CAR CHAT/RANT: No Oil NOR No Butter Should EVER Touch Your Natural Hair 🙄 | ALOVE4ME

I hope you enjoyed this car chat addressing a frequently requested topic of whether using oils and butter is harmful to natural hair. Check back every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday for a new upload.
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[@jamilawright1674]

Black hair been thriving off of oils, buttters and pomades since the dawn of time. Know what works for your hair.

[@JazzyB9481]

Exactly!!!! They are staples in several cultures across the world.

[@sommerprettygirlgamer2719]

Exactly

[@roxjnie9028]

lol nottt true! our people have a history of using it first to not get lice in their hair when they were being forced to work in the fields, oils and grease/butters lubricate so it was also a good way to manipulate the hair! they continued to be popular during the relaxer days and straightening days and why? bc water and oil don’t mix, and it was a good way to keep the hair from reverting when you got your hair done; improper use of these products can cause chronic dehydration issa fact; too much of a « good thing » can become a bad thing. most products are already formulated with oils in them so raw oils butters and grease it can defenitely be too much especially for people who don’t shampoo as often as they should or only co-wash. the build up is crazy you should look up videos where they show this build up on a microscopic level bc you don’t to necessarily see it nor feel it with your eyes

[@JazzyB9481]

@@roxjnie9028 I've been using oil my entire natural hair journey and have grown my hair to tailbone length twice (in between texturizing/dyeing it and cutting it all off)...so I'll keep using them 😁 but too bad it apparently doesn't work for some people, it probably depends on hair type

[@marsbarsinthestars3226]

@@JazzyB9481 seems like most people who are benefitting from this method are people with lower porosity in their hair (not saying high po ppl dont benefit) which makes sense cos its already hard to put water into their hair, so putting an oil on top will generally make it harder to get in moisture

[@mizgee8667]

Natural hair is Not a one size fits all thing period.

[@danielunedi]

Black Girl Curls don't say that. They do say that the basics of hair care apply to all hair types. They also mention that which products are best for your hair depend on lifestyle, environment, hair density, strand size, number of cuticle layers, and some other things I probably forgot.

[@keepinitkawaii]

@@danielunedi 👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾

[@latasiatatum5996]

@@danielunedi i agree with you to an extant they do give the basics such as “wash your damn hair” but to tell someone what your doing is wrong and/or you don’t need it when it’s working is when it becomes a problem and why people say hey hair is not one size fits all

[@TheKeishana]

Life and experiences is not one size fits all.

[@marlak4203]

Yep. Same thing with skin care and other care. You go on other channels for skincare(face) and the "pro's are just like the stylists, they down DIY's and an natural care stuff. They push and promote the man made, non natural stuff. And they too speak in absolutes. Its virtually NEVER good to talk like that. Humans are not simply black and white. There are various factors in play that make it where some things work for some and doesn't for others(location, genes, diet, health, etc.)

[@BountifulOrchard]

I could take care of my own hair better than any stylist could. People need to start applying common sense and quit jumping on every train that enters the station. Wash your hair it’s not hard, excellent response to this matter..

[@Sunflower94H]

Amen 🙏

[@TheMspoodle2]

That's how the no grease trend started years ago.left women with short hair.. I love grease and oils!!!!

[@janereyrules1083]

Amen to that! I went back to hair grease and will never turn back!

[@TheKeishana]

To each is own ...some people can, some can't ..

[@christines1821]

Yup and dry hair I went back to blue magic and leave in a month ago best thing I ever did, less shedding more moisture .

[@cutenobi]

Good point. I got rid of all the excess butters and oils except for grease. I’m about to experiment with beeswax but grease will always be something that I run back to if beeswax doesn’t work. Have you all tried beeswax?

[@Abmarp]

Im dead ahaha

[@SheReaDelSol]

People keep asking me too cause obviously I love oils and butters and i’m like like “do what works for you, sis.” But you are preachingggggggggg. This us vs them shit is cornyyyyyyyyyy. Stylists have been leaving black women bald for generations and influencers have been spreading “wrong” information for at least a decade. There’s misinformation on both sides, but there’s a lot of good information on both sides. Viewers and consumers need discernment. I surely pick and choose what works for me 🤷🏾‍♀️🤷🏾‍♀️🤷🏾‍♀️

[@felicia_716]

Well said!!

[@Neosoul_prima]

Preach sis

[@saharajohnson6481]

Sometimes you go to the right people do your hair you know somebody for a long time know how to do your hair my girl cousin always go to get her hair done she go to the right people do her hair

[@ravinj8625]

Yessssss

[@lilou7434]

🙏🏾🙏🏾🙏🏾🙏🏾thank you sista !!!!

[@CurlsofaCPA]

(Disclaimer: for my people who like a visual, I am calmly sipping tea as I write this lol) Like most people said it's the condescending tone and shade for me. I've been consuming KZbin since 2008/2009 and I've seen the natural hair community go through a bunch of trends and it all boils down to people letting other people live their lives and flourish the way they know how and if oils and butters work or don't work for you that's your business (que Tabitha Brown voice). I have no issue with people dropping knowledge but delivery is important to me, personally, for me and my house, me myself and I hahaha like if I am genuinely doing something wrong I don't need it to be handed to me on a platter filled with shade and judgement. Ultimately its our job as consumers and content creators as well, to sift through the BS and learn our own hair (continues to sip tea; its tropical green tea if anyone was wondering hahaha). I truly enjoyed this car chat/rant

[@smiltonbla1]

I wholeheartedly agree on the tone of the message! I just found BGC like two weeks ago even signed up for their subscription. Last week I canceled so it would not renew because some of the delivery of their message was just off putting to me. I know that I can be a bit sensitive so I thought it was just me but it is good to see that someone else felt the same way.

[@CurlsofaCPA]

@@smiltonbla1 yes! I am a believer that everything isn’t for everyone. If I’m not comfortable with someone’s delivery I exit stage left and if I choose to stay that’s my business if I want to torture myself 😂 cheers to protecting our peace

[@maniahstallworth7860]

Exactly!!! They’re so rude in their delivery with their “that’s why your hair dirty” attitude

[@dez700]

Not to mention,no stylist has ever even mentioned wearing natural hair, to me. I would have never decided to move foreword with natural hair if I listened to my stylist.

[@msstacey777]

BGC focus on “curly” hair of black girls achieved with wash and goes and not necessarily “natural hair”. I can see where women that wear WNGs 99% of the time can benefit from not using the oils and butters because it may add more weight and less definition to their coils. However, if the hair is probably worn more in twists, braids or some other style where the hair is more contained or protected, I can see how oils/butters/grease would be beneficial. I see women on YT like Indigenous Strands and 22nd century woman and Miss Mississippi with very long and flourishing hair and they do NOT wear WNGs as their main hair style and they use oils/butters/and for Miss Mississippi she uses grease. If you look at the models for BGC, they are all WNGs and I’ve yet to see any of their clients they’ve posted with hair down their back that’s flourishing. So per my observation, it’s all in what you’re looking for. WNGs prob do better without oils/butters/grease because of the frequency of hair wetting and the need for hair to coil with the foam or gel they recommend. Where as if you’re looking for longevity and want to obtain length and don’t mind those type of protective styles and/or keeping the hair covered, I can see the benefits of using oils/butters/grease because they do help (in my opinion).

[@lanitablue5534]

KZbin has definitely been a staple for the natural hair community, and credit should be given where it’s due. Living in a primarily white community I would have been lost without KZbin.

[@zacharydrake156]

Same. That’s why even with all the natural hair community problems i’m still really glad to be a part of this community

[@melleciosa]

I could also do with out ther shade and mockery from those who have jumped on the bandwagon and and concluded that "detox" is the only "correct" way to care for ones hair.

[@Mrs_Canary]

There is no "correct " way but how we listen to youtubers ( strangers who profit off of us). A different perspective from a non youtuber shouldn't get backlash. Like she said in the video....she and They are Sharing " their " journey

[@ndawi-9947]

What annoyed me the most with the BGC girls conversation is that The issue that should’ve taken Main stage is the fact that women weren’t properly shampoo/clarifying Their hair but for some reason they Centered the conversation around oils and butters. The girls with high porosity hair are fine with oils and butters because they are trying to trap moisture, but if you’re low porosity and you’re using oils and butters and aren’t properly shampooing your hair than yeah your going to be an issue. I don’t know why they framed the conversation in the way they did.

[@kiya3507]

there ebook is called “Wash Your Damn Hair” so they have always advocated for people to prioritize cleaning their hair. the no raw oils and butters conversation stems from the common hair issues and faulty reasonings behind why the women that came to their chair have used raw oils and butters. therefore, there’s more to it than just the no raw oils and butters debate. It actually requires receiving accurate information about how to go about learning the fundamentals of haircare to tailor it to your personal hair needs, in which is at the center of what BGC does. BGC went in more detail in their recent YT videos on the 30ddx, if you want to hear directly from the source.

[@miaomiaou_]

Yes! Like, wrong culprit lol

[@roxjnie9028]

funny thing about low/high porosity is it’s actually rare for people to be on the extreme sides of the spectrum, sometimes people who claim they had lowporosity simply had build up from heavy products like raw oils/butters/grease and improper shampooing/clariying.... porosity can change like the weather, even stylists only use that information when they press your hair or do a color; at home we don’t really need to « know » about our porosity and that’s thé hard truth

[@ndawi-9947]

@@roxjnie9028 well I'm coming from a high porosity perspective and regardless of if it's extreme or not my hair reacts differently than low porosity when it comes to how to take care of it.

