@jasonking8571]

Remember the choose quiz in the beginning of the movie Slum Millionaire, the last option is "It is written".

[@miapiare]

They should have them play today. Honestly.

[@Stalley75]

That's because basically everybody looked the same in the 50s.

[@JCS2059]

HGWT5763. 02/01/07/2013 A.D. i saw herb stempel in a few t.v. interviews some years ago and he was just as straight-forward as any one person could possibly be. charles van doren simply could not live with himself by continuing with this unfortunate sham-he just couldnt take it any further. neither of these men, deep down within their souls, ever wanted to become part of this charade to begin with.

[@Tmanaz480]

JCS2059 ... the most heart-wrenching scene in the movie is when Charles has to confess to his father that the accusations were true--that he cheated. A lot of mid century generational angst packed into that scene. in there.

[@TheLiberalPersuasion]

Interesting how they allowed the contestent to sometimes pose the answer as a question and the emcee would jump in quickly to confirm the correct answer even though that would seem to be inappropriate. Of course, we know that the fix was in, but it seems now to be more transparent.

[@cinemaspotlight-themovievl3559]

Charles vs. Herb - a match made in the 1950's during the Golden Age of Television!

[@whitneybennett9045]

So obvious, no wonder why this was investigated...I can't stop laughing, the basic sociology of human behavior is at odds here with the truth. I can see most Americans watching this jumping up and down because he missed the 1955 best picture for 5 points to possible win the game. Kudos to the host who doesn't care who wins! (yeah right!)

[@Kaddywompous]

I want some of that snake oil they're advertising!

[@dorman76]

the basic flaw in this game was it was fixed.

[@tsukune007]

you can tell that they were coached how to play, and how to ansewer

[@PhobosMD]

Best Answer @ 24:30 :-)

[@JFGecik]

According to Wikipedia, this was in November or December of 1956. The two men faced off in four games.

[@furrywhalesforlife1]

Van Doren talks to much, if he had talked less it might seem more real.

[@davemitchell116]

Who's the better actor, Van Doren or Stemple?

[@GuardianDiancie]

None of the above

[@thelocalmaxtax]

Dave Mitchell Stemple.

[@secondstring]

Stemple by default. Van Doren's terrible.

[@bpot22]

Correction: Herb should walk out with $49,500. Because $2500 X 7=$20,000 and Herb had $69500 coming into that game so he walked out with 49 1/2 grand.

[@goodolgranite8247]

And Thus, The Great Game Show Scandal Of The 1950's Began

[@begs54]

Charles Van Doren. What a crappy actor. Man, even if I didn't know this was rigged, you could tell he was doing and saying everything on cue... Herb Stemple showed more class for taking the dive, And the amount of BS coming out of Jack Barry's mouth. He should have been black listed from tv. But the 50's were about ratings and knocking radio on it's ass. AND they had heavy hitting sponsor's like Geritol. Big bucks.

[@1punch_man]

Charles was one freaky looking dude.

[@zebra3567]

the Marty question : 10:30

[@victorsbookshelf8844]

I have read a bit about the scandal involving Charles but I don't know much about it. Was this whole episode "fixed" or "rigged"?

[@FreakieFan]

watch 1994's Quiz Show, it's all about that scandal, it's a great movie

[@visaman]

In some towns there was just one channel.

[@MrLehnerd]

was there not a Movie made from this if i remember

[@jhillst]

Aside from the rigging, the thing I don't like about this game is the "stop the game" option. It gives the leading player an unfair advantage; the trailing contestant should be allowed a fair chance to catch up.

[@dan0ms]

The contestants don't know how many points the opponent has. That is the catch.

[@jhillst]

go dog: I know, but still...if a contestant has, say, 16 or more points at the end of round two, there's a good chance he/she is in the lead and is going to stop the game.

[@lilypad797]

I feel so bad for herb. They made him say the wrong answer on the easiest question at the time.

[@mikegillis6157]

when was the question that van burren knew?

[@wackyworldnews]

quiz show

[@ccie12933]

Herbert Stemple = Sheldon Cooper

[@premierscd]

Semple's life was basically ruined after this and he went with a vengence after the show. The book states that Van Doren was extremely handsome. Where? He looks and acts like a schmuck............

[@MrElidioto]

I need Zarumin too !

