Delta Just Ordered the 797…sort of

[@6862ptc]

I'll tell you why Delta is not interested in the A321 XLR as a replacement for the 757, it's because the A321XLR is NOT a replacement for the 757. Everyone focuses on range, range, range, that's not what is special about the 757, it's the performance, the wing. The 757 can take off out of SNA 5700' runway full people, fuel and bags/cargo and fly cross country, at high Flight Levels and with IFR reserves for two alternates. It can fly to all the mountainous cities Delta serves such as SJO, GUA, BOG, UIO and many others. Except for the 737-700, nothing has the performance to do it without ridiculous gimmicks to make it out of those cities. Gimmicks like Packs-off takeoffs or APU-to-bleed takeoffs and performance so bad you have to leave with less than full passengers, fuel and/or bags/cargo, taking delays to take-off against the traffic flow due to runway downslope and/or wind restrictions on performance etc. Boeing and Airbus are so proud of their 737NG's, 737Max's, A321s, bragging those aircraft have fuel savings greater than 20% over the aircraft they replace. Heck, they have 20% less performance, so yeah that's where your fuel savings comes from. Also, the new 737s and A321s are so performance limited they're stuck at the lower flight levels unable to top the weather. This requires weather deviations equally hundreds of miles on a typical summer cross-country flight (there goes your fuel savings). So the A321XLR is no replacement for the 757, all they've done is add more fuel tanks to the A321NEO. Big whoop...But hey everyone loves the new jet smell.

[@kazansky22]

This guy gets it!

[@j.r.777]

I was unaware of those things so thank you for sharing that information!

[@mehad9885]

You a pilot? You know a lot!

[@Freeborn88]

People just don't realize how big of a monster the 757 truly is until it comes to performance.

[@MaxPulse1]

Wow, I trust that both Boeing and Airbus execs are looking at your response. One of the best overviews I have read.

[@mikemiller3949]

The takeoff from John Wayne Airport (SNA) in a 757 was a thrill. The power up of the engines, the releasing of the brakes, the g-force during the steep climb, the sense of weightlessness during noise abatement over Newport Beach, and the power up over the Pacific. It was a wonderful ride.

[@kevinnoble6320]

I heard bout that takeoff there. Never got a chance to fly outta John Wayne ina 757. Noise abatement is something cool for all takeoffs outta there. A hotter takeoff is always fun on my.list

[@Luton-Mick]

In my near 50 years alive I have flown more times than I can remember on everything from a BAC 1-11 to the A380 but the only plane the really left an impression on me was a near empty RR powered 757 with an "enthusiastic" pilot, what a machine to experience in the right hands!

[@RADIO-FREE-AMERICA]

Yes, it was like flying on a living breathing black panther!

[@charleshammer2928]

@@RADIO-FREE-AMERICA At 410

[@fjp3305]

I'd bet it did!

[@alexp3752]

I had such a climbing experience with BA out of Heathrow decades ago, and I will never forget it! As a MD-11/MD-80/717 driver the rapid climb out was simply amazing! Remember, the Boeing 757 program was headed by Mr. Phil Condit, who later became chairman of Boeing. Unlike his successors, Mr. Condit was a real aeronautical engineer. None of the others could tie his shoelaces.

[@chrisanderson1543]

This is Trump’s plane with Captain Dunken at the controls. With no passengers, it is a rocket ship!!😅

[@kevinnoble6320]

Not only is the 757 my favorite plane of all time. Its great u can put it anywhere. High altitude airports short runways etc whatever. And its a bad ass hot rod of jets. Power to weight ratio is jus amazing

[@matthewtownsend2368]

In thrust we trust

[@danharold3087]

Boeing is doing the right thing. It knows the engines on the 757 is a large part of what made it unique. A 797 with the currently available engines would be a "me too" or "also ran" product. It also gives Boeing a chance to finish outstanding certifications and ramp up 787, 737 and 777X production. With that out of the way it can use advances made in these 2 or 3 years on the new design along with the latest, more desirable, engines. Some are not understanding the title. It means by ordering the MAX 10 Delta has shown its intention to buying the 797. Not that it has ordered the yet to be designed plane.

[@cobyexplanes]

They're also in the process of building out a new digital suite that will make designing a new plane much easier. If they start now it might take them longer to build it than if they waited for the suite to be mature.

[@danharold3087]

@@cobyexplanes I agree. Also think they are or will be looking at improved production processes. More automation and process with less ways to fail.

[@AnimeSunglasses]

I'm inclined to agree. Replacing the 757 is one of those things where if you don't do it RIGHT, you've done it very wrong.

[@1afly2]

He said that so he can get clicks

[@DC8Combi]

@@cobyexplanes if you’re talking about the turdaverse verbal diarrhea I wouldn’t hold my breath. The Boeing gangsters talk a lot of smack their caliber is low in the cesspool they’ve created. A shout out to the fraud Richard Petrey Boeing Investigations we are still waiting how’s about telling everyone about the V-22 CCRAM debacle for starters?

[@edenmatthews915]

I love the 757. It’s the muscle car of airliners. Years ago I was walking through the Atlanta airport instead of taking the tram and I asked a Delta pilot what’s a pilots favorite plane to fly and he didn’t hesitate and said 757. His reason - it’s got power to spare

[@jimmiller5600]

Since Delta is a core-757 user it can probably keep it flying better than other airlines. Is it thirsty? Yes. So you'll want to only use it where you have too. But which airline owns its own oil refinery? Delta.

[@scpatl4now]

As well as owning the planes outright.

[@DrSeuss-nv9hw]

Delta also has a lucrative deal with the NBA. Correct me if I'm wrong, the NBA owns 757s that it leases to Delta. Delta configures the cabin for giant people, supplies catering, etc. These 57's are painted in Delta's livery and staffed by Delta crews. $$$

[@NovejSpeed3]

​@@DrSeuss-nv9hw the NBA has a contract with Delta but I'm not sure if they own the aircraft per say. Delta also has some A320 and/or A319s in strictly VIP configurations.

[@drutalero2962]

Oh shit really??

[@Kavurcen]

They also have a massive maintenance and repair operation

[@Primus54]

Boeing’s merger with McDonnell Douglas killed further development of the 757. That was a huge error as Boeing has had to keep modifying an aircraft with its design roots going all the way back to the early ‘60s… the 737. Besides being a beautiful aircraft that pilots love, the 757 has great short field and high density altitude performance while still having high capacity and great range in a narrow body. If Boeing is smart, they will call the 797 the direct 757 replacement and design in all of the 757’s assets. With any luck they’ll try to duplicate the appearance, as well.

[@LtColDaddy71]

They are all just tubes engines and wings man. The modern car has roots to the model T.

[@JavanHamiltonTV]

*Lack of demand* is what killed the 757. That market didn’t become a thing again until more than a decade later. Old Boeing would have been in prime position. New Boeing, to your point, is caught with its pants down.

[@cobyexplanes]

I think that’s an oversimplification- the 757 didn’t have much of a market during its prime years. It was more a victim of poor timing than anything else

[@TheLugiaExpert]

The 757 was not that popular while it was on the market and Coby’s already made a video about why you can’t created a 757 Max

[@Primus54]

@@TheLugiaExpert The 757 was about a decade early in its development and would be selling well today. And with all legitimate respects to Coby, he is presenting one man’s opinion. Thanks!

