How Evil is Mapleshade? (Warrior Cats)

[@danslyy]

Mapleshade's Vengeance was the first Warrior Cats book I read and I loved it because you could practically make a movie with humans using the same plot and I would watch it.

[@channerchan1791]

That sounds interesting

[@LesbianAhhhLabyrinthRat]

DANSLY SPOTTED also I totally agree with you.

[@m00nfxiryleah]

Hi danslyyy

[@clarehidalgo]

Reminds me of K-Drama or C-Drama or Telenovela

[@crystalizedvulpine]

every single time someone blames frecklewish and bloomheart and ravenwing for the kits exile and not oakstar a starclan cat loses its stars

[@imaginarylivingbody7154]

Nah blaming Ravenwing is completely fair. He was the one who told Oakstar and essentially told Mapleshade that he was going to tell Oakstar and that her kits would probably be punished too but that’s okay because they’re half-Clan. He’s awful.

[@LesbianAhhhLabyrinthRat]

I forgot about Bloomheart omg...

[@mmmm-lg2mj]

Ravenwing deserved it

[@MartiniiYeah]

@@imaginarylivingbody7154 the only reason he even told oakstar is because he was literally legally and spiritually obligated to do so. it’s never once stated that he wanted or was even aware that the kits were going to be exiled.

[@imaginarylivingbody7154]

@@MartiniiYeah No. He knew they were going to be exiled. He says as much. He tells Mapleshade that they will end up suffering because of her, indicating that he knew they were going to be put in danger. He doesn’t argue against the exile either, even though he’s a medicine cat who is supposed to protect kits. And he didn’t have to tell anybody. He could have just ignored it.

[@startheangel9760]

Ravenwing was an inexperienced medicine cat that received a vague omen from Starclan, the omen represented the three kits drowning in the river and Starclan should of just told him that personally

[@dragonstouch1042]

I’m pretty sure this is the only instance of a self-fulfilling omen

[@eastfallzz]

fr tho

[@baasparkopenings851]

We need to put Starclan on this tier list fr cuz they're at LEAST worse than appledusk here imo

[@IJustAnimateThatsTheJist]

​@@baasparkopenings851+ Tbf they always make things worse. They either refuse to intervene (someone suffers/gets offed) or they do intervene (someone suffers/gets offed). They're horrid at their jobs lol

[@Parasolhyena]

​@@dragonstouch1042 True unless you count whatever the hell Goosefeather is getting from them. Some of them aren't self-fulfilling but some of them sure were and even on of the biggest ones, Tigerstar, could even be argued is self-fufilling because not once but twice on screen (who knows how many times off screen) does goose feather freak out at him as a kit in the books and call him evil vermin, that can't be good for a kits psyche. Plus starclan telling pinestar as well.

[@SpaceInvader42359]

I'm glad to see Oakstar get the blame he deserves. Even if Mapleshade hadn't made her kits cross the river and drown, there was no guarantee they'd be accepted in Riverclan! They could have been grabbed by a fox or a badger, hit by a car, or starved to death if Mapleshade wasn't able to provide for them on her own. He knows how dangerous the forest is, he knew full well he could be sending those kittens to their deaths.

[@Littlefox1213]

@@SpaceInvader42359 I think Darkstar would be more sympathetic toward the kits than Oakstar

[@Jayfeather_lover]

I really do think mapleshade loved her kits, yes she was reckless with them at times and said things that would make you think she was using them, but in the end she really did love them, their death absolutely broke her, she tried so hard to save them in the river and didn’t even care about trying to get herself to shore. If mapleshade really didn’t love her kits then why was she so heartbroken by their death? In the riverclan camp it’s clear how heartbroken she is, and after that she literally goes insane, she has nightmares and has multiple hallucinations about her kits, their death is the biggest reason she went insane. And I, personally, partly blame appledusk for their death, he had clearly Been leading mapleshade on for a while, once he got a mate in his own clan or regretted his disloyalty to riverclan he should’ve immediately broken it off with mapleshade, but instead he doesn’t, the whole reason mapleshade even crossed the river was to get to appledusk, yet when she gets there all she gets is heartbreak and insulted and not a shred of sympathy for the fact that she just lost her kits, instead all everyone does is nothing, and appledusk, the one cat she thought would support her, because he had given no indication that he wouldn’t, completely destroys her, all he cared about was saving his own butt and making sure reedshine still likes him, and on top on that he makes a point to make an already devastated mother feel worse than she already does. Not saying she’s not evil or anything, I think she’s a really cool villain, but I really do think she’s loved her kits, I don’t think it’s fair to say she didn’t even after the heartbreak their death caused for her.

[@MartiniiYeah]

yes, she loved her children, but that doesn’t omit the fact that she still used them for her own self gain. she might’ve been heartbroken when she died, but she still used them as a scapegoat to try and convince herself that her killing people wasn’t bad. she used them and their deaths to feed into her narcissism, and her loving them doesn’t change that at all.

[@Starlight_787-r9k]

​@@MartiniiYeahYeah

[@kawaiipotato5972]

I get that BUT she can love her kits and also view them as tools She does love her kits but she also uses them as a way to have claim over appledusk when he becomes close to reedshine and even though yes she was being lead on by apple dusk she could’ve also taken a hint in him not longer seeing her and becoming close with reedshine and how she talks about them before their birth as tools to be used to unite riverclan and thunder clan and how she never takes their potential feeling about being half clan into account even saying she herself will expose their half clan heritage to the clans like we’ve seen the struggles half clan cats go through and the discrimination they face like let’s not forget when mistyfoot, stormpaw and featherpaw were starved and held prisoner and stonefur was killed because the four of them were half clan and mapleshade is too selfish to see how this could potentially completely ruin their lives and reputations among the clans along with the fact that she forced them to swim despite their protests in the flooded river despite there being a bridge they could’ve used in the end she is the one that brought them to the river as a way of showing them off to appledusk which caused ravenwing to understand the meaning behind his omen and lead to their ultimate exile along with her inability to except the fact that her kits wouldn’t have died had she not forced them to swim but in the end she blames everyone else but herself that her kits died Like I said I do believe she loved her kits but this was ultimately trumped by her selfishness as she never took her kits feelings into account and that’s what lead to the kits deaths in the end

[@Ellie-fu6vf]

The fact that there wasn’t malicious intent behind her using her kits is honestly what makes me love her so much. Most people, even the most awful, justify their actions in their mind. She’s really realistic before the river, I’m sure she isn’t even aware that she’s using the kits.

[@Parasolhyena]

I mean it's the same deal as frostpaws mum, you can love your kid but still use them, still think doing so is for the betterment of the clan. Also "not a shred of sympathy for the fact that she just *lost her kits*" her kits deaths were due to her negligence, the river clan cats clearly saw it as her causing the kits deaths due to negligence. Even the kits didn't want to cross the river but she made them, she could have done a lot of things other then try to cross a raging river, and I give her some sympathy for grief of being kicked out of her clan but even then she is the responsible parent and needed to make better choices. Mapleshade thought the right thing to do was to push her kids onward into a raging river rather then waiting it out, just because she wanted to get to Appledusk now. At least frostpaws mum realized her daughter was more important then what she thought was right, in her last moments, she chose her kid.

[@pinkydee10]

MapleShade will always hold a special place in my heart as the first Warrior Cat I was ever exposed too. Even then, I refuse to be associated with the apologists. I love how manipulative MapleShade is but I also hate how she used her Kits as bargaining chips. Sure FreckleWish was the first to ask if BirchFace was their father but MapleShade’s first mistake wasn’t refusing to leave AppleDusk, it was letting both FreckleWish and OakStar believe the kits were their kin. In my opinion, the only cats that deserved to die in MapleShade’s vengeance were MapleShade herself and AppleDusk for stringing her along and causing ReedShine an unnecessary amount of grief, poor girl had to live with the fact that the father of her kits had another mate from a rival clan who tried to murder her.

[@dragonstouch1042]

I’d still argue Appledusk didn’t deserve to bite it. Cheating is unforgivable, but murder is still murder and he clearly did not want to fight Mapleshade. He was also seemingly trying to distance himself before he found out about the kits and the novel is from Mapleshade’s perspective. For all we know, he was starting to wise up to Mapleshade’s dangerous obsession and it was just too late. If any other cat deserved it, I’d still put Oakstar above him

[@MartiniiYeah]

⁠@@dragonstouch1042 it’s not even canon that appledusk cheated on her. it’s a fandom perception. appledusk is really mostly innocent in the canon.

