Colorado: Subaru Prepares for a Climb to 13K ft / 4K meters (featuring @mtnsubi)

[@uritaub5441]

Great Subi! Love it!

[@bruceyyyyy]

I'm not sure what MtnSubi is but I'm glad to help by watching/liking. Some thoughts: CO and similar high elevations areas sell 85 Octane at Gas Stations and say it's OK in cars designed for 87. Subaru of America says otherwise. They recommend 87 octane no matter the elevation. At those elevations I DEFINLTEY noticed a lack of power with the 2.5. As even at 8k feet climbing some passes on the highway it was unable to maintain 60 mph. Those little FB25/TR580 make a great combo in OB/Foz/Treks and are probably better crawlers (or at least seem less likely to stall out) than my EZ36/TR690 from my experience. Not sure if this is gearing or something else going on internally. 13:20 This parking area is where we parked when I was here because a JK? owner came down and said do not attempt as he couldn't make it so us (in the Gen 5 OB and a 4.0 XJ) decided to stop here. I likely wouldn't have gone any further than Carey's OB here though but I would love to have attempted it. (: It was fun having a snow ball fight in July at the top. Good content as always Jon!

[@pf465]

I always run 91 octane, especially if I'm going into the mountains... but that is contingent on availability :)

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thanks Bruceyyyyy, I’m sure Carey will appreciate it. @mtnsubi is her Instagram tag, and the name of her Rebelle Rally team. She will explain more about her setup in her next video where she attempts imogene pass. She mentions her front bumper giving her the clearance needed to get by certain obstacles, running stock size tires so that she maintains as much gearing, her locker letting her maintain momentum, starting the trail with a clean air filter, running octane booster, and some more things. Her 4th Gen outback actually has the 1st Gen lineartronic TR690 (not the HT version though). This version definitely doesn’t stall like the version on the Turbo variants. My friends Subaruski and Parker Manticone have taken their 4th Gen Outback/Legacy up some really challenging terrain. That my 15 FXT couldn’t drive up.

[@bruceyyyyy]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring Are you sure about the 690? I thought those were in the 10-12 models when they still ran EJ motors. The 13-14 got the FB25 and the 580. The valve body on top and the engine filter also on top is usually a give away. Subaru took notes from Iacocca and markets 5 cars with the same drive train. Either way, I have seen the 580 not stall out while mine would even though mine had twice the torque.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Well, Subaruski and Parker both have 2010 models. Not sure what year Carey has, i just know it’s a 4th Gen. They changed the Transmission mid cycle huh? Interesting.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

I could have sworn my 2010 EJ WRX had the filter on top.

[@georgedanilov8898]

I went up there without any extra prep I have 2 inch ADF lift, skid plates, and AT tires (General Grabber ATX) on otherwise stock 2005 Outback 2.5i I got stuck on the same rocky hill @ ~ 13,000 - 2 switchbacks before the summit. Pedal to the metal, stationary I’m happy to find the limits of my car without damaging it

[@brohammer]

Ridiculously beautiful landscape, that’s for sure ! Always good videos, Jon

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Southwestern Colorado and everything along the Million Dollar highway is exquisite

[@_Machine631_]

love that she does this. although she does have limits with trails like that. AWD isn't great for a more rocky terrain. And with newer vehicles and all the tech, it makes it more of a challenge.

[@ThePhotographyHobbyist]

Never really thought I'd end up on channels like this, but here's the deal. After looking at Subarus because we'll be getting our son a new 2023 WRX, I got to liking the Outback Wilderness (the 2.4L turbo Outback with 9.5" of clearance), I starting thinking that version of the Outback would make a great retirement car (and keep my F150 just for misc use, but not more vacation trips in it). So that's the plan as of now, retiring in about 7 years or so. Not sure what Outback versions will be available at that time, but looking at how this young lady got her naturally aspirated Outback almost all the way up that pass with no help, I'm thinking surely I could do it in the turbo version which is also geared a bit lower. I just wish it didn't have a CVT. That's one thing that's hampering the Subaru in this video (would have been better off with a regular automatic trans or even a stick, but Subaru doesn't offer that anymore in the Outback). Anyway, It's good to see stuff like this so I know what's available out there for me to go have an adventure on (without getting killed) in my 'vacation Outback' some day :D

[@pf465]

I added 2 coolers to my 2017 Forester, Setrab 13 row with thermostatic sandwich plate for engine oil, and Setrab 19 row with Thermostat control for CVT. Now you got me thinking about adding a fan as a bail out back up. I'm also working on some other non conventional ideas based around under hood air flow to further dissipate heat. Great video as always JDZ. I will re watch it later on the big screen for full affect of those excellent shots.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Nice, sounds like a robust setup! Sounds like a fan upgrade would be perfect to activate off the thermostat you already installed.