[@jimcaufman2328]

I have flown 6 jets in my career. My least favorite was the 727. It was over engineered and required a sharp Flight Engineer to keep in sync. The A-300 was a fantastic airplane in its mission profile. A good money maker. The 757-200 was my first "electric jet" and took some time for me to adapt to the computer interface but when I mastered it, I loved the airplane. The 767-200/400 were the same type rating as the 757. the 200 was a fat 757 with more range and cargo space. The 400 elevated the cockpit to the 777 layout and was stretched to the max. The problem was at max weight it was a 30,000 foot airplane. Down in the weather and turbulence. I avoided the 400. I lover the 777-200. It was my retirement airplane and I cannot say enough good about the airplane. My other airplane which I flew a two airlines was the DC-8. A new pilot or flight engineer soon learns that the DC does not stand for Douglas Commercial but DIRECT CABLE. I flew the 61, 62, 63 71 and 73 models. The airplane was dirt clod simple compared to Boeing and extremely dependable. most of the 707s were reduced to beer cans while the Dougs keep on flying. Almost 80 percent of my flying is long haul international. Customers much prefer a 757 over a 737 sardine can because of the seat width and ceiling height. I am tied for a favorite airplane between a B-777 and a DC-8. The 777 is probably the best airplane ever built. But the DC-8 was the best of its time. The 797 needs to replace the 757 or Boeing needs to restart the 757 line with a more fuel efficient engine with the power of the Rolls Royce RB-211. The PW 757 was a dog.

[@rogerturner5504]

At last, an intelligent contributor to KZbin. Bless you sir!

[@As_A________Commenter]

Interesting take. I have worked at a few airlines myself, and my first narrow body was the A320. Later I flew the 330 200/300 and it was immediately my favorite aircraft, the RR engines had plenty of power and it just did everything well. I think the dominance of the 75/76 in the US market really hampered its popularity in the late 90’ to 2000’s. A twist of fate moved me to another carrier and I spent a few years on the 777 and later the 787. The triple edged out the 330 as my favorite plane I’ve flown, it just does everything well and was a pleasure to fly. It truly is the last over the over-engineered planes built with the pilots in mind. We operated the 787 with a common type rating and initially I was excited about it. Indeed the economy of the Dreamliner cannot be denied, it was making many routes profitable and we wanted it everywhere on the network. I can’t say I didn’t like the plane, but I always enjoyed sliding back into the 777 seat more. It was just the right amount of tech without seeming ‘gimmicky’ and nothing ever breaks on it. I’m back on the airbus now, and will likely finish out my career on it. Since I have no further interest in long haul, the flight deck comfort of the Airbus far exceeds the Boeing 737. I am a bit discouraged at the long range versions coming down the pipe, as 5-6 hours on a narrow body is all I care to do in one stretch.

[@DoNotEatPoo]

The best aircraft is the 727. It's the only model you can completely deconstruct the wing and remain airborne. It's also the only aircraft with 40 degrees flaps on approach requires 99% throttle to prevent it from turning into a falling brick. Another huge bonus was you can plant the screaming infants at the back of the aircraft which will eliminate any sort of noise complaint from the other pax. If I recall, you could smoke on this aircraft too.

[@stevenvogel9249]

Congratulations Jim Caufman on your long career and hopefully as long retirement.👋 Let me add my view as I retired from MTC after 37 years at a major airline (starts with D ends with L) having worked 9 years in the hangar and then LINE MTC both Domestic and INTL. until retirement Jan.2019. Previous to that I served as a Crew Chief on the UH-1 Huey. Started out on 727 O/H then worked the DC-8 RE-engine CFM mod. On transferring to LINE MTC in '91 worked everything from DC-9 to the MD-11 and B-747 via a two year tour at INTL LINE MTC. Agree with you on the 727, it took a lot to make an on time departure as it always needed something and you guys killing us with squawks.😊 727 were the workhorse of the day and made me and the company good money, fond memories. The DC-8 is/was built like a tank and the only commercial AC to intentionally go supersonic during a test flight. Google it and see who was in the chase plane.😊 Toss up between it and B-767 400 as all time favorite. Respectfully, Retired AMT 🇺🇲🙏😎

[@TrainPlaneFan123]

@Level Three WHAT ABOUT PSA 182? THE WING GOT DAMAGED AND IT CRASHED

[@pilotpeter8850]

Some people who don’t get past the first minute of this video might think it’s clickbait. But it’s actually such a well craft analyses that makes a ton of sense. Good work Coby 👍🏼

[@carguy-xv2cl]

Well it is still click bait at the end of the day.

[@RADIO-FREE-AMERICA]

I wish the Lockheed L1011 was still in production! It’s vertical lift wing made it a joy to fly in! It was reliable, quiet, and felt like you were flying around in someone’s living room! Those were great days for sure!

[@francisbalzer9324]

The RB211 was less than reliable and was much of the reason the production numbers for the L1011 were so low.

[@abrahamdecruz5128]

Agreed. Apparently high fuel costs made the tri jets unviable. Hence the Lockheed and DC10s are history. Perhaps Lockheed can design a twin jet like the Boeing 757 as there is a gap in the market for this.

[@leoramirez9070]

Ppp

[@lukethompson5558]

@@francisbalzer9324 Funny, that’s the same engine on the 757, and what makes it so great

[@747heavyboeing3]

Why the selected RR at Lockheed is beyond me. Rolls Royce was in financial crisis and this delayed Tristar entry into service. DC 10 was first and Lockheed never caught up. They should have selected P&E or GE engines.

[@eddiec4536]

Delta also flew the awesome Lockheed L-1011 tri jets that were built in Palmdale California as well from the 1970's to 2001. My favorite plane.

[@MH-fb5kr]

Had so many great flights on the TriStar… wonderful plane, very advanced technology, comfortable, etc.

[@RADIO-FREE-AMERICA]

Glad to see this, I loved the L1011. It was always a pleasant experience, a big, comfortable, quiet, and agile plane, with its vertical lift wing. I spent many hours on the Delta L1011, I just wish there were a newer version of it, that was still flying! Lockheed put out a superior product for sure! It’s only real competition, the McConell Douglas DC 10 really never measured up to the L1011 either in safety, reliability, or in system redundancy protection! I think it must have been Lockheed’s last commercial aircraft production unit!

[@VE1PS]

Lockheed tin lemon. Lovely in the air, a maintenance headache on the ground.

[@dryque]

The 757 used the same engines, those humming rr's engines are in any case the epiphany of excellence

[@tfl4963]

TriStasr built the 70s and 80s air travel

[@pastorlarrypotts8289]

I love the 757! The power blasts the plane upward and flies smoothly! And it is beautiful!

[@well-blazeredman6187]

It might be old but the 757 is still a looker.

[@cobyexplanes]

Preach

[@redryder1146]

It is a good looking aircraft for sure!!

[@soylentblueispeople2]

Long legs big…. Engines…

[@jaybee9269]

@@soylentblueispeople2 >> I always appreciate big…engines.

[@JavanHamiltonTV]

And always will be.

[@fairalbion]

I hope Boeing makes the 797 just as stunningly beautiful. The 757 is like a supermodel, a little gray, but has kept in shape & is still getting the gigs.

[@cobyexplanes]

The George Clooney of airplanes?

[@derbagger22]

@@cobyexplanes More like the Lyle Lovett of planes. Yuck... But for some reason, people love them...

[@potato1907]

and i hope it actually works this time.

[@Andrew-xh8vb]

Let's hope the do not try to cut corners They are good at cover ups

[@mister518]

Lmaooooo av Geeks are a different breed 😂😂😂😂😂

[@widget787]

It does not need the XLR to replace the 757(-200) at Delta, 99% of Deltas 757 Routes are within the range of the A321 Standard Neo and MAX10. Capacity wise the 321 and 10 are just slightly smaller than the 757. The bigger problem will be to find a direct replacement for the 767-300ER, 767-400 and A330-200 as well as 757-300. If Boeing is smart their 797 will be bigger than the A321, slipping into the gap between the A321/MAX10 and 787-8/A338. This Gap does not only exist in capacity but also in terms of range/Performance.

[@ydfhlx5923]

Remember range in paper isn't everything. Planes usually need to carry less cargo if they carry full fuel, which reduces revenue. And I don't think replacing A330 or 767 will be that big of a problem, there's the A330-800 and B787-8

[@widget787]

@@ydfhlx5923 theoretically there are the 787-8 and A330-800. But if they were suitable replacements Delta would have ordered one of them already. Both are too heavy and have too much range to replace the 763ER/764. Airbus/Boeing could offer a variant of the 788/338 with a lower MTOW and derated engines to make them a little more attractive to Airlines like Delta but they would still be overweight because of a Wing that is much too large for the Missions. Just a few numbers: empty weight of a 763ER is around 90t, the 787-8 weighs 1/3(!!!) more at around 120t. The A338 has a similar empty weight.