[@Parasolhyena]

@@MartiniiYeah I mean cheating as a concept isn't even cannon in the early warrior cats books.

[@lesbianmapleshade]

"it was letting both FreckleWish and OakStar believe the kits were their kin." I've seen a few bad takes about Mapleshade, but this is just next level. What else was she supposed to do? Mapleshade wanted to resolve the feud between ThunderClan and RiverClan (who were fighting over a bunch of rocks. Neither clan needed it, and neither clan was starving.) Yes, she had kits with a cat from another clan, but she had a very good reason for it. She loved her kits and her clan, and what did her clan do for her? They supported a terrible leader who banished a woman and her two month old children. Mapleshade was justified, cry harder.

[@MartiniiYeah]

@ she was NOT justified in lying to a grieving family. if she wanted to solve the dispute between riverclan and thunderclan, she wouldn’t have chosen to be in a half clan relationship with someone from riverclan. she CHOSE that while knowing her children would’ve been ostracized if she ended up having any. she completely deserves to be frowned upon for lying to them.

[@Ca3keMeowza]

I just read Mapleshade's vegeance yesterday and most of the situation was caused because Mapleshade refused to hear, or, because she thought that everything was going to be alright, that her clanmates will understand her, etcetera. I think that the way Mapleshade acted BEFORE her "revenge" was... questionable. She lied by omission about the father of her kits, and yes, Frecklewish did just start to scream on her face about Birchface being the father of her kits, but Mapleshade didnt refuse either, actually, she thought that Frecklewish guessing around was a blessing of starclan, she said she wasnt going to lie, but she does it anyways. About Frecklewish? She isnt 100% innocent, she was flawed. Another thing i would like to mention is that it NEVER said that Frecklewish died, Mapleshade notes that if she lives, she would never see again, but it's still unknow whether or not she died, Mapleshade flees from the patrol to early to see that, and since we are on Maple's point of vision, that is all we know about Frecklewish. Frecklewish also COULD'NT have saved the kits, she was just one cat, not a whole riverclan patrol. Ravenwing isnt exactly in blame of the kits and Mapleshade's exile, he just did what he was supposed to, he told his leader about possible codebreakers, and that is all he needed to do, although SOMEONE could have said that there was no use in exiling the kits, but oh well. Oakstar is something that baffles me, he as a leader should know the warrior code, and yet, he still exiles three helpless kits, Jesus Christ! I also didnt understand why Mapleshade killed Appledusk instead of Oakstar? Surely she could have gotten her way to kill him? Drop a tree on him or something! Just do it! Appledusk, so mischaracterized... First of all, no, he didnt abuse Mapleshade, he genuinely loved her, second of all, he did care for their kits and did try to save them, HOWEVER, he warns Mapleshade to keep away from the river, for a few obvious reasons: Their clans just had a fight in sunning rocks, so if she was seen near riverclan, she would get in big trouble. She had kits, those things are gentle, i didnt understand how any of them didnt get hypothermia, they were around 1-3 months old i think, so yeah, they're fragile as heck. The river is something only riverclan cats usually cross, so most cats will (probably) stay away from it. Also, Appledusk did not say the kits were mistakes, i understand how that line can be misinterpreted as himsaying his kits were mistakes, but he said; "I've made a mistake" AND NOT "Those kits were mistakes" he loved his kits, he really did, although i do agree that Appledusk should have had been exiled aswell. Also, Mapleshade's last goal is... confusing At first, she has her aim towards Appledusk, then, while fighting with Appledusk, Reedshine appears, which instantly drives Mapleshade towards her, but then, Appledusk jumps in front of Reedshine? I i didnt see the need to make him have this sacrefice in the end if he would have had just gotten killed by Mapleshade anyways. Also, by the end, Mapleshade doesnt even care about getting revenge on her kits deaths, she focuses clearly on making riverclan (Cough cough Appledusk's kin) suffer, which is weird?? I mean, what? It just breaks off the entire idea of her seeking vegeance of her dead kits. Overall, yes, Mapleshade is guilty, very guilty of: -Frecklewish's, Ravenwing's and Appledusk's deaths -Lying about Birchface being the father of her kits -Her exile -The death of her kits Of course, telling a mother who just lost her kits that she was to blame for their deaths is certainly wrong, (cough,cough Appledusk) but... she knew better than to do that, she could have just stayed away from clan territory entirely, but no, she trusted her idea that riverclan was going to accept her, she didnt find a single thing wrong in what she did and constantly blames other cats for it.

[@shrimpzystinkies]

Ok let’s all agree that the real villain is the writing team

[@Minoka_kit]

For killing the kits

[@ThatOne_Strangekid]

As much as people try to demonize apple, he isn’t a demon, yes, he made his mistakes and stupid stuff, but he is NOT a demon.

[@Allister_TheGhost]

THIS!!! i swear, in the warriors community, people think characters are either saints or demons, no inbetween. god,

[@Asherrr-q4p]

YES THIS, Appledusk may be an asshole but he not evil.

[@Pancatoodle]

He’s trying to be better, Mapleshade… well, she won’t change for vengeance.

[@lesbianmapleshade]

"as much as people try to demonize apple," man we don't even have to try, he does it for himself

[@Kotop-o4p]

Putting pre-RiverClan Exile Mapleshade above Oakstar is bonkers.

[@nessiebwur]

I love Mapleshade. I still read Mapleshade’s Vengeance as a personal tradition on Halloween. She’s my favorite villain

[@thornn1602]

i would argue pre exile mapleshade should be closer ranked to appledusk, not number two. none of her actions were malicious like oakstar and darkstar. pre exile mapleshade is stupid and self absorbed, but she never purposefully meant to harm anyone. she just didnt think about the consequences of her actions. and i say this as a mapleshade disliker i am not apologizing for her actions.

[@bladethewolfartist7095]

I still feel like ravenwing misinterpreted the sign from starclan. Perhaps instead of saying he should tell everyone it was eluding to the poor kits fate, hard to truly say as its not exactly written in stone tho what its true meaning was. And frecklewish is for the most part innocent, she witnessed her brother and his apprentice DROWN I have little doubt she was terrified of water and what it would do to her were she to try and help much like her poor brothers apprentice. Frecklewish was also dealing with the sudden revelation that maple's kits weren't her brothers as she had thought and I have little doubt was too emotional to think rationally in the moment

[@dragonstouch1042]

If that’s the case, not sending the omen would’ve been the better choice since I’m convinced no one would’ve put two and two together and even if they did get exiled later on, the kits would’ve been older by then, and storm season likely would’ve been over

[@bladethewolfartist7095]

@@dragonstouch1042 sometimes starclan just send signs that are a whole lot of nothing, Tiger and fire sign did nothing in the end, the fourth cat literally was meaningless etc etc. So it's hard to tell when starclan signs are potentially useful

[@midnightauklet5203]

Mapleshade is the most fun when she’s evil I love her 💖

[@SHARKFINStudios000]

7:23 darkstar looks like she would just be like, "Hey" in a cool voice

[@Spinosaurus_4egyptiacus]

she*

[@SHARKFINStudios000]

@Spinosaurus_4egyptiacus my bad lol

[@SHARKFINStudios000]

@Spinosaurus_4egyptiacus I fixed it

[@Spinosaurus_4egyptiacus]

@SHARKFINStudios000 nah dw there's like three different darkstars and they're all forgettable

[@SHARKFINStudios000]

@Spinosaurus_4egyptiacus haha 😄

[@heisenbachofficial9437]

I'd put Ravenwing in questionable. As a medicine cat, he could've prevented the exile (maybe by reminding Oakstar that putting kits in danger is kinda against the code). But he didn't act, even though it was in his power, so I see at least potential for calling him evil. The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis. -Dante Alighieri

[@Asherrr-q4p]

That is true but one we don’t know his intentions for it. And two literally anyone could have brought that up. So does this make everyone in Thunderclan bad because I’m pretty sure every warrior knows the code.

