Brexit vs the world: Is Britain too self-obsessed?

As the Brexit process treads water, we've decided to stand back and ask: does Brexit matter in the big scheme of things? Is it virtually irrelevant beside the forces that are shaping our changing world? Gary Gibbon chats to Peter Frankopan, Oxford professor of global history and author of the best-selling The Silk Roads and The New Silk Roads.
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[@parmentier7457]

As a Dutchmen, three years ago I was a little bit sad the UK leave us. But now I really don't care. I think many Europeans don't care if the UK leave us.

[@DaDunge]

Except as a strong liberal voice in the union.

[@bertnijhof5413]

That Neo-liberal ideology did bring the majority of the people poverty. So as a Dutchman I happy those Neo-liberals leave.

[@kmfw72]

'Neoliberal?' Whining term for socialist losers. 'Majority of people' - where? Germany? The UK wasn't part of the European Central Bank, which was imposing austerity on Ireland, Greece or Portugal, Germany was - and read German newspapers like Bild with headlines like 'Griechen wollen unser Geld' and 'Das Geld der Deutschen ist verloren'

[@SirAntoniousBlock]

@@bertnijhof5413 I don't think Liberalism means what you think it means, the Netherlands is the very definition of Liberalism.

[@bertnijhof5413]

@@SirAntoniousBlock I think you confuse liberalism and neo-liberalism, which is an theory about economics.

[@inbox_au]

Some general comments (a) The British Empire doesn’t exist anymore (b) The UK will never be a major trading partner with countries outside of Europe eg. Australia’s major trading partners are Asian due to distance (c) UK don’t seem to know who are/will be their trading partners ... no one’s waiting for the UK.

[@MrGordonhaining]

D) England has nothing the rest of the world wants to buy hahaha

[@stackzbeats9344]

The505Guys no the Brexiteers think the British empire still exists

[@acecatman]

there are still remnants of the british empire left to be destroyed, like the canadian federation.

[@kingofracism]

@@acecatman and the commonwealth too kind of. I'm English and we should cut ties with all commonwealth nations in a peaceful manner. This puts British citizenship up for contention. Which means it could be easier to deport all non whites once Britain has broken up and the British isles becomes free independent nations again.

[@libertasdemocratiam887]

So capitalist cooperations and nations are going to pass up the opportunity to further their bank balance selling there goods to us? They going to ignore the massive gap in the market? Since when did cooperations start putting their ethics and beliefs before their bank balance? Last time I checked even facebook puts profits before ethics. I highly doubt where money is concerned people are going to turn the other way, especially people who already driven by profits and their bank balance.

[@ageoflove1980]

I think that the UK should take a long hard look at the Netherlands, because in many ways its a smal brother of the UK. It had a very large empire, lost most of it after WOII and had to reinvent itself to stay relevant. It doesnt have enormous amounts of natural resources but it does have a highly skilled workforce and lots of knowledge. Somehow the Netherlands did manage to find a role in the world (for example, the second largest exporter of agricultural products in the world after the US, not bad for a country the size of a post stamp). And I believe it did that by letting go of the past and accepting that they are no longer a big player themselves , but rather a part of a club that are. It seems to me that Britain still cant accept , almost as a sort of Post Traumatic Syndrome, they are this situation.

[@MrExEssex]

What's "WOII"?

[@cartmann227]

@@MrExEssex you are challenged aren't you

[@only1thatmakessense]

Nah people are pissed off and its got nothing to do with self image

[@joepeake8972]

@@only1thatmakessense But you do hear brexiteers talking as if we're a strong enough power to compete with the likes of the US, China, Russia, and Germany. They seem to think the EU was just holding us back from becoming a superpower again and making deals on our own terms rather than the US's. I sympathise with being pissed off (lots of good reasons to be!), but not with the delusions of grandeur.

[@only1thatmakessense]

@@joepeake8972 i say again, i dont think its delusional i think its more about having control of things immediately around you.

[@swanpride]

Yes, it is. Let's be realistic here, the EU is the biggest trading block in the world and has trade deals left and right. One of the reasons why the UK is thriving selling to third states in the first place is because of those trade agreements. It can't hope to get better conditions than what already are pretty much the best conditions available.

[@sibience]

Stop using common sense and start believing!

[@ruk2227]

Now tell that to the little Englanders. It's sickening that despite all evidence to the contrary, a significant segment of the population still want to go ahead with this shi*e show.

[@videomania666]

@@ruk2227 We want to leave the corruption and polititcs of the EU, the trading is fine but comes at a price we can no longer afford

[@Jack-fs2im]

R uk Ch4 has only 9% of its staff from a working class background,The EU wants war with Russia and is economically declining.The rich Bankers,Landlords,City of London and unelected privileged media want to remain.Pile the people up in the cities and make them scramble for jobs.Did. You oppose other countries wanting independence.Stop backing what you have been fed and join the people for Brexit and our own destiny

[@ruk2227]

@@videomania666 And what price is that? You do realise, we'll have to cede some sovereignty if we opt for WTO rules or for whichever trade deal we strike up. Much like we do now.

[@walterrudich2175]

"How can we manage to stay relevant?" This reduces Brexit to its core: First sacrifice your position as a world leader for nothing and then try to undo the damage.

[@DapaChrons]

a world leader that listens to the US in foreign politics and listens to EU demands in trade?

[@jameslawrence3666]

@@DapaChrons Little England ... with its sunlit uplands ?

[@jameslawrence3666]

Oh dear..... China has had a bit of a nightmare since this was broadcast, huge population collapse, terrible debt problems with a crumbling property market and zero-covid. Emperor Xi is having troubles

[@Arltratlo]

@@DapaChrons what demands, just rules the UK put in place while in the EU!

[@Arltratlo]

@@jameslawrence3666 the uplands are in Scotland...and that will leave the UK asap!

[@MarkStoneCalasade]

Self-obsessed? Definitely. Add delusional about its importance and power to that.

[@michamash]

The Brits are about to be mugged by Reality.

[@marusak72]

There is a list of countries that used to be empire. Mongolia, Macedonia, Turkey, Peru, Portugal

[@ronpeel1878]

All countries are self possessed ... why would any country be overwhelmingly in favour of another country's interests over and above their own.

