Can You Legally Ship Lithium Batteries?

[@jayson865]

Just my 2 cents but I would not recommend just anyone shipping hazmat (lithium batteries are class 9 miscellaneous dangerous goods). To make it simple, if you can call it simple, you have DOT & FRA for road and rail regulations, IATA for shipping by air and IMDG for shipping by sea all of which can have slightly different packing requirements for the same dangerous goods. I used to work as a logistics coordinator shipping various DG's all over the globe and there are a LOT of regulations and requirements (some country specific) such as special packaging, markings, paperwork, and placards that average joe's are not going to be aware of. I believe the phone number he refers to in the video is known as an ERN (Emergency Response Number) that the carrier can contact should they have a spill, breach, fire etc. concerning your shipment. Yes, they must be able to reach that line 24/7 on the first call, however you can set up an account with a company such as Chemtrec to get an ERN and CCN# to put on your labeling and shipping paperwork. You must also fill out this dandy little form known as a dangerous goods declaration which lists the nature and quantity of hazardous materials contained within each package. Trust me the list just keeps going on and on. If you're feeling spunky just google title 49 of the code of federal regulations.That should be enough for most people to say screw it, however if you're serious about shipping hazmat for your business I would strongly recommend contacting a Hazmat & Dangerous Goods Consulting service to help you better understand all that is required. I've been away from the shipping game for a while and I must say I do not miss it. Keep this in mind, there are college courses pertaining to the shipping of hazardous materials. Cheers!... Jayson

[@lucus999999999]

Jayson Ayers i

[@charlie5555]

Hey, Thanks for your video was very informative, and I found it to bre very halpful! Thank you

[@gsantee]

Just buy an EV with the cell type you want and then shuck it for the modules/cells.

[@robertcrawley2985]

I regularly ship 18650s with the USPS. Just make sure that they are securely wrapped and separated. Label the outside of the shipping package "Ground ship only - Do not fly". Check with your local postmaster for more information.

[@Energy_from.the_Sun]

I’m on my second fiat 500e 6s1p LiMn2O4 going out. This video made me super nervous. However, I was up front about what I was shopping and had to pay $110 the first one and $130 the second. The second hasn’t reached its destination yet. I will update when it does. Hopefully😟

[@circletech7745]

In other words, if you are shipping just once don't bother. Pack it up well and if they ask what's in the box, say it's computer parts ( you aren't lying because laptop batteries and 18650 cells ARE computer parts). It's super unlikely you will get caught unless the package blows up in transit and if you packed everything well that will not happen. This is sort of like the many laws the government has on file that are good, but nearly impossible to enforce. Like copying a DVD movie that you own or driving 100mph if you are in the middle of nowhere and there is not another car or human for miles. Yeah what you are doing is illegal, but it's incredibly unlikely you will be caught.

[@Randy4me]

USPS needs a warrant to open up anything 1st Class and above. Basically needs to be hit on by a drug dog. If you are just shipping a few cells that a packed properly they will never know.

[@JacobJonesy]

Loose cells are specifically regulated and are not "computer parts". For them to be a "computer parts" the cells need to be in a battery pack, and even then the regulations say the battery pack must be installed in an electronic device.

[@floridacargocat]

Unfortunately, the first two sentences reveal a thinking of "willful non-compliance" (and this is a major offence in the USA). Proper classification is an essential element in shipping HazMat. Batteries are part of a computer, but under 49 Code of Federal Regulations, a battery is a battery, and this item is subject to very strict transportation requirements. Please do NOT take this lightly. Not properly indicating the contents of the box to UPS/FEDEX/whoever else is a willful non-compliance, and is treated accordingly in case something happens.

[@CanonFirefly]

In Australia you can ship them pretty easily via road. I have had single 20700s shipped by air domestically with vaping gear without issue but I think the vendor may have been pushing the rules.

[@fredfredburgeryes123]

>with vaping gear was the battery already inside whatever gear you got?

