Can the 'MAGNUS MIDTBØ 9c TEST' Reveal Your Biggest Weakness?

ROSS'S CHANNEL: @Ross-Fulkerson
ANNA'S CHANNEL: @AnnaHazelnutt
Test Scores: 40=9c, 39=9b+, 38=9b, 37=9b, 36=9a+, 35=9a+, 34=9a, 33=9a, 32=8c+, 31=8c+, 30=8c, 29=8c, 28=8b+, 27=8b+, 26=8b, 25=8b, 24=8a+, 23=8a+, 22=8a, 21=8a, 20=7c+, 19=7c+, 18=7c, 17=7c, 16=7b+, 15=7b+, 14=7b, 13=7b, 12=7a+, 11=7a+, 10=7a, 9=7a, 8=6c+, 7=6c+, 6=6c, 5=6c, 4=6b, 3=6b, 2=6a, 1=6a
⚡ AFFILIATE STORE: www.hoopersbeta.com/store
👕 Official T-shirts: teespring.com/stores/hoopersbeta
🔗 Links to website, show notes, etc: linktr.ee/hoopersbeta
📧 For business inquiries: [e-mail]
😍 Instagram: @hoopersbetaofficial
SPECIAL HOOPER'S BETA OFFERS & DISCOUNTS:
➡️ 20% off Frictitious hangboard+doorway mount: frictitiousclimbing.com/?ref=...
➡️ Free shipping on any Frictitious product with code "hoopers": frictitiousclimbing.com/?ref=...
➡️ 20% off KAYA PRO (climbing guidebooks, offline mode, gps, beta videos, etc.): app.kayaclimb.com/share/affil...
➡️ $10 off Tindeq Progressor with code "hoopersbeta": shorturl.at/mnxU5
➡️ REI (buy anything to support the channel): bit.ly/43eW9Tk
➡️ The Wall Climbing Gym: Get a Day Pass and Gear for $15 when you mention Hooper's Beta at the front desk: www.thewallclimbinggym.com/
➡️ Mesa Rim North City: Mention "Hooper's Beta" at the front desk for a one-week pass with free gear rental!
➡️ KZbin Memberships: Join the HB fam to get access to various perks, like priority comment responses -- bit.ly/3WVDWaY
OUR SERVICES:
⚕️INJURY & REHAB CONSULTS - JASON (virtual and in-person): www.hoopersbeta.com/private-s...
🧗 CLIMBING COACHING - DAN (virtual and in-person): [e-mail] or testpiececlimbing.com/schedul...
🎥 VIDEO SERVICES - EMILE (videography for KZbin, climbing videos, Instagram, etc.): email [e-mail]
WHO ARE WE?
Hooper's Beta is a passion project, started by Emile Modesitt and Jason Hooper. Help us create the Largest Library of Free Training and Recovery Videos for Climbers by subscribing, sharing, and shopping with the affiliate links below!
// TIMESTAMPS //
00:00 Context
00:51 Warm-Up and Ross's Advice
01:43 Test 1 - Ultimate Finger Strength Test?
06:51 Test 2 - Ultimate Pullup Test?
10:53 Test 3 - Ultimate Core Strength Test?
13:44 Test 4 - Ultimate Endurance Test?
18:21 Results - Is the Test Accurate?
19:15 Key Takeaways and Conclusions
// SHOW NOTES //
Episode 120
www.hoopersbeta.com/library/c...
// DISCLAIMER //
As always, exercises and rehab programs are to be performed assuming your own risk and should not be done if you feel you are at risk for injury. See a medical professional if you have concerns before starting a new training or recovery program.
// SPECIAL THANKS //
The Wall Climbing Gym. Check them out at: www.thewallclimbinggym.com/
// PRODUCERS //
Written and Produced by Jason Hooper and Emile Modesitt
#trainclimbsendrepeat #climbingtraining #doctorofphysicaltherapy

[@HoopersBeta]

What do you think your biggest limiting factor is? How do you know? --> According to this test, mine is endurance lol. But if you watch the vid you'll know why that's probably not accurate. ----> Be sure to check out Ross's and Anna's channels for ultimate climbing stoke! (Links in description.) -------> The original test was designed to give you a french route climbing grade (6a, 7b, 8a+, etc.). We converted these to V-grades since many of us are boulderers, but the conversion will never be perfect nor was the test designed to give you a bouldering score. Special thanks to Martin Mobråten & Stian Christophersen for creating this "9c Test" so we can all participate, discuss, and learn from it! Check out their book "The Climbing Bible" if you want to learn more from them (both very strong climbers and coaches). The original 9c Test on Magnus's channel: kzbin.info/www/bejne/i4Clc2etoLmXrrM

[@dario2691]

Tekkers

[@fane7965]

As a 3 month professional V0-V1 climber, I think my leg strength is my weakness. My posterior chain is also weak and my hip flexors are a mess. Thanks office work 👍!

[@paulgaras2606]

I know! My pulleys! Thanks to your content I avoided a pretty nasty injury last week, I felt myself starting to slip and I had to choose if I was gonna pull harder and send or bail. it was like a litter hooper with a harp was on my shoulder telling me to bail. My ring A2 is Sore as hell but healing fast.

[@petergbeal]

re: bar hang/pullup. There are bars and there are bars. The width makes a huge difference relative to hand size and any texture added to a metal bar changes its usability in both hang and the pullup. I think it's probably better in terms of sport specificity and more consistent in predictive capacity to stick with a 20mm edge for all the exercises. The problem of course is that all the 20mm edges out there are different, rendering any stated measurement useless. Standardizing that would be a huge step in validating assessment protocols for climbing training. Good video and yes, Aleena's finger strength is definitely in the V7 range.

