A Better Late Than Never Criticism of Sonic Frontiers

[@BlazeHedgehog]

If you think SNHU is right for you, check them out using my URL: www.snhu.edu/blazehedgehog

[@auralunaprettycure]

Blaze, I know I have kinda failed my forgetting to follow up on replies in the comments several times (I was the guy who was commenting to try and commission you). But I just wanted to say, I respect your content, outlook and effort. I love all your videos. I watch them all. I love seeing you talk about your games, I love seeing you review. Your Sonic boom review and “Fix” Sonic videos inspired me to try and make videos too. Just… keep being awesome. Love ya Blaze

[@auralunaprettycure]

Also, I edited your video in a YTP (not cause I am triggered, but cause I like YTPs.) hopefully that was alright for me to do? I had so many ideas for jokes for it, I had fun making it

[@BlazeHedgehog]

@@auralunaprettycure Well, that's a first for me, at least. I guess I'm okay with it.

[@BBWahoo]

SNCHU? Sonichu...? 🤪

[@Bobb11881]

@@BlazeHedgehog Thanks to this sponsorship, I feel like my life is finally on track for the first time in at least six years and I might finally be able to make the game I've been dreaming of. When that happens, you're at the top of my list for a free copy.

[@MatrixEvolution17]

"Food tastes better when you're hungry and sonic fans are starving" is such a good way of putting it. I genuinely wonder how Sonic Team will follow up Frontiers. Morio Kishimoto has been very responsive to feedback and ST have had a lot of new hires, which will be better than having a team of only 60 people. There's no way the next game could possibly be worse right?

[@asu.ikocatboi]

Frontiers had 130 developers working on it. 60 was during the prototype phase.

[@MatrixEvolution17]

@@asu.ikocatboi ah I see. Either way, higher budget, more staff and more dev time for the next will be good

[@nerodoesart5886]

​@@MatrixEvolution17I think Frontiers had enough dev time. Most Sonic games have been 1-2 years maybe 10 months. They had 5 years for 1 game. I did hear that they got had 400-500 people at Sonic Team now. Frontiers started with 60 and got up to 130-160 while making Frontiers closer to the amount of people for Unleashed. Also, unpopular opinion, but I think Sonic Team may have gotten more budget, but they put more budget on the marketing than the game itself. Also, higher budget games doesn't make it immediately good. I think if they have better director and a better team they can make great games no problem, but I'm more worried about Morio Kishimoto still being a director since it was his idea of making the open zone empty and cyberspace controlling differently than the open zone.

[@cheemees]

I think Kishimoto should stay as a director, A lot of the Positives of Frontiers are actually what he came up with. The Super Sonic Boss Fights were his Idea, the Open Zone Formula was his idea, In Twitter Kishimoto mentioned he wanted to Revise the Ending because he felt it wasn’t Climactic , The Updates for Frontiers was him trying to listen to feedback from Fans and trying Experiment and improve the game. Kishimoto also is interested in bringing back the momentum based level design and physics, and replacing Boost. He brought back Spin Dash in Update 2. He’s bringing back Playable Characters and fixing the ending. I’ve never seen a more Open Developer than Kishimoto. He’s a perfect fit for Directing Sonic Games

[@MatrixEvolution17]

@@cheemees I appreciate his openness to feedback but I wouldn't mind a new director to freshen things up. Kishimoto has been directing every new mainline game (minus Generations) since 2010. Could be cool to see what new ideas someone else brings.

[@Kriseiri]

Trying to boost over the drawbridge is like the most universal experience I've seen people have with Frontiers. It just seems like something you would do and something you should be able to do but no, invisible wall. A bummer.

[@TheJmack90]

It pretty much sums up Sonic Team’s poor design practices. Present an explorable open world…that gates you off from exploring??

[@MillywiggZ]

It’s a metaphor for how the devs of Sonic games don’t understand its players… or gaming in general. If someone had said ‘Frontiers’ was made by an algorithm, most people would believe it.

[@AndersOHMoberg]

Even as a Sonic Frontiers enjoyer, the drawbridge is the smoking gun on the artifice of the whole experience.

[@Kune.]

they didn't even make like any in game world reason just an invisible wall, that red web thingy from the start could be used for that

[@stephaniejohnson5361]

​@@MillywiggZ Frontiers was solid for Sonic standards but it wasn't polished and it didn't have that Sonic charm. Final horizon however gives me hope for future games because it felt like Sonic

[@ganges2264]

Finally someone who isn't dick-riding frontiers and ignoring how flawed it is. Truth is most people who liked it have either never touched a sonic game (which was clear during play testing of the demo) or are just satisfied enough with running mindlessly in an open area without any objective. This is the first time in sonic history , where the art direction was genuinely awful. There are just 3 themes for the islands and they're all unrelated to the sonic series in anyway. just generic and bland , trying to appeal to newcomers who liked zelda and dont know anything about sonic. Atleast mario odyssey still felt like an orginal mario game. And the voice direction for the characters is incredibly depressing , sonic isn't even a teenager anymore , he's a 30 year old man who's sick of life. The dialogue is cringe hell , and it tries to be deep so hard that it is laughable. The animations , if not borrowed from other games , are awkward at best , especially the cut-scenes. The cut-scenes have fanmade level quality. Its never been this bad. Compare lost world cut-scenes with this , and you wouldn't believe frontiers is the official sonic game on next gen hardware. I could go on and on, but you get the point. I've suspected frontiers ever since IGN released gameplay footage and the game only kept looking worse from there. But most sonic fans just need to homing attack to an automated section with 20 bounce pads and grind rail sections to be satisfied

[@fredpayne7748]

The sonic fanbase really are in an abusive relationship with stockholm syndrome. This is in the bottom 5 sonic games for me. I'd rather play 06. I have no idea why this is being praised but it's either shills for money or sonic fans have just been beaten beyond comprehension.

[@mechakirby9576]

@@fredpayne7748 and dont forget that thanks to the internet most sonic fans dosent haven the self worth to complain o critique anything that is not new. for fucks sake even journos bullied fans when they criticized the lack of basic features in other games.

[@Antonio-is2cn]

People liked Sonic Frontiers because it was the newest 3D Sonic game in a while that allowed the player to freely control Sonic in a open 3D space since Sonic Lost World and/or Sonic 2006 which is something people have been missing after 4 boost games(not saying they're bad) Was Sonic Frontiers a great game? Yes. It played really well, it had a good story and the soundtrack was fantastic, it's clear that people loved Frontiers.

[@Skeleton20133]

Paid shills like it. @@Antonio-is2cn

[@LinkRammer]

Sonic fans got mad that genshin impact won because they liked sonic, I got mad because I hate genshin impact. We are not the same.

[@AnasAlmutiri-fw4rq]

they both should've lost to stray imo

[@james_-zx2be]

People are not going nearly as hard on this game as they should.

[@SuperSonic68]

In my opinion, Sonic's combat COULD work if it was more in-line with his movement and his movement was more fluid. Imagine: Sonic rolls down a huge cliff and off of a ramp, just like in the Sonic CD opening. Nice-feeling physics, momentum, the whole thing. Then, the player tilts the camera downward and sees a cluster of enemies. The player performs Stomp move from high above. Since they started so high up, the stomp's impact not only has a large AOE, but also sends the enemies upwards with a shockwave! Sonic then follows up with a bullet-time series of punches, kicks and homing attacks, tearing the enemies apart in mid-air. Then, after the last enemy is a pile of scrap, the player charges a Drop Dash and rockets off into the distance, perhaps off of a hill and jumping into the air to keep that flow going. Maybe find another enemy to fight.

[@stormcutter59]

What you are asking is far too epic and competent for Sonic Team to handle. Maybe the team that worked around Unleashed could have done this but not now.

[@SunSh1neFN]

@@stormcutter59damn bro, all the guy wanted was some stomp tweaks and bullet time punches.

[@stormcutter59]

@@SunSh1neFN Exactly lol

[@stormcutter59]

@amzrosevca Seriously. They are so incompetent at making great games. Their always seem to be some catch whenever we get even a decent one. You can't hope for quality like Nintendo or Capcom, just good and bad parts at best. A mixed bag

[@TheReZisTLust]

I spin dash into enemies to knock back then jump and they collide with his hitbox letting me either combo or bounce to death and it's quite fun

[@krxxc.kk6]

I actually really liked Frontiers, but I'm glad to see a video that isn't just mindless praise of the game for once...The people in this fanbase that are even willing to tolerate the slightest of criticism of this game feel few and far between

[@nerodoesart5886]

You're one of the few that I've seen in the fanbase that doesn't seem to praise everything. Most people who like frontiers would be hypocrites or not admit that there are tons of issues that may ruin the game and call it not perfect but a good step in the right direction. I'm fine with people liking the game, but the amount of praise that it gets and being called a masterpiece is ridiculous to me. They do know that they are trying to defend a game with tons of issues that's supposed to be the next decade of Modern Sonic games, right?

[@kaosagamerreal]

"mindless praise" yes sorry if people like the game

[@nerodoesart5886]

I understand that people may enjoy the game, but there are definitely a lot of flaws in its fundamentals that I should be addressed. I just don't like that people are praising the game and considering it "Peak Sonic" and acting like that there isn't a lot of issues down to the engine and the core gameplay that is much concerning for the future even though this game was supposed to be big step in the right direction for the next decade even though it's more of a vague step in a uncertain direction that could lead to something substantial or just a disaster.

[@krxxc.kk6]

dude i literally said i like it, by mindless i meant people who meatride it and deflect the fact it has some issues@@kaosagamerreal

[@kaosagamerreal]

@@krxxc.kk6 why werent you more obvious about that

[@SpeedyBlur2000]

It doesn't look like the rails and the platforms in the sky really blend in or feel at home with the world that they are in. They just look plastered everywhere like you said. In other Sonic games, rails, platforms and other stage objects fit the theme and design of the stage that you are in. Like yeah, a platform in Green Hill Zone may function the same way as one in say Chemical Plant Zone, but the look and design of the platform is different and made to blend seamlessly within the stage itself. All of the platforms and rails in the open zone of Sonic Frontiers, from what I've seen, have the exact same design no matter where you are on the Starfall Islands.

[@ragnarockerbunny]

My interpretation of Sonic is perhaps the most conventional. Despite being a financial criminal, Yuji Naka basically defined everything you need to know in Green Hill; jumping fast on slopes, fast high paths and slow low paths, a big time bonus because the logical conclusion of a speed focused game is to learn to speedrun it (or even just try get faster casually) and that beautiful ring system. Frontiers fixes some things and breaks some things. I have little problems here and there and then a handful of really big problems but... There's a lot of joy there. The open zone structure taps into the joy of running fast and jumping off things. Cyberspace as a quasi BOTW shrine... Well, I was a staunch disbeliever until the game was in my hands and I saw that they got it. Speedrunning those Cyberspace stages was an absolute joy, and while the theming could have been more diverse, the level design could have been less flat, the physics could have been refined... There's more than just something there. Sonic Frontiers represents to me a game that was fun but unrefined, in a way that begs for iteration. Sonic Team will likely inevitably throw everything the fuck away to make a goddamn 3rd Person multiplayer looter shooter but just one more time, just one more time... Stick with it and drop another game changer.

[@battlinjoe2592]

I agree, except for the whole thing with Yuji Naka. That whole situation is suspicious, especially since Square Enix are probably on the same level of morally dubious as Konami, if not worse.

[@SpeedyBlur2000]

Yes. They should stick with this gameplay style and refine it for future games to make it better.

[@garrtoons4303]

I like to look at Sonic Frontiers as the Batman Begins of Sonic games. It's trying something new and inspiring while also being flawed in many departments. However, maybe it'll lead to more inspiring stuff (like with The Dark Knight).

[@Carsonj13]

But we're supposed to HATE Yuji Naka now! All because Peter Moore, the guy who ran EA Sports beneath the Earth's Mantle, left him with that good ol' EA Sports saying! YEARS before he even got a job working there! Haven't you seen the videos from Golden Bolt and that other guy who thinks Max Payne 1 has aged better than Jet Set Radio Future?

[@james_-zx2be]

I believe Sonic Robo Blast 2 nailed it. Sonic isn't only about momentum, slopes, or even loop de loops. Playing as Sonic is all about speed as a reward for skilled gameplay, imo.

[@WAKKAWAKKA.]

"There's probably more meaningful characterization in Frontiers than all Sonic games from the last 15 years combined" Sonic Unleashed: ... i'm not over 15 yet... and my little brother The Black Knight is right there what do you mean "Combined"? And let's not forget about big brother The Secret Rings... What is he talking about "Combined"?

[@7_wd40]

Agreed tbh

[@Antonio-is2cn]

"The last 15 years combined" He's referring to the 2010's Sonic games for being "too lighthearted for his liking"

[@AccelerateHedge]

​@@Antonio-is2cn and also just really bad

[@WillyToons]

Congratulations on getting the video out, @BlazeHedgehog! I don't agree with a lot of your thoughts on this game, but your in-depth and intricately produced videos are always appreciated.

[@MillywiggZ]

By this point Sonic is more of a blue blob. Nobody knows what to do with the character, it’s like WipEout, Tony Hawks and etc. more products of their time. It’s hillarious at the same time when Y2K and early 90’s are trending now SEGA thought to copy ‘Breath of the Wild’s homework rather than lean into the 90’s “extreme” attitude of the property that fan games have leant into.