[@yorkshireginge]

your talking about the eu and dont know it

[@nickjung7394]

Well, Great Britain bankrupted herself by fighting the Second World War. The Empire was given up I suggest, because the ordinary soldiers identified more with the colonial troops that they served with than with the self centred political class that had treated the ordinary person with such contempt after the First World War. The mantra among ww2 veterans was that "you are not going to treat us the way you treated our fathers" general Slim made the point to Churchill when he he told him that "my men will not vote for him". This character has an opinion that seeks to denigrate the ordinary working person. Time for him to get a real job.

[@peteroxley4987]

How refreshing it is to listen to Peter's overview of Brexit, the world, and where we are all heading. Thoroughly enjoyed the interview. Let's have more programmes like this rather than rants and raves from ill-informed, and often uninformed, people pushing an agenda!

[@casperwallace9685]

That's not going to happen, Tory has just been put in charge of BBC and Ofcom has a big Tory Donor plonked in charge.

[@Mercs_Beamers]

Going great Brexit right?! How’s that lower immigration? How’s that 350 million every week for the NHS? How’s the over ready deal taste? Kinda like lies and BS

[@Arltratlo]

lol, the UK is the UK and the EU is the future! the UK only got the past and the future is gone!

[@lucasmoreno5330]

I live in spain, where my son attends a international school. Of the German, French, Spanish, Italian parents I meet at school, none are following or interested in Brexit. They feel it’s something over there 👉

[@johnbrown9439]

Can things get much worse for Spanish and Italian youth?

[@nicklaskowalski]

John Brown at least they have freedom of movement if they want it. The UK is taking that away from its citizens. For what?

[@walterrudich2175]

This is proof how insignificant the UK has become on an international level.

[@angrytedtalks]

@@walterrudich2175 No it isn't. It is proof that before Covid nobody in Europe gave a damn about Brexit (or the EU, probably). The UK is less than 1% of the world's population, other developed countries have their own history/prejudice to wallow in.

[@delcamelot]

@@nicklaskowalski You can still travel with a visa .. free movement has been abused .... free movement means to work or study in a european country ...not being a parasite ....

[@marshhen]

This is a fascinating interview. He provides a credible overview. Thanks for doing this and uploading it.

[@jacobwhite9006]

Really - a credible overview? An upper class Brit with thinly veiled disdain for anything outside of Britain relativising Brexit as much as can still be possible? He's deluded for sure

[@jasoncorsbie5047]

@@jacobwhite9006 Do you have the basic mental capacity to listen to and comprehend a relatively balanced discussion with mildly complex sentence and paragraph structure. Does it make you angry because you cant follow his train of thought?

[@musictomyears8]

Just by calling the US foreign policy benevolent is enough evidence to call him shallow and overrated

[@NLTops]

@Boris Farage I've decided to call it Bratlantis.

[@casperwallace9685]

Yep, he tells us just how badly Westminster of all colours have allowed our kids education to be so bad, the clever ones will leave the rest will get kicked to the kerb, because they can't compete with the kids of other countries.

[@michelegrieco9104]

Look at the treaty you made with Japan. You have accepted terms worse than those proposed by the European Union. Wake up.

[@mcr2356]

It's preety much the same deal. Same with Turkey.

[@bjrnhenrik-pettersen9063]

Not true, the Japan deal suits the UK far more, the real test will be joining the Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership and whether the US and states like S. Korea and Thailand decide to join.

[@499PUCK]

The best statement that was made during this clip was made about trade. What does UK have that anyone else needs?

[@sebastiangeorge7714]

Lard and beans?

[@mauricelove6016]

Must be brussel sprouts (I was shocked my first Christmas in the UK when I saw these horrid things were a hot item for Christmas dinner). Or maybe turnips?

[@Pax.Britannica]

Turns out, if a nation has a spine & set of principles, and refuses to deal with genocidal regimes for instance, it tends to just... Win. We've always been a nation of bitter weeds in Britain. Yet it wasn't the French who held off the advance of fascism & communism.

[@Robin-cf9ts]

Financial services to allow the wealthy to dodge tax in British territories no longer effected by EU membership. The whole real reason for Brexit I believe.

[@johncarden8985]

The interviewee here seems knowledgeable and balanced in his opinions. Interesting to listen to in the current confrontational narrative.

[@fredmidtgaard5487]

I remember a British newspaper headline many years ago: "Storm in the Channel. The continent is isolated!".

[@kmfw72]

Old myth...

[@js7085]

"self obsessed" is actually a pretty precise and adequate way how to describe England

[@alexmorton610]

I live in Glasgow, a city where we have districts that have the highest rate of child poverty and the lowest life expectancy in Europe. The UK government has demonised the disabled to such an extent that the UN described their plight as a breech of human rights. Homelessness has sky rocketed, unemployment figures so distorted they're meaningless and home ownership is out of reach for most young people. More advanced than our neighbours? Are you on drugs?

[@js7085]

@Diana Mitford There is nothing highly civilized going on at the Irish border. The government has been no more than a muppet show the past years. England is ignoring Scotland and Ireland with their precious opinion about themselves, the unity is crumbling. What could be civilized about the death of Jo Cox. The list is long why there is nothing a lot more civilized in England vs. the rest of the world

[@javierslytherin9898]

@Diana Mitford You are very dilusional

[@peterebel7899]

@Diana Mitford Always the best skipping knowledge but using racism. btw America is not a country But I am happy even you seeing a lot of nations and ethnics at the same level of civilization.

[@zoejay]

Ina Virtosu Well said...

