This Sonic CD Theory Is INSANE

[@chaomix]

What do you think? Are you a 1 > CD > 2 kinda person, or are you a Sonic CD Truther and think it fits elsewhere?

[@arybattlegrounds777]

havent even watched the vid but instant W + W comment

[@dedeythesonicfan3455]

Hi

[@Sonikku_Za_Hejjihoggu_1991]

CD is peak.

[@superadrik09]

I'm a 1>CD>2 kinda person

[@jamiegioca9448]

It just makes so much sense, aside from Eggman using inferior Metal Sonics in StH2 and on

[@remukko5178]

Are we all forgetting Sonic CD is a time travel plot? Metal Sonic is fought in the future. It could be that Eggman was still innovating on robotic Sonics in 2 and 3, and only made Metal chronologically after Sonic 3. A bit confusing, but that's how time travel plots are.

[@HASNOU_]

Bro thats fire

[@thelightspeeddash6329]

You're Too Fucking Cool

[@Skyfecta]

Sure, except the "future" for Stardust Speedway is reached without time travel. You automatically get there in Act 3, the same as all acts. This is because Eggman is taking over each zone one at a time the same time you blast through them.

[@creeperreyrey1610]

​@@Skyfecta It could be that Metal Sonic was the best variation, and he struggled to make something so perfect a second time with the setbacks of the 2nd and 3rd games. Future or not, he could build him, he just couldn't focus of making him while building a giant flying face of himself and then protecting it once it crash lands in Angel Island

[@deletedTestimony]

"eggman got Metal Sonic from an alternate future" is too good to pass up, and I like it.

[@Your_LocalWizard]

I don't think the Metal Sonic argument is the slam dunk a lot of people think it is. Sure, Metal might have the most hype around it, but he was also assisted my Eggman during his fight, not to mention that Metal was designed to race Sonic, whereas the Mechas were made to guard the Death Egg, and presumably Mk. II was made to absorb chaos energy. The mechas aren't designed as upgrades for Metal, they were designed for different purposes

[@SharpWill]

Right, Metal Sonic was designed for racing and the Mechas were designed for fighting

[@hulyaterzi8560]

There's also the fact that Eggman probably rushed Mecha Mk. I based off of the fact that the playable area in Death Egg Zone was pretty tiny, giving him no time to make a good enough robot to guard the Death Egg. Also, we know that Mecha Mk. II is almost as fast as Sonic even after all these years thanks to IDW

[@cobalt_effect]

Not to mention the fact that Metal gets destroyed by running into a door, while you have to actively damage the Mecha models.

[@Izzythemaker127]

My thoughts exactly, they probably aren't the same line of robot

[@Neokan_n]

Finally someone who doesnt see them all as the same guy, jesus!!

[@nationwideris]

6:21 Japanese Sonic 1 manual confirms that Eggman and Sonic have met before this. This is however their first time fighting for possession over the emeralds

[@xXDexter3000Xx]

they meet in segasonic arcade

[@inendlesspain4724]

It was also the first time Eggman employed the use of Badniks.

[@OpoOnTheGo]

Cursed time tho ngl

[@Rishi123456789]

>Japanese Sonic 1 manual confirms that Eggman and Sonic have met before this. This is however their first time fighting for possession over the emeralds You're right. I'd honestly love a prequel game set BEFORE Sonic 1 about the first time Sonic and Eggman ever met each other and that game should be called Sonic Zero.

[@TheNemesis432]

@@Rishi123456789 Honestly I would've prefer if they adapted US promotional comic storyline for a prequel game. Sonic and Eggman being friends long time ago creates such an interesting chemistry between them and explains why Eggman hates Sonic so much and why Sonic believes there is good in Eggman. Only instead of Eggman being corrupted by negative energy of Chaos Emeralds, he would simply reveal his true colors at certain point and force Sonic to end their friendship. I'm iffy on Eggman turning Sonic blue, but Sonic shoes being an Eggman invention and gift from him to hedgehog would be a nice touch as well (and tie into Sonic Labyrinth with Eggman being able to create a perfect copy of them).

[@wessltov]

Why is the logic of "Eggman may just have been experimenting" not applied to Metal Sonic being replaced? Especially if Sonic destroyed him previously

[@ChaddyFantome]

Because MetalSonic fans NEED to make the others out to be his prototypes to make him feel more special than he already is... literally no other reason tbh...

[@GameparkGames]

Metal Sonic lost easily and was abandoned by Eggman, his future robots are more bulky and combative meaning he could be trying to improve the robot in some way

[@therealslimweegee]

To add to this, Eggman appears to have made the Mecha Sonic models as “Anti-Sonics”, but when they were both destroyed, he might have realized the only thing that could beat Sonic was himself, and thus he went back to Little Planet, retrieved Metal Sonic and began upgrading him to be a robotic copy of Sonic that would, one day, surpass the original. Hence why the Mecha Sonic models have not reappeared often but Metal Sonic does.

[@destinymace]

@wessltov I have theorized the Mecha series robots to be an expiremental line for stranger ideas on how to best the Hedgehog(and the Metal series is a branch series off of the Mecha series, being built with futuristic[or in the case of Metal Sonic, literally future] materials. This line is also more expensive.)

[@Exetior_Jina_Lover]

​@@therealslimweegeeIDW

[@marsnil]

I stand with the theory that Sonic CD is still placed between Sonic 1 and 2, but Metal is just quite literally from the future, Eggman simply doesn't know how to build him yet, but he manages to time travel and bring him back from another timeline.

[@PiecakeQ]

This is what I exactly think

[@Starman1029]

And if we count what happens in Sonic 4, metal sonic is left behind on Little Planet after being defeated by Sonic. The other robot sonic's that come after in Sonic 2/3 could be Eggman trying to replicate metal sonic on his own

[@AbnerBarrios1996]

This take is so random that I think it's awesome

[@jiffbuzz1468]

This theory and the point about eggman trying to replicate metal are incredibly based takes and also way less complicated lol

[@Artista_Frustrado]

i mean it could work, what we see in the game is Present-Eggman using the Time Stones to travel to the future so he can send the robots to the past via the Robot Teleporters

[@vaporv01d32]

Considering CD is a title focusing around time travel, it would make sense that, even as the first robot, Metal Sonic would be the best. Simply put, Robotnik has more time, starting his work in the Past, all the way up to the Future.

[@Aint_Qualified]

Finally! I thought I was the only one who remembered CD was a time travel game!

[@matthewponce1942]

And Little Planet resources were probably unique to that place, so when metal was left in the planet and Eggman didn't have this rare resources anymore, he had to finish this new robotic sonics with other methods and eventually ended just coming back for metal

[@AXAXAXAYt]

Way to voice my thoughts 😂

[@papyrusty368]

My theory is that sonic CD takes place before sonic 2, and the reason sonic's spindash is different is because tails taught sonic how to properly spindash, rather than the crappy one he had in CD.