[@AnnaHazelnutt]

Thanks for having me!!! Always so fun collabing with y'all! The quality of these edits + how your videos are always packed with applicable training information *chefs kiss* just fabulous

[@HoopersBeta]

Wouldn't have been the same without your psych and humor! Crystal chips ftw!!

[@vegiimite]

I always love you as a guest on other people's channel. Please keep sharing your time with them and keep having fun.

[@2009ASGJPJ]

hello. Just a quick question about the rung used in your first test (shown in the video) was that on the lattice rung? because I can also significantly hang so much less on the lattice rung...

[@boulderup9c]

The pullup does need to be a legitimate pullup. In the 9c video with Magnus and Stian and Martin, they mention "no kipping," but that does not mean "anything else goes." It has to be a good form pullup, and that is well-defined outside of the test. Also, I think there's a huge bouldering benefit for increasing hang endurance, especially for beginners like me, because with longer routes sometimes that is the only limiting factor. I've improved my hang endurance and it correlates closely with success on longer routes. Great video! Very informative!

[@ShannonMcCraryH]

I think the test is surprisingly accurate. The deviation on the lower end of the chart is due to the difference between current physical potential vs personal experience and skill.

[@timmyo92]

Damn Ross is a freaking beast with his 10 minutes that's insane! Good on you bro

[@yogaforclimberswithievaluna]

17:02 'how long you can force yourself to keep trying hard when it feels miserable' 🙌🏾💪🏽

[@HoopersBeta]

Such an important aspect in climbing! One I could certainly work more on.

[@MiguelClimbs]

Too much good info in this episode. Shoutout to the pros and Aleena in this episode too. Jason, you need to climb harder 😂

[@HoopersBeta]

😅 agreed!! Time to buy a van and camp out at the crag until I send V11.

[@MichaelFairhurst]

It's always time to buy a van and camp at a van until you can climb V11. Even if, no, especially if, you can already climb V11...

[@iancowley7799]

Three of my favorite climbing youtubers! The collab I didn't know I needed, didn't see coming but now definitely want more of ;) Thanks for all of the delicious climbing related info you put out in the world

[@HoopersBeta]

Thanks for the support!!

[@noone-ld7pt]

Amazing breakdown of this test! I've found it useful to do it along with some mobility tests regularly to track progress, and it's really nice to hear you confirm my thoughts about it's limitation. Also, Train to get better at climbing, not to get better at tests is really good advice that I definetely needed to hear. I might have focused my training a bit to much on improving benchmarks when I probably should've focused more on actual climbing! Thanks so much for making this!

[@HoopersBeta]

Glad you enjoyed it! And I love that you found that point particularly helpful! We all love to see progress, especially when it is measurable, so it makes sense that we can get too focused in on these sorts of measurements (especially if we are no longer jumping grades in climbing lol).

[@fabiopalma4429]

I'm in the process of devouring your entire videos! You guys are the best

[@slavadabadoo]

Looooved this video! So much great knowledge and insight and of course great guest cameos!

[@HoopersBeta]

Awesome, glad to hear it!!

[@slapthesloper]

Super cool having Ross and Anna on here hope you guys made more videos together

[@HoopersBeta]

Agreed, it was very fun working with them both!

[@thewateringwiz7118]

It’s so good to see Ross here ! Love his channel and have been following him for a while. Anna is awesome as usual !

[@HoopersBeta]

Yeah! It was a super fun video to make. They are both awesome.

[@Ogameshed]

You guys should do the lattice tests that you mentioned, curious about the results!

[@HoopersBeta]

Yeah that would be fun/interesting!

[@richardbradley1532]

I was going to suggest Lattice.

[@terraflow__bryanburdo4547]

I have been sing similar testing for decades (currently5.13+ age 66). 90+% of by use of the bar for testing (and especially training) is using a three-finger drag open grip, which I find translates MUCH better to climbing finger strength-endurance. For core I use some unique dynamic exercises which I would have to use video to describe, but are very quantifiable and transferable especially to the steep overhangs of my projects. The upside of using a systematic approach is that I have climbed 5.13 for over 30 years with zero injuries.

[@toddgreen6862]

I never understood why they didn't progress from the L-sit to front lever progressions (knees bent, one knee bent, straddle). As you mentioned, the jump from an L-sit for 20 secs to a full front lever for 5 seconds is *massive*. Granted it might be difficult to squeeze everything into 10 points, but I'd drop/combine some of the easier ones rather than the hard ones.

[@HoopersBeta]

Yeah that could be a more logical progression! The knee tuck front lever is fairly approachable so starting there and going through the progressions you mentioned may make more sense. But regardless, a hard component to accurately assess!

[@Aaron-th7xx]

Also, given how simple the test is, I'm quite impressed with how accurate it was for all four of you.

[@EmileModesitt]

Pretty accurate for Ross and Anna, not so much for Jason and Aleena

[@Aaron-th7xx]

@@EmileModesitt True. I think Jason's result is still relatively close. And since Aleena is a novice climber but has a good athletic base, it's not surprising that her actual climbing grade would be lower than her strength grade.

[@HoopersBeta]

If Jason's neural tension hadn't numbed out his arms on the endurance test he probably would have gotten within 1-2 points of Ross 😂 -Emile

[@oleshikaru]

Great video! Anna is always great too! im trying my best to improve on my climbing and using your videos as a rough guide some times. Ill get that "official" 7A soon. im so close!

[@HoopersBeta]

Thanks for sharing! Hoping you get your official 7A soon :) Be patient and enjoy the process/journey.