[@cydoman8014]

Why has it not occurred to more people in the US and the UK that a democracy must have an appropriate atmosphere, environment and condition in the election process that is designed to ensure proper citizen verified knowledge and understanding? If the election does not include some firm restraints on meaningless promises, foreign or partisan interference, financial disparities, unrevealed wealth backing on one side, of course there can be predictably dysfunctional outcomes. A small majority on a question of great significance on nation-wide economics leaves too many people left outside the agreement. Foreign adversaries wishing to destabilize a nation governed by democratic ideals look for ways to weaken their enemy from within. Tyrannies, kleptocracies, greed-led global financial interests seek opportunities to destroy from afar, pitting partners and compatriots against one another. In an action like the Referendum, holes can be created for others to use to make likely a split union. A pail that is half full cannot hope to put out a fire that requires a full pail of water. Tilting an election that can be won by a small margin is bound to leave problems. A country divided against itself cannot stand. That this problem existed for two years must be understood. Advancing into a future with significant unknowns, based on suspicious assurances of benefit and optimism that is more exuberance than merited puts everyone at risk for decades of traded anger and blame. Tyrannical governments and the people who run them do not allow citizens to call a halt to changes the people suspect will bring harm to the governed. A nation that sees itself as self-governing does not need to prove its right to decide to act directly on the government's declared intent when they see a need to do so. It is enough for the people on both or all sides to collectively step into a mess and declare "Enough". All the people and not the individual players must occupy the authority, regardless of the attempts to persuade otherwise. In a nation in which government exists with the consent of the governed and for the benefit of the governed, it must be by clear, well thought out and influence free assent of the governed that all major changes are ordered. No partisan position can replace the fulsome assent of the people's intelligence. If that substitution is allowed, the problems simply dig in, procreate and eventually overwhelm everything and everyone, unleashing troubles on all. There is no reason to speed into danger. There is no reason to fall under time threats either. There is reason to think, to talk, to consider and reconsider. There is reason to research and reason to say "Prove it". There is reason to fear and reason to be brave. There is no reason to be turned into a statue of despairing uselessness or silent subjection, even til the last second before midnight. If the people think there has been a mistake, stand aside and let them correct it. It is their satisfaction that counts.

[@TheBayzent]

Because citizens are overall lazy and short sighted to a fault, and no government can force people to educate themselves beyond a very basic level because some people are literally incapable of processing how things would affect their lives. This us why you need to keep it to slogans like "We are giving the EU a Gazillion pounds a year that could be invested into our own NHS" or "We have THIS law because the EU forces us to". Sensible people would see this and ask "OK, but why do we give it? What do we get in exchange?" or "what are theexact mechanisms the EU are using to force us to apply that law, and what happens if we decide not to anymore? How will the EU punish us?", but in my experience most people won't, because they have just enough rationality to tie their shoes by themselves, so these statements will ellicit an emotional answer. The sooner you make peace with the fact we share this planet with utter morons the earlier you will be happier.

[@bjrnhenrik-pettersen9063]

The EU has no democratic accountability, US and UK governments can be voted out. The sovereign debt crisis and now the vaccine failure are symtoms of the EU's lack of accounability.

[@nigeh5326]

If u work in warehousing or transport in the next 10 to 20 years those jobs will be automated leaving a lot of people in the Midland and North out of work. What future is there for them? Indeed what future is there for any of us who aren't in the city, London and the South East? There is so much talk about London and the South East and virtually nothing about the rest of Britain.

[@VikingDrummerRob]

All of the UKs money is located in London hence the obsession with it.

[@alberain]

Automation will make work obsolete, a tax on automated industries will fund a universal basic income.

[@tundeuk]

Good question. As a Londoner I always thought the north required more investment. I thought the Olympic Games should have been held in the north.

[@ELFanatic]

This is fact. Automation is coming for all our jobs, all of them. It feels like tech has finally slowed, but we're in the eye of the storm. AI, bio-mechanics and nano technology, are very likely to have an immeasurable, irreversible impact on human existence in the upcoming years. and jobs will be lost.

[@runedyrting8476]

What a good Interview. Let`s have more Journalism like this.

[@Willientus]

In the UK we have a leader called Dutch May, and she keeps telling us "I have a plan!" but they never work. Well done if you get it.

[@Arltratlo]

BoJo the clown, Lizzy the lettuce and Sunak the curry chicken, you are screwed for life!

[@FFM0594]

"We must give huge respect for what America is trying to do". What, destabilise the world?

[@queenredspecial]

Exactly. That is a major WTF moment!

[@asumazilla]

Respect is the right word even if you dont agree with these policies?

[@dingdingdingding2871]

@Feministikon Prøjekt 😆😆😆 you don't know what you just typed

[@vladescu3g]

great suggestion to brexiteers, "read more" they seem to stop reading since 1945

[@markh7288]

I wonder how long the union will last after Brexit. Northern Ireland voted overwhelmingly to remain, so did Scotland. Will we become the United Celtic republics?

[@Arltratlo]

the UK is the sick man of Europe again, like 50 years ago and the Tories have another 50 years to proof that they are wrong in everything and dont care for it!

[@yvettecowley873]

The US has been a good policeman around the world. WRONG?? Look at the mess in the middle east. By the way, the US behave as a policemen only in countries where you have oil and petrol!! Strange ?? Isn't it!!

[@yvettecowley873]

@arawis 1st. We cannot imagine something that's not real yet. 2nd. China is a communist country but paving its way to democracy at its own pace. It now favours the capitalist system. 3rd. China has no intention to be the policeman of planet earth. They beleive that their hybrid system ( State controlled capitalist system) only works for china. They have no intention to export it. It's a different culture from the west. Each country should use its own model to create wealth for the poor.

[@zoolkhan]

@arawis imagine no one would meddle in the affairs of others....

[@vladescu3g]

look at Syria, Russia isnt doing any better isnt it.

[@499PUCK]

Who created the Middle East problem? UK created the Israel / Palestinian conflict by giving away land they didn't own. Who created the Pakistan / India partition? Who created the troubles in N. Ireland? The U.K. Is paying for the sins of their grand fathers.

[@matthewyabsley]

Hello Yvette. If you look at the things you pointed to then it isn't hard to come to the conclusions you have. However if you consider that this very same boomstick has been pointed at far more countries than it has ever invaded. I think that has been the policeman that people speak about, that if the US gets involved they will completely mess up the country they are threatening. I think overall that boomstick has leveraged more from countries as a whole.

[@eleanorclub]

He had me at, "We're not the only clever people in the world." Unlike so many of today's leaders, he's historian is not blinded by hubris.