[@ffffff__]

But oils and butters don’t trap moisture that’s the issue. Moisture is bound to leave and is only obtained through the initial conditioning process. Although some find butter and oil provide physical indicator of shine (often perceived as moisture) it does nothing but add product to your hair . Also porosity don’t mean nothing unless you are chemical dying your hair, to be able to pinpoint your porosity doesn’t make sense as this changes due to various factors.

[@slayedbeauty3123]

I feel like they're always trying to fix something that's not broken...at first we used hair grease and our hair was thriving, then we heard that hair grease is bad so we started using the LOC or LCO method and now we are hearing that oils are bad. They're gonna keep coming up with trends until we all go bald.

[@ItsAJarofJam]

I was nodding my head along to this entire dang video. I went natural in 2009, Nappturality and Longhaircare forums were the only sources of information + like 5 youtubers. It was trial and error, it was DIY, it was all of the good and bad that came with relearning the hair on a black woman's head that has kept me natural this entire time. As much as I appreciated the info I learned from the Wash Your Damn Hair ebook that those hairstylists provided, I'm not going to say that only using commercially produced products are the one and only wave.

[@Erika-lv6lh]

Mainly considering that it's not a regulated market

[@TressesOfAlexis]

This has just gone too far. We ALL have to be responsible in our consumption and use of information. And more importantly, we have to be accountable for what we choose to do with the information. My hair never grew this long and healthy with a stylist and that’s not to say that it couldn’t. But, in the end, we all have to do what’s best for us.

[@Neosoul_prima]

Preach sis

[@maggiejerome4843]

Cause I was surely part of the earlength community when I used to go get my hair done at the salon. Now it's thick and popping and I will not be talked down to. Period.

[@ileanasantamaria2364]

@@maggiejerome4843 THIS!!!!

[@alee7322]

Absolutely

[@Sunflower94H]

Right

[@TriniGirlNatural]

My hair was drier and broke more when I tried no oils. Oils are back to stay

[@tsuronhema3235]

Same, I only lasted 2 days with no oils or butters. Never again 💀

[@jonathanfrancois1782]

@@tsuronhema3235 😂 the first time i tried, i had the sane result as you. But I bought a hood deyer and it's a game changer! It will last

[@soraya.e5482]

Oils did nothing for me I had to let it go

[@uberhaute_naturalz84]

Grease all the way! You see that Dax Indian Hemp with Jamboradi, it's better than all the oils I've been slapping on my scalp(except for my grapeseed oil😄😄)

[@janereyrules1083]

@@uberhaute_naturalz84 amen!

[@yayabell8341]

I so agree and I’m a stylist! All of us as little black girls “even them” Got our hair washed and your mother put some kind of oil in it and braided it up for 2wks and then did it all over again. We had dooky braids. We had hair! Some of the older ones got their hair washed with ivory soap and then oiled and braided. Oil is the chicken soup for hair You don’t have it all the time but when it’s sick, you use a little to feel better. ☺️ No one should try to tell us not to use it.

[@jlovesj3335]

We used grease. Ppl started using oils with the whole natural hair movement

[@TheLightShines]

​@@jlovesj3335 um no my mama oiled my scalp and greased my hair. Hair oiling is a common, very old practice.

[@Adriennea1]

Every thing you said in this rant is SO TRUE! I will especially remember that whenever someone advises to NEVER use this or that, they are trying to sell something! That’s wisdom. You are right because everyone has different goals for their hair!

[@JazzyB9481]

I think they're so aggressive because of the movement to go natural and do your hair at home. They probably felt hurt, so they're attacking others as a result + to get customers back. It seems to be working. I love not spending money on things that I can do myself and I have grown my hair to tailbone length twice using oils and shea butter, so I'll keep doing that. There will probably always be an us vs them mentality because it's a competition for black consumers.

[@shelleyrice1]

If it weren't for the natural hair influencers I wouldn't have a clue how to care for my natural hair, when I decided to go natural 2 years. My long term hairdresser was just not able to guide me how to make the shift from relaxed to natural. I appreciate all the insight you have shared 😊

[@soraya.e5482]

I mean you didn’t really need a movement to know atleast basic hygiene like shampoo and conditioner. Like literally people make kinky or curly hair into a science project it’s really not.

[@shelleyrice1]

@@soraya.e5482 It not a question of 'just' shampooing and conditioning, if it were that straightforward then there would be no need for natural hair influencers. Taking care of natural hair is completely different than looking after relaxed hair, which I maintained for over 23 years.

[@soraya.e5482]

@@shelleyrice1 I’ve been natural before the movement when there wasn’t anything in the shelves for textured hair except how to straighten it. I literally used grarnier fruits sleek and shine just shampoo and conditioner then rocked a ponytail. That was it.

[@sylmarie]

@@soraya.e5482 Everybody isn’t out here looking to just rock a ponytail. What worked for you isn’t what will work for everyone. This isn’t about basic hygiene. If that was what worked for you then good for you. There’s no need to be condescending about it though.

[@soraya.e5482]

@@sylmarie it was just what I did when I had no where special to go. Everyone has a go to style obviously 🙄 I would do something different on occasion but I was giving an example of something you can do. And to be honest you act like twist outs and braids outs and all these different things were invented during the natural hair movement these styles are not knew I’ve done them and seen other women doing them and just never had a name for it.

[@Sloppyjoey1]

I agree with your deduction entirely. I won't lie the no oil / butter thing worked for me but I went back to leave ins and creams and had even better results, that's when I realized this has much more to do with build up and truly clean hair. I also live in Las Vegas so we have very hard water, I find that butters, proteins and hard water builds up faster than I thought, shampoo is more important than I thought, and silicone isn't the only thing that builds up. Ironically I like silicones now but, Everyone's fighting over methods and products when honestly the issue is cleanliness lol. I will say, when I got over the 'build up' issue my hair is so much softer so I think it's worth trying for those who have stubborn wiry textures like mine. Love the vid :)

[@watcheiress]

BINGO! Wash your hair often to prevent buildup. My hair flourished when i began washing it once a week!

[@samanthajones3049]

I have been a natural longer that YT or most of these influencers have been alive, including ALove4Me. I say - - Do what works for you. I got rid of stylists and hair abuse in the 90's. Raw oils saved my hair - especially coconut oil. To each his own. I no longer give advice or rant, and grew my own hair out - long past the back..... Age and wisdom will bring peace.

[@TheThirdEyeAngel]

Listeeeen! You said everything I’ve been feeling about this. The us vs. them mentality that is constantly pushed in this community is so unhealthy. Also, I find a lot of people to be saying so many correct things in the worst of ways. Stylists can educate without 1.) demonizing natural hair influencers (a lot of the ones doing so started off being and are still influencers 🤦🏾‍♀️) and 2.) making naturals feel stupid for experimenting. When I stress cleansing your hair, it comes from a genuine place of once having so much build up I almost buzzed my mane off. BUT err body is still going to do what is most comfortable for them as they go. I still get beat up about using silicone, but I wash my hair and use my products with intention. Like you, I resent a lot of this but I mostly resent that we as a community continue to fight what should be a symbiotic relationship between us all. It shouldn’t be this hard yo 🤣

[@ALove4Me]

It doesn’t have to be hard!!!🙌🏾🙌🏾🙌🏾

[@TriniGirlNatural]

It shouldn't be this hard is right! Wash your hair turned into oils are evil and bashing people online smh

[@ItsAJarofJam]

Exactly. Like thank you natural hair stylists for showing up (after all these dang years) but don't all of a sudden show up on social media calling all of us foolish!

[@adwoamk8918]

From what I have heard so many of these stylists were dealing with clients who would argue them down because of incorrect stuff they had heard from influencers. These trained cosmetogolist would present scientific facts and the client would disagree based on what they had on YT. Understandably that must have been frustrating. It's no different from these tik tok psychologist, who are misinformed and uneducated in the field but have a large enough following to mislead.

[@TheThirdEyeAngel]

@@adwoamk8918 If we’re being 100% there are LICENSED cosmetologists on this platform who have sold people on just as much bad ish over the years. There are piss poor influencers the same way there are piss poor stylists and piss poor members of any other profession. The bulk of us are out here sharing our own experiences and we continue to remind people that it is just OUR experience. There is also a lot of misinformation that many of us also try to correct because contrary to many of the beliefs in this comment section, many of us do care. Coming from my background (which is not hair) I learned early on that progress is often reflected in how you go about obtaining it. Natural hair influencers are here because of a gap that existed in the community for so long. As the dynamics of social media change there is no reason why we can’t exist as a unit instead of playing the blame game. Especially when there is a lot of accountability to be had on both sides whether stylists want to admit that or not. Jabs can be taken but the truth is, we can preach common sense healthy haircare practices until we’re blue in the face and people still won’t listen because that’s not what they want to hear. Neither one of us are going anywhere, so instead of taking jabs I think there is a lot of work that could be done by actually having a conversation.