[@CanonFirefly]

One was a Wismec RX Machina that did have a battery not in the device but in the retail packaging. The other occasions were bare cells in standard cardboard boxes that cells generally come in.

[@sefscoladacontrola]

I have an e bike and I am moving to Puerto Rico. How can I get the battery there

[@raaah]

I sold drone batteries on eBay out of the country and eBay canceled the delivery a d gave the money back to the customer but they let me keep the money. I did this 7 times. They told me they just sell the item locally. The same battery went to Ohio and Tennessee with no problem

[@abdullahbakheet4630]

I just bought an Electric Bicycle online from the US with +500 Watts lithium-ion battery packed inside the same bicycle packaging. Can i ship it overseas? Using Aramex or UPS?

[@dagdernit572]

I recently bought a bulk amount of 18650 batteries on EBay that were not packed well with no danger/lithium ion warning labels. Some of them arrived warm no reading when tested with a voltmeter. I emailed the seller and she said to put them on a charger and they will bounce back to life. Well, I did that and almost started a fire melting my charger. (My Nitecore charger wouldn't charge them) Burned my fingers pretty good running outside to cool them off. Came back to find acid leaked out of the top after getting my fingers on ice. Ended with seller issuing a refund. From now on, I will not buy a cheap deal again that's for sure.

[@carnaud]

I understand regulations but, these are regs put in place to prevent energy storage....not just safety as they should have Hazmat shipping enclosures for Aircraft that can withstand LI battery’s occasional “incidents”, of which should be able to withstand so much energy density release per container.

[@jayson865]

Clay Arnaud I believe the point is that if you're properly packaging and marking your batteries they WILL be put in the hazmat bay of a cargo only aircraft. There are passenger aircraft that carry parcels. If a package were improperly marked it could potentially end up on a passenger aircraft. We all know some carriers mishandle boxes in transit and there are careless people out there who will inevitably package batteries poorly which could lead to that mishandled, poorly packaged box of batteries on a plane where it doesn't belong. I would like to think that when I step onboard an airplane that there is no hazmat in the belly that could potentially bring the airplane down with me onboard. Cheers!

[@JacobJonesy]

What do you mean to prevent energy storage? That doesn't make any sense..

[@wzDH106]

People have died from lithium ion aircraft fires. Keep them with surface shipping, what's the rush anyway?

[@davidurdahl6656]

I do it all the time. But we are talking maybe a couple pairs. With USPS online.

[@Ronke01]

Sure you can as long as you adhere to the IATA regulations of shipping of dangerous goods by air freight. The phone number just needs to be anyone who is able to provide additional information about on the shipment and specifications of the contents and the packaging. You need the Cargo Aircraft Only label, Lithium Ion Battery Handling Label, the class 9 hazard label, consigner adress information, consignee adress information, UN number and name of the contents, weight of the contents, dangerous goods declaration, battery handling declaration and nowadays you need an IATA certified license.

[@jehugarcia]

Lol, just those few things

[@Ronke01]

jehugarcia I used to teach this stuff to cargo handlers, air crew and shippers for the Belgian Military. I was a fully licensed IATA shipper at that time as well. The rules havr only gotten stricter and stricter every year.

[@angeldaniel2640]

Tnx. I’m from PR and finding batteries are very hard to come across with. Let’s see if I can get a proper reply from Javier with info

[@omaririzarry6646]

How about shipping them by sea?

[@floridacargocat]

With all due respect, statements in this video are not always in compliance with regulations. In case somethings happens, authorities will investigate, and then it will become very expensive or even lead to jail time (in case of willful non-compliance). It depends on circumstances. The best way to stay out of trouble is to obtain training as per DOT requirements (if it goes international by Air, then it would be as per ICAO or IATA. Compliance means that you know how to classify, pack, mark, label and document properly. Courses are provided by FEDEX, UPS and many more HazMat training providers. I agree with a statement made ("and all that other nonsense"), that regulations are not always straightforward, but they represent best knowledge on how to mitigate risks. When it comes to LiB shipments by "Joe Blow", then I do not think that this person is competent enough to achieve compliance, as for LiB there are many more very specific regulations than you would expect. Leave the shipment of LiBs to those who have been trained properly. When you read all the incident and accident reports, you will be surprised how close the (American) public got to major and catastrophic accidents. LiB are part of today's life, but be aware that there is an unpredictable level of risk for a major accident.