[@reyperez3424]

You should make a video, things like this helps us a lot

[@pf465]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring Ha, you read my mind... the sandwich plate has NPT thread provisions tapped into it for such occasions (currently plugged).

[@pf465]

@@reyperez3424 Good to know... I'll see what I can do. Thanks for idea.

[@brianwilliams3146]

Great video!

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thanks Brian 🙏

[@janhbhugo5085]

Very good video, well done everyone !

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thank you JanHB 🙏

[@Hondo21435]

Awesome Trail!

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thanks Mr. Hondo

[@timhardman4764]

Excellent episode Jon. I really enjoy your balance of capturing the beauty of nature, some of the personalities and of course the skills and strategy of negotiating the tough spots at each obstacle. I've been struggling for a few years over the decision to spend about $5k on my 2006 Ridgeline buying Flat-out suspension yielding 3" of body lift, larger diameter KO2's all the way around, sliders and skid plates plus the labor to install all of that OR buy a more capable Rig and put the $5K mod budget into the cost of the "new" to me rig. Decision Made. Next week I'll be picking up my new ride - 2015 Nissan Xterra Pro4X with bumpers, winch, 33's, 2" lift and other goodies already done to the rig. Looking forward to getting out on the trails and if I'm lucky I may bump into one of your caravan outings. Thanks for all the info you have put out over the years on AWD going offload with a variety of other 4WD vehicles almost always joining in. Your inclusion of the Xterra piqued my curiosity to investigate this vehicle I had mostly written off or not paid attention to in the past. I had pretty much decided I was going to get a 4runner (1st choice) but for $20K there is not much out there that isn't pretty old with miles and no mods. I'm guessing an equivalently equipped, same miles same year 4Runner to my modded $20K P4X would have been about $35K+. I still love the 4Runner, I'm not a fan boy of any particular make, I was just priced out of that option so I'm happy there was another choice that fit my budget and needs. I love your rig and set up also but again, with all the mods, out of my budget. I'm always looking forward to your next adventure.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thanks for the kind words Tim and precongrats on the Xterra! It’s a proven vehicle with lots of potential in the form of upgrades like the Titan suspension swap. Happy for you! Where are you based out of?

[@timhardman4764]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring Just recently moved from Ohio to the NW corner of the Valley (Phoenix) and specifically Surprise, AZ What area of the country is home for you?

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

I’m in southern California. Close enough! Braden, the guy with the blue Tacoma is all the way from Northern Utah, but I’ve been on 4 trips with him .

[@thomasuzarski7368]

Watch before she couldnt go anymore, both rear tires weren't turning. I thought the locker , locked both back axles ?

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

The obstacle became too severe, the torque converter stalled out

[@frankietuned]

Funny how the camera doesn't do that obstacle on Yankee Boy Basin justice. It's steeper then it looks on video. It was starting to rain pretty hard when we got to that point. One of the Gladiators we were with was concerned about his vehicle. I drove up it and came back down. I advised them against taking it though because of their wheelbase. The rain really changes the dynamics when you're out there. When we got back to camp in Quray it was like the whole mountain was engulfed in cloud. It was amazing! Another excellent video thank you for sharing!

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

💯 Frankie! That’s exactly why I included the footage of my climb attempt and also the Tacoma getting really tipsy going down. The driver of the Tacoma drove up a few of the switch backs and advised we didn’t continue because he was losing traction. His Tacoma is regeared to a 50 something to 1 crawl ratio too.

[@frankietuned]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring it was super sketchy in the rain. Just means we'll have to go back again. We were trying to get to the mountain lake up there. If I remember correctly it was named "Blue Lake" lol

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

@@frankietuned yes! I wanted to go there too! I would like to try it again, now that I have a flexier suspension setup

[@frankietuned]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring would love to join you guys. Wish I could bring my Pilot and my Jeep Wj lol

[@no-lodesigns]

Great trip! Looking forward to the next installment for sure!

