Class Breakdown: The Sorcerer - The Dungeoncast Ep.24

Will and Brian get into some serious sorcery on this episode. Entities boasting raw innate power in fantastic fashion; Sorcerers are as fun to role play as they are to write backstory for. Come check out everything this class has to offer this week on The Dungeoncast!
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The Dungeoncast is a D&D podcast where co-hosts Will and Brian talk about everything Dungeons & Dragons. Everything is up for discussion from Gods and Demon Lords to being a dungeon master and even building characters while keeping the conversational atmosphere lighthearted and friendly. Tune in as they explore the Dragon's Hoard of topics available from #5E, 4E, and all other editions of the world's most popular #ttrpg! Thanks for watching! #dungeonsanddragons

[@Candid1ify]

Always thought of the Sorcerer as the artist like Jimmy Hendrix or Van go, run more on inspiration then concrete. Wizards as general Practitioners like Doctors and Physicians.

[@josephladeroute6184]

Just a thought... if Harry Potter's magic comes from his bloodline, yet he also studied it, does that make him a multi-classer? Good podcast, guys. Great to listen to

[@Thedungeoncast]

Hmmm, may hap he is! Thanks for listening!

[@Not-The-Plan]

Hey may be an arcanist from pathfinder with the arcana bloodline.

[@chewbaccasan442]

Love your guys videoes I go to dnd adventure league at my lgs now because of you guys

[@sivartevafal]

My friend is playing a Teifling Wild Magic Sorcerer, he’s still new to D&D so he let me come up with his powers backstory, I decided that an arch-devil, haven’t decided which yet, was able to influence his soul at the moment of birth and give him this power so that he could be used as a “superweapon” in the Blood War eventually, so I’m laying the seeds for that eventual discovery, thinking I’ll have the party encounter a fortune teller soon. I’ll RP it all seancey and when it’s his turn she’ll start screaming about “A child of Blood and promise” “the foundling of Entropy” “the eyes of his infernal father are upon him!” And then boom candles go out and the whole party is just magically ejected into an empty field where the tent used to be...

[@AnatoDragonshard]

I consider the wild sorcerer as the guy that grew up around near ancient ruins and magic was absorbed like radiation. Kinda like the kid that hung out around the power plant because he like the glowing rocks... Then he started glowing.

[@phoenixjm83]

This is my favorite class! I'm so glad I found this podcast! You guys really help to make the game easier to understand and you're a great source of inspiration for character creation. Thanks again!

[@TaoScribble]

I wanna be a neutral good draconic sorcerer urd with a mini-flumph for a pet. The only thing stopping me is my severe hatred of rolling dice and being social. XD

[@WickedlyInkedWolf]

Is John Constantine from DC comics a wizard or a sorcerer? Web DM never got back to me.

[@Thedungeoncast]

A Human Wizard with the Background: Criminal and the Feat Lucky I would say.

[@charltonsticher3461]

He's actually a warlock.

[@ChristnThms]

Thematically, I want to see more origins. I'm also hoping that as the origin options expand, we'll see different ways to use sorcerer points. The metamagic is great, but I'd like to see sorcerer points used to flavor each origin.

[@lam-ben-yam4015]

I always imagine sorcerers to have some level of arrogance to them since they were born with these powers naturally.

[@Etanexhunter16]

So glad I discovered this channel

[@Thedungeoncast]

+Étienne Bourgeois Glad you found us too!

[@JukeBredd10]

I wish they made an Arcane Bloodline, but I don't think that's going to happen.

[@MonStarGuy]

18:10 My favorite sorcerer subclass from 4e was the Cosmic sorcerer. I'd love to see it make 5e canon.

[@yuuyiatakahashi1943]

I’m late to the cast, found you guys through another channel that I found a few weeks ago. Hadn’t played since the early days of 3.5 and got dropped into “Hey can you come hang out and run our 5e campaign?!” (Long story but that’s the short of it) But at 00:38:00 he starts saying he’s been trying to find a way within the mechanics to make a good offense/defense character that could utilize the draconic origins scale armor... here ya’go... Wood-Elf Sorcerer Monk, with draconic origins and either way of the Kensi or Open Hand as you monastic tradition

[@sakisaotome6753]

