Busting Electrostatic Speaker Myths - MartinLogan

We address common ESL myths with a "man on the street" question and answer style video segment, from MartinLogan.

[@hklinker]

I’ve had a pair of ML Aeons for 18 years. I did replace the stators after about ten years, but hey, those speakers made me party so hard and smoke so much of everything in those ten years - in a very humid environment - that it’s no wonder. I’ve been much better behaved since then, and the speakers continue to be amazingly great 😇.

[@toyin.dindoinlove9236]

Oh man. With my degenerative disease I hope I can buy myself ML electrostats before the end.

[@digidrum2003]

I wish you the best !

[@kingofpunk1977]

I hear Electrostatics are dirt cheap....MYTH!!

[@m7powers]

LOL!! The chick drinking coffee "... they're not for home theater." SLUURRPPP

[@totalbliss1]

I attended the Capital Audiofest this year where they had several rooms in a Marriott filled with high speaker systems and one room with a fairly affordable (atleast in that company) electrostatic speakers blew the others away with all their fancy set up in my opinion. Since then I wanted a Stat speaker badly. They said to get the best sound experience you have to be within an angle of the setup but I didnt notice that to make a big difference. It was sweet sounding throughout the entire room.

[@erinmcwhirter9505]

Martin Logan or not, Electrostats are simply amazing to listen to. If you have ever listened to them for a while it will astonish you. I purchased a set of Vistas 2 years ago and I am very impressed so far. They are not cheap, but neither are very good conventional speakers.

[@nareshsaket5401]

I have never seen this type of speakers before. It's amazing

[@fineblumcb]

i built ESLs as a hobby when I was younger. recently I got back into it after 16 years. The pair I took out of storage were covered in dust. I blew them off with compressed air. When I hooked them up, they sounded like new. However, after a few days listening, one of the transformers blew so I replaced it with an output transformer from an old tube amp. i lost a little gain in one speaker, but they still sounded good. They're are a lot of trade-offs with ESLs, but nothing sounds more real.

[@Chris-wp3ew]

beaming/ Head in a vice... TRUE... I HAVE a couple pairs of Martin Logan speakers and I do love them.. However, they are sensitive to listener placement.

[@karstenvonfjellheim5321]

I only listen to Darkthrone on my MartinLogan Speakers!

[@hoilst]

I...I want that woman's coffee cup.

[@craneywatch]

I listened to those speakers and I know that electrostatic speakers are awesome in terms of delivering pure and rich sound.

[@petethegreekre]

Electrostats! I've heard they sound too good. Bam! True.

[@lizichell2]

I have esl 63s from quad. They are lovely

[@runescaper76]

Oddly enough I saw how this exact brand was made on how its made yesterday.

[@russellreising4294]

I have the Summit X speakers, and they are the most beautiful speakers I've ever heart. I power them with a Simaudio Moon 700i integrated amp, also the best I've ever heard. The synergy is breathtaking. I should add that the customer service people at both companies are as good as their products.

[@madebythebird]

This is my favourite post… ever.. We love Sluurp.

[@MickeyMishra]

Just about everything about sluurp has been taken of the google searches. It use to be the biggest thing and now gone. Weird.

[@TimpBizkit]

Is it possible to crank the volume too loud and have the plastic diaphragm touch the metal and short? Or is the metal insulated on the inside too so only the electrostatic force gets out?

[@eposyba]

I love my ML Vantage.........and could care less what the haters say

[@dtseng69]

My ml aerius are 27 yrs old and going strong. Maybe I’m lucky?

[@cletusrobinson]

I have a pair of Janszen 412s and they still sound great!

[@Troubleshooter125]

Martin-Logan reQuest owner since 1995. Listen to everything from Beethoven and Shostakovich to The Beatles and Toto. The reQuests have dynamics up the wazoo, they capture and reproduce small-signal information beautifully ("micro-dynamics"), and 19 years later, they still sound GREAT. An occasional vacuum to the panels and some Formby's for the wood, and they're still in beautiful shape.

[@ProbeRoket]

i got my eye on the esl.