[@tinus411]

exactly my thoughts

[@johnsmith-rs2vk]

@widget 787. You know what your talking about . Good Man .

[@iroc341]

Except the 57 can carry full cargo and fuel at all times, even in hot weather . No aircraft can match what the 57 can do. For its size.

[@a_goblue2023]

The 757 was one of the best planes ever built, i hope Delta keeps it as long as possible and that the 797 keeps a similar design to the 757

[@cobyexplanes]

I'd imagine they're gonna borrow more from the 787s design than the 757. The plane is awesome, but its design is quite outdated

[@training67605]

I really hope it’s a twin isle ala 767. Would make for a very appealing freighter besides all the upside of faster boarding and more premium options.

[@chrispontani6059]

There’s two reasons why DL went for the Max10/797. 1.) Where are they going to wind up on the order book? Everybody and their mother is interested in the XLR. If DL ordered it, they’d be at the bottom of the list. By getting onto the Max10 list, they have a better chance of getting new aircraft sooner. And as you said, it gives Boeing the vote of confidence and a few billion dollars to develop the 797. 2.) Delta is too large of an airline to be committed to just one manufacturer. Smaller, especially your ULCC’s are interested in economies of scale by squeezing unnecessary expenses out of their maintenance departments. But what happens when you have to ground every type of one model in your fleet for a safety issue? If you have both Airbus and Boeing in your fleet, you can spread the pain across the unaffected part of your fleet. But I’d you’re all-in on one manufacturer, there’s a 50/50 chance either you’re up a creek without a paddle or unaffected.

[@Deltadavid1572]

I agree with you

[@GarrisIiari]

I agree, but you forgot a big reason number three. Negotiating power. If Delta is vendor locked into Airbus, that doesn't give them a lot of negotiating power because Airbus knows they have that leverage. By having a mixed fleet, they send a message to either party that they could always go either way.

[@chrispontani7637]

@@GarrisIiari You read my mind. You don't want to beholden to either one or the other.

[@steinwaldmadchen]

Don't you realise that LR and XLR are just another 321NEO with higher MTOW and more / bigger tanks? With the order and options in hand, Delta can change their mind at anytime they wish - they just need a phone call to Touluose and a cheque. Just that they don't feel the need right now. In fact it seems like theirs have fewer tanks and lower on-paper MTOW than even the standard 321NEO. While I agree Delta is dual sourcing, they're also known to be very opportunistic. They order MAX10 because it is cheap, so as the PW-powered A220 / 321NEO and 330NEO. And dumping 737 is not realistic anyway given they've been receiving young 739s new and used since 2011.

[@JavanHamiltonTV]

+1 on that second point. I remember the AA groundings when the Mad Dogs were recalled around 2007 or 2008.

[@aschlect]

Delta has not been downsizing the 737 fleet. Yes, they retired the TEN (~1% of it's fleet) 737-700 aircraft, but they added 4 738s from GOL, and another 29 739s from Lion Air. This is in addition to the existing 130 739s and 73 738s. So, before signing an LOI for the MAX 10, DL had increased it's 737 order book by 33 aircraft in recent years.

[@tenkloosterherman]

Big companies make strange decisions too.

[@thelostone777]

Don’t forget the A200s

[@EVH3730]

You are correct, thank you for stating this: I was going to do it but you already did. Delta is not downsizing the 737 fleet, they only retired the 737-700s while adding larger 737s. The decision was based on more capacity and relatively the same high-density altitude performance available from the 737-8s.

[@jbar_85]

I’ve flown the Delta 757 several times over my life. I’m always happy to take it because it’s so cozy and roomy!

[@baomao7243]

The math is more complicated when you’re the dominant customer. Adopting a single mfg fleet means no leverage later negotiating with that supplier given they know your switching costs (ie reverting from sole source) are enormous. There is, however, a cross over point where it actually can make sense to keep BOTH suppliers to keep their pricing in check because it maintains competition (not to mention flexibility and resilience of supply chain). In other words the purchaser intimately understands the OpEx vs CapEx tradeoff.

[@BELCAN57]

That's a smart move for any airline. Wonder why Southwest stays all Boeing?

[@baomao7243]

@@BELCAN57 A much smaller airline, I suspect

[@bearcubdaycare]

Southwest seemed to have a lot of sway over Boeing, dictating a lot about the MAX, and dictating a per plane penalty if commonality were violated.

[@craigbeatty8565]

Really? Talk to Ryan Air then. One type and one manufacturer has enormous cost savings.

[@baomao7243]

@@craigbeatty8565 Depends on scale and maintaining strategic options. But agree if it is an OpEx-only analysis.

[@shakey2634]

I’m a recently retired airline guy. Coby is pretty informative, that’s why I tune in to his channel. One thing that’s missed in all this conversation is that line pilots have been saying for years, if not decades, is that Boeing needed stop the ballooning of the 737 at the -700 and that is when they should have inserted the clean sheet 797. They spent enough to salvage the bloated Max that it would have financed the entire 797 project. Imagine how well positioned Boeing would be against the Airbus 320 series had they done that. But you just can’t explain anything to the bean counters that have taken over corporate America.

[@numtot2172]

The 757 is by far my favorite narrow body jet. It’s a shame there are so few of them left in service

[@ark14700]

At the very least we can still yeet them across the virtual skies in Flight Simulator. Bluebird is currently developing it in the sim.

[@vincenthana9801]

@@ark14700 Xplane11 Flight Factor B-757, my favorite!

[@panam747]

Lots left in service for such an old model. The cargo companies love 'em!

[@alphamalegold1]

If Delta keeps flying the 757 into the 2030s it’ll become Avgeeks favorite airlines

[@widget787]

Like Northwest used to be.

[@stevewilson6390]

Jet 2 airlines in the UK still have five of them and are approx 32 years old .

[@paradoox02459]

You mean it isn't already?

[@wannabedal-adx458]

FACT!! 😎

[@WreedTrimmer]

Imagine they still flew the 707

[@mylesdias8453]

The Boeing 757 look sooooo athletic and graceful!! I absolutely love it!

[@GoldendoodleBaxter]

Perhaps Delta Airlines can get Boeing into actually developing the 797 sooner. (Just hoping the plane comes out great in quality, if it actually comes out of course). If American Airlines can get Boeing to build the 737 MAX, no doubt that Delta can do the same thing here.

[@alphamalegold1]

Hopefully, but part of the reason Boeing built the max was cuz Airbus was also threatening to take its business to airbus. Delta is doing the opposite here and showing they want the Boeing no matter what. Coby did a video on it a while back

[@-er-un1wt]

I still think Boeing will wait tell they can attach hydrogen engines.

[@cobyexplanes]

@@-er-un1wt Boeing seems more focused on SAF than hydrogen at this point - we'll see if that changes

[@-er-un1wt]

@@cobyexplanes yeah will all depend on what they want it to be. I think that a hydrogen aircraft would be a massive leap forward and they could market it like they did with the 787 and put in as much new stuff as possible, or they could release the 797 as a more typical Boeing aircraft with a similar level to the 787,777x,737max, and 747-8. It all depends on were they want to go with this if there going to go for a clean sheet design I have a feeling they are going to want hydrogen engines would allow them to get ahead of Airbus as Airbus have said at the end of the decade they will be developing one likely to be a a320 family replacement. However if they really want a quick fix I could see a revamped 767 possibly with new wings and new engines, if they do that than I think they will focus that technological leap and clean sheet design onto a 737max replacement instead. They are gona need a max replacement at some point and if Airbus dose the a320 family replacement there gona want to compete with it so they may want to focus in on that rather than a super advanced 797 so it can go either way. In my personal opinion though for the rest of the decade Boeing will be focused on research and development, 777x family production sales and certification,further 737 max sales, and er variants for the 787. Then when the 2030s come they will launch hydrogen engine clean sheet designed 797 and 737 replacement and at the end of the 2030s re engine the 787 and look into a clean sheet 777 replacement for the 2040s

[@davethornley2637]

I am by no means an expert on the US market, but it seems Delta is taking a very pragmatic view on the next 10 years of air travel and is most definitely sending Boeing a big signal about which aircraft they should be bringing to the market. United, on the other hand is shooting for the stratosphere, quite literally with its investment in Boom. I'm microwaving popcorn for now.

