Building my arcade part 10 - Seimitsu vs Sanwa vs Happ

[@frudolf5999]

5:40 thank you !! for pressing the buttons instead of slapping them to show the differences. Other testers smash the buttons from a 10cm distance, all one hears is mushed plastic and they expect the viewer to relate the feel from that. Some even describe the sanwa buttons as clicky, even though they don't click. They just clacker if smashed

[@KiraSlith]

It's the same problem in the mechanical keyboard world. You can't really tell the difference between any button if you hammer on it so hard. The crash of button stem slamming against the bottom housing is the only sound you're testing at that point, but you're not going to hear that when you're using it normally.

[@vDSandbox]

1 year late but they do that so we will know how it will sound when we play, when you play fighting games you dont actually "press" the buttons that soft do you

[@frudolf5999]

@@vDSandbox both. Pressing a button slowly in a close up shot reveals more details. Do you hear a scratching sound due to unprecise production? Does the button go down stable or does it wobble e.g. when pushed at the rim? How much play is there? Similar constructed buttons of different quality just mashed sound the same

[@ion-shivs]

Great video, thanks. I'm just getting into this world of putting together my own arcade setups - so it's good to have this comparison.

[@RedRanger2001]

This is the recipe for the Happ Joystick made for commercial fightsticks-- *Sanwa JLX joystick *Sanwa bat top with adapter *Sanwa JLF/Qanba shaft cover (the color must match the bat top handle) *Sanwa JLF/Qanba dustwasher (the outside part can be either be black or color-coded (the color must match the shaft cover and the bat top handle) *Seimitsu LS-55 spring (put it inside the stock JLF spring) *Four 50g .187" microswitches *.187" to 5-pin conversion harness Oh, and iL made PSL-C buttons.

[@freddychopin]

Truly excellent video, exactly the sort of comparison I needed to see.

[@Ozyrus]

After using three different sticks for the last few years, LS-32, LS-40 and JLF. these are my findings and if they help someone in some way then I'm glad. I have done mods to the Jlf, but this is based on full stock everything which I've put it back to for comparison purposes. The first mod I did for the JlF was a common one that most people do, 2LB spring and Kowal actuator. I ended up feeling that this essentially makes it feel closer to an ls-40. LS-32: best all rounder, for any type of game so good for an arcade cabinet with multiple games like a Pandoras box, more beginner friendly than an LS-40. Better for dashing, 2D fighters than a Jlf in some ways.alsobeing brutally honest, anyone that complains about 'pivot popping' is a total noob, that only happens if you forefcully press the stick against the gate with a lot of force in a static continual press, that's not mimicking an actual intended use of the stick, that's gate riding like a caveman. JLF:very beginner friendly, very light so does allow you to chain attacks and be quick with motions, very friendly for circular motions for newbies, also extended periods of playing. Not great for dashing, or shooters. LS-40: probably the best out of the three for shooters, platformers, and fighting in terms of precision but the most unfriendly to beginners, you have to learn to make very tight efficient circles, especially for things like super combos in KOF. I ended up putting the LS40 on my New Astro City cabinet as very multipurpose for all game types and forces you to become efficient with your circles. The LS-32 would be my second choice in case a friend or family member were to have a go for example, more beginner friendly but still more robust than a JLF. I still switch between the three sticks for different games, but these are my most unbiased findings, for the stock versions so far. I currently have covid and am v tired so been using the JlF for online Third Strike. The comparisons are never ending and you have to buy these sticks to find out the best application an what fits your in terms of all over the variables, hand size, play style, grip style, so many variables.

[@clem8475]

Great video! Really illustrates the difference between the buttons, almost as if I were there trying them out for myself.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Hey thanks. 👍

[@LodanZark]

The street fighter 2 cabinet in Japan used seimitsu ls-32 lever and seimitsu buttons

[@miketate3445]

Those great clicky Happ buttons will always be my favorite. They are the feel of golden age American arcades. Shame they seem to be out of favor these days.

