Is remote work over? Two experts debate return to office mandates

[@dwoolf7019]

It's an Ego thing and fear of losing control by the "old school" leadership.

[@j01150126]

Boomer mentality

[@careyfreeman5056]

It's about commercial real estate. But nobody would care about that, so they sell these tropes.

[@PBRStreetgang]

Nailed it on the head. Classic "Well, I have to go back so why not you?" argument. Why? Because as long as I have a computer, internet access, and a phone I can outshine everyone who sits in the big corner offices. MS even has a remote app literally called TEAMS. Not only can you video-conference, but also share files and updates instantly with your team. Nothing about working in an office makes sense after remote workers continued to be just as if not more productive from home. The problem from the old-school train of thought is that "well, we bought or leased this place, so we're damn well going to get our money's worth." Too many flaws in that kind of logic to fit in this comment.

[@user-jy3zl2vp4b]

aka allowing standards to drop.

[@qatarworldcupwinnermessi]

They want people to quit. Of course they know their employees prefer to work at home. Most of them making the rules work at home. They don't want their peasants having the same perks as them. Get back in the office and if you don't like it, QUIT

[@naptimelaser]

The fact that Jay is working from home during this interview is hilarious to me

[@dimedavispresentstalkyospit]

🤣🤣🤣

[@TheCNYMike]

It's either ironic or hypocritical.

[@legalfictionnaturalfact3969]

He's doing that because it humanizes him. Exactly what he doesn't want for lower level employees.

[@ddbtube2138]

😂😂😂 it doesn’t have to do with performance and productivity. It has to with who holds the real estate. Who invest in this big companies.

[@Fadeinwow]

He can't pretend to be working and he's not paid hourly. Big difference. If work from home continues, it will need to go from hourly to performance based. You cant expect companies to ignore all the videos on social media, showing people how to trick the computer to think your working; so you can watch a movie while still getting paid. Thats literally theft

[@jvw418]

Being a “team member” when you aren’t being compensated for inflation in your commuting and daycare cost, rent etc is BS!

[@anthonypan205]

"If your work can be done remotely, it can be done in another country" Well, pretending that your work can't be done remotely won't change the fact that it can be done remotely

[@toddtaylor81]

Hahaha nailed it

[@samsciascia4004]

If they value in the office you won't be replaced if they don't remote work pays less based on the market.

[@pmsTriix]

Yep

[@MG-rg3jo]

Perhaps but the greater point is your more effective when you are at the office and therefore more valuable when you do go in. Right or wrong that is the belief of employers.

[@microwavecoffee]

I think the point he's making is that if the work is done as a team it would be more self-sustaining, and would have less chance of being replaced.

[@alohatraveler]

Employees aren't going back to commuting 14 hours per week so the corporations can feel good about synergy. Those days are over. Corporations aren't paying their employees a real living wage so those that allow a work life balance will get the best, most talented employees We have proven telecommuting works. The good old boy network is over

[@Bryceccc]

You're on point!

[@MG-rg3jo]

I think job losses due to recession will correct a lot of this. Things reset themselves very quickly. I remember during Covid people thinking we were never going back to the office. Let me tell you there is a far greater chance of going back 5 days a week than permanent work from home.

[@ブレイヴフェンサ]

I wish it was truly over but doesn’t look like where I live too many old heads still writing the rules.

[@Nirobiscloset10]

Exactly!! I agree with every word!

[@vicary12]

THIS!

[@InspiringThings101]

The answer is simple. Have companies offer remote/hybrid options and have companies that are fully 100% on site. The data will tell which way employees prefer. I bet those pushing for full back to office, won't dare to test this out.

[@markmilitant]

Kevin is right I’m tired of these old grandpas 👴 telling us to go back to work remote work 🧑‍💻 is here to stay wtf 🤬

[@dtxgmoney]

Senior managers in my business I've overheard that they missed the office gossip, water cooler talk.

[@markmilitant]

@@dtxgmoney Lol 😂 old head nostalgia weirdos times have changed

[@rjsuvakjr]

This is the first time I have seen him have this standpoint. Good to see Mr. Wonderful actually listened.

[@kjay5056]

The "old grandpas" are paying the bills. Once the leverage of finding workers goes away so does the leverage of workers wanting to work from home. It's going to be do you want to come in or do you want to work for this company. Also, these workers wanting to work from home they should also lose their "locality pay" if you are not going into the office? If you were working in NY and now you are in South Carolina, they have have every right to give you less salary because you live in a less expensive area. You can't have it both ways.

[@stephaniew4972]

I agree with Kevin, remote will be the future option if not workers will leave and look for options.

[@logangantner3863]

Employers will also stop hiring Americans altogether.

