Bushmeister BA-X12 - what will make it work?

[@Magnumexpress87]

It would be interesting to see a side by side comparison with the bushmeisters inertia system and the buckmasters gas system using the same variety of shells.

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Huh, I'd never actually heard of the Buckmaster until you mentioned it. I don't really have much experience with gas operated shotguns, but my understanding is that recoil force matters a lot less, but cleanliness is a lot more important - they might foul up faster than an inertia shotgun and require cleaning more frequently as they have more moving parts. Those Buckmasters seem interesting though; I might have to see if I can track one down...

[@notmkr-busta2937]

@@blackstumpballistics5361 would be sick if u could get one

[@jasoar1563]

im ordering mine this week

[@AlsTube2008]

Great vid mate. caught a flinch on the Eley Amber.

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Yeah, I did too, but thought it was too funny to cut out. I guess I just need more range time!

[@mitchmcbride6053]

Love how we can’t have pump action shotguns but I got one of these and an Adler 12 g and fuck they are quick

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

... Which is why we don't talk about that. Lever-release and button-release firearms are comfortable, accessible, disability-friendly, and safe - the perfect combination of features for sporting shooters in the 21st century. Talk about stuff like that instead ;)

[@petpillow]

Great video, I picked one of these up last week, just curious as to how I can fix a pic rail to the top of the barrel?

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Thanks! The receiver is drilled and tapped for a proprietary pic rail that your dealer can get from NIOA, and it looks like it should basically go on like any other pic rail. I brought home a new red dot to mount onto this last week, so I'll do a video on putting it all together sometime soon.

[@petpillow]

@@blackstumpballistics5361 Thank you for your reply! I'll be sure to pick one up soon and put a reflex on her 😀

[@SirKnight7]

What would you think is more reliable, this or the straight pull Adler?

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Honestly, that's a difficult one to answer, and not just because I don't have heaps of experience with the newer Adlers. Both have very simple mechanisms (and don't have much to actually go wrong), are incredibly popular, and have been thoroughly tested by the same supplier. The Adler has definitely benefitted from having many additional years of development and is well proven in the field with customers, but the Bushmeister is no slouch in this field either, as it is manufactured by Rec Arms - the same company who make the Impala straight-pull. It will likely take another year or two for the Bushmeisters to be universally understood by anyone who might need to work on one, however, and the Bushmeister is still the only inertia-operated lever-release shotgun currently on the market - all of the newer button-release models that have come out since have a gas-operated mechanism. Straight off the shelf, fit and finish is much better on the Bushmeister, but whether this remains the same after a couple of years of shooting has yet to be answered. However, I haven't had any big concerns about my Bushmeister and expect it to work perfectly fine for the small amount of hunting I do. I've got another video coming out in the next week or so that might answer a few other questions you might have about the Bushmeister, so stay tuned for that :)

[@SirKnight7]

@@blackstumpballistics5361 thanks heaps!!

[@trevdyer173]

Curious to see how the GB mini mags go . They don't always Like to come out of the Adler's due to the long brass

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

I'm actually not familiar with GB Mini Mags; do you know what supplier they come from? I'll contact them and see if I can get a few boxes.

[@BallisticSollution]

Great overview mate, appreciate it!

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

No worries, more content on this coming!

[@8ZRD11R]

Love your reviews. Very professional. I have been told to be careful of the Verney-Carron Speedline, if you accidently push the release lever while you are still holding the trigger down you bend an expensive part inside the gun. That sounds like questionable engineering to me for a firearm of that price. Can you either confirm or deny if this shot gun is the same?

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Thanks! Most Verney Carron firearms work great, but they are quite complex. Both Verney Carron and ASA (the Australian manufacturer and distributor for VC firearms) have made improvements on the mechanisms since they were launched in Australia, and so there are several different variations of the Speedline (and possibly the Veloce; I'm a bit less familiar with the shotgun) out there on the market in Australia. Many of these have small parts that aren't interchangeable. However, their warranty service is generally pretty good, and many people who I've heard bought Speedlines that failed or broke received replacements as quickly as possible. ASA are usually fantastic to deal with and will bend over backwards for their customers. So, this might be a question best asked of your dealer, especially if you are looking to buy a new VC. You probably won't regret it. Buying used though... I'm not sure how far their warranty goes. You might want to get a gunsmith who is experienced with the model to have a look first. That all being said, my Bushmeister doesn't have any issues if you try pushing the lever while holding the trigger, whether it be accidental or otherwise (because people do try to... make it do that. I have to pick my words carefully!) I actually did some filming trying to demonstrate what happens if the operator does this some time ago, and might do something with the footage sometime.