[@TCBumby]

Wow, I can’t believe I haven’t heard of this professor before.

[@ianbradley7215]

Worth watching. Simple enough for me, complicated enough to figure the why.

[@zeytelaloi]

Yeah this guy is a great communicator.

[@AccomplishmentMissed]

“Is country X too self-obsessed? Let’s ask somebody from country X to find out”

[@BigHenFor]

@the one and only The answer is Yes, because you were leading that life, and your fat cats were getting really fat on it, and quietly hiding there profits abroad instead of paying the plebs a living wage. As soon as the EU figured out that they wanted to stop the tax evasion, and said 'No' to the Americans taking over, suddenly the UK was unhappy. Not really. The UK plutocrats were unhappy, as they don't want those pesky plebs to know how much money they have hoovered away raiding publicly owned assets, and money laundering for anyone with enough money. The British electorate have been thoroughly rogered by their wealthy plutocrats, and when they realise they have been played, they will not be happy. They are the collateral damage, especially those at the bottom of the income distribution. One can tell what the plutocrats priorities are: extract as much money out of the population, and persuade them to fend for themselves. Good Luck with that.

[@SirAntoniousBlock]

Do you have any raw materials? _No_ Do you have good trading relations with your neighbours? _No_ Do you have an empire anymore? _No_ Do you have any foreign language skills? _No_ Well what do you have? _We've got GMT_ 😂

[@ebajjj]

"They had no plan and walked around like idiots". That`s what eye-witness and EU Vice-president Timmerman protocolled about the British negotiators in Bruxelles and that`s what British students will have to answer in exams in British history to get their degrees. Lol.

[@alicianieto2822]

British history being taught accurately, in UK? Please, don´t make me laught. They will have to answerthat the EU played dirty, or conspired against UK, or that UK got what they wanted, or something like that

[@TremereTT]

@@alicianieto2822 They will never even get taught that UK was part of the EU once... There is only one important thing in UK history and that is "Two world wars and one world cup!". UK is obsessed with Germany when it comes to history. They even believe they contributed a big part in winning WWII...it's ridiculous.

[@sarfaraz.hosseini]

@@TremereTT Almost 400,000 British soldiers died, many were injured, the UK's industries and cities were devastated, it gave away it's aerospace tech. to the Americans like Boeing, the country bankrupted itself in the fight, and the the UK was the staging post for the liberation of Europe, and then stood firm against fascism and then communism. You're welcome.

[@sarfaraz.hosseini]

@@alicianieto2822 European history being taught accurately in the EU? The EU cares so much about democracy, it made the Irish and Danes vote again when the people rejected treaties. It's demanding full access to UK fishing waters and for the UK to align with EU courts for a trade deal. It's devastated the economies of Italy, Greece, Spain, and Portugal, and left Italy to rot when they most needed help.

[@alicianieto2822]

@@sarfaraz.hosseini "They voted twice on an important matter, therefore they don´t teach history right" Fascinating logic, tell me more about it.

[@MattTheSpratt]

YES I COULD HAVE TOLD YOU THE ANSWER WITHOUT CLICKING ON THE VIDEO

[@e1woqf]

The British: on their way from an Empire to insignificance and they don't even seem to take notice...

[@MatthewAhavah]

@@plainenglish1774 why does it matter? Because you want to insult his country?

[@PeterWoodstorrechianca]

@@plainenglish1774 All the people on here like e1woqf have no content , fake accounts

[@e1woqf]

@@plainenglish1774 I'm a citizen of the EU27 😘

[@e1woqf]

@Jonathan [British Imperialist] There is no such thing as "God". Your Empire does not exist any more. It's about time you get it.

[@tsmay4598]

@@e1woqf It does in his head.

[@eamonnca1]

Great interview. I always like to hear from academics on topics like this instead of pundits.

[@denisdaly1708]

Me too.

[@casperwallace9685]

First you need to clear out the virus's in media, they run the narrative in UK

[@theresenydahl9531]

Thank you, a very informative interview. Exactly, the Brits are xenophobic about China too and the Chinese know it, it's not a great start for a trade relationship. One aspect that is never mentioned is that as a colonizer, war starter, xenophobic and condescending nation, Britain has pissed off and are still aggravating many nations, making themselves an easy revenge target. EU is a friend but the view on Britain due to all attacks on us is changing our attitude. A full stop break of relationship might be a mutually good solution, the UK should in all fairness go out No Deal Brexit and get what they voted for with all consequences that comes with it. Maybe sometime in the future the UK might want to rejoin or maybe not, that can only happen after they've done some self searching about their hate for the EU. We wish the UK the best of luck with the WTO rules, may it work out well for you.

[@mrjamescurry]

Fascinating Insight.

[@alicianieto2822]

"Whatever our assumptions about China, they play by the UN rules, they haven´t done what we did in Libia, or in Iraq-"Wow! The change in host´s tone of voice after that part! That was interesting! PD: 1600-1800 a good run?I don´t know if he means it or if he is trying to make the other less deffensive.

[@Spaced92]

Err Tibet. They play by UN rules because they block Security Council resolutions on it, they MAKE the rules. We're not making assumptions when they talk about forcibly annexing Taiwan and building artificial islands to claim ocean resources.

[@kw7142]

@@Spaced92 also the fact they don't allow free speech or religion also

[@dingdingdingding2871]

@@Spaced92 usaukfrance too blocks different resolutions in security council. The thing is, these countries mentioned actively breaks their own rules and pick and chooses to abide by them or not. China doesn't do that. China doesn't bomb another sovereign country in the name of communism.

[@Robertsmith001]

@@dingdingdingding2871 China invaded Tibet and illegally occupied it

[@lechatgris7810]

I had a job interview in which I talked about these very same things (democracy, migration from West Africa, invasion of Taiwan, language, Russia, China, etc.) and I was told to take a hike. Then this guy comes along, says the exact same things and everyone calls him a genius!? Life is so unfair.

[@phwodehouse]

the european union is already part of the global market. look at the deals done. so the question cannot be be "inside the eu or trade with the world".