[@Xan-iv6tq]

@@logangantner3863 and those non-American workers they don’t hire will be remote 😂 exactly what they don’t want

[@logangantner3863]

@@Xan-iv6tq I don't think you are drawing the correct conclusions. Employers don't want remote workers because in-person workers deliver better results and personal growth. But if the employer has no option other than remote workers with watered down results, they're going to choose the offshore labor that costs 1/3 of their American counterparts. American developers are actively outsourcing themselves.

[@mrfivebyfive87]

How detached from reality is someone who thinks that people crave micro management to function?

[@legalfictionnaturalfact3969]

He's a blatant liar.

[@craigenputtock]

If your boss tells you that you have to go back to the office, look immediately for remote work, and as soon as you get it email your boss and tell him that he can give your job to his mother.

[@logangantner3863]

Enjoy the recession.

[@kjay5056]

I agree with what you say and that's exactly what's going to happen.

[@critterdude311]

If you can't create the 'synergy' with a remote team, that's a reflection on your poor management skills, not the workers.

[@IAmTheAnswerer]

Jay is a clown. I am so sick of the veiled threats about how companies will just hire someone overseas to replace you. I have seen companies do this just to end up dealing with communication issues, cultural issues, competence issues, experience issues, security issues, project delays, time zone issues, and contractual & regulatory issues - just to name a few. Many of these companies ended up reshoring these jobs because the headache and issues were too much. And for what? Because they wanted to spite their workers because they couldn't control them. So in the end they hurt their own business, lost highly skilled talent, wasted time, and wasted money. Nothing wrong with outsourcing if you do it right, but bad managers like Jay never do it right. Workers are adults. They are not children. Let them work from home, or they will find a company that will, because top talent always has opportunities.

[@logangantner3863]

I promise you that a standard Indian dev is much cheaper and more competent than a junior American dev trying to break into the industry. Mass WFH environments are making it much more difficult for Americans to secure their breakout roles in tech fields and it's only getting worse.

[@Phelps1111]

@@logangantner3863 What? That's generally not been my experience. I've seen countless points from standard indian devs asking questions on stack overflow/etc. with answers that don't even make sense from other indian devs.

[@logangantner3863]

@@Phelps1111 Notice that I'm comparing a standard Indian dev to a **junior** American developer. Junior developers don't post answers at all on stack overflow and other forums, and if they did it would be far more ill-informed than the average response. And again, a new American hire typical expects 60-90k starting. A mid-career dev in India will work for far less than this.

[@legalfictionnaturalfact3969]

Logan, why would you compare Junior devs to "standard" devs.. by which we assume you mean staff devs? Companies that offshore to spite their workers end up getting what they deserve. Indian devs simply aren't superior as a general rule. The proof is in the pudding and these crappy companies come crawling back. :-)

[@blockmaster6904]

Honestly remote will have less drama.

[@careyfreeman5056]

I love how they play the "work ethic" angle when this is all about the commercial real estate market.

[@shaojeemy473]

I live in Chicago, started commuting about three months ago. I got held up by two guys on the train asking me for my belongings or I will get stabbed. Told HR. HR responded, "report to police and take another train." They would rather me risk my life to sit in an office than give me peace of mind working from home. We have the infrastructure for WFH, it's just their "lifestyle".

[@IAmTheAnswerer]

That is terrible. Its clear that the company doesn't care about you. Start looking for a remote job!

[@kjay5056]

I think you need to vote for new politicians in Chicago...it's a sh$#t show there...no surprise.

[@Shaojeemy]

@@kjay5056 moved my ass to texas last month

[@kjay5056]

@@Shaojeemy 2 thumbs up...good move and hope things go good for you there!

[@generalposter4792]

Long before the pandemic, most firms have been using virtual teams for years. Part of the team in 2 or more spots in the US. And other parts on the team in India, some in Argentina. So these have been extremely successful. So it did not matter if all those were home or in the Office. School with small kids is different because their attention spans need a person to keep it there. Adults have already done this and succeeded. And not just in the last 2 - 3 years. My firm has been successful at virtual teams for 10 years. So not sure what the "Expert" is talking about 🙂

[@SuccessfulladiesSoftLife]

I can do you one better, firms have also been hiring remote customer service agents all over the world to replace American worksers for cheap. So the excuse given that American workers will be replaced, many already have.

[@Riddingwithvivian]

If your not bringing the added value to your position and company regardless of where you work home or office then you will be outsourced

[@CM-tc4ny]

Funny how the folks who don't actually do any work have the most to say about how actual workers work.