[@victortunisse6686]

Watch out buddy, you could be burned as a witch... 🤣 But seriously, it feels like these guys wanted to make a generic RPG game, and halfway through production the big boss came in and said: "Hey guys, it looks like that new Sonic movie wasn´t a bomb in the West after all, so now this is a new Sonic game" then the director said: "But boss, the game is almost ready, we have all this open world map finished, we were ready to rip the shit off the new Zelda...!" and then: "Nah, this is a Sonic game, just kill the main characters, slap some Sonic ones on its place, put some random rails and springs and let's call it a day..."

[@IkeOkerekeNews]

What do you mean critics hate the "90's extreme" aspects of the franchise.

[@WasifBoomz]

I think that combat could potentially work in 3D Sonic, but only in a physics-based system. 06 and Unleashed's Day Stages showed signs of this where you could smash enemies into each other, and it made the combat in those levels honestly way more fun than it ever was in Frontiers. I'm imagining riding rockets into enemies, luring enemies to hit each other, riding them down hills to gain speed, that kind of stuff.

[@mari0shi065]

I always viewed sonic games as a strange non-euclidean marble physics game. it just so happens that there's characters and plot to it. Seeing the franchise stray farther and farther from that kinda hurts.

[@shnibbletron69]

It really is that simple yet sega hasn’t figured that for 20 years now

[@Luna-pk7gz]

Frontiers soundtrack I can't agree on, it's the most generic EDM shit I've ever heard, all the cyberspace music blends together. It's kinda wild how bad this game was to a point even the OST was not cooking.

[@ReverofEnola]

^THIS. Plus, the Cyberspace OST lacks identity. I can maybe tell you 5 tracks at MOST that I like. But most of the music blends together & sounds the same. Doesn't help that the level names are numbers & that the over 40 levels all share 4 themes. Thus blending them together even more.

[@VirtuousAezon]

That's what I'm saying fr

[@ABlob]

Small note: Sonic Mania and Team Sonic Racing also got delays but I'm not sure if it's really for extra development time for the latter. Sonic Mania even got multiple delays. Also, technically, actually, Naoto Ohshima's last Sonic game before Sonic Superstars was Mario & Sonic at the Rio 2016 Olympic Games for Nintendo 3DS specifically, and only because Arzest partially developed the 3DS version and Naoto Ohshima is leading Arzest. ^^'

[@SunSh1neFN]

Bro did both Technically 🤓 Actually🤓🤓🤓

[@ABlob]

@@SunSh1neFN Yep, that was the joke.

[@carrillmunnings525]

I SO agree with your point on the combat. I hate that Sonic uses his fists and I hated how tanky the enemies were in Heroes so it's baffling that they'd do that again but more in Frontiers. To me, enemies in platform games mainly exist as a way to propel the player forward. You bounce off of paratroopas in Mario to reach higher heights and you homing attack across flying enemies to cross gaps in the Sonic Adventure games. I should NOT have to stop my forward momentum to deal with some stupid enemies. Frontiers really just took every popular thing in games and made a weird Frankenstein game out of it. Breath of the Wild's aesthetic and open world, Shadow of the Colossus's story, NieR Automata's hacking bullethell minigame, and a tacked on RPG skill tree. It's a sign of a clear lack of identity. And I get the sense that most of the Sonic fandom that hypes up Frontiers, don't even really understand Sonic's core identity either. Most of them seem to be prefer the modern era and a lot of the ones I've spoken don't even seem to be interested in platform games. So of course, these people would hype up the Sonic game that wants to be anything other than a platformer. The Sonic fanbase primarily is passionate about the characters of Sonic... not platformer gameplay.

[@kunfupanda1231]

I swear some people see an open world no matter if the series fits it or not, no matter if it’s completely empty and dull and just go “oh open world so its the best game ever”… shame.

[@Touma134]

Can't wait for a thousand low effort worthless puzzles or busy work to waste 200 hours on at the cost of actual well made content.

[@GeekCritique]

Been looking forward to this one since the game came out. Thanks, Blaze. :D

[@JangoUnchained98]

Sonic Frontiers is disgusting, in my opinion.

[@joshwaterfield2483]

I feel like I am in a tiny camp of people that feels like the term "open zone" is the perfect way to describe this game. Open world games always imply that you are placed in exactly that, one specific world that you are dropped in and it's open for you to investigate at your leisure. In the context of sonic, zones were always the terminology used to denote "levels", if you will. So by having a handful of levels or "zones" in the shape of the different islands, that were large enough to play around and explore, I think in the context of sonic, open zone is the most perfect and accurate description of what we got.

[@Tessodan]

50:00 I think the developers realized that having to cyloop enemies like that would be a problem so they added the quick cyloop into the game. It breaks the pace of the combat but they planned for it. You don't actually have to slow down and cyloop them you can just homing attack them and press x or triangle or whatever the top button is to instantly take off their shield and continue your combo to kill them. It's an upgrade you get by the second island but this criticism is valid. (Although I got it on the first island due to grinding exp lol)

[@BlazeHedgehog]

The problem there is that I'd always have trouble getting the quick cyloop to come out when I wanted it. I think you can only use it twice before it has to recharge, but they always spawn 4-6 enemies. So you use it twice at the start of a fight and then it takes so long to recharge I can't use it until the next fight.

[@Tessodan]

@@BlazeHedgehog True! Very true. This game has a lot that should be fixed. I really like the game but I just... Idk there's a lot in the game that goes against itself like the combat not being all that tense because Sonic can't die by losing health and it's hard for enemies to really hurt you. Sonic can just cyloop for more rings during fights when he loses them or just... Run away lol. I wish they had more time to really look at this game and get a concrete idea for what it should be. It's their first try at this though so I guess in the next game we'll see a big improvement to this open zone sonic thing. Ik that's what a lot of people day but all we can rlly do is wait for now 💀

[@lupinthenerd439]

​@@BlazeHedgehogYeah, the quick cyloop has cooldown. I does cases i target an endmy with the lock and do a large cyloop with the boost, since the lock makes the camera zoom out and a good view of the sorroundings

[@best_mate456]

The normal cyloop is better against soldiers and the quick cyloop is better on gardians and titans especially

[@Touma134]

The delay is astonishing considering how much the sega higher ups has a hard on for kneepcapping sonic team. Maybe it's a sign of better things to come.

[@sonicbrawler182]

You kind of misinterpreted what "open zone" meant. While SEGA may be one of the first to use the term directly and so consistently, it doesn't specifically refer to "an open world with Sonic gimmicks", and can be applied to other games. All "open zone" actually means is incorporating open world game design into smaller maps that still convey a sense of scale. The difference is that an actual open world is meant to be completely seamless (aside from transitioning into dungeons and towns and the like), and would usually be associated with massive RPGs and adventure games - your Elder Scrolls or your Breath of the Wild/Tears of the Kingdom. The point in those games is that you're almost giving the player the complete freedom to choose their own adventures from start to finish. Open Zone really just means you have a fairly large, open-ended environment, that gives you the freedom to explore and progress towards a singular objective in a variety of ways. In Sonic Frontiers' case, you have the same objective on every island (defeat the Titan), and you have a few prerequisites to meet to accomplish that, but there are a large variety of ways you can progress towards that objective by exploring the island. For example, you need Memory Tokens to progress, and those can be found in a variety of ways, such as through platforming challenges, cyloop chests, defeating enemies, random drops from cyloop, and Big's fishing game. The player can spend as much time collecting memory tokens as they want through all of these available means, mixing them together until they eventually have enough to proceed. The same goes for all of the other collectibles in the game, they are available through different means. And the key thing is that the islands house far more than you would ever need to progress, which lends itself to different players focusing on different aspects of the game or different parts of an island to focus their collection efforts on. It's similar to open world game design, but smaller in scope. You're ultimately being pushed towards a single objective and don't have any crazy side adventures you can embark on like in an open world game, but you do have a great degree of freedom to progress how you want through the singular narrative you are given. And of course, the environments themselves are open and lend themselves well to being able to explore with a character like Sonic, but the smaller scale compared to an actual open world means they can still make sure the map is constantly dotted with things to interact with and make use of Sonic's abilities (that's another thing - open world games often have many different abilities and weapons to the point the designers can't always make them required use, or they may only be used in very specific quest lines associated with them, but Frontiers gives you all necessary abilities from the beginning - the skill tree abilities are just extra flair for combat and make it a bit easier). Open zone game design also does not necessarily have to encompass an ENTIRE game, in fact it's super common for open zones to just exist as part of a larger game that is otherwise linear. Even something like the recent FFXVI is an example of that, it has open zones, but they aren't the entire game. But some games like Super Mario Odyssey and Sonic Frontiers do largely use open zones for the majority of their run-time.

[@Gotchankofan]

Boost

[@xScruffyDaSasquatchx]

This has become one of my favorite sonic games ever but i realized i have the benefit of being on pc and being able to mod out my problems with the game

[@kingbash6466]

Not too bad of a video. While I don't agree with every criticism, I do like people who are honest about the game instead of forcing positivity because of Sonic's waning reputation for the past decade. Not to say we should mindlessly hate on this game, but blindly praising it can be just as bad. Last time that was with Colors where people thought it was a return to form for the franchise, and now over 10 years later, fans are arguing that it's one of the worst games in the series or at least the worst mainline 3D game. On the delayed Sonic games part, they actually delayed Team Sonic Racing from a late 2018 release to spring 2019, possibly because it would have competed with Smash Ultimate (didn't matter since they ended up competing with Crash Team Racing Nitro Fueled, and we saw how well that went).

[@jotarokujoandstarplatinum1280]

I ultimately came out pretty positive on Frontiers; to date it's tied for my favorite 3d Sonic game with Adventure 1. The main thing that rubs me the wrong way, which you touched upon, is its lack of commitment to many of its new ideas and doesn't bother polishing up its older ones. It feels like a very insecure game; they don't trust the core gameplay to be engaging enough, so they include options to easily bypass them. It gives me the impression that they're well aware of their reputation and are fearful of going too far with some things, including the combat system. The lack of external rewards for collectables also sucks. I've 100% the game 3 times as of today; the core movement is satisfying enough for me to want to go around collecting all of the memory tokens, but I do wish there was *something* material you could get out of it beyond a little sticker in the island selection menu. With the June 23rd update, which came with the ability to turn off deceleration when jumping from a boost as well as the spindash, I think I can safely say that Sonic Frontiers is the best feeling game I've ever played in terms of movement; at least when the terrain you're running on isn't completely busted. I swear Sonic will either fly into the Sun or stop dead in his tracks is his shoes come into contact with something as minute as a pebble in that game; the former can be fun, but the latter is frustrating and sucks. I still don't understand why some cliffs can be scaled with a drop dash and some are hard barriers that don't allow you to scale at all. I'd personally like to see Frontiers' combat fleshed out, but I don't think I trust Sonic Team to do a good job. If I were to gut anything from the game it would be this. That in mind, I still think it's a fairly great game, and I hope to fucking God they build on the good ideas of this game rather than start from scratch again and give us yet another unfinished game full of ideas that are still gooey on the inside. P.S. I'm glad to see Big in the games again, but as a big fan of fishing minigames I'd genuinely like to see something more in-depth than the glorified gatchapon machine we got in this game. That may be an unpopular opinion so I doubt I'll see anything like that though; there's always Sega Bass Fishing ig.

[@poppi8432]

fantastic video, i'm glad not everyone is so desperate for any sonic game with any seriousness that they give this mid as hell game a good score. most boring empty and uninspired BOTW wannabe i've ever seen, sega even shamelessly whined about it not doing as good as TOTK last year. way to be subtle about what you're ripping off sega lmao

[@best_mate456]

This was better address than the other criticism I watched. You took more further that what I hated like having so many skill points on me OTHER than that, update 3 is going to drive me crazy when release. Is not going to fix everything obviously but the biggest issue of sonic frontiers is going to get fix finally Fantastic video and I hope you play update 3 wether you enjoy or hate it 🎉

[@ThomasCapella]

I've never seen a video that captured my thoughts about the game as much as this. I struggle to articulate my thoughts in a manner that doesn't sound like I'm just a hater, but you managed to do so very well. I feel like this game is way overhyped and I can only hope that maybe Sega learns from Sonic Superstars but that's only a hope.

[@jaretco6423]

Finally someone understood. I keep hearing from Sonic fans that Frontiers & Superstar were going back into the Renaissance Era for Sonic and I'm like " No. Not really. ". Sure there are better than the ones we had since Lost World. But that ain't saying much. They have so many problems that needs to be addressed and improved on. Sega hasn't learned there lessons yet and they still keep making unpolished & broken games. Plus there's Mania. That one was more of the second Renaissance than Frontiers & Superstar and it was made by the fans of Sonic. If Sega would've kept those guys, than I'm sure we would've been more into the second era of the Renaissance for Sonic. Instead, they just kept what they got and makes an not so well quality games that they fell to capture. Sonic fans needs to stop acting like babies and just admit they beloved franchise isn't back into it's roots yet.

[@chrisfratz]

On the note of people who defend the werehog in unleashed, that's why I'm always annoyed when someone comes to the defense of the werehog with a clip showing a fully leveled up werehog absolutely pummeling enemies, because that's not really realistic to an actual playthrough of unleashed in my opinion. I love unleashed, specifically the daytime levels, and the warehouse can be enjoyable, it's just that the fights bring it down so much and experience points just don't come fast enough to be able to max him out. Maybe if you take all of the experience you get in the daytime stages and just funnel it into the warehog, but then you're skimping out on the speed and boost stats.