[@nicolascarmel4130]

Hey @HooperBeta Thanks so much for your video you guy's are incredible unique content! What do you think about a video on gaston and it's biomechanics. I struggle to ingage my back and shoulder properly and I think other's have the same problem. Thank you love your work!

[@georgealexanderp]

More Dan! Awesome vid as well.

[@HoopersBeta]

Comin up!

[@austinbentley4604]

I use this test every few months just as a general progress tracker. Its nice to know that your training is paying off or that it's not and its possible you need to revaluate your training regiment

[@grantmoser5393]

Great video like always

[@HoopersBeta]

Thank you!

[@conorsexton5777]

Hey Hooper's Beta, I noticed on the wall next to the pull-up bar there's a infographic on perfect pullups. I would to post something like that on our gym. Would there be a pdf of resources like that?

[@jonkrause6714]

Mental. I’ve lost weight, gained weight back-strength is basically the same. I periodically do these tests, but I’ve noticed my technique has gotten better-hence even my first V5-V7 here at The Wall yesterday (Sunday) in midst of 7 hour session. Great video and education of things to continue to try and learn. 🙏

[@HoopersBeta]

Congrats on the improved technique and sending your first 5-7! That's awesome. Your 7 hour session reminds me of something I talk to people about with climbing trips. Sometimes people are surprised that they are sending their projects 3 days into the trip when they couldn't on the first day. It's not that you magically got 5% stronger (necessarily) and that was all you need to send. But rather, it's usually improvement in technique (or strategy) that unlocks it.

[@jonkrause6714]

@@HoopersBeta Thank you for the kudos and encouraging response. It was definitely a great mental day as I bought two pieces of beautiful art from @dicksonjanda. The expressive art at the start of my session really calmed my mind, coupled with some awesome fails-led to just having fun and getting on the V5-V7.

[@japapatramtara]

I am super surprised how 6a climber could handle 140% BW on 20mm edge. With such power she really must climb around 7b+ or something. I climb for ten years or so and still cant hang on 20mm at all. Not even one second and still able to send 7a/V5 OS/flash. And fun fact is that I always thought that finger strength is my strong side :-)

[@HoopersBeta]

Perhaps because she is newer she hasn't develop the necessary technique to climb at that level, despite having good strength :) If anything I feel that's what that test has helped highlight, for myself as well!

[@dglasti833]

The flowing warm up looks interesting, is there more detail about it?

[@TheEndorphene]

Would love to see you do a lattice test or comment on the test itself, theirs is much more comprehensive and science based. I believe Anna has done one?

[@phsopher]

6:00 Very interesting placement of a huge upward pointing spike right where a falling person't head would be.

[@HoopersBeta]

Definitely not intended Beta! We should have cleared the space out a bit more. There was a lot of testing going on and we were using two different pins (the pointing spike you're referring to) and didn't expect the fall backwards. But regardless, you're not wrong, we should be careful and pay close attention to our environment.

[@jonathanrossddsmhs1271]

10 minutes is sick! Way to go Ross.

[@HoopersBeta]

Wonder how long he actually could have gone 🤔

[@Ross-Fulkerson]

Thanks man! It was a struggle at the end hahah

[@kristianrother]

@@HoopersBeta For comparison to another pro who's doing more routes instead of bouldering, Pete from the Wide Boys recently did a challenge against 7 guys from Storror (Pete vs. 7 they rotated in when someone dropped off). I won't spoil the results but I was impressed with everyone in that video. They did it over a cold river so maybe that pushes you to go a bit harder ;) @Ross great fight. 10 minutes seem absolutely insane to me.

[@Helalbrig]

Pete could change the grip, so even though the conditions where way rougher, Ross’es 10 min hang here was harder in comparison imo

[@henning_jasper]

I think my actual limiting factor at the moment, this might sound stupid, is not projecting harder Boulders. I'm still mostly doing and trying 7a/+, maybe 7b once in a while but never 7c or 8a and I think that is a big mistake. If I would try those the whole time I'm sure I would come along a 7c/8a that I could actually send. I should try this test and see where I would rank 😄 nice video, really enjoyed it!

[@EkoBiohazard]

Wait, wait, wait, did Ross really hung for 10 whole minutes!!?? I already thought the 5 min from Anna were incredible but he doubled that?? I'm just impressed, these climbers are strong af, physically and mentally!

[@driesvanoosten4417]

Pete Whittaker hung for more that 24 minutes in a recent storror video. The man is crazy...

[@EkoBiohazard]

@@driesvanoosten4417 well, you're right, the guy is just from another planet!

[@HoopersBeta]

In that video he was allowed to shake out, which makes it much easier. However Pete has a video on his personal channel showing him do it without shaking for 20 minutes! So cool!!

[@marc5279]

i dont think the one pull-up test pretends to evaluate what would be an applicable climbing skill, but rather is a good exercise to reveal the potential to make other individual moves thanks to your strength. Keeping in mind someone who hasn't trained especifically for one rep pull-ups, the score they get through this test will generally correlate with how strong they are in other parts of their body aswell. So this test allows to predict how hard they might be capable to squeeze, lock off, pull/hold their weigth through different positions, and such... or at least what's to expect more or less about them. The fact that is about one rep, and not more, i think makes sense because (when climbing and at least in the movement department, not grip positions) one rarely does 2 or more consecutive moves that are almost alike. So, leaving all the other capabilities aside, out of a climber that can casually pull-up 200% bw, you'll expect a lot more potential to do hard physicall moves that involve whatever parts of the body, generally, than out of a climber who can only pull 125%, even if the climb they will compete on has no move that resembles a pullup. It's not about how usefull the pull-up is, but about what the pull-up indicates about your general strength, if that makes sense. So if you don't do well in this test, you don't need to train one rep pull-ups, but rather train general strength in all types of movements, because that's what this test indicates is holding you back. That's my take :)

[@matemindak384]

12:47 That was funny as hell "honestly I haven't done a core workout in .... *shameful pause* .... years."