[@8bit_paul]

Kevin is right, I've been WFH 2 years 5 months and it's not changing back. Teamwork works great from home, it's all about communication. And mentoring and transparency and client communication have ALL improved with WFH, as long as we have the imagination to be proactive and follow through with it, and not be stuck in the same old same-room dependencies.

[@WPS691]

Employers are so impractical. And then the employees just following suit are pretty much useless cos they can't find any other job.

[@jeff946]

Great points. Plus you don't have all the noise/directions of so maybe people around you talking. Getting food, taking a bio break are quicker at home. I don't know why that guy thinks you don't interact with others working from home. You do (chats, calls, etc), just not in person.

[@WPS691]

@@jeff946 - The guy in the phone thinks he needs to walk 'up to' people and disturb/distract them to show his presence and ego around the office. That's the big problem with these 'managers' / 'leaders' - they love seeing others stroke their egos in person.

[@logangantner3863]

There is NO WAY that mentorship has improved with WFM. Zero chance. The past 3 years, I have watched so many new hires floating in the wind at multiple companies. The other employees literally just forget about them because they don't physically see them struggling. New hires are afraid to proactively seek help because they don't understand the culture of the workplace and because it is more intimidating to DM someone compared with walking by their desk. When I switched companies last year and I needed help getting started with the software, people would literally ignore me when I messaged asking for help, or get back to me 8 hours later. It's a trash system and we're going to have trash devs in the future because of it.

[@tullymcfarland9015]

@@logangantner3863 Citation needed also read the room nobody wants to hear your ad hoc excuses for office mandates you tool. You want your job to function as a parasocial environment go ahead the rest of us want to live life.

[@SB-ms6xo]

Kevin is absolutely correct and his comments reflect the opinion of the overwhelming majority of the work force. Remote work allows a company to attract and hire the best talent. That talent level directly impacts an organizations success. All companies will tell you that they are seeking the best talent and you can't find it if you limit your search to a 50 mile square box. A zoom call does not some how "magically" inhibit an employee's intelligence, ability to collaborate, or creativity. I have managed remote team for 3 years and can say with overwhelming confidence that we are more productive, more engaged and have less turnover. I previously managed teams and worked in an office setting for over 15 years, so this is not conjecture. The work force is evolving and soon the majority of it will be the millennial generation Corporations and their leadership who maintain an antiquated approach will see their talent simply vanish. Bright, innovative and forward thinking minds need to be compensated with the commodity of time and a sense of balance, not just dollars. Simply put the consensus of my generation is that time is more valuable than money.

[@Steven-T]

Yup. Never thought I'd be agreeing with Mr. Fantastic, but every point he brought up was valid and tangible. Time, money, safety, reduced stress, environmental impacts, ergonomics. The other side talked about "feeling the buzz, building relationships, teamwork". No good reason against wfh besides poo-pooing something that's different.

[@deputy3690]

No, Kevin is wrong.

[@GoosetavoS42]

New ideas and bright minds is what keeps the country going forward. Sticking to the old ways decrease that

[@1merkur]

Insisting on "back to office" has two main reasons: 1. management being incapable to adjust to work remotely 2. managers being afraid that it'll become obvious how little they actually do

[@et8886]

Mentorship is over-rated and it rarely happens in a work environment. You can mentor someone remotely as easily as in person…

[@dunkarldunkarl4168]

Exactly

[@logangantner3863]

This is bs and just not true. Mentorship is extremely important to new hires in any technical field, especially software. And while it is *possible* to mentor people remotely, it is way less likely to happen. Social bonds are so much flimsier when everyone is remote.

[@et8886]

@@logangantner3863 social bonds require effort, trust, and time to be established and maintained. Social bonds, especially at work, are flimsy in general without the above regardless if you are remote or in person. Being in the office 100% does not increase the probability and effectiveness of mentorship if the work culture does not promote/support it.

[@logangantner3863]

@@et8886 I'm sorry but what you are saying simply does not ring true. I had excellent mentorships and work relationships in jobs prior to WFH culture. Never happens anymore; everyone seems to be passing ships in the night these days. Everyone is so eager for WFH to be permanent that they just make up stuff like what you just said to justify it. There ARE actual drawbacks to wfh.

[@jasonwong3945]

The question is who has time to mentor and collaborate anymore? You got one person teams. These days. Everyone is bogged down with work. People throw work at you in a sink or swim environment regardless of if you are in the office or not. I for one would rather have more time myself to concentrate and figure out how to do things than stick in the office and waste time only to have to spend more hours at home to learn...once again by myself

[@luckyme213]

Times have changed people, remote work is the future. Bosses are just made they will have a hard time bossing people, and they will have to get their own coffee 😅

[@Nirobiscloset10]

Exactly! Lol

[@logangantner3863]

Remote work will not be the future if it's actually the case that in-person social bonds have long term benefits to work and to quality. Cream always floats to the top in the end.