[@pacsonic9000]

You can decrease the happ button pressure by removing the spring in the button.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

nice, that's good to know 👍

[@ant3602]

Finally a quality comparison video. ty

[@pcroom34]

Nice Video, is there a link for the seimitsu short shaft joystick and firmer spring buttons please

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

everything is from arcadeworlduk dot com

[@pcroom34]

@@RiddlerOnYutube Thankyou buddy your a star!!

[@Imurge]

great video mate. now u got me thinking about the quicker firm stickn over the jlf when I'm building my Arcade stick soon

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

cool, mine is packed away, i couldn't use it everyday as its just too strong for casual play on my bartop. A good stick tho if you want some pro action.

[@stevec.8411]

can you plz linke where to buy the joystick box? (the black box with the holes) Thx.

[@TurboLazer007]

I wonder how the firmness was on the Seimitsu one

[@Meerlu]

Haha

[@bonggzilla]

for shmups seimitsu ls32 and sanwa buttons and a sanwa jlf stick and seimitsu buttons for fighting games is my set up at home

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Yeah the ls32 is a nice stick. That's a cool sounding setup.

[@thepettitgroup]

Do Suzo Happ buttons fit in that case? I figured they'd be too long/deep to get the case closed.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

no, they are too long.

[@Arunnejiro]

So you like the firmness of short shafts?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

😘

[@MegaRevalution]

Really fantastic video. Was exactly what I was looking for.

[@21stCenturyDub]

Seimitsu all the way, especially for STGs. Great video!

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

agreed, and thank you!

[@21stCenturyDub]

@@RiddlerOnYutube subscribed BTW :)

[@TheHighlander71]

I don't think there's much you haven't tested. Nice approach.

[@coinopanimator]

Just installed my Seimitstu ls32 on my 8Bitdo arcade stick and man do I love it over the Sanwa jls (i like my shaft a little firmer). Love the intial 4:06 SNK layout.

[@NotHimJim]

Very useful for video for me!!! 👍

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

MonkeySpaz5000 Great, hope its coming along nicely for you.

[@jimmysilvera5512]

This is arcade acrylic of the EBAY?

[@shenmeowzo]

what a cool project. that thing is gonna be the nuts! mmm lovely lovely clicky stick :)

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

shenmueso thanks i hope so.

[@Sam-Lawry]

A LS 32 with octo and a tight spring..maybe like a LS 56? Also,seimitsu should sell pcb silent microswitch. Now,only a LS 40 exist in silent like the JLF. On silent buttons I just use the first generation with the nape inside..but..not really silent. I would like a almost silent stick with real silent buttons at night. Now,I use LS 32 on my supergun,LS 56 on Hori,LS 40 on neo geo stick and JLF with higher string on arcade.

[@jaz8088]

Seimitsu Stick's and Suzo-Happ Buttons with the Quality Micro Switches is my Choice, i have tried many more

[@daoxiong3171]

What stick did you install on?? Couldn't fit the .187 buttons.

[@Darwinion]

All depends on the switches used. If you had the old style Cherry switches in that Suzo button it would have been a lot nicer.

[@rons3634]

The noise on those Seimitsu buttons were really annoying. I'll go look for vids on the Sanwa buttons to see if they are quieter.

[@daoxiong3171]

Excuse but I really need help. I wasnt able to install the happ buttons onto my quanba obsidian.

[@daoxiong3171]

@@petalsinthebreeze they feel similar but the iL does feel stiffer. And guys if your happ type buttons dont fit, use two nuts on one button. One above the stuck and one inside the case to make room. Well it may look funny but it works.

[@Meerlu]

Is that case able to close properly with the super long Suzo-Happ Buttons? Would a Suzo-Happ joystick fit the mounting holes?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Hi. No the long Happ buttons are wont fit. Theres no room for the microswitch and wires. Not sure about the joystick though.