[@linkydoki]

thats a cute idea actually,, it was intended to go after sonic 3 though. mecha is designed to be inferior to metal and if CD took place before sonic 3 why would metal just. not be there. and theres a lot of other things that wouldnt really make sense but i will stop yapping now

[@MikeyLuigi64]

@@linkydokiThere’s a theory that, considering CD’s time travel mechanics, Metal is actually originally from that bad future where Eggman had control over Little Planet and all its resources. The Mechas would be Eggman later trying to replicate Metal with the time and resources he’d have in the present, to no avail

[@CatWarior22]

Nah bro, what is that theory 💀. We've already seen sonic teach tails how to do the spindash in multiple pieces of media and sonic is literally a hedgehog (hedgehog can curl up into a ball).

[@papyrusty368]

@linkydoki My explanation for that is that eggman didn't bother to repair metal sonic after CD, and instead decided to make new robots to replace him. At the end of the day, the theory that tails helped sonic refine the spindash is purely my headcanon tho, so there probably are a lot of plot holes

[@BIaze_BIox]

When a dumbass makes a theory:

[@Chokun-Gaming]

I've heard a theory that states that CD happens between 1 and 2 _for Sonic_ but due to the time travel shenanigans of little planet it was some time after 3 & Knuckles _for Eggman_ which would explain Sonic's sprite and janky spindash while also letting Metal Sonic be the most advanced robotic copy of The Hedgehog chronologically

[@ashbrown-ko5pr]

This is the theory with the most sense I heard all day!

[@nombegenericosinimaginacio6278]

This is the first time i've heard a theory about sonic cd ocurring between 1 and 2 having sense

[@pointwoods]

The Spindash thing is just a development oversight methinks. It wasn't originally meant to appear in cd but was added because of sonic 2. Amy's lack of inclusion in other games is also a development thing, since sonic cd was made by the half of sonic team that stayed in Japan after sonic 1. The team who also went on to create knuckles chaotix, explaining her inclusion there.

[@UltraCenterHQ]

Sonic CD Theory: Sonic isn't a CD

[@Dummigame]

gold

[@robertlupa8273]

cdeez nuuuuuuuuuts

[@fw_Chr0me]

Metal Sonic isn’t actually made of metal.

[@DLGanimator]

Man, this reminds me what my friend said: If Sonic CD is a CD, then it's not a video game, it's just a CD.

[@nighthad]

​@@DLGanimator bro what are you doing here?!

[@MilkshakeSkunkette]

if i recall, wasn't the "see you next game!" screen featuring tails with that car- actually in reference to sonic drift? which was released after sonic CD? would also explain well... the car xD

[@Hey193]

Sonic r

[@Wendy_O._Koopa]

I would have assumed it was Sonic Crackers, which as you know was reworked into Knuckles' Chaotix; but I guess Sonic Drift works much better with the release order.

[@MilkshakeSkunkette]

@@Wendy_O._Koopa yeah xD though man i wish we had gotten crackers- the overworld looked genuinely cool xD

[@CyberpunkStudiosLtd]

It was definitely a reference to Sonic Drift. Other than it being green (instead of yellow) the car matches the one Tails uses in that game.

[@gregtom3272]

Nope sonic and eggman DID NOT MEET in Sonic 1, that game's japanese manual confirm they had multiple encounters before the game's events occured

[@lpfan4491]

Retconned in Origins. And yeah, I don't particularly like the replacement of them literally not even properly meeting before the events of the game, he just sees the events and goes on to solve the crisis. It's lame.

[@lpfan4491]

@@SonicXisCanon Then you should really go Sonic 1 to 06 or possibly Secret Rings. Unleashed caused like half the continuity issues(at least it was what felt like half until the current era caused a bunch more) because it was clearly intended as a soft reboot to get away from 06, before that was taken back later.

[@jomaq9233]

⁠​⁠@@lpfan4491was it even retconned? The Sonic 1 opening cutscene in Origins doesn’t exactly have to mean that Sonic 1 was the very first time Sonic ever met Eggman period

[@JaredtheRabbit]

@@gregtom3272 And I think SegaSonic the Hedgehog was one of those prior encounters.

[@robertlupa8273]

@@jomaq9233 yeah at most it's the first time Eggman used animals to power his robots, which Sonic is shown to be surprised by in the Origins cutscene

[@End_Productions]

Counterpoints to the Counterpoints 1. Tails and Sonic don't have to be together. While it is mildly out of character for them to not go on vacation together we see in the Adventure games among others that at least right now they live their own separate lives and can even go decent intervals of time without seeing each other. 2. We are reading way too far into this teaser image. Sonic 2 and CD were in development at the same time by two different teams. The Tails image was likely just them wanting to reference the character because they couldn't add him 3. Is actually pretty sound. Sega of America tends to add story elements that don't need to be there, and I mean we got an official mention of Tails Sky Patrol before Tails' Adventure 4.Yeah that's also fair, but I mean I explained half of them

[@foxtrap86flame]

Anyone want to counterpoint the counterpoints to the counterpoints, so on and so forth? Get into a counterpoint spiral of controversy and opinionated chaos.

[@SIG7Pro]

@@foxtrap86flame sonic cd after adventure 1 because i am now sega and i say so

[@kyla_kylington]

POINT 2!!!! I NEED TO TALK ABOUT THIS im shocked nobody mentioned how tails WAS MEANT TO BE PLAYABLE, it was meant to be sonic and tails, and this was confirmed after beta leaks,

[@End_Productions]

@kyla_kylington Shit forgot about that. Well, at the same time, this was like the 3 game in the series, and to my knowledge, 3 & Knuckles wasn't in development yet, so who's to say why Tails was cut, I mean sure it could be for story reasons but is that really in character for Sega to do?

[@End_Productions]

@SSJacksWolf Riddle me this hot shot. If cd takes place after Adventure, then why do the character designs go from Classic to Modern and then back to Classic

[@Kelps.mp4]

The thing with Eggman using worse versions of Metal Sonic is probably because Metal got trapped in Little Planet when Sonic freed it from Eggman's chains, so Eggman went to use the previous attempts of creating a robotic Sonic, thus why they are just pushovers. "But Sonic 4 takes place after Knuckles' Chaotix, so how was Metal still in Little Planet even though he was used twice before it?" At this point, I don't even try to piece it together.

[@Terumimi]

It begs the question of if 4 is even canon anymore, since it never got a definitive ending, little planet is referenced as being normal and not captured in modern media, and mania pretty much refused to reference it as "sonic 4"

[@FabienBg]

Sonic cd THEORY 0:33

[@TronicSSJ07]

Nope, Chaotix has Metal Sonic.

[@Neokan_n]

THE METAL SONIC FROM CHAOTIX IS NOT THE OG METAL SONIC!!1 ENDL

[@SocksFCGameArchives]

For me, Chaotix is the true Sonic 4, even if it's not the best

[@toottootsonicwarrior5777]

My theory is that I think Metal being absent during 2 could be explained as the robot simply being out of commission since it's battle against Sonic. We know it's one of Eggman's crowning achievements so it may have taken a long time to repair such a complex machine. This complexity may have also been the reason for all the future 'Robo Sonics' being such duds as Metal may have been a "lightning in a bottle" moment for Eggman and he may have struggled to recreate his masterpiece, only coming close with Mecha Sonic.