[@jeriahrosen101]

I thought Sonic was fast enough in Unleashed, that i didn't really feel the need to upgrade his speed and boost that much tbh. The werehog is where i spend most of my time leveling up because it makes the levels much more enjoyable, and the fights go by faster as well. When you focus on strength and combat stats that is.

[@sonicthomasgamer]

@@jeriahrosen101When you upgrade your health in the early game you’re wasting points while the enemies get stronger and swipe that little bit of health you leveled up to and you do not as much damage When I play now I level up strength because obviously And combos so the enemy goes down faster This is like every RPG that lets you level up stats ever You live and learn When you don’t level up your strength or try to level up everything you’re going to have a hard time

[@mossen98]

3:00 "to hard too learn a engine like unity or unreal" well atleast u dont have too worry about one of them LOL

[@robertlauncher]

That was the absolute worst pinball game in the series. Take me to Casinopolis Nights please

[@Schwoomy]

I personally love sonic frontiers, it feels very replayable to me, the open environments are fun to just run around in, I enjoy the combat system, I think the story it went with is something the series had been needing for a while ever since the 2010 era started, the control customization is good to have, and I really appreciate how receptive Morio Kishimoto has been to feedback and it makes me hopeful for how this formula could evolve in future games but if we want future games in this series to continue getting better, then somewhat harsh critique or “tough love” is needed to address and improve on what problems the game still has

[@slayerstarx7109]

The whole memory thing with reusing level themes doesn’t even work well and they didn’t even use that excuse well. If it really was about that then I find it very convenient that it only remembers green hill zone, chemical plant and sky sanctuary but nothing else from Sonic’s pass

[@ThibautMahringer]

Moreover, there’s the original city theme, new levels never seen before and levels Sonic never went in (Sky Rail for example)

[@l3rvn0]

It's pretty sad to see you commenting on combat and the like, because even though you say that no one really knows what Sonic is because the series has changed so much over the years, you have a very rigid definition of what you think Sonic should be You compared Sonic with Flash, but Sonic on CD, OVA and Adventures was portrayed more in line with Dragon Ball, and that's how many people saw the series in the 2000s, Dragon ball Z with Furries, and it could work...Frontiers just don't do a good job, but some fans see the potential there... I personally don't know how they could make it work, but if Frontiers was a 2D game, it could work like Megaman Zero, a game that had a lot of melee combat but that most enemies can be killed with one hit or ignored, making it great for speedruns

[@BlazeHedgehog]

I don't know if it's that narrow. To me, every new Mario platformer feels like an extension of what Mario is. Sonic Team has had a hard time nailing that in the most recent Sonic games. If there was a natural progression it'd be a lot more easy to accept, but so many Sonic games are bizarre left turns that it's harder to follow an evolutionary lineage.

[@l3rvn0]

@@BlazeHedgehog Mario in general is pretty consistent, but the series had a small change of identity in Sunshine when Koizumi took over as director, he likes to insert drama into the narrative, not by chance Sunshine was fully voiced. Sonic... goes through this every half dozen games, they have a consistent vision until they suddenly change direction for no reason... After Adventure 1, the series ended up becoming character driven, each with their own perspective on story, their own theme song, the narrative took several notes from Dragon Ball Z and shonens in general. To allow the characters to express themselves more their moveset was expanded, even in the Advance games, but they never added much to the gameplay. Like in any good shonen they ended up putting the characters to fight each other many times, but the combat wasn't deep enough, it was just pressing the jump or some other attack until the opponent dies. The first time we got anything more interesting was in Sonic Battle, where, again taking notes from DBZ, characters would throw each other across the map and follow them at high speeds and then slam them into the ground or at a wall. After 06 the series completely abandoned the shonen aspect... until recently with Forces and Frontiers, which apparently will have multiple playable characters in the next update. Well-executed combat mechanics would complement the shonen aspect well and help give more identity to the characters. To do this right I think the combat must be quick and non-intrusive, you're basically going to use it more on bosses or to eliminate obstacles that can hinder your platforming or exploration. Talking about exploration, a Metroidvania-esque approuch would also work great with Adventure-like skills and upgrades giving access to new areas, etc

[@bluestar5812]

@@l3rvn0 Mario is easier to be consistent because his games are the most basic version of what a platformer are. Every game character can jump. Mario as has the benefit of not having a character, he is a caricature, a blank slate. This allows Nintendo to morph and shape Mario to be anything. This is much harder to do with Sonic because he has an established character and relationships, and set of abilities, which forces Sega to explain why Sonic is racing on a car and not on foot. As long as Nintendo nails the feeling of the controls they can do anything they want.

[@l3rvn0]

@@bluestar5812 Donkey kong is the most basic version of what a platformer can be, you play it literally as jumpman. Super Mario Bros have momentum, power ups and a few dynamic elements. For comparison, Megaman stops immediately when you release the right arrow and always jumps the same maximum height, but Mario is slippery and can jump higher and farther according to his momentum. Sonic was directly inspired by it. And while Mario can do a lot of stuff, Nintendo usually are very rigid to what they let Mario do, that is why his moveset changes very little from game to game, but Sonic was designed to appeal to teenagers and show how much better the genesis CPU was over the snes. But what teenagers find interesting is constantly changing... Pursuing what teenagers find interesting, they end up in Adventure 2 with this mix of Sonic, mechas, Dragon Ball Z and Tony Hawk and that's ok. The execution wasn't the best, but most additions complement Sonic well (actually, IMO 3D Sonic could learn a lot with Jet Set Radio Future). Things got really serious when Sega went third party, they now wanted to appeal to children, older fans, fans of the Genesis games, everyone, so they ended up changing everything each new game. If momentum based gameplay was already painful to work with on the Dreamcast, it was completely out of question having to develop the game for multiple consoles in a tight time window, so they just gave up. Some games are more platformer based like heroes, others are reflex based like Unleashed and some are literally "Mario Based" like Colors and Lost World. Time skip to now, and Sonic is kind of going back to where it was in the early 2000s. We had momentum based gameplay with multiple playable characters with Mania and a shonen inspired mess of a open world game, that is kind of a Sonic Adventure 1 sequel and that in a few weeks will have multiple playable characters as well. IMO, its the perfect time f̶o̶r̶ S̶o̶n̶i̶c̶ A̶d̶v̶e̶n̶t̶u̶r̶e̶ 3̶ to fix things

[@starlightrose3237]

i personally enjoyed frontiers but i can't deny that most of the points made here are valid. it's just a shame that most of frontiers' flaws can be traced back to sega repeating the same mistake they always do and not giving sonic team enough time or money to implement their full vision for the game.

[@Ezpeezy309]

Although I still love this game, it’s clear that sonic team has a lot of cleaning and polishing up when the next game comes out

[@emmanuelmondesir8677]

In my humble opinion: I'm tired of Sega/fans pushing for combat in Sonic platforming games. If they want a Sonic character-action game, they can just say that. In platforming games, enemies, outside of mini/bosses, shouldn't take more than 1 hit, 2 AT MOST for sturdier enemies. No need to lost the focus on momentum for the sake of a conflicting gameplay style. Respectfully.

[@Nel_Annette]

Also instead of cyberspace levels (in a perfect world, the environment of each one would be different), I would still have the thrones transport you to the boost-formula style levels but have them still take place in the same environments as the islands you access them on. We see Kronos, Ares and Chaos Island surrounded by smaller grass, desert and volcano islands in the distance. They could have easily taken place there. Also, I don't think I would have hated Ouranos as a final Island as much if -the awful Rhea Island (it's just the other part of Kronos, why is it even named differently?) wasn't right before it -there had been more islands with unique environments in them making the gap between Kronos and Ouranos bigger, giving it more of a bookends feeling. There should have been a snow island. Or a jungle island. Perhaps an island that wasn't even an island, but a half-sunken massive ship/city of the ancients. And that final boss. Good god. We have a game that emphasizes Super Sonic fights, and your final boss is... a bullet hell? It could have been a multi-phase, AWESOME Super Sonic fight against the End's many forms drawing from Sonic's memories. I hope whatever DLC 3 is giving us is more akin to that.

[@best_mate456]

I mean with supreme now have 7 arms is already confirmed is changing 😂

[@derpydino17]

Man, it's great the see Blaze uploading again. I hope you're able to post more game development content in the future.

[@BlazeHedgehog]

I would love to, but I'd need more financial security for that. That's not me begging anyone to do anything, more just the fact that games take a lot longer to make than videos. I still work on games when I can, but that's a struggle when time feels so tight sometimes.

[@KrisJoshJones]

You ever play Burnout Paradise? For years I’ve felt like that game would be a great blueprint for an open world Sonic. Drifting through tight valleys, barrelling off cliff sides into tucked away shortcuts. The "Big Surf Island" chunk which focuses on doing massive stunts in smaller vehicles in particular makes me feel this way, the weight and sense of speed was just perfect. I know it’s been said many times but it’s still so bizarre to me how little the terrain itself actually factors into Frontiers’ platforming.

[@ragnarockerbunny]

The issue is that Burnout is such a fundamentally different game than Sonic. In theory I like the idea of a well defined lived in play area with ramps and races and secret alleys but Frontiers doing five or six smaller spaces that string a narrative along actually makes more sense to me. The big issue is just how incohesive those spaces are; The ramps and loops and springs are super disconnected from everything, whereas something like Sonic Unleashed managed to blend the "gameyness" into the environment far more successfully.

[@BlazeHedgehog]

These are dots I connected a year ago on my ask blog! You definitely might be on to something. blazehedgehog.tumblr.com/post/668761259494293504/honestly-if-they-took-forza-horzion-and-added-a

[@shroomologist]

It stinks of salvaged environments from an unrelated cancelled project repurposed to make a Sonic game honestly. I'm not saying that's what it is but it really seems like it. Does the combat ever really even incorporate the terrain into the gameplay? I know certain encounters take place in dedicated arenas but when you come across low tier enemies multiple times is it always on open ground or do the surroundings vary in order to mix things up a bit?

[@BlazeHedgehog]

@@shroomologist No, never. There's a bit I think I show near the start of the combat section of this review where you fight a group of enemies in a tight slanted desert area but that's about as varied as it gets. At most, there are a couple of Guardians (Squid and Fortress) where you get locked into a scripted chase sequence once you start their fight. On the final island, there's also a Guardian called "Ghost" where the only way to damage it is to cyloop around 3-5 waypoints before it siphons all your rings and kills you. Usually each waypoint is at the end of a special platforming challenge. But everything else is fought in basically the same spaces.

[@shroomologist]

​@@BlazeHedgehog That's a shame, you'd think it would be an obvious thing to try really. Plop a few stage hazards down to avoid while you fight enemies, you could have enemies on multiple tiers that make you switch back and forth to avoid bullet spam, perhaps a converyor belt or giant turntable to move them around in a different yet predicible way. I mean the original games only had a few enemy types per stage and the combat, if you can call it that, was as straight forward as it gets but having the same enemies appear in different contexts is what stops it from getting monotonous. I find it just a little bizarre how they opted to feature 2 slightly different platforming styles, 2 different combat styles, puzzles, pinball, ikaruga etc but seem to have almost completely avoided trying integrate the different gameplay styles in any way. It almost comes across as a last minute fusion of 10 independently developed games lol.

[@sirqrow881]

even if Frontiers isn't great, Genshin winning is stupid in my opinion, I don't even think a gacha game should have the ability to seeing as its essentially gambling.

[@FirestoneAnimation]

It's definitely an upgrade from Forces, but by all means it's not perfect. Story and physics and gameplay, not a massive step forward, but a step none the less. Edit: About the houses and structures, Sage did point out that the Ancients had a hard time adapting to the world so the structures were pretty much like that.

[@reversalmushroom]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks Frontiers' worlds are ugly, looking like they're filled with garbage. The stonework is ugly too.

[@Nel_Annette]

They're SO boring. I have no idea what everyone is praising. Grass, Desert, Volcano, Grass, Grass. Big empty fields filled with the same ruins over and over, really boring challenges to expand the map, crappy boss battles, and clusters of rails and platforms in the sky that just look like out of place junk.

[@andiekatamari]

weird to think so many folks will think some story updates and new characters will improve critical opinion, when the most key failures of Frontiers are the character movement and open world/cyberspace layout and design. basic fundamentals. i would LOVE to play as Sonic's friends again. in a more regular level to level Sonic platformer game with awesome controls and level design

[@SlickEvan]

Aren't those the things people have been LIKING about Frontiers??

[@shinji2898]

@@SlickEvanYep, almost like some things are seen as being bad or good by different people..

[@grizzakaful]

​@shinji2898 Exactly, everyone has difference of opinions. Do I think they will fix everything? No. Do I think this will at least now set the standard that we hope sonic games will go to and improve upon it? Absolutely. All we can hope for is that Sega realizes what they need to do for their next project and how to improve it.

[@darkspinechronic-1825]

Yeah but in the open zone at least, you can set Sonics control to how YOU want due to the sliders available in the options. That's why I dont get why people say his controls are bad in the open zone like dude. Mess with the sliders and you'll find something that feels right

[@darkspinechronic-1825]

It comes down to the person knowing how to set him up i guess tho

[@hoodedstreetmonk352]

I have yet to play Frontiers myself. However, the impression I get from most people played it is that this framework can be promising for future games... but the game itself is just ok.

[@stormysoup1083]

Ye it's like a 7/10 at best but shows potential

[@BlazeHedgehog]

I will say, I'm more interested in seeing where they go from here than I have been in a long time.