[@vbscript2]

Delta has very few routes that they fly the 757 on that are anywhere near 4,000 nm anyway. They simply don't need the XLR. The vast, vast majority of Delta's 757 routes are domestic short-haul or the shorter end of medium-haul (e.g. West Coast to Hawaii or U.S. coast-to-coast.) Nearly all of those routes are under 2,500 nmi and quite a lot of them are only a few hundred miles. For example, Delta flies its 757s even on routes as short as ATL-MCO, ATL-TPA, and even ATL-BNA as well as a lot of its hub-to-hub routes where they just happen to need a lot of daily capacity. Its range is completely irrelevant for those routes. The MAX 10 and regular 321/321neo can serve any of those routes with no problem. The A321XLR is more for trans-Atlantic routes. Delta currently uses widebodies on all but a small handful of its European destinations and none of the ones it does use 757s on are overly important to its route network. It could do without them entirely if it really wanted to, but keeping a few 752s around to handle the job won't be too much of a problem. Also keep in mind that Delta additionally has a bunch of 753s that are significantly newer than most of its 752s - some of the last 757s ever built - so its 757 fleet isn't likely to go away entirely in the next decade anyway. As for Delta 737s, there's zero chance of those being retired in the next decade or probably even the next 2 decades, even without the MAX 10 order. Delta has 159 (soon to be 163) 737-900ERs. Its first one was delivered only 9 years ago. These are one of the core components of Delta's domestic fleet and won't be going away for likely a couple of decades. The MAX 10s will fit in nicely with the -900ER subfleet with lots of commonality. Many of the 737-800s will probably start to be retired over the next decade or so, but the -900ERs won't be and wouldn't have been even without the MAX order. The vast majority of Delta's 752 missions will be relatively easily replaced by its 737-900ER, 737 MAX 10, and A321ceo/neo fleets - a total of 545 aircraft either already in service (291) or on order (254.) It's the 767-300ER hole that will be tougher to fill. That's where the NMA is really needed. The 321 (either regular or XLR) doesn't come close to matching the 767-300ER on either passengers or (especially) range. The 763 has nearly 50% more range than even the XLR and, even with a significantly less dense configuration (i.e. long-haul configs rather than short-haul ones,) still carries 15-20% more passengers than the 321 in Delta's configs. Delta uses the 763 for everything from high-demand short-haul routes to trans-Atlantic service to Europe to even trans-Pacific service to Asia. Good luck flying from the CONUS to Tokyo in an XLR... There simply isn't currently a good 763 replacement, either from Boeing or from Airbus. The 321XLR is significantly smaller with far less range, while the 330neo and 787 are both much heavier. The 757-300 and 767 are currently the only aircraft in that huge gap between the 321 and the 330neo/787. This is the hole that NMA needs to fill, allowing for more medium-market point-to-point long-haul routes with a widebodies that are still comfortable for passengers. 10 hours in economy in a 321 does not sound like my idea of a good time.

[@SgtInvictus]

How did you take the time to write this as a KZbin comment

[@26RAviation]

you lost me at XLR

[@ADPeguero]

Very logical and well-written. Makes sense. Could the NMA/797 be to the 787 kind of what the 757 was to the 767? Is this the idea? I know Delta uses the 757s a lot for charter flights for Sports Teams and other large charter customers. I don't remember ever working a non-757 charter flight out of BOS.

[@carguy-xv2cl]

Agreed. The 757 is a nice plane but the obsession is a bit ridiculous.

[@vbscript2]

@@26RAviation XLR = Airbus A321XLR - the plane that the video acts surprised that Delta isn't ordering.

[@dtvconsult]

For most businesses, it’s best to have at least two suppliers. Otherwise, you can’t negotiate pricing.

[@pitchforkrebel5594]

True. And such a situation of maintaining a viable rival is not without precedent. In the 1960's and 1970's, GM's Electromotive Division built the best locomotives; yet railroads kept ordering General Electric and Alcos (until they exited in 1969) in order to avoid dealing with a monopoly.

[@VeniVidiAjax]

Well…in aviation it’s the other way around. It’s also cheaper because you need less training going from airbus to Arbus as pilot.

[@pitchforkrebel5594]

@@VeniVidiAjax Dealing with a monopoly vendor presents the same issues, regardless of industry. You'll have to take a basic microeconomics course if you don't understand that.

[@ytzpilot]

Airlines like Southwest save money with exclusively flying one aircraft type

[@pitchforkrebel5594]

@@ytzpilot Which needs to be balanced with potential for "vendor lock" and the potential for monopoly. Once again, if you don't understand basic industrial economics, take a class.

[@regthebackyardjackofalltrades]

I recall when the Navy was getting rid of the C-9’s, a Captain asked me if I like the C-40. I said that it would be better if they hit the 757. I was an E5 back then so no one was going to listen to me. The C-40 is a good aircraft but I like to maintain the 757. I finished my 30 year stint working for our Uncle Sam with the C-40. If this is a modified 757, I’m for it.

[@louisstennes3]

I saw an interview where pilots just love the 757 and many said it was the BEST airplane they ever piloted. I have flown 757s on trips and I must say it is a marvelous airplane. Sometimes newer isn't necessarily better but they will need more maintenance to keep them going. I think Delta is doing the right thing. Remember when these aircraft go in for major maintenance overhauls they are being upgraded too with the latest in avionics, technical upgrades, etc. The military is famous for doing this with 50 plus old airframes.

[@yolo_burrito]

The military doesn’t have the same cycle life a commercial jet does though. Commercial jets only make money when they are loaded and in the air. Mil jets sit around ready a lot more.

[@dknowles60]

wrong North west could over haul 50 year old air frames. North west was taken over By delta. there must still be some EX nORTH WEST PEOPLEAROUND TO SHOW DELTA HOW ITS IS DONE

[@namenotavailable11]

I have a different take. Boeing dumped them for cheap to get the Max 10 order book going. Boeing is doing exactly what they've always done, complain about unholy discounts when it's your competitor, but thinking it's "just good business strategy" when they do it. This is what drove Bombardier into Airbus' arms for the C-Series, with Delta's C-Series order no less. Oh, the irony.

[@TheGreatBigMove]

I've always loved the 757, and the more I learn about it the more I like it.

[@GageisGreat12]

Didn’t expect to see you guys here lol

[@JavanHamiltonTV]

It was (is) a great aircraft.

[@rkevic]

I like how the 753 looks, it’s almost like a flying straw with two engines.

[@titanicbigship]

hi

[@KandeShack]

My Son is a Pilot for Delta! He’s based out of SEA and soon he’ll will be flying the A330 from SEA to Amsterdam, London, Paris etc. proud of him.✈️👨‍✈️

[@MUSCLEPUP44]

Congratulations to you both! I love flying on the A330. Smooth, quiet, and comfortable. I feel quite safe in them.

[@FiveTwoSevenTHR]

The 757-200 is a beautiful jet. It would be cool to see the 797 be basically a carbon fiber body 757 with bigger engines.

[@johnc4404]

My thoughts exactly and what they should have done to replace the 737-Whatever years ago!

[@Logan_rdb]

Y si lo engordan un poco quedaría mejor

[@mungogrant1857]

Would not need much bigger engines if it had a carbon fibre body. The interest is in what new engine in development would fit.