[@Meerlu]

@@RiddlerOnYutube Thanks :)

[@kimjongun2946]

My personal favorite is Sanwa JLF with Happ buttons over cherry switches.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

That sounds like a nice setup. 👍

[@Vitaliy_zl]

seimitsu or hayabusa RAP stick? What is better? I have hori RAP SC6 edition and I feel that my stick is not so good as I imagine.

[@Jproppa]

Add a 2lb spring and 1mm oversize actuator. It helps

[@Konuvis]

Does Seimitsu make a silent stick like Sanwa?

[@vdfritzz]

i own a sanwa and a seimitsu stick, the seimitsu is so much better for shooters due to the smallest deadzone and stiffer spring, definitely not placebo, the big deadzone on the sanwa feels awful on shooters, you can't control the plane properly, can't do fine adjustments but i tend to be more consistent on fighters using the sanwa

[@jrok96]

so are gamer finger copies of these or vice versa?

[@DrumNbassSets]

Are you still using this stick?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

The LS stick? no but i will be putting into a new project in the near future.

[@DrumNbassSets]

@@RiddlerOnYutube what are using now?

[@Seyiid1453]

great Clip a need this to know. thx a Lot it helps me to choose the right one.

[@janderkin]

Good video, but I'd like to know what kind of gate Riddler prefers. I have to assume that it is a square gate by the games he chose to test with.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Hello, the gate on these sticks is a square gate.

[@janderkin]

@@RiddlerOnYutube Do you ever feel the need to switch to an octagonal gate for games like Tekken or are you able to manage well enough with square gate? I'm a newb to fightsticks.

[@__Pathfinder__]

I have Sanwa, Hori and Seimitsu Parts. And i prefer Seimitsu LS 32 Stick & PS 15 Buttons for retro gaming or 2D Fighting Games. But Sanwa is way better if you want to play 3D fighting games like Tekken or Virtua Fighter. The Hori Hayabusha Stick is not bad, too. It depends a bit if you need a short throw distance or not and of course personal preferences. Semitsu LS 40 = Shooter (all the Neo Geo retro stuff) Seimitsu LS 32= 2D Fighting(Street Fighter) Sanwa JLF = 3d Fighting(Tekken & Virtua Fighter) SNK Cabinets use the LS 40, Capcom SF LS 32 and Namco JLF for a reason!

[@__Pathfinder__]

@Hassen Zero OLD NEOGEO cabinets from 90th use Seimitsu LS 40 Stick / PS 14G buttons, Capcom SF 2 use LS 32 Stick and 3D fighting arcades like from Namco or Sega use Sanwa JLF stick & OBSF 30 buttons. Playing shooters with a Sanwa JLF is crap. Reactiontime is not quick enough... Playing Tekken with Sanwa is better than Seimitsu. Depends on the games.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

@@__Pathfinder__ i agree with you, the LS stick i have was great for shooters but i went with Sanwa on my arcade as all round more games. are on it. Thanks for the great tips.

[@__Pathfinder__]

@@RiddlerOnYutube i have different arcade sticks for the different genres.

[@Charliemmafan]

So are you just playing mame only really on a raspberry pi set up with a SNES looking case or what just curious?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Hello, yes. The snes case was bought because it has slots for ventilation underneath it unlike a lot of the other cases i looked at to keep the pi cool as possible, its kept inside the bartop cabinet so not on show.

[@Orochi_001]

Springs have no bearing on stick actuation distance.

[@jesuszamora6949]

I was about to say. Actuation distance is all about the actuatirs and the switches (especially lever switches).