[@8ZRD11R]

@@blackstumpballistics5361Thanks mate, I am thankful for your reply. I only own traditional looking guns with nice timber stocks and blue/black metal. I know the advantages of synthetic and stainless, but I spend more time looking at my firearms than cleaning them and it's what I like. It's my hobby and passion. As stupid as it sounds, I have never even fired more than half the guns I own, I just like having them!!! I wouldn't buy a current production gun second hand. The only reason I haven't bought a VC was the concern about bending that part accidently, price isn't the issue. I think I will buy a Bushmeister now based on your review & information, so I hope they give you some type of a kickback. Thanks for your help, and happy new year!!

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

@@8ZRD11R Haha, thanks mate, but the only "kickback" I get from these videos is recoil. At least, for now anyway :P There's absolutely nothing stupid about having a specific taste in firearms or having guns you haven't fired - firearms might be a utilitarian tool for some, but sporting goods are all about taste. And, ultimately, if you don't like something about it, why spend money on it in the first place? I'm a big fan of the blued+walnut aesthetic too and most of the guns that I have bought from new reflect that, including one very pretty over+under 12ga that I think I've only shot once. If anyone ever pokes fun at your collection of unused firearms (collecting is it's own legitimate purpose, and over here you're actually not allowed to shoot firearms you have on a collector's license), just tell them that they are an investment. Quality firearms generally appreciate in value (or at least hold steady), and they could be thought of as assets too. I convinced my dad to buy a Winchester 94/22 about 6 months ago to kick-start his retirement, and not only does he absolutely love it but it could be sold for 3x what he initially paid if he needed to part with it. Plus, it isn't too inconceivable to imagine a future where our access to new firearms is more restricted than it currently is (at least in WA)... There are worse things to spend your money on. Thanks mate, and happy new year to you too!

[@oxland1]

Any chance you could do a full strip and clean? Awesome video thanks

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Yeah, that's another video I've been trying to get around to doing, just been a bit busy lately. Filmed content for 5 videos for this channel this weekend so far, so things are coming ;) If you need help with stripping and cleaning for now though; it's actually really simple and the instruction manual does a decent job of explaining it. Lock the bolt back, remove the barrel, and with a really firm tug straight out you can remove the bolt handle. Release the bolt with the regular bolt release lever (hold your hand over the open end of the receiver to stop it shooting out), and it will pop out, ready for you to wipe down. Even though the instructions give you vague (and badly translated) instructions on how to disassemble the bolt, don't - it doesn't need it, and might make you scream. The bolt doesn't really need any lubricating - I just use a light oil to wipe the tiny amount of fouling that builds up. If this is the first time you've taken the bolt out, give the space that the bolt handle was in a tiny *tiny* amount of light oil to help get the handle past the ball bearing - mine needed a bit of help the first time. Otherwise, it should all just go back the way it came apart. The great thing about inertia shotguns (and other blow-back firearms in general) is that they are generally pretty easy to clean and look after. Anyway, like I said - I'll try and get around to filming that bit later this week, but I hope this helps for now.

[@theboyzyes]

great video....I want one. What Cat do they come under?

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Thanks mate! It depends on what state you're in I think, but in WA we classify it as a "bolt repeater", which is a Cat A. I would imagine most other states would classify it similarly.

[@StayFrostyOfficial]

I've seen something similar in 22LR in QLD it's a cat A/B

[@sokhar69]

Thanks for the video. I just wish you also had some Winchester Super Target 7.5 28g 1290fps to test as well haha. Or maybe some other target loads around the 7.5 shot 28g 1250fps+ range. Maybe the 28" barrel version isn't so great for the shotgun club after all.

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Yeah, I'm hoping to get some higher velocity target shot to test in the near future, and I have heard that the Super Target 1290fps works well in the Bushmeister, but I have a slab of the 1250fps that I bought for my over-under that I need to get through first. Next time I'm in the shop I'll check what the suppliers have in stock, but there will definitely be a part 2 to this video.