[@andershammer7596]

Martin Logan electrostatic panels seem to be dying left and right and replacement cost is prohibitive. Acoustats have a strong conductive coating on their panels and still play fine today. Too bad the company Acoustat is gone. The best electrostatics today are the Sound Labs but they are a bit expensive. Acoustats were affordable.

[@Geezy164]

Anders Hammer Where is your source for this claim?

[@scottyo64]

@@Geezy164 That's what I would like to know as well.

[@andershammer9307]

@@Geezy164 I used to be in the audio business. I've owned my Acoustat speakers for 40 years and they still sound great. If you do some research on the Martin Logans you will find a lot of people complaining about their Martin Logan's dying and the cost of replacement panels skyrocketed.

[@tokensoftokens]

I've heard some homemade esl's that that would "pop" at high frequency's from the electricity arcing from the stator to the diaghram, but I've heard Martin Logans and other professionally built panels played extremely loud without this happening.

[@orangejjay]

For anyone who sees this later: That's because the MLs have devices between the stators and the diaphragm which ensures they will never do this.

[@BSGSV]

My $800 Polk Audio CRS-SDA conventional speakers are pushing 30 years with no audible performance degradation.

[@scottyo64]

Still looking for a place I can hear a set of ML's "PROPERLY" set up. I have never heard a set I liked but box stores don't believe in setting MLs up where you can hear them properly. So also my point is I disagree with ML speakers working good for a home theater system as I don't see how you could have it set up for more than a couple of listening positions. I would love to hear a set up that proves me wrong though. I have looked at ML's speakers for years thinking I would like to try a set. I like the way they look and keep hearing how good they sound, someone prove it to me please!

[@vivianokeswa488]

Martin Logan, please send Electrostatics to me as a gift. I’m the biggest fan but I’m not sure where to get them here in South Africa 🇿🇦

[@zacsiauchan201]

One myth left unexplained. I am curious if these HV stuff produce ozone that may be harmful to the lungs?

[@zacsiauchan201]

Thank you for your information. I also use eletrostatic speakers in my bedroom and started to worry as some of my 'audition' told me that

[@windupwatch]

Any ML owners notice that the top end is attenuated in days of high humidity? My Aerius certainly are. When humidity is lower, they sound absolutely superb (including the bass, which is outstanding, by the way), but in the doggy days of summer, sometimes they sound like there's ablanket thrown over them. Anyone know a fix?

[@arongatt]

they should implement that in all models then (bias voltage)

[@HansDelbruck53]

Dehumidifier

[@davidrsmith2417]

Colleen, I have owned the ML Monolith III since 1993. I too have noticed that on really muggy summer days, the treble seems softer, less prevalent, with less sparkle. I attribute this to several things: first, over time, the super thin sheet mylar plastic "driver" becomes coated with a thin layer of dust, on both front and back sides. We vacuum the (unplugged) panels about once per 6 months per the recommendation from ML tech support circa 1994. Unfortunately, this thin coating of dust is not fully removed by the vacuum, so over the years it builds up even more. I believe that this dust is somewhat hydrophilic, and on days when your indoor humidity rises (mine gores up to about 54% even w/ central air), this dust becomes heavier and the effective mass of the plastic film increases. If my hypothesis is correct, we are now simply talking about a heavier driver, with higher inertia, which cannot respond as fast as it once did. The ML speakers starts to sound more like a Maggie in the upper-mid-treble (still very good but with less sparkle, realism and magic). I surmise a second reason is that the room's sound absorbent items (drapes, rugs, pillows, sofas, stuffed chairs, sound absorbing panels, etc.) all become more weighted and dense with higher humidity. As a result, they trap (mute) more of the direct and ambient sound that when they were much lighter and less dense. The shorter wavelengths of the treble sounds get attenuated most easily, the mid-range less so and the bass maybe little if at all. This over-damping effect is the same result you get when you simply add more sound damping material to most any operating listening room. Thirdly, and this is from my background in electronics design - the small air gap between the plastic sheet and the front and rear stators (the metal panels with the holes) lives in the ambient room air. So if your listening room has high humidity or high heat, then the electric field strength between the stators is in fact reduced compared to cooler, drier air. This directly lowers the acoustic efficiency (acoustic volume/input power) of the ESL panel. This efficiency reduction affects all of the normal frequencies that your ESL panel can produce but again, it affects the treble relatively more than lower frequencies. This single effect will reduce both the the brightness and the perceived volume of the ESL panel. So, it is likely that each of these small effects are additive, and gang up on the listener to produce a less bright, less realistic music reproduction. I vote for better air conditioners with humidity control! And special vacuums for ESL panels.