[@ulicadluga]

Absolutely. The most grotesque thing about Brexit are the bare-faced lies about what the UK cannot do as a member of the EU - and what the UK will supposedly be able to do when it leaves the EU!

[@beegnutz]

At least he admits a few things. Edit: sounds like some common sense..... wow

[@anonymouse740]

Yea not expected at all coming from Channel 4 News. Maybe they'll pull this interview soon.

[@logik100.0]

Peter Frankopan writes fantastic books. The silk road is fantastic. You have to listen to him.

[@logik100.0]

@SMEGY 89 I base my opinions on the quality of the work. If you care not for the opinion of an expert in his field you are free to do so. There are lots of people out there who prefer not to take expert advice so you will not be alone.

[@logik100.0]

@SMEGY 89 Ok your a Brexiter, that explains a lot. You must think a Harry Potter book is real history... Have you read "The silk road" by Peter?

[@logik100.0]

@SMEGY 89 Did you or did you not compare Peter Frankopan who is a Professor of Global History at Oxford University, to J.K. Rowling who writes fiction about wizards?

[@logik100.0]

@SMEGY 89 Have you done even the slightest investigation in to what Peter works on? Even just a little tiny bit? For example did you know he writes for The Evening Standard about Brexit? Warns that the consequences of economic slowdown in China, coupled with trade war with the US, present major problems for the UK in 2019? If you watched the interview you would have seen that was exactly what he was talking about. My experience is brexiters never like to deal in reality or do fact checking, you have not broken the mold.

[@logik100.0]

@SMEGY 89 Where was the requisite for the interview to be a bonafide "economist". He is an expert in sino anglo relations. That is exactly what he talked about. Did you watch the youtube video? The interview was about the way China will change in the future and its relationship with the UK and how that will be affected by Brexit. Exactly the topics he has been writing about. If you want to critique what he said go ahead. But to compare him to a writer of fiction it stupid.

[@bishopwhite1822]

If May quitting can change to outcome, it shows that it is not about England but about the politicians internal power struggle. Divided we fall. Divided we are concord. Divided we are weak.

[@bartoszczarnotta5806]

Guys, you are just medium size, island state. Nothing more, nothing less. Get used to it!

[@bartoszczarnotta5806]

@Albert Pike Very much it does. There is one million of my fellow Poles in the UK. And, conversely, there are also many UK citizens in Poland. And all of them are now put in limbo, with potentially catastrophic consequences.

[@emm_arr]

@@bartoszczarnotta5806 Don't take Al Pike too seriously. He's only here to shitpost.

[@bartoszczarnotta5806]

@Albert Pike Yes, "serious offence". Likewise, Brexit is such interference in our, Polish politics. Not in words but in practice. Same with all EU countries hat are unfortunate enough to have large diaspora in UK. Alas, ask Irish or French...

[@emm_arr]

@Albert Pike Stupid shitpost, Al! You sound like you are demented.

[@emm_arr]

@Jonathan [British Imperialist] That's not how gratitude works. Stupid post.

[@angelogandolfo6374]

I think UK has never been a convinced european, and always contrary at the European integration.

[@stuartjackson8091]

That England place, it's a bit like Serbia isen't it.

[@aritakalo8011]

That Crimea thing sailed with geography decades ago. Plus the fact that Sevastopol is there. Which no one seems to talk. Just that Crimea is strategically located. It's not just Crimea alone. It is all the decades worth of facilities in Black Sea Fleet home at Sevastopol. It was all levels of illegal annexation, but sometimes still the biggest army diplomacy is employed. At that point pieces of paper become fragile and after sometime every one goes "well the reality is this and won't change". The sanctions are punitary, not corrective. In it they serve a purpose. It sends a signal: You crossed a legality line, that has consequences. Even if we can never restore things as they were before. No one was ever going to fight Russia over Sevastopol in west. That is the real politik truth. as harsh as it is to Ukrainians. No one ever was and no one ever will. Because that means going directly against and endangering the Black Sea Fleet and that means WW3. Attacking one of the pre-eminent fleet homes of Russian Navy is pretty much declaring war on the Russian Federation. No matter one calling it intervention or mission or war declaration. It's like saying USA wouldn't react to someone attacking Pearl Harbor and asking them to give it back to Hawaiian Kingdom. It was conquered by force and after sometime it will just become normal part of the Nation and is a vital Military basin. Attacking it will lead to full declaration of war. Since that is how important Pacific Fleet is to USA and that is how important Black Sea Fleet is to Russia. One touches neithers home port without risking all out war with their respective home nations. Ukrainians drew the short straw on that thing in geography, geopolitics and historical events.

The attempted US takeover of Ukraine with their NATO war crimes gang had to be resisted. You can't allow fatmerica to have a base on your border.

[@miv6770]

Albert Pike - EU 4th Reich? Hmm... let’s try to learn some European history, mate. About Sevastopol and Crimea: do you reckon that world power players think it would be reasonable for Ukraine to become another Nuclear power on the global stage after the Maidan events in Kiev, by holding Sevastopol? Not a chance, never. No one wants that. Countries with nuclear capabilities are on a very short list, and that is for a good reason. Therefore Russia having Sevastopol, which by the way historically for centuries was part of Russia, was something that all the powers of the world actually agreed to, no matter what the press says or what the apparent strategic decisions are. Let’s leave it as it is, for the better good (no nuclear war). Full stop. Second: if someone claims that Europe is a Reich, and Europeans are a 4th Reich (too much hatred there, but keep sharing the real views from the island of England, don’t stop please, keep sharing - because it’s useful to get to know the English feelings...) than let’s just share some facts: slavery, apartheid, two genocides in Ireland against the Irish people by stealing their food with the British army, while millions of Irish children, women, man were forced to die of hunger, of famine - and the list may continue. But hey, let’s just point out the present: Glenfell tower - which is the real expression of Great British norms and values in practice, potholes, an adversity towards learning and study (no foreign language, no history learning - for decades the English have learnt a very state-controlled version of history, which is where you as a civilisation got it wrong, cause with this policy your system is worse than the Stalin and Hitler indoctrination combined, just keeping the English people indoctrinated by the state controlled education - you perfected the 3rd Reich actually in that education system of yours :( But go ahead with that education system of yours, you create globally un-adaptable citizens, just ones which are in the long term very xenophobic and agressive - only that you don’t have an Empire anymore and all that xenophobia, hatred and aggressiveness displayed by a very large part of England we’ll be barking at the wrong tree :) The sins are many, no one is perfect anyway. But look at your country in the first place - and leave the Europeans alone... And, on a more pragmatic note, just leave. Exit. Brexit. Whatever you name it, just leave.