[@nicwise5227]

Working Mothers need a voice on this!!!! Remote is making a huge life quality and productivity improvement without commute!!!!

[@niccolemarcial5406]

We didn’t have a voice before.. why would we now?… But yea I agree. I can’t imagine having done this baby thing while being forced back into an office to be on zooms all day anyway (I do computer work)

[@giarc1988]

Never going back to an office

[@alangivre2474]

You can always have your employees return to office for a price. The question is whether companies they are willing to pay it.

[@shawn.s.woodward2787]

Then AI can do your job

[@grasshopper1153]

I judge companies by their opinion on remote work. If a company does not allow remote work, then they probably have old-school attitudes and they probably do not have the best people in my field and I will pass them up.

[@Micro_Learning]

Same....same. It's awesome how it's such a great indicator. It's like...that's all you need to know.

[@andre-le-bone-aparte]

No one says the obvious... Hard for the "Boss" to sleep with the new intern when she's able to work remote. Remote Work is a win for work-place harassment!

[@Nirobiscloset10]

Exactly.

[@vitamindealer7915]

@@Nirobiscloset10 this is a very strange thing that this question is not posed to these Pro office bosses. It is totally a reality.

[@Nirobiscloset10]

@@vitamindealer7915 Truth.

[@vitamindealer7915]

@@Nirobiscloset10 all illegal behavior in an office happens typically face to face, not in writing.

[@dixiegirl999]

I recently had a job offer that I had to turn down due to it being an hour from home. They too understood due to the time it would have taken to get there & cost of gas too. On top of that, I just broke my ankle a few weeks ago & that would make it much harder on me than working at home. Luckily, I got offered a job to work remotely & offered more money too.

[@张秦博]

congratulations。 where did you find jobs? I registered on Indeed but didn't find yet.

[@nessab6798]

@@张秦博 I am on Indeed everyday. I am currently in office doing a job that can be done from home, however IT claims they dont know how to make it happen! I HATE HATE commuting and with the fall and winter seasons right around the corner my depression is already kicking in. I would love to move to Florida and continue doing my job, but clearly there is no push to even try much less DO at this backward company I find myself working for. Ughhhhhh

[@张秦博]

@@nessab6798 hah, maybe you will find something fun in the office and the commuting. bad things can change to be good things. hah. got it, I will check on indeed.

[@Bradimoose]

The company I work for has lots of remote workers and they fly us in a couple times a year for meetings and teambuilding events like going to a baseball game. The team works fine I don't understand why they want everyone commuting again.

[@oOignignoktOo1]

Because they need yout to spend more money on hyper inflated fuel so you eat through your savings so they have more leverage / control over you. If you have f-you money they can't shackle you.

[@scrapbrainsinc]

I strongly disagree with the idea that everyone is super easily replaceable. I've worked at companies that had teams overseas, and had to have a 6PM PST meeting with them. The results really weren't that of 20% of the quality of our home company. With Zoom/Skype today it's so easy to to get a call with 3 team members, and share everything clearly on your computer. No need to play lets see who booked which conference room for the next 30 minutes, while running around the building getting kicked out of here or there. Need computer help? IT can easily remote into your computer and fix any problem.

[@jockcooper8888]

yeah for me zoom is so much better.. Just the fact that I can share my screen and talk about or explain something, then someone else can respond and share their screen is 100 times better than being in some conference room. At my company there are screens in most rooms, but they are clunky and difficult to use, it doesn't really compare.

[@felixthecat2786]

People are certainly not easily replaceable. Everyone thinks that but then they have to train people and it takes years for someone to become an expert like that old worker was. Good luck with the "i'm just going to replace you" mentality.

[@wadeharris348]

I've been working remotely since the whole thing began and haven't been back to the office since or seen my coworkers except via phone call meetings. I love it. We do our work well as a team and I get the benefit of being home with my gf and my dog. I'm able to cook my own meals, workout during my lunch break and actually live a healthier life. I'm getting ready to change jobs and will be taking a hybrid role as they are increasing my salary significantly, but these past two years have been amazing. I wasn't tempted to go out and buy lunch or coffee with others. I was able to max out my retirement accounts and still invest almost 30k throughout this time with a low salary. It really does help when you work from home. I'm more interested now in working to live rather than living to work and want to enjoy my money that I worked hard to save and invest.