[@SumusVelgos]

We can see that Van Doren is a rookie here, he's such a bad actor ! He would learn fast, though.

[@hamburg1306]

Stemple said idea behind fix was to get close competitive games to build drama. Both players in on the fix. Completely staged and choreographed. But Marty question looked too obvious to miss and not stopping game up 16-0 were clear signs of a fix

[@ROXKSTARPRO]

Even if the contestants could not hear each other, can't they see the reaction of the audience? and make a determination on that?

[@mikesauer8196]

The announcer says at the beginning that they can't see out because of how they do the lighting.

[@Sbrownlee]

Actually, as the host states near the beginning of the game, the lighting in the booths prevented the contestants from seeing the audience.

[@Steve23JJ]

im missing something probably. why (if they can't go down under 0pts) they dont start with a 11pts worth answer?

[@witherblaze]

Stefano Carta getting it wrong with the other getting it right can put you at a major disadvantage.

[@IndexBoy]

Interesting. And I think I have tired blood.

[@monkfan72]

Not quite how it happened in the movie. :D

[@Aryanbrotherhoodboxing]

Disney War by James B. Stewart brought me here.

[@louiscucci4982]

William Moore - No

[@watermelonlalala]

The only thing the average American would think is one guy is tall and the other guy is short.Van Doren is neither aristocratic nor charming. Mumbling and looking down at the ground is not charming. Stempel is an average looking guy and deadpan, unlike the freaky guy that played him in the movie.

[@robynsegg]

That "freaky guy" is John Turturo, and he's a damn good actor.

[@margplsr3120]

true - but Ralph Fiennes is amazing. Maybe in 50ties this guy was consider as aristocratic and charming. It was so long ago.

[@bobtheballoon8947]

Brendan Hall my exact thoughts!

[@ryantheroper]

can geritol fix boredom?

[@kissesarestitches]

at this point it was only herb stemple who knew the game was rigged. No one had coached van doren, and his 'unnatural' appearance was ...completely natural.

[@zacheryalderton7797]

He was jogging before he had a ❤ attack correct

[@RealMudSkipper]

The movie botched this.

[@drb120176]

Is that Bob Sheppard the Yankee announcer in the ad?

[@robertpatrick5188]

This announcer spelled his last name "Shepherd." In addition to being the voice of Geritol and the products of the J.B. Williams Company, he was announcer for "Ted Mack and the Original Amateur Hour" in the '60s. That show was sponsored by Geritol, by then owned by J.B. Williams, and the company's other products such as Serutan and Lectric Shave.

[@PaulThePuppetier]

not 60 years ago,it wasn't.

[@whitneybennett9045]

blah, he knew the full name of the writer, and paper, and not the title of the article...yeah right! Did he behead her? Yes he did, you did it! 2,3,4,5 wives and what happened to them...they all died! haha great entertainment, is that how they justified the deception. I wonder if the writers think they were being smart or brilliant

[@jdpoel]

Stempel*

[@ancamg]

The society we live in stinks!

[@bartvandervelden1970]

That's absolutely not true. Both players knew all the answers before.

[@zacheryalderton7797]

He died

[@warsilver99]

Ah the 50s... unforgettable, yet very forgettable..

[@DuendDoPapelCelofane]

Oi carol.

[@MrElidioto]

I need Geritol !!!!

[@robertszvetics210]

+johnny rotten me too i got tired blood

[@randyking3057]

Show needed a scandal; it's one big sleeping pill.

[@robertszvetics210]

it was marty you kavoneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[@vinlajluv1]

Poor casting by Robert Redford as the character who plays Herb (John T) is much more outspoken and "nerdish." Quite disappointing, Mr. Redford!

[@RainmanCT]

right because historical accuracy is the only consideration when casting a film

[@Ronbo710]

Agreed. And the guy who played the gameshow host would have made a better Van Doren than Fiennes lol.

[@cellardoor7500]

Laju Balani totally disagree. It was well casted. You couldn’t do better.

[@requiemforamerica8432]

politicians then, like today were quick to jump into the bandwagon of public sentiment for their own ends while i agree that the whole thing was sold to the people as being "about slavery" probably even then, politicians themselves most definitely used it for their benefit , just the same as they do today

[@kissesarestitches]

at this point it was only herb stemple who knew the game was rigged. No one had coached van doren.

[@PW580]

Herbs Voice is so annoying.