[@eveolution14]

When I was relaxed, I had been going to hairstylists and keeping up with my trims, etc. But I wasn't retaining length or seeing growth the way I would have liked. Then I found Hairlista in 2011 and followed her recommendations on caring for relaxed hair. Not only did I see healthy growth but I was able to retain length a lot better when I took ownership of my hair care. I went natural in 2017 and started going to a natural hair stylist because it was new to me and I wanted to understand the fundamentals of the natural hair game. But every time I would go in for an appointment and would share how I was fining coconut oil as a great pre-poo for quicker detangling sessions or trying protective styling, I would be ridiculed. I even did my wash and go better than she did mine. It was at this point I realized I had to take ownership of my hair care again. And when I did the difference was clear. I have used tips from the 30-day detox but a lot of what they recommend I was already doing and guess where I learned that from? The Natural Hair influencers. My question is where were they in 2008, 2011, and so on and so forth. You all of a sudden want to jump into a space that stylists weren't checking for in the first place and cut at the people that help create and maintain the space. If you want to educate and show me another way, fine. But miss me with the constant digs and chopping down black hair influencers. They have been here for me more than you have ever been. Healthy Hair was growing before they came on the scene

[@TriniGirlNatural]

👏🏿👏🏿

[@needhelp0913]

🙌🏾🙌🏾🙌🏾

[@shari-leedavis1576]

THIS 🙌🏽🙌🏽

[@FRESHLYROOTEDEDUCATION]

It's not necessarily that we weren't checking for this space. It's that most of us didn’t have time to give to a free platform because we were working to pay bills, raising families, running businesses while trying to carve out time for ourselves. To show what we do effectively it takes quite some time, lighting, angles, editing etc. Because as we know when the people like something the people want more of it and they want it in depth. Shoot just managing an FB business page is taxing and that was fairly short form but now you have IG, tik tok, Twitter etc. It quite literally is like another business that you may have to hire someone (like a lot of influencers do) to manage it. Which is more money needed for the expense account which means higher prices we HAVE TO charge and then people comparing about that. It truly is a crazy cycle so we show up where we can and get paid by the people that value our work (or have set a side the funds) enough to sit in our chairs. It's take care of my family to and business with pay OR do it for free online for God knows how long.

[@LeahBandB]

You said it all. Your journey sounds so much like mine! When I was relaxed, I went to the same stylist for years and never retained length. Started learning about hair on forums back in 2012, changed how I did things and all of a sudden my hair was long and thick. And even seeing the positive changes, my stylist STILL gave me flack and made me feel miserable for doing things differently - so she lost my business. When I went natural, I never even considered going to a stylist. I understand that there are wonderful stylists out there who are genuinely frustrated that clients refuse to take their advice. What I hope these stylists understand is that that client distrusts stylists for a reason. That's a bridge that needs to be rebuilt. Attacking the people that shared their journey on KZbin and elsewhere and belittling the women who learned in the only ways that were available to them is not how you do that.

[@karamitchell4627]

Thank you for posting. I had the exact same sentiments. I’m not all about jumping on every bandwagon provided. I clarify my scalp and hair and go from there every week.

[@cynthiaadams4322]

I am a hair stylist and my hair is 4c so it get very dry so I use oil and leave in as well as keeping it clean!

[@Neosoul_prima]

“My hair ain’t long like this for no reason” preach!!! Of course long hair, doesn’t always mean healthy hair. However, consistent hair is healthy hair! I said that this method, isn’t teaching people about the formulation of ingredients, and how to use them for your own specific texture! I agree with cleansing the hair consistently! However as you said the butters and oils have their place! When you said it doesn’t support black business it’s so true as well! POC for centuries, didn’t always have access to chemicals like silicones or other emollients/ cleansers. We have natural science, that has literally helped us for centuries! Influencers have been THE NATURAL HAIR STYLISTS FOR DECADES! so I thank y’all! Especially this channel!!!!🧡🌹

[@baileysmom0601]

How is going to black stylists and buying black owned products not supporting black business? Cause people don't want to do the LOC method that's unsupportive of black business? How?

[@shellon22]

I stopped listening when they said they're taking the stupid out of natural hair. I'm good because last I checked many stylists are the reason why people have no edges and some of them are prematurely bald. I will do what is best for my hair.

[@maniahstallworth7860]

It’s not about what you say, it’s how you say it. Most of these hairstylists are getting mad at the questions we have when we ask why no oils and butters and give off this “it’s so simple. Y’all just choosing to have dirty hair” attitude.

[@mandy9775]

Most "hair professionals" aren't taught how to deal with and maintain afro natural hair. So your hair texture being a challenge to them is your fault. I've seen a 50 chapter cosmetology textbook and maybe 3 chapters discus afro textured. Mainly on how relax or weave it.

[@morganmcclain4624]

@@mandy9775 How is our hair being a challenge to them our fault, we cannot control the hair that grows from our scalp

[@scj7408]

@@morganmcclain4624 I think they meant to the hairstylists it’s our fault not it’s literally our fault if that makes sense

[@WhatTheKink]

It’s the bashing of natural hair influencers for me. I honestly question myself before I make certain videos because I feel a touch of “imposter syndrome.” It’s as if putting out hair videos is somehow...wrong to do. As a certified teacher, I still respect the homeschooling mom. *Edited* Since these comments are going left 🙄, I also want to add that I do actually follow the practices of these stylists and those similar. Their expertise on many heads can never compare to me just doing mine alone. No raw oils and butters for the past few years on this head. I’m a believer who also happens to be an influencer.

[@TriniGirlNatural]

Your videos are great sis ⭐

[@patriciacampbell7296]

I love your videos. Dont' stop making them.

[@uberhaute_naturalz84]

People can be crazily sensitive these days. As we say in Nigeria " on top my channel" someone will be doing like they are so entitled! Kai!

[@Twinflameparadigm]

I love that you said, "As a certified teacher, I still respect the homeschooling mom." I home schooled both my children from K through high school and have several friends who are certified teachers, including my BF from elementary school who was extremely supportive, but a lot of teachers acted like my choice to homeschool was saying something negative about them personally when all I was doing was what I found best for my autistic spectrum black son and my family. As far as influencers go, they filled an important gap in the black natural hair community that professional stylists didn't dare tread until recently. I've learned a lot from this channel as well.

[@theresamw3559]

They’re bashing misinformation, not people.

[@cfoster6804]

Shout out to LHCF! I joined the forum in 2009. I still go there from time to time to read the old hair threads. Excellent video you are spot on!

[@latasiatatum5996]

Well I’ve always been washing my damn hair so that works I’ve gone thru trial and error with my hair following BGC’s 30 days detox (didn’t work for me) as well as influencers and being a licensed stylist doesn’t make your information the end all be all. We have to teach but also respect other people’s journey. A home school teacher is no less important as a degreed teacher in a classroom. As for me blue magic will not leave my arsenal again. I do not use raw Coconut Oil and JBCO but it’s in the first 5 ingredients of my shampoo and Deep conditioner and it works FOR ME period 💁🏾‍♀️. I love your content always honest, informative, and respectful.

[@OneSmartFro]

Everytime time I step away from social media I comeback and there some new wave of what not to do or should do to your hair and people harassing those who chose they own path cuz it work for them” not matter what that it is. Natural hair community is mad goofy now 😂😂😂. Way to many contradictions.

[@danigomes7879]

I was doing that method and lost all my hair. I used to wash my hair, condition it and that was that. It fell out. Now I’ve found what works for me and that includes oils and butters. My hair has never been longer. Those ladies are scammers.

[@kaimommy2876]

😮I’m unfollowing now & going with my gut from now on. I am sorry that was your experience.

[@georgiatl6088]

If it was not for KZbin I wouldn't be a natural since there's no natural hairstylist where I live. I love my oil and butter and I will never change that.

[@rachelk4914]

I just rewatched this video. I totally agree with the point that hair products with oils/creams can be ok for our hair as long as we wash our hair often. This is the approach I’m taking with my hair.

[@astarstargirl]

The real gag is that they are just using gel or mousse as a sealant instead of oil

[@ALove4Me]

Yep

[@doreendiary]

Even shampoo can cause build up when not thoroughly rinsed. Oils and butters lubricate the hair strands thus reducing the occurrence of damage. Penetrative oils also prevent damage from hygral fatigue. The problem is not the oils and butters but failing to remove build up like you stated it’s unfortunate because these things can be so beneficial when used properly.

[@Twinflameparadigm]

Also Carol's Daughter was started as DIY for her family. So, I agree, I don't understand the bashing of DIYers either. Great commentary as always.

[@rachelm.3173]

I've watched some of their videos, and they promote not using products with oils/butters in the first 5 ingredients. A few of my fav brands come close such as Shescentit and Curl Origin; which I love because you can get products without Shea butter. Different things work for different people. I can and have gotten on board with their philosophy that less is more in regards to taking care of natural hair. I definitely will not stop watching natural hair KZbinrs.

[@SabzKhumalo]

I agree with you, I advocate for DIY. Each trend is just that a trend. So people need to do themselves. There are doctors out here saying you shouldn't shower often because you strip your skin of natural oils, protectant and microbes. So if you use stripping shampoos you need to replace it with something moisturizing.