[@digidrum2003]

Move them inside your home.

[@TheMaxx111]

My Martin Logan stat panels lost their coating after 20 years and good luck getting that fixed. It has been 6 months of pain and no hope of getting it fixed.

[@andershammer9307]

My Acoustat electrostatic speakers are still working and sounding great after 40 years.

[@miguelgilbravo4228]

Solucionaste tus problemas con los Martín logan? Los tienes aún?

[@BobSmith-mz1uo]

3:23 SLLUUURRRP 😁

[@kaybhee6]

esl... imped drops to 1.5 ohm,, after 8khz,,, which vacuum tube amp can drive this,,,

[@portl]

They really do rock

[@riotact747]

IMHO these are stunningly spectacular for stereo music listening, I would never choose them for home theater though.

[@toyin.dindoinlove9236]

Why? Not hating just asking for perspective.

[@digidrum2003]

@@toyin.dindoinlove9236 I would think it would be listening positions....I enjoy movies with my family and EL speaks have a sweet spot for best sound....I have box speakers for my home theater and EL's for 2ch music.

[@systemawarrior]

Used my Martin Logan source in my home theatre and their accuracy made movies come to life. You hear every little thing they are given in the soundtrack and it creates a more immersive experience.

[@alberttatlock5237]

electrostatics have little bass this is a fact, a hybrid uses a traditional woofer to take care of the bass. remove that and you have a true electrostatic speakers. you cannot change the laws of physics. A purest would say you are just adding a sub to make the electrostatics sound better. i'd say the sub provides most of the sound and the electrostatics provide the lesser high notes, that can easily be sorted by an oil filled horn tweeter for a sound that is just as good but for a fraction of the cost. What you have here is a very expensive designer item so you can show off to friends

[@andershammer9307]

Thats bull. try listening to a pair of Acoustat X speakers like the ones I have. tight deep fast bass thats stunning. I tried a velodyne subwoofer once and all it did was muddy the bass. It didn't add any bass. I was played a record and heard what sounded like a big truck rumbling outside and said to myself no that can't be so I lifted the stylus and played the same part over and heard the same truck. The only reason my electrostatics might sound like no bass is because they don't distort the bass the way conventional speakers do.

[@jfmc2581]

Albert Tatlock , yeah a true electrostatic speakers, it's called a tweeters! They can't even produce midrange without the traditional woofer. Total gimmick, amazing it has lasted so long, but they do look cool :-)

[@robschaller9061]

Horse crap. Go look at Audiogon or any other vibrant community where used gear is sold. ML upper-end speakers hold their value better than anything in that sub 25k range. You almost never see them under 50% of MSRP

[@lunam7249]

yes. i have ESL + big cone woofer...hybrid sounds awesome

[@scottdetter]

I have ML Ascent i’s and have never heard of theses myths.

[@InsideOfMyOwnMind]

My friend had a pair of Sequel IIs. Sure, with the right amp they could rock but they just sounded weird to me. Since then I bought a pair of one-off full range curved panels. Absolutely sweet with a good sub.

[@TheBigMclargehuge]

Elecrostatics, they have no bass!! You can't feel the bass!!

[@rcrinsea]

That’s why MartinLogan builds hybrid speakers, where the woofers handle the bass.

[@stretchwith]

If the speakers are placed properly, and IF you sit in the center, the bass is good- not great.

[@lizichell2]

My esl 63s have loads of bass

[@andershammer9307]

@@lizichell2 My Acoustat X's have TONS of bass and they are 40 years old.