[@heisenbachofficial9437]

@Asherrr-q4p Whilst every warrior knows the code, not every warrior can speak up against their leader. A medicine cat can, since giving guidance is part of their job. And I'm unsure to what extend Ravenwings intentions matter (although I heavily doubt he intended the kits to die). The possible consequences of his inaction (sending 3 kittens into a storm might endanger them) should have been obvious to him. Best (and most probable) case: Ravenwing was negligent in not questioning Oakstars decision. This would still give him partial blame.

[@Asherrr-q4p]

@heisenbachofficial9437Hmmm actually you have a point but the only thing I still can’t agree on is ravenwing being evil the farthest I’ll go is problematic but I’d love to here the reason he could be potentially evil.

[@heisenbachofficial9437]

@@Asherrr-q4p I agree, that's why I'd put him in questionable. I believe that to be evil, he'd have to have the intent to kill the kits, which I doubt.

[@maeve9084]

I can’t stand it when people say that Mapleshade had to cross the river. The bridge was not too far away!

[@bloodsylveon]

Exactly!!!

[@Littlefox1213]

I also think that Vicky got the whole bridge thing wrong too lol. There IS a bridge but the bridge that connects RiverClan territory with Treecut place is lined up with WindClan territory, not ThunderClan! Mapleshade uses the bridge to Fourtrees and somehow ends up in ThunderClan territory, when she should’ve ended up in WindClan territory. The actual bridge that connects RiverClan and ThunderClan territory is the Treecut place I don’t mind the mistake honestly. I just find it funny lol!

[@brambleheart]

Everyone is forgetting about Oatspeckle, he did so much in the book smh

[@Freckolwiishees]

All he did is die literally

[@0MGITSPANDA]

Who?

[@MayfeatherWC]

Ehh, I'm more into Midgepelt, myself /j

[@Littlefox1213]

@@0MGITSPANDAShe was Ravenwing’s mentor

[@0MGITSPANDA]

@ ty

[@hannahcody0511]

I never realised any of this about Mapleshade before. She's much more heartless and self centered than I origonally thought, especially when it comes to her kits. She is a niglectful parent for sure, and I now feel that she deserved to lose her kits ( just not by death )! I wish there was a CPS moment where the kits survived, and only she was banished from thr clans, and either Thunderclan or Riverclan kept the kits, and the leaders feel sorry for the kits and the problems their parents created. The kits shouldn't have had to suffer for their parents choices.

[@ilovewillowrosenberg]

In Darkstar's defense, taking in Mapleshade could worsen the war if ThunderClan found out they were harboring a code breaker. Also all she knows about Maple is that she was disloyal to her Clan, and that she was careless with the lives of her kits. I don't think she should have kicked her out, she should have at least been allowed to stay for the funeral, but i understand her actions.

[@alexgame8700]

should have also exiled appledusk

[@0.721x]

@alexgame8700No. because no cat deserved exile for simply having a mate from another clan.

[@alexgame8700]

@@0.721x as oakstar did, darkstar had to do it too

[@imaginarylivingbody7154]

@@0.721x So Mapleshade shouldn’t have been exiled either.

[@Starlight_787-r9k]

​@alexgame8700Oakstar was ina different situation, Mapleshade used his dead son's name

[@vilmaheikkila6837]

Seeing this video pop up, while reading the book is surely something

[@vaishnavikudipudi1038]

Mapleshade my favourite character as a character and nothing can change that even if she is/isn't evil

[@Mistpool_edits-WC]

I think frecklewish and raven wing were completely innocent. Why? Raven wing was doing there job and he probably felt betrayed when he found out so I don’t blame him. Plus if he kept the secret he could get in trouble. Frecklewish felt betrayed by mapleshade cause she was her best friend so obviously the betrayal turned into anger and she couldn’t save the kits. She is not a RiverClan cat so she can’t swim

[@Asherrr-q4p]

Honestly for Ravenwing I think people are so used to cats from the main series keeping’s prophecy’s to themselves because that’s what happens a lot, especially in the first 4 arcs.

[@Mistpool_edits-WC]

Yeah

[@lonemew3503]

Frecklewish was a bit of a jerk to be honest. She had every right to be mad at Mapleshade but there's no excuse for her calling 3 kids creatures and supporting their exile. They did nothing to her. Grief does not justify or absolve you of your actions.

[@Kotop-o4p]

@@lonemew3503Based

[@gilramanujan8826]

Tbh Mapleshade’s vengeance is definitely one of my favorite warriors books. As I feel like it is the most thought provoking out of most the novellas and leads to a lot of discussion. However, part of me kind of wishes that her arc was longer for say a super edition or maybe a mini arc. As I think it was really interesting to have a perspective like Mapleshade. And I do think it’s interesting how she got readers to sympathize with her actions despite how awful they truly are. It kind of reminds me a bit of Breaking Bad, where you are following a morally grey character. However, I like breaking bad, I feel like if the story was longer maybe we could have seen more that the novella could give us.

[@Spottedstorm27]

I fully agree with the top 4 good cats. Good babies. Even Ravenwing, as much as I dislike him for not making sure that's what the omen meant, knowing the code, I can agree on.

[@dragonstouch1042]

I mean, from how he describes the omen, it seems like there’s only two ways to interpret it, and the ‘kits drowning’ interpretation isn’t something he could’ve thought of at the top of his head. Honestly, if Starclan was trying to stop the kits’ deaths, they should’ve never sent the omen to begin with since I don’t think anyone would’ve figured it out with it

[@miawmiawmiawmi]

omg hi i know you from the disc

[@Bluecupcake_funko7]

I agree on this, atleast someone ranks them objectively

[@dinolil1474]

The way I just groaned with despair seeing this video 😅 Fascinating though, thank you! I agree with your judgement on Appledusk. While I do think his attitude towards Mapleshade after the kittens drowned could be explained as him being in a state of shock and grief, I accept that it wasn't the time - and that his cheating is still scummy. Questionable is honestly the best label for him. Thank you!

[@Autumn-Leafeon]

Ah... I smell a video that's going to end up getting deleted, or having an interesting comment from the creator. It is interesting to be this early.

[@tell-me-a-story-]

Frecklewish should be lower in the list. She did nothing wrong. She had the right to be mad about what Mapleshade did.

[@rowanrawlz1871]

The pre murder maple ranking literally doesnt fit by your own metrics This is by how evil they are. Most of maples actions are caused by her stupidity and blind belief that everything will go well because starclan hasnt told her the opposite yet. Her letting her kits swim is stupid, not evil

[@Ryleyneedstooilup]

Keep crying😃

[@0.721x]

@@Ryleyneedstooilup You got mad over my comment. The only person who’s crying is you. Get a life :)

[@rowanrawlz1871]

@Ryleyneedstooilup do you think before posting 😭

[@sharksmoothie]

@@rowanrawlz1871don’t bother with this person. They’re literally going around harassing people in the comments that have a perspective they don’t like

[@Ryleyneedstooilup]

@@rowanrawlz1871 if I didn’t think before replying how would I even come up with this comment? You’re saying Mapleshade doesn’t have evil intentions before she was rejected by riverclan but this is a list about how evil these characters are😅

[@mosspigletslivesmatter1910]

Putting pre exile mapleshade before oakstar is absolutely insane. Infact the only reason mapleshade is outside with her kittens in the water prior to their exile is because a rabbitfur, an elder, is berating them about not being as good as Birchface. There’s nowhere she can go where it’s just her kittens because she’s constantly surrounded by Frecklewish, and if she’s anywhere else in camp, her clanmates are harshly judging literal babies because they don’t have the skills of a fully grown, adult, experienced cat. You say Mapleshade judges they’ll be good swimmers for being half riverclan cats, as if rabbitfur doesn’t do the exact thing. Also the argument that mapleshade “only sees her kits as pawns” has always been hypocritical as if freckelwish doesn’t only consider the kits as a means of revenge against appledusk, literally clawing up the floor of the nursery as the thought of it. These kits have zero meaning or worth to her outside of being able to get revenge on appledusk, therefore she has no qualms in immediately dismissing them and wanting them exiled. You can absolutely call mapleshade irresponsible for her decision in taking her kits out of camp, but pretending it was entitlement, her being evil, or her deliberately not valuing their lives is an extremely bad faith and disingenuous take. Saying what happened to Mapleshade is not a tragedy, nor were any of her decisions (excluding her murders) were made out of desperation, including saying she was outright EVIL before any of her murders, is a fundamental misunderstanding.