[@rhyam737]

This was a much needed video, thank you! I personally tried the no oils, no butters, weekly reset thing over a year ago and I’m really grateful to that method bc I came to see my hair as easier to deal with and able to be wash n goed. I stopped neglecting my hair and leaving it in “protective” styles. But it was a jumping off point for me. My wash n go routine now is veeeery different, but it works for me. I’ve watched this thing become almost cult like over the years and it’s just a lot. I use oil if I want to, I use eco and wet line if I want to, I cowash frequently, I sometimes style only with leave ins, I deep condition weekly, and I love shampoo and I love clay. My hair is happy and hydrated so I can pretty much do whatever 🤷🏾‍♀️

[@TriniGirlNatural]

Yesss ❤❤❤

[@heyjackeibeauty1217]

I think there has been a lot of miscommunication of what Black Girl Curls has talked about and what they actually advocate for. In their #30dayhairdetox, they advocate for people to not use raw oils and butters on their hair, not for people to not use oils in their products because some of the products they recommend have oils in them and these products have the oil broken down in a way that can be easily absorbed in the hair. Also, many of these stylists have been around for 5, 10+ years and have been advocating for basic haircare for the duration of that time. Many of us have just haven't seen them until now.

[@miawalker1246]

BGC does my hair. I've been changed. Almost 3 years in.

[@heyjackeibeauty1217]

@@miawalker1246 Same. I followed them for a few months to feel them out last year and seeing the results on their clients who had a range of densities, textures, and lengths over and over again is really what convinced me to really plug in and join. Now being a part of it and returning to basic haircare, it all makes sense. 🙌🏾

[@Twinflameparadigm]

@@heyjackeibeauty1217 Your hair is beautiful BTW. I just subscribed to your channel. I love what BGC is doing, but the ridiculing DIYers reminds me of when I was 14 and the stylist my mom and I went to would ridicule my attempts to do my own color and cut in front of the entire salon; it was demeaning. So their snarky comments about influencers and DIYers trigger me every time LOL, but I just look at it as a form of "desensitization" therapy because in the end, I do love the principles they share and I'm saving time and getting better styling results.

[@heyjackeibeauty1217]

@@Twinflameparadigm I hear you and trust me, I was in the same boat when I first found BGC too. I felt they were harsh but stuck around because their advice was solid. In doing that, I realized that them coming for these DIY methods is not the same as coming for the DIYers themselves. I have not seen or heard them come for someone character or career. Sincerely though, if they have, please let me know because I don’t think that’s right. In the same breath, in the natural hair community, I constantly see people coming for hairstylists, especially Black ones. Even in this video, there were things said that we’re just flat out untrue and rude and didn’t need to be said, rant or not. And I think what we don’t see, and what hairstylists (specifically the ones that work with natural hair) share is that they have black people coming to their salons, crying and upset and their hair in shambles, thinking their hair doesn’t do a, b, or c because they have tried everything they have heard and seen from us (natural hair influencers/ content creators) and nothing has worked when the issue isn’t their hair, it’s the advice they have been given (and I’m as guilty as everyone on this platform for giving out trash advice that has been detrimental to people’s hair and haircare). Heck, even Aisha (one of the hair stylists of BCG) used to be a hair blogger so she knows what it’s like on both sides, and has been doing the work to help naturals have fly hair without all the fuss. Either way, I think some of this tone policing in general needs to stop. The hairstylists are who they are and they not only have to deal with the anti-Blackness in the hair industry, they have to deal with the misinformation that is spread across the internet on a daily basis. And there are so many different natural hairstylists out there that you can follow and support if you don’t necessarily jive with BCG (I’m happy to recommend some too).

[@heyjackeibeauty1217]

@@Twinflameparadigm And lol at “desensitization therapy”. I hear that. 😂 I’ll admit, us naturals are sensitive and for good reason. Sensitivity isn’t a bad thing. And, I think we just have to be careful to not always see people being critical as being negative. Sometimes everyone needs to take a step back, take a deep breath, and reassess before engaging in conversation with each other cuz we all want the same thing at the end of the day.

[@cheriecooley9362]

I am a relatively recent subscriber who enjoys your content and believe BCG provides some useful information as well. However, I have to agree there does seem to be a divide occurring between the hairstylist wing such as MoKnowsHair's recent videos and BCG ongoing advocacy and the YT NH community which includes inlfuencers and regular women sharing their personal hair journeys. Perhaps BCG converts have been overzealous in their wish to share what they believe to be game changing information. Moreover, many folks have "bastardized" the information by not sharing the method in its fullness. At any rate, it has come across as bashing the NH community in a condescending and unpleasant way. The method isn't necessarily revolutionary and somewhat similar to hydration methods used primarily by other ethnicities. Since the majority of BCG content is behind a pay wall, i.e. purchase of the Ebook, joining the digital salon (no longer available), visiting a cut it kinky stylist or accessing the virtual See Some Curls, it is somewhat disingenuous for their adherents to say there is not a financial motivator at play. BCG is pretty unabashed in their stance that they should be compensated for their expertise as professionals. No arguments here. I believe black women should be compensated for their work. However, because there is no freely accessible website, Amazon Kindle book or the like, the majority of YT content on their method is secondhand. BCG focuses on educating stylists on caring for and cutting tight curls and building their business as hair stylists, again, a financial motivation. They also encourage women return to licensed professionals for proper education on haircare. Since they advocate for primarily setting the hair via wash and go, women seeking variety may feel limited by their process. Teaching stylists how to cut and care for tightly coiled hair and make these services readily available in our communities is God's work so I hope they or someone succeeds in that regard. I live in DC with thousands of black women and I am not sure that this skill set is super available in this area. Conversely, average black women may have deep mistrust of hair stylists and with good reason. As one commentator stated "black women were notoriously bald." To be honest, I have never seen our hair thrive in the ways I have seen since the natural hair movement. I won't date myself but I have seen our hair come full circle from "Black is Beautiful" to the NH community. The sharing in the NH community has resulted in length retention that had thus far eluded the vast majority of women in our community. So kudos to the NH community for filling in a gap when the stylists in our community were behind the curve in providing what we wanted. Honestly, I have not been to a hair stylist in five years since a "natural hair stylist" (silk press stylist) cut off five inches of my hair. (Hair that was cut was not damaged but my hair grows unevenly so should have been layered). It takes a lot of work to retain inches of my fine, low density, high porosity hair. IT IS NOT A GAME so I can't play "stylist aesthetic" vs "my desire" with them. At the end of the day, it is MY hair. Suffice it to say, some of us have lived long enough to observe the Jheri curl, semi monthly relaxer, braid shop, Dominican salon, keratin treatment, sew in, and now frontal eras and as a result, developed particular weariness of hair stylists. Back in the day they used to complement a stylist by saying she had a "growing hand." These will likely survive this sea change in hair culture that has been exacerbated by COVID, but others may not. As to the oils and butters, I must admit my HP hair loves lightweight oils and protein. I love shampooing because us fine, low density girls will do anything for volume and co-washing doesn't support maximum volume. I will say many of the botanical products I have seen used and tried have super limited ingredient lists which somewhat mirror DIYs...marshmallow root, aloe leaf juice/extract, mango extract, flaxseed gel. tea tree oil, slippery elm, etc. These formulations are also relatively expensive for haircare products. I appreciate that I have learned so much from channels like yours, Curly Chemistry, Afope, Naptura85 and too many others to name, especially about ingredients. As a result, I have figured out how to obtain similar results with formulations best for my hair without breaking the bank. Please know that you are appreciated!!! Hopefully this will all simmer down and we can all go back to enjoying the great content!

[@TriniGirlNatural]

The whole truth. Thanks for sharing

[@Mande30]

💯

[@FRESHLYROOTEDEDUCATION]

There's tons of bomb curly stylist in your area and surrounding areas. Check the BGC stylist directory in their site and check local curly stylist hashtags on IG. Make sure your read the stylist websites and vet their IG pages and check for representation 😊

[@ClaimedQT]

Very well said

[@hshel2063]

All of this.

[@michalovesanime]

I'm from the Netherlands, and have 4c hair..without youtube I never would have gone natural.. I STILL can't find a decent natural hair Stylist that does my hair type without making me feel like shit... So yeah this Stylist knows best shit really doesn't ring true to me...I've only had fucked up or disappointing results with stylist/hairdressers..without KZbin I wouldn't have known what to do...or the options that are available

[@Timetrae]

I would have NEVER EITHER!!! Like I couldn’t even imagine stopping relaxing my hair and transitioning without KZbin. I had never even heard of transitioning hair before!! And I certainly wasn’t gonna go back to the horror of my childhood hair care. I had a head full of long hair but the pain was unbearable and don’t even get me started on that darn HOT COMB!!

[@natrlchallenge]

My hair will not respect the challenge and I know not to test 😒. I hope all who try it are successful.

[@dmblake4]

Amen!

[@ALove4Me]

I know I don't have to say this for those who regularly watch my videos, but this video is getting more views than anticipated, so: feel free to agree or disagree with me in the comments, but keep it respectful. If you get out of pocket, I will not respond to your comment. I will delete the comment and possibly block you.