[@ronmurphy7800]

It's all about you. That's societies problem. You, your dog, your gf, your little group of friends. Let's face it, you are afraid of the world and life in general. Carbon footprint! What a joke. You still will put on approximately the same miles because you sneak out driving during the day while you are supposed to be working. So you make your own lunch? What about the cafes, and servers? What happens to their businesses and ability to make a living? Air quality? Come on. So what about the air quality in every other buildings you go in. No more bars, restaurant, movie, basketball, museum, hotel, church, college, school, concert, play, etc, for you?most don't have new hvac, which by the way will never be retrofit with filtering technology because of cost. Your immune system takes care of you if you let it work and you take care of yourself physically. Afraid of getting your watch stolen? Easy problem to fix but you want to defund the police and quit prosecuting crime. You don't have to stay in your little bubble, live life. Just admit that you have no desire or the skills or the heart to really be involved with other humans in a dynamic society. Only the ones you allow onto the little screen on your computer and your little circle of like minded sheep. It's all about you. Sad.

[@tuabenjamin]

@@ronmurphy7800 …angry much? Sheesh. Lmao.

[@DanknDerpyGamer]

​@@ronmurphy7800You know, just making up stuff about others doesn't make their points invalid, nor makes you look smart, right? 🤡🤡🤡

[@Andrew-it7fb]

@@ronmurphy7800 It sounds like you're afraid of a world where you're actually judged on your production and not just looking busy by sitting at your desk at the office. I don't go out during the day because I'm working. I've saved a ton on gas, not to mention the time saved. People who want to go out for lunch still can. Nothing's stopping them. Your excuses are ridiculous.

[@ronmurphy7800]

@@Andrew-it7fb I'm glad you saved money that's admirable. But my point is that society is crumbling because everyone has decided it's only about themselves. I carpooled to the office to save money, I get it. But the folks I carpooled with became good friends. Can you extrapolate that carpool out to dozens or hundreds of others you would be interwoven with in a office environment? You will make it through life without saving the gas money believe me. Those few hundreds of dollars will be irrelevant in the whole scope of your life. But true friends (not Facebook) that you experience life with will change your life and make it rich and rewarding. Live life in community with others. It's the only reason why we are here in the first place. Peace

[@PedestrianPony]

Either you let me work from home or I take my degrees and 15+ years of managerial experience and going to work for your competitor who happily will. The reason WFH isn't going away is because this is a free market where any firm that requires in-office time will lose top talent to those who don't. Easy.

[@badgerfishinski6857]

Exactly

[@TheWizard856]

No reason to enter an office. Don't threaten me with outsourcing. If you want to outsource to India me being willing to commute won't be stopping you from doing that.

[@John-sm6by]

100% this! Employers twisted logic that they’re going to outsource the jobs of workers that want to work remotely, by hiring foreign workers that are still going to be remote. By all means, go for it!

[@John-sm6by]

Funny how Kevin points out 9 valid points of concerns of employees, yet Jay totally brushed them aside with disregard and goes back to the trite response of, “but what about the collaboration, what about teamwork, what about your career, your growth.” Just shows you how much this guy doesn’t care about your needs, but wants to go back to the old system that supports his own growth.

[@RandomPeasant123]

Career growth? We are just a number on a spreadsheet to them!!!

[@jvw418]

Also; company leaders that push for return to work for “team building” while making record profits are just looking for a way to stay relevant in their position. If they can’t adapt to digital culture, the way all of those employees did; they will eventually be the herd being thinned out by the board when revenues fall due to high turnover of tenured employees not being compensated to return to said office

[@PeterParker-wj3cr]

working remotely really comes down to the specific job. If you work in a call centre then no need to work from an office. If your a cashier then you have to go to work..lol

[@cherisew.843]

Totally agree

[@Goyanks28]

Exactly lol not a hard task

[@briannerk3373]

@@Goyanks28 lol

[@lynniec]

It's easier for management to look like they serve any useful purpose in an office setting. Studies have proven productivity is increased working from home. The vast majority of offices in corporate America are toxic and depressing.

[@TomTor-k4u]

I think the fact the both of them did the interview from their homes/office should settle the argument. both of them realized that in order to be efficient and productive they should not drive all the way to the studio. That's what remote work gives you! the ability to be productive and to utilize your day in a more efficient way. I think the real reason businesses want ppl to work from the office is they are afraid to lose their employees to a better company. lets face it, when you work from home it is easier for you to shop around, interview and assess you real worth.

[@DoveDaniels]

remote working is better than working with people in the office. like seriously we don't want to be in the office with people.

[@Seegie16]

If theyd embrace work from home wed have the solution to high oil prices. But, nah thats too easy..

[@Nirobiscloset10]

Truth.