[@messengerpigeon6472]

The difference is SHE'S the reason the cats are talking about that. She willingly lies by omission, knowing if the cats knew the truth they'd be angry. She takes advantage of a grieving family, letting them believe the kids of Birchface's murderer is their kin. Was she evil? No. But she was far from good, and completely self-centered. She forced her own kids to cross a river during a storm after RiverClan cats told her they were too young to be swimming. There was NOTHING stopping her from having them go to the bridge. She speaks indirectly cementing the idea that these are Birchface's kids. Spitting on his grave and making fools out of a grieving family. And no, Frecklewish didn't see them as a means of revenge. Her first thoughts before and after they were born was the brother she was extremely close too still being present in some form. She even respected Mapleshade not naming any of the kits after him. Ravenwing even mentions that the kits gave Frecklewish a reason to live again. Appledusk is brought up BECAUSE Mapleshade is the one to mention him. Telling them to let Appledusk know the kits are born. She's literally using their grief to her advantage. Both Oakstar and Frecklewish had their hearts tore out a second time because of who the real father is. Oakstar is the one that makes any mention of getting revenge, not Frecklewish. And she DIDN'T rip up the moss merely sank her claws into it. Far different and just done out of eagerness of being able to brag that Birchface lives on. Like literally none of this would have happened if Mapleshade didn't lie. Appledusk was her thoughts first and foremost, even more than her kits.

[@mosspigletslivesmatter1910]

@ this is incorrect - it was frecklewish who was upset that mapleshade didn’t name any of them after birchface. (“Excellent names”, oakstar mewed. “Didn’t you want to name one of them after birchface?” Frecklewish asked, sounding disappointed.”). They both absolutely see them as little more of a means of getting their own back. Frecklewish’s love for these kits, as is Oakstar’s, was always entirely conditional. She didn’t want them to die, but she had absolutely zero care, attachment or regard for them after finding out they weren’t her brothers. And she’s not wrong for her feelings changing upon learning the truth (aside from calling them “half clan creatures” who don’t deserve to be warriors and wanting them driven out), it’s the way people act like her care for the kits wasn’t conditional when they’re so obviously written to be. They’re only ever mentioned in relation to birchface, Riverclan or getting revenge. Mapleshade’s kits were failed and disregarded by everyone - yes, everyone, Mapleshade failed them too. But she was still the only cat in the entire story to show a genuine love and care for them that wasn’t conditional. The way the clans are, mapleshade had little choice. She originally disclosed she would be raising them alone, and wished to not discuss their father, which beetail respects and simply wishes them well. Not only does Frecklewish assume (which no, I’m not painting her as the villain for doing), she does so /before/ mapleshade can say anything. She even says “I can’t lie, not if I want them to know the truth later” “The air in the warriors den was suddenly so thick that Mapleshade couldn’t catch her breath. She stared at Frecklewish, unable to speak. The golden she-cat didn’t seem to need a response from Mapleshade. She nodded slowly, and the light in her eyes burned even more brightly. “I’m right, aren’t I? Oh, thank starclan! And thank you, Mapleshade!” It’s also acknowledged that if she says otherwise now, she WILL be pressed further. Granted she says no after Frecklewish has ALREADY announced she’s going to help raise them - explicitly saying “help raise HIS kits”, it’s highly unlikely it would go well. It’s also acknowledged that for her kits to have any chance of being treated fairly and being welcomed, even if only for the start of their lives, she has no choice but to agree with Frecklewish. Infact even after she tries to subtly distance her kits from the image of Birchface as much as she can instead of leaning into it, the one expecting you can argue being her saying “He (appledusk) needs to know thunderclan is now stronger than ever” - she doesn’t *enjoy* it or is twiddling her thumbs at taking advantage of them, she’s infact deeply uncomfortable by it and never wished to involve Birchface or his family at all. MV’s if anything is one of the most blatant shows on how unfairly half clan cats, even children are treated - and how it was solely being half clan that made everyone disregard and turn a blind eye to their lives and not as worthy, even by cats who you’re meant to deem as good.

[@messengerpigeon6472]

@@mosspigletslivesmatter1910 You can be disappointed and still respect a decision. Not pressing on the names is respecting. No one is saying Frecklewish's love was unconditional. It's made like, explicitly clear that the love was based on their relation to Birchface. No one is saying any of the main cats in MV is good, not even the books support that. The whole point is grief. Not once are we supposed to see any cat as good in any sense. Mapleshade's lies by omission SEVERAL times in regards to the kits. She still could have said they aren't his kids. Cats didn't have to reveal who the fathers are. She willingly led them on, even taking it as a sign from StarClan. Her "unconditional" love for her kits was solely because she didn't see them as their own. She already set them up for an impossible task, being the ones that would bridge the gap between ThunderClan and RiverClan. Ultimately so she could be with Appledusk. A lot of her love for her kits was because of their connection to Appledusk. Her lack of care is shown when she convinces herself her kits are telling her to kill so they can go to StarClan. Because what SHE wants is to kill, but refuses to take responsibility for anything she does to the point she hallucinates her own kits so she can justify her murders. She's an extremely selfish cat, to the point of being delusional. I honestly see her as having a personality disorder. It's made clear how selfish she is when she sees Reedshine and Appledusk. All her "care" for her kits go out the window because Appledusk is "hers". Not to kill, but as a partner. Even though he was one of the ones she had to kill to get her kits to StarClan. It's only after accidentally killing him she goes back to thinking about her kits. To justify the murder. And it's not really about the kits being half-clan in my opinion. But about being put in an impossible situation. If the kits had any other RiverClan parent I honestly think the reaction wouldn't have been as harsh. It's the fact that it was Birchface's killer that fathered them that set everything off. (In fact I headcanon it was Birchface himself that sent Ravenwing the omen bc who else in StarClan would care that much? Even the excuse of destroying ThunderClan is moot. Cats like Tigerstar, Darktail, Brokenstar, etc were stopped and they caused plenty of destruction.) I did like Mapleshade being 2nd because everything going wrong is bc her own actions(and StarClan). She repeatedly makes bad decisions. But the only actual evil in the book is Mapleshade when she starts killing. I don't see how anyone can see her as genuinely evil before that. She's delusional, not evil. Too many ppl think wrong = evil. But while not good, her plan had merit, bc even if she was kicked out later on after the truth came out the kits would be older. But everything coming out when Frecklewish and Oakstar were still heavily grieving ruined things. Her book is just an all around tragedy, the most impossible situation anyone could be in. And I do think it's overlooked often in discussions (including when I talk about it) regardless of everything she was a mother, the only cat in TC that did have any sort of actual love for her kits. And even if she didn't, she recently gave birth, the toll suddenly losing kits would have on her body would be harsh physically and mentally. I often can't stand people talking about who's the most evil in her book because it's not about good and evil. I think Akira's breakdown was good. Oakstar and Mapleshade before killing was a hard one, but when thought over, I do agree with you! He does deserve 2nd place, because ultimately HE'S the leader, the needs of others should come before his own. While his actions were done out of grief it doesn't change that he abused his power and screwed over the innocent for the crimes of their parents.

[@miawmiawmiawmi]

why does this book get everyone so HEATED

[@messengerpigeon6472]

@@miawmiawmiawmi in all honesty probably because so many people's first interactions with it was through youtube where a disgusting loser(not calling them this bc of MV but other things they did) portrayed it as Mapleshade never did nothing wrong, everyone is so heartless, and as a cheater revenge story and that Mapleshade did good by murdering those cats. That was the common understanding of it for years. And now that people have actually read the books there's been lots of pushback against that and deeper looks into the story.

[@CreatureCreations-]

Honestly, Appledusk isn't even that bad. Sure, he cheated, and I'm not going to say it's ok, but the story is very different from his perspective. You're married to a woman from another country and you know it's unallowed. You have three kids and even though you can't be close to them, you still love them. Then your wife decides that it's a good idea to tell her country about your relationship. She brings your kids to a river and drowns them, even after she's been warned the same day. Of course you're going to find another partner.

[@0MGITSPANDA]

No

[@CreatureCreations-]

@0MGITSPANDA If you're going to disagree, you'll need more than that.