[@martinjandijkstra3205]

I do have the ML odyssey. Impedance gets very low at high freq. This may not harm the amplifier as relatively low power is involved but you may loose output because of the internal resistance of the amplifier. I recommend a powerful amp at low impedance, definately not a simple receiver.

[@Thesassyiscute]

My Aerius 1 still going strong, just clean the panel every 5 years

[@scottrobel2875]

yes thank you for the info

[@master9716]

i heard the Esl's and are the best speakers ive ever heard meaning instruments sound 100% real and loud. i havent heard the B&w Diamond speakers yet but for 1100 a pop you get the sound of 10,00 dollar speakers- althought ive never heard 10000 dollar speakers lol .

[@Gamez4eveR]

3:50. It's true! MLs do get the best out of Megadeth!

[@danielbrowniel]

Nice Commercial! MYTH, This was not a commercial, no one in this video is a paid employee of makers of Electrostatic Speakers

[@18000rpm]

Some of these are misleading at best and deceptive at worst. They definitely need more space than conventional speakers as they are dipoles. And the panels DEFINITELY don’t last as long as conventional drivers especially if you live in a humid environment. And the worst thing is MartinLogan tripled the price of replacement panels in the last few years.

[@hklinker]

I have replaced my stators once in the 18 years I’ve had my Aeons. I live in a place that is very humid for about eight months of the year. If I can get to 25 years before another change, I’ll be happy. And hey, I bought my flat based on size requirements for the speakers.

[@18000rpm]

@@hklinker well 10 years sounds about right, get ready to shell out nearly $2K for new panels from ML soon. They tripled the price from when you last replaced them.

[@hklinker]

That’ll get interesting, cuz I paid a bit more than 2K for the speakers new in 2003.

[@carlosoliveira-rc2xt]

Love the reference to the 40s and 50s. I guess they forgot about the CLS from the mid 80s. Pure marketing BS.

[@nasskhan4543]

I bpught a Quad 63 2 nd hand which sounded great but developed a fault within days. Got my money back dealer was fine. But electrostatics are tempremental & expensive to repair. Shame cos I love the sound.

[@edoardoruggeri1]

Electrostatic loudspeaker have much higher sound quality

[@Blox117]

@Jeust0999 whered you go to hear it.

[@syedrizvi2910]

I just bought the Theo’s let’s see haven’t set up yet

[@lazzer408]

I like flat panel ESLs better. Less reflection. Much less fatigue.

[@TimpBizkit]

Is there any issue with back wave cancellation? Also I noticed the back wave can still reflect off walls and possibly colour the sound?

[@stretchwith]

All the reflections are part of the plan. They must be positioned carefully. I dont care what this video says.

[@michaelledford4751]

I don't enjoy bass heavy music at all so bass isn't really an issue for me , Logan's lack dynamics to my ears even in a properly set up rig in a room where the acoustics have been addressed , I much prefer my McIntosh line arrays over everything I've heard at any price point .

[@donbelongia8019]

to each his own. I have martins properly set up cant find anything better

[@andershammer9307]

There are other electrostatic speakers with better bass and dynamics like the Sound Lab.

[@WhiskyTanuki]

@Hometheaterdoctor may I know what brand and model?:P I am really interested in ESL speakers

[@MichelLinschoten]

ESL and magnetostats are hard to beat on the mid-high range, they just present their own "issues" due to its design/nature. 1 They do NOT last longer than cone speakers, and i can make this a strong point. ESL will attract dust, it is more fragile (slapping the grill was funny) but lets test its fragility where it actually matters. SPL, they will be taxed rather fast and simply cannot produce the levels a cone can and will in comparison. This is and always has been an issue, that's why you guys make the hybrids. 2 They do not use much power? Feel free Martin Logan to explain why there is a 1.0kw per side or so on transformers inside your ESL speakers. You really think that's not measurable on the bill when used daily? Right... 3 They, when used properly last a good bit, but if you ever have to replace the stators? By then you own a "old" model, hence they do not make it anymore or ask you for 2k per side (happend to a friend of mine that informed at Martin Logan) 4 Most spoken and pretty generic well known issue with them? Low responses are there but not on the SPL a cone can, this is the problem imho with music. You need that full dynamic range to entirely enjoy your music, so a good subwoofer (that is fast in response and goes deep) is often costy and a cost you did not bargain for. You can make them sound amazing, but at what cost? I'll stick with my inferior cone configuration if you do not mind Martin Logan..