[@gustavopizarro2517]

Some companies want people to work back into the office because management is terrible. I worked where management does not support/train/communicate/etc which cause for the lower staff members to take on heat which makes everything look bad. Instead of realizing that, they think bringing back people into the office will change the outcome. Silly people if you ask me

[@derylrichardson423]

Jay sounds like the little old ladies in the office that printed and saved every single piece of paper and refused to save documents electronically, out of fear of losing them. The world turns and as it turns, we must improve and move forward. What I'm waiting to hear someone say is that 40 hours a week is too many hours to be in the office. I think we need to either spend 5 hours a day in the office 5 days a week or only 3 day work weeks or allow business to operate on weekends or allow business to work past 5 PM (I'm talking about cooperate jobs, because most of them are M-F/9to5).

[@misscapri]

Absolutely!

[@Nirobiscloset10]

Agree.

[@julienbonin]

At 5:30, this guys says something about people wanting to be professionals the rest of their lives. No body wants that. People want to work, make as much money as possible so they can retire and spend time with their families. This dude is lost.

[@alexdegaston422]

Kevin nailed it in many ways. A few other things he didn't mention: 1. When you are looking for people of certain skill sets you open yourself up to a much wider pool of candidates by advertising "Remote" instead of "certain location". This is by far the biggest benefit of "Remote" hiring. You can focus RIGHT NOW on hiring the very best fitted candidates worldwide for your position, not just the less than 0.1% of people (or even much less if not in the very largest metro areas) with the other 99.9%+ excluded up front. 2. You can very often save a lot of money by offshoring jobs to overseas providers. Personally, I'm an American living in Vietnam and I have 22 people working for me where we do this. Our labor costs are much lower than competitors. 3. Geo-redundancy is built-in with having "Remote" workers. If your office location is having some geographical disaster (like hurricanes, earthquakes, traffic snarls, etc) you have built-in backup to keep operations going. 4. There are tremendous cost savings in not having office space; and just keeping it as hoteling space for when they do come into the office. In reality it would be better to just schedule team building activities away from the office anyway at some local restaurant about once every 2 weeks. 5. If you ever need to do layoffs quickly, having a huge "Remote" workforce & then making "mandatory" that they go into the Office will be a quick way to get attrition & greatly reduce the need for severances. In the long run for so many job positions its going to become "added cost" to have "onsite" positions that operations/finance managers will have built into their cost centers & profit centers accounting/budget plans.

[@erimei8478]

The issue with working from home is only that you have a lot of sycophants in the corporate world who view going back to the office as an ass-kissing competitive advantage over their cohorts. Those are the folks who will ultimately end up ruining it for everyone else.

[@vir123456]

This is a prime example of why so many people don't want to work for big companies and would rather be content producers on social media.

[@TASconfidential]

The push to bring people back into the office isn’t about team building or any of that crap. People are trying to get people back in the office for economic reasons. Cities, and business districts thrive off of the costs you spend on commuting and working on site. Bus & Rail commuter companies, and downtown commercial business interest groups are lobbying hard for telework to be demolished because they want your money from transportation, food, coffee, parking garages, parking (and speeding) tickets,and other in-office related costs. It’s all about evening out the economy, by draining your pockets

[@vitamindealer7915]

And perpetuating illegal behavior (not in writing), and also to encourage gossip and infighting

[@MrRjsnowden]

Exactly

[@tango-bravo]

If the unstated fear from management is that employees are all sitting around at home sleeping or drinking all day, they should consider browser tracking or other surveillance options, such as webcams on all day for record keeping. While employees may balk, they would still get their remote work, be able to take a lunch and power down, etc. Any employees who have been obviously milking this will likely quit under those requirements…problem solved? I’m sure there is a good chunk of the American remote working population that honestly work from home better than they would in the office, and without all of commuting time wasted, drama, and in-office time drains. By the way, I wonder how many companies that went remote also saw precipitous declines in sexual harassment or other office-centric “hijinks” during the remote work era? Less toxic cliques, less temptation to participate in groupthink leading to happy hours, and other similar things that often have bad bleed over back into the following workday. People just don’t want to deal with that, and I’ve got to think that some of the folks who are chomping at the bit to be back to in-person work are really craving the opportunity to return to drama and chaos that they thrive on?

[@Azrael8]

Remote work is here to stay.

[@martinzelaya2927]

I'm in NYC and there are no new leases for office space. As a result, hardly anyone is leasing retail space for the most part. Rent is still going up , though most of the apartments remain empty. It's a scam. A city begins with employment, then residential ( housing the workers) and finally retail. Companies with time on their lease are waiting it out. The only people to come to the offices to work are really young people because they need a social life. Like he said, you can get just as much productivity from remote work and you save on leasing. As time goes on there will be more and more vacant office space. The only hope cities have is rezoning for entertainment to attract tourism. On the weekends NYC is packed with young people commuting from the tri state area. Unfortunately, there's not much left to do, due to the lockdowns. Even before the pandemic the city was in decline due to the high cost of living, and most of the night life was rezoned for luxury condos ( most of which remains vacant).