[@jandoinc]

Thanks Coby! I think Delta can afford to comfortably keep the 757 for two more decades. The 757 fleet is still in good health, maintenance wise. Delta has the best mechanics in the industry backed by an incredible infrastructure and technology driven processes.

[@InCaveEntertainment]

A 100 plane order for a 737 Max isn’t anywhere near a big deal. As far as 737 Max orders, United ordered 544 of them in a single order, Southwest 514, Lion Air and Dubai with 250, RyanAir with 210, and then a whole slew of others. 100 orders from an airline as large as Delta is a tepid, cautious order and was done simply to keep Airbus in check on pricing. Delta seems 100% committed to doing 90% of their future business with Airbus. I know two Delta test pilots and the way Delta sets up their rating criteria, Airbus always comes out in top

[@danb2234]

I think that this is a very smart move on the part of Delta, as evident with Ryanair when the MAX issue hit, it is important to diversify your fleet

[@jeffgantz4385]

I’ve talked to a few pilots who fly the 757 as a charter. The F’ing ❤️ it! Size, range and performance. They flew in and out of Denver a lot: altitude and summer heat were never a problem. Many have found a 2nd life when converted to an air cargo plane. Those crews love it for the same reasons

[@mcahill135]

The “flying pencil” is the second best looking airliner next to the B-707. That iconic design will never be surpassed in looks alone.

[@RADIO-FREE-AMERICA]

The best looking aircraft was the Lockheed L1011

[@miguelbarrero5572]

I always called the MD-80 family the Flying Pencil and not the 757, for me the MD-80 looked like a pencil, just my opinion.

[@tenkloosterherman]

@@RADIO-FREE-AMERICA I liked it too, but taste is open for a lot of discussion.

[@stuartlee6622]

The DC 8 ?????

[@WPM_in_ATL]

Delta can keep a plane running longer than just about any other carrier. To wit: They bought the B-717s from Airtran/Southwest when that merger took place. They certainly knew the DC-9 and its successors. A B-717 was simply a rebadged MD-95.

[@dknowles60]

THAT is because delta has a of god ex north west A&P people around

[@powerwheelscd]

Delta's 757's use the engines that are on the C-17, so the parts for these engines will be made for another 20 years, long after every RB211 powered 757 is parked.

[@MiniAirCrashInvestigation]

This man does not miss

[@cobyexplanes]

◡̈

[@markwils5042]

Delta never had a problem in flying older planes. There are sound economics to it. Also the 757 is a good cargo aircraft, which is extremely important these days. This is why the original drafts of the 797 were a widebody.

[@RADIO-FREE-AMERICA]

How many years did Delta fly the McConell Douglas DC-8? I flew on one on Delta, from Birmingham to Atlanta in 1980. What an old lumber-some aircraft!

[@stevemclean9411]

delta (NWA) flew nearly 50 year old DC9 s. They all carried their original airline owner registrations, except for some second hand Eastern airlines jets which got new RW registrations from Hughes Airwest.

[@markuks]

For the 797 to work, it has to be a narrow body version of the 787. A fully composite aircraft.

[@victorrusselljr8069]

I've exclusively flown/fly with Delta (43 months) on my monthly trips for my air medical company working on helicopters all over the United States. I worked for ATA Airlines after 13 years in the Army as a Blackhawk crewchief and I got my FAA A&P License before leaving the Army. I worked the ATA L1011, 727-200 and 757-200. The 757 was incredible to work and in flight and very reliable as was the L1011. I fly on Delta 757's often and never had a late departure or mechanical issue at anytime since flying Delta. The other narrow body fleet of Delta have many late departures or maintenance cancellations requiring rebooking.

[@valdesre1]

Both companies have been around for a long time I totally support any and decisions either one makes. They know what they are doing I just wish I had their experience in business

[@markodom3841]

Yours was a refreshingly non “know-it-all” comment. A nice change from all the so-called business experts you hear spouting off these days. Thanks.

[@captainWally23]

I think the 75 is my favorite plane. It kooks like it's flying when it's sitting on the ground. Beautiful!

[@davidcole333]

Just keep the 757's flying. There's no reason they can't until the 797 is ready. Especially if they have a world class maintenance organization in place for them.

[@ethansaviation2672]

Exactly

[@markar6395]

The 757 is a phenomenal aircraft. Back in its prime years, It was the only aircraft that could fly with a full load and enough fuel to fly from the Greek Island Skiathos with a very short runway to the UK. Just one example of its exceptional characteristics

[@markybear92840]

I kinda doubt the 757's will fly much past the acquisition of the MAX and A321. Its sad, but another example of boeing stepping on their own 'landing gear' and not planning for the future.

[@yankeesforlife24]

Great video. It’s interesting to me that Boeing hasn’t considered restarting the 757 program, even with its high cost to restart it. They know that it’s the only current aircraft in its class and You would think a second program would sell much better than the 1st since airlines understand its unique value.

[@joelleerickson2642]

I thought your analysis was really interesting, not the least of which because I thought that a 737 MAX 10 order would be aimed towards replacing its 737-900ERs and domestic-use 757s, and not an endorsement for the 797. I’m based in Seattle/Tacoma and most of the Delta 757s I see are going to Hawai’i or are used for high-volume domestic services. These roles are where the 737 MAX 10 and MAX 9 really shine, as demonstrated by where Alaska Airlines is placing their MAXes in the route structure! I would love to see a follow-up video on how the current order books of other airlines benefit the 797 production. United Airlines seems to be the best customer for the 797 in the United States given their unique route structure (Dubrovnik, Bergen, Palma de Mallorca, Stockholm, etc.) but they were left out of this video. Great work, as always!

[@cobyexplanes]

Glad you liked it!

[@jpriller5105]

The Max 10s are actually going to replace the older A320s, not so much the 757s. The 900ERs are fairly young and will be around for quite a while.

[@thomas9374]

I belive the focus of Delta is not the 757 replacement, they do this with 737-10 and A321neos. They need a 767 replacement. The 737-10 replace the A320s and 737-800 which are becoming very old. Also the A321xlrs will be delivered quite late. I currently can only see Delta getting A338 or 788 which might get some downturned engines to be more efgicient, but thats not really a good fix.

[@widget787]

Exactly my thoughts, this is why I think Boeing should build the 797 bigger than the A321/757.

[@sanandaallsgood673]

It seems that you're on point with the ability of the 737-10 and the A-321 Neo to fulfill the need to replace the 757, even though they don't have the same range. That 500 mile difference isn't really that big of a deal and if Delta thought it was, they could always go for the A-321 XLR to stopgap that issue. Since the acquisition of the A-350's seems to support it's long range desires, it seems unlikely that Delta is worried about the 737-10 or the A-321 Neo being used for those long range flights, but more for intracontinential flights like coast to coast. With all the issues Boeing has faced in the wake of the Max debacle and the 787 issues, waiting on the 797 sounds logical, allowing Boeing to 'clean up its backyard' before wandering into new development.

[@mattevans4377]

Since Delta own all the aircraft (no leasing costs), they can probably store all their 757s, and use the ones in the best conditions on the longer routes, while the rest of the fleet are parts donors.

[@Smedbo1]

Excellent point and one I was surprised to not hear mentioned in the video or seen in the comments until your entry! Delta’s outright ownership of its 757’s is likely the key major factor driving their decision to continue using the model! People tend to overlook the fact that most airlines today only own a tiny percentage (if any) of their fleets with the majority of aircraft being leased! Leasing is incredibly capital intensive but of course has it’s own advantages ranging from tax and depreciation considerations to reliability and efficiency associated with newer equipment etc. On the flip side, continuing to fly older, less efficient but still reliable and paid for aircraft allows airlines to essentially be able to endure the higher operating costs, still make a profit (albeit a much thinner one) and at the end of the day continue to have the older planes make overall operational and economic sense to use! Why do you think almost every Legacy Carrier continued to operate sizable (in some cases even Huge) fleets of 727’s until just after 9/11? The 27 was a great plane but certainly not modern or efficient by 2001 (almost 20 years since last produced) but they continued to be operationally relevant, and yes, just barely profitable enough to keep the balance sheets in the “black!and justify their use! Full free and clear aircraft ownership (and reliability)were the 727’s last two true “saving grace’s that kept it around so long and clearly the same appears likely to happen with Delta’s 57’s (at least until FedEx/UPS and other cargo carriers snatch the last of the the pax equipped airframes up! Either way, I hope to keep seeing 757’s flying for many many more years to come!