[@sokhar69]

@@blackstumpballistics5361 Cheers mate, much appreciated. How many rounds have you gotten through your BA-X12 now? Would the inertia spring loosen up a bit after a couple of hundred rounds and maybe allow reliable cycling of the 1250fps Super Target?

[@PalmersPhotos]

@@sokhar69 Probably around 300 by now, most of them heavier and faster than your typical target load, but I haven't really found the 1250fps Super Target to be more or less reliable at any point in my shooting. It feels pretty much the same as when I first started shooting with it, so I doubt things are going to change at all, but lots of people are playing with their guns and the design might well change in the near future, so maybe a trap version of the gun might come out in the not too distant future?

[@sokhar69]

@@PalmersPhotos Ah I see, probably broken in by now. Just curious because my local gun store usually has 1250fps Super Target available, so it would be convenient. True, they might revise the inertia spring in future models to handle target loads better. I'll keep an eye on it, might be a fun shotgun for the shotgun club, which isn't an over and under. Cheers again.

[@oxland1]

I have put around 300 34g number 2's through mine. Also many of the Winchester super target 1250fps 28g 7.5 shot and most of them don't cycle properly.

[@jyeprice9382]

This vs the lever action?

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

If I hate on levers too much, I'll upset people. So, with that in mind... Levers suck, get a Bushmeister :P To get the most out of an inertia shotgun like this though, you do need to run it in pretty thoroughly and be more disciplined with how you handle it while shooting.

[@jyeprice9382]

@blackstumpballistics5361 I got one or each ahahaha I couldn't decide I got the lever for 400 aud. So pretty good price.

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

@@jyeprice9382 Honestly, that is another really good thing about the levers - they've been around for long enough to have a pretty sustainable and affordable used market. It'll probably be another couple of years before button-release and lever-release get to that point on the used market. I hope it runs well for you!

[@whatscrakn101]

What happens if you hold the lever down can it keep cycling?

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Haha no, you dodgy bastard :-P. Firearms like this are really thoroughly tested to make sure they can't be easily converted into one with semi-automatic functionality, but if it could we'd definitely not talk about it publicly. I'll demonstrate/talk about this next time I'm out filming with it.

[@piggysleft]

I added a 4 shot extension and sorted out the action release “ problem “ internally same as a Sulan tac 12 there’s a hint enjoy freedom.

[@oxland1]

Wondering which choke you used with the rifled slugs?

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Cylinder/skeet choke this time, but I do plan to do a video on that topic with more slugs when my pic rail and red dot arrives

[@mikedurant1976]

Can you tell me how this would go for a left handed shooter. Could you action the lever with the thumb of your left hand? Thank you

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

I haven't got it with me at the moment, but you probably could, and there wouldn't be any reason why a gunsmith couldn't make an extended lever for it. With the way the mechanism is arranged you could theoretically move the lever to the other side of the receiver too - I know of one that is being converted that way. The ejection port would still be on the right-hand side of the receiver though, but cases tend to be ejected a bit forward, so that probably wouldn't be an issue.

[@danielhobby]

@@blackstumpballistics5361 hi mate. Could you share detail of conversion to left hand? Looking to support a mate affected by a bad accident

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

@@danielhobby For the Bushmeister, you wouldn't be able to convert it for left hand operation by yourself, but most gunsmiths that can fabricate parts should be able to do it. My dealer/gunsmith - Beaton Firearms in Perth, Western Australia, currently have one they are going to convert this way at some point in the future, and it sounded like it would be relatively simple to do but would involve modifications to the receiver and a new cocking handle to be made. I'm personally a massive fan of accessibility modifications to firearms, and there are quite a few really good options available on the Australian market that could be the basis of quite capable firearms for shooters of all abilities. One that I own is a Savage A17R in .17hmr, also available as the A22R in .22lr and .22wmr. I’ll be doing more videos with mine in the future, but it was featured in my ZeroTech Thrive scope family video last fortnight. The CZ515 is another lever-release rimfire that Beaton’s has made custom cocking levers for and can be converted to left-hand operation by the owner at home. Alternatively, if it is a shotgun you’re after, the new Buckmaster PB-12 looks like a really capable firearm as it uses a push button on the left side of the fore-end instead of the lever on the receiver, and the gas mechanism would probably allow for lighter loads than my Bushmeister. And, the new SCSA Taipan pump action .223s are shipping this week, and they seem to be pretty affordable for a pump action.