[@LordCommandor]

Just landed my second remote position today with ADT. I have no complaints. God is good.

[@Lorne.Mccuaig]

This video commentary is filled with scam threads. Sad to see. It's happening on all finance related you tube video's unfortunately.

[@limitless1692]

remote work = outsourcing work to third world coutries It means you will lose your cushy job soo...

[@dwoolf7019]

These companies sure don't mind remote work when it's fattening the bottom with overseas slave labor.

[@vikasd.7139]

Are these 3 in the same room ? Same office ?

[@Xan-iv6tq]

Sounds like ppl who are terrible at their jobs want to go back to the office to annoy people

[@haroldlebo2005]

This isn't about WFH or commuting, no, most of the people who are advocating going back to the office are more worried about their commercial real estate losing value that'a what' this is about.

[@arpanshome6328]

Team work, accountability etc.. by going to office is non sense.

[@Andrew24711]

War zones? Lol....i think ppl just dont want to cost of living in those cities...but otherwise 100% Kevin. Jay is living in the 90s ..... i work well with my clients - and all we have done are remote conference calls ( prior to covid). These ppl just want ppl back in commercial real estate for personal profit...

[@williamerdman4888]

Nope, Jay nailed this one.

[@vitamindealer7915]

I am no stranger to LA - absolute war zone

[@Badrep420]

I’m fine with hybrid but going to the office full time i won’t do. Rather go to another company

[@dougbixler7577]

Isn't it funny that it is Baby Boomers that are being asked this question when Gen Xers and Millenials are the ones that are actually dealing with this and are being even more productive remotely. My wife's company is in no rush to mandate workers back to the offices and they have seen productivity and employee wellness sky-rocketed through the stratosphere. Jay Clayton is the old school that will never get it because he has been a CEO-level worker before the technology revolution where Microsoft Teams and WebEx are common place.

[@WPS691]

So true. Why're they asking these dinosaurs?

[@badgerfishinski6857]

I'm a baby boomer and. I 100% support working remotely

[@PBRStreetgang]

The old "That could have been an email" joke about mandatory office meetings never rang so true.

[@lostconciousness4255]

imagine being the CEO who phones in all his orders and makes 7 figures a year talking about fairness and companies that built their entire business off online remote social interactions like Google and Meta demanding employees needing to come in.

[@jessebfly]

I've watched employees endure so much hardship in their personal lives- like marriages and home life when one partner or both have to commute 45 min to 2 hrs each way just to "be in the office". Those same employees are also a hell of a lot more productive for 2 hrs a day doing work than being in a car. And as for the perils of blue cities- like high housing costs, bad schools or expensive private schools, massive crime and vagrancy, and a general poor quality of life- Kevin is right. A happy employee is a productive employee

[@yannip2083]

I noticed that those who refused to come back to work in the workplace are mostly included in the current layoffs. Corporate America is no longer begging employees to come back to the workplace, but instead, just layoff them. What do you think?

[@Gump-tion]

Only people wanting the office return are, company people, the lonely, and those escaping the home...Everyone else is happy to work from home and hop on calls in dress shirts and underwear!

[@Royal_G80]

My employer decided to close their office and have everyone work remotely. Last time I heard the old office is empty. So it really depends on your line of work and your industry.

[@1982blvd]

Hail to Kevin! The other dude's response was mumble jumble about team work. We have already proved that team work can be done remotely based on the last 2 years. Working remotely far outweighs than being in the office.

[@PI1901]

Working in an office is over. Boomers need to get used to it. Covid was a tipping point and it was time for a change. Companies that don't adapt to the new normal will be missing out on great employees and will lose their competitive advantage. I can't imagine going back to sitting in an open cubicle all day. Not gonna happen.

[@slayermeb]

Outsourcing it's ok, but remote work is not? lol

[@late921]

Mr. Wonderful is spot on! This other guy is out of touch as he participates in this interview remotely!

[@lecturer28]

I wouldn't agree that America responded best to the pandemic

[@andyrewfx]

Did he lead this interview with comparing American workers to school children?

[@TheRealSaintNickNorthside]

As a young person I've gotten nothing but overwhelming complements by my older peers at my job. Now have 5 interns that report to me, headcharging an AI effort that could potentially save our company a whole bunch of money. Guess what? I started work in 2020, full remote. I didnt need to walk into an office to get where I'm at. I just needed to produce and show them I could do the job. And I did. I'll never not wfh.