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Are we going back in 2023?

[@no-lodesigns]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring I'm game to go somewhere. I'll have to start thinking.

[@bmc_rc6212]

Awesome content as usual, do you happen to have a link to that transmission cooler that Carey has in her outback? I might be looking to do the same thing, but definitely going to get a scan gauge 2 first! Thanks for these video they are very helpful for us upgrading our subarus!

[@JustinCaseWages]

Carey is so rad and so is Rebelle Rally! Well done, Jon. Thanks for showcasing vehicles like this and of course the Honda.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thanks Justin! Yes, Carey is super cool

[@clintshanks2538]

I just did Imogene Pass Aug 15th 2023. I have a 22 P4X, stock suspension w/upgraded tires. This trail was more taxing than I thought it would be. No damage to my truck other than I rub some paint off my trailer hitch. I can’t imagine doing this trail in a unibody platform. I am an anything from Japan fan boy. I’ll be a Subie fest in Sept. So please understand that I do not mean any disrespect when I ask, why push these cars to do things they were not designed to do? With the price of the vehicle + mods, there are so many platforms, to start with, that would be better suited for these types of trails. Again, I mean no disrespect at all, I just don’t understand.

[@thomasuzarski7368]

Awesome outback

[@careylando2795]

Thank you!! 🙏🏽

[@thomasuzarski7368]

@@careylando2795 do you know the lift it has and tire size?

[@careylando2795]

@@thomasuzarski7368 it has a 2” LP Aventure lift and (in this video) had 215/75/15 tires on 15” Method wheels. I’ve since upsized to 235/75/15 tires, same BFG KO2s.

[@bernardshaw7585]

Wasn't sure from the video did the Tacoma with 5.29 gears and the rear locker not clear the obstacle?

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Yes, with rear locker engaged, it easily cleared the obstacle. I thought I recorded it, but I couldn't find the file.

[@iluvdrt8776]

Bro, you need to come up here to the pnw. It's unreal.

[@careylando2795]

100000% I got a little taste of the PNW the day before this trip started and drove from Bend to Ouray in 1 day. Then, went back up to WA a few weeks later. Spectacular terrain too!!

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

I’ll head up there for sure in 2023! Probably for overland Expo

[@jamesmeans6558]

Another great one Jon! Really digging the BALLS system... I "think" I'm still a little afraid to mess with the braking system on these Hondas even though I understand what it's doing. Maybe after some more testing by you and others to make sure that the BALLS system doesn't do something unexpected while heading down the highway, I will consider getting it. Of course, that is if the gentleman who created it makes a "kit" we can buy. :)

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thanks James 🙏. The guy behind balls is doing just that, “testing”. We are both testing. So far we found the potential for leaking. That issue was addressed. Also, the BALL system was designed to make sure its safe even if it fails. Solenoids will eventually wear out, but if they fail, it fails open, so there’s no chance for it to lock up a brake. I need to do a video on how the ball system is operated. The best way I could describe its application is: “It’s for someone that is experienced with offroad terrain that knows the concept of avoiding crossing up the axles and knows how to left foot brake. This system is manually controlled where you individually brake the front left or front right wheel.” As shown in this video, it’s very effective, but admittedly, I could really use more practice. The reason this system works in the midsized Hondas is because of the way the transmission is geared, but this does create extra load and the transmission got extra warm. Having to tackle obstacles like this back to back would be unreasonable. This modification is perfect for getting through the unexpected. You’ll see other AWD vehicles using a winch to pull their vehicles up obstacles like this. BALLS is nice because I can get over something like this on the fly.

[@jamesmeans6558]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring Thank you for explaining a little better Jon. Maybe you could get a "second camera" operator to film what is going on inside the cab at the same time as what is happening at the wheels... or something to that effect. Look forward to your next project!

[@Crashe2009]

Great video! It's great to see people pushing their Outbacks to new limits!

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thanks Caleb 🙏

[@joshuawendt2050]

Was the outback NA or turbo charged?