[@crystalam6336]

My comment has been deleted twice and it was not disrespectful. I simply shared my experience of not using raw oils and butters. 🤷🏽‍♀️

[@ALove4Me]

@@crystalam6336 actually, I haven't deleted any comments, so KZbin must be flagging them. Did you include any links? because KZbin will not show comments with links

[@Lafilledlapluie]

Additionally, I don't really do the appeal to authority fallacy of "stylists" because before 2008 natural hair wasn't being styled by stylists. Most of them have also learned from KZbin and came here like "professionals" 🤣

[@ivyalston7277]

That chit chat was on point, “we all don’t share the same goals” not everyone is on the same journey, so take what you want from a KZbinr or give your experience and don’t act like it’s the end all info. Keeping giving us truth

[@fancyflower3298]

If it wasn’t for KZbin influencers I’d be bald. I got so much info from KZbin more than any stylist. The reality is that KZbin is working and people are taking care of their hair more without going to the hair salon. Also, there’s a reason you don’t see girls with hair as long as naptural85 in the hair salons. If you notice the majority of their clients have hair at ear length or not pass shoulder. Stylist will take credit for longer hair they had no business in growing.

[@nadiajordan3447]

The black salons in my area barely exist. Black woman are now taking care of our own hair. Love your content.

[@uberhaute_naturalz84]

What gets me most are the natural hair channels where they don't read the ingredients list, don't follow the instruction, then trash the product! Who does that? Knowing you influence some peoples, I see such attitude as withcraft!

[@cfoster6804]

@@uberhaute_naturalz84 Right! That annoys the heck out of me.😤

[@uberhaute_naturalz84]

@@cfoster6804 Honestly, I see it as wickedness! I think companies should call out such kind of evil souls disguised as influencers out!

[@ensmith210]

I agree. I pick and choose the advice I want to incorporate in my hair care/growth journey. It may or may not work. Now I'm trying to figure out what ingredients work best for me. I need to write down what products I'm using. Lol, that would help. Thanks for the conversation vid🤗

[@uberhaute_naturalz84]

Exactly. I've been doing that for more than 3 years and right now, I know what and what doesn't work. I also have a hair calendar where my regimen is and it has helped me identify the styles that suit me, the product that is best for those styles and the fastest way to go about it. I'm just so grateful to God.

[@ensmith210]

That's exactly what I'm working on doing. This will help me with narrowing down product(s) to use and lessen waste and money🤗

[@uberhaute_naturalz84]

@@ensmith210 E-hugs 🤗🤗

[@ms-behaving]

I quit using oils before I heard of Black Girl Curls and my hair has never been better. It stays moisturized and looks good for 7+ days. It doesn't skink after I sweat and workout, it's growing and maintaining length and I'm a high-lift blond. I haven't missed oiling yet! I don't think the Black Girl Curls duo are malicious. I think they want people to have effortless good looking hair that lasts. What is there to be upset about in that?

[@adwoamk8918]

I swear I never did the loc method before YT and my hair was moisturised. Oils and Shea butter make my hair hard.

[@ms-behaving]

@@adwoamk8918 they did the same thing to my hair even when I was shampooing weekly. I couldn't wear a wash and go because I had the thickest layer of build-up, my twist outs would stand up straight in day 3 too. I hated it!! Plus I've noticed oil makes my scalp stink during the week. I don't have those issues now that I use well formulated products again.

[@f.m.m6706]

@Lacreisha Phillips thisssss>>> !! Great take sis. I myself didn’t want to come to terms with the fact that all the years I’ve spent ‘sealing hair with oil’ was so god damn counteractive. It really is realizing the difference between influencer & professionals.

[@LoXena]

I love raw avocado oil and shea butter and no one will tell me otherwise. I don't see a bunch of indian stylists suddenly trying to argue with people for them to stop using oils. It's only us, arguing for stupid things

[@janschild]

Yes avocado oil is the truth...

[@capricornlove4816]

Yes, Thank you❤🌷 Other countries use ollive oils for centuries, but nobody is bashing them for it! It times for our own community stop bashing people, that use products, if it works, Kudos to you! I suffer from CCC alopecia, so I get the itchy and burning scalp, so I have to be mindful of what products to use, one size don't fit all.

[@tiyyas3022]

At the end of day not all of us listen and do everything told to us by an influencer, hairstylist or even the doctor. We just need to learn how to mind our own businesses and flourish in whatever we choose.

[@haleybrown2795]

Although I have found BGC advice/practiced to work for me (even though I was doing so before I even found them and became more visible, I’m U.K. based so a lot of this info isn’t readily available/natural hair stylists etc...) I do find it to be annoying that BGC and stylists popping up right now (even if they’ve been around) are charging a lot of money just to reveal techniques/product info whereas for the most part we’ve got all the techniques/advice (even though may be misinformation) for free on KZbin for years. I feel like if they were really down to helping the community they would collaborate with influencers.. but like A said.. it’s all about selling something. There shouldn’t be a ‘it’s this way or no way/this is the only way’ type approach which is seems most of of these BGC stylists have.

[@SylenaAnelyesTopaz55]

@13:32 this is literally what I was trying to get across to one of those stylists on tiktok but they told me why use oils if they serve no purpose. But we know that oils are good for coating and providing slip which for me reduces the amount of fairy knots I get. But they tried to say that only constant hydration and frequent trims reduces knots not oils.

[@Aaa-te7ei]

lol yah they are incorrect. if you need to trim your hair frequently then something isn't right

[@Journeytaker101]

I have HIGH porosity hair, and I shampoo and condition weekly and once a month clarify my hair. I need to use oils and butters to seal in moisture. My hair will break if I don’t use any at all. My hair is fine, low density 4c hair...uhm I will stick with what has been working for years now. Thank you for saying this!!!

[@lizthebroken]

I started consuming 'their' content with an open mind as I just wanted to do what's best for my hair. But I found 'them' condescending and shady so I stopped following them. I don't like their tone so I didn't receive what they had to say.

[@joycedelifus4979]

Girl you are so right, they always selling you something. I have heard the ones on KZbin don’t know what they are talking about, I have to laugh 😆 you are right on every point. About time someone spoke up on this. Thank you. 🌺

[@simonewilliams4044]

Another issue I’ve been running into with these alleged stylists are their lack of desire to educate. If I’m being told to stop using oils and butters, what other products are you offering as an alternative? Some of which are using this time to promote their own lines or emailing lists. For me personally when they take on the “Scold, but not inform” route they’ve lost me.

[@shalom2376]

My thoughts exactly.

[@kaimommy2876]

I second this! I follow them on instagram and asked if you are committed to being a subscriber or can you stop and start at any time. She said stop and start. I’d prob do a month to see what they talking about & leave them alone or not. Cause, it’s plenty of information out here on care that simplify what they are saying. There are plenty of other stylist, yielding similar results without the need to sell a download or a monthly anything. I don’t understand the need for a $75 digital textbook when the theme seems to be simply wash, condition, and style. If so simple, why $75 for simplified information and routines….& why so much money for a subscription if you are “genuinely out here” helping women. I feel like women’s need for help with their hair is being exploited for the purpose of selling a product, hair line, tools, or an expensive download. I feel like I have grasped the concept without buying the book and I still do what I do to my hair, just wash it…DUH. It’s great. I was talked at and spat at for asking a question. If women are genuinely lost with their hair why be this rude? Also if it weren’t for KZbin, they would not have a job. Little do they know, they low key influencers for them high brands they promote. This video was on point.

[@sherwood9917]

What I don't like is how dismissive some in the "no oils, no butters movement" are. It is one thing to debunk myths, and an entirely different thing to ridicule people. Also, say what you want about KZbinrs, they willingly share/shared their ideas with all who wanted to learn, and without them, dare I say, these women in the "no oil movement" would have no clientele.

[@rashffee]

Listen using whipped sheas butter to take down and detangle after braids. When I used castor oil in my twist outs, my hair was the strongest and softest.

[@PrometheanFlame]

Thanks for the video. This captured a lot of what I have been feeling about this recent movement. Haircare regimens are individual and personal. What works for one person may not work for someone else. So while a no butter/oil regimen might work for someone, I wouldn't create a rule that states no one else should be using oils or butters in their hair. Especially when they are accessible and mostly harmless (minus allergies) for DIY and commercial formulations.

[@TheUptownBody]

Sooo I’m high porosity & love me some science. No offense to the hair stylists, but I’m gonna listen to the folks with hair down their butt cracks who use oils & butters. Going to a stylist growing up left me bald 👩🏾‍🦲 Thanks for coming to my TED talk 🤍

[@LoXena]

These stylists hair is fried anyway...

[@wannellalawson4001]

I noticed lately. How naturals are going to hair stylists getting their hair done. If you want to go it is fine but I am on a budget. These stylists are charging too much money. I do not trust them. I am so glad for Black ladies on You tube. I have learned a lot. When I decided to go natural I told my hair stylist. I was going natural. Asked her to cut my hair. Get rid of perm ends. She cut my hair but she did not do it right. She had been giving me perms and cutting my hair for yrs. Now she screwed it up. After that no more hair stylists.

[@videeohs1]

I love to watch natural hair influencers but to me it does make sense to look towards hairstylists/cosmetologists for advice bc they have the experience & knowledge of working w many heads of hair whereas a YTer has only done their own.

[@HappilyNappy000]

Thank you! Influencers are great, I have no isses with them. I love KZbin but they should not be viewed as experts. We need the stylist. I feel like they should be able to coexist. I really don’t see the problem. There’s room for both influencers and stylist as long as we all understand the role of each category

[@adwoamk8918]

Exactly, the number of YT who say do not do this, do not do that, is wild. Most of them don't have any creditials or experience, but because they have long hair they get away with it. Then I check their relaxed hair videos and realised they have always had long hair.