[@0MGITSPANDA]

@CreatureCreations- you’re kinda condoning his cheating, and he led mapleshade on and gave no sympathy when his kits died. You can’t change my mind. He sucks

[@CreatureCreations-]

@0MGITSPANDA "Sure, he cheated, and I'm not going to say it's ok." Did you just not read that? Mapleshade was incredibly clingy, and he did care about his kits. That's why he left Mapleshade, she inadvertently killed them.

[@0MGITSPANDA]

@ I read it, but at the end, you say “Of course you’re going to find another partner”, hence the cheating condoning. Mapleshade was not clingy and that was a bad argument. It’s normal to want to see someone you love more than once a month. Especially while you’re pregnant.

[@JohnHarkabus-iu1hr]

I do believe Mapleshade in Thunderclan messed up a bit, although I think Oakstar should've been second, not her. She had bad actions, but Mapleshade was still a good, loyal cat deep down when Oakstar exiled her. It was being exiled that made her disloyal.

[@dragonstouch1042]

A good and loyal cat wouldn’t have lied like this (I’m not talking about the half clan relationship itself, but the lying by omission). If she had squashed the rumors about Birchface being the dad (not necessarily revealing the truth, but putting the rumor down), it might have turned out better.

[@MartiniiYeah]

she *did* however lie by omission to a grieving family and had them convinced that the father of her children was their dead family member. that’s a really horrible and disgusting thing, regardless of how it’s made out.

[@kawaiipotato5972]

But she isn’t loyal she chose to mate with a riverclan cat and bore his kits and even before this she continued to love him Along with the fact that she lied to all her clan mates by omission and allowed frecklewish and Oakstar to believe and spread the misinformation that her kits father was their dead son and brother which while isn’t outright disloyal is still a pretty messed up thing to do especially considering the real father kits was the cat who (to thunderclan) killed birchface and flowerpaw Along with her just generally being really selfish regarding her kits which ultimately lead to the kits deaths as to her they were tools to ensure her importance in appledusk’s life as the mother of his kits

[@Rose-j5v6b]

Tbh I LOVE Frecklewish! I felt bad for her. She is one of my favorite characters besides Mapleshade,Myles,and nettlepaw

[@rowanrawlz1871]

Ravenwing placement 💀 He literally tells maple to her face that she knows this will harm her kits. "Just doing his job" is never an excuse be fr

[@kawaiipotato5972]

Starclan only gave him a sign that there are three things that didn’t belong in thunderclan and this is all starclan told him and this could mean at best the kits simply didn’t belong in the clan and at worse they can be a extreme threat to thunderclan at any point throughout their lives and ravenwings job is to ensure thunderclan is safe Oakstar, mapleshade and starclan itself I feel is more to blame as all ravenwing did was warn oakstar about a sign starclan gave him that could mean extreme danger for the clan Oakstar was the one that made the choice to exile the kits Mapleshade forced her kits to swim across the river when there was a bridge And starclan were the ones that gave him such a vague sign that could mean anything

[@rowanrawlz1871]

@kawaiipotato5972 in what world would starclan give a sign that means "kill the kits" (with the exclusion of born evil prophecy). Protecting the clan also means upholding the code and protecting the kits. Outing them publicly immediately is not a justified play and he assumed immediately

[@kawaiipotato5972]

@@rowanrawlz1871 I understand what your saying but ravenwing didn’t know the kits were going to die and he didn’t sentence mapleshade and her kits to exile he simple told Oakstar about a potential threat and he made the decision from there like I said Oakstar and especially mapleshade are more at fault for the kits deaths as ravenwing had no control over what was going to happen other than warning his leader about what could potentially be a danger to the clan It’s like when a patrol notifies a leader about a threat on the territory the warrior isn’t at fault for telling the leader about the threat and it’s ultimately the leaders choice as to how it’s handled that warrior is simply doing their job by protecting the clan from that potential threat And we honestly will likely never know the validity of his vision and the decision he came to due to the kits unfortunate deaths

[@Ryleyneedstooilup]

So according to you Ravenwing has an “excuse” to not reveal the identity of the kits’ father to the clan?

[@QueenBiscuits]

THIS IS PERFECT TIMING I JUST READ THE BOOK A COUPLE OF DAYS AGO

[@anormalfish-rp9mq]

I cannot imagine being in Reedshine’s place and just forgiving Appledusk. The writers really messed her up.

[@meowzerboi]

5:04 bro starclan sent frecklewish to the dark forest

[@paigepriddy7715]

I think this is the first time ive agreed with the entire list! Awesome video Akira! love the research and thought process!

[@rheamaurice167]

In my AU, Birchface actually WAS the father of Mapleshade's kits, and Ravenwing lied about them, AND faking the three water reeds omen. I hate you, Appledusk.

[@0MGITSPANDA]

I love ur AU. Screw Appledusk, we love our maple

[@Ryleyneedstooilup]

You just ruined the story

[@Ryleyneedstooilup]

Why would you write an AU about if maplehshade didn’t break the code? That’s the whole point smh and why would ravenwing do that?

[@rheamaurice167]

@@Ryleyneedstooilup IDC, I love her

[@Minoka_kit]

@Ryleyneedstooilup it's an AU let people have their fun

[@seanhunt7360]

Crooked star promise, tall star revenge, yellow fang Secret

[@Mikayla_Aura_Dragon]

Mapleshade is my fav character so as soon as I saw "mapleshades vengeance" I clicked as fast as possible

[@bloodsylveon]

Tbh i like frecklewish...but SHE COULD HAVE CALLED OUT TO HELP THE KITS(And she waites a hot minute to)And of course she can't swim but still.then the riverckan cats could have hear her and saved the kits early.And i dont wanna hear about the kp place there was literally a hostile kp when mapleshade was walking alone.(But she should have used the bridge) Ok...LET ME MAKE IT VERY CLEAR TO Y'ALL IN COMMENTS-. Freklewish saw Mapleshade and her kits fall in. Waits for 5-6 minutes doing NOTHING!(Yes she can't swim we see that with mapleshade) And then when see sees the patrol and appledusk put mapleshade out only now does she think"ah yes now her kits will be safe" I don't hate the poor girl she 100% deserved to claw mapleshade. But she definitely doesn't have the right to sit there and watch.

[@apossum6231]

why would she call out for help when there was already help there? there was a riverclan patrol saving mapleshade…

[@dragonstouch1042]

…because it was a storm and no one would’ve been able to hear her? Also, I think we’re all underestimating the old forest river. It was big enough for boats to go through

[@MartiniiYeah]

frecklewish literally saw a riverclan patrol across the river and thought they would be safe.

[@bloodsylveon]

@@apossum6231 as it says in the book freklewish saw mapleshades kits fell in why didn't she call for help then?(She even said her self she watched them fall in)

[@bloodsylveon]

@@MartiniiYeah yes but it's was a hot minute until they came

[@stoatwhisker384]

The only thing you forgot is Oakstars whole. Launching attacks into the twoleg place for literally no reason? Like yeah buddy the kittypets are a huge threat let’s repeatedly attack them

[@dinolil1474]

To be fair to Akira, that never happens in Mapleshade’s Vengeance. It only happens in Pinestar’s book - and only once, and not a regular thing.

[@P0k3._.drAg0nz]

How dare youtube keep this away from me for 20 mins 😤

[@nowellsacay7066]

Know this is irrelevant but I needed the right timing, because it's Christmas time so I turned jingle bells into a warriors version 🎶Jingle bells🎶 🎶Tiger smells🎶 🎶Leafpool ran away🎶 🎶She left her mate🎶 🎶Cause of fate🎶 🎶Bagers ruined the day🎶 🎶Hey🎶

[@Viper.edits.]

Honestly, mapleshade fell in love with a riverclan cat, appledusk, but he respected the warrior code while mapleshade didn't. Mapleshades kits would have been alive and never got exiled if she fell in love with birchface.

