Chiming and Striking Enfield style clocks, pointers on synchronizing them and making them work

I am illustrating my experiences in dis-mantling and re-assembling a Smiths Enfield "Style" of three train; Time, Chime and Striking Clock, in synchronizing the three trains to work together as well as correcting various mechanical errors which arose or may arise in the movements. This clock is not a Smiths Clock but one example of various types which were produced mainly after the first WW by the Smiths Enfield factory. Many of a similar style (chiming) were produced in Germany which were, I understand, initially marked "foreign" or not marked at all, as German products were not popular. I believe that the German movements were of excellent quality (e.g. Wurttemberg.) My apologies for repetitions, lack of correct terminology, poor editing and the length of the video but I know that 3 years ago I would have welcomed some direction in this complicated subject. I hope that novices such as I will glean some useful info from my efforts.

[@Offshoreorganbuilder]

Thanks for going to the trouble of making this useful video. As you say, the explanation is not 'slick', but the 'warts and all' presentation has its own charms. I especially like the break for luncheon! I sympathise with your struggles to name the parts correctly, as there does not seem to be an easy source of the correct names for some of the more obscure components.

[@markstone7142]

This is an amazing video - and a brilliant mind behind it. I have exactly the same movement and it works well, but I'm keeping this video link in a safe place for reference because it has taught me so much. Many thanks Spencer - you have been teaching a man or woman to fish. Excellent!

[@defcon2691]

Spencer, por fin he comprado un teléfono que me traduce tus clases magistrales al español. Siempre agradecido por tus enseñanzas, un afectuoso saludo.

[@thornabyonteesyorks3643]

I would like to thank you for taking the time to do this video I took apart an old german westminster chime clock as a first try! I managed to put it back together but your video has been invaluable not only in identifying a couple of mistakes I made in re-assembly but more so in my effort to get it sycronised! not quite there yet but with another review or two I will get there !Your help has made a great deal of difference Thanks again!

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

I am plodding on like you. I am glad you found the video of help. I know that it is not correct in all respects as they are my own experiences but I think I point in the right direction. You encourage me to get a few more done. I have found clocks to be a wonderful solace and very taxing too in my retirement. I have also posted a few on restoration of slate clocks. They are in desperate need of saving. Best clocks ever for the price you pay on ebay when they are in need of restoration.

[@thornabyonteesyorks3643]

@@s.spencertenagodus8051 It is exactly what I needed,! you certainly pointed me in the right direction I have managed to get the clock ticking over at the moment i think it needs both strike and chime to be wound up as well as the going train and it was great to watch the works actually moving and the chime tripping the strike ! still not syncronised to the correct time etc it really is an old clock with a lot of wear,I am going to see if it runs overnight ! They are facinating and a bit scary but relaxing at the same time Thanks again and I will look forward to any others you do ! Those slate clocks do look really interesting but one step at a time ! Many thanks !

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

@@thornabyonteesyorks3643 striking slate clocks are simpler than the three train clocks so don't hold back on the change if you get the chance.

[@thornabyonteesyorks3643]

@@s.spencertenagodus8051 Thanks thats interesting, may be my next purchase !

[@bernardkroeger4045]

@@s.spencertenagodus8051 I have just purchase a slate clock which I assume is not working. I will watch your other vids. Thanks a lot.

[@davel831]

Thank you so much for taking the time to do this, i have really struggled to set and sort out the striking for my west minister chime. This video is excellent and really helps and guide a novice like me. Thank you again so much

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

Great to hear from you. These old clocks are always a challenge and I'm so glad that it was helpful. Do check out the first comment by Reau??? Who corrected me on the friction spring on the minute hand. If you have time move on to French Slate clocks. They need rescuing, take time to restore but are often absolute master pieces of craftsmanship. I have a number of videos that may be of help and treetopspider also has some too.

[@davel831]

@@s.spencertenagodus8051 Thank you very much i am just in the process to see why my chimes is slow to chime?