[@seeingeye8368]

I'm English and I live in New Zealand nowadays. The British really do not realise how irrelevant the UK is nowadays. Countries trade with their neighbours, not so much with countries on the other side of the world. After all, why would you buy a loaf of bread in Glasgow, when you live in London? It makes no sense. The business people I know have no idea why Brexit is happening, in fact, they are laughing at the UK. The whole thing is an embarrassment, but the British are so ignorant and self centred, they will have no idea what a disaster is happening until it is too late.

[@IronMan-qi3yg]

Why does this conversation remind me of the ones during Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

[@omnishambles4477]

There runs a train? Trains don't have legs

[@Ian_Paq]

What? Britain is not prepared Brexit or not Brexit!

[@hurri7720]

Some here use the "British Empire - the largest in the world". but forget to mention it was in land mass only. It's actually rather ridiculous. It seems to me there is among some Brits a tendency to forget less shiny facts like that the UK was behind Italy in GDP before joining the EU.

[@ludovic2431]

Business is about granting somebody something. It must be clear the EU is NOT in that business as far as it concerns a country that always thinks better of itself. The EU is about an ideal that has never been supported by British oldtimers. Young people are going to pay for that. "Out is out". Time to have some progress which has nothing to do with a country that houses the richest and poorest people of Europe.

[@owentompson6281]

some insightful views, some i disagree with. Very interesting non the less

[@wolfgangnachname7740]

Brexit&Trump are the Romolus Augustulus to the world domination of Uk&USA.

[@caffebatavia9139]

Japan tried it in 1933 in China.. how did that end?

[@marcosmota1094]

I'm in the states, but I switched over to news from Europe and the UK and less American news. Watching interviews like this and what is shown in the US is like night and day. Here, even the big screen background animations are a distraction. The hosts try too hard to be dynamic and dramatic. Maybe Rachel Maddow is the exception. The room tone, topic, interviewer, and speakers in this series are all amazing. Thanks to all the staff and guests for elevating the conversation.

[@sniffthecactusduh]

17:00 this was really surprising to hear. The EU is a political union first and an economical second, so why would they not have a geopolitical view?

[@vaannebilim]

because everyone should accept british desires and point of views !!

[@BigHenFor]

@@vaannebilim LOL!

[@L0rd_0f_War]

Very interesting talk. Contrast this with the piece earlier (last week) on "Brexit tales: Have opinions changed in this Wiltshire village?". How lack of education and awareness brings abut such disparity in thought/understanding is the real tragedy, and what caused Brexit and Trump this decade.

[@Darkwintre]

On both sides in the UK we saw through their lies which is why the Tories are struggling and Labour is almost as bad.

[@Paul_C]

Eh, the UK will fade into nothingness

[@sircliff323]

That's sounds like a fantastic story

[@tinekedevos-elsenaar5901]

I think so to

[@michaelotieno6524]

UK will fade into England

[@HansLandaNaranja]

The UK has already been fading into nothingness since WWII

[@Paul_C]

@John Buffalo ah well, according to British statistics chances are, if you have no physical problems, within no more than 10 years you won't matter anymore. Sadly were you to have great grandchildren they will carry the can.

[@cwallace7388]

Brilliant mind. Very thought-provoking and wide-ranging discussion from a global perspective. Non-committal on Brexit outcome, as it should be, since no-one can predict with certainty. He sounds somewhat skeptical about the wisdom of Brexit. If this observation is correct, I would have to agree!

[@pamwoodable]

Awesome interview both of you! Thank you. I've just discovered Peter Frankopan - the voice of compelling, intelligent reason.

[@swanhildm]

Doing myself the disservice reading a bunch of the comments I have the strong suspicion that the vast majority of writers lack the language skills, education, objectivity or intelligence to understand what the good man is actually saying. Without a doubt the smartest man I encountered in a post with brexit in the title thus far, except Fintan O'Toole.

[@aleks8283]

I hear you. Churchill apparently said once : "If you want a case against democracy just spend 5 minutes talking with your average voter." The Brexit discussion I have witnessed over the last 2-3 years is a good point in case.

[@swanhildm]

@@aleks8283 I was massively flirting with the idea of supporting direct democracy but I'm cured now, thank you very much.

[@aleks8283]

@@swanhildm I dont think the concept of direct democracy is a problem in itself. InSwitzerland they have at least one referendum ewry 6 months. But I agree with you, at least it is not workable here in the UK with the current level of education and the way the media and politicians get away and unchallenged with behaviour that would get any ordinary employee fired.

[@aleks8283]

@The505Guys what do you understand under a property requirement to voting?

[@jimmymiller5896]

Property as a prerequisite of voting rights would be to undermine the individual rights & status of the individual person. That would address one problem & create a much bigger. In my opinion, education & a change in public mindset to respect our own individual responsibility to society & the collective. Drop / lessen the total self centric ethos that leads to the current xenophobic voting decisions.

[@bigbrother5044]

I don’t think the interviewer likes the answer he is getting on china so he is looking for the appropriate negative connotation on china from him.

[@jasmineluxemburg6200]

I will not forget his comment ‘not all weapons go bang’, nor his balanced global perspective. So refreshing in the toxic air of brexit. But then i do read, travel , pay attention to world affairs. I am old, from a working class background. Two most significant influences in my life. Eyes, ears and heart, if they function and make opportunity do result in a wide perspective. Its good to hear non paranoid, balanced inputs. In london we can talk to the world and hear the world, but few do ! Even better go. Lots of time when retired, another 6 wks in china planned, listening with my greedy ears to the young camping out in city hostels escapees from villages and fearful parents, full of laughter and courage.......

[@brigidhoulihan6188]

Fascinating programme. Thanks for posting.