[@ndawi-9947]

That’s a great insight but also realize that hairstylists and cosmetologist were also the people who would wreck our hair when we would go into their establishment feeling like because they had experience that they would know better than us. The only time my hair is ever been wrecked is when a stylist who said they knew what they were doing fucked it up so bad that I have a big chop. The apprehension the natural hair girls have with stylists didn’t come out of nowhere.

[@TriniGirlNatural]

@@ndawi-9947 facts 🙏🏿

[@videeohs1]

@ndawi I can see that. Personally I’ve had loose natch hair for less than 3 years (grew up w dreads) so I haven’t had any bad experiences w a stylist, but I have taken lots of bad advice from influencers. I guess I just hope that more people would be open to listening to these stylists who are giving us so much free info, bc it doesn’t seem like cutting, coloring, & styling your own hair for the rest of yr life because of a past bad salon experience is sustainable to me.

[@candisecovington5553]

I have been biased about hair stylists since I went natural. Some of them still push things that are ultimately problematic for natural hair. Bottom line, I don't follow stylists or influencers. I follow what works for me and what has grown my hair from big chop up to now. No one is going to know your hair like you will when you start taking care of it. When you learn your porosity and density and when you learn through trial and error what your hair likes and how it behaves. I shampoo once a month. Some people can get away with shampooing more than that or not at all. I use oils and butters. Some people don't. I use silicones for slip for detangling purposes and I'm contemplating going back to not using them at all. Either way, my hair is still thriving. Natural hair is not a monolith. That's the beauty of it. Keep it simple and consistent. That's what has gotten me this far. I went natural back in 2012, but I salute those of you who went natural in the early 2000's. Y'all really paved the way. By the time I came along there were products coming out left and right that made the journey fun and manageable. As for the attack on DIY products ... Hello? What is going on? I will never stop mixing my conditioners. I will never stop adding oils to my butters and treatments. I will never stop mixing my avocado and banana masks. Those homemade concoctions are everything. I don't know what's going on in this new age of natural hair, but I'll stick the tried and true.

[@tammymoore8804]

I am one of the original detoxers from December 2015. They do not sell product only recommend you use quality ingredients, which some of them by the way have castor oil etc. But they are well formulated. I think your hair would benefit from a detox but ultimately it's your choice. I can only speak for what works for my hair I have not used those products alone, raw or unformulated on my hair over over 5 years and my tiny curls (4c although I don't believe in the alphabet hair lettering system) are gorgeous, defined and hydrated. No oils or butters were harmed. Aeleise has been a natural hair stylist for over 10 years teaching women how to embrace and love the hair God gave them. She's been doing hair BEFORE the product launches and before it was cool to be natural. To each it's own, but they have receipts (i'm one of them), it's not just internet folly, There are women walking in a room and turning heads. I get questioned all the time about my hair and my reply is.... I cleanse, condition an style. Yes it's that simple. But please don't knock it until you try it. As a matter of fact, prove them wrong try it for 30 days and see what happens and come back and tell us the honest to God truth. We'll be waiting.

[@TriniGirlNatural]

They sell or used to sell their recommend products list in a private forum / book I believe. They also sell / used to sell some sort of coaching. There definitely was selling involved.

[@eveolution14]

@Tammy Moore, I know they are brand agnostic. I get their point. I truly do. Yes, I have seen some hair influencers misuse UFD, and end up displeased with the results. Tha thoroughly irks me and displeases my soul. I am a champion of keeping it simple. I think the crux of the issue is the delivery. They are really condescending and are usually on the defense. I was subscribed to the digital hair salon and when Naptural85 did a DIY video people on that forum posted it and proceeded to make fun of her. It really put me off and I didn't renew my subscription. No one is disputing their knowledge or receipts. It's the delivery. Run your race without having to trip up other people. We all have a choice in this life. Don't diminish my right to choose. I get you are commenting on just basic hair care but if a host of people are feeling a way about your delivery, look into that. I can certify that they will respond to this video shortly via Instagram live on KZbin and sadly I think they will still be condescending. But hey if that's the way that feels the most authentic to them then so be it. I don't allow myself to be offended by them anymore.

[@tammymoore8804]

@@TriniGirlNatural for the first 3 years there was no e-book, no private platform just information. Don't influencers get paid? I'm not knocking anybody's ability to make money.

[@heyjackeibeauty1217]

@@tammymoore8804 💯

[@karmikarm1079]

@@eveolution14 You knocked it out the park with your comment. I a 100% believe in their knowledge and the education they are providing. I was initially skeptical about trying their methods but 3 weeks in, I noticed a positive difference in my hair. But just like you said, it’s the condescension and delivery that’s a turn off. Educate me, don’t talk down to me! If I’m misinformed about something, explain it to me without being a smart ass. They act clueless when people try to address this with them. All they do is double down on the condescension.

[@candacebrooks1037]

I 1000% agree with you . I own a natural hair care business and Shea Butter and Oils have helped my hair in many ways. Helped me so much I want to share my experience with them and the ingredients that I have used. I will never say no to butters and oils my 4c hair loves it.

[@Lafilledlapluie]

Lol I've been ignoring this topic but now I've done research and I'm??? I think it's another curly girl method that will be abandoned in 5 years. I thought it was just no raw oils/butters but someone said no oils/butters in the first 5 ingredients? 🤣 It's for wash and go types I guess. Setting foam and mousse are trying to have a moment I guess

[@d.deegodjones]

I've been natural since 2004 and all of my pictures where I used oils and butters for an extended time my hair loos thicker, The pictures where I was just using water and gels for an extended time my hair looks thinner and limp. My hair loves oils and most cultures that use oils for centuries like India are the ones with the butt crack length pony tails. Do what works for your hair these stylists are just mad that people are learning to do their hair themselves .

[@kaimommy2876]

EXACTLY. ❤

[@staciegreene2262]

More like Africans . They put us on Chebe

[@eileenward5668]

I'm with Alexis, my hair has never been this healthy with a stylist, just saying. I have never learn how to really take care of hair from a stylist but, I have learn alot on how to take care of my hair from several natural hair care KZbinrs. I believe if I watched youtube creators right when I became natural, I would've had the information to prevent my heat damage.

[@reneei1940]

Have you ever had a licensed stylist that not only paid for cosmetology school, but then paid extra to learn how to care for our naturally curly hair? They are out there. For me, I learned so much from the A’d and also my stylist and I can successfully do my hair at home. That's not the biggest thing though. The biggest thing is the knowledge I gained. Through the A’s and my stylist, that I found through the list that they put together of natural stylists that specialize in out hair; I have learned how natural hair is supposed to work, look and feel. I learned about proper ingredients and how they should be used. Through them, I can look at a product, look at the ingredients and know if it is something worth me spending my money on. They are saving me money. No longer do I need to hop around, and nobody can come and try to sell me any type of hair product, I can skip pass all the gimmicks that say it's caters to type 4 hair, or it's a ‘miracle’ product. I know better now. And when you know better, you do better.

[@MuzikPerson]

Sigh, like at some point we gotta take accountability for what we let influence our decisions. But just like there was a journey with a lot of us as a community accepting and learning about our natural hair, stylists did the same. I sat in a stylist’s chair in 2012 to help me with my transitioning hair in & she was complained about me not having a relaxer. My hair barely lasted 24 hours. A licensed cosmetologist. But guess who helped me figure out my hair bc I refused to step into another salon yrs after that? INFLUENCERS. And just like it was more of a norm to NOT accept our hair, there was, and still is, a lack of education on Black hair care in today beauty education world.

[@TriniGirlNatural]

Truth 💯

[@ChiannaNycole]

Aged like fine wine. ❤

[@dlilwon]

They took the baby and the bath water and chucked it. Me hair likes oils/grease/silicones etc i co-wash and i clay wash. Am ditching shampoo for now as it is breaking my hair with this hard water in London.

[@kmie3346]

I'm a natural hairstylist and I approve this message 💯

[@jazzyt985]

All I can say is Amen! I could not say it any better. I really appreciate your generosity in providing objective information.

[@phnixT]

Great video!! Subscribed! Honestly I don’t get the no oil/butters trend. I haven’t found a video that fully explains it. I tried to watch one of Black Girls Curls streams and honestly it was too long and the only thing I heard was these other stylist said wash your hair. Which I’ve always done. I haven’t heard fact (science) based reasoning on why oils/butters are bad. From what it seems this trend started because 1) some people weren’t washing their hair properly. 2) some people were using oils and butters improperly (we have all heard the YTer call an oil moisturizing smh). And 3) not everyone needs castor oil and Shea butter, but some do. Our hair types are WAY to diverse for one size fits all. Think about all the stuff you have to take into account from density, to porosity, to curl pattern, to strand thickness. I don’t see how a one size fits all thing works in any situation. I’ve tried to learn about this method a bit but honestly I don’t have a problem with oils and butters. And after years in YT I follow YTers who back up claims with science as a foundation for everything else I hear so I’m good.