[@danielhobby]

@@blackstumpballistics5361 The Bushmaster won't be suitable for his disability. The only firearms that would work are the Bushmeister or the Verney carron in a left hand side lever.

[@dylansmith2324]

what side saddle would people recomend ?

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

My pants have pockets ;)

[@Chimpso]

Thought I'd leave a comment as I just got mine today. After running it in with a few rounds of stuff it could cycle no problem, I tried the Winchester Super Target 28gm 1290fps and it managed to cycle all of them no issue. Need to break in the springs a little to get them to run reliably, so shoot a box of heavier stuff first before trying them out. With the good performance of the 1290s I'd say the 1350s would have no problems cycling the action at all.

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Thanks for dropping by - I'm glad you're enjoying your new Bushmeister! The 1250fps I was shooting felt like it was really close but not quite there, and I've heard from a few sources that the 1290fps runs well. I'll probably end up making that my standard target load next time I buy a couple of slabs.

[@MYeahman]

Gotta sort out that eye flinch bro

[@bigtrev761]

🇦🇺😎👍

[@onik6512]

will this be cat A&B or are they just gonna make it a useless import by sticking it in cat d?

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

In WA it is a Cat A, being a "shotgun, bolt repeater", and there are plenty of other similar lever-release firearms that have been available in Australia for a long time. As to whether the license category will change in the future only time will tell - we all know what happened with the Adler lever-actions. Hopefully common sense will prevail this time.

[@oxland1]

Cat A in nsw

[@onik6512]

@@oxland1 I hope you’re right, I’ll be picking one up if that’s the case

[@ryanpedersen5722]

Im on the waiting list, probably 12 month wait yet :(

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Unfortunately, there's going to be quite a few people in that same boat, but I think it'll be worth waiting for. Personally, I am normally quite hesitant about being an early purchaser of new electronics like cameras due to production and customer support issues, and while NIOA themselves are fantastic with product testing, warranty services and customer support, it will take a few years before the industry really gets to grips with a new big product like this and consumers are able to make the most of what a new system like the Bushmeister has to offer. There are definitely going to be several smaller third-party manufacturers that are working on their own modifications and customisations that will appeal to many shooters (and one that I know of that is almost finished - watch this space!), and the roll-out of both NIOA-produced and aftermarket accessories is going to take some time too. Subsequent batches of Bushmeisters to arrive into the country will have a lot more variety in features available, and I'm pretty sure NIOA are playing with some new ideas themselves too. It'll be worth waiting for, but unfortunately you'll just have to watch people like me on KZbin having fun with ours in the meantime :P

[@spannaspinna]

The barn in Oakey Qld got some just arrived

[@ryanpedersen5722]

@@spannaspinna thanks mate!!! Call them now!!!

[@ryanpedersen5722]

@@spannaspinna you're a legend!!! 😀 thanks again

[@spannaspinna]

@@ryanpedersen5722 anytime mate

[@sionsoschwalts2762]

The PB12 is better. The PB12 uses a push button on the grip so you don't to have to move your hand.

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

The Buckmaster does seem to have superior ergonomics and I'd be really keen to try it, but there are a few reasons why I'd still choose the Bushmeister over it. The Bushmeister uses an inertial mechanism, which is simpler and more reliable when using heavier hunting shot, whereas the PB12 is a gas-operated shotgun and will likely be a lot more fussy with regards to cleaning and general maintenance. On the flipside, as the PB12 uses gas instead of inertia it will be more reliable with lighter target shot. That being said though, the Bushmeister costs half as much as the Buckmaster, is easier to get, can be modified to suit left-hand operation, and, most importantly, looks prettier.

[@maddog6820]

@@blackstumpballistics5361 Hello a left hander here was thinking about getting the Bushmeister but read its no good for a lefty but you say it can be modified. How so ? Also would have been good to see the differentness in pattens between each shell name. THANKS you got a new follower

[@maddog6820]

Ok just read some more comments so you answered my question. When you find out about the left hand conversion please let me know if you have time or borrow it and do a vid Thanks

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

@@maddog6820 I've not actually seen one modified for left hand use, but I have spoken with gunsmiths who think it should be fairly straightforward to convert. That all being said, their plans only really account for moving the cocking lever (making a new one) and not the ejection port, so you still might get a face full of hot gas every time you shoot. For reliable and comfortable left-hand use, you still might be better off with a lever or straight-pull bolt, but if your dealer (or a dealer near you) is also a gunsmith it might be worth having a chat with them and seeing what they think. I am also planning a couple of shotgun pattern testing videos, but... 2 shotguns, 5 chokes each, and 4-5 different "standard" loads - I'm going to need a lot of targets and a lot of time! Thanks mate, stay tuned for those... eventually!