[@nickcraik7464]

Man, Trey Parker knows a lot about Brexit.

[@goldenteacher2011]

Justice is expensive but fair? Not fair if you’re poor then?

[@swanhildm]

stewee2011 True, but I guess he meant the whole apparatus you have to keep running if you "try" to give everyone a fair shot at justice.

No.

[@weareallbornmad410]

Yeah, I caught that too. No justice for you if you can't afford it, but it's a very good, "fair" system... one of the many ridiculous statements I found in this interview, sadly.

[@Catcrumbs]

He's talking in the context of commercial dealings of foreign entities that chose to govern their interactions under UK law. It's expensive to run those types of cases, but the UK has a justice system regarded as generally impartial. Everyday justice between people in the UK is not the topic he's discussing.

[@weareallbornmad410]

@@Catcrumbs He should have made his point much more clear, then.

[@GH-oi2jf]

How do you get “vs. the world”? Britain wants to rejoin the world as a sovereign nation.

[@984francis]

In a word, yes.

[@franknordbergno]

Hey, I was going to say that! But to be fair, it doesn't apply to all Brits, not even to all Brexiteers. But there is this very loud hard core with a completely unrealistic idea of how important Uk and Brxit are for the world as a whole.

[@ulicadluga]

"Justice is expensive but fair". I don't mean to be hostile to the interviewee, but he pinpointed exactly the reason why justice is NOT fair! Even the balanced and liberal commentators in the UK talk waffle. It is a symptom of the complete and lateral as well as the vertical "stupification" of British Society. I hope I never hear Vernon Bognor talking "gobbledygook". Also, if the interviewee thinks there are "limited resources", he has clearly never heard of the "Trident" program, which sickeningly wastes our defence capability (navy and stategic) at the expense of the lives and wellbeing of the most disadvantaged in society!

[@denisdaly1708]

He meant it in a different way, as in it takes resources, if you want justice. I Agree with you as well, and your points about waste and priorities.

[@ulicadluga]

@@denisdaly1708 I agree. It takes resources. So justice is only available to those with resources. That's what legal aid was meant for. Without a functioning legal aid system there can be no functioning justice for all

[@berniemeehan8928]

how can you put such a positive spin on US military invasions and destruction of so many countries??

[@vladescu3g]

did we saw the same interview? c an you comprehend what he said? it wasnt even close to a positive spin

[@mqmqzmq]

@@vladescu3g positive or negative, depending on your position. To Iraqis or Syrian, US military actions are much worse than what Peter has described. To neutral countries, Peter' comments on US military actions would be fair and subjective. If you were Americans or its close alliance who also fight in those wars and believe it's for justice, you must feel his comments rather harsh

[@gabbegubbe8556]

and the point is .....😨

[@barbarusbloodshed6347]

Yes.

[@AlJalandhari]

14:00 wow this is an impressive interviewer asking get-political questions that matter. Why does frankopan keep saying the us isn't making mistakes on purpose, as if its foreign interventions are benign

[@musictomyears8]

Because he is paid to be apologetic for US foreign policy. if he had said the opposite he wouldn't have been an Oxford professor

[@ProjectOverseer]

The EU, taken as a whole is the UK's largest trading partner. In 2017, UK exports to the EU were £274 billion (44% of all UK exports). UK imports from the EU were £341 billion (53% of all UK imports).30 Nov 2018

[@alberain]

Which means we have a trade deficit with the EU, trading with them under current conditions is putting us further and further into debt, the tariffs put in place under a no deal Brexit will help rectify this while also increasing government revenues.

[@ProjectOverseer]

@@alberain No it won't unfortunately.

[@alberain]

@@ProjectOverseer You gonna say why, or you just asserting that without giving a reason?

[@ProjectOverseer]

@@alberain Because the shortfall was more than compensated for by the EU's investment funding - billions that we lose instantly. And the fact that our established trade deals will be gone as new rules are implemented. People seem to forget that we were the third biggest member on the EU commission. In the 43 plus years of membership, we've made many positive changes. Britain had more influence during its four decades as a member state of the European Community/Union than has normally been recognised. As such the UK was able to do much to shape the policies, institutions and character of the Union. And the loss of this influence once the country ceases to be a member of the EU will be highly significant, both for the British themselves and for the EU that they depart from. Such were the conclusions of the ‘British Influence in Brussels: Looking Back and Looking Forwards’ event at the LSE on June 18 2018

[@caffebatavia9139]

Good interview..

[@lucille4824]

Enough ! As European I start to loose my temper with Great Britain. thats blackmail from London. Deal or no deal, be responsible please.

[@asmylia9880]

@@mlewis4006 we want you to go but you won't go without getting paid for leaving. Why even should we give you something which you've decided to do for free?

[@ailsamairi]

It seems that a lot of people dont realise that people who voted for Brexit, are not interested, and do not care about the global stage. The industrial revolution started in England, however, it was also ripped from it. Fabric, and steel works were big industries, but were suddenly closed down, being told Britiain had to move into the future, which they were told was service based, and international trade meant that these things could be outsourced for cheaper elsewhere. A lot of British people felt fucked over by the name of progression. This is why there is a huge divide between cities and rural areas, and why Brexit was voted for a lot more in rural areas. The arguement that we would lose international trade, misses the point as to why people voted for Brexit. They want to lose international trade, because international trade meant they lost their local industries that couldnt compete on a glabal stage. The idea, or hope, is that with less international trade, smaller industries within the UK will have a chance to rebuild themselves, and operate in the UK, for the UK. With a hope that a more closed off economy will lessen the class divide, as well as the urban/rural divide. But people who have grown up all their lives in urban areas, dont realise what has actually happened to the rural UK areas, and how desperate they really are. For these people, its not about the global stage at all. Its about the national stage; and being able to matter and have oportunities within their own country.

[@MagmaProductions1948]

It's truly sad that I'm British and I 100% agree with what this guys saying.

[@hamzariazuddin424]

Really great interview.....Francophone is a polymath when it comes to history and the actual international relations, order and events that take place.....

[@MrPhilEU]

(Frankopan)...