[@nicolasbernasconi7228]

@@toottootsonicwarrior5777 there's also the fact that according to sonic 4,metal was trapped in little planet, so any apparition of metal in a game that happens before sonic 4 could be a separate robot like metal sonic kai (from chaotix)

[@robertlupa8273]

@@nicolasbernasconi7228 It's a huge shame we had to wait until Shard to have two Metal Sonics fight eachother in any media _(unless StC/Fleetway has something that I'm not aware of)_ when the material was right there in the games.

[@justbny9278]

It could also just be way too much of a hassle to bother for most of the time It's not like robotnik ever makes like an army of Metal Sonics even AFTER years after having moving on to more advanced plans

[@Cheesetendo]

3:40 The whole plot of Sonic CD involves time travel with Eggman having control over the dark future so i always thought thats where Metal Sonic came from, it would explain why hes more advanced than the other sonic clones and why he doesnt show up in other classic sonic games, hes just from the future so he wasnt built yet.

[@mastermario360]

That's actually a great explanation tbh. Because he doesn't make any kind of appearance outside stardust speedway bad future. Which is the only level that forces you in a bad future even if you made good futures in act 1 & 2.

[@shadowfan115]

Bruh if I recall correctly it's even stated that Future Eggman sends metal to the past to help his past self achieve world dominance faster in the damn official manual

[@ryanlittleton8556]

6:21 an interesting note is that Japanese manual says in Sonic 1 this isn't the first time Eggman and Sonic have interacted with each other

[@thisispkmadness]

Thank you

[@winnerthecoolguy2009]

Honestly I wonder what Little Planet was doing during games like Sonic Forces

[@fl0837]

It apears a month each year i think

[@RedTHedge]

It appears one month a year, so it's likely we were too early or too late to see it.

[@Mr.MR2111]

Little Planet litteraly leaves existence for 11 out of the 12 months of the year. So mostlikely it was just gone

[@CarbonRollerCaco]

@@Mr.MR2111Flying away from Earth≠leaving existence. You're confused by CD's bad ending showing it reappearing. That was Eggman's doing because he has the Time Stones in that ending.

[@CarbonRollerCaco]

It got blown up by the Metarex.

[@comicfan1324]

Although I respect the argument that states Metal Sonic should come later due to how much more successful he is compared to the other robot Sonics, I think there’s an easy way to explain why he was so much better: Unlike the Mechas where he had to focus his efforts towards the Death Egg, Metal Sonic was his main weapon of conquest as he searched for the time zones. That means he got a bit more quality effort put into him instead of being a glorified side project. Also, even if that isn’t the case it’s not like Eggman hasn’t gone backwards in terms of designing things before. I mean just compare The Death Egg Robot which he built very early in his career to the first boss of Sonic Colors. Just because something is newer doesn’t mean it’s gonna be better.

[@comicfan1324]

@@Marchers46 Thanks

[@LittleLexi24]

I agree with everything you wrote here.

[@iheartbacon76]

also, sonic cd is a time travel game, so eggman quite literally had all the time in the world to make metal sonic

[@Breakaway-ic5gj]

He also downgraded E100s in sa2

[@Quickstein]

I think that's easily explained for the E-1000's. They're a mass-production unit, or as Omega puts it, "worthless consumer models," in the same fashion as an Egg Pawn. Corners needed to be cut to make them easy to slap together.

[@Hutch2Much]

people seem to forget that *metal sonic failed* in cd, just like how all the other robot sonics failed in their games. it makes perfect sense to me that eggman would abandon metal after that

[@URA235]

Yeah, in a Sonic 4 cutscene it is shown that Eggman literally abandons Metal on Little Planet after he failed

[@Positron001]

​@@tlst94 looks too much like the blue rat he wants to strangle

[@Oceakip]

@@Positron001 LMAO

[@abram-green]

Tails not being in CD post-S3 could be explained as just "Sonic went by himself." We know he goes on his own adventures (SA2, 06, Unleashed), his friends just usually happen to appear. Also the "see you next game" could just be explained as an Easter egg like Batman Sonic or Fun is Infinite.

[@kuala3840]

Of course that's an easter egg. It drives me crazy when people look at an easter egg and say "that definitely explains everything". If i create a Sonic game, and add a tiny easter egg about, i don't know, Superman, does that mean that Superman exists in Sonic world? No!

[@kenishachisholm5692]

​@@kuala3840 woman dude no need to get so mad over him calling an Easter egg and the batman and super man stuff

[@mrm20x6]

I've always thought the Metal Sonic theory was silly. Just because fans generally think that Metal has a cooler design doesn't actually make him objectively a better robot. It also ignores the fact that Metal failed in CD, so why wouldn't Eggman try to make a different Sonic duplicate? I think he tried to make a robot based on Sonic's speed, saw that it didn't work, and then focused more on Sonic's combat abilitities with his newer robots. I can only speak for myself, but I found the fight with Mecha Sonic in 2 much more difficult than the fight with Metal in CD, which at least in my case makes him a more of a threat to Sonic. Also, technically Sonic CD takes place before and after all other Sonic games.

[@ChaddyFantome]

THANK you!

[@kenishachisholm5692]

No your wrong

[@jdh9419]

An interesting theory: Sonic CD’s present time takes place between S1 and S2. The past time takes place before S1, and the future time takes place after S2

[@spearmintpony7105]

10:05 I read the whole passage and nowhere does it say Tails taught Sonic how to Spin Dash. The move Tails is doing in the final paragraph is the rolling technique from Sonic 1.

[@kylegetz4917]

Metal sonic was built to match Sonic’s speed using future technology, eggman built the mecha sonic robots to overpower sonic or to try to recreate metal sonic with more limited technology. The spin dash is weird in sonic cd because tails hasn’t taught sonic a better way to do it yet. “See you next game” is referring to sonic drift. Amy Isn’t in sonic 2 or 3 because she wasn’t needed until sonic adventure.

[@Fax-Man1]

Finally someone with a concise, rational, and easy to justify explanation for such an obvious matter, thank you. The Devs did not mess up by putting CD before 2, it makes complete sense and does not need a ""death of the author"" fan ret-con.

[@JamesR624]

Yeah... let's see. Our two source options here are 1. The actual official source; SEGA. 2. A fanbase that is famous for infighting.... Yeah.... really hard choice here....

[@naitsabes6222]

Sega is also the ones who said “classic sonic from gens was from another dimension” so 😂

[@Battleguy02]

@@naitsabes6222 At this point with the amount of retcons the current Sonic Team is doing to classic sonic it is for the better that he is from another dimension.

[@british35]

@@naitsabes6222And on the other side, we have a fanbase who can’t agree how many quill hairs he has (a bit exaggerated but you get my point)

[@jonasd.2548]

metal sonic being in CD always made sense to me because hes from the future. you never fight metal in the present. it locks you to the good or bad future. After CD, eggman would then go on the experiment in the present making his own metal sonic in sonic 3&K

[@RedTHedge]

No, not at all. Eggman made metal, you just only race in the future. He also travels from the bad future to the earth, so it's possible Stardust Speedway's future is actually the present

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@RedTHedge maybe

[@Izzythemaker127]

Neat train of thought, but every act 3 in cd is basically just boss act, and they are locked to the future in every level, presumably so you have to see which future you made.