[@mundomando5051]

It feels way differently cos' the seimitsu joystick uses lever microswitches.. Idk. the neutral position but from my past experiences with Sanwa JLW and Myoungshin Fanta which also uses lever microswitches, normally the lever on the microswitch is firmly pressing towards the actuator of the joystick, so when you move the joystick around you are working against that extra force ~ lever ~ sortof spring, this extra tension helps a lot to get fast neutrals. Joystick used in fighting game cabinets probably aren't the ones with lever microswitches cos' they just add in one more layer of failure? However Tekken cabinets in Korea do use lever microswitched joysticks (Myoungshin Fanta), they are famous for their superior ~ clean inputs compared to Sanwa JLFs. The question should be: Does the pros of using lever microswitches outweight the cons? I have to say i'm mostly using my IL Eurojoystick (old Happ Competition) / P360 for Street Fighter but lately i just use my Myoungshin Fanta (lever microswitches) joystick (originally bought it for Tekken) for everything... Once you change you can't go back i guess... From what i tried, joysticks with lever microswitches are superior in terms of clean inputs, quality and feel.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Mundo Mando Great info thanks. The world of arcade sticks is all new to me. im glad to get great advice.

[@Random-yq1wu]

Long time JLF user here. I'm currently trying out LS-32. Due to level switch I've notice doing standing 360 motion has different activation angle depending on whether the stick is rotate clockwise or counter clockwise.

[@Surgicaldamage]

Where do you get that case? Is it easy to upgrade with it?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Hello, i got it from ArcadeWorldUK. Its easy to setup but thw case is not very deep for long arcade buttons so best to use Sanwa or Seimitsu

[@Surgicaldamage]

@@RiddlerOnYutube Respect.

[@Surgicaldamage]

@@RiddlerOnYutube how did you fit the happ ?

[@neojeets]

All Sanwa all the time for me

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Good choice, they are quality parts.

[@manrightchea]

Sounds boring.

[@blaster5800]

fanboy sheep

[@milanbaros2005]

Yeah the Sanwa look like retro arcade buttons to me.

[@LodanZark]

Crown sdb-202 are better than sanwa

[@billhickswasgreat3421]

Where do you buy original sticks? I'm not sure which ones are genuine (even on sites like Amazon)...

[@jesuszamora6949]

Focusattack.com and Paradisearcade.com are your hook up in America. In the UK, arcadeworlduk.com is where you should go.

[@TheRealDustinNunn]

I recommend sanwa and hayabusa parts because they are more sensitive than other arcade stick parts.

[@mattfoster1493]

I just got some hayabusa's, the sound of loose plastic sounds kind of cheap to my ears though the response is excellent.

[@jl5177]

Semitsu buttons ftw!

[@HystericalHuntress]

Amazing how nobody ever mentions how modular the Sanwa platform is. Spring tension can be anywhere from stock 0.8lbs, to 1.5lbs, 2lbs, 4lbs or even 8lbs. You can put oversize actuators in as small as 0.5mm oversize and some are even 2mm oversize. You can also change out the ball for a bat and even switch the shaft. Even can change the gate type. Due to how reliable and modular the platform is. Sanwa sticks are my preferred. And that's coming from a crusty competitive Tekken player. I also like Sanwa buttons. My stick is a Sanwa JLF with a custom 1.5lb tension spring, a 0.5mm oversize aluminum actuator and stock microswitches and shaft, with a custom bat top. Also use the stock square gate. I use the buttons totally stock. Wouldn't dream of using anything else.

[@bigsmoke53]

Ima build my own happ fight stick, i grew up with that style and i feel like anything else wont feel authentic to me

[@nihsmik]

I know what you mean dude. I just switched out my jlf for happ and it's way better. The circle gate for jlf would miss diagonals and the square just doesn't feel good. These happ sticks really bring me back to the good ol days.

[@bigsmoke53]

@@nihsmik Im gonna get the IL EuroStick though, its supposed to be the original Happ stick, until Happ merged with Suzo and moved its production from Spain to China. I currently own a MayFlash 300 Elite with all Sanwa parts, I just cant get used to it.

[@nihsmik]

@@bigsmoke53 bigsmoke53 Yeah dude, I was gonna let you know to get IL sticks. A good way to know the difference is the grommet is silicon (white color) and the dust washer for the IL is the same color as the joystick. So for example, if you got a red happ stick the dustwasher would be black but if you got an IL then the dustwasher would be red. I got mine from t-molding.com but focusattack and paradisearcadeshop sell authentic ones too. Avoid eBay at all costs. Oh and if you're going to use happ/IL parts, you're going to want a wood housing. Japanese parts are made for thin metal/plastic housings.