[@jt92]

But what about LiPoFe4 batteries? they aren't nearly as unstable as Li-Ion batteries.

[@jehugarcia]

All lithium batteries are extremely safe, and yet considered hazardous materials

[@JacobJonesy]

The families of the crew of UPS Airlines Flight 6 disagree. The plane crashed because their lithium battery cargo caught fire.

[@wzDH106]

jehugarcia lithium batteries are safe in the proper environment, with a safe chemistry, and installed properly. Boeing knows first hand how dangerous these batteries can be if not taken seriously. People have died from these batteries. As much as I appreciate the need for them, let's keep the shipping on the surface and away from pressurized tubes 35,000 feet in the sky.

[@rogerkerkmann]

Is this just for flying or trucking also

[@ShadowRifft]

wasn't it due to pressure fluxuations during take off and landing that cause some batteries to catch fire when shipped by Air? I think it's Ground Shipping only now for batteries and even still you prob have go through a process to ship by bulk. It'd be cool to get a breakdown of what types of batteries are potentially more hazardous, and a refresher vid of battery types in general for a future vid 👍

[@RJSoftware2000]

The Hazardous Materials Support center said they can't designate ground only because of time frame issues. It winds up going air anyway

[@R2000x]

So if I buy some batteries from alarnhookup and for some reason i need to send them back. Alarmhookup needs to send UPS or Fed Ex to pick them up?

[@jehugarcia]

Pretty sure if you send the exact same packaging with all labels intact, then they are covered

[@henrickramos4948]

If it’s not going over seas, I think ups and Fedex ground can deliver them.

[@STONEDay]

Back when battery outlaws were shipping 18650s out like rabbits in the outback I had a package kzbin.info/www/bejne/qXWnfYucqpuor8km15s show up that I'm surprised arrived in one piece. How did the batteries not fall out of the bag that was torn? Hmmm. You can still get them shipped like this too (from a different website).

[@Bradlee297]

Are lithium battries wet or dry I'm new to this and my country don't allow wet battery imports

[@jehugarcia]

Neither, they have a liquid electrolyte but it’s very minimal that it doesn’t qualify as wet

[@DobleWhiteAndStabley]

Sweet! Ive been trying to find the answers to this for a long ass time! Now i have a plan of action to head towards. So question. I didn't catch it. Selling custom battery banks like phone chargers. Would that be under this regulation? Because that is what im doing. Custom wooden battery banks with custom wood brandings on the case.

[@babylongate]

My beautiful friends, please I have one question and please give me a specific answer of this problem, ... I have this...1036Wh (25.9Vx40Ah). you understand that of course , BUT THIS (25.9V) is a DC... it;s DC guys....and here's the thing....when I use inverter to get AC V of 120 hypothetically .... so what's happen to the old formula (1036Wh (25.9Vx40Ah)))) how can you put 120 V there???

[@JacobJonesy]

You should learn the difference in power, voltage, and amperes. Then check out ohm's law: v = i*r (voltage = current * resistance). Then check out a boost converter circuit, it steps up the voltage at the cost of lowering the current. Now all you need to do is oscillate this high voltage DC signal and you have high voltage AC. edit: I'm not an engineer, I don't know if they would boost the voltage first using a boost converter, or if they would just simply use a transformer to boost and isolate the AC signal

[@JankyShack]

1036wh / 120v = 8.63 amp hours. Power (watts) = Volts x Amps. Your inverter is probably only 75% efficient so expect to get more like 780 watt hours out of that battery.