[@jonasd.2548]

@@RedTHedge my point still stands that you only see metal in the future. not to mention that many years later in sonic 4, metal sonic is still rotting in stardust speedway which would technically be the future. then you have to ask who the is metal from sonic heroes? maybe its one that eggman built after CD like in sonic 2 and 3&K none of this really makes sense because if we go off of sonic 4's logic, there was a metal sonic in sonic heroes and sonic 4 at the same time which could still be possible but two metal sonics is crazy.

[@jonasd.2548]

@@Izzythemaker127 but they're still in the future though.

[@AngieMarioFreak2001]

The thing about the spindash that everyone seems to forget when talking about this topic is that knuckles can do it too, and I doubt tails would teach it to him Maybe the spindash is some technique that's passed down from generations and tails possibly researched it and learned it, while sonic, seemingly being an orphan, never learned how to do it properly, resulting in the weird spindash in cd. Or it's just a gameplay mechanic that's been retconned as sonic always being able to do it lol

[@comicfan1324]

This is my honest opinion: The placement of the game has been retconned several times. Back in 2016 Sonic made an appearance in Lego dimensions and along with him Robo Sonic (or as he has been confirmed to be called now Mecha Sonic MK1) appeared, and Eggman said “My first creation to truly rival you.” Sure this game isn’t canon, but this doesn’t imply that when that crossover was developed SEGA was working off of the belief that the Robot Sonic from Sonic 2 was the first creation. Then, once again in the non-canon but officially licensed Archie comics some of the final issues of the series was telling the event of sonic CD, and it is made explicitly clear that the Death Egg has already come and gone. But then we also have cases like sonic origins where it is undeniably stated that the game takes place in between Sonic 1 & 2, and of course in sonic CD there is the iconic “see you next game”. So I feel like no matter which side of the argument you’re on there’s evidence to support your headcanon. Personally, although I used to be in the camp that believed CD came after Sonic 3, I don’t mind CD taking place before Sonic 2. After all, there is something kind of neat about Metal Sonic being the first sonic robot, and despite several attempts to replicate his success, egg man could never quite make a perfect copy, which is why he’s bothered to keep metal sonic around, even after all of his failures and betrayals. There was just something special about him you can’t easily mass produce

[@comicfan1324]

@@SonicXisCanon I think the scene in Origins overrules Sonic Adventure’s. The timeline was far less developed. Besides, they both Achieved the same thing: Tails was depressed but meeting Sonic changed everything. It’s just like how the Amy flashback isn’t consistent with Sonic CD but we understand what it is supposed to mean

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@SonicXisCanon Sonic X IS NOT EVEN THE SAME CONTINUITY, it is not IDW, it is just another completely different continuity.

[@comicfan1324]

@@SonicXisCanon There was never a point in sonic CD where sonic was carrying Amy while metal sonic was chasing them. I would also bring up the fact they’re not even on little planet in the flashback, but I’ll give them a pass since that’s more of a saving assets thing, I’m also giving them a pass for the designs not being consistent. So I’m trying to give flashback as much leeway as I can, but simply it doesn’t lineup with sonic CD perfectly but you still get what it’s trying to convey. The importance of the flashback is still intact even if it’s not 100% accurate

[@robertlupa8273]

@@SonicXisCanon Fair enough.

[@lpfan4491]

@@comicfan1324 By all accounts, we have to give them the benefit of the doubt that it is Little Planet in the flashback. I know it was originally Windy Valley, but that version of the stage does not exist anymore, so there is no actual continuity oopsie through asset reuse in the final game.

[@ultimatespideyhero]

I'm a firm believer of 1>CD>2 for a couple reasons: 1.)If we have to take in Gameplay mechanics, Sonic's Spindash in CD feels very different to the rest of the classic trilogy which can lead to the idea that Sonic hasn't "Figured out" how to use it the best until he meets Tails in 2(If we take that as canon) where he teaches Sonic the better method. 2.) Metal Sonic *did* match Sonic's speed, but he also crashes into a wall and falls apart easily. It's likely the Mecha Sonic line on the other hand was built with combating Sonic directly in mind rather than keeping up with him. 3.)Eggman created Metal Sonic on Little Planet which had the time stones and most likely very advanced technology. So when Sonic stops his plans, Eggman had to start from scratch and came up with the Mecha Lineage. As for why Mecha Sonic MK1's in 2, Let's not forget Sonic *stormed* the Death Egg which caught Eggman off guard and probably sent Mecha out in a panic to keep Sonic busy for a bit. 4.) This one's admittedly a stretch but Sonic 4 actually gives us a good reason why Metal wasn't used for a while. He was still on Little Planet when it went back up in it's natural orbit. Even taking in that S4 isn't canon, it's likely Eggman eventually retrieved him from LP and got him back up to pristine condition. 5.) Amy's absence can easily be explained. She wasn't able to keep up with him yet. It's not until Superstars where she manages to stay on Sonic's tail and even then they don't really see each other commonly until Adventure 1.

[@naitsabes6222]

Back when sonic characters had their own lives instead of always being with sonic 24/7 😭

[@MakriaMicronation]

1. Metal Sonic only appears in the future, so it could still be after the Mecha Sonics 2. Amy was on Little Planet, Sonic and Tails were on Mobius.

[@fawkesthefox912]

I think a good way to handwave some of CD's odd inconsistencies are the game's wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey circumstances. For instance, Little Planet's Past/Future stuff is all over the place. Some places are also very high-tech and fancy looking, with designs and setpieces we don't see outside of the planet. It's likely Dr. Eggman used the unique futuristic technology of Little Planet (specifically of the Good/Bad Futures) to build Metal Sonic, explaining why he's so superior to the Mecha Sonics that followed him. It also explains WHY Eggman seemingly went backwards in robot Sonic progress: without the awesome technology and such from Little Planet (which disappears by the end of CD along with Metal), Eggman's left with the same technology he was already using beforehand. So he chases that Metal Sonic bliss, iterating with the Mecha Sonics in an attempt to succeed and match what he had lost until he eventually reclaims Metal Sonic in Mania/4. And as for Sonic's Spin Dash...notice how inferior it is to the Spin Dash we all know and love. Revving up in standard ball form, holding the button down to build momentum...it's likely that Sonic was just starting to learn how to Spin Dash, and took him a while to really perfect it, as we see with the much better handling version in 2 onward. (Easier control, leaning forward with that super fast rev...) Simple as that!

[@E2ForLife]

Sonic 1 > Sonic CD > Sonic 2 > Sonic 3 and Knuckles > Sonic Generations ( Past) Sonic Mania > Sonic Forces ( Past) > Sonic Superstars.

[@british35]

Wait, that means Sonic always goes through Forces twice. I’ve given up trying to understand how that doesn’t cause anything bad

[@reckless_nin]

People never think of the idea that Metal Sonic got left on Little Planet and Robotnik recovered him sometime in like Mania

[@LittleLexi24]

That’s exactly what I’ve believed.

[@keiser1188]

eggman recovered him in Sonic 4, infact.