[@bluefire9285]

A 7/10 is a good score tho. Why do you say at best like its low?

[@stormysoup1083]

@@bluefire9285 it's not a bad score, Frontiers is decent but it's nothing amazing, the kind of game I'd enjoy my time with but not a game I'd consistently find myself itching to go back to and it's still something I can recommend to others

[@best_mate456]

@@BlazeHedgehoghow you feeling about update 3 that they are revamping the ending story

[@augustbornone]

That was a very well thought out and in-depth review BlazeHedgehog, having finally beaten Sonic Frontiers fourteen-to-fifteen days ago, I have......... VERY mixed opinions on. Thats not saying that this game is bad, for what it is, it's a somewhat huge improvement over Sonic Forces, I found the story to be well thought out, it may not be Sonic Adventure and/or Sonic Unleashed levels of great, but for what its worth, its really enjoyable, I like how the characters get MASSIVE character development, with my favorite being Tails' character development, Sage as a character is very interesting and I will admen that I shade a sad sight at the ending scene and joy at the Post Credit scene. The gameplay was also really great, I am a huge fan of Hack-In-Slash Beat Em Up Games and Sonic Frontiers was what I wanted, I mean yeah, its NO Genji: Dawn of the Samuria, The Legend of Spyro: A New Begging, Spider Man: Shattered Dimensions, Darksiders 2 and Bayonetta 2, but it's still a great time. I'm also a fan of how the Guarding Bosses are handled, given that the four main Islands has multiple Guarding Bosses and how you can play any of them in any order you want, it gives them HUGE replay value that's on-par with Mega Man/Mega Man X, and given how much I enjoy those games, that brings a smile on my face. And finale I'm also enjoy some of the bosses, special mention goes to Ninja who is an excellent tutorial boss on how the mechanics work, Asura for reminding me of the Egg Genises from Sonic 06, and the first Titan boss, Giganto, who is......amazing. But despite that however.... many calling it the best Sonic game ever made is WAY too exarate. For one thing, the Overworld Deign could be SO better, they could have made it so that you can go from Point A to Point B more manage able and instead made them way to confusing, mainly the third Island, I had to look up a guide so many times that it made this game tiring. I'm also not a fan of the "Prologue" battle agents the first three Titans, the first one was fun, but the last two is WAY too cumbersome with many bulls#it placements of serten objects (screw the Knight with its fracking Buzzsaw). Another thing that I'm REALLY not a fan of its the Character Tokens, during the second and fourth Island I had to grind SO much that it's not even funny, it may not be Sonic Unleashed's Medal levels of tedious grinding, but in a game that's all about going fast, they should have just left it out entirely. The Mini Games that are mandatory to beat the game are also something I REALLY dislike, there not terrible, but they are SO tedious that it made me want to rage, the Casino Night Pin Ball game from Chaos Island and the last hacking game in the fifth/final overworld before gaining the final Chaos Emerald can seriously go fu#k themselfs. And also I'm not the fan of how the second and third Titan bosses, YOU (as Super Sonic) don't get the satisfaction of destroying the Titan, instead you use the Wyvern's own missiles agents it and in the case with the Knight, you use its own sword agents it, the latter of which uber angered me as after losing so many times in that bullshit Buzzsaw Segment in the prologue, I was REALLY looking forward to seeing Super Sonic demolish Knight, so you can imagine my disappointment when I found out that Super Sonic used Knight's Sword/Whip to deal the final blow..... And finale, of course, is the final boss.... which after having to switch the difficulty just to beat the "True" Final Boss just to beat Sonic Frontiers FOR REAL after just beating it MINUTES AGO and facing The End... I have to ask somthing..... we went from: 1) A Ginormous Water Serpent-Like Dragon Monster (Sonic Adventure) 2) A Gigantic Lizard Attach To A Large Space Shuttle Thats Heading To Earth (Sonic Adventure 2) 3) A Large Robotic Dragon-Like Monster (Sonic Heroes) 4) A Devil (Shadow The Hegehog) 5) Fracking Gods (Sonic 06/Sonic Unleashed) 6) A Robotic Wisp Thats Controlled By Eggman (Sonic Colors) 7) A Robotic Time God (Sonic Generations) 8) A Humanoid Egg-Man Mech (Sonic Lost World) 9) A Humanoid Mech that later on turns into a Robotic Wisp Look-A-Like (Sonic Forces) And in this game, we went from a Giant Humanoid Titan, a Large Dragon, a Four-Legged Knight Robot, a Stronger Version of the Giant Humanoid Titan, AND THIS IS SERIOUSLY WHAT THE GUYS AT SEGA CALL THE FINAL BOSS??? An "I'm smarter than you" jackass A.I. Moon that spams Energy Balls and Energy Lasers/Beams????? Did Sega just run out of time when they created The End and just made this the "battle" to conversated???? So overall, Sonic Frontiers is a HUGE mix-bag for me, please let me explain that this game is not terrible by ANY means and I would like to stress that I DID have a good time with Sonic Frontiers, am so glade that it's here and I'm really excited to see what Sega plans to do next, it's just that I might go back to the previous Sonic games (e.g. Sonic Adventure 1, 2, Sonic Unleashed for the Wii and Sonic Generations) due to all of the problems piling up on each other on this outing.

[@nerodoesart5886]

I felt mixed too after beating the game, but when I went with my gut and logic. I gave it a 4.5/10 to 5/10. I just don't think the game is all that good even in 5 years of development. I think most people gave this high scores and look away from it's issues because it's not Sonic Forces, which feels like a excuse for making the game better. I got confused earlier this year when people gave this game a high score and gave the director a 30-60 page docs, videos and sites on how to make the series better and how make good games even a bunch of improvement with Frontiers Which doesn't feel like Frontiers was that successful except for sales. It also annoyed me when people liked the game would just pretend there were no issues when they do see the issues and knows that it harms the game a lot, people call it not perfect, still a good game or a good step in the right direction. Even be hypocrites with modders making the play better. There was a person making a mod for more momentum like gameplay with a proper spindash and people were saying it was overpowered and the modder tried to justify what they were doing with the mod and people didn't like it because of the spindash being overpowered and saying Frontiers shouldn't be like this. Once update 2 came out, people said the spindash was fun even though it was more game breaking then the mod. Which was unfair. So... Yeah.

[@augustbornone]

Lets just hope that Update 3 will be able to fix most of the problems.@@nerodoesart5886

[@TunaTunerFish]

I don't typically leave comments much, especially not on KZbin, but I wanted to say how... cathartic this video is? That might sound dramatic to some, but I've actively found this game off-putting from reveal to release. Nothing of what I saw from then to now has shifted my feelings towards it, at least not in a positive manner, and it made the reception from many fans all the more confusing to me. Not confusing in the sense that they aren't allowed to like the game, of course they are, but it's like how you described it early on: I don't see it. Unsurprisingly, I haven't bothered buying it and playing for myself because spending money on a game I'm confident isn't for me sounds like a huge waste. But to hear from someone who HAS played through the entire game, expressing the same issues and overall vibe of the game just feeling... wrong? It's refreshing to hear when you feel like one of the odd ones out. Even moreso when there are toxic folks out there attacking people for criticizing or disliking the game, trying to shut them down by telling them to "shut up," how "Sonic fans are never happy," or pull immature nonsense like what happened with The Game Awards. Despite some seemingly taking issue with it, I think starting the video off talking about that feels justified considering the kind of behavior that's been going on. This is a great video all in all, and no one should ever feel bad for describing their honest thoughts on a video game.

[@victortunisse6686]

Exactly how I felt too... Sometimes I wonder, who´s fault is this? Why does this always happen with Sonic? I mean, many Sonic games had similar issues in the past, like bad controls, bad physics, weird stories, weird concepts, bad understanding of Sonic itself... Is this a Sega corporation problem? are they forcing these decisions on the developers? is it a developer problem? someone inside the team? Is it money? is it the fact that Japanese in general don't enjoy Sonic as much, but the development are being made by Japanese people? I would love to turn into a little fly just to get inside their offices and pinpoint the origin of this problem...

[@Bobb11881]

I'm all for Sonic trying new things and not sticking to a single identity. It was conceived to combat the safeness and homogeny of Mario, but even Mario is incredibly experimental these days. His most popular games are the kart racers. His most popular platformers are the one where he goes to space to save the entire universe and the one with a photorealistic dragon that shows up out of nowhere. There's no reason Sonic shouldn't be allowed to experiment with new things. But this isn't a new thing. It can't be overstated how much Frontiers apes from Breath of the Wild. The boost meter is just the stamina meter recolored blue. The game takes place in a desolate world filled with the ruins of an ancient civilization and the tone is appropriately somber, just like BotW. The Kocos are obviously inspired by the same mythological creature that the Koroks are based on, and their names don't even try to be different. They even serve a similar purpose. There are four giant robots that were built to combat an ancient evil entity and you have to fight them. The world is filled with bite-sized puzzles and challenges. Why is that laser puzzle there? Because it's something Zelda might do. But don't worry, it's not like the entire game is stuff ripped from BotW. They also stole purple coins from Mario Odyssey. I get that they have a different function, but couldn't they have at least _tried_ to make them look different? It can't be a coincidence that they're purple coins. The story on the other hand serves the sole purpose of "fixing" things people didn't like about recent Sonic stories, which is _never_ a good idea. You should never write a story about how previous stories were bad. You're not writing a story at that point, you're writing a KZbin rant. See GodzillaMendoza's recent video on The Amazing Spider-Man comics. The best way to deal with previous stories being bad or controversial is by either ignoring the bad or controversial parts (or the stories as a whole) and writing something better or by releasing an official statement striking it from the canon. I don't want to see Tails cry about how bad his writing has been recently and then repeat his arc from a 1998 game. I just want to see his characterization return to how it should have always been. You don't need to explain it or give him an arc to bring him back to where he should already be. I know people haven't been happy about Sonic games not referencing the events of other Sonic games in recent... decades... but you didn't need to throw in 50,000 of those references regardless of if they make sense or not. It feels more like nostalgia pandering than continuity building. Hell, the fact that Sonic games haven't referenced each other's events in a long time was the perfect excuse to ignore widely hated stories like those of Lost World and Forces without explicitly rendering them non-canon. That would have been a win for both people who hate those stories and people who like them. But no, they had to be explicitly confirmed as canon for some reason and now all the people who hate them have to deal with all the out of character and continuity-breaking moments of those games being canon. I know Amy being a Sonic fangirl is clown on, but they didn't need to completely erase that part of her character. Now she doesn't even resemble Amy anymore. Her new big defining trait is tarot cards, which feels like more nostalgia pandering considering the fact that it was referenced once in an instruction manual and then disappeared from her characterization for decades. You could argue the same goes for Knuckles and grapes. Turning a one-time offhand comment into a huge part of the character isn't character building. Trying to fix things people didn't like isn't writing.

[@mammamiawhygod2091]

Shadow the Hedgehog wasn't the first time they listened to fans wanting Sonic to have a gun, it was Sonic Adventure with E-102 Gamma which was then adapted into the mech gameplay of Sonic Adventure 2. Say what you want about both of those play styles but I just find it to skim over that history and immediately bring up Shadow the Hedgehog.

[@anga156u1]

I think the intention as for why the ruins look like they tell nothing is because they are supposed to be in a way, incomprehensible, they are not just a civilization lost in the war, they are an alien species with a technology so advanced that it's practically magic, their lifestyle is nothing like ours or anything that resemble Sonic's world, it almost sounds like Lovecraft with the Ancients being like The Great Old Ones. they are even stated that they pre-exist every ancient civilization we have seen and outclass the Black Arms in both technological advancement and predating them by years. It sounds like a silly excuse, but that's kind of how Lovecraft is also written, a lot of ambiguity about something so great that it means nothing, but it can be fascinating, is both incomprehensible and lost to time.

[@DefinitiveDubs]

I agree with everything in this video except for the combat part. I think giving Sonic melee attacks and having some kind of combat system makes sense. Because otherwise, how would Sonic deal with enemies and bosses in 3D? Previously, it was by hitting a weak point, and then surviving an attack pattern long enough for the weak point to open again. In the Genesis games, Sonic could wail on the boss for multiple hits at any given opportunity, and ideally that should work in 3D, but how? The old method of simply jumping on them doesn't quite translate to a 3D space, especially with the speeds Sonic is going at. If you use the homing attack and simply spam that over and over, it would look a little goofy and could have disastrous results, as it does in Heroes. It would make the most amount of sense to give Sonic some type of melee attack that he can spam at the right time. The fans calling for a combat system grew up seeing Sonic in cartoons, where he'd easily sidestep and dance around his foes as they try to hit him, and do all sorts of crazy maneuvers in fight scenes that you normally don't see in gameplay unless you're playing something like Kingdom Hearts. So if all fans are able to do as him in the games is jump, that's kinda disappointing. Even in the Sonic OVA, lauded by tons of fans as one of the best representations of the series, you can clearly see him doing kicks, against both Metal Sonic and Metal Robotnik. Even in SA2, they experimented with Sonic having special combat abilities, which he uses when you fight him as Shadow. It even makes thematic sense in contrast with Knuckles. Whereas Knuckles does slower but far heavier punches, Sonic would do a series of extremely fast but comparatively lighter kicks. So this idea isn't something completely out of left field and I don't think it's as cynical as copying what other games do. Bottom line: from both a gameplay and a thematic or character perspective, Sonic NEEDS some kind of combat. It doesn't need a skill tree, it doesn't need enemies to have health bars, and it doesn't need EXP or stat progression or any of that crap, but it does need something to justify boss battles that aren't the same "run constantly and hit a weak point every 30 seconds" boss we've seen for the last 20 years.