[@YHDiamond]

Ah yes, ordering planes that don't exist!

[@tommmicron]

Last time an American Airline(s) did that, it didn't go down very well...

[@YHDiamond]

@@tommmicron well the 737 max did do well for Boeing even if it killed a few hundred people... These companies care about profit, that's it.

[@chickennugget7586]

@@YHDiamond So they don't care about that other part. *SUEING*

[@YHDiamond]

@@chickennugget7586 it likely makes sense for them to start a program that is worth tens of not hundreds of billions and then get sued for only a few billion

[@alphamalegold]

American did this w the 737 max

[@dodoubleg2356]

YES...HOLD OUT FOR THE 797!! Keep the newest 757's, retire the oldest, & supplement those losses w/the MAX 10 & A321NEO if necessary.

[@bok.1722]

As a former delta tech ops tech, a person who worked 757s, currently work 737ng/max and A320/1 old school and NEO, I have to admit a few things both good and bad in all airframe. The 757 is a simplistic hearty reliable workhorse. AA improved the 757 by making central vacuum lav system and to me hard to build a better aircraft. I disagree with the 757-300 for old age use due to the left side of the aircraft behind the wing has oil canning. I suspect this could be trouble in oldest models when cycles go up without reinforcing that side. The aircraft is just too long to be that skinny. The nose gear seems flimsy but never seems to have issues. The 737 is a 50+ year design that still works extremely well, gate reliability is better than the A320 series aircraft. The enemy of the 737 is that 50 year design that doesn't allow much improvement. Cargo doors that open inward that on short bumpy runways heavy braking, luggage shifts forward and blocks the fwd cargo door... requires mx to come very often to sort it out. I have a solution but no one will listen lol. The aircraft proximity to the ground is useful for mx. Systems are well thought out and tried and true but cockpit is small and cramped in comparison to the living room in the a320 series. Whoever manufactures the composite brake system modification to the 37NG should be investigated and taken out back of the factory and shot. Sarc. It is a disaster, as the composite brake disc's fuse together and when this happens, it is extremely difficult to remove the brake assembly from the tire or the main axle. Hint, do not use liquid lubricants as you make a paste and even more difficult to remove it from the main axle. Use compressed air or Nit with a blower and blow all around and behind down the main axle shaft. This freezing of composite brakes discs on the a320 almost never happens. A320 series, although the NEO has had a few of not publicized small engine fires and uncommanded engine shutdowns in the first few years, they seem to have fixed the issue. The aircraft integration is both the aircraft greatest and worst feature. The ground proximity sensor system is a bit problematic and if you actually pull the lgciu CB, you can not operate the hydraulic operated cargo doors. You need to manually pump it. Also you can not do EEC eng bite test with CB pulled. The avionics is so finicky and prone to PMS and sometimes a 320 just doesn't want to fly. So often pilots at the end of pushback are resetting CB under the command of maintenance control. The eicas messages sometimes desensitize pilots into ignoring msgs. This is not good for aviation safety. There are many things I do like on the a320 but overall, I have never had a system fault on me in the 737 that is not installed. Yes the a320 faulted a system with numerous faults for the central emergency 02 for passengers when the airline did not have that sys installed. Lol. The engine fire squib is also problematic on a320. About 2 to 3 times a year requiring to go and reseat the cannon plug, a 30 min process. Overall I would take both Boeing products over the a320 series aircraft but I understand that airbus rolls out red carpet and makes sweetheart deals for airlines to pick them.

[@JohnAnderson-zb3cr]

Did you really just post a 5 paragraph comment on KZbin? Jesus Christ

[@bok.1722]

@@JohnAnderson-zb3cr guess your one of those types who doesn't like to be enlightened or have a conversation;)

[@yanbesidski7765]

Thanks!

[@Deltadavid1572]

Delta made the right decision in ordering the 737 MAX

[@JavanHamiltonTV]

This guy gets it. 💯

[@peterhougardy8661]

That is if the 10 gets certified before year-end! If not Boeing has stated there will be no 10!

[@michaelfeanny4108]

Hindsight is always 20-20…Boeing should’ve pursued their FSA 737 replacement instead of the MAX line. They should’ve built an updated 757/767 MAX/Plus program in lieu of this: new motors( I get they were waiting on engine technology but had this been a priority project the engine manufacturers would’ve focused on a power plant for it) updated flight deck, new wings, new interior. Every A321 sale is a lost 757 sale for Boeing and there are THOUSANDS of them, with more being ordered every month. I get that they had to prioritize damage control with the MAX, 777X, and 787 QA issues, but if the MAX had never came to be Boeing would be in a very different place right now. As a 737 pilot it’s mind boggling to me that this jet is still the premiere product offering from them.

[@Curt_Sampson]

The issue there is that Boeing was under a _lot_ of pressure from Southwest (and perhaps some from other customers, too) to produce a new, more efficient "737" that maintained the type rating and minimised pilot retraining. That's one of the primary causes of the MCAS issue: they needed it the MCAS to maintain certain parts of the 737 NG flight behaviour, and training pilots on it, or even informing them of its existence, would be added training. Southwest has no doubt for a long time been a source of pressure to keep the 737 going, and one that's hard for Boeing to ignore. It's the largest operator of 737s in the world, and has to date ordered 235 737 MAXs. I can certainly see how business folks would feel a lot of pressure to keep pushing the 737 until the platform finally breaks, and given that Boeing at the management level is essentially McDonnell Douglas (and way out in Chicago, to get away from those pesky Boeing engineers) it's no surprise that they decided not to address their long-term technical issues and instead carry on wringing the 737 for all its worth. For a long time there's been a big hole in the market where the 757 was; Airbus seems to be aiming to fill that to at least some degree with new iterations of the A321. We'll see how well they they do with the XLR, and that may give us some sense of how much demand there is to have this hole filled. It could well be that there is (or develops) huge demand for another 757, the XLR won't quite be able to meet that, Boeing will step in in ten to fifteen years with a 797 that does just what's needed and is using better technology than the XLR, and Boeing will come out of this looking decent, if not exactly a shining star. Maybe.

[@TheLugiaExpert]

@@Curt_Sampson if you look into it, it was actually American that was pressuring Boeing, as they purchased A320’s for the first time and pressured Boeing to make an upgraded 737 or else they’d switch.

[@Curt_Sampson]

@@TheLugiaExpert I did mention that other airlines were also exerting pressure on Boeing. Are you saying that Southwest wasn't exerting pressure at all, or wasn't a _major_ source of the pressure? If so, you're wrong. But the key point WRT MCAS is not pressure for a new 737, but pressure for one that requires minimal (i.e., no simulator) retraining. _That_ was the source of the need for MCAS, and the need to hide the MCAS. I've not found any indication that an airline other than Southwest insisted on this, but I'd love it if you can point me to evidence showing otherwise!

