Commander Clash S8 E2: CEDH w/ Dylan and Cameron from Play To Win

[@PlaytoWinMTG]

Thank you so much for having us!! We had a blast. We'll have to play again soon now that flash is banned! (Maybe this time I can even figure out how to record my screen properly.. haha) -Dylan

[@papaUrabrask]

No hand cam for Dylan but hand cam for Cam cracked me up for some reason. You guys are awesome and I hope you make a return someday!

[@sheldonrotondo840]

Not a huge deal but in the deck intro, seth’s commander are shown as thrasios instead of tymna.

[@gillablecam]

Omg thank you, I was wondering why there was white and black in there haha

[@andrewg9216]

@@gillablecam so was I. I was so confused and just thinking I had missed a ruling since I am new to Commander.

[@HeritikGamer]

sheldon rotondo ok , that’s why there’s black in it then ... I was thinking WTF ? lol Thank you for proposing that question .

[@gjones9356]

Cameron is Crim wearing a fake mustache and I won’t be convinced otherwise.

[@cacs2201]

It took me a while to notice it wasn't Crim since I am just listening this as almost as a podcast

[@andreash.9251]

He's not even trying to alter his voice or way he speaks. try again! :D

[@PalPlays]

@@andreash.9251 Won't pull the wool over OUR eyes! Checkmate Goldfish Crew!

[@hugodiazroa]

1:33:48 you can only fail to find with tutors that go for a specific card type/ card. So you can't fail with DT, gamble or vampiric

[@cloaking111]

Search your library for a card... So I guess the only way to fail there would be to have been milled out?

[@hugodiazroa]

@@cloaking111 lol, I guess

[@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303]

@@cloaking111 at that point, you're either in trouble or about to win that turn.

[@jakobostheimer4066]

Yes play to win is the best new channel. Im so glad that you invited them

[@atomicpork]

Them: "If this resolves and he has in his hand, he wins the game and we can't interact with it." Tomer: "It doesn't sound to bad, I'll allow it. Its not like it lets him draw cards like Rhystic Study."

[@c.jhamblin5759]

Cameron sounds so much like crim its scary

[@whaleofdarkness]

Without the giggling :)

[@siri7005]

It's uncanny. I'm still not convinced they're not the same person :eyes:

[@papaUrabrask]

Crimeron

[@Alkhemia8]

This might be one of my fav commander clashes just because people were interacting instead of just playing solitaire

[@frankomancer]

I really dislike cEDH both as a concept and in practice, but seeing everyone playing cards that interacted with each other beyond wiping the entire board was incredibly refreshing. It's been a while since an episode actually held my attention for so long

[@Alkhemia8]

@@frankomancer yeah I have no idea why they never run interaction outside of wipes I don't play cedh do to the price tag but I always try to include targeted removal and interaction.

[@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303]

@@Alkhemia8 on mtgo counterspells are pretty bad since it give you a round of priority each turn you hold up mana, and I believe it gives you a turn if you tap out anyway for cards like force or daze

[@bigwig8657]

Love to see some cedh, but cmon no Richard for CEDH? Ya'll were scared of getting Boryborygomosed huh @mtggoldfish

[@RyanMclain]

c'mon, prob still would have been a like 5(-2)color esper infinite psionic blast zombie-kithkin tribal Ramos mill to wreck oppo's

[@erfunk]

53:30 Guest: discusses Lurrus, buying back permanents. Tomer: casts Ad Nauseam, interrupting. Tomer: "Go on." I see you, Tomer. I see you.

[@NaviTheMD]

LOL so funny how the time Tomer decides to bring some insight to cEDH saying how attractive FlashHulk is, it gets banned.

[@bulbasaurappreciator]

Dylan and Cam rock! Also loved seeing Tomer and Richard on their channel

[@jasonkorf7700]

Ah Rot Wolf a CEDH staple along with being a Commander Clash staple, lol. I definitely hope they do another CEDH game this season since Flash is now banned.

[@johnroyston3859]

I don't play cEDH but I see that it gets a lot of flack - I think the reason is because most of the criticism is coming from casual players so of course if you play a power level 5-6 against an 8-9 you're gonna be angry. This has definitely been true for myself since I usually aim for 5-6 in my personal decks. I play EDH with friends for a casual good time so things like back to basics, cyclonic rift, sunder, or even moat/teferi's moat don't usually get played because we just personally don't think it's very fun to lock someone mostly/completely out of the game. That being said, when ALL the decks are high power level, like this episode, it's awesome to watch!!! Great episode y'all!

[@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303]

For me it's when I played against my friends "casual" bruna Angel's deck, and on turn 5 he drops an odric and suddenly I'm at -163

[@RyuPlaneswalker]

1:35:00 Total Abacus play.

[@benjiboy1337]

With Seth having Angel's Grace and Thassa's Oracle in hand, wouldn't he win when he gets milled out, unless forced to draw a card before his untap step? Untap a white land for Winter Orb, and have double blue in mana rocks.

[@BlakeHobbesLML]

oh that's a good catch actually. Galaxy brain over here

[@mystdreamy739]

seth would have been forced to draw on an empty library before he got to untap with the mystic remora.