[@BoxManJr11]

Think you could make a video about if alcohol exists in the sonic universe

[@NaraSherko]

wat

[@BaconHairDefaults]

Rooptop run. No need to explain further

[@lololordjr]

The drunk hobo in sonic adventure 1 no need to explain further

[@minimalbstolerance8113]

The Sonic Manga had a whole chapter about Tails getting drunk at Casino Night zone after knocking back a whole bottle of champagne (that was stuffed into a bunny girl's cleavage, incidentally) losing all his rings gambling, then beating up some random guy for more gambling money. I swear I'm not making this up.

[@comicfan1324]

Do you know speaking of the sonic timeline? Does anyone have any idea what the deal with the Phantom Ruby is? Sonic mania truly takes place in the main timeline then why doesn’t modern sonic and modern egg man already know what the ruby is? Why doesn’t sonic remember being transported to a future where Eggman conquered the world? Did prolong exposure to the Phantom Ruby erase their memory of it, kind of like how the ruby erased Eggman’s memory at the end of Sonic Forces as revealed in sonic IDW? If that’s the case, it’s real convenient that it didn’t erase their memory, but just this one rock.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

they could have forgeted it either way, between Mania and forces, there was many events with extremely maximum danger and alot of experimentations from Eggman, it is not impossible that they forgot.

[@Sonic2024freedomera]

@@SonicXisCanon what?no it does not, Classic Sonic is just past sonic.

[@flamingophone]

No it does fucking not​@@SonicXisCanon

[@Cretaceous158]

@@SonicXisCanon Mania is in the main timeline, while Encore is the main timeline where Sonic doesn't go to Forces, and Adventures is the timeline after Generations that he did.

[@comicfan1324]

@@Sonic2024freedomera OK, and how do you explain sonic forgetting the time he travel to the future where egg man conquered the world, and he had to team up with his future self and a red wolf to save the world? especially since the bumble cast claims the entire series takes place within about a year and a half that’s a pretty big thing to forget

[@ThatSFFrFr]

The "See you next Game" screen is probably just a teaser for sonic drift

[@Ollie.H-23]

I wouldn't take anything the US manuals from the Classic Games as true. Sonic CD's manual calls Amy Rose "Princess Sally" and the Knuckles Chaotix manual talks of things such as "The Power Emerald," and it also says Charmy Bee is 16 years old. It also says Vector is a devoted Christian, so the US manuals have many inconsistencies and shouldn't be taken as fact

[@Cretaceous158]

The Charmy being 16 and Vector being religious was in the Japanese manual. The US Chaotix manual does not give a character bios.

[@Ollie.H-23]

@Cretaceous158 No, Charmy was listed as 6 in Japan. Translation errors caused the US to list him as 16.

[@Cretaceous158]

@@Ollie.H-23 Here is a translation of Chaotix's jp character bio: "He was the first insect to cross the speed of sound, and he is so proud of it that he cannot keep quiet when he is denied. What's more, he is quite moody and mature in his words and actions. The self-proclaimed "fastest insect in the world", he flew to the island in search of new flowers."

[@Ollie.H-23]

@@Cretaceous158 and?

[@Cretaceous158]

@@Ollie.H-23 Charmy is the opposite of his current version. Also here is a translation of Vector's JP character bio "An extremely cheerful and optimistic person. However, he actually has a stronger sense of camaraderie than anyone else, and has the strength and kindness to face any challenge. He believes in the existence of God, and comes to the island after hearing the news of an island of miracles."

[@dolomite1067]

I've got a lot to say about the "Sonic CD takes place after Sonic 3" evidence, because I am a strong believer in Sonic CD taking place in between Sonic 1 and 2. My reason for Metal Sonic being so much better than the Mecha Sonics and being a regression is mostly just that Eggman tried redoing Metal Sonic's likeness, but trying to give more to him failed overall. Eggman tried doing Metal Sonic, giving him more battle capabilities, but is overall more bulky, meaning the abilities could be used. Then Mecha Sonic Mk. II was realized, using the power of the Master Emerald to go super and thought that would be enough, but he made it moreso as a sequel to Mecha Sonic; a Mark II, if you will, and just built off what was already there, meaning it was still quite bulky and didn't do much unless powered up. Then Eggman just decided that Metal Sonic was good enough and decided to reuse him for everything else and added some more things to that. Heck, other people and companies have done the same thing in real life, like Crash Bandicoot's series. Tried something original with Wrath of Cortex, then with Twinsanity, both didn't capture the exact things that made Crash 1-3 fun, and after many years of trial and error, went back to Crash 4. It's happened with Sonic, too. Like how they tried doing the same Classic Sonic Physics as Sonic Mania and Generations in Sonic Forces, couldn't do it correctly, and then just went back to using Mania's physics straight from the code, and even adding the Emerald Powers as the new thing. And as for Amy not appearing in Sonic 2 and 3, everyone in the series says "Long time no see" to Sonic for a reason; Sonic is a drifter that just runs away after a job's done. These characters have their own lives, and usually only get together when stuff is going DOWN (or, at least before games like Colors, Forces, and the Comics, where they seem to always be together). And according to Sonic Origins, Sonic used a plane to get to Westside Island, and I don't think Amy has any resources to get her there; she's meant to represent the common folk in the early days. And as for the Spin Dash thing about Tails teaching it to Sonic; Tails' Adventure only has him unlock that when he has an item with Sonic's face on it, which could imply that Sonic was the one who created the Spin Dash, but Tails is the one who pefected it and taught THAT to Sonic. Sonic CD is the game that Sonic learned the Super Peel-Out in, and considering it and the Spin-Dash are so much similar in CD, Sonic could've figured things out (he's not stupid; he knows how to fly a plane and utilize his speed in unique ways, he could probably think of the Spin-Dash as well). And if Tails DID teach Sonic the Spin-Dash before Sonic CD, why is it so much worse? Maybe Sonic could've thought he could improve it, but just couldn't? Maybe, but it's kinda unlikely. Even then, Sonic CD's manual in English calls Amy "Princess Sally", so I don't think they should be fully trusted. That's just my own addition to these thoughts.

[@lpfan4491]

Honestly, I still wonder how Amy even got to Prison Island in SA2. The same way Chris did in Sonix X or what? xD

[@naitsabes6222]

@@lpfan4491cuase she’s an adventurer lol and stubborn

[@naitsabes6222]

Yeah I miss when all of these guys had things and had their own separate lives , but in the 2010s there alwyas with sonic. 😂

[@shawndagreat420]

This is such a good take

[@SonicTheCutehog]

CD happening before 2 just makes so much sense when you also consider Sonic 3. Sonic 3 happens immediately after the events of Sonic 2 with the Death Egg crashing onto Angel Island and knocking it down to the ocean. How would Eggman be able to try to conquer Little Planet and go back to the crashed Death Egg on Angel Island after CD ends all without Knuckles noticing?

[@kenishachisholm5692]

It does not make sense dude

[@lorenzo689]

Because cd is after 3 not 2? No one is arguing cd is after 2 lmao

[@SonicTheCutehog]

@@lorenzo689 That makes no sense

[@kenishachisholm5692]

Fr​@@lorenzo689

[@kenishachisholm5692]

​@fr he is just yapping at this point SonicTheCutehog

[@Girbekafecon]

"the metal sonic situation is insane"

[@sajeucettefoistunevaspasme]

So insane everytimes he appears police sirens start to go off

[@realer2748]

eggman and sonic are said to know each other before sonic 1, and just because a character doesn’t appear in a certain game doesn’t mean they don’t exist yet. These characters are not attached at the hip besides maybe sonic and tails.