[@JB-kv8yt]

same system as the verney carron stop n go

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Similar, but not quite the same. While the operation is similar, Verney Carrons use a gas system, whereas this uses inertia to cycle the bolt. In practice, the difference is that inertia guns are simpler and cleaner but can sometimes be a bit finicky when it comes to lighter loads, whereas the Verney Carron is more complex and requires more frequent maintenance and cleaning but will reliably work with pretty much any load if well maintained.

[@JB-kv8yt]

@@blackstumpballistics5361 on the verney carron the "reloading pedal" would often break making the gun unusable...would appreciate feedback on the Bushmeister in that regard.

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

@@JB-kv8yt I'll have a fiddle with a Verney when I'm back in the shop later this week, and talk to the smiths about it and see what they think, but I doubt the Bushmeister has been out long enough for a pattern to become apparent about issues like that. Do you mean the loading gate or the thumb lever?

[@JB-kv8yt]

​@@blackstumpballistics5361 the thumb lever I mean (manette doigt armement in french ... I live in a french speaking country), bought a Speedline (rifle) in 2017 and it broke on me after 100 rounds...back then the manufacturer wwas a complete A holes about it and took 1 year to send me a back a new gun... my guess is that they were mad that I talk about the issue on french hunting forums...anyway...Verney Carron makes great gun ( my dad got a Impact NT and it runs great) but this system proved to be finicky to say the least....after paying 3000 Euros (about 3500 USD...I got the executive model with the fancy buttstock and engraving) for a gun that is unusable after only 100 rounds things got heated on the phone...my brother got the Veloce (shotgun) during the same period and the same thing happened after 200 rounds...from what I gathered they fixed the issue in 2020

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

​@@JB-kv8yt I think they have revised the design a couple of times since then - my dealer has a .300wm Speedline and we've run thousands of rounds through it with the only issues being that we need to give it a bit of a tune and tighten every now and again. In Australia we also don't deal with Verney Carron directly - our importation restrictions actually prevent some firearms like this from being imported, so one of our local wholesalers has an assembly line and imports parts from France. This definitely makes problems like you have had much harder for a manufacturer to ignore, and in general getting Verney Carron firearms serviced or replacement parts in Australia is a fairly easy process for us. Either way though, I'm sorry you've had issues like that - no new firearm built by a reputable manufacturer should have problems like you've described, and certainly not one as expensive as a Verney Carron! Is your new rifle more reliable?

[@lukzy9209]

Gotta work on eliminating that flinch. It’s very pronounced.

[@flyinroo9869]

Bye bye adler hello beautiful

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

Or, get a rifled barrel for the Adler and keep both!

[@user-my8zo8uh3n]

Look people ita a great video k stop clutching at straws 32 grain loads or more or choose something else ffs get a grip the guns good just use it as it works dont be trying to get a 350 chevy v8 trying to get good econamy etc it is what it is 12 guage is no different its a beast with alota stopping power just go with that .leave the lesser to the lesser or soft cocks .

[@frostedbutts4340]

Lmao try again in English dude.

[@user-my8zo8uh3n]

@@frostedbutts4340 what can i say it brings out the italian in me lol

[@user-my8zo8uh3n]

@@frostedbutts4340 dvghknbfssabjjgfd hows that much better lol

[@user-my8zo8uh3n]

Come on frosted at no point here did the rules say no alcoholic beverages are to be consumed before comments

[@serverlan763]

It's funny how you lean into it like it's a 450 Nitro Express or something. It's only a 12g

[@blackstumpballistics5361]

As this is an inertial shotgun, it is important to ensure that there is enough recoil impulse transferred to the recoil spring. Not a problem for higher power loads, but you can't afford to be sloppy when trying to run light target loads like the 24g Eley Amber. The leaning is not about recoil mitigation - it is to ensure reliable operation of the mechanism. However, having run ~150 rounds through it in 2 days, with half of those being either slugs or 36g+, a good grip can't hurt. That being said, when people tell me "you don't lean in enough" on one video and "you lean in too much" on the other, my take-away is to just do my own thing and ignore responses like this.