[@Saharadesertb]

Well you don’t just choose who you love 💀

[@AyanoAishisdaughter]

If anyone is to blame it's StarClan for even telling Ravenwing ☠️

[@Felinasproductions]

MapleShade was obsessed with Appledusk. I think she did care for her kits. MapleShade to me was always a selfish and unstable cat but after the kits death was magnified

[@0.721x]

I'm sorry, but the points you made for Appledusk literally don't make sense. There is no reason to assume that Appledusk purposely killed Birchface; there is nothing to suggest that he's lying about the situation, and regardless, it's self-defence. Criminalizing someone for the action they made because they were scared of dying is unfair and lacks the ability to understand perspective. And the warrior code only says to kill if you absolutely have to. Appledusk also did not avoid Mapleshade, and the quote you used to prove this point doesn't at all suggest that he and Reedshine were together at this time. You make it seem as if he purposely used her for a specific something, which is gross. He never "pretended" that he was still with her. When they meet up in the first and fourth chapters, Appledusk is genuinely happy to see her and shows physical admiration and love toward her. That cannot be faked. And Appledusk never taunted her?? Literally, how do you perceive that as tuah hating? This is the weirdest mischaracterization I have ever seen of him. And it is very much the time for him to address that. The sole reason they break up is because of their kits, Pershing. The sentencing he uses suggests that otherwise, if their kittens had lived, he would've helped her. The same thing can be said for Appledusk. While I don't condone cheating in the slightest, and while it isn't relevant at all to our conversation of grief, I would like to note that he did in fact love both of his mates. Him risking his life to nearly drown for Mapleshade and their kits says it all. Him jumping to take the killing blow for Reedshine and laying down his life says it all. Before the exile events occurred, when he met Mapleshade at the river and saved Patchkit, the text notes that while he's speaking to her, there is a deep, deep longing in his eyes, which does show that he cares and loves her despite it all. He tells her that he’s proud of her and that she and their kits are strong. Does not that say enough about how much he admired her? Boiling him down to a simple cheater with no other personality traits is ridiculous and shows a lot of peoples lack of reading comprehension. "Well, if he loved her, he wouldn't have.-“ These are cats. Just because they have sentient-level human thoughts does not mean you should go applying human morals and actions to them when they don't know what that is. The only thing from human society they understand is murder. Appledusk risked his own life to jump into a flash-flooded river to save Mapleshade and stayed with her to comfort her when he brought her onto the bank. He was willing to jump in that river again when she told him their kids were trapped. Moving onto his grief because I need to explain this in as much depth and my own analysis as possible since people don't seem to understand a character's nuance or what that word even means. When Appledusk returns to her after trying to save their kits, the text notes that Mapleshade wouldn't see his expression and that he came wordless and didn't speak to her while taking her to their children. He had completely shut down, which is a factor also caused by grief. From my own experience of grieving and going through different stages, shutting down is a common thing that occurs in those grieving who can't feel anything other than intense sadness. Appledusk shutting down and turning Mapleshade away wasn't written in just for him to be an asshole. That wouldn't make sense considering the very obvious theme of this book. It's written to show how differently grief can affect others. Anyone would shut down if they had to witness the sodden corpses of children, especially if it was the parent themselves. During chapter four, before getting to RiverClan camp, Appledusk remained quiet and despondent until after he heard Mapleshade admit that she had purposefully led their children into a flooded river during a storm despite what he had told her early about keeping them away from the river to ensure their safety. He isn't aware of the full situation of what happened back in ThunderClan; therefore, his actions and grief are motivated solely by what he knows. Appledusk's talking tone is shifted to being stunned, which is being shocked. It's as if your heart is dropping because you've just learned of a terrible situation or truth. Earlier in the book, Appledusk displays a great concern for the lives of Mapleshade and their kittens if ThunderClan were to find out the truth. They both willingly risked their own lives and the lives of their kittens to keep seeing each other despite how cruel the warrior code is. Which I should add, neither of them is in the wrong, and neither deserved to be punished. I believe this is why he referred to his actions as being a mistake, because otherwise, if he and Mapleshade had never gotten infatuated or just been more careful, then their innocent children wouldn't have had to suffer. Not sure how anyone interpreted this as him calling his wife and children mistakes, but that also just proves the point that this fandom doesn't have good media literacy. You could understand every character's POV and emotions if you just read back on some parts of the book or just took the time to actually understand each of their grief and how they handled it. The book also notes that Mapleshade almost winced at the pain in Appledusk's eyes when he says that. He doesn't hate Mapleshade or his children; he never did, but his grief caused him to think irrationally and not clearly think the situation through, and his grief prevented him from actually wanting to understand why Mapleshade did what she did. "I should have never betrayed my clan by meeting with Mapleshade" is a thing he says out of grief because his meeting with Mapleshade led to so many conflicting actions that harmed those around them that didn't deserve it. In fact, their meetings ended up hurting each other. Mapleshade's recklessness cost them their lives and their precious babies, which Appledusk then views as it being her fault and views her as a killer, which isn't a bad thing. It's an irrational response, and he feels that he hasn't had time to process the events happening. It's why he tells Darkstar he will regret everything he did because all it did was, in the long run, unexpectedly come back to hit him in the ass when StarClan ire killed their children. When Appledusk explains why Mapleshade and their kits were here, the text notes that his voice falters. To falter means that the speaker cannot speak normally because they're feeling emotions too intense for them to understand, which is an action also caused by grief. The pale brown warrior shook his head. “Why should I? It’s your fault that these kits are dead. I never want to see you again.” I will repeat this point again that Appledusk is refusing to help her because of the intense grief he feels. "It's your fault that these kids are dead; I never want to see you again" is a thought and emotion that stems entirely from his grief, not because he wants to "save his own ass" or wants to "suck up." Which to add during this, he never tried to defend himself when Darkstar was planning to exile him. It was Reedshine and Reedshine only. Meaning that he wouldn't have cared if he was cast out with Mapleshade as well. I do think that if he had been exiled, either way, he wouldn't have wanted to be anywhere near Mapleshade. Appledusk is the only character (besides Myler) who showed Mapleshade any sympathy for what happened. He feels sympathy because he had time to calm down from his grief; he refuses to harm her and only tells her to leave because he still cares for her. She is his past mate, the mother of his children, and someone he deeply trusted and still even admired. He obviously doesn't hold any more ill will toward her anymore unlike Frecklewish because he has time to calm down over the intense grief he felt losing his children, and he understands that she is hurting too.

[@Sexygamer2000]

Very nice take. The main point of Mapleshade book is about greif and how complex it is and make us do not good things sometimes. I’m surprised nobody caught ontop this because this is a reoccurring theme in that short book. It’s why the book even exists

[@miawmiawmiawmi]

all of this is invalidated when you consider that reedshine is already pregnant a few days after mapleshade’s exile, though. her being pregnant would be impossible if he weren’t with the both of them at the same time.

[@Sexygamer2000]

@@miawmiawmiawmi Literally none of it is invalid. You can’t even disprove multiple of what he said and literally what does Reedshine have to do with what he was talking about

[@0.721x]

@@miawmiawmiawmiThere is literally a several month Timeskip while he is away from Mapleshade they are never together at the start and neither is it implied. So try again. And don’t try to invalidate my argument when you can’t even tell me how I’m wrong. The book literally contradicts you.

[@Ryleyneedstooilup]

@@0.721xWhat’s your obsession with defending appledusk? Every video you’re writing an entire essay defending this character that we all know is evil?

[@zoedowson4226]

NEW BOOK HAS BEEN POSTED ON THE WC HUBS!!!!

[@Browny_KitSlendytubbiesFan]

Hi, I'm a new sub :D

[@BecCallow1471]

Funnily, I made my entry to the short story contest about Ravenwing. That said, I imagine that it's going to stir the pot more (if it winds up getting into the top results).

[@mollyosborne4940]

When people say MapleShade "forgot" about the twoleg bridge, I feel like they're just ignoring the fact that the bridge crosses between RiverClan and WINDCLAN territory, not ThunderClan.

[@dragonstouch1042]

@@mollyosborne4940 there are 2 bridges, and one is at Four Trees, which is always the better option as neutral territory

[@imaginarylivingbody7154]

@@dragonstouch1042 She and her kits would still have to cross a river or cross a bridge that is part of a Thunderpath.

[@DUSTYDRAWS]

Also maybe the reason frecklewish didn’t help mapleshade and her kits is because she saw parallels to the death of flowerpaw and birchface and mapleshade and the kits.

[@clarehidalgo]

More like the death of Flowerpaw and Birchface traumatized her and she fell into the Bystander effect when she saw the River Clan patrol

[@Mikayla_Aura_Dragon]

Also, I think that the omen ravenwing got was a warning to NOT LET THE KITS IN THE RIVER or the death that happened wouldn't have. And mapleshade never really LIED that frecklewish's brother was the father, frecklewish ASSUMED IT.