[@whelmking6497]

Great vid. This test is kinda magic.. it seems like surely it can't be accurate, but I know many many people who've taken it and it is shockingly accurate (within 1-2 V grade or 1/2 YDS grade). It's way less accurate for new climbers or at lower numbers, as shown by Aleena's results.

[@gaajeshoek215]

In Magnus video at 29:18 he explains why its less accurate for new climbers. With perfect technique they should be able to climb at that lvl based on their strength. Might take a while for a new climber to reach those levels of technique. For pro climbers with (near)perfect technique stamina and strength is more the limiting factor.

[@phsopher]

I think the front lever is a very a logical progression from L-sit in terms of climbing applicability. Yes, they use different muscles but that's beside the point. The test basically simulates reaching foot holds on an overhang. If the overhang is not very steep then you can reach high footholds with an L-sit motion while on a more steep overhang with foot holds that are farther away you need more of a front lever to reach them in a controlled manner.

[@HoopersBeta]

Not sure how that's 'beside the point'. The muscles used should remain somewhat consistent and I'm not sure that you're correct either in stating "the test basically simulates reaching foot holds" because... 1) why do you need to simulate reaching footholds as a huge measure of climbing skill and 2), keeping tension on footholds on overhangs would not involve the anterior chain like the L-sit does but rather involves the posterior chain. Also, the leap from an L-Sit to a front lever is quite a large change for "1 extra point".

[@phsopher]

@@HoopersBeta Because reaching footholds is one part of climbing? Why do you need to hang from a bar as a huge measure of climbing skill? Or doing a weighted pullup? To me it seems the core part is as good as some of the other measures if not better in terms being climbing-specific and the progression seems logical in terms of measuring increasing difficulty of overhang climbing. On the issue of the size of the jump from L-sit to front lever, I'm inclined to agree. I think it would make more sense have a more gradual scale like L-sit -> tuck lever - one leg lever -> full lever or something.

[@HoopersBeta]

If the test was labeled as "how far of a foot hold can you reach from a hanging position and then how long can you maintain that position without actually using said foothold" then the progression to a front lever makes a bit more sense (despite the huge jump in difficulty as you mention, and the fact that holding a 30 second front lever reaches far outside the scope of a test like that IMO). But the test is actually called "core strength test," in which case the front lever suddenly makes a lot less sense (as we discuss in the video). So perhaps they mislabeled the test (on purpose or by accident -- who knows?) and meant it more as a measure of what you suggest, but it's hard to say for sure! Considering their main focus seems to have been to create a super simple test for anyone to do, it would be understandable if they didn't give it *that* much consideration as to what exactly the test is meant to tell you. Just another reason it's important to be knowledgeable of the pros and cons of tests like these, and to know what you're actually testing. -Emile

[@MichaelFairhurst]

@@phsopher the front lever resembles a climbing movement in the same way that the human flag does. Which is to say, basically it is a rare movement at best. It looks like a climbing movement, but once your toes actually touch the foothold, your glutes and hamstrings and calves all play a huge role, none of those muscles are tested in a front lever. The main thing tested by a front lever is how strong the lats are when at the absolute end of their range motion. Basically, if your arms are at a 90° angle from your shoulders then your feet will be too heavy. This is why a good form front lever means having arms at about 30°: it moves your chest to be a counterweight for your legs and feet. But two things make this hard; one is that the weight of your toes has a lot of leverage on your lats. And the other is that your lats are, when at this 30 ish degree mark, very weak. A saggy front lever makes both of these factors easier and a bent knees lever only makes the first factor easier. What this means is that the front lever is a terrible terrible terrible approximation of climbing core engagement compared to steep climbing with footholds. For one thing your calves and hamstrings and glutes take weight off of this long lever arm -- lots of weight --, making it closer to a tucked lever than a full front lever. But also, even if you did need to use your shoulders to lift your butt, you would almost certainly be doing so with your arms in a much stronger position, probably much closer to 90°. So front levering. Does it mirror a dynamic swing to bring your feet up to a far foothold? Yeah, I guess. Is it important in climbing to be able to hold that swing at its peak for 20sec? Um....nope, obviously not, lol. Is it measuring "core strength" in any other climbing context? The answer here is basically a no, not least of all because it's hardly testing your core strength at all.

[@xinsanedefeatx]

As a novice climber, I imagine this could be a decent metric to track progress and identify a weak point, but likely isn't the most accurate predictor of current ability (tho from my understanding it's supposed to be a predictor of potential, not actual ability anyways) I also imagine it's probably more useful the less skilled you are since as your skill level increases you can find ways to work with/around your weaknesses better

[@felixthiele3610]

Hi Hooper! I noticed your comment about neural tightness when doing the hang test on the bar. I tried it when it first came out and I can only do 30sec or so before the tingling becomes unbearable, even though my climbing grade would suggest several minutes. Generally, my limbs fall asleep quite quickly. Do you have any tips or exercises to reduce this neural tightness?