[@eo4345]

Oils and Butters are not bad. The idea is that the way that we have been led to depend on them is. It’s not a stop using butters and oils. It’s just a detox method to reset ur hair. If your familiar with white people hair. White People wash their hair very often which is why their hair gets really greasy, because shampoo makes the scalp dry and as a result the scalp over compensates by producing even more oil. So they wash their hair even MORE often and it creates a cycle of greasy hair and dry scalp. The opposite has become true for SOME black people. There are black people who’s hair has become defunct because they are not washing their hair with clarifying shampoos as often as they should be. They use clay or vinegar to wash their hair or cowash. But they use RAW whole ingredients to moisturize their hair. The molecules in raw oil and butter are much larger than oils and butters put in manufactured products btw. So their hair stops producing its own oil and sebum because their is already a build up of product on it. Oils and butters repel moisture. Oil and butters are hydrophobic. So the first couple of times, u put water on your head and oil traps it. Great your hair is moisturized. But by the tenth time you haven’t been properly stripping ur hair so you go to do lco method and it’s not working because liquid can’t touch your hair through the build up. Oils are so infused with ur hairs structure that it repels water. It’s even worse because the few times people go to use a real actual shampoo they always do a hot oil prepoo treatment right before which is entirely counter productive. Then they continue to wonder why their hair is still dry. So the detox is meant to reset that by giving ur hair a break for a while by doing the water only method or water and gel before you can then go back to doing the lco method

[@minimalassembly7893]

Phnixt, I would encourage you to at least listen to (no need to watch) the whole video. They are basically giving free hair care guidance. I had my hair cut at their salon some years ago and that’s when I started following their methods off an on. Like you, I was skeptical about and resistant to the seeming “one size fits all” approach. I was probably one of their more annoying clients, asking a lot of questions and challenging their philosophy vs. the results I was seeing. My hair was so dry during the first few weeks of using their routine. Then things shifted and my hair started to hold hydration better, with more consistent styling results. I am still tweeking my routine to get my best results yet, but my hair has never looked better and I get compliments often. One size does not fit all and they offer various product selections and product application techniques depending on your hair properties. I get the feeling that they are still learning as well with each new head of hair they encounter. I also notice that they are approaching social media more openly and humbly because they realize that a growing audience is an influencers most valuable $ currency. You cannot offend people that you are trying to recruit as followers to grow your brand, but I digress. I encourage you to watch “The Real 30 Day Hair Detox” at minute 19, which explains the no butter/no oils philosophy and how it is more about the formulation than the restriction of use. I also encourage you to watch MoKnowsHair, an old school natural hair blogger turned cosmetologist. Her latest video, “Moisturizing Natural Hair - Is it dry or dull? ” around minute 4. She backs up the claim that oils/butters are not suitable for sealing moisture in the hair. She stresses that all the moisture that your hair will get happens on wash day via “water” and your deep treatment and the hair naturally seals itself after you rinse out the conditioner treatment. It does not need “help” to do it. She goes on to state that oil (or butters which are solid oils) does not moisturize, nor does it have a ph to open or close cuticles on its own, so it serves no purpose. She is not affiliated with black girl curls in any way.

[@minimalassembly7893]

EO, the goal is not to go back to LCO or to raw oils and butters.

[@phnixT]

@@minimalassembly7893 I will take a look at the videos. I think the issue is people not understanding. No, oils do not moisturize. They seal. Like silicones seal. Oils don’t alter the cuticle. They just create a barrier that keeps water from escaping from the hair as fast. I am high porosity so sealing is a must for me. I don’t use products with non-water soluble silicones and I don’t use sulfate shampoos. This is by trial and error not because of the CG method. I do shampoo my hair and always have. My hair likes oils. I don’t really use butters but not for any reason other than oils go on easier. I moisturize with water or aloe Vera juice. I seal with oils. My hair has no issues with this. I will watch the videos but when I look up scientific research I don’t see evidence that support oils are bad. I actually just saw one that said pre-pooing with coconut oil diminishes protein loss. But I will watch. Thank you for the information.

[@phnixT]

@@minimalassembly7893 I watched MoKnowsHair. She gives a tremendously much better argument for no raw oils/butters. I will probably still use oils because I don’t have any issues but after watching a couple of her videos there are other things I will tweak. I like her channel a lot. People who are having issues should definitely watch her because she gives an actual explanation other than she has done a lot of hair. Thanks again.

[@TriniGirlNatural]

When it comes to experience, influencers know hair in a way that many stylists do not and vice versa. So let's stop saying influencers only know their own hair. Many stylists do someone's hair once a blue moon and send them off never / rarely to be seen again. Yes they know how their hair responded on that day but they really don't know how the hair responded to any of the treatments long term. Yes they have repeat clients but they still only see little glimpses of each journey. Influencers "consult" with thousands of Naturals on their day to day progress with their hair and specifically what works and doesn't work for them over the years. I'm not gonna say who has more long term relationships with particular Naturals to follow the course of their hair journey but let's not ignore that influencers do as well. I have spoken to thousands on social media about their ongoing hair journeys between Facebook, Instagram and KZbin. No it doesn't make me licensed. But yes it makes me able to draw on experiences beyond my own head. Stylists saying over and over again that influencers only know about their own head just indicates stereotyping and lack of a conversation bringing true understanding. I read the trichology research papers and studies probably more than most stylists do. Each influencer and stylist is different in terms of what they put in and what they get out.

[@Rosannasfriend]

You explained this so well I just might have to subscribe to you.

[@TriniGirlNatural]

@@Rosannasfriend thank you so much 💓💓! We are all in this together ❤. That's how it should be

[@pertinasmith8183]

I agree with this!!! People have different hair and our hair does different things with different products. I feel like I would have long hair but I allow people to tell me," Oh you shouldn't do this or oh you should do this." And the things people told me I shouldn't do was actually growing my hair. It's annoying

[@annettemint]

I'm so glad I'm on break right now...just gonna sit back and watch the foolery.

[@ALove4Me]

🤣🤣🤣

[@LaToya_C.]

You are speaking 💯💯 truth!! And ONE TIME for discernment!! Yes, ma'am. Common sense is essential. 🙌🏽👏🏽

[@DH-dt2hk]

True that....I’ve had more bad hair stylists than natural hair YT influencers & DIYs and spent more time and money fixing mistakes by stylists. Thank God for better products for naturals to nourish our hair. The natural sebum scalp oils in the coilier curl strands may take longer time to coat the length of it depending on how long. Makes a sense to wash, condition, moisturize AND protect which means finding a good product that works for YOU 🥰

[@vickieoliver103]

I agree with you. We have to do what works for us. I know that oils and butters work for me and my hair is growing and retaining length so i'm not about to change up.

[@shari-leedavis1576]

I agree that they can say their piece without bashing influencers, because not every natural hair influencer does the same thing. I'm trying the 30 day hair detox n I live in the Caribbean and its quite difficult to access some of their recommended products.

[@BlackGirlCurls]

We’ve never bashed anyone personally. It’s not about the products. We have participants all over the Caribbean, the UK, Europe and all over the continent using the insight for the application and technique.

[@flojam5687]

Shari: What do you mean by bashing? If you mean they are educating that certain practices are not necessary; or it can take you less time to do your hair because essentially that’s what they do. Now influencers are a public figure and therefore their content and methods are subject to valid criticisms. You can learn a lot from them, I have. You can achieve similar results with different products so even if you don’t have access to their recommended products their are alternatives. The concept is that our haircare can be simple and learn to love our own hair.

[@olivian.matthew2155]

You’re so right about good products started as diy. Curlmix and uncle funky was diy until they decided to mass produce to the public. The NH movement on YT allowed us to be more conscious, it enabled us to show up for ourselves when stylist were not equipped. Beyond the detox, it could be a marketing ploy to discredit the KZbin NH community so people can go back to stylists. They are trying to shift the paradigm now that stylist are becoming more aware of handling natural hair. I don’t do LOC/LCO, use leave ins, oil my scalp or pre-poo frankly because I’m lazy, an engineer and I don’t want to do more than I need to for hair care not cuz of this “new” rhetoric. However, I see value in what stylist are saying but they don’t have to make it their business to throw shade. Be humble, love on people and drink water!

[@adwoamk8918]

I don't think these any ploy some stylist having been talking about this for years, how whenever they have natural hair customers they have clarify a few times because of products overload and that the hair is always dehydrated. Clearly it's a problem.

[@olivian.matthew2155]

@@adwoamk8918 the issue for that is not shampooing, it is not the use of oils and butters. People are saying no oils/butters because people are still not shampoo effectively. Also I mentioned beyond the detox, there seems to be the repeating notion to pair with a professional that knows about hair, so it’s the notion to retire from KZbin and come back “home” to stylist where you belong. Mind you nothing is wrong with that saying this but the execution/delivery of some of the stylist is divisive where they undermine and belittle others to make a point. That is not necessary.

[@TriniGirlNatural]

@@olivian.matthew2155 none of it can stand up to a sensible discussion lol. The hair is dry and has build up? Just shampoo and moisturize lol. It doesn't need to be a cult when one sentence will do

[@olivian.matthew2155]

@@TriniGirlNatural exactly, why do some stylist have to be rude about saying this simple thing or cut down others to do so? I get that there are people that really don’t understand or know but deliver the information with grace and love, don’t be rude, defensive and call it “snarky” or “sassy” to dismiss your questionable delivery.