[@hitbyatank]

What really took me out of the Sonic vibe is all the floating crap everywhere. The levels on Sonic speed simulator (on Roblox 💀) are actually pretty fun just suuuuuper small

[@Dragzilla66]

The DLC Final Boss and the DLC cyberspace portals tortured me over and over again. Inconsistent difficulty spikes. 💀

[@jayceallen6530]

When I went back to this game I really realized how overhyped it was by the fanbase, this video really goes through my problems with it. Horrendous pop in, a dull art style, a story strangely similar to botw, lack of cyberspace zones and original level designs, bad base movement(i know you can tweak it but its base mechanics feel sloppy) jank combat, and more. It really us a bigger mess of a game and the bosses were the only thing that got me to finish it. If the bosses and music are the only decent things about the game than its really not that good of a game

[@Scroteydada]

Open world could have been the perfect solution to the padding extra gameplay styles of game previous. The same assets can be reused by having Sonic come at them from different angles as new destinations appear.

[@Beastmd]

I hope you realize it’s disingenuous to make the comment said at the game awards all about sonic fans cheating. Genshin impact fans were cheating as well bruh, they were obviously talking about all the bot votes in general, not specifically sonic😭

[@ghhn4505]

Hey man the Genshin fans cheated first lmao Also the only "proof" that Sonic fans "cheated" was a spike in votes after a large youtuber told Sonic fans to go vote for Frontiers so

[@Chadzilla_the_Keyblade_welder]

Sonic fans punched first and provoked them. And ultimately lost. It's called Karma. Plain and simple. Sonic fans need to learn to stfu.

[@Carsonj13]

Sonic fans tried to ddos the game awards? Is there any proof of this?

[@camillo6455]

Hi this is a really great rewiew very insighful keep it up !

[@blur7491]

This video is very well formatted and well edited, and the script is pretty well condensed but, as someone from a completely different stance on the game, i couldn't help but heavily disagree with a key aspect that plagues your critique. During the open world segment, you mentioned how frustrating the inconsistency of the scripting was to you due to going against your muscle memory; but thats the thing, *your* muscle memory. *my* muscle memory had me always use the joystick as if i still had control over Sonic, so in sections like in Rhea Island, it was just natural for me and it made complete sense. Another example is you critiquing the usage of mini games or drawing comparisons to the way BOTW presents its ruins, and all of it all boils down to *your* past experiences with the series/straight up OTHER games to peg down Frontiers which i honestly didn't get. Another example: You say the mini games "dont belong in a Sonic the Hedgehog game"...why not? Hell, BOTW, the game you keep comparing Frontiers to (for good reasons tbf, i dont mind you comparing), has a detour where you have to go on a 20-60 minute side adventure just to get into a female only town. None of these aspects were like this in a Zelda game before, but its there to add variety and not make the game the same old same old. Like, earlier on you complain about how every Island feel the same, then also complain that they tried new concepts within each Island via the mini games and I just dont get it? Another aspect I do not get it was your rant early in the video about Sega "not doing anything to preserve the original team" and that Sonic's identity suffered because of that, citing Frontiers as an example of that, but the ways you described Frontiers to be "out of place" (Puzzles, Story, gimmicks etc) all ALSO apply to games like Sonic Adventure, games that still had a good portion of the original team. Hell, Sonic Adventure makes all these gimmicks mandatory to progress through the game. You can skip fishing in Frontiers, you cant in SA1. In fact, in this very video, you said that you being able to skip content in Frontiers is actually a flaw because it showed a lack of confidence from sega's part, but then praised Skyrim for doing the same thing? You cannot tell me Skyrim has a consistent level of quality through and through with a straight face, so why is it a benefit for Skyrim that you can skip through the parts you arent a fan of but a flaw for Frontiers? Anyway, once again, great video, but these inconsistencies in criticism where you praise other games from the same genre for doing the exact same things Frontiers does kinda drags down the video a bit.

[@thelognerrator]

22:59 Gonna be "that guy" but Open Zone actually refers to the fact that instead of one contained and connected open world, that there are multiple open zones, zones being used in a similar context to the classics.

[@BlazeHedgehog]

Sometimes the world needs that guy

[@Stew91]

Whitehead is professional developer, not some fan that Sega decided to pull out of the woodwork.

[@mikester8171]

Ok to be fair in that comparison to the Flash, how do you think he’s taking down bad guys at super speeds? Not just running into them, he runs and punches and gets into fist fights all the time. The Flash TV show that you pulled clips from shows him doing that all the time. That’s what makes speedsters cool seeing them fight at super speeds, same goes for Sonic honestly, nothing wrong with him throwing hands while still turning into a ball and tearing through things.

[@Scerttle]

My favourite part of Sonic Forces was that the mysterious voice sounded a lot like Hydaelyn from FF14 in the Japanese dub and the first thing I said was "Oh no, Hydaelyn's gonna be bad in this game" lmfao I'm glad the game delivered.

[@BenHyuga]

Honestly hated the game. I like the narrative choices they did for the story and think they should take a more serious approach to sonic story telling in the future. That said I absolutely despise the idea of open zone. They somehow managed to make a more bland exploration than SA1 hubs. All there is to do is just do shitty side quest that give you a map. Lets also not forget how bad the physics are for cyberspace you need mods to make them even feel halfway decent to play along with short ez to play stages.

[@DefinitiveDubs]

I'd like you to do a video on the insanity of Sonic fans and their inability to accept any level of criticism. I believe Ian Flynn once said that a psychologist had analyzed brand reverence among fans, and concluded that Sonic was the highest he had ever seen in his field.

[@ceciliavaldez843]

Me as a sonic fan: well guess I am mental now 💀

[@BlazeHedgehog]

I'm no psychologist, though. I think Sonic fans are just wounded from being so misunderstood for so long. Sonic became this franchise that was easy to dogpile on even though there was a large group of people who still found it to be very beloved. Even though that tide is shifting, it's created a culture that gets very defensive very easily.

[@AYTM1200]

​@@BlazeHedgehogperfect analogy.

[@richbichrich]

its interesting - i agree with pretty much all of this video but nearly a year later the high points (bosses, story bits, music) stick out to me more than any of the negatives. i dont think i'll be replaying frontiers for a while after update 3 releases though

[@telekinesticman]

Fantastic video. Totally agree on this being trend-chasing and not at all like what Sonic "should" be, to me anyway. Open world Sonic sounds great on paper, but this is a total misfire in terms of execution.

[@Chadzilla_the_Keyblade_welder]

Even though I thought Frontiers was alright, I really liked your review on it. I agreed with a lot of your point's. Especially when you said that there's no "problem solving" in the game. The game basically holds your hand through the experience. And the cyberspace levels are just awful. Heck, I'd would say that Genshin is a fair more appealing game to look at visually compared to the boring looking islands in Frontiers. I also liked how you were calling out the horrendous behavior from the Sonic fanbase. Including how poorly they were during the whole game awards nonsense. I've dealt with annoying people in the past, here on YT. And I've never used Twitter.

[@Ceeington]

I haven’t watched the full video yet but I’m pretty sure it was Genshin fans using bots to cheat which is what was being referred to in the clip you showed, regardless I know a lot of Genshin fans voted purely out of belief they’d get some rewards for winning it which is just disingenuous in regards to what game genuinely deserves to be awarded

[@punkypony5165]

Yeah it was basically confirmed to be genshin fans botting. They won legitimately but it wasn't the sonic fans botting.

[@SapphireKnight675]

they were rewarded afterwards so it does seem the more credible case, to be honest, they minus well of removed them instead

[@waypastcoolkid]

Have you unlocked the spin dash? Completely changed the game for me

[@BlazeHedgehog]

The patch with the action chain stuff came out while I was putting this together, so I've only done maybe a third of them so far. It definitely looked very strong from what I could see.

[@waypastcoolkid]

@@BlazeHedgehog it’s quite fun! :D

[@supercyclone8342]

@@BlazeHedgehog The new koco challenges show extreme promise for the next game, since they make pretty good use of Sonic's moveset, including momentum jumps! Also, I just saw a mod that adds some scaffolding + Eggman theming to the floating platforms, which makes things more cluttered, yet it actually looks pretty good.

[@ng3176]

​@@supercyclone8342Out of curiosity, what is the mod's name ?

[@supercyclone8342]

@@ng3176 look up "blue vivacity eggman invasion." The mods are in the description

[@vani-lla]

5:12, Sonic 4 Episode 1 and Generations 3DS are two games that got delayed before Boom Fire & Ice.

[@thechuckjosechannel.2702]

Glad to see you back Blaze.

[@andersonsansonowski5644]

for me, sonic is all about speed being a reward for being good at the game and when you think about it that is in every game, with momentum or not - the classic games made that a thing with momentum based plataforming, fast reactions, and multiple paths - It was all translated to 3d with the adventure games - the boost games had you needing various different things to fill the boost meter SONIC FRONTIERS is a strange case because though the alternate paths and reactions are still there, the game had no momentum (though now with the new updates it does have a lttle) the boost things were more of the meter upgrades, speed upgrades, and others..

[@amirataamirzadeh9477]

Not sure if I agree with basis of your philosophy, that the main point to bring up in this analysis is a lack of understanding of the new devs, or the missing original influences. Like that's not factually incorrect but... I really don't have an issue with that (if we're only talking about game design philosophy and series continuation cause everyone is screwed over in corporate World. Also I'm not saying disregarding artist intentions is a good thing, this inconsistency is a side effect and the reality we live in, and we can very much work with it for better things) I can maybe explain myself better, but I'll just say I much prefer it when the series is so wildly inconsistent with it's identity, it's the Spiderman situation. Folks have been trying to recreate every interpretation of this franchise themselves, giving more control to general public to explore their preferences on their own. It removes "the auteur" and a piece of work is no longer bound to the whims of its creator. Even Sega as a corporate power has lost power over this franchise to an extent. I feel like the strong fan game Dev scene owes part of it to this. One can argue that leads to a poorer work or it explains the chaotic landscape of the fan base, but I'd argue bad corporate environment and practices are much bigger influence in this franchise's output quality than its inconsistency. And if I comment on the story, I think a lot of frontiers' "non-mystery" and silent dead world is a lot like stalker (1979) Dont know if that was intentional, frontiers is a Mish mash of different inspirations and references but I like that.

[@nerodoesart5886]

I'm not fond of the series being inconsistent, because I feel that makes the series have no identity or seem clueless. Just because Spiderman does it doesn't entirely mean everyone wants this. I think that it's a massive issue with Sonic games not feeling or being what they should be due to the teams decisions and ideas. Also, I did remember Takashi Izuka saying they brought in the old zones again and level design to teach the new developers how make a good sonic level and its a Easter egg. Also, most of the things that they are doing is coming from fan "feedback" or ideas being taken. I've never seen Sonic try to be consistent and I think that would be the best option than just making the games look careless like the lore and gameplay characteristics. It comes off as them not caring about all these things and wants to make a good game regardless of what Sonic does. I just want Sonic to be like the earlier 3d titles to be honest even though I never grew up in that era.

[@amirataamirzadeh9477]

@@nerodoesart5886 I think there's already an abstract Idea What sonic is among public One can look at modern sonic and classic and say "yeah that's sonic" Sonic can have jackswing and metal core in its games and audiences of both genres can appreciate the other. This also applies to what folks don't want Everyone looked at ugly movie Sonic and universally rejected it, it was a reaction that was even heard outside of the inner circles of gaming. A reaction so huge that changed the course of the movie franchise. I say that there's no ultimate identity for the series to have, this doesn't mean a lack of identity, it is hugely personal and subjective and the current landscape allows those perspectives to be explored. One of the last Sonic projects was a free April fools visual novel featuring an all modern cast, and folks liked it.

[@nerodoesart5886]

@@amirataamirzadeh9477 I don't really care to much about that game. Mostly the 3d and Classic games. Also, classic Sonic has a identity, but modern Sonic doesn't. Classic Sonic is one thing while Modern is completely different. Everybody looks at classic Sonic and can be like that's classic, but once everything goes to Modern meaning the movies, TV shows, games, comics, even like boom. It's widely decisive. Even there being the Jp version being the true Sonic while En Sonic kinda all over the place. I also get what you mean, but I still don't think it's the best. I know people have their own personal preference, but that makes it more of problem for Sonic Team to take note of if they want to get back on track since everyone is split on what he is, looks like, his world where it's hard to choose what's the definitive Sonic. I think this would be too big of an issue if most things felt consistent and cohesive to feel like it's one world. Also, Ian Flynn has a different interpretation of the character and does it in Frontiers, but the Jp changes a lot of it if they don't see it working like the Pontac and Graff games. Meaning that they have a certain way that Sonic should be, but don't know exactly what most people want since it's clearly subjective and a devisive topic for people to get into that looks at the character much different because of the amount if experimentation. For me, I want Modern Sonic to be back to who he is like the Dreamcast, GBA and earlier DS games... Which is very simple, but most people don't want that Sonic or think of it as a good idea and want the series to do something else like Characters going to war, being more serious or kids friendly or like having a army of some sorts like that. Even redesigning them to be different looks than the cooler and edgy look to the 2000s. There are a lot of ideas and devisive opinions, which makes it completely confusing. The jp knows what Sonic is kinda as a character, but not so much about others since there has been many different Sonics throughout the past 30s to find one that seems more in character. And now this heart my brain.