[@52hydra]

Buddy had a crosstrek with spal fan and a trans cooler. CVT always got too warm. I have a 6mt forester and no temp issues so far but hills are sketchy.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

I hear of people running double transcoolers, maybe that will be more effective than adding the fan. My Passport has a super dinky transmission cooler. I think it’s meant mainly for towing, because on the highway doing 70 mph, the transmission is super cool, but ok slow trail riding, not enough air gets rammed into the vents. Have you heard of ZF design? They made a low range transmission with a 45:1 crawl ratio for Subaru manuals. That would be game changing for you!

[@52hydra]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring Could you link me that transmission? 17 forester. If the price is right I might consider it.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

@@52hydra probably expensive, but it’ll transform your rig www.alldrivesubaroo.com.au/gearbox/dual-range-transmission/

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Contact the “ZF Design”. They’re based in Colorado and should be able to help you. I don’t know them, or anyone to refer you to.

[@businesschud]

Yeah I've got a Crosstrek 2.5L. It's stock, and on a hot day (90F) in Orange County California climbing to Santiago Peak, my transmission temps are about 220F as I climb up.

[@pnw_element9822]

Damn right I wheel what I got as well no shame if I have to turn back

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Yep, that’s the overland mindset. The goal is exploration, not conquering obstacles 😃

[@KTMcaptain]

People don’t realize how important a locker or LSD is for their crossover. Without low range to generate more torque and flexy suspension to keep good traction the vehicle has to generate more torque than necessary to drive since the traction control requires torque at the brake to transfer power to the opposite wheel. A locker will just deliver the minimum torque required, whereas an open diff can require up to double the engine torque. . I’m sure that helps to reduce the strain on the engine.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thanks for pointing that out Jordan! All of Carey’s upgrades played a part in her success, but the locker let her maintain her momentum. She also ran stock size tires to maintain as much gearing as possible.

[@careylando2795]

I can’t agree with you more. It’s definitely made a big difference for my adventuring, and puts less strain on the vehicle as a whole because I can move slower through tough terrain.

[@KTMcaptain]

@@careylando2795 absolutely, how is the daily drivability with it? iirc it’s a Detroit style unit where it will disengage the outside wheel in turns. Any clunking or weird behavior. I use to off-road my moms 5eat 3.6R Outback, what a capable car. Excited to finally see this journey.

[@KTMcaptain]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring yeah, I really like her build and philosophy. Weight is the enemy off road. This will be a great series. I was shocked that she ran those temps on the freeway, very good to info.

[@careylando2795]

@@KTMcaptain I honestly notice zero issues driving around town. This particular 1-bolt diff seems to be quieter and smoother than some others have reported on their different vehicles. There aren’t many Outbacks with a locker; more Crosstreks and Fozzys. I don’t hear any clicking or slippage when turning. It’s just “there” when I need it.

[@bradenb]

Haha. I only have myself to blame on getting so tipsy in the Taco. I had no trouble going up so I didn't really think it would be a problem going down. IFS problems.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

I was going through footage and totally forgot about your GoPro. Arrggghhh, yeah, you just floated up the obstacle with little issue

[@FatalAnimal]

Man that last tough obstacle. I was rooting for both you and Carey to get over that thing! Congrats on the good driving skills, good spotting and your BALLS for making it past the obstacle - ROFL! 🤣

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

I made sure to include all the footage of that obstacle, because to the untrained eye, things just don’t look as bad on video. I’m sure the Internet would say, “that Subaru couldn’t drive up that little bump”. The blue Tacoma almost rolling would help people see how tough the obstacle is 🤣

[@careylando2795]

Just needed a little more ooomph to get up there, but it wasn’t in the cards with the gearing and elevation. Pretty incredible seeing where those limits were for the vehicle.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

@@careylando2795 ​ that was a gnarly obstacle. At 17:52 you can see how steep it is, so don’t feel bad 😃.

[@pf465]

@@careylando2795Good job getting out there Carey... I Love that front bumper.

[@bullet2monkey]

Love your videos as always. I was just in Ouray a few weeks ago and we went up Yankee Boy in my 06 Grand Cherokee with QuadraDrive 2 (stock besides slightly oversized tires ~31"), made it to the last couple switch backs before I decided to park it at one of the pull offs. Hiked up to the top and the only vehicles up there were SXS's! We skipped Imogene because of this, specifically because I always had heard that it was harder than Yankee Boy. But with what you were saying, it sounds like past that last sign is harder that Imogene? Makes me feel validated about being sketched out the last few switchbacks, they get gnarly! I thought I was being a wimp haha.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Imogene is so tame compared to that section passed the sign at Yankee Boy. That’s some serious terrain! I was reviewing the GoPro footage of my friend with the blue Tacoma. Unfortunately, I forgot about his footage and didn’t include it in this video. Was there a lake up there?