[@shrewdsharpshooter]

Nice video. What type of crimp connectors did you use for the Seimitsu buttons. Do the 4.8mm connectors work?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Hello mate, yes i used the 4.8mm crimps. They fit fine. I found the 2.8mm crimps very tight when i wanted to remove them to change buttons. Use the 2.8mm ones if you dont plan on changing your wiring or buttons around.

[@shrewdsharpshooter]

@@RiddlerOnYutube Yeah very tight, I'm using them in my Sanwa obsf-30mm buttons and they give me a hard time removing them when I need to open my arcade stick. Now I'm planning to make another arcade stick using Seimitsu parts this time, thanks for the piece of information I appreciate it.

[@MrRockfish01]

What shader are you using on street fighter?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

the shader is called "Crt-pi curvature"

[@LodanZark]

For me the best buttons are the gamer finger and the crown Sdb-202 with cherry mx speed silver microswitches

[@improvingdesign]

Yeah great video. Did you have to rewire the joystick or just reconnect it,?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Hey thanks. This type of stick uses a HP5 connector, same as my JLF stick so no rewiring was needed.

[@Martys2DGaming]

Good info. Thanks

[@rdot980]

Should mention iL sticks. They're what HAPP used to be before HAPP moved production to China. I was going to go with HAPP, but found a video explaining why to go with iL instead. HAPP's move to China decreased the quality of the sticks. iL decided to continue producing the quality sticks under their own name.

[@rdot980]

Should also mention the fact that for the buttons, you can switch out the micro switches for lighter switches or leaf switches to decrease/eliminate the clicky-ness and pressure needed to press them.

[@jesuszamora6949]

I was about to say, he's likely using those shitty e-switches the Happs come with.

[@hereticsshallbecleansed7245]

​@@jesuszamora6949 is it easy to mod in the different switches? I like happ but I want something with a easier press with the same clickyness.

[@jesuszamora6949]

@@hereticsshallbecleansed7245 Piss easy. You can pop them off the buttons and drop in replacements, and the switches are just screwed into the joystick so they can be taken out just as easy. Though if you get Industrias Lorenzo parts with cherry switches straight away, you'll have easy, clicky presses right out the box.

[@E-BikingAdventures]

Are those actual Sanwa buttons or the chinese ebay knock offs? What's your opinion of the cheap ebay ones?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Hi, these are Sanwa and Seimitsu branded buttons from ArcadeWorldUk. ive never used the chinese ones so not sure on how they feel.

[@E-BikingAdventures]

+Riddler. Ok. Thanks.

[@cartoonworld1000]

Seimitsu does have solid colour buttons available, I like your use of those colours for the neo geo games.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Thank you

[@epicon6]

@@RiddlerOnYutube PS-14-GN are the solid color versions of these. Seimitsu sells buttons with two kinds of microswitches. What you have are the better ones in my opinion. The other kind is smaller what was originally a start button microswitch.

[@vintagebluenote8564]

Hi, do you sell it or make for commission?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Hello No i dont.

[@mondealenvers8657]

2 properties about the lever that literally nobody on KZbin talks about, it's like you all youtubers agreed to never mention the detail about whether the stick has extra travel after hitting the micro-switch, or the geometric shape of the stick zone (whether being octagonal, circular or square angles) if you do not understand this part think of a GameCube stick vs an Xbox stick

[@jesuszamora6949]

Damn, what switches do you have in those Happ buttons?

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Clearly the wrong ones, what a noob. I found you can get softer ones.

[@jesuszamora6949]

@@RiddlerOnYutube Haha, happens to us all. 🤣🤣🤣

[@Zeffarian]

​@@RiddlerOnYutube D44X switches are the best ones for Happ buttons. The generic ones you get that come with happ style buttons from places like amazon are awful.

[@kimjongun2946]

@@Zeffarian This. Pop for the $1 upgrade for the Cherry switches. The cheap Chinese switches are absolute shit.