[@HoopersBeta]

Yeah! Two videos in fact. One that's just about nerve tension, the other specifically about the ulnar nerve. kzbin.info/www/bejne/l4bNZpmtga9oY9U kzbin.info/www/bejne/gmGodHuKnMhniq8

[@carlesmolins3269]

“Novice climber”, grade 6c…. Man where do I land then? 😅

[@HoopersBeta]

She strong! 💪 😀

[@davidtorres8396]

I thought this was a sport climbing test? 9a is a v17 boulder. Are sport climbing to boulder grade conversions accurate? I find that among my partners most of us are much better at one than the other. And stefano ghisolfi for example climbs 9b+(5.15c) but doesn’t boulder 8c+/v16

[@HoopersBeta]

Conversions between grades will inevitably introduce some level of subjectivity/error. This test uses the French grading system, where 9c (french route grade) is approximately 5.15d (YDS grade). Converting those values to bouldering grades will definitely not be perfect, but probably close enough to still be useful

[@smockytubers1188]

I wonder if Test 4 would show anything different or be more precise if the subject was allowed to adjust their grip and move to a single arm and back, only ending the test when they touch the ground. I'd guess this is actually more applicable to long sport climb endurance. Maybe they just don't want that part of the test to take a half hour, or way longer for some of the best climbers out there.

[@HoopersBeta]

lol that's true, maybe the lack of adjustment was for that exact reason! I know that would have helped me a lot if I could have lowered one arm for a second or two.

[@aidenwalk1118]

I’m surprised there isn’t a test for balance in the legs or something. Like tight rope walking, max time dragon squat holds, off set weighted deficit box pistol squats etc. something that is very applicable.

[@ChaoticRain1]

Aleena is really strong for a non-climber! what other sports does she do cause shes obviously athletic!

[@rando5673]

A better core strength test is using an ab wheel at full extension in a hollow body hold for time

[@richardbradley1532]

Interesting and amusing

[@samt73]

Projecting V3s but only on big holds - hangs 140% bodyweight on the fingerboard. Might be time to try some harder crystal chip climbs!

[@HoopersBeta]

Haha indeed!

[@maizalima2493]

I feel called out. I can pull up with 80 lbs when I’m strong and can campus routes but can’t crimp for shit. I told my coach my fingers are weak, she doesn’t believe me because she’s seen me cut feet on smallish holds and stay. But I really believe that my shoulders are what holds me on the wall

[@HoopersBeta]

Keep in mind that grip positions on the wall can vary a lot, so a finger strength test on one edge using one type of grip may not be a very good indicator of your actual finger strength in practice. Some people are much stronger in a 3 finger drag or a half crimp or a full crimp or some pinch hybrid, so to really get a feel for your finger strength it helps to test out which holds feel best to you. Then again, I'd be highly suspect of any climbing coaches decision to not recommend any finger strengthening whatsoever. -Emile

[@TheSubieFan]

ROSS AND ANNA OMG THATS CRAZY

[@HoopersBeta]

Two wonderful people.

[@vagabondwastrel2361]

With more data points yes.

[@cedricstalder4320]

I have a question maybe you could answer. I always do pull-ups from completely stretched arms. For the regular pull-ups this works really well. Im also able to still do it quite clean with 160% bw. As soon as i try an L sit pull-up, the first few centimeters feel incredibly hard, and im not able to do it clean. Do you know if im lacking in strength of this muscle or is it normal to feel this much harder? And thanks for the video. It was a really enjoyable mix between entertainment and learning :)

[@HoopersBeta]

The L-sit pull up changes your center of gravity and thus changes the initiation point which places emphasis on different muscles and yes, definitely makes it harder at (especially at the bottom for most people!)

[@martinstuvland8620]

I'd recommend try training "gymnastics pull-ups". They focus on locking off all your joints in the body, so as little force as possible gets lost in pendulum movements. It's much harder, but also more effective for strength. Basically forming a long C from the tip of your grip to the tip of your feet.

[@9000nin]

Endurance hangs is how I injured my fingers twice (tenosynovitis) x.X

[@suki355]

Ross and anna? Nice

[@HoopersBeta]

Great people! Was super fun working with them both.

[@timsoft3]

i'm surprised you don't have a link to the magnus vid (test) that is refered too, but a nice balanced critique of it anyway. 🙂

[@HoopersBeta]

It’s in the pinned comment 🤙

[@leoingson]

More Aleena (and Anna, Ross)!

[@gmelliot19]

Front levers are much more challenging for the abs than suggested in the video. Why? It might seem that front levers are strongly biased towards the lats over the abs because the external shoulder flexion moment is much greater than the external trunk extension moment. Basically, the lats are much further from the center of mass than the abs. But this doesn’t take into account internal resistance. The lower lats connect to the pelvis, making the lat actually work as a pretty strong trunk extensor. The abs have to work to resist the force of the lats at the hip so the lats can work at the shoulder. This means the more force the lats are producing the stronger the abs have to work.

[@jessebclimbs]

I would never have guessed that your level is V8. I would have thought V10/V11 based on what your finger and pull strength from this test alone. I'm curious about three things: 1.) Is your self reported V8 a consistent grade, or top grade? Indoor/Outdoor? 2.) How long have you been climbing? 3.) How long is your longest project? I've noticed that a lot of climbers that tend to have pulling and finger strength scores that don't match their level, generally are either underreporting their ability, have not been climbing for a very long time, or have never put more than a few sessions into a route/boulder and thus their reported grade is not representative of what they could do if the were to camp out under a boulder that suited their style perfectly for a dozen sessions.

[@steffen1461]

Is there a link with # points next to the grade level. The graph doesnt help much if it jumps from V3 to V8 with no points listed other than 1 and 40.