[@Innermultiverse]

Yea but don’t forget the fact that Mapleshade knew this and used it as a cover up for the kit’s. She just let Frecklewish believe the lie

[@ax3247]

Lying by omission is still lying btw :( 💔

[@MartiniiYeah]

yes frecklewish assumed it, but mapleshade refusing to admit that the assumption by false is still lying by omission. she still lied about it and it’s horrible and it’s unforgivable.

[@dragonstouch1042]

@@Mikayla_Aura_Dragon then why send omen in the first place? No one would have figured it out if Starclan had said nothing, and by the time they would’ve, the kits probably would’ve been old enough to make the trip

[@imaginarylivingbody7154]

2:50 Ravenwing neutral? Don’t make me laugh. Yeah he couldn’t control the fact that StarClan sent him an omen. But he didn’t have to tell, especially since he KNEW that the kits would have been put in danger as a result. Him having sad eyes doesn’t change the fact he facilitated the exile of a mother with her three innocent children. His job is to also protect kits from danger and he broke that by allowing them to be exiled. He told Mapleshade, the kits’ mother, that they don’t belong in ThunderClan because their father is Appledusk. He implies the kits are not trustworthy purely on the basis of them being half-Clan. He, like many cats in ThunderClan, is incredibly xenophobic and didn’t seem to care that him revealing the omen was endangering the lives of three children.

[@SwaritGunukota]

Video 11 of asking akira to make an updated version to what order should I read the books

[@YinAndYang_ii]

Is Mapleshade evil? Yes. Do I still love her character? Yes. You go girlboss! I hate oak star for exiling literal children,

[@daydreamer8941]

I want to say Reedshine to me is somewhat neutrual, but I found it kind of heartless to tell Mapleshade she caused enough trouble tonight for even trying to bring her kits to Riverclan. I mean she doesn't mourn the kits whom would have been the half siblings of her children but she also didn't ask to be Appledusk's other women.

[@ChickenNuggetsyayyy]

Not to mention what mapleshade did to crookedstar in crookedstars promise in the dark forest

[@Pocipine]

How do I enter my art into one of your art contest?😊

[@krystabauerly]

This is gonna be a controversial video 😂😂😂😂

[@warriorShadefangg]

Loveee you a Akira!!

[@EPIXRICH]

I am willing to live the rest of my LIFE defending *everyone* but mapleshade in this book

[@WarriorCATSFan-c5l]

I pity the innocent kits that she murdered. Yes, she murdered them, because there's no way that she took them to swim in the swollen river, IN A STORM, for crying out loud, and thought they would be perfectly safe! And then... she "realized" there was the Twoleg bridge that she could have used instead. THIS WHOLE TIME?!! But, I think she still grieved her kits, even the supposedly "heartless" cat. Yeah, and of course, the cats she murdered, too, obviously. But yeah, the poor kits.

[@seanhunt7360]

Also for bule star Prophecy

[@zeep-z3rp]

i really wanna see a video of graywing from dawn of the clans, when cats are at the lake territory, they think the forest cats are old, but what about the mountain cats that made the journey? plus, graywing LITTERLY NAMED THE CLANS, and i litterly CRIED when he died, my book is soggy, and i wish i got to see more of him in the books, good work with the videos.

[@umbsol5053]

ravenwing didn't choose to get an omen but he chose how to interpret it and what to do about it. he literally says the kittens will end up suffering once he tells thunderclan but he does it anyway. cats have gotten crazier omens like pinestar and yellowfang being told their kittens shouldn't live but they didn't carry through with them because that would be sick. medicine cats have a duty to protect all life first and foremost, and to serve starclan second. ravenwing knowingly doomed three 2 month old kittens and i can't see that as anything but evil

[@ax3247]

"medicine cats have a duty to protect all life first and foremost, and to serve starclan second" Cool headcanon! 🥰

[@umbsol5053]

@@ax3247 all the best medicine cats we're meant to root for consistently value all cats' lives above starclan or the warrior code. there's also mothwing and shadowsight who have 0 connection with starclan but are still medicine cats. saving lives is more important to being a medicine cat than following starclan, and exiling kittens because starclan told you to is definitely not what a medicine cat's job is

[@SomeBadDrawings]

I feel like Appledusk shouldntve been angry at her, or sorry for loving her. Like he was mad at her for what? being unable to predict a flash flood?? Profesional meteroligists cant do that, how can a cat do it? Heck, she probabally didnt even know what a flash flood *is.* Edit: I'm not saying what she did was the right thing, but that she wasn't trying to to the wrong thing.

[@dragonstouch1042]

Taking the kits into a clearly rough river (even they recognized it as dangerous) when there is a bridge

[@Allister_TheGhost]

hello??! that’s not why he was mad??? maple brought them across a river. even if it wasn’t flooding, it was still dangerous. he’s mad because she killed their kits, not because she couldn’t predict it.

[@imaginarylivingbody7154]

@@dragonstouch1042 She had access to two bridges. One is on a Thunderpath and one that is far away/a long journey to get to RiverClan’s camp (and is also on a Thunderpath). The bridge she uses in chapter 4 is already across the river.

[@SomeBadDrawings]

@@Allister_TheGhost that happened because she couldn't- i give up

[@dinolil1474]

Petalkit literally tells her mother that it's flooded moments before Mapleshade tells her to get in it; If kittens could tell that it's flooded and dangerous, what is Mapleshade's excuse there?

[@Annikarabi]

3:35 meeeeeeeee!!!!!!!

[@Lionkingsimba4]

Personally I love this novella. It was the first one I read. I'm finally glad to see Oaks tar finally got his blame. Every time people talk about this novella they blame freckle wish bloom heart and raven wing like...OAKSTAR WAS THE ONE THAT EXILED THE KITS

[@Lemonsandlimeswithoranges]

This is correct👍

[@DestinyEdits95]

If I’m being completely honest, the debate I always see is weather or not Maple or Freckle are in the wrong, personally the fact that MapleShade used BirchFace as an excuse was because Freckle wished assumed the kits were his when maple said she’d be raising them alone, ik she could’ve just said they weren’t but still I believe Freckle is innocent but ya that part was her fault

[@Moonstars_Cadet]

generally, my favorite book bcz i read it in the middle of class

[@deeww14]

im gonna get the book this Christmas! and also some other books like crookedstars promise and another copy of bluestars prophecy.

[@xx1derqueeniexx]

Appledusk get's too much hate. Appledusk was right when he said that it was Mapleshade's fault their kit's drowned. SHE * mapleshade * was the one who took their kit's across a flooded river which even little Petalkit could see wasn't safe. Mapleshade had other option's like the twoleg bridges or going to twoleg place or literally anything beside's taking them across a clearly unsafe river. it only make's sense that appledusk was cold to maple after their kit's death's. he was grieving and if your lover killed your kid's you wouldn't want to see them again either. For anyone who says that Appledusk didn't care about Mapleshade and their kit's and that he was just using Reedshine...i beg to differ. Appledusk is clearly happy when he learns maple is pregnant saying: " i'm going to be a father! incredible!". the fact that he was in a forbidden relationship with mapleshade at all show's he care's for her. when maple foolishly takes the kit's out of camp to the river of all place's Appledusk tell's maple that the kit's are wonderful and that he's proud of her for giving him such wonderful kit's. he is clearly distress when he find's out the kit's were in the flooded river. As for Reedshine: Appledusk give's his life to save her and their unborn kit's and refuses to let her help train Perchpaw * who he is shown to be a caring mentor to* in fear for her and the kit's safety. I personally think Reedshine and Appledusk were already mate's and that Mapleshade was the other woman. it only make's sense as that explains how Reedshine could be so heavily pregnant when maple sees her and apple when she is on her murder mission. Lastly i think that another reason Appledusk broke up with maple is because maple was seen to be very possessive of appledusk. Some quote's that prove this: " you and your kit's must die! appledusk is mine!"- Mapleshade attacking Reedshine. "Stay away from him Reedshine! he's mine! these kits will make sure of that!"- Mapleshade at the gathering when she see's apple with reed. now i'm not saying maple didn't care about her kit's but she clearly saw her kit's as a way to cement her relationship with appledusk and mark him as hers, which is just messed up. Anyway's, besides the whole "cheating" thing * even though they are CAT'S and other cat's in the clan's have had more than one mate * i think Appledusk was a good cat and doesn't deserve the hate.