[@lunam7249]

you present an educated comment....i run and use ELS in hybrid config. along with cones....planar tweets are also wonderful....bass is cones and is 65 pound magnets

[@orangejjay]

@@lunam7249 This is not educated at all. Transformer VOLTAGE does not determine the amount of power used. Power used is based on WATTS and AMPERAGE.

[@lunam7249]

@@orangejjay your correct...but esl do use alotttttt of power watts!!!!

[@mrhoffame]

LOL Good one!!

[@ca77721]

I believe that matching a proper source(amp/receiver) is important.Also i think electrostatic speakers, although have great detail,imaging and clarity.Would also be fatiguing.I guess they are have a sound signature that isn't for everyone.They did sound great from the short demo i heard.I'd rather have electrostatic headphones over speakers.

[@systemawarrior]

I've owned Martin Logan source and they were never fatiguing. Always immersive.

[@gavincurtis]

But the white vans sell MartonLogin at 1/4 the cost :P

[@Neojhun]

Oh god i wish i could justify buying a set of Martin Logans. NOw that i know they don't require special amps give me even more reasons.

[@donbelongia8019]

Not special amps, but good ones

[@paull8627]

Yes he lived, but did he live well? Hmm? Kidding

[@jogmas12]

How do you keep electrostatic speakers free from dust???

[@Chase1297]

jogmas12 I would say just dustoff every so often

[@robschaller9061]

take your vacuum with the hose and curtain brush attachment and vacuum them

[@digidrum2003]

They come with covers when purchased....or use a bed sheet.

[@FingerinUrDaughter]

how about "they cost 1500$ and are literally just a fucking steel mesh with paint. TRUE"?

[@Candleman89]

No, the "Stators" are completely insulated with a layer of polymer. It is possible to make the diaphragm distort but you'd need hi current amp pushing something near 200 watt peaks to do it. It's a lot easier to get similar sized Magnepans to distort because they don't have woofers to handle the lows. Therefore it's really Magnepans that don't handle rock music well, although in my experience Mags have a bigger soundstage and better imaging. Always a tradeoff.

[@nightmarecivic]

@plato147 LOL go listen and own a set they are great!

[@donbelongia8019]

I have a pair of martins and they make phil collins sound good

[@anthonydavis9907]

I have 4 questions do they sound better than Bose are they louder and do they cost more where can I find them cheap????

[@bujoun76]

Yes, yes, and yes! As for cheap. You pay for quality or you can keep your beloved Bose speakers. I can assure you that these electrostatic speakers are far superior. And try to use a little more punctuation in your writing! Please...

[@SwollenBlade]

anthony davis better than Bose lol, that's like comparing a toyota corolla to a rolls royce.

[@donbelongia8019]

I use both, 901 and 200 watts foe video reinforcement and martin logans foe music matched with luxman M 4000 for power, remember that my martins have hybrid base but I add martin sub seems to open up the mid-range

[@robschaller9061]

They destroy Bose and No they are not cheap Used you will find it difficult to get beyond the lower end of mid line

[@lunam7249]

ohhh my friend....you said "bose".....now i have to take a soapy shower!! please dont say that when discussing high quality sound...."bose" is "garbage" and i would NOT let my cat take shit on them!!sell you "bose" on ebay or give them away....buy midrange domes and titanium tweets... big magnet bass...

[@bvagansfan]

Has anyone here thats complaining actually own/owned a pair of these?

[@HansDelbruck53]

Electrostatic speakers are too expensive! Myth?

[@kingofpunk1977]

Your welcome

[@BobSmith-mz1uo]

you're

[@gavinhadley7672]

...uh hold the phone...my Aerius i panels had to be replaced at 12 years. Conventional speakers last longer fellas...sorry. I love MLs don't get me wrong but facts are facts!