If you want a sorcerer bad Gish let tell you of mine. I try to play as sword mage as I can. The truck is to go high dex. +3 dex at the start of the game gives you 16ac which is equivalent to chain. So you begin the game with the equivalent of mud tier heavy armor without any levels in fighter yet. Make sure you get green flame sword and booming blade add two of your cantrips. Add these are the 4e sword mage cantrips anyway. I also got ready of Frost for a distant attack with a debuff and shocking grasp as a Melee range spell to disable OAs. The way I have been playing things is to level up in fight after an odd level sorcerer level. So that I am getting my spell level progressions. At second level you take fighter and get a shield. Now you have AC 18! If you didn't get a good finesse weapon from race you move up to rapier. You'll get a great a couple levels late so at 6 you get war caster and you are now set. At lvl 3 fighter I took battle master since it pairs nicely and can be used with gfs or bb and is devastating on critical. If you bump your dex up to 20 they means you will have 13+5+2 = AC 20 using only regular armor. Of you get a +1/+2 Shields you will be amazing especially with the shield spell. Them you just need to pick your metamagic and spells to tailor around your build. Quicken and twin spell are amazing done it lets you cast a full spell and do a melee attack with your gfs or bb. Also you can twin bb for extra attack. You don't get any aegis abilities or the summon sword but it does make a really good Gish. The other option you have is scorcadin half sorcerer half paladin. This is an unbelievably great class combo but it's harder to do as a dex class to take advantage of the dragon sorcerer armor. Like in my fighter above. Is especially challenging since you technically need 13 str. So if you want to go dex you need to roll stats (and obviously get good roles) or just go str and ignore dragon armor. But regardless with sorcerer spell slots and paladin smites it's an amazing Gish combo.

[@sakisaotome6753]

A couple of notes. If you use the fixed HP option usted off rolling the dragon sorcerer effectively had a D8 hit die. The second dice that the chaos sorcerer rolls gives you the option to pick which result you take I believe. So if it's you fireball your team or you hurt your foes you can pick the later instead of the former. Also dragons Sievers sorcerer may spend sorcery points to get resistance at level 6+

[@TwistedTentacleInn]

"what J. K. Rowling says, goes" - Brian 2017. Oh Brian, if only you had some " foresight" spells cast before you said that, you'd avoid a possible Twitter backlash in 2019. - Innkeeper Vase Odin

[@Shogundoxie1414]

Harry Potter is a lousy ripoff of Star Wars

[@alexzilla5459]

Only touch the lamp! XD

[@thomasalegredelasoujeole9998]

Magician comes from ancient Persia « Magi » ; who were zoroastrian astrologists and priests (The Three Wise Men from the east !)

[@lord6617]

just imho, the sorcerer's spell list is total bullshit. They get access to some spells, then the same spell effect a few levels up or below they for no reason don't have access to. I can totally see them not getting ritual spells and a few other types of spells, but most of the spell list limiting they've had inflicted on them just serves to screw over flavor and style of play. They are already limited in spells known, limiting them to 1/2 or less the arcane spell list is just garbage - and you know they realize this, because if you look at things like xanathars, the ratio of wizard to sorcerer spells is much closer to like 2/3 to 3/4, but they won't retroactive the core list which is annoying. It also screws over metamagic.

[@Arzual]

Nice work guys! And that "jingle" around 18:00 minutes, is that your own creation or is this just a song I don't know or have forgotten?

[@Thedungeoncast]

Thank You! And yes that is an unnamed jingle of our creation. Probably should title it tho... I think we'll call it "A Short Rest".

[@filthycasual6619]

Swords and sandals example - Conan -

[@seanheath711]

Playing a shadow duergar sorcerer and want to multiclass... what do you guys suggest? I'm turning level 2..

[@bluedruid8152]

Look at the magus from pathfinder its a gish done right

[@coleriedel751]

F 4th edition. Sorry, not sorry.

[@NamelessKing1597]

39:25 you could multiclass paladin into sorcery, they both spellcast using charisma.

[@juusovuolle8251]

and then dip 2 levels into hex lock

[@sakisaotome6753]

By ignoring the meta magic and sorcery points you are missing such a HUGE part of the sorcerer class. You guys skimmed the just the thinnest party of the class. Unless I missed some which actually might be add I was listening to you guys while waiting for the library to open to get xanathar. So I may have missed drifted off a bit cone to think of it. So If I did I apologise. If I didn't you guys really should yeah about them its what really sets the wizards and sorcerers apart.

[@Thedungeoncast]

I believe we talk about sorcery points at 17:00 and start talking about Meta magic at 21:45.