[@sparkledog-husbandy1305]

idc if she's evil mapleshade's still one of my favorites because she's evil lmaooo

[@SpaceUmbreDoggos]

I would say appledusk deserves the dark Forest more than Frecklewish. He mated with a cat from another clan, cheated on that cat, and is inderectly responsible for ravenwing, Frecklewish, and his own deaths.

[@Kotop-o4p]

So having numerous mates is equal to hell? Bullshit

[@Cousins_for_a_cure]

AHHHHHHH AKIRA POSTED! AHHHHHHHH

[@seanhunt7360]

Can you do the same for moon flower death

[@AngieBlackburn-mb8vt]

Wait did freckle wish assume the kits were birchfaces kits but mapleshade never said they were

[@dragonstouch1042]

That’s still lying by omission. Mapleshade should have clarified Birchface was not the father (she didn’t have to reveal the truth, only clarify it wasn’t Birchface)

[@AngieBlackburn-mb8vt]

@ oh true

[@DragonSpawsm]

How dare the algorithm hide this masterpiece from me for 2 hours!!!!!?????????!!!??!???!!????????!!!!Edit1: 88th comment

[@MalloryFriese-s9e]

This has nothing to do with the video, but I don’t have discord, so is there any other platform to send my art for competitionions? (Please reply)

[@MeuMundinho22]

I disagree with some things but in general I agree, BUT I WANTED TO REMIND EVERYONE Darkstar didn't even give a proper funeral for the kittens! not a speech from the medcat not the elders burying them as is tradition and NO VIGIL YEAH

[@dinolil1474]

She literally says that ‘the accident of their birth is not their fault. They will lay amongst RiverClan warriors’. They were buried by Eeltail. Since when does a med cat give a speech at a funeral? I don’t remember that ever happening in the books. I’m pretty sure Redtail, for example, never got a speech.

[@AngieBlackburn-mb8vt]

I love mapleshade but I don’t condone her actions

[@messengerpigeon6472]

This is a very good list and honestly I overall agree with it. I don't consider anyone evil until Mapleshade kills as nearly everyone is acting out of grief (and then there's Darkstar who just doesn't gaf lol) But, I love anytime it's pointed out Mapleshade only saw her kits as tools for her to use. Of course she's a grief stricken mother but she caused almost everyone's grief in the book. There's no justifying her FORCING her kids to cross the river and I hated how many people treated it like she had no choice for years. I think it was very telling and in your face that she caused her kits death out of ego because she took the bridge for herself right after. She wanted them to "prove" their RiverClan blood. And too many people think we have to be on the side of the POV character when no, sometimes the POV character is objectively the worst one in the book. I still don't know what the people on the Erin's team was thinking because their bs about Frecklewish makes no sense and it'd make more sense if Oakstar was the one sent to the DF. StarClan literally sent the warning so WHY would they send Freckle to the Dark Forest? Why would they expect someone that just lost her brother to the river to swim?

[@Ryleyneedstooilup]

Why are you everywhere😅

[@D-and-D-3172]

Meow meow meow meow meow(I said I like cheese ) (I’m new to catish)

[@Kitllow]

I saw a cat that looks similar to mapleshade😆😆

[@MapleshadeColossus]

Very informative, though, as someone with an 8 year degree in Mapleshade research and apologism, I'd like to put in my 2 cents on the matter. I think it's ALL Frecklewish. She should've just NOT been easy to manipulate. Mapleshade is in Good tier along with Myler. /j

[@Freckolwiishees]

Thank starclan its a joke i was getting scared

[@Cats_And_Snakes4ever]

I personally think that AppleDusk and FreckleWish deserve to go to the DarkForest because even if FreckleWish couldn’t swim its still better trying to save kits then letting them drown and she made a promise and broke it to help with MapleShade kits and unless she had a justifiable reason not too its still not okay and i would put her as evil.Now with AppleDusk i wouldn’t put him in questionable i would put him as Evil Because he was lying to MapleShade and cheating on her and neglects her and blames her for her kits death when she was in RiverClan and lets her get exiled Which why i would put him in Bad and not evil.(btw i love MapleShade 🍁>_

[@Freckolwiishees]

I would write an entire paragraph defending Appledusk but im too tired for that

[@Lightheart_1.0]

Dude it was a FLASH FLOOD that took the kittens away. You talk about "broken promises" when Mapleshade lead on a grief stricken family on the idea of her kits being part of a dead family member. Mapleshades basic plan was to make then think they were Birchface's kits, then later announced that they were actually the guy who murder their son/brother's kits at a gathering. That is all levels of screwed up to do. At that point of Frecklewish's life she had no obligation or way to reasonable help the kits. She would just be a corpse for Riverclan to pick up so the fish won't avoid the area. I bet that even if Frecklewish DID die trying to save the kits life, Mapleshade would blame her anyways for not doing enough. Mapleshade is a very selfish character so I can see that in line with her behavior. I get that you are a Mapleshade fan, but recognize that you don't need to drag every other cat she wronged too. At best these cats are neutral or morally-grey (unless you are Oakstar/Darkstar-).

[@0MGITSPANDA]

I agree, no one can change my mind on how Appledusk sucks and is an idiot. Along with many other words of choice which I will say in my head😊

[@clarehidalgo]

My grandma witnessed a Father and daughter drown in the riptide when she was a child and has been afraid to swim ever since even in a swimming pool. If she saw someone in the riptide, I can't say that I know if she's call for help or not. Frecklewish witnessed her brother and his apprentice drown and was afraid of the water. Frecklewish saw the River Clan cats on the other bank and fell into the bystander effect by assuming they would handle it instead of calling for help. I don't think that makes her or my grandma "Evil" on a moral level. Even as someone who has been CPR certified before (you have to renew it every 2 years), if I was there I would delegate someone to call for help then would assess the scene. The scene is not safe, 4 people in danger is worse than 3 person in danger. Frecklewish is not evil, the only bad thing she actually did was say mean words. She was stupid though to not make sure help was actually coming

[@Femboyhootersworker]

@@0MGITSPANDAnobody cares honestly

[@Mabledipperstansandbill]

Why am I so early

[@Jellytimestudios]

Wowzes I'm early lol

[@IslambekSaburov-u4y]

Easy money 15

[@lesbianmapleshade]

mapleshade is innocent, cry harder

[@MartiniiYeah]

@lesbianmapleshade she’s a murderer and a child groomer. she definitely is not innocent.

[@YinAndYang_ii]

You’re thinking about thistleclaw for the groomer part, not Mapleshade.

[@trixsrandomaccount]

@YinAndYang_iii love mapleshade with my life but she definitely is a groomer 😢(crookedpaw)

[@alexgame8700]

for me they are the culprits 1:okastar: he is directly guilty of everything in exiling a herd with cubs knowing full well of the dangers of the forest such as foxes, badgers and diseases he broke the code that requires protecting a mother with cubs 2:appledusk who doesn't really try to help mapleshade, on the contrary he puts all the blame for their death on them, maybe mapleshade knew the bridge but imagine being hunted with your children and you have little time, you just used it as a temporary entertainment, the typical one night stand 3:Ravenwing who is a shaman who is the closest warrior to the Star Clan did nothing to counteract the less than moral choice of his leader ps sorry for my bad english

[@Freckolwiishees]

Appledusk literally saves Mapleshade from drowning and jumps into the river to save their kits + he told Mapleshade not to bring the kits into the river because it was dangerous and she did it anyway, he had every right to be angry at her.

[@RISINGECLIPSEWCUE]

maple shade is a odd evil character she has a reason that is good to kill but the ways she does it makes her more evil

[@amethxst_f0x]

UNDER 10K VIEWS GANG !! 👇 (not forcing)

[@Misty-Therian-32]

Anyone under an hour ? ⬇️

[@LOKIFOX137]

When I first read the book I felt sympathetic for MapleShade.But now....I was wrong. She used her own kits like chess pieces to win a war.She risked her kits' lives even though they were protesting, and there was CLEARLY A BRIDGE!