[@ArtskyAnimation]

The robot inconsistency is simple in the words of that guy i forgot "metal sonic is built for speed and metallix(mecha 2) is built for power" also silver sonic is a stop sign to slow sonic down

[@YeeterDeleter_]

My theory is that Dr Robotnik created Metal Sonic using resources from the future during Sonic CD and once Sonic destroys Metal Sonic, every Mecha Sonic variant onwards is him slowly building up to the original version that he eventually builds post S3&K as the timelines would eventually link again, meaning he would be able to regain the resources he earned early via time travel

[@MichaelofWaves]

I'm pretty sure the teaser "see you next game" was referring to sonic drift since...it has a car. That or it's just a joke, keep in mind this is the same game that gave us mario face sonic and batman sonic. Amy not being present in sonic 2 and 3 feels like a moot point. The ending animation to origins showing us amy with the gang implying she joined with them at some point AFTER CD. I think Sonic origins retcons this same thing with the spin dash. At the time saying tails taught him the spindash was a cool idea to try incoperate gameplay with the story. But in other media such as sonic prime. It's implied sonic always knew the spindash and to a bigger extent the dropdash.

[@Ericss2009]

lol the old US manuals aren't canon. Unless you believe that Amy is Sally Acorn, Sonic lives in Mobius, and his speed comes from his shoes. Tails did not fucking invent the spindash.

[@XMB45]

In terms of Metal Sonic and Eggman using seeds instead of animals in CD, I saw a theory around that Metal Sonic was built by Eggman in the future in Little Planet so he had more access to more improved tech. Since he couldn't go back to Little Planet at the time, he had to make crappier Sonic copies. And the seeds could also be just Eggman experimenting with Little Planet resources, possibly in the future too.

[@MarkiplierMeatMuncher8]

I might have an idea on why Tails is not in CD... He had a cold and had to stay home

[@fw_Chr0me]

I think it was said that he was at some sort of science fair or smth. I forgot

[@nathansos8480]

@@fw_Chr0mebut the other one is better

[@kenishachisholm5692]

HUH ​@@nathansos8480

[@kenishachisholm5692]

​@fw_Chr0me you must of watched a video from that KZbin who I forgot his name.........LOL

[@dngr_4209]

My Counter point : The ending cutscene of Sonic CD in Origins is where Sonic gets the tornado flying to West side island and flys past Amy because he doesn’t have time to pick her up

[@songwave7524]

the truth of the matter is simple, CD was probably getting worked on around the same time as sonic 2 which meant that they probably just headbutted the spindash in the game and also why its using the sonic 1 model instead of the improved sonic 2 model and also why tails wasn't added in the game.

[@najadamu2724]

Wasn't the Tails "See You Next Game" teaser in Sonic CD actually referring to Sonic Drift? That's why there's a car in the picture.

[@Colekole]

Your forgetting eggman might want to try something different as all metal sonic could do is get faster and electricitrify himself while m1 had different moves like actually being able to spindash and throw his spikes everywhere

[@skrappothemonster1436]

Here's an idea. Maybe Metal Sonic took Eggman a long time to make so he decided it'd be easier to just wait until Little Planet comes back around next year, rather than completely rebuilding Metal from the ground up.

[@Tawbay-cr5bw]

The REAL DEFINITIVE answer is the creators of these games DID NOT CARE. They just wanted to make cool momentum based platformers guys it ain’t that deep.

[@lordpsi99]

The Tails "See you next game" is referring to Sonic Drift, which is why Tails has a car.

[@koreyworey6345]

I always imagine the reason why there are robotic Sonics that are not as good as metal Sonic is because Eggman didn’t have enough time and budget for a proper one. (For example in Sonic 2 he was doing the whole “death egg” thing.)

[@juanmorrison8794]

I'm trusting CD being after Sonic 1 mainly due to Sonic Team working harder to keep Sonic's lore consistent, what with hiring a lore manager and retconning Classic Sonic to be past Sonic rather than an alternate universe Sonic. Still, this theory is pretty interesting to think about! Great job on the video!

[@socheata643]

CD and 1 guy. But with Sonic The Hedgehog 2 Spin Dash and the remasters

[@MegaManNeo]

I'm convinced it's taking place between 1 and 2, even before they made it canon. Looking at it from the development side, obviously both teams had the idea that Sonic shall be able to spindash to move faster in a protected form. Looking at it from story wise, I'd say Sonic obviously came up with it himself and still tried to adapt to how he can make it even better for himself. It's like how he becomes faster and faster each game and these days doesn't even need to transform to defeat older final bosses.

[@malharezyoutube]

After Metal fell, his chip was lost in the city… only to be found 2 or so years later in Sonic 4. In between those points Eggman tried replicating and possibly surpassing the original Metal Sonic experimenting with more whatever the fuck he was doing with Silver Sonic, bulkiness (Mecha Sonic MKI) and agility (Mecha Sonic MKII) and I also believe during that point he remade the shell but couldn’t perfect the coding to be exact, explaining his appearances in Sonic the Fighters and Triple Trouble and Chaotix… that’s my head canonical explanation of that plot hole.

[@Wilo7412]

My theory is that Sonic learned how to spin dash a little bit when having a break after sonic 1 and thought it was a good idea to use it as a move to go fast and tails told him the better way, and my theory for metal sonic is that, when little planet was saved, eggman started to make all the robots by using better things for the robots and quickly made mecha sonic in sonic 2 and saved his remains while death egg zone was exploding then used mecha sonic’s remains to make mecha sonic MK. 2 and made him a bit better and stronger than the mecha sonic in sonic 2

[@jacobiscool496]

Sonic CD has always been one of my favourites but thats just my opinion :D

[@Immacksgdoesntpostonthisone]

I like to believe that the other Sonic bots besides Metal were just side projects Eggman was working on while he was working on Metal Sonic in the background for chaotix and heroes

[@61ozneakaenzo16]

plot twist: sonic cd never existed

[@SanicX8760]

Mindblowing

[@Alestance]

Actually, if I recall correctly, through the manuals, its implied that Sonic and Eggman have met each other before the events of Sonic 1. Eggman putting animals into robots wasn't a means of powering them, but rather a means to mock Sonic. "Oh you like busting up my toys, do you? Lets see how you like it when I put your friends in them then!" kinda deal. An exerpt from the Japanese Sonic the Hedgehog manual from Eggman's perspective: "Dr. Eggman, the evil genius scientist, has begun to embrace his evil ways again. "Sonic... that annoying, cheeky hedgehog. He's the one who's always ruining my great plans. This time, I'm going to crush him with the power of my science! Heheheh...""