[@lupinthenerd439]

I'd rather have a more consistent series, but i think that where we are is a good spot: 3d open zone with modern designs in one side, 2d classic sonic in another and spin off games and general media in the other side (or sides if you will). I think this is a good "inconsistecy" to have

[@SapphireKnight675]

​@@nerodoesart5886 doesn't help either we had three completely different eras, Classic era we all know, the Adventure Era (Adventure to Black Knight) was experimenting with gameplay in a new dimension with more epic stories, while the Modern Era (Colors to Forces) were just about refining a single gameplay style but not much effort in the story or lack thereof in a basic form, and now Frontiers and Superstars are trying to figure out how to go forward with this series with the only practical success being the movies

[@MillywiggZ]

“This is it, huh?” Video is over by that point hahaa!

[@AYTM1200]

Am I the only one who loves this guys voice and style of narration.

[@hairy_cornflake]

I gotta admit it...but as someone who just got bored playing Breath of the Wild, I fairly enjoyed Sonic Frontiers.

[@Antonio-is2cn]

OMG same here!

[@r4psc4llion32]

glad to see I’m not the only person on the planet who just didn’t really enjoy this game. I felt like I was the problem when I booted up the game for the first time, the game that everyone was praising and saying “saved the franchise” and just. hated it.

[@blinkyy4594]

So having enemies that all have unique weaknesses and gimmicks is bad but button mashing is good until it isnt? I never seen a review contradict its own points so blatantly just to criticize is hilarious

[@SlickEvan]

I enjoy Blaze's content but I was really hoping this wasn't the case. I have yet to watch it, so I'll see for myself but I already feel a strange aura on this review. In we go~

[@BlazeHedgehog]

Enemies with unique weaknesses doesn't matter when it's not fun to interact with them. Like I said, there's a simple pleasure in seeing flashy combat animations, but the kind of depth they're trying to bring out of this combat system isn't very compatible with the other gameplay styles.

[@321cheeseman]

Being able to quickly mash out combos on some basic enemies and then get back to running along is preferable to enemies being invincible until you perform some slow, boring, menial task before you're allowed to mash, but neither is very good, and especially not in a Sonic game. Combat has never been done particularly well in this series. Where's the contradiction in that?

[@Antonio-is2cn]

*It's okay Blaze probably hated the combat in Sonic Heroes Shadow and Sonic 2006 too*

[@windy3935]

Different "perspective" is cool and all, but this still remains a good 3D Sonic game. A lot of games with an abundance of flaws and glitches are hailed as some of the best video games ever made. I wouldn't say SFr is one of those, but it is a perfect example of a pretty flawed game that's still fun, enjoyable, and good. Sonic has had recurring quality issues since the genesis games anyway, onward. Sonic games primarily have to be rated as Sonic games, otherwise to be a fan of the series is an L and ironic considering how extremely few installments are objectively incredible. You can't say SFr is a bad game while being a fan of and defending prior installments. Whatever department it be, that of gameplay, general design choices, technical performance, etc, just about any installment is notably flawed somewhere.

[@nerodoesart5886]

That's... A werid way to look at it. Do you want the games to be better or keep flawed as it's been? From how it's worded it kinda comes off as all games be like this so it's fine. And when you say a lot of good games with glitches, I'm only thinking of Cyberpunk 2077, Slient Hill remaster, Sonic Colors Ultimate, Gta remasters, and Sonic adventure 1-2 ports. That's not good. I would personally still consider the game somewhat bad, but around being average. If the game allows the player to get away with exploiting the games mechanics, using glitches, fishing... And the Spindash making the game fun and broken then there is a bigger issue that most people are not realizing.

[@windy3935]

​@@nerodoesart5886 From what I said, I obviously didn't say that. Dude. A game doesn't need to be bad nor be rated bad to be improved. I can say the game is good while still supporting improvements needed. I didn't say the game is perfect, so that argument doesn't make sense. The whole point of not giving a game a 10/10 is to show it still needs improvement. That's common sense. You get a C or 73% on a test because you still have room to improve. Furthermore, no game is perfect nor ever will be. You seem to come off as that type of person, especially Sonic "fan", who continuously criticizes Sonic games as if that's all there is to be said about them and will become perfect as a result of it. Blatantly ignoring there is literally faults to be found and selectively focused on, for any game. For 2023 that's a disappointing list. "Bad" is below a 4/10, so no it's not somewhat bad. It's flawed. Many of yall can't properly rate products and distinguish what is bad, what is flawed, and what can be good with flaws. Same for average vs mediocre vs bad. The game is competent enough to be well beyond a "bad rating". Collision, clipping, etc issues are present in every game, especially games that cowardly try to strip as much freedom and agency from the player as possible to lessen/avoid findings of glitches. I like to use Naughty Dog as an example, because they're overrated as hell. The SHEER amount of bugs and glitches in TLOU (and "Part II")... you know... probably exceeds Sonic. Look, that's not the point; the point is there are enough bugs and glitches to question that game's rating. The premise of your argument is too ignorant for you to seriously make. How are you not aware that just about every game has exploitable mechanics and designs that can allow people to pull off ridiculous things. Doesn't matter the budget, price, etc. The reason why your argument is bad is because you'd have to call most, if not every single, game bad for being flawed and having the number of exploitable things they have. At the very least whether you care for speed-running or not you should be aware of how many games people can beat in a matter of minutes to a single hour. Being ignorant to other games' flaws, except Sonic (of course), doesn't make them better games or any less guilty; it just means you haven't noticed them. (Others such as myself have though.)

[@nerodoesart5886]

​@@windy3935I had a paragraph of things that I wanted to say, but all of a sudden, it deleted. I never said that I want games to be perfect, I want games to be legitimately good. I have a lot of knowledge on video games and I played many different genres of games. I know video games will never be perfect and I know that it can't be. Sonic Frontiers is not perfect, it's very flawed and somewhat broken down to it's core, but It can be improved... Somewhat. Even though it looks more like it needs more than a improvement like an overhaul for the next game. Sonic Frontiers is supposed to be something revolutionary for Sonic series for a decade and the game to push the series into the right direction like Street Fighter 6, Tekken 8, Mortal Kombat 12, Mario Wonder, and Final Fantasy 16. But this game comes off as a not quite making the finish line while the other games are much more ahead than Sonic even though they have been around much less or longer than Sonic. The exploiting bugs and glitches in video games or in this case, Sonic Frontiers. I don't have a problem with it. I'm saying that if players have to exploit the game to make it more enjoyable then there is a problem with the actual core gameplay like the homing dash that I have seen most people used and act like it's a core gameplay mechanic in the actually game even though it was not intended. People begged for Sonic team to keep the glitch in and Sonic Team listened and did not try to touch it throughout the updates. I'm not a speedrunner in video games and just enjoy playing the games normally or at my own pace. I don't have an issue with people exploiting glitches, my problem lies with if it makes the game better than playing normally or having skill ceiling wouldn't that mean that it was not good in the first place. For example, most people did not enjoy cyberspace, but once they figure out that glitch and how the glitch worked then they constantly been using it and saying that "Cyberspace is fun now." Would that all have changed if Sonic Team decided to patch that unintended glitch? Also, I am all for the developers getting feedback, but not how a lot of Sonic fans on the game director's Twitter account has been doing it. Like... Not only they are giving him feedback, but they are giving him long documents, videos, websites on how to make a good video game or Sonic game in general and the director is taking it as good feedback for the next game. Even though everybody have different idea of what sonic should be and how he should play, which comes off as people thinking that the game is very much flawed to the point that they need to give them this much to help Sonic Team. I have no problems with them getting feedback, but if it resorts to that then I think there is a underlying issue with the fandom and Sonic Team given direct feedback than most people think. All I am saying is that I want the series to be better rather than just looking clueless like Frontiers that looks like it lacks an identity. I don't want the games to be bad, but I also don't want give the game priased that It doesn't entirely deserve, which would make me completely disingenuous. In terms of improvement, it all depends on the developer's and director's ideas and decisions and how much time, money, and skillful developers making the game. Also, if they have a good director that is in charge of most of the games development even though the higher ups are funding and watching the progress happening. I still think Frontiers is somewhat bad like 5/10. There things that could be improved upon, but most of it needs a big overhaul for the next game like making the game from scratch and not building on top of Unleashed, Generations, Lost World, Forces, and Frontiers and inheriting engine issues and the developers pretending that's it's fine. Even taking over a decade of issues in one engine. I am not impressed or excited about the current state of Sonic as a franchise and even how low that the franchise has went to try and get back up to only get Frontiers. Some things they should have improved upon a decade ago like cameras, physics, collision, even Sonic's movesets, but frontiers downgraded the skydiving, quickstep, level design, boost, etc. People may see it as a good step in the right direction even though I see it as neither good or bad step in a vague direction that could lead to something substantial or a disaster. I will like to be proven wrong, but most of the time I always have been proven right even though I'm not trying to do anything of the sort and just using pure logic. If they could prove me wrong then I will easily take the L, but as it stands now. I don't think so, but we will have to wait and see in the next coming years. Sorry, if this makes me look like a certain type of way like a jerk or a person who tries to look like I am right even though it's not my intentions, but I'm just tired of Sonic at this point that I played other games that played better or is more fun than Frontiers like Spark the Eletric Jester and Bomb Rush Cyberfunk. So yeah.

[@windy3935]

@@nerodoesart5886 Many people get MORE enjoyment out of exploiting games. Some people thrive off that. They've said it explicitly and have shown it through aggressive gameplay tactics. Even objectively there is an exceptional appeal to exploiting games because it in itself can be considered a game too, which is fun. "Sonic Team didn't patch the feature..." See, it's this type of argument and mentality you have that really this discussion will go nowhere and the series just isn't for you. Look, I get it a bit (i'm not pro homing dash; I've only used it twice, both times by accident and I have over 100hrs in game). But you have to fully acknowledge that ST recognized the bug before anyone else, observed player feedback, and responded positively by keeping it in the game (im not saying always give fans what they want, im just speaking in THIS case). Then they added a feature to "compliment" it by showing (/exposing) players who uses said feature, which is a(nother) W for ST. You have this full-on-serious attitude that doesn't allow you to appreciate and see the positive side of matters. Looking at the situation purely as a "it's a bug, it must be fixed period! >:(" is a very narrowminded view. Their decision unified the community, made them appreciate the game, created more engagement, etc. (Good CS level design wouldn't be enough to save the game anyway, honestly.) It's as I said. Speedrunning in general 99% of the time involves glitches. There are self-imposed challenges speedrunners do for fun called 'glitchless runs', which is getting through the game purposely not using glitches. Back to the other, series like TLOU, Shantae, Jak and Daxter, Ratchet & Clank, Spyro, Sonic, Dead Space remake, every game involves people glitching through walls, exploiting environments, etc to get through games faster than normal means. Because as I said, no game is perfect or polished enough to avoid exploitation tactics. Glitch or no glitch, it doesn't matter. Them [exploi.) exceeding or just heightening gameplay, it doesn't matter. Cyber Space would have been considered unfun without HD, yes. Until the spindash came and triumphed over it, adding to further enjoyment when combined. And this time the mechanic was intended. M.Kishimoto has opposed some of the feedback, I've seen it. (He told some dude he was confident in his direction for Sonic over some other guy and told him he should develop his own game with the idea they expressed.) It's possible he's also just being polite and/or doesn't want to alienate the fans. Sonic Team in general is very much aware of the fanbase's passion and demands. The way some other developers have responded on X like N.Druckmann, Ian Flynn a bit, etc have been unacceptable and definitely lost themselves fans. You're aware of how divisive the fanbase is but at the sametime don't acknowledge it being a large part of why there's so many request. It's not just due to (your perceived) quality of the game. I'd easily bet you they could make a 9/10 game and you'd still see numerous request and feedback: characters, features, moves, music, and the list goes on. Every single Sonic game there's massive feedback. It's exhausting and overwhelming, especially with TSR which was overexaggerated. Gens is hailed as one of the best games in the entire series and even it gets flack for its little content and some other things. The Sonic fandom is exceptional; you should know this by now. I've met, seen, and interacted with more than enough to confidently tell you most fans will never be pleased. There's too much of a divide. Been to Gamefaqs (some pure awful people there), Reddit, Resetera, PSNP, SonicStadium, SonicRetro, Twitter obviously, etc, etc. You got 2D purist, 3D purist, 2D haters, 3D haters, adventure haters, multiple playable character haters, boost haters, boost stans, and the list goes onn. Again, but in short, I see what point you're trying to make about the feedback, but it's not entirely tied to Frontier's quality. Hell, it's common sense people are just taking advantage _and_ trying to get as much as they can from the situation [asking Kishi]. Frontiers had development problems. It restarted development midway even. Through everything that's happened since, with the latest patch, the game just isn't thattt bad. You HAVE to also give leeway here; this is a first of its series. Sequels are usually the best installments for a reason. Let the formula cook. The game deserves a ton of praise for things you're overlooking, which is basically why we're here. Unlike people usually, I see and evaluate both the bad and good in everything. This is just a "minor" example, but they finally implemented that day and night cycle they been trying since at least S06 (Unleashed was close but you know the deal there). And they pretty much went all out with it, being in real time (unlike the high budget, polished AAA Marvel Spider-Man game for contrast), showing in cutscenes, etc. Since it works the sameway, the weather system as well, which is beautiful in this game. They compliment the story emotionally too as ST said pre-release. They've finally managed to design a Sonic game without gimmicks like the Werehog (which is not hate towards it as Werehog is great tbh), wisps, etc. Not only improved the controls tremendously but also basically made it the best it's ever been (Adventure 1's controls are dead ass overrated, especially DX and up, there are flaws few people mention); ideal control for 3D Sonic finally. Sonic's characterization is fricken finally mostly back on track, and good effort was put into restoring/fixing the other core characters as well. Super Sonic was redefined greatly (the music, combat, role...). One of a few good things with the arcade levels design was their success in making fully 3D stages for the first time in a somewhat boost-style game. They've finally added a toggle for disabling boost distortion effect, which is minor-ish but a first. And I can go on. You obviously have your list of criticisms, and we're already under a video that primarily does that, so it'd be pretty necessary. But yeah. Alluded to it earlier but Frontiers WAS made from scratch. It's cited as a main reason why the game took so long to develop and why they had problems making it. They were USE to building on from what came before, but they took a different approach this time with Frontiers. Devs ain't pretending the engine issues are fine. Fixing that is a BIG undertaking, something better off for a sequel. Wait till then to give them less slack. See, you're nitpicking and are expecting everything to be perfect. Sonic has a ton of moves. They're not all going to all be to your ideal standard. Do you play fighting games (plenty of them, Tekken, Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat, King of Fighters, Guilty Gears, Dragon Ball, Naruto, Dead or Alive, Soul Calibur, Smash Bros., Injustice, whatever)? Have any favorite characters who's moveset are never perfectly the way you want it, with moves that suck or whatever (despite being a game almost entirely purely dedicated on fighting mechanics)? We don't even need to go there. Any game there are mechanics, features, or story elements you will undeniably be disappointed in. Yet you expect all these things in Sonic to be non-problematic. I'll give you quick step, since that clearly hurts the gameplay experience. Level design is going to take a hit when the main game introduces and has large ass island maps to explore, unlike every other previous sonic game that had basically NOTHING BUT linear levels to focus on. Plus, the CS are clearly more like Sonic 2's special stages, and yes that's a valid point to make. I'd say the real main issue are the limited background themes. Skydiving I don't know. Boost... Many assume this is still a conventional boost game, but it (clearly) isn't. Just because Sonic has a "run faster" button doesn't make this a boost game. They're doing something different, and people are sleeping on this. Imma just be honest with you. It's like I kept telling Trip, just leave the franchise. It won't live up to your standard. Questionable why anyone would even stick around for years to a decade (worse if longer) hoping for games to be made to their standard that hasn't and seemingly won't happen (especially with Sega as the publishers). Plus a lot of yall conveniently overlook how hard it is to design Sonic games compared to other series. Yall be bringing up Spark the Jester but know damn well that alone wouldn't suffice for Sonic. Spark only does 1-2 two particular things well that people specifically want out of Sonic, but the rest of what makes Sonic special wouldn't be present. ...