[@michaelfeanny4108]

@@Curt_Sampson I agree with you, that is why and how the MAX came to be. I guess the point I was trying to make was not why the MAX happened but why even with everything you said it shouldn’t have. Even with the pressure from SW, AA, and Airbus (attempting to be relevant with the 320 NEO family) they should’ve realized the 737 was already stale technology and pursued their FSA (Future Small Aircraft). I fly both the 737 NG and MAX and it’s beyond dated…the NG should’ve been the 737’s swan song. It has no EICAS, the cockpit is from the 60’s, it’s small, loud, and the MAX is no better just a little more power. Compared to a 787 or even a E175 the difference is night and day the 737 should’ve been put to pasture a long time ago. There’s no reason Boeings narrow body offering in 2022 isn’t an advanced high performance composite relevant aircraft (in essence a narrow body scaled down 787). They simply missed the ball with this. I get that they’re making sales on it now but that’s in large part because there’s literally nothing else for it’s customers to buy. As far as loosing sales from SW, AA, and others by not producing an updated 737 at some point those carriers are going to have to transition to a new airframe. The FSA which they were working on at the time and shelved because they were worried about their near term bottom line without a doubt would’ve been a superior product than the MAX and would’ve been successful. The argument that they would’ve lost out on all these contracts and not recovered is obtuse. There’s a duopoly in aircraft manufacturing and the wait list for new deliveries is years long. Airlines will buy whatever planes are available or they won’t fly at all. As far as the hole left by closing the 757 line it never should’ve happened. I understand it was a post 9/11 world and that the wing box was difficult to build but they sold over a thousand of them. NOTHING can do what that airplane can do. The 321NEO/321XLR come close in some areas but don’t give that overall high performance (hot and high) middle of the market beast that was and is 757. It needed relatively small updates to hone its design but it would’ve decimated the level of success that Airbus has been having with the 321. That is the aircraft that airlines want and need. They are literally begging for it and Boeing is left with this subpar offering in the MAX 10 while simultaneously watching thousands of A321s get purchased. Boeing, for the last 20 years has consistently made the wrong decision in most of its programs.

[@ACPilot]

@@michaelfeanny4108 - Personally, of the 737 Classic, NG and MAX, I enjoy flying the MAX the most. Flown it from short 30 min domestic to Scotland/Ireland transatlantic to N.Y. I think when Boeing is ready to take the project on, they will, based on the 787, make a wider narrowbody, to replace first the 757, then the 737 MAX. Use the same nose and fuselage, but two different wingsets, gear configurations, and next generation LEAP, and a LEAP+ offering higher thrust for the largest variants.

[@l3v1ckUK]

I think Airbus need to make an A220-500 to replace the A320, and then a new A360 narrow body to replace the A321 and 757-200/300 in the early 2030's. This A360 could have the extra range airlines are looking for, for longer, thin point to point routes. Boeing had the problem of either trying to make the 797 cover the size range of the 737 and 757, or having to build two new planes (possibly with a common fuselage width) to cover the market.

[@cobyexplanes]

Ya it's interesting, all the new aircraft families are shifting slightly. The 787 slots between the 767 and 777, the 797 will slot between the 737 and 757, and the A360 will likely slot between the A321 and A330. Strange times

[@john.1272]

Airlines aren't looking to replace their a320s and a321s right now why would they make an entirely new plane for it

[@cobyexplanes]

@@john.1272 If the 797 comes out in 2035, that will be about 20 years since the first NEOs were rolled out. At that point it would be time for replacement

[@catinthehat6719]

Also wouldn't airbus be zoned in on the Zero-E program?

[@ccm1767]

@@cobyexplanes There is no good reason Boeing should aim for 797 to slot between the 737 and 757. That isn't the market of the future and not a current product gap. The gap for the 797 to fill is something between the 757 and 787 in size (and range). That's even what Boeing previously said they were going to build. Granted, now that they are waiting 5-10 years, hard to know what they will do. Delta isn't buying A321XLRs since they don't need them. They need a 767 sized replacement (larger and with a longer range than an A321XLR) and a USA domestic 757 replacement (which seems likely to be the A321NEO). When they signed for B737-10s, Delta even said they expect those planes to be equipped for longer range flights and have a higher % of premium seats than their A321NEOs. Thus, they see the B737-10s for business heavy trans-cons and longer range flights that B757-200s fly now. So what they don't have is a B757-300, B767-300ER, and B767-400ER replacement. They also want to keep upguaging flights where possible, and using A321XLRs on such existing routes would be downguaging (i.e. the opposite of what they want to do). Since they aren't buying A330-800s or B787-8s, I think that's a hint of what they would want B797s to be capable of size wise, but with a smaller, lighter, more fuel efficient plane than those.

[@GoalHornGeek]

Once it does take off, I’ll be pretty lucky and will see it quite a few times a day. It may replace the 757 running to Atlanta (currently runs on 757 6-7x daily) as well as the 767 to Paris

[@g3johnston]

If I remember correctly, the Max 10 development is held up with the FAA, so this deal seems like it likely has a lot of favorable terms for Delta given Boeing’s back is against the wall with regulators and reputation. It’s possible they may only take delivery of a portion and convert the rest in a few years.

[@0REXIN0]

2:38 that’s the smoothest landing i’ve ever seen

[@sheldoninst]

A321XLR is NOT a “perfect” replacement for the B757, but rather a modest replacement… until Boeing actually gets its act together and settles on design for an oval cross section fuselage plane, it’ll be a long day before the B757/B767 replacement. Plus Delta is known to keep its planes longer than most, remember they owned the L1011s for a couple decades before finally being forced to replace them.

[@cobyexplanes]

Aside from hot and high performance of the 757, what makes you say that?

[@janellek21]

And when they acquired Northwest they put geriatric DC-9's back in service for several years!

[@Brad-gk9jd]

Over the years, Delta has made some brilliant moves in buying aircraft. Delta's best buy was ten old Eastern's L1011, bought an absolute bargain and refurbished with many more years of service. While other airlines bought turbo-props, Delta did not.

[@FlightSideOfLife]

Awesome vid as always Coby! Love your recent 797 research

[@marekeos]

Hope they ordered extra bolts and nuts.

[@JoshAndJojoGaming]

😂

[@rushfan3]

Great video. Delta committing to the, as yet to be built, 797 (nma) is a great move. By saying they'll order the 797 over the Airbus 321xlr is a win for both Delta and Boeing. This gives Delta, like it did for Pan Am and the 747, more of a "say" on how the 797 should look and perform. And by committing to the 737 Max 10 they are giving Boeing the green light to ramp up work on the 797. But the 797 is still a decade away,so we'll see what happens between now and the planes launch.

[@johniii8147]

Turns out the 747 wasn't a smart move by Pan Am. It was one of the factors that led to going out business. It was simply too big for them in most markets.

[@derbagger22]

I love Delta. But I won't fly the 737MAX out of principle and I dislike Boeing planes, in general.

[@thisnamehasnoreason]

Hearing that 757s are 25+ years old might scare people. The only thing on the aircraft that is 25 years old still in the fuselage, the bulk of the aircrafts internals have been upgraded and replaced.

[@L33tSkE3t]

The B757 s a special plane. It is the aircraft that often serves as Air Force 2 because it can carry many passengers while taking off and landing on very short runways.

[@nickfliesplaces]

757 is BAE its to pretty and great for passengers to replace with an A321, the fact that you use the 2nd boarding door is so nice, so that you get a split for 1st/comf for exiting and its nice to have the physical separation that it makes it my fav delta plane.

[@tenkloosterherman]

Huh?

[@Traumahawk007]

797 will be similar to 757 with wider fuselage, mostly carbon fibre & will have RR Ultrafan, poss bleedless too.

[@moisesperez4659]

As a former air traffic controller the 757 was my favorite to work and fly. Always enjoyed working deltas south Florida to Atlanta route. 3500 fpm climb was standard for these beast. Airbus was not even close.

[@gidderman]

Since the 757 is such an amazing plane, one thing I don't understand is why Boeing doesn't just make more of them? Literally ditch all the expensive re-engineering and use the old designs, and build it again... why does everyone have to re-invent it the wheel, it has already been beat to death...? Why waste the time, why not just keep making more of a good thing?...

[@kevinpoole1543]

Because it would cost jyst as much to built a new 757 assembly line and source suppliers than it would to build the 797. The old 757 assembly line and tooling no longer exists, and Boeing sold off the property in Renton long ago. It’s now a shopping center, apartments, and most recently, a Top Golf.