[@tailzgimer1726]

People often forget that in sonic cd metal sonic isn’t as powerful as he is in later games and stories He gets his had smashed in suggesting cd metal sonic is pretty weak compared to his future incarnations So in my headcannon dr robotnik went back on the design after he realised the mecha line up isn’t as great as he hoped it would be and decided to upgrade metal sonic to be better which is why metal sonic is so powerful now compared from sonic cd, and the mechas being inferior is as simple as dr robotnik only wanted to slow down sonic and who is to say mecha sonic mk2 is inferior? As mecha sonic was never infact defeated it took knuckles to defeat him again. And also Amy not being playable in other games is as simple as it’s not everyday you can find a floating island or another island Also cd was developed alongside sonic 2 and it feels more of continuation of sonic 1

[@PixelatedPerfection]

i mean i feel like the whole tails "see you next game" wasn't intended to be a timeline thing, but just a teaser for sonic 3 & knuckles, which would be developed after CD

[@Chibiknux]

I have a crazier theory/headcanon. Metal Sonic wasn't made by our Eggman. He came from a bad future where Eggman got Sonic robotized. He is Sonic. That's why Eggman hasn't been able to replicate him, and why Metal Sonic insist to be "the real Sonic" in Heroes.

[@waggieentertainment9387]

WHAT?!?!?!

[@Chibiknux]

@@SonicXisCanon haven't thought of that since Nega is a whole another mess in the canon, and I don't know if he's gotten to little planet. For the sake of consistency I'd say Metal Sonic was Sonic robotized by Eggman's machinery put in place on little planet's past and Eggman just found him in the future causing destruction. But hey, if you can elaborate that headcanon throwing Rivals into the mix then do it, i love frraky headcanons

[@ninlaw9810]

makes sense but he can also program robots with free will

[@neighborhoodthreattv]

Yeah I saw that video, too. And afaik it is a sound theory and it's my personal headcanon, as well.

[@Bearman851]

Robotization only really existed in American Sonic material. Which is why it makes no sense to me, especially since we should see more evidence of robotization, such as with other robotized animals.

[@valmid5069]

Cant wait for more content from this channel!

[@UltimateSuperX]

I think the reason Tails isn't with Sonic in CD is because he was on his own adventure in Tails' Skypatrol, which is proven to be Canon by the IDW comics. As for "See you next game" thing, it is most likely a hint that Tails is going to be in the next upcoming Sonic game at the time, which would be Sonic 3, a game that came out a year later after CD

[@Jombo1]

Sonic fans when writers don't think about every single aspect of their story about a cartoon hedgehog that goes zoomies:

[@ThisGreenDingo]

“See You Next Game” isnt at the end of the game! It’s a secret image from the sound test that Judy Totoya made in reference to the fact that tails would be making an appearance in S3K. Not lore!

[@ChaddyFantome]

The CD devs didn't know Sonic 3&K would be made. It's a reference to Sonic 2. Judy Toyota AKA Yasushi Yamaguchi confirmed this himself.

[@Idazmi7]

Sonic CD is a separate timeline

[@LorenzoDoesntExist]

Metal isn't "more advanced than Mecha." One is a duplicate of Sonic and another is a big Sonic-themed droid. They serve different purposes. Developers are just coming up with characters for a given game. Just because they're not referenced in a later game doesn't throw the entire timeline into question. Nothing everything is a "plot hole." US manuals barely know what they're talking about. Sonic didn't learn to roll into a ball from Tails. He's a hedgehog smfh, he rolls into a ball. It's interesting that you reference Tails Adventures taking place before Sonic 1 when the US manual actually places it after Sonic 2, which is another mistake. Lastly, Sonic 1 isn't the first time Sonic met Eggman. The Japanese manual indicates that they've been rivals for a while. Naoto Ohshima intended for it to be the CD version of Sonic 1, so it's definitely closer to that than after Sonic 2. It entered development before Sonic 2 and they coordinated with the Sonic 2 team. Artist Yasushi Yamaguchi also felt that it took place between the two well before Origins placed it there. And when does Sonic 4 take place? Metal's shown still left at Stardust Speedway after CD as if he hasn't been in a tonne of Classic and Modern games since then. Episode Metal's clearly a rushed afterthought that we shouldn't overthink. It even says in Episode Metal that a long time has passed, so there's no concrete reason not to take the release order for Sonic 4. It's a nothing story, seriously.

[@Cretaceous158]

Mecha Sonic mk 2 seems to be replicating Sonic's powers rather than just his speed. His super form has him use abilities that are very similar to abilities Sonic learns in Frontiers.

[@randomistough0]

If metal sonic is "better" than the other robots than why does eggman replace him for a shitty boss that takes 4 hits. In fact the only time metal does something other than kidnapping is in the future, after eggman improves him... I think I know my theory is dumb but still

[@Adamwinters]

I follow CD being the direct follow-up to StH1 16-bit with this head logic: 1. Sonic knew Tails before their shared adventure in StH2, and was working on his Spin Dash in CD…at some point before StH2, Sonic had to rescue the less skilled Tails from Eggman in the 8-bit StH2 game. 2. Amy just didn’t go on many of the 16-bit adventures. Amy couldn’t do much in her younger years and had no means to get to the other islands, like an airplane. 3. Metal Sonic wasn’t Robotnik’s first mecha creation but was the culmination of his various prototypes. He never gave the earlier models proper field tests but kept the stored around various places and dedicated himself to perfecting Metal Sonic. After that failed, he focused his energies on other projects… Egg Robot suits and the Death Egg. He found a little time to dust off the prototypes to get them working well enough to buy him extra time. Maybe S&K Mecha Sonic got some extra attention and might have even been an unfinished evolution of Metal Sonic, but with limited time and resources didn’t reach full potential or perfect form. 4. StH2 16-bit & StH3&K probably have to all happen within the same week… same month at the longest. Robotnik was really pressed for time after crash landing on Angel Island, and honestly made an impressive run against the heroes, given what he had to work with. 5. Nobody really knows where Sonic, Tails, or Amy was during the Chaotix amusement park adventure. Eating Crackers maybe? Sonic and Tails eventually flew to the island but got there too late to get involved with the Metal Sonic rematch. Maybe Amy went there as a summer job as a D.J.? 6. Sonic Spinball is probably a different corner of the Sonic-verse (because Satam Freedom Fighters exist) but could still take place between the 8-bit and 16-bit StH2 games.

[@bowserredbird]

1 > CD > 2 FTW! Also, no sign of Mazin anywhere...

[@PeuRo]

There is one thing that everyone forgets about Sonic CD: Is about Time Travel. Sonic faces metal sonic in the FUTURE (all bosses zones are in the future). And there is the time stones. Even the spin dash can be explained of him (from the present), gaining part of the memories from the future timeline. The same goes for eggman. So after the events, metal sonic is destroyed in the future, and eggman re-recreates him only when he suceeds with the advanced technologies of him (probably in Knuckles Chaotix). And I guess the sonic mania Doesnt happens in the main timeline. After S3k is sonic 4 in the main. But after generations in the mania time line, after S3k is mania. (But I like to think that the mania timeline was supposed to be the american sonic from the famous Sonic bible, in the planet mobius and etc).

[@Sodaslushy]

God why cant sega just give us a cohesive timeline

[@eoin1272]

I think the notion that Tails invented the Spindash is a misunderstanding of what that text actually said. It claims Tails learned how tuck into a spinning ball *while running* (Something Sonic can do in Sonic 1). The Spindash starts from a stationary position, not the 'running start' that Tails gave himself. I think the text was just trying to emphasise that he eventually learned how to copy Sonic's pre-existing spin technique. I feel like the wording would be different if it was implying that feat was a new thing entirely.