[@windy3935]

@@Eriko.Christy The gameplay IS good, just imperfect. Majority of the game is platforming (which is the main appeal with Sonic, something any critic wants to conveniently ignore), and that's everywhere. Game then gives you plenty of flexibility to be inventive with your platforming, even moreso after the deceleration toggle and spindash additions. Playing as Sonic in these open zones, a long wished for thing from fans, alone is fun. And not just for sake, but because Sonic actually feels good to control and run around with all over the place. While not the fully momentum based style most of us probably wanted, what's here is a start and a satisfying one at that. All games have filler. It's developers ways of extending playtime. To purposely use one highly popular game as an example, Uncharted 4 has a legit overabundance of mundane climbing sections to extend the game's runtime, and that's without it being particularly engaging too. "Sonic's filler" is pretty inoffensive and actually fun to do (besides the hamster wheel mini game, but there's extremely few of those and it last a literal few secs, nowhere near long enough to seriously complain about). "Boring filler" I don't see the logic in. If it's a personal thing that isn't fun for you, that's fine, but outside that "boring" isn't a good choice of words. The side conversations are fine. Fishing is mostly fine, especially so if we compare it to what we had last (Big the Cat's), and even without it fishing tends to be simple in these more cartoony games (Animal Crossing, Dragon Ball Z Kakarot, Legend of Zelda, Mario, Pokemon, etc). The platforming aspect of the platforming challenges are good. Music note collecting is fine and Koco challenges are great. The puzzles are varied and largely fine, with low difficulty in some of them being the only major problem I can say. (Don't know if extreme mode addresses them.) The character specific collectibles are lame I guess (even though you get a golden crown for getting them all), but the vast majority of games have underwhelming collectibles systems and that which people never bother to complete. Collecthatons is the only genre of games people really care to collect everything. Lastly, getting back to Frontiers, the side content doesn't need to be amazing to not be boring or bad. Oh wait, I forgot they added the Open Zone challenges. Those are largely good, on hard difficulty where it's fairly challenging (and presumably better on extreme mode). "the speed stages are the side mode of the game" - These kind of occasional points are not legitimate arguments. It's cool to dislike that personally, but you can't use that as a valid point to say the game is bad. Otherwise someone could get away saying anything imaginable, like Sonic games are bad because of their special stages, or Sonic sucks because the artstyle in his games don't follow conventional norms, or whatever. Anyways, I went over that a bit already. (Again) Cyber Space is treated like the special stages of the game, which conceptually there is certainly no problem with in an Openworld-like setting. Short length is not a valid criticism on it's own. If the quality, quantity, and/or main meat of the game (aka Open Zone) are good enough, it's fine. Can you seriously not comprehend how unreasonable it is to expect 30 stages in an Open Zone game to be on-par with the best in installments that specialize virtually entirely on that linear level design? (You conveniently also forget that Sonic levels in Adventure series and Unleashed are few, under 10 to be more specific in terms of major levels.) We have 5 massive open-zones here (the main course), additionally with their own platforming sections, you can't ignore that and strictly compare past titles' levels to just Cyber Space. This brings me back to how similar they are to special stages. Here's the cool things about CS: besides the first two portals, it's a completely optional system; and it's also not useless since they're an alternative and in some cases faster way to get keys, which are needed to get the Emeralds. I sure hope you made the same complaint for Marvel Spider-Man's samey warehouse layouts and Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild's repetitive dungeon layouts, among others. And these are far bigger budget games! Even with Frontier's lesser but still increased budget compared to past titles, it's still doesn't even remotely compare to these other franchises. Budget is a factor, not the argument incase anyone focuses on that detail. Cyber Space is underappreciated. Sure, even some of the top Sonictubers and other players warmed up to it after spending actual time playing it (pre-U2 BTW), but of course there's still a large bit out there who don't like it, with the reason "not being on par with the best in Unl/Gens" among the stupidest ones. Though I like how the levels come nowhere close to being anywhere near as repetitive, tedious, and simple as all the Sonic Team 2D classic games' special stages are (some modern Sonic games too), fully 3D stages (so overdue) that not even Unl or Gens pulled off (and Forces despite having 3 separate playable characters), and reworked/experimental level design that merges Adventure style with Boost style. And im not talking about old levels being remade from scratch, but an intentional decision to make even original levels more traditional and less faster paced (in a good way) rather than the full-boost nature in Unl-Forces. Gens decided to just add more platforming in conjunction with the boost, which comes off lazy/cutting corners, while Frontiers actually made an effort to fuse both styles of level design. SA2 is my fav Sonic game, with Unl right behind it. I love both styles, so im not anti-boost. CS not bringing back the "blazing speed and blitz through enemies" system is not inherently a problem, and I already explained that. (Seriously, the whole point in removing it was to emphasize the balance of two styles they're going for. Hell, the plot supports it as well by having a number of Adventure-specific stages return and characters acknowledging their existence.) edit: It's coming up on the 1 Year anniversary. Y'all really need to drop or rework these immature level design comparison arguments with past titles. They didn't have multiple open zones, not even a single one. Hell, not only does Frontiers have those open zones but also a *high* number of platform challenges and mini levels within them (which Unleashed's, with its hub and pre-level action areas, objectively doesn't hold a candle to), and that's alongside the plethora of puzzles in the game. I could easily leave it there, but you know also, the open zone would have clearly suffered if they put the insane effort you wanted into CS. It'd often have that feeling of emptiness, nothing to do, and not enough content, 3 widely misused complaints across gaming that's been aimed at any openworld and even open-ended game for decades.

[@typreegamingtpg2198]

30:58 Also personally I don't think Sonic Frontiers' customization stuff is good game design. Yet somehow, everyone else praises the game for this. You can't really design anything out of it, which is why Open Zone takes the broad but shallow form that it does, and why Cyberspace takes the linear but restrictive form that it does. This is part of the problem. It's a critical dead end. A lot of the things one may attempt to criticize about the game's controls can just be waved away with "there's an option for that". I've literally seen this happen before. There's nothing you can do to innovate off of it besides just doing it again or simply including more options in the next title. Normal games do not do this. Especially not children's platformers like Sonic. They may have plenty of sliders, sure, but not literally for things as important or broad as "movement speed" or "turning speed" lol. Why not just simply design a good control scheme instead? What is the difference between having "accessibility" and actually having a defined, decisive attitude on what you want your game to be and how you want your game to play? This is why I can't get behind the idea of Sonic Frontiers being the "future" of Sonic games. Because, what decisions are actually being made here? I think this in itself is simply another product of Sonic Frontiers' awkward, confused, undecided vibe. My only hope with this is that Sonic Team are actually somehow collecting the data for what settings people choose in Sonic Frontiers and somehow using that to invent literally anything ideal on their part. But I mean, why should I even expend the energy in hoping that they would take the time to do something like that? Or even have the means to do so in the first place?

[@mechakirby9576]

agree the funny thing about this is that if any other game in the series decided use the same level of customization with the same low level game desing people would still bitching about it years later but somehow frontiers get a free pass.

[@megamike15]

if this really is the future of the series i think it's time to move on. go play sparks the electric jester 3 or something.

[@SpeedyBlur2000]

From all of what I've seen of this game, it seems that it has so much potential, but it feels like a first attempt. It feels like Sonic 1, where they are just testing the waters on what they can achieve with this open zone gameplay style.

[@marx4538]

I don't know much about Frontiers, but I do agree with quite a few of your points and I wish Sonic games stopped trying to be so high budget and just had some simpler, shorter games with less of a grandeur, instead doing something like that Sonic VR romhack from a while ago where it's just a bunch of fun trials with new gimmicks experimented on. I do think Sonic 1 is one of the best games in the series, however :) That said, the one thing I don't get is your dismissal of the bullet hell shooter final boss. From what I saw, most hated it, but personally, even if it seems really poorly done and very mindless by bullet hell standards, a final boss (or a boss entirely) in a Sonic game being focused entirely on gameplay and testing your skill is a pretty good idea to me. Even in the classic games most bosses were filler that barely even tied itself to the gameplay well, with the best bosses being those that actually resemble the levels themselves more (S1's Labyrinth, CD's Collision Chaos and Stardust Speedway as examples) and the worst ones being the final bosses, that hid how pathetic they are by forcing you to no damage them for no reason, and with each of them getting worse until S3's final bosses resemble a glorified cutscene more than actual bosses. Mania tried to do better with it's gameplay focused Titanic Monarch 2 boss, but it was ultimately rather tedious and gimmicky. I think Sonic games should look at something like classic Castlevania or Metroid for boss inspiration, as some bosses in those games might even work better as Sonic bosses than actual Sonic bosses do (say, Metroid Fusion's B.O.X. fights) I feel the same about enemies: I really don't like how the solution to enemies being just a way to bounce off stuff or a thing to roll through without care in later Sonic games became to turn them into tedious combat encounters, but I wish they revisited the idea behind the Metropolis badniks and did something similar, where you do have to care about how you deal with them and dodge attacks in unique terrain.

[@JD-xz1mx]

Imagine if instead of generic lifeless new islands, they used classic sonic islands. Angel island in open world.

[@omgwillustrate8475]

50:54 Maybe this is news to you, but there IS melee combat in F-Zero. Tackling out opponents at high speed is part of the fun.

[@BlazeHedgehog]

The definition of melee is "disorganized hand-to-hand combat." I appreciate the effort, but it's definitely not the same

[@omgwillustrate8475]

@@BlazeHedgehog don’t know where that definition comes from, but ask anyone and they’ll consider any attack that’s up close and within reach a melee attack. And in F-Zero the attacks are called side and spin attacks respectively. They may not involve hands in the traditional sense, but the vehicles serve as extensions of the pilots who drive them the way swords, knives, and spears are extensions of the combatants who wield them, so I strongly believe it counts.

[@skribly2647]

Some things like the combat and the skill could work, but they want to appeal to casual gamers. I do agree with your opinions about the game for not feeling like sonic, really hope with the next one theyll do it

[@Fractorification]

For as much as I enjoyed this game, there’s so much that could be done to improve the formula. I personally think that it’s biggest issue is that it’s still partially a boost game. They should’ve committed and made a momentum based experience like the adventure games as that freedom of experimenting with rolling off slopes would work better in an open zone as opposed to boosting. Boosting is soo limited on what you can do movement wise which is why some of the puzzles feel tacked on and never use your speed on them. The latter puzzles are mindless platforming sections because that’s all boosting can do. This was a case of the developers wanting to have their cake and eat it: Experimenting on a new direction, but unwilling to let go of the tired tropes Sonic has played with since Unlashed. If they’re going to keep making more open zone games in the future, they need to rethink the way Sonic fundamentally plays and reacts to his environments.