[@SwollenBlade]

Gavin Hadley uh the phone is holding, the aerius i was released in 1996. I'm pretty sure there has been some upgrades in the last 2 decades of panel building.

[@thepogue]

My Prodigy panels made it 15 years before they started acting up....and I had them reconditioned (taken apart, cleaned and recoated) for $600...should get another 15 plus...so yes they do need work down the road...but they were over 10K new...so its was an easy call...

[@rcrinsea]

This is MartinLogan.

[@18000rpm]

Tom Mac how did you get them recoated?

[@scottdetter]

Gavin Hadley Had my Ascent i’s over 20 years in my home theater system in a cigarette smoke filled basement. Dusted them twice. Zepplin, Rush & Genesis Rock the house in 2 channel mode.

[@MilkJam212]

Real winners use headphones. Just saying

[@lunam7249]

you mean "stax" .... arent you the "montebank" about town??!!i agree, however, the in car bass#1 , the home theater stereo 4 quad channel is sometimes desirable...i have all 3 types of audio...

[@five5x]

None of the people these actors are protraying would know about these speakers. Let alone afford these speakers. Hell, if these were real people that one lady blew her money on her fabulous mug. I do find it funny ML goes to all this trouble to prove electrostatic speakers are amazing, but still end up using drivers for bass.

[@robschaller9061]

So what? What the fuck does that even matter. You clearly DO NOT PAY ATTENTION. ML are HYBRIDS dumbass

[@systemawarrior]

They are amazing and they are not trying to hide the fact that they are hybrids.

[@raymond9987654321]

sorry if this isn't related to the video, but Why does this video in particular use the HTML5 youtube player instead of the flash player?

[@musicboy30]

The panels don t last much time. Expect 10 years of life and then spend 2000€ for new panels.... For most models!

[@Thin447Line]

I've had mine for 20 years and they still look and sound brand new. Take care of them and they'll last.

[@HostileHST]

@beepoff Exactly what I told my self!

[@isaachy777]

lol at these myths

[@IsmokeTouch]

Sorry but I smoke in my house

[@Thin447Line]

I used to be like you. But like a pompous ass I only smoked premium, expensive cigars. Then it cost me nearly $20,000 on a house sale, so I quit cold turkey. No amount of scrubbing and shampooing could fool anybody who came to view the place. They all knew the second they walked through the door, "This guy is a SMOKER! Isn't he ???" Then they turned right around and walked out. Tobacco is just plain stupid no matter how you slice it.

[@simpox94]

pro tip, just buy a regular speker -___-

[@nightmarecivic]

@bvagansfan I have a pair that is over 12 year old and I love them!

[@Coilaman]

Once you hear a pair of PSB speakers, there is really no need to explore anything else. Hip hop to metal, PSB will show you good time and then some.

[@andershammer7596]

Sure you can use a receiver with electrostatics but they will sound like crap. If you want electrostatics you must use good seperate components. Otherwise its not really worth it.

[@larchpine9802]

bitch, please

[@shedtime_au]

I hear electrostatics are efficient ... MYTH. The average electrostatic has an output of 88dB. I've designed them, I've measured them and I've repaired them. Yes, even Martin Logans. Using a bigger amplifier won't help, they just arc due to air ionization. What this means is that you will NEVER get realistic dynamic range.

[@andershammer9307]

I can get 104 dB seated in my chair with my electrostatic speakers and bass and dynamics is the best I've heard from any system. They may not play as loud as some but they give me a realistic reproduction of a full symphony orchestra.

[@jakegibbons9628]

I cannot find the words to express how much I dislike the expressions and mannerisms of every single person in this video. I almost don't want to give money to the company that created it... but I probably will

[@simonirvine1628]

They can shock small children and pets when you turn them up really really LOUD.... Its true.... ⏏⏹⏺⏪▶⏩⏸

[@borisbulldog]

Not true, the membrane on the panel lasts 12-15 years. My Bose 901s sound great after 40+ years. That being said I own a pair of ESLs