[@Scapone2001]

I gained new respect for Kevin

[@MajesticBlueFalcon]

Wow, Jay, that was a non answer if ive ever heard one. Disnt touch a single point Kevin made.

[@romerotito85]

Chicago isn't as bad as long as you know where the bad areas are located.

[@MagnificentSails]

i don't like how you don't know how secure your personal info is with remote workers. You don't know who they live with, if they have you on speaker phone, etc. Very insecure.

[@MagnificentSails]

@Joe Forge Not when people are on speaker phone out in their back yard asking you for personal information. Might as well be on a loud speaker. 📢Call your bank and have them ask you for all of your personal info to your account and find out they are in their back yard, see how secure you feel having that exposed.

[@angelicjacobs9983]

That is a valid point. There is a security risk with some jobs being wfh.

[@MagnificentSails]

@@angelicjacobs9983 It is unnerving when you think about it

[@derekcaan7686]

These tired old farts just can't get with the program that good, productive talent will work even in a remote setting as long as the pay and benefits are good

[@pengbertuuu]

Office is good for people who don’t do real work.

[@notabot1798]

I don’t need a driver. I need good pay, fun work, security, and understanding from my employer. In return I’ll give it more than my all when I’m on their time and then some.

[@simba1608]

Two experts? Experts in what?

[@anyone150]

Safety is another reason why continue to work from home especially in places like Los Angeles, San Francisco, Oakland etc due to spikes in crime after defunding and demoralizing the police. So chances of being mugged or attacked as one walks from the car or bus stop to the workplace are higher than before covid (3/2020).

[@chavruta2000]

hey old rich white guys. the times have changed.

[@mychromebook9935]

being a "team member" lol. They will axe you the moment you are not needed or times get tough.

[@swb3248]

Jay; what century are you living in?

[@vicary12]

Everyone hates working from offices as they have to spend min 2 hours in commuting, we have to breath poor air quality and we have to miss our family, why?? No reason!

[@Entertainment-is6ex]

What they described as a ‘saving a little commuting time’, is often 2hrs+ per day for many people! 😂 1:22

[@frost1183]

“You need a boss you need a task manager” Does he want salt with that boot he’s gagging on?

[@PP-oz2oj]

I will not work for Jay ever.

[@CogensFamilyTV]

Companies in 2019… never will we do remote work. 2020… we must do remote to survive as a company .. now they are trying to regain control over employees who realized they were hating being away from the home they bought but spent most of the time away from as well as family time..

[@delayedgratification581]

What makes them experts?

[@rushrush1209]

I hope not. I work from home. I get a lot more work done at home. No unnecessary chit chat in the office. It's easier to work overtime when I work from home, because I don't have to think about driving back home. There's more time in my day, and I'm saving money on the high price of gasoline.

[@jimmaag4274]

I think remote work will end up being a reward for high achievers.

[@premchettri7170]

Both will prevail. As we head to recession, employees will lose the leverage over employers, making employers to force the process on work from office compulsory. However more of hybrid and some part of WFH wont stop as people have tasted the freedom

[@RJG253]

Excellent point Mr. Chettri.

[@manubhatt3]

I think this whole debate misses the point and is pointless to begin with. It is trying to paint all people with single brush! Reality is, For some people(probably very social ones) coming to office would be a good thing, and many of those might actually (wrongly)think and opine to the contrary. For some, it is neutral - doesn't matter much. While for others, working remotely(mostly, NOT all of the time) would be productive and better - these are probably the introverted and unsocial types. I agree that we all need atleast some social exposure from time to time, but that varies from people to people.

[@letterpage7640]

❤

[@conservativecalifornian2571]

Do not isolate but trust the people you hire. Don't threaten people with benefits. Remember these are the same people that got you through the pandemic

[@letterpage7640]

❤

[@hughjassol2072]

I wouldn’t listen to a word of what Levin O says.

[@dtxgmoney]

Working remotely is not a one size fits all. For my situation I come in to the office to do the same thing I do when I'm working remotely. I still have deadlines and performance expectations and my work ethic hasn't changed because my boss isn't breathing down my neck. I am exempt meaning I can work "off the clock" legally in an individual contributor management role and I do that often to make sure I'm on track to meet targets. Technology connects us better together than being in the office does. In fact even when I'm in the office I'm meeting with peers digitally and not in person. My work is done on the computer 8 hours a day, 5 days a week. That can be done anywhere.

[@siegfafnir8300]

I have a friend who work in a hybrid job. Most of the week he is at home but the days they need people in the office, the job buy food for them.

[@jeretso]

Crime and Traffic stinks. That's why my office is 30 minutes outside the city.