[@HoopersBeta]

Available in a chart in the show notes here: www.hoopersbeta.com/library/can-the-ultimate-climbing-test-really-reveal-your-biggest-weakness But for quick reference: 40=9c, 39=9b+, 38=9b, 37=9b, 36=9a+, 35=9a+, 34=9a, 33=9a, 32=8c+, 31=8c+, 30=8c, 29=8c, 28=8b+, 27=8b+, 26=8b, 25=8b, 24=8a+, 23=8a+, 22=8a, 21=8a, 20=7c+, 19=7c+, 18=7c, 17=7c, 16=7b+, 15=7b+, 14=7b, 13=7b, 12=7a+, 11=7a+, 10=7a, 9=7a, 8=6c+, 7=6c+, 6=6c, 5=6c, 4=6b, 3=6b, 2=6a, 1=6a

[@steffen1461]

@@HoopersBeta Awesome, thank you so much!

[@timmayer8041]

Keep in mind there's a difference between being physically capable and technically capable

[@stroob3734]

10 mins hang is insane how the hell

[@atherismagic4639]

Aren't the font grade conversions at the end wrong? Like isn't 8b supposed to be V13 or so, not V9/10?

[@HoopersBeta]

The test doesn’t give you font bouldering (upper case letters, like 7A, 8B, etc) grades, it gives you a French route grade (lower case letters (7a, 8b…). But since many of us are boulderers we wanted to include V grades as well. It’s impossible to perfectly convert between the two grading systems and the test was never designed to give you a bouldering grade, but we still think it’s a useful metric. -Emile

[@atherismagic4639]

@@HoopersBeta I had no idea! I never realised the capitalisation was different between boulder and route grades, so this is useful information. Thanks!

[@NicolasJulioFlores]

Doing the hangs on the campus rung, which is at a slight angle but with a slight incut usually, instead of the 20mm edge on the hangboard yall had behind you was certainly a decision.

[@HoopersBeta]

We wanted to do it the same way Magnus did the test in his original video

[@tiagula]

5:57 I was a little afraid of impalement/injury here. 😱

[@michaelblake9948]

I interesting how they use the front lever as a core test as it’s more lat/ mid back dominant.

[@HoopersBeta]

Yeah quite dominant on the lat and mid back.

[@calvintse274]

Does anyone know how he’s converting European grades (eg 8b) to V grades? I thought 7C+ was V10 but in the video he says 8b is V9/V10

[@crimpchimp]

7C+ is font bouldering scale, equal to V10. But 7c+ with a small letter c is the French sport climbing scale, equal to 5.12d yds. The test originally referred to sport climbing grades. Converting from French sport grade to bouldering grade won't be precise, as they pointed out below somewhere.

[@HoopersBeta]

We converted the french route grades (which is what the test is originally designed to give you) to bouldering v grades, which will never be a perfect conversion but can still be useful.

[@Sceadusawol]

You should watch Storror's recent collaboration with Pete Whittaker (of Wide Boyz). It's a hang challenge.

[@HoopersBeta]

Unfortunately not quite the same as they were allowed to shake out and hang one handed, which makes it much easier. Still a super fun video though!

[@Randomize12345666]

The first thing my mind went to is calculating y'alls body weights with the added body weights numbers and percents, which is maybe kinda weird but perhaps because I'm kind of heavy 88 kg climber, climbing for 7 years now. In kinda jealous of light body types

[@HoopersBeta]

Heavier climbers can still crush! Jimmy Webb, Jon Glassberg, etc.

[@paulgaras2606]

“ why don’t you campus that?” “You do it in a 15kilo weighted vest Manlet” The 85+ club knows

[@Randomize12345666]

@@HoopersBeta yeah, crush joints and tear ligments on any move that has me stopping my body's mass inertia in a swing

[@alvaroc6326]

Most people I've seen taking the test banana arch their backs immediately on the front lever making them invalid from a calisthenics point of view, it's pretty hard to make it perfect. Also the lattice guys do the max pull up on a 2 rep so you can't cheat it. At least for bouldering I'd add a campus testing and if possible one arm crimp tests.

[@HoopersBeta]

Sooo hard to perfect! 2 reps is good. I wonder if even more (3-5?) would be better. The "power slap" campus test is definitely a good one!

[@Nzalucky]

i took the test over the summer with one of my friends and i got a score of 25. my highest outside grade is v7 and indoor v8 so i guess i need better technique but i already knew that lol.

[@HoopersBeta]

Lol yeah still helps to have confirmation that it's technique you need to focus on!

[@Mike-oz4cv]

Or you lack flexibility (which is closely related to technique). Or maybe you are afraid of falling.

[@Nzalucky]

@@Mike-oz4cv my flexibility is decent but my mobility is really good. ive only been climing for just 2 years now so hopefully the technique will come with time

[@peterjames7509]

that casual 10min hang is insane wtf

[@HoopersBeta]

So casual, and with no grip adjustments!

[@AntoAparicio]

I'm pretty curious about if you guys could do one arm pull ups. I think you shouldn't have any problem with so much pulling strength!

[@HoopersBeta]

Jason can indeed do a one arm pullup. Not sure about Ross but I’d bet he can. -Emile

[@travisladuke9662]

What the heck?? I can't hang off of the 20mm thing at the climbing gym at all. even with no weight. I climb v4s there reliably! Maybe it's less than 20mm? It sure looks like the same campus board that's in every gym in a video. Yes I avoid the crystal chips boulders.

[@HoopersBeta]

Interesting! Maybe you just have good technique / use your feet really well and that's why you're able to? Or maybe you have good upper body strength but haven't yet developed the finger strength for smaller holds?

[@LoveAndClimbing]

10:33 "It might weigh on your conscience is all." How much weight can your conscience handle? 140% of body weight? How many points is that?

[@HoopersBeta]

Haha well... I'd say it weighs around 10% because 180% felt fairly easy whereas 200% was obviously a challenge :)

[@LoveAndClimbing]

@@HoopersBeta In your expert opinion, do you think having a strong conscience is applicable to climbing?