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

@@davel831 I don't have an affiliate experienced answer but it could be that the chime spring is tiered. If it runs consistently for 7 days Chiming every quarter then I think the spring is OK but if the chimes peg out after 1 or 2 days then the spring is knackered! However this test is very tedious and takes really ages to run thru for 7 or 8 days. Alternatively if the chime races (which is not the case) then the tiny spring on the fly governor is not tight enough. So perhaps for one reason or another the fly governor may not be spinning freely so slowing the chime sequence. This could be caused by the pivot being bent or out of true etc or by another wheel in the train not transmitting power i e the spring is OK but the train has a retarding influence somewhere. The simple answer is I don't know. But a quick look at these options maybe the solution!??? Good luck. Its the learning curve and I am still at the bottom with the other novices.

[@china-trip]

My best friend, Great... Awesome... Full watched. Thanks Have a happy day!

[@rogers531]

Thanks Spencer I have been having trouble with the same clock. The chimes are so slow. Maybe if I open the fly wheel, I've checked bushings, and. Chime spring. Perfect. Thanks blue combes underneath the Hammer ha a little issue. Now you picked that. I may have to turn them around.

[@guitarmad6471]

i have the same clock movement and your video is great guidance thankyou

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

Glad it helped makes my side of my hobby worth while thanks

[@Aikidobear129]

My brain is sore ;) I was wondering if you could or would recommend a book that explains the methodology of these clock chimes. I've been searching and searching without any success. I was kind of hoping there would be a "Clock Chimes for Dummies" book out there somewhere. I am attempting to syncronize the chimes on a FHS movement and hate working on something without understanding how and why it works.

[@tommyyang5867]

👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍 GOOD JOB

[@reuasam2186]

Hi. Firstly, as a fellow amateur enthusiast I've recently stumbled across your website and KZbin videos and have watched a few of them with interest. Thanks for sharing them and please don't feel the need for the apologies you included in the introduction. I think the "natural style" in the posted videos actually makes them easier to follow. Having just completed (after I reckon an investment of 70+ hours) a Garrard Westminster chime movement and case your "agony of an exercise" comment resounded with me! On this particular movement you attributed the intermittent stopping of the going train to the hand-setting restraint on the minute wheel arbour being too tight. This got me thinking and (excuse me for asking) I wonder if that diagnosis is correct? The reason I say this is the restraint mechanism (as you of course know) is purely to allow the hands to be rotated (whilst the wheel in the train remain stationary) for the purpose of time setting. But, in normal running operation the minute wheel (under the power of the mainspring) rotates WITH the minute wheel arbour. So, normal running operation is not dependant on the minute wheel being able to slip on the arbour (in fact if it is too lose the minute wheel rotate without the arbour - meaning the hands don't move). Looking at it another way, if the minute wheel was absolutely rigid on the arbour I would expect the clock to still be able to run without problem - it just wouldn't be possible to adjust the hands... I wonder whether the reason for the failure was actually something else that has been fortuitously remedied just by the process of disassembling and reassembling the movement? Excuse the apparent impertinence of the comments but they are offered with the genuine intent of being helpful.

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

Hi Yes I think you are right. I got carried away with the fact that the minute hand was very stiff to correct by hand. Thinking through your comment logically you are right. The only thing I did was perhaps to prevent the hand from being bent cos the spring was too tight. On reflection I think I did make other adjustments which contributed to fixing the issues. Mark you that movement has been a nightmare!! I did get it working but it is still very iffy. Very nice comment, much appreciated and absolutely right. I have learnt again. Thanks.

[@user-rq9po2zv4k]

Є чому вчитися у вас😊 дякую

[@mustangk62]

Wow, Great video!! Are the arbours removeable on all Enfield movements? This is the only video I've seen, where this option is even mentioned!! Thankyou for taking the time to produce these videos...they are so incredibly helpful!

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

Hi sorry taken so long to reply. the arbor refer to i assume is the main arbor for the three springs. No i think this clock is possibly a Germán one without marks (1920's just after WW1 and we were a bit touchy about German kit then) and the Germans are pretty authentic in their manufacture of clocks so if they see a simple solution they implement it. here the have allowed for the arbor to be removed from the spring (provided they are let down first). this is not always the case. in most Enfield clock you have to take the plates apart to get at the springs to replace them. hope this helps

[@slunt3123]

Doesn’t look like an Enfield. Looks like a Petersen. Has his unique shaped rack and diamond plate on the back.