[@charlespickering2726]

One thing to note is sure china can build a 59 story building in a couple months because they don't have much building regulation. But then a lot of those buildings start falling apart in a few years because again they don't have much building regulation. It takes a long time to build a building like that in the states but you can be pretty sure that building would likely still be functional in 100 years.

[@jameswhiteley6843]

Well it’s kinda normal for a country to put the interests of their own people first as opposed to international business.

[@zomaga1]

Exactly why i am so curious how better trade deals are negotiated by small power vs. bigger block of powers. When every nation is trying to get best deal possible for them. In those situations stronger one should get roughly better deal logically from layman's perspective at least.

[@TorianTammas]

James Whiteley This is why America first offers the UK a horrible deal.

[@emm_arr]

This isn't a kinda normal way of going about. What's not kinda normal is people with an anti-Semitic posting history like yours.

[@irieite9666]

@@TorianTammas yup. That's why Trump and Putin love brexit. Divide and conquer. Weaken EU, weaken Britain and conquer them.

[@stackzbeats9344]

Name 3 benefits of leaving the EU

[@PristianoPenaldoSUIIII]

Short answer: yes

[@johnadams-hughes8025]

Very insightful interview and having read The Silk Roads have now purchased The New Silk Roads.

[@niamhmcnamara4896]

So encouraging to hear some sense spoken on the subject. Unfortunately this isn’t a politician. Is politics attracting the wrong people or does it change them, I wonder.

[@volkerwendt3061]

Simply put; yeah, way too much. Insanely overestimating its importance, Now I'm going to watch the video.

[@faultylifesaprentice9043]

Wait... that one was funny! The time zone is an advantage?! He... He... He... hehehe!!! Ha ha ha!!! Wait!!! Tokyo wakes up and they think: wait, we need to wait for London to wake up, because our 6am is not really 6am, it is way too early! Then New York wakes up and they think: what a bummer, we're already late! London woke up so early! And they always do that! Ludicrous!!!

[@Shub99]

If it's time zones, India attracts far more investment and skills to serve Europe , North America .. the main economies ..

[@rabuba1]

The time-zone is a great advantage!

[@simmysims9209]

Only UK product what I buy is scotch whisky. I like Irish whisky too so no problem with no deal ...

[@wendygulley2805]

It's the powers of Britain that are self-obsessed, they do not want to lose their Empire. The people don't care because we are not a part of that Empire. We just want our country back.

[@Darkwintre]

So damn TRUE!

[@prophetsnake]

The UK brand is done. NI is going to leave you, and poof - no UK. And not before time

[@alabama1413]

Leaving one union to kick start the demise of your own. The irony! No reason for Scotland nor Northern Ireland to stay part of the UK.

[@jameswhiteley6843]

So you think the Northern Irish will simply want to leave the Union because they voted to Remain? Gibraltar voted to Remain in the EU disproportionately. They still want to Remain a British territory rather than be ceded to the Spanish.

[@jameswhiteley6843]

Al Abama my guess is you wanted for Scotland to leave the UK before the referendum?

[@sircliff323]

Yeah I'm back to Nike.

[@PeterWoodstorrechianca]

I have never met one person in Britain who wants northern Ireland

[@kynchan3332]

The problem with mainland Europe is it is also fairly fuel and mineral resource poor, rather like the UK. So the value comes from adding value to raw materials that other countries are not able to do yet, protecting those products, selling fast and hard, rinsing and repeating to keep that lead as much as possible. The UK has very specialized services with brokering partnerships and opening businesses in growth areas of the world. Most of Europe is much too complacent to do the same. If the UK economy was so bad Europeans would not come here for work but the immigration figures clearly show the EU really needs the UK.

[@hannofranz7973]

I found really interesting what he pointed out right at the beginning by saying that this has to be seen in the long run and that there are a number of economic aspects that may be as or even more important in a global change of powers. We can take for granted that Brexit was probably a tremendous miscalculation of a country that just doesn't have so much international weight anymore. Neither do we know whether the EU will be still existing in 50 years time and which countries and blocks will rule the world then. We can only guess that it will be China.

[@lockydude007]

That building the Chinese build in 30 days. I say will have falling down with in 3 years. And I say 3 years is the best that building will do

[@clarissagafoor5222]

You really don't know that much about this part of the world, do you?

[@lockydude007]

I been there a few times and 2 friends are married to Chinese women

[@landlord5552]

Answer is: Yes

[@jimsy5530]

He's absolutely correct about Sinophobia in the UK. There's an unwillingness to see China even as an equal, let alone a better. Britain's not what it was. China has overtaken us. Need to get used to it, and work with them.

[@170adamb1]

I suppose one kinda Plus us Brit's have is that most of us were too lazy to learn a second language. Instead we let other countries learn ours. Most kids off the continent can speak English fluently almost as quick as their own language.

[@JP-mc1zk]

I don't think Britain is too self obsessed, the other 27 countries would be if they expected us to just give up on our democracy.

[@richardparker1901]

Yes, Britain takes itself very seriously, although perhaps this grandiose attitude is more specifically an English phenomenon. The rest of the world looks on in bemusement.

[@Ofasia777]

The same people who were fooled by Brexit still think they can do no wrong and that it was the best idea ever, by and large.

[@foppo100]

It is no good calling people who voted to leave that they are deluded.Some people never travel learn another language or understand different cultures in Europe.Our lives are changed by constant 24/7 information and what is the truth is often difficult to find.We have had piece in Europe over 70 years after two horrific wars.These are dangerous times the way people behave and chauvinism we are better than you is not something to be proud of.

[@unboxingtheboxx]

DONT WORRY PEOPLE; BE HAPPY WHATEVER HAPPENS,LIFE IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN BREXIT.

[@bbaasje]

This guy thinks Belgium is a city 😂

[@istnugoed]

If Belgium was a city, it would be the biggest in the world. 3.5 times the area of NY City. How about them apples.

[@FOLIPE]

@@istnugoed only 3,5 time NY city? Still 5x smaller than Altamira though (the largest city in Brazil by area).

[@lesfoley3286]

A very nice genuine sounding guy!

[@insertyourquarters]

Refreshing interview, honestly.