[@hahne9]

To be fair, the Lattice rung she did the test on before is way harder to hang on than the rung in the video. It is way more rounded.

[@HoopersBeta]

Perhaps! She is definitely stronger than the first test though

[@mariosconstantinou8271]

I am trying to find info / videos about the famous "Elvis Leg" during climb. Basically why it happens and how to prevent it! It would be nice to have this info from an actual doctor (future video maybe?)

[@HoopersBeta]

Good idea! Will add it to the list.

[@chadvolk962]

If Ross doesn't do weighted hangs or weighted pull-ups in training for comps or climbing, what is he doing to have such strong fingers and back on these tests?

[@crimpchimp]

Maybe the answer's on his channel ;)

[@Ross-Fulkerson]

I've done some weighted hanging but never with more than 80ish pounds. Mostly just lots of climbing and body weight hangs in my warm up.

[@janjan8752]

nice video

[@HoopersBeta]

Thank you!

[@etiennepagex1756]

data never lies

[@jipe4153]

Whats the angle of the 20mm edge?

[@HoopersBeta]

Should be flat ideally. Not sure why Magnus did his test on the campus board, but we wanted to do it the same way he did. The middle campus rung is probably a bit bigger than 20mm but 🤷‍♂️

[@jipe4153]

@@HoopersBeta yeah it looks harder on a slanted 20mm edge.

[@jamesearp6896]

I love Magnus!!

[@Iam0pti]

It was mentioned in the original video that "Magnus: I guess that was kind of the point of this test, that anyone can try it. Stian(Trainer guy): Yes". It seems like it was more of a benchmarking tool, seeing they also mentioned that the depth of the rung you used for the finger strength test is/was not standardized, but rather said that it was only important to personally do the test on the same depth/size each time you do the test

[@HoopersBeta]

They did a great job making it approachable for anyone to try! We think it's also important to know a little bit more about how each test works so you can use them to your advantage rather potentially making poor training decisions from misunderstanding them (like thinking you need to do a bunch of core training because you can't do a 30 second front lever). -Emile

[@andrewadams530]

Holy Ross hanging for 10 minutes, what an actual GigaChad

[@davidhelman3045]

Also this test doesn't work well for people who have a long calisthenics background but not a long climbing background, I scored a 30 but can only climb v7, but I can do one arm pullups, front levers for more than 10 seconds ect, but my climbing technique is far lower than my physical capabilities

[@HoopersBeta]

Fair point! But, in a sense it.... does work well? Lol. By that I mean it supports something you probably already knew, that technique is your issue and not your physical capabilities.

[@clown5911]

I Can't believe Pete from the Wideboyz did the dead hang for 20 minutes, what an absolute madman...

[@HoopersBeta]

In the Storror video? It's certainly impressive, but he was allowed to shake out and hang from one hang as much as he needed to, which makes the test far easier. As Magnus said in his original 9c video, "with shaking it's very easy; I can hang for 15 minutes easily"

[@vanmanivan]

@@HoopersBeta When he did this same test (without shakeouts) he hung for 20 minutes. Accidentally set an unofficial world record. Insane grit.

[@Aaron-th7xx]

Insane that Pete Whittaker did the max hang for 20 min.

[@HoopersBeta]

Right? Insane!

[@stefanwossner2007]

Yes, out-hanging the full Storror team (they hung one after the other, Pete in one go)!

[@terraflow__bryanburdo4547]

Pete is a freak. His current parkours videos are incredible.

[@SonnyKnutson]

He did get to shake out tho. If it was both hands on the bar with no shakes. He wouldn't last that long. But still long for sure xD

[@terraflow__bryanburdo4547]

@@SonnyKnutson Allowing hand movement is more relevant to climbing. When I am doing a long shake out I am constantly moving my hands. I NEVER just hang statically. As an aside, I should set up a kneebar trainer to strengthen and test my kneebar ability :)

[@arnejeder840]

my biggest limiting factor is weight, core strength and practice time, yet i wonder why leg strength is a complete non-factor after 6a? i have been casually bodybuilding before picking up climbing and my leg development allowed to skip a lot of beginner grades. i am tall and heavy (198cm, 105kg) so my climbing journey will probably differ a lot from the average beginner to intermediate.

[@HoopersBeta]

I'd question your claim about core strength, especially if you have any sort of athletic background :). "Body tension" (e.g. not cutting feet) is not as much a function of core strength as newer climbers tend to believe. If I had to guess I'd say 1. finger strength and 2. technique are going to be your main limiting factors, but of course there will be variation from person to person. Leg strength is rarely a limiter in climbing as long as you meet a basic threshold of strength/mobility (e.g. Are your hamstrings strong enough to not get injured during heel hooks? Do you have the hip mobility to hike your feet up by your waist while maintain abduction? Do you have the glute and quad strength to press out of a high step position? etc). Many people achieve that fairly easily, though, sometimes just from climbing, whereas the fingers, shoulders, and back require a far higher level of conditioning for climbing that doesn't always come from "just climbing." Best of luck on your climbing journey!! -Emile

[@arnejeder840]

@@HoopersBeta thank you for this massive answer! :) the leg strength part is now much clearer to me. In my head, I included technique in practice time, so your guesses are most certainly spot on. unfortunately I brute-forced finger strength too much, so I have to be more patient with that. and i am already focusing on technique more and will keep the body tension topic in mind!