[@nouatreiunu]

Supporting 797 program in the long run, doesn't exclude buying some 321XLR in the next years to cover their short (time) to medium time needs, until 797 (+ the usual Boeing N years of delays) will really come to the fleet...

[@parkerjon29]

Calling the A321 a perfect 757 replacement is a absolute joke.

[@mikeroll8515]

Less emotion and more info. I'd like to understand where you're coming from.

[@cobyexplanes]

@@mikeroll8515 I would too

[@soylentblueispeople2]

Agreed. The 757 has superior range & payload. The Max 10 and the 321XLR can not compete with the 757-300 in range or capacity…

[@JavanHamiltonTV]

@@mikeroll8515 Agreed.

[@manganvbg90]

I have been lucky to fly the 757 a few times, they are not that common here in europe. What a sweet plane it is

[@corpsimmons575]

I would like to note: Delta, from what I can tell from my local airport and FlightRAdar24, Tends to not utilize the 757s range. I see a lot of them operating flights that require more seats than, say, a 737-900 or an A320 can provide. They do certainly operate long distance, but I think the MAX 10 order was more to fill this sort of commuter distance operation of the 757.

[@sfrsteel]

I think by the time they had a good number of XLRs it would be 2035 ish. It's likely a good financial plan to wait. The XLR is not a 757 replacement, so the wait and see attitude is likely the best one for Delta

[@thomasmacken9721]

Judging by Boeing boards record with the Max & the 787, Delta will be waiting years longer than the 2035 estimate before they get the 797.(profit before safety)

[@cobyexplanes]

Good news is Boenig's earnings this quarter showed they spent way more on R&D than in recent years. Thats a step in the right direction

[@BWB_Cubing]

1:24 a scratch in my screen is at the exact place where his mouth would be Making it look like hes upset lol

[@stebiaggio]

The 797 is still a big question mark and will end up to be a revised/improved of a B757, which would be perfect if it was ready now. Considering will take not less than 10 years, for DL would be better to go with the A320/321 family now, rather than wait for something nobody knows (not even Boeing) what it will look like. The B737MAX big purchase has been a great marketing operation, overall, which allowed DL to get planes at a lower price. It's just a matter of $$ and they were able to get a great deal from Boeing, as consequence of this very challenging time of theirs.

[@ThorntonWillie]

Good thing I got to ride on a 757 several times in the 90's. I remember when I first seen it I was like that plane is not as small as I thought it was. And that was after being on a 747. Been on many aircraft and nothing climbs like a 757 in the commercial world. I should feel lucky got to ride on a dc-10 and a md-11 too.

[@kylecampbell1444]

The A321XLR isn't a perfect replacement for the 757. It doesn't have the payload and performance of the 757. Especially when you look at the cargo side. The XLR uses cargo space for fuel which hurts cargo weight and space, plus the cost per seat mile goes up with it. But do agree the that they will hold some of the 757s for the long thin routes. Like to some south American, high altitude destinations out west, and to places like the Azores. Them using the 757s from Atlanta to Orlando won't be around for ever.

[@khylejoseph166]

You just contradicted yourself. It's not a 757 replacement BECAUSE it doesn't have the payload and performance of the 757. Not all of the 757s mission profiles are long, thin routes. Majority of them are short hops within continents and maybe a couple Transatlantic flights. Aside from that, it's a pretty bum replacement if it cannot take off from short runways at MTOW. Or not be payload restricted on flights from hot/high airports. It only matches and succeeds in range, but aside from that I'd say it isn't a true replacement.

[@TelekinesisStudios]

Wild shot at 6:28! That's a Delta 757 landing at PVU (Provo, Utah) where Delta doesn't fly, and no airline operates the 757 on regular routes. I assume it's a charter (possibly for the BYU Football team, Delta is their charter airline partner?)

[@arielsegal7515]

I think that more than everything, Delta is just making a hard incentive to a bleeding Boeing... It's a good way to help them to recover... I thing the best way to recover but not just to fix the MAX, 787 and 777X... It's bringing a newer Airplane even if the proyect take time. Psychologically it will be a boost for them.

[@davis6123]

Delta will not be getting rid of its 717s and 767s for a while. They had said 2025 during COVID, but after the rapid recovery of travel, they’ve been retrofitting 767s and plan to keep 717s through at least 2030. The 767-400s will be around for another decade, they are incredibly important to Delta’s fleet.

[@tenkloosterherman]

I flew the 767 many times on the AMS-SCO route and I developed a healthy dislike for the type (incidentally: the planes on that route were owned by KLM but quickly leased to Air Astana). KLM ust have disliked the type too.

[@tonyduy796]

I think that if a 757 replacement isn't provided by Boeing in the upcoming few years, Delta would convert some of its a321neo options into the xlr version as a b757 replacement

[@scotttild]

They can’t convert an Airbus order to a Boeing one. They would have to pay a penalty for canceling an Airbus order.

[@tonyduy796]

@@scotttild no what im saying is that delta would convert some of their neo options into a321neo xlr orders as a replacement for the aging boeing 757 that Delta is still using.

[@ronaldfish1569]

Yes Delta should hold out for the 797

[@bandit4true]

Love the 757. Boeing madeva huge mistake not continuing new production of the aircraft while airbus continues to built its protégé in the A320 and A321 series.

[@andrewwmacfadyen6958]

The 757 was the tool of choice for the European package tool operators full loads out of shortish runways in mid summer

[@epbski]

It's also possible that during the next decade, Delta could decide to order some amount of A321XLRs to replace at least some of their 757s for longer routes. Since Delta already has the A321neo, it would have complete commonality with the XLR. Delta could order a certain number of XLRs, while still waiting to replace the bulk of their 757s with the NMA/797.

[@chrismckellar9350]

Delta could buy the A321lr, as the A321lr extra fuel tanks can be removed and added allow the variant to be converted into a A321neo.

[@technole]

The day that Ed said he wanted to be a launch customer of NMA was kind of telling they are willing to wait it out as long as needed. Not to mention any "797" deal would likely be tied to Delta TechOps getting an engine service contract being one of the largest MROs in the world. While A321XLR isn't an exact replacement for 757, I have no doubt that the XLR will end up on Delta property no matter what happens as they still have open options with A321neo.

[@thecomet28]

I think the 797 will be more advanced in all aspects than the XLR. Although the A321XLR is a great creation by Airbus, it doesn't meet the new green efforts being set out by Global Leaders. Boeing could come to the table with a powerful aircraft but with more green efficiencies than today's technology, saving Delta more money in the future. I see the 757 & 767 staying around a long time as they fit Delta's route network better than the current Boeing and Airbus offerings. The 797 will be the next 787 in terms of economics and technology, hence why they ordered the A220. The A220 has some of the best economics of any aircraft in the market. It's a market leader, and Delta wants to be at the forefront of market-leading aircraft.

[@Thirteenwindows]

I have a strong feeling the 797 might look like a single-isle 787 or a "shrunken 787"

[@soylentblueispeople2]

I disagree… The 797 will be a fat 737 Max with twin aisles 200+ seats and great range in my prediction…

[@tigerchuu2148]

Of course the 797 will be more advanced than the 321XLR… Boeing isn’t even making the 797 yet while the 321XLR is already doing test flights. It takes about 5-8 years for a plane to go from development to flying so if 5-8 years from now the 797 is not more advanced and environmentally friendly then I’ll be shocked.

[@JavanHamiltonTV]

Correct. People say that the 737 is 50-year-old technology, but the A320 is more than 30 years old. Both are old as dirt, and we need new equipment out there.

[@rikjanssens8971]

I love Boeing so much. But my biggest love is the 757. I hope they will built a new generation of 757, such like the 757-800, 757-MAX or the 757-X.

[@utoob7361]

Boeing continues to reap the benefits of canceling the 757 in favor of the obsolete 737. At least the shareholders were happy for a quarter.

[@LudingtonBass]

I like the idea of not putting all ur eggs in one basket. Tho having one primary line has its benefits. It’s also good to keep both companies (AB and B) fighting to get and keep ur business.