[@blaster5800]

Real 80s/90s experience = HAPP.

[@jesuszamora6949]

More IL than Happ for the joystick.

[@got2lb]

How thick of a control panel can these be mounted in? They don't look very deep.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Matt Behrends 9mm max. If you want deeper then they're not for you. You're better off to try Suzo Happ or Industrius Lorenzo.

[@MyChannel-vm6dw]

You do know that you can EASILY get the same "stiffness" and small throw with the JLF Sanwa with adding a tension spring and an actuator right? You make it seem like the Seimitsu is the only game in town when in fact the Sanwa stick has WAY MORE flexibility and customization than the Seimitsu.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Oh yes, i know you can add springs and stiffer microswitches. Thanks man, i really didnt mean it to sound as if Seimitsu is the only way to go, just my preference thats all.

[@manrightchea]

Those same actuators also screw up the dead zone and make the stick feel unnatural. Sanwa isn't the only game in town, learn to diversify. Stop acting like Sanwa is the only answer.

[@manrightchea]

@@RiddlerOnYutube You don't have to explain anything to him. Many of these people act as if none of the other arcade parts are good or have merits because all they know is Sanwa. There is no actuator that will make a jlf feel like an LS-56, LS-60 or 62 etc. Those bigger actuators also ruin dead zone on the JLF because they weren't intended for it. In games like Tekken, many of your neutral moves will be messed up.

[@thissmithymanga7119]

I prefer seimitsu buttons and sanwa sticks

[@DSDMovies]

I've seen other people say that too, was actually what I searched for to find this video.

[@meteor1522]

Sanwa is simply the best.there’s a reason most arcades use Sanwa and not Seimitsu.Seimitsu to me feel and sound like generic buttons made for cheap sticks.

[@SoulforSale]

A stick that stiff would actually ruin my game. My personal preference is a looser stick with less click.

[@Padoca]

seimitsu is great for shooter idd. Sanwa fair better on the fighting games, you can have one for each genre idd.

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Padoca i agree, the strong spring is ideal for shmupping may be a little too strong for Sf2.

[@RedRanger2001]

Actually, Seimitsu is great for all arcades games besides fighting games (not counting the Neo-Geo fighting games)... You can play Final Fight, Double Dragon, or any of the beat-em-up sidescrollers with the Seimitsu joysticks... I recommend the circular gate...

[@owainkanaway8345]

I think Seimitsu would be better for fighting games than Sanwa because it's not as loose, but from what I heard the shaft on Seimitus's sticks are short. I heard there are Seimitsu sticks that are as long as Sanwa JLF.

[@gcavrubio]

Nice video. I am not a big fan of the tension in the Seimitsu lever

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Yes, it is very tight, great for shooters i thought but not for much else.

[@JairoHendrix]

Are you British? Your accent is so cool

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

Jairo Oliveira Yes i live in England.

[@wallacegentry4085]

You are being biased.

[@specialformula14]

why are you so gentle on the sanwa ... its like your trying to make it quiet .... bash them like your playing a fuckin game to give us the actual sound... geeeeez..

[@toniclementegarcia6656]

Buy IL

[@keithbridges2144]

biased

[@tengoAireEnLaCabeza]

Hello friend thanks for the video. I'm thinking between this and the LS 40. I mainly want it for games like commando and Star force, I don't play fighting. I bought the MyFlash f500 v2 and I notice the travel of the lever very wide and soft. The verticals in games like 1943 are very long to make and have little precision. Would you solve this problem with these models? I wanted to tell you that I don't know what cable I have to buy. On the board where all I have goes is this ibb.co/mS7ccL7 Where did you buy everything? I like those buttons. Thanks

[@RiddlerOnYutube]

i will recommend the Seimitsu LS32 for shoot em ups. I got mine from ArcadeWorld dot co dot uk

[@tengoAireEnLaCabeza]

@@RiddlerOnYutube Thanks so mucho, Lets Rock :)