[@TheThirdEyeAngel]

@@TriniGirlNatural The irony is that those exact words have also been repeated by OTHER stylists. I’ve consulted my stylist every step of my journey and she’s said the same thing. She’s watched me grow on YT too and her support has been everything. I definitely don’t see that dynamic here with these folks at all though. But, it’s interesting watching these people act like their stylists opinion is the only valid one when there are plenty of licensed folks out here who are sharing different practices and still have clients with healthy heads of hair.

[@theTruthAlone]

It’s no raw castor oil, shea butter, coconut oil, eco styler/ wetline xtreme or those types of plastic gels. It is also not to use products with said ingredients in the first 5 ingredients. It doesn’t say that you cannot use oils and butters they can be used in well formulated products, but they shouldn’t be in the first 5 ingredients. Use a good quality shampoo and conditioner once a week and style with a good styler. It’s not as outrageous as you think and it really has simplified my wash day and my hair is thriving. The reason why they’re so anti youtubers is because they are seeing women come to them in the salon and they are having to work really hard to correct their clients hair because it’s in such a sad dehydrated state from following KZbin advice.

[@CLeavell225]

That part! A lot of people think it's an absolute and that's not what they're saying. If it weren't for the As/BGC I'd probably still be an exclusively heat styled natural. I appreciate their knowledge and expertise

[@PreppyFay12]

This is literally it! I feel like people are confused as to what they are actually saying.

[@ALove4Me]

Yes, I know. I wasn’t just talking about BGC. If you don’t know what I’m referencing, check out Tik Tok. So, with the same logic I should write off all hair stylists because quite a few don’t know how to handle natural hair.

[@MJsmom10]

I wish this comment could be pinned to the top! These ladies been doing the work behind the chair ...and have seen how SOME of these YTbers/influencers advice have ruined hair. On the other side of that, there are stylists who have ruined hair bc they didn't know what they were doing either. As someone said above, there's been PLENTY of bad info on both sides. These ladies are doing good in the natural hair space! I've never heard them bash anybody in particular but they also don't hold their tongue when it comes to bad info... no matter who's spitting it.

[@heyjackeibeauty1217]

@@ALove4Me If you’re talking about Camille Janae, her advice is very similar to BGC. These hairstylists are just advocating for simple, basic haircare. 🤷🏾‍♀️

[@melleciosa]

I agree that the Us v. Them is completely unhelpful!

[@aliciamoore8679]

I'm at waist length, give me all the oil and butters.

[@Foxyj310]

Unfortunately it seems like people hear a part of what Iamblackgirlcurls says and run with it. They are not saying do not use oils and butters in your hair. They’re saying some things are not formulated in way that will benefit your hair and can cause it harm. Some of the products that they use contain oils & butters, it’s just not one of the main ingredients. I watch a lot of their lives, and they are constantly saying “do you” it does not have to be an us vs them situation if people would not get in their feelings because they don’t agree.. I have been natural since 2010 and I have a closet full of products to show it. I love my natural hair but I hated doing it because it was an all day process. When I started following iamblackgirlcurls and tried they’re advise my whole world changed. Not only can I do my hair in 1 and half hours, my hair is so healthy and it takes much less products to get it done. I’m so glad I tried it. And yes I continue to watch influencer videos because I enjoy them, but I’m thrilled with what my hair is now, and I’m saving tons of money.

[@madamerouge4082]

I like the natural hair community and I’m glad we’re still learning and talking about different things. A lot of people probably just realize this no oil no butter thing works for them. There’s so much information now and always new information that’s coming out. As always do what you find works best for you! I love us and our continued growth ♥️

[@ladygodiva32man]

Sis! Nuff said! You are so on point..i feel the same way. You said all the things that shit through my mind..i can't try that method cause that was my issue and my hair literally hit the floor way after postpartum shedding stopped. I would just be ruining all my hard work. Do you

[@Michelle-dm3nl]

I have been natural since 2008, and also was heavy on longhaircare forum and other communities that encouraged me when I had no idea what I was doing and I'm grateful for it. Now it's gotten out of hand with influencers turning the community into product junkies at best and at worst literally ruining people's hair. I don't want to spend hours sealing, experimenting and doing the most - people are spending 4 hours on their hair and for what reason?? I have a career, a partner, family, friends..I have things to do. It's no wonder there is a whole wave of women going back to relaxers or doing the gina curl because this natural hair lifestyle isn't sustainable. My hair is "4b/4c" and everyone with this hair type keeps acting like its a struggle, and I'm not sure why it has to be (though I know texturism is real). Doing the detox helped me change my mentality and I think it's the biggest benefit and why they say do it for 30 days. It takes 45 minutes to wash and style my hair, my hair actually lasts for the week and stays hydrated the entire time without me doing anything at all until the next wash day. It is the healthiest it has been in years. I do not ban butters and oils after the detox, but if I use it I know what I'm using it for and it's not to "seal" anything in and it's definitely not for styling my hair with the expectation that it will last more than a few days. I'm not sure how what they are saying about raw oils and butters goes against supporting black businesses, part of their model is literally to train stylists, many who are black on how to do tight curls which is what people are complaining they didn't learn to do, and many of the products they use are black owned. I do think in order to partner with a stylists its an investment, but I rather put my money there than a new fermented rice leave in spray that does nothing but a youtuber swears by, which by the way these companies are creating to capitalize on all the foolishness.

[@Michelle-dm3nl]

Also want to add that I do think your content is solid, which is how I came across the video! But so many influencers are saying whatever that isn't evidence based. Could the comments by stylists could be less cheeky and snarky? For sure, but I get their frustration.

[@FRESHLYROOTEDEDUCATION]

All of this! The goal is universal basic sustainable hair care the simple way. I'm with you, 90% of the products I use in salon and at home are black owned. And a couple use high quality blends of oils and butters in their formulation but NOT in the first 5 ingredients and not raw in the hair which is in line with my practices before training and since training with BGC/CIK. I'll always support them as well as educated influencers giving accurate info that site their sources & stylist.

[@daughterofzion5845]

If oils & butters work to seal your hair & keep your scalp healthy, then you should use them. If oils & butters way your hair down then don't use them. Each person should do what works for them. My high porosity fine hair needs some oil.

[@LeahBandB]

"Everybody has different goals for their hair." This resonated with me so much. For example, "If you do this, your wash and go will last a week." Umm, it's not a goal of mine to have one hairstyle last an entire week. It just doesn't fit my lifestyle. I think what really gets me is that there are so many assumptions about WHY individuals are making the choices that they make for their hair and half of them are wrong which means the advice being shoved down our throats isn't good advice lol Sorry for the rant. It's just really obnoxious.

[@roz1444]

Good points to consider. It's nice to have different ways of approaching caring for natural hair. You're right, back in the early 200"s, there weren't many people going natural. I'm just glad it's no longer a shameful, secretive matter that it was in the past.

[@ALove4Me]

Exactly!

[@brittneer8940]

My hair stop having excessive shedding and broke less on the ends when I got rid of the oils and butters in Jan! Never looking back!

[@shawnnycollins4274]

I've had the exact opposite experience using oils. My ends have gotten stronger and stopped breaking off. Shedding is at a bare minimum. I can't do without my oils, especially coconut, castor oil, and almond oil.

[@SunniDae333]

Thank you. Thank you. THANK YOU! I 110% Agree with everything you're saying!

[@chick9090]

quite a few of the stylists who are promoting this idea are doing so because of the hundreds if not thousands of clients they see who say things like "my hair doesnt cooperate" or "wash day is a never-ending charade" or "i cant get my hair to look like so-an-so"... my stylist told me last year that black women do not need to see their hair as a chore. it can be as simple as you want and i think THATS the message... wash, condition, style.. dassit. if you choose to make it more complicated and it works for you thats totally fine, however it its not working (and alot of people complain that their routines arent working... thats why they turn to youtube) you should try something simple.. as someone else stated you and only a handful of other youtubers that ive seen support their videos with evidence and recommend research. i really do love that about this channel, and i think your videos are quite helpful. many others out there are doing a lot of SELLING, just as you mentioned. also, while i dont think the bashing/teasing it right on either side, its not cool to discredit stylists who went to school to learn both the science and technique of hair (not saying thats what this video is about, ive just noticed it in the comments and on twitter...). many of the ones speaking out now are professionals. many people on youtube have experience dealing with one head of hair.. nothing wrong with influencers discussing their regimes and detailing styling methods however too many simply do no know what they are talking about and it has a negative effect on their viewers.

[@dtaylor7822]

WELL said! The stylists are trying to help, they are knowledgeable about tightly curled hair and have worked on hundreds of heads. Many seem to have missed the point of this movement, and maybe are focusing on the stylists personality or jokes about influencers. I'm not understanding the anger and feelings of betrayal.

[@leslielewis40]

I agree wholeheartedly. I say do whatever you want with YOUR hair. I’ve seen people who say no oil and their hair is fine. I’ve seen people who swear by oils and their hair is fine. In the end, I doubt it makes any difference at all. After all, the actual strands of our hair are dead anyway. What is living is the follicles. So...🤷🏽‍♀️

[@SatyaEmerging]

I always say that everybody's body - and hair/scalp - is different. What some say shouldn't work for my kind of hair absolutely DOES, but I wouldn't have known that if I hadn't paid attention to my own intuition and trials. My hair and scalp are in the best condition they have been in in well over a decade. Find what works best for you at this juncture, and do it!