[@johnnovak9724]

I would like to thank you for taking the time to do this video I could not find any video like this explaining those two racks between plates. I have similar clock (Gufa)with two racks too. Do I understood correctly the one rack is for stopping chime train in right place and another for synchronise chime train with hammers (melody)?

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

Thank you for your interest. Yes you are correct but they are independent whilst still being synchronized. There are two governing snails the chime snail top right and hour snail on the centre arbor or cannon pinion. The Chiming train runs as the small chime snail dictates, (white metal on the right hand side.) The center star lifting wheel on the main arbor or pinion, as it rotates on the quarter hours, lifts the long silver strike detent as it reaches the quarters, but the longer “star” lifts the strike detent a little higher on the hour. As shown more clearly on the video. Meantime the chime snail determines the length of the chime as the pin on the circumference of the snail is held up for progressively longer as the snail turns before it drops into the next quarter’s recess, so stopping the chime. As it is picked up for the last quarter, on the hour, the snail lifts the pin a bit higher, in sync with the center star, lifting the strike detent a little higher. The chime snail pin in the last quarter drops on the hour, the rack and a strike detent frees the warning pin in the strike train so that the strike train is started and runs as determined by the rack tail falling on the center snail of the cannon pinion to expose the number of teeth on the rack that the gathering pallet - the little flag lifter - will run for the strikes. It is difficult to try to express in words the mechanical sequence so perhaps do follow the video - this explanation may even be a bit misleading but is, I think, in principle correct. Good luck and thanks for your interest.

[@user-rq9po2zv4k]

Дякую вам за працю

[@slunt3123]

Looks like a Gebr. Petersen movement.

[@rehorneman]

What a great video. Very thorough. I think I will have to review certain sections several times! I am fairly new with clockwork. I have not heard of Smiths Style. I am familiar with Hermle and Urgos. Right now I am learning Cuckoo/Quail clocks. They are a little complicated but I love the sound. Have you ever done cuckoos?

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

Never done a cuckoo clock. On my schedule. So glad you liked the video. An agony of an exercise. but your comments make it worth while. Thanks.

[@marcjackson9943]

Hi I have a Smith and Enfield...i think its called "the Sutherland" as its the only one iv'e been able to see looking on the internet...it has "Westminster chimes" and am trying to attempt to repair it, would you/do you know if all of these clocks have the same principals when repairing them and could i use this video as reference even though the layout is different?thanks

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

Hi Marc, The Smiths Enfield clocks do follow a pattern and are usually quite similar and sometimes parts can be interchangeable, but tread carefully, the plates may be spaced differently, the teeth a different number or the wheels/pinions not exactly the same. in addition there were many other makers particularly "foreign" - Germán hiding identity after the WW1 or later as Germán makes. these are usually really good clocks, with Westminster chimes but parts are not interchangeable and more often than not the sequence of chime/strike are worlds apart in their automotive action. this clock was not a Smith Enfield but quite similar and is a reasonably good example of the principles of a chiming clock. so good luck with the repairs. i started in much the same way buying on eBay. just keep at it. they are not simple, but are simple mechanics, meaning the can be complicated to understand but usually follow logical patterns! kind regards Simon

[@marcjackson9943]

@@s.spencertenagodus8051 thanks for the quick reply. i'll keep on tinkering and if no joy i'll get intouch with "The Repair Shop" haha

[@markfanning1098]

Thank you for the video great stuff, I have one of those clocks, but the pendulum leader was missing when it arrived, do you know where I could get one.

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

Hi Mark, I buy my "new spares" like springs etc from Cousins www.cousinsuk.com but the second hand spares i trawl thru eBay and find a similar movement and buy it or sometimes you may be able to pick up the same part as advertised in Antique Clock spare parts. i think it is a case of simply hunting down the bits needed. good luck - its a long haul!!

[@markfanning1098]

@@s.spencertenagodus8051 thanks a million I'll keep hunting.

[@bazthehandyman]

Just wondering why you wear gloves?

[@s.spencertenagodus8051]

at 80+ they are not as they used to be! and Mathew Reid of the Open Clock Club (see videos) insists on them. much of the time I don't wear them as they make the work very difficult but at the end, after cleaning and polishing the movement, its best to wear them and not leave finger prints as they endure for ages!