[@sakisaotome6753]

you are so right! I completely apologize and you even emphasize how important it is for the class. i just rewatched the video and i think i dozed off at some point in the begining when you were talking about sourcrouse origins and woke up again while you were talking about them, so i didn't even realize i missed anything. So a couple new points to bring up. one which kinda goes to what you said you used to feel about not liking them cuz they were innately born with magic instead of having to study for it like wizards. but and you bring up music and bards later, so this may be a fitting analogy. Its like comparing someone like perhaps bach to mozart or beethovan. They were child prodigies. they had the music in their blood. mozart was composing music at 5 and playing for the palace at 17. that is just like what sorcery is like, but mozart had to work to improve himself and some of his best known pieces were written toward the end of his life because he worked to improve his art. and that i think is the difference between sorcerers and wizards. To the Sorcerer Magic is an art, to the wizard it is a science. science is different to art but it is no less valid. also though i often play a dragon scorcerer as the scion of a dragon, the players handbook suggests its more common for that magic to be a blessing bestowed upon a family by a dragon rather than actual mating. that said my own sorcerer is the granddaugther of an ancient dragon so /shrug. you also mention that sorcerer are suited toward blasty style play because of its metamagic, but it is also true that the sorcerer is also well suited to a buffer/debuffer build. aslo because of their metamagic. for example the twinspell you mention is the ability to target 2 creatures with a spell that would normally let you only target 1. this means that you can twin cast very powerful concentration spell on multiple characters, be it a debuff or a buff. so you can haste 2 people in your party, or you can cast disintrigrate, or polymorph, or dominate person. and while a sorcerer doesn't get the sculpt spell like the evocer to exclude your allies in your area of effect spell the sorcerer has careful spell which allows any allies in the effect to automatically succeed their save. that means its not so great an ability to use when casting fireball as they would still take half damage, but spells that are save or no effect like color spray, web, hypnotic pattern, reveres gravity, incindiary cloud are auto saves so allies are free of their effect meaning that sorcerer can be great battlefield controllers. now earlier in the video you ask the question why do we need another spell caster class (especially one so similar to the wizard) it wasn't the add a sword and sorcery type caster. it was in fact purely mechanical. it was to deal with a mechanical issue that players had with the vancian magic system. now adays in 5e and even in 4de spontanious casting is the default method of spell casting. but that wasn't so in 1-3e. before the sorcerer casters had to prepare their spell, but not how they do it today. in those editions you picked each and every individual spell you were going to potentially cast. meaning you did just prepare magic missle you had to pick how many of your spell slots were going to be for magic missile. so you might prepare 2 magic missle, 1 burning hands, and a colory spray. if you cast 2 magic missile and you wanted to cast a 3rd you couldn't. you couldn't just give up a burning hands in order to cast magic missile you could olnly cast each specific spell you prepared. if you never fought groups of enemies than you waisted you color spray and burning hands. ALL classes were like this, with the minor exception of the cleric who coudl swap out a prepared spell for either a cure or inflict spell. the sorcerer introduced the ability to spontaniously cast any spell you know. which was HUGE. they also knew less spells like today but they could also cast a few more spells than wizards. in 4e & 5e spontanious casting is now default. also metamagic in 3e was a wizard thing because it was pointless for a sorcerer to do as it took way to long to cast it that way.

[@sakisaotome6753]

Also 3e didn't have any bloodlines or sorcerous origins. The dragon origin was originally a prestige class that came out some time after the release of 3e but it was popular and kinda became the default.

[@DoWhatNowQuestionmark]

First this episode was very poorly written researched and executed. Other episodes were way more informative and easier to listen too. Not only was this episode was filled with miss-information about the class. But what was the most ear cringing was how you two were conflating Meta-gaming and Power-gaming. Meta-gaming is literally cheating, usually in a way like you the player having your 8 INT Barbarian with no knowledges give correct information about how to counter Bla arcane spell. What you two were referring to with such confidence and ignorance was power gaming. Which as long as you do not cheat is perfectly and encouraged by the game. If some one wants to build a character that focuses on utility or damage or healing nothing is wrong with focusing on it and taking everything available so they may do it top notch. Making fun of it, looking down on it, and staying you would not allow it in your game makes you a horrible DM. Now if you said this person Magic-Penciled extra stats, which would be another form of cheating, then yes understood. But again that would not be Meta-gaming. This episode is getting a thumbs down not only for being poorly planned and executed. But for just being mostly trash content. This episode be re-shot and this one should go into a blooper real. You can do better Dungeoncast.

[@paulh3892]

Love the videos guys! You two do a great job of explaining the game and lore through humorous and candid conversation filled with lots of pop culture references