[@PatrickRich]

Adding a fan might help, but I think having the additional cooling is going to do a lot more on its own. I added an aux pusher fan on the cruiser and it helps a little, but only a few degrees C from my testing. The best way for more cooling is for sure more oil cooling area.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thanks for the info Patrick! Carey’s transcooler definitely made a big difference. My OEM transcooler is super tiny. It doesn’t seem to do much of anything unless air gets rammed into it. The radiator in the midsized Hondas are gigantic. There’s alot of space for a larger transcooler. The only problem is that the ZF9 has proprietary brass quick connect fittings. Fortunately, it’s not prone to overheating on trails like this. But conquering that obstacle made my Transmission get to 239F. The highest it’s ever been.

[@PatrickRich]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring Your radiator is likely the primary cooling loop for your transmission if its like most vehicles, and the transcooler is just additional cooling area. I would guess Honda sized the radiator with a large overhead for the transmission for towing. I suspect that Subaru's smaller frontal area and limits the size of their total cooling area and with no real expectations of towing they don't really worry about that overhead. In that case, a trans cooler has a bigger impact.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

@@PatrickRich ah, I see! As always, thanks for the info!

[@kevinmiller7184]

Great scenery Jon. This is timely as I'll be dragging my powerhouse 2.5L Outback into the thin air of CO in a few weeks. Maybe still time for a mod or two...

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Thanks Kevin. Octane booster might help, that’s what Carey used.

[@ir8maverickmichaeljavillon306]

Let’s go Cary! You can do it! 🤙🏽

[@careylando2795]

Thank youuu!! 💪🏼💪🏼

[@ScatteredDreams120]

Does she have xmode?

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

She has a rear autolocking differential, no xmode.

[@ScatteredDreams120]

Makes me wanna get one now. I got a base sj and no xmode. I wanna wheel a little harder but I find myself leaving my car behind most times because I'm uncomfortable. Really cool seeing her do that as I'm a lady myself 🤟

[@ScatteredDreams120]

In your opinion, are cvt subarus without xmode less capable?

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

@@ScatteredDreams120 I had a 2015 FXT with xmode. I felt it didn’t do much of anything besides offer hill decent control. It was better for me to turn off traction control and engage 1st gear ratio. The newer Subarus with dual xmode does a little better. It’s the rear auto locking differential that will make the real difference.

[@ScatteredDreams120]

Shoot your reply feels familiar. I think I might've asked this question before 😂 sorry. I remembered I asked that Brucey fellow but I didn't remember asking you.

[@iluvdrt8776]

I had to turn off starlink to use my scanguage. It kept calling the police on me when I started the car lol. This has happened to other people as well. Just an FYI

[@businesschud]

LMFAO Thanks for telling me, I thought my Starlink was randomly acting up. I just put a SG2 in last week and Starlink is sending me a sh^t ton of emails. It thinks I died or something.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

LOL!!! Thanks for finding the source of that problem Jason!!!’ Ahahahah 🤣🤣. So how did you guys fix the problem?

[@iluvdrt8776]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring I had to cancel my starlink subscription.

[@xzinx]

balls !!!!

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

🤣🤣

[@JDS-Dalton]

Great video as always Jon! Carey has herself an impressive outback! I'm actually thinking about upgrading to a similar sized transmission cooler that she has since my current one is tiny.

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

Man, wish you could have made it out, but next year is looking promising. Sounds like Bruceyyyyy might be up for it. We can have 2 Subaru Forester Wildernesses out there!

[@JDS-Dalton]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring yea, sounds like everything will be good for next year. And that'll be great! He got rid of the wilderness though, actually wanting to buy the diff skid from him haha

[@JonDZ_Adventuring]

@@JDS-Dalton oh wuuuut? Man, he’s always trading in his vehicles

[@JDS-Dalton]

@@JonDZ_Adventuring yea, I was bummed, not many people are willing to send it with their new cars like he is! Haha