[@steve64464]

I hate to be that guy but erm that guy you were talking to over video call ....His smoke alarm was beeping due to low battery which is kinda ironic :-D

[@MultiProtected]

in europe for big quantities you have to watch and conform ADR legislation for transport... and the transporter have to be ADR autorizated because litium batteries are dangerous material

[@gee4mac]

You should stream with OBS or something. You could directly stream the video call instead of placing the laptop in front of the camera.

[@jehugarcia]

Some day we’ll figure that out, for now I’m not letting the tech get in then way

[@ladderssnakes1755]

Can you come up with solar/lithium powered mosquito hands free ff zapper? God knows how much they need in PR.

[@worldhello1234]

@4:26 Just smuggle it. :)

[@grumpyjohntxredneckrc6346]

I don't get it? Everything I buy has lipo or lion Batteries in them, from foam airplanes, drones, or even just Batteries alone! I bought 8pk of 22650s & they came in 3-boxes inside each other w/ no markings whatsoever! I bought a lipo for my Transmitter & it had a lipo in it! I bought a computer, cellphone, plus many others! All have them in packaging &/or separately USPS... Thanks...

[@tomamerman7699]

Grumpy John TX Redneck RC 8 cells max less than 20wh per cell or 2 batteries less than 100wh each is the max we can ship legally. There's also different shipments with more constraint. Batteries shipped with or without equipment has different rules. It just sucks either way. And it changes almost every 6 months

[@jehugarcia]

Yes, lots of people illegally ship stuff and the ones that don’t have paid thousands of dollars to get the proper certifications in place to ship that lipo pack to you, but that doesn’t mean you can (legally) ship that battery to someone else.

[@MartinSansone]

@@tomamerman7699 Hi, can we PM each other on current state of battery shipping methods that are approved? We are working with Europe for certified low cost battery shipping packages. You mention you wish a standard packing pocket or something, what specific sizes you as a shipper need? Thx.

[@unclemuir]

Would you want to be on a plane with lithium batteries that were a hazard?

[@CanonFirefly]

Uncle Muir every flight has hundreds of lithium batteries in the cabin with you...

[@jehugarcia]

Correct, but it turns out they might actually also be carrying cargo on passenger planes and if they are not packaged correctly might cause a problem, Ask Tom if that’s happen to him

[@unclemuir]

In the cabin that should be controllable if there was a fire, in the cargo hold it could be out of control before you knew about it. If you are shipping lithium batteries make sure you follow the rules. You don't want a problem at 30k feet.

[@haroldcokayne]

Uncle Muir I would be more concerned about high profile passengers than what is in the cargo. you would be amazed at how many plane crashes and / or explosions were from external controlled events. I hope I have not popped your fear bubble ...

[@wzDH106]

Cabin lithium battery fires are controllable in that crew and passengers can use all available means to extinguish and isolate the problem. Cargo compartments are designed to eliminate the oxygen ventilation once triggered from the smoke detectors, halon is then injected to control the fire until ARFF / CFR can intervene after an expedited landing. Lithium ion battery fires are not controllable through these safety nets thus classifying as the hazmat they are.

[@Jazzmarcel]

Sounds like a dam scam!.......i wonder what's the real reason why they want stop the transport of li ion batteries!

[@jehugarcia]

They don’t want the liability of exploding batteries, they want to be able to keep treating packages as if they were soccer balls

[@wzDH106]

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/UPS_Airlines_Flight_6 Death is nothing to take lightly. Read the actual accident report. It'll give you chills for days.

[@lw1945three]

can you ship by Ground?

[@jehugarcia]

If you are not shipping to an island yes

[@gentlebear21713]

Then you don't have to deal with the FAA

[@JamesGibatThoroski]

Easier to ship gasoline.

[@gentlebear21713]

Get a real expert next time......you can ship them ground

[@jehugarcia]

Good luck shipping ground to Puerto Rico “Expert”

[@jaxturner7288]

Average joe getting $75,000 fine for shipping a lithium battery or hire a company to answer the phone? Yeah right, capital b B.S. right here.