[@Tugsuu0304]

I think people shouldn’t overcomplicate these things

[@seriut]

it's kinda hard not to

[@demomantf2476]

Where's the fun in that?

[@deadbeatSad]

That's booooooring

[@seriut]

@@demomantf2476 people just kind of have a hard time understanding is what I'm guessing. Sure it wouldn't be fun, but some people just have aren't great at processing

[@the_dommo]

let people have discussions, they aren’t attacking you

[@PyroNick01]

I am definitely a 1 > CD > 2 person, and I can explain Metal's existence. Now, I did read some comments saying how he built to just race Sonic, but another comment, which is relevant to what I'm going to say, is that he's from the future. Now, they said that Eggman brought him from the future, but what I'm thinking is that an Eggman, from a different timeline (aka the bad future timeline), actually sent his Metal Sonic to the past, in order to aid his past self. That's just my headcanon, but there is more. The reason why Metal isn't present in future titles until Chaotix is because, and I believe this was from a KZbinr I've watched, Metal was stuck on Little Planet, which is why the Mecha robot line exists: Eggman is trying to replicate Metal in some way, either waiting for Little Planet to come back, or until he can perfectly remake him (which could explain his ability to be able to use chaos energy in things like IDW or, technically, Mania's animated shorts here on KZbin)

[@sdg4andfriends338]

make a tutorial to how to draw junio sonic style please your adventure style sonic tutoriel was perfect

[@billloney2567]

I don’t see why this is still a thing, SEGA themselves have literally shown us that CD takes place in between Sonic 1 and 2

[@iheartbacon76]

I still stand by CD being between 1 and 2 because it has far more evidence 1. CD is a time travel story, Metal Sonic is literally from the future, as you only fight him in the future period in CD. Eggman had ample time to build him due to time travel, and the other robots weren't as good because he had less time and had to work on the death egg 2.CD's events not causing paradoxes likely means Sonic and Eggman created alternate timelines, which leads me to believe Eggman took Metal from a "bad future" timeline, as we see Eggman taking him from the bad future stardust speedway, which can't exist in our "main" timeline since sonic reversed the effects of Eggman's scheme either by timestones or destroying generators, which is why he's in sonic 4 and not in the classics 3. Tails "inventing" the spindash has no bearing as it was only mentioned in the US manuals, which are the same manuals calling amy "sally acorn". Knuckles already knew the spindash naturally as he's a spiky animal. Shadow did too, so Sonic coming up with it randomly is pretty likely if knuckles can. 4.The CD spindash itself is worse than 2's spindash, as sonic hadn't perfected it yet. Tails' spindash in Tails Adventure is also worse than 2's, so when sonic perfected it in sonic 2, he most likely copied the improved version to be more like his hero 5. Amy not being in sonic 2 and 3 makes sense, because we see that Sonic ran away from her at the end of CD, he also had no reason to bring her to westside island. This is why she isn't in the other games TLDR; Eggman likely got metal from another timeline due to the lack of paradoxes. Tails probably didn't invent the spindash because of the inconsistent US manuals, Sonic is a hedgehog so he probably has a natural instinct to spindash but he just didn't perfect it in CD. Amy had no reason to be mentioned as she wasn't that important at that point

[@naitsabes6222]

Sonic didn’t ran away from her 😂, he just moved on to another adventure

[@iheartbacon76]

@@naitsabes6222 he didn't give her time to catch up, I'm sure she probably wanted to go with him though

[@kenishachisholm5692]

Meh ....no I believe sonic 2 is still before cd it strange to me how people still think it is before 2 it just doesn't feel right to me for it's placement​@@iheartbacon76

[@ericselim254]

"Tails invented the spindash according to the US instruction manual. This is canon." >The US instruction manual >Canon I was tempted to stop watching right there. "He can use the spindash in his spinoff game" By using the SONIC item.

[@VXA1PSTART]

I think CD is between 1 and 2 because CD levels look like 1's levels.

[@kenishachisholm5692]

No it doesn't like did you forget sonic cd is a time travel game

[@kenishachisholm5692]

And it's not a good reason

[@VXA1PSTART]

@@kenishachisholm5692 damn somebody wasn't loved as a kid 😬

[@kenishachisholm5692]

​@@VXA1PSTART I guess that explains your childhood then

[@areakastudios6704]

Tbh this is such a complicated question that I honestly would prefer if they kept it ambiguous.

[@harryenchiladas8826]

6:22 This is a mistake, in the Sonic 1 manual itself it says that this is not the first time Eggman and Sonic meet.

[@ORLY911]

I just go with between 1 and 2 because its the simplest solution with the least problems. Ill argue Tails Adventure is canon though, if just because its the first piece of media where we actually see the inventive side of him, which is his primary trait in pretty much everything afterwards. As for between which games it takes place thats very much up for debate.

[@anthonyscripts]

1:27 What's the name of the music in the intro?

[@gothicseawitch8772]

It's just a remix soly for the channel

[@willowboy_618]

I'm too lazy to write down my theories or think about the whole thing while living my busy life, which is why I'm happy how this video summarized the discussion about classic sonic timeline. Awesome job👍

[@Copy1992-s6h]

me: she spent 2 whole games looking for sonic 4:30

[@MarcusTheObjectShowFan]

The see you next game thing shows tails with a car,we can assume he had a break and drove back to his house

[@reggielacey2235]

The canon timeline is between 1 and 2 Case closed

[@gaigestaley2798]

My theory is that CD happened as a dream during the events of sonic 1 and 2 since the whole thing is about time travel which only appeared once in the classic series.

[@King_Cisco]

There is a way to explain Metal Sonic. The robots seen in 2 and 3 are the prototypes for Metal and since Metal Sonic was badly damaged in Sonic CD, since both 2 and 3 happen right after CD, Eggman didn’t have a lot of time to fix Metal Sonic and resorted to using the prototypes.

[@tailzgimer1726]

Mechas aren’t prototypes as they function completely differently Metal was originally made to race And the mechas were meant to fight

[@JumpMan96_]

I'm a 1 > CD > 2 kind of guy and I'd like to counter the evidence at 3:03 1. The Metal Sonic argument can be explained in three ways: - Metal Sonic was mostly designed for speed while the other Robo-Sonics were built for different purposes like fighting. - Considering Robotnik had control over most of Little Planet, he could've used the resources he gained to assist in constructing Metal Sonic and making Metal more powerful. - If we follow from the previous point, it would explain why we don't see Metal again until Chaotix or Mania chronologically. It probably took Robotnik quite a while to reconstruct Metal Sonic without the use of Little Planet's resources and being busy with other plans. 2. Amy being completely absent from 2 and 3 can be explained by the fact that Sonic kinda just leaves her behind after freeing Little Planet (as seen in Origins). It would most likely be difficult for Amy to easily get to places like West Side Island and Angel Island on her own without the use of a plane or boat. 3. Sonic being able to do the spin dash despite supposedly learning it from Tails in the Sonic 2 could be fixed by saying Tails just taught Sonic how to spin dash better in Sonic 2, this would explain why Sonic's spin dash more or less improves after CD.