[@craigbritton1089]

The ability to transfer weight force to the legs/ footholds instead of the fingers/arms/ shoulders can dramatically increase the time you have to make a move; and how much power/ endurance you have for the next move. I remember a decades old article in The NEJM that said on isometrics you lose about one percent of strength per second; so getting an extra ten pounds of weight transferred to your legs will give you several more seconds on each hold. And if you initiate movement with the legs; that also gives one more time and less force/ power needed in the fingers.

[@jackbrown8052]

Just to be able to attempt the MAGNUS MIDTBØ 9c TEST judging by the fitness of the test subjects and the tests themselves one would have to be slim, young and strong. To put it simply no old, fat and lethargic people would be successful at testing.

[@qweasd9153]

the front lever test seems to be actually insane, it is impossible to name one hard boulder or route that requires the climber to assume a front lever position for more than 5s. Core strenght in climbing is almost always connected with posterior chain and shoulder strength.

[@HoopersBeta]

Thanks for chiming in! To be fair, front lever strength is very useful for climbing and strength tests and exercises don't need to perfectly replicate climbing to be useful. We never need to do a pullup with 100 pounds attached to us while we're climbing, but it can still be useful to know our 1-rep-max on a bar. Similarly, we don't need to do 5 second front levers while climbing, but being able to do a 5 second front lever indicates a level of ability (strength, recruitment/activation, coordination) that can translate well to climbing. Our main issue with the inclusion of the front lever in this particular "9c test" is that it is called a "core strength test" and that there is such a massive jump in difficulty between a 20 second l-sit and a 5 second front lever just to gain 1 point. So I think front levers are great for climbers, but I don't love the design and categorization of that particular test :) -Emile

[@craigbritton1089]

As a climber since 1966 I have noticed that climbers who can control a front lever seldom have problems keeping their feet on the wall/rock. I have known multiple climbers who could not do a one arm; but could do multiple one arm pullups with horrible smears against an overhanging wall

[@MangoIceCreamLover]

im the type of confusing climber that cant even do one push up or pull-up, but can climb a 6c+ sometimes. Which doesn't make any sense. Only slab tho, but yeah. I thing i did a hangboard test once with my body weight and i could be climbing 5a according to the test lol.

[@myusen]

The translation between V grades and Font grades was a bit off, no?

[@HoopersBeta]

There are lot's of resources out there attempting to convert the grades and seemingly they all slightly differ. Hard to say!

[@heikek2134]

I think in another comment someone said the test was designed for climbing, so it's not Font grade, but French route climbing grade, which is apparently yet another grading system.

[@AlexTighe]

Coming from an elite gymnastics background, the core strength test is definitely not a true representation of an athletes abilities. It's commonly known in the gymnastics world that front levers are a 'party trick' and are heavily dependent on body type. You'll see many athletes that can easily camp out in an L-sit for 100+ seconds, but cannot do a front lever. Also, being able to hold a 'perfect' front lever from a gymnastics standpoint (i.e. no bend in the arms, head neutral, pointed toes, knees straight, parallel to the ground, and zero bend in the hips) is very very different than getting 'close' to the position with some errors. Nonetheless, it's a fun test to do!

[@HoopersBeta]

Thanks for the share! Glad to have an insight into the gymnastic world and good point about the body type. Also, yes... that perfect form is just so hard lol.

[@ZackRaborn]

Nice.

[@HoopersBeta]

Very nice

[@Randres24]

Super very nice.

[@nbka8rs]

Algogogogogo

[@leanderseiler]

Isn't 6a already a V3 and 6c+ a V6?

[@HoopersBeta]

Depends on the grading system you're using (YDS vs French vs V-scale vs Font. scale). This test is based on the French scale, and we just converted some of the values to v-grades.

[@VeryShortClimberBeta]

I score 22 pts on this test theoretically meaning I have the strength to be a "v11" climber, but I'm just a v6 climber. I think that these tests, similar to lattice assessments, are most accurate in grade prediction when you are within 1-2 standard deviations of "normal" in body size, and become less accurate at extreme ends of the scale. Nonetheless, still good benchmarks to have against yourself to measure improvement over time!

[@slapthesloper]

The 22 pts giving 8a is the sport grade (5.13b) which would be a boulder grade of about V7 (7A+) so actually pretty close for you

[@HoopersBeta]

Yeah Rex T is correct, 22 points is closer to V7/8 not V11 so it may be closer than you thought.

[@VeryShortClimberBeta]

Whoops you're both totally right!

[@21nGG]

I thought the 9c test is equated to sport climbing grades and not boulder grades?

[@LukBacca]

they are the same

[@alexgalays910]

it's a circus show test :D If you never trained front lever, you probably are going to easily do the L-sit but fail at doing the front lever for even one second.

[@HoopersBeta]

Hah :) I wouldn't necessarily say circus show... but it was very fun / entertaining to do! So, maybe in that sense :P Yeah agreed, the front lever is hard!!

[@alexgalays910]

@@HoopersBeta If anything it's entertaining! Never imagined someone could hold that bar for 10min... and he was very composed. Amazing feat.

[@wordpress4373]

Is Anna made of Hazelnutt?

[@HoopersBeta]

Nutella I believe

[@genin69]

Your 5 seconds are infinitesably shorter than the 3s time youtune gives you to skip ads

[@HoopersBeta]

? KZbin makes you wait 5 seconds before skipping ads

[@isaarunarom7830]

and mhe decided at 7 minutes he would stop aty 10, deff coulda gone futher'\

[@Limbaugh_]

Damn I do v5’s and some 6’s but no fucking way I could do a 150% hang (90pounds added)

[@leanderseiler]

I score 25 and climb 7a, am I doing something wrong 😂

[@HoopersBeta]

Technique? Mindset? Hah :) Or you're just strong and need more time with climbing