[@saturn_wolf]

I do think there's merit to some of what you're saying, but a lot of this video honestly comes off...a little harsh? A little meanspirited, especially with things like the opening talking about the Game Awards and comments like "Have these people never made a game before?"

[@nerodoesart5886]

I think it's probably from how poorly designed it is for the most part. I think it comes from him wanting the series better, but so disappointed that they aren't much more than it should have been in 5 years, which is kind of understandable. But I see what you mean.

[@BlazeHedgehog]

The digs at fans are maybe a bit mean but I do think the game itself warrants it.

[@kaosagamerreal]

while i do agree that the game has flaws, i still love it, and the updates are improving a lot of the game that being said, this video had some weird attacks? like i dont understand the dialogue where you take pot shots at the people who praise it? it doesnt help that youre hearting comments that gatekeep, such as saying "sonic fans eat any slop" i have to agree with some comments, you were weirdly aggressive towards the people that saw more in the game than you did

[@AnimalXing]

Love this video! Simply put, Sonic Frontiers doesn’t hold to up scrutiny. However, it’s one of the best Sonic games in some time, and the updates have improved the game.

[@WaddleDee105]

Nice review of what is one of the most baffling Sonic games. Not just in terms of the game itself, but the reception from fans (and to a lesser extent, critics). We were all (rightfully) dunking on this game back when we got our first bit of gameplay but by the time the game released, the fanbase had already declared it a masterpiece despite ALL of the problems we saw back in June 2022 still being in the final game. Could just be me being an old, cynical asshat, but I get the impression that we've gone so long without an appealing mainline Sonic game (especially if you don't consider Mania to be a mainline game) that the fanbase will eat any slop up at this point out of desperation. I like your take that Sega going after "good review scores" is why so much of the game is just Sonic Team taking ideas and mechanics from recent, trendy games. I wonder how much of the blatant BotW influence was Sonic Team ACTUALLY wanting to make something like that, vs them feeling forced to make a game like that in order to make something with potential critical acclaim. It's sad either way cause even if they truly wanted to make a game like BotW, they utterly failed beyond surface level elements. Also, you ARE saying Ristar correctly!👍

[@DeclanEDowns]

I think it's pretty gross that: 1. People weren't allowed to change their opinion on the game when it released. People, even as early as the first impression video by IGN was positive. They just didn't understand how they were going to market it, which led to the lacklustre reveal during June. Once players got their hands on the game, they knew what was going on and found themselves enjoying it. 2. This is the one game where Sonic Team really just did their own thing. To simply call it trend chasing is a terrible generalisation, especially since the comparison with Breath Of The Wild is more of a stretch, and has more in common with Bowser's Fury rather than a Zelda game. It really comes off as you're upset that people, including Fans, Critics and General Audiences found something truly special about the game. The moment I got to play it at EGX, it clicked with me, and I left London upset that I couldn't keep playing. This isn't slop, especially after the great games I played before Frontiers launched, and to call it that is so sad to see. Genuinely feel bad you couldn't figure out what makes this game work for so many.

[@BlazeHedgehog]

It is absolutely chasing Breath of the Wild. The piano music, the somber tone, they even give Sonic climbing mechanics (that they never use). I'm pretty sure even the leaks from THREE YEARS AGO called it "Breath of the Wild, but Sonic."

[@lupinthenerd439]

​​@@DeclanEDownsyou stole the words from my mouth (and more nicely as well) . I'm sick and tired of YT creators dunking on people that enjoys this game and calling them "starved fans" and saying that they are eating mediocrity. Even some old school fans found enjoyment in this game and have no problem calling it a sonic game despite being a "trend chaser". If you don't like the game, just say why without the need to bringing down others because some kid found out twitter for the first time and decided to go on an harassment campaign

[@TheJmack90]

@@lupinthenerd439 “some kid” but Blaze been around longer than most of y’all. One of the few that actually understands what makes Sonic tick

[@lupinthenerd439]

@@TheJmack90 The "some kid" I was referring to is your usual stereotype of toxic fan that Blaze called out in his video. the point of those sentences is that Blaze could have done the review without some spitefulness comment that talks down to everyone who enjoyed the game, even the ones who were genuinely looking forward to the game and weren't disappointed without defending it like their lives depended on the success of the game And even if that was the case, just because he stayed with the series longer it doesn't mean that Blaze is always "right" about sonic

[@MinervaFFXIV]

wish people weren't so obsessed with what Sonic "should be"

[@BlazeHedgehog]

What would you rather they be obsessed with?

[@KaleSTUDIOS]

@@BlazeHedgehog nothing, obsession is bad.

[@MinervaFFXIV]

a fanbase welcoming change leads to more unique, better games from the devs. I personally feel Frontiers could've been more fulfilling if Sonic Team felt they could step further away from the established formula without people being upset that it's "not sonic" but we'll never know for sure

[@AYTM1200]

​@@BlazeHedgehogthere's nothing wrong with asking that question but it normally results in people saying "Sonic should be EXACTLY the way it was when i grew up" instead of let's take the best aspects of each game and combine them into a cohesive gameplay loop/ formula.

[@victortunisse6686]

@@MinervaFFXIV Dude, wtf are you talking about? Everyone and their mothers know whats Sonic is supposed to be, it´s a fucking platforming game about a blue cartoon hedgehog who uses speed and physics to navigate! What the hell is so hard about this shit that people struggle so much to get it? And by the way, if I go buy a Street Fighter game, boot it up, and some random shit starts playing that has nothing to do with what a fighting game is supposed to be, pffffft! Dude! That´s the last Street Fighter I´ll buy in my life, know why? Bc if I spent my money on Street Fighter, I did so to see the characters get punched in the face, I wanna see some hadoukens, Shoryoukens and all that fighting game shit, not whatever else the developer was in the mood to do that day. Imagine you go to a coffee shop, and order a espresso. Then instead of coffee, you receive orange juice, than you say "Hey, that´s not what I paid for!", and they answer "Oh, don't worry, we are just going for a more unique way to do things, we´re experimenting with the formula, we don't want to be limited by the public expectations of what coffee should be...". What would you say? Would you say "Oh, really? That´s amazing! I wanted to drink coffee today, in fact, I paid for it, but since you are experimenting today, I think I´ll drink this orange juice instead..." or "Oh, yeah!? So you can shove this juice in your unique way, give my money back cuz I´ll buy my coffee somewhere else!". 🤣🤣🤣 Want to experiment? Create unique new ideas with new mechanics and gameplay? So they should grow some balls to start a new franchise, a new game with a new character, not slap this on top of Sonic bc they know the fans will buy any shit they do anyways...

[@CoolDudeClem]

I never even completed it, by the time I was only halfway through the second level I just couldn't stand it anymore. I un-installed it and never touched it again. Strange thing is that I even like some of the less popular Sonic Games, but this, Sonic Frontiers, pissed me off more than I can ever tell! I feel like I just wasted my money. Everyone was like "Oh wow, this is the best Sonic game ever!", "This game saved the Sonic franchise!" "It's what fans have wanted for so long, blah blah blah." Well I played it and was disappointed. This game was just NO FUN, I either got really bored, totally lost without any idea of where to go, or just plain annoyed. AGAIN, the only playable character is Sonic, despite the franchise having so many other characters. After beating the first level I just didn't fell like I'd progressed at all, and there's so many other things, too many to list. I get lost in an open world, the map is useless as it only shows you where you've been, those stupid annoying Koko things showing up whenever you stop, big enemies always "introducing" themselves EVERY time you encounter them, that stupid slot machine thing, a cutsceene that allways plays whenever you have 400 rings (or however many it was), speaking of rings, any rings you collected don't come back if you die, the game play is nothing like the other Sonic games like what we've seen for the past 10 years or so, and there's just so many other annoying things about this game. I wish steam would refund my money or let me exchange it for another game. I even liked Sonic Forces more than this, yes I said it.

[@DeclanEDowns]

I'm surprised that as someone who must have played these games for so many years, you've grown a very...narrow minded view what a Sonic game should be. You must be aware enough to realise that the franchice has been many different things. It's been a platformer, yes, but it's been a kartracer, visual noval, rpg, AM2 Fighting game, sports series, Anime, sitcom, metroidvania, party game, pet simulator...i could go on. Frontiers is the latest in a long lineage of experiments and chance plays from a Team that has had to handle being resource starved by the parent company. So, to see you pretty much fight back against the team trying something new, to call them trend chasers, and to discourage them, well...I'm honestly kind of wondering where in your script did it go wrong, and trust me, i don't say that lightly. First off, why are you calling Evening Star, fan devs? This is undermining their time as original creators. I'm sorry, their not fan devs, their professionals. You tried to do a gotcha but it comes off as more "Patting the fans on the back" for making the devs look stupid. Second off, you talked about how ridiculous the amount of ways you could progress was weird, even tho, that is something many open ended games do. It's that freedom of choice, and like one commenter said, you have the freedom of tackling a main goal, the chaos emeralds. You made it out like the devs were trying to secretly admit that the rest of the game sucked so you could just do one thing instead, even though that isn't true at all, are you suprised that an open ended game...let's you do what you want, how you want? I could bring up more issues with the video, however for the sake of both of us, I'll leave it there. Genuinely Blaze, idk what you was trying to go for here. I respect if you didnt like the game, and even some of the problems you brought up, especially with the floating rails and platforms etc. I did agree with, but this came off as very narrow minded. I do wonder how you feel about Frontiers' success. From it's generally positive critical reception (directly described by Video Game Chronicle btw), to it's sales success as the best selling 3D Sonic game, to it's awards won in Japan. Are you upset? Happy? I really can't tell. I tried to give this video a chance, i really did, and I've been a subscriber for a long while, but by the end of it, I'm left utterly confused, and even kind of...let down. Like before, i said i didn't mind how you felt about Frontiers, but what i neglected to say was, i didn't mind, as long as the reasons felt genuinely justified and within reason. What ruined it for me was two things. 1. The beginning, i felt like you was trying to make me, someone who genuinely was over the moon with it, feel bad for liking it. It was implyied that my standards are low and I'll eat anything. 2. Your assumptions of the developers intent. That's not something you need to add in a video like this. That's not criticism, it's a baseless statement. I wouldn't be suprised if you strongly disagree with me, or possibly put aside my gripes, but i probably won't be checking out the channel anymore. I'd rather not support someone who is willing to pretty much insult my tastes in media. If that wasn't the intention? Then the script clearly failed, and should have been more checked over. Good luck on your future content. Thanks for reading.

[@VirtuousAezon]

Narrow minded because his view doesn't align with your more OPEN minded opinion. Facts bro.

[@BlazeHedgehog]

I don't think I've grown very narrow at all. If anything, I've broadened my definitions over the years. I was down in the forums at release for Sonic Adventure 2 complaining about how it didn't feel like a Sonic game because it was too speed focused, levels were too narrow, there were too many pits, etc. But, over time, I opened up and grew to love the Sonic and Shadow levels there. I love Sonic Unleashed. I love Sonic Riders, even. I've just always felt that you can't gobble up everything and anything just because it has a blue hedgehog on it. If that made you feel bad, I'm sorry, but I was here in the earliest days of KZbin having to contend with people mad at me for badmouthing Sonic 06 of all games. I saw a lot of that type of person very up close. That might not be who you are, but it doesn't invalidate the experiences I did actually have. I don't see the problem with trying to hold on to the idea that Sonic games should work within the core definitions of the series. That was my whole thing when talking about Mario having this core focus on jumping. As different as Mario games can be from game to game, they always feel like Mario, and not just because they happen to star a plumber with a red hat and overalls. Sonic does not have that quality. Imagine going from Sonic Heroes, to Shadow, to Sonic 06, to Secret Rings. All four of those are VASTLY, COMPLETELY different games. Same if you went from Generations to Lost World to Sonic Boom. That's NOT a strength of this franchise (or any franchise) and it doesn't make me narrow minded for not liking it.

[@DeepWeeb]

I get the impression Sonic and many other franchises (Zelda, Dark Souls, Pokémon, etc.) make the jump to open-world designs and get lauded by it even if the actual product is very by-the-numbers, unpolished, with lacklustre worlds and removed from the series' core identity for the very simple reason that *people were already sick of the old formula that has been done over and over again they'll take **_anything "new"_* (and the irony is that open-world games aren't a "creative risk", they are the safest bet in modern gaming!) Now the way Sonic fans put Frontiers champion on it for getting slightly-above average reviews really says a lot about how desperately they want the franchise to be validated by the larger gaming landscape instead of a laughing stock (the way they started a war with Genshin fans for no reason and acted as if they were going to win, whether by cheating or not, and continue to sulk over it after losing is just pathetic)

[@BlazeHedgehog]

It's weird you lump Zelda into this because Zelda's always had huge open exploration-heavy environments, even as far back as the first NES game. They just had to break up the structure differently. Zelda, maybe more than any other game, is very compatible with open world concepts.

[@DeepWeeb]

@@BlazeHedgehog Just mentioning it as part of the franchises that were stuck in a rut for a very long while, in Zelda's case it was the same dungeon structure of "finding item, having a small tutorial for said item, the boss needs to be defeated with that same item", and Breath of the Wild shackling the series in that sense. Obviously that BotW was extremely successful and well regarded, setting a new standard for open-world games, so if anything most of the games that try to become open-world are doing so because Zelda did so (as you brought up in the video)