[@MrShinyObject]

@@mystdreamy739 remora is a may, and the urza deck isn't running any way to force drawing cards other than wheels and time twisters that either do nothing or kill them both.

[@countqueso1286]

@@MrShinyObject That might not be the case, since the win would be by milling with codex shredder he would not neccesarily have to exile his entire library and could maybe use windfall to force Seth to draw

[@whaleofdarkness]

Cameron could have used Codex Shredder's second mode to return a counterspell from his graveyard to his hand (for Thassa's Oracle). Or if his deck had a counterspell left he could just fish for it with Urza as he had infinite mana and infinite Pseudo Carddraw.

[@aidanmcnay133]

20:24 When you use Force of Will exiling Force of Negation instead of using Negation exiling Will, that’s one unnecessary life lost lol😂

[@Jonathan-qk5ed]

It sends a message...

[@SkipToYourOwnLou]

Aidan McNay came to comment the same thing

[@kaszael]

I was yelling at my scream. Even though it is just a life, it seemed like a very easy choice there...

[@Jonathan-qk5ed]

@@kaszael I bet you were yelling quite loud to be able to "yelling at my scream,*" lmao.

[@aidanmcnay133]

Chris L It’s not about nagging - I come here for the commentary. It’s a running joke that the comments section always points out everything (and is frequently talked about and laughed upon in the show). Moreover, I hope it was fairly obvious that my comment came across in a humorous manner (not intended as a hate comment). I think everyone can recognize that no one plays optimally all of the time (certainly not while being recorded), but it provides entertainment in hindsight. Moreover, I think that everyone can enjoy the content in whatever way they want - if for some people, that means finding all the little mistakes, no one should criticize them for that.

[@izzydd5075]

cEDH is my favorite (sub)format and Play to Win is one of my favorite youtube channels. therefore this episode is now dubbed my favorite commander clash episode!

[@jfrizzell6645]

Wow, if Cameron laughed more, he would sound just like Crim. Fooled me many time in this video.

[@kill_claw8682]

Didn't realize it wasn't crim till like halfway

[@TelafiestaSecretMenu]

big fan of the game and the channel keep up the positive attitude and give Seth more work, we want more of the bearded man!

[@Gaiametris]

Please do this again post flash ban!

[@JimmyJam154]

I love to see Play to Win collab on this channel, they are recently my new favorite cEDH channel to watch. I love the commentary they give on the game. Really looking forward to seeing their channel grow.

[@rexone9564]

When I saw the commanders and length of the game I just assumed it was 2 games.

[@michaelsander2878]

Part of me was hoping for 3-4 games. :)

[@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303]

Never underestimate the power of urza stax

[@hydra66]

if Crim put some lands in his deck, this would be his type of game

[@JCFoxpox]

As someone that has no interest in CESH, this video is one of my favorite commander clash videos ever. Absolutely amazing

[@juliandilmi1664]

I must say say, I really like the new format with new guests every week so far! I hope we'll see the Play to Win crew return at some point. Thanks for the great episode!

[@matthewstoner8130]

In game one why did Seth let back to basics resolve with no play to get it off the batlefield

[@munsulight721]

That was an hard decision that I'm even unsure what was the better decision. I think countering seems better, but I'm not sure

[@mystdreamy739]

I love your implication that there was gonna be a game two.

[@frankomancer]

My guess is his logic was that either way all of his lands were going to be tapped down, so it was preferable to make everyone elses stay tapped as well to keep them from winning

[@NathanJ666]

Play to win is my favorite cEDH channel. Awesome to see them getting their well deserved attention. Excited to see the channel grow.

[@anxez]

Tomer and Seth are so very frustrating for simply not playing their cards sometimes.

[@GamerdevilPro]

Agreed Also their "hate plays" towards each other are annoying and detrimental to the quality of the game, it already annoys me sometimes in "regular" games but the impact of these kinda plays is a lot lower there so it isn't as much of an issue but here...

[@bluntWeapon99]

@@GamerdevilPro This is a chill channel, not pro player. Those hate plays add to their personality and to the overall enjoyment of the video imo.

[@GamerdevilPro]

@@bluntWeapon99 cEDH only really works if people play to win and try to go for optimal lines of play. The idea of cEDH is based on that. Of course you can randomly FoW useless things just to tilt someone but then the other players just go off and you wasted your spells to troll. Playing like that is casual. That is fine and has its place but if you wanna play cEDH you have to drop these kinda things imo. I always say the main difference between cEDH and not-cEDH is the attitude and not the power of the decks and I think you can really see it displayed here.

[@MultiTaz333]

Rot wolf is very powerful in cedh

[@sethchapman1425]

Sweet mother of Bolas Seth. Counter Back to Basics. Depending on deck I would be playing I would scoop.

[@sethchapman1425]

I will say your way with dealing with Back, was fun.

[@chimneyimp1486]

i was expecting a copy artifact after the back to basics from seth (around 30:00 )

[@davidhansen5067]

Loving the bloodthirsty goose. Peace was never an option!

[@Ih8appls]

Although I like watching some of Prof's videos, this episode was hundred times more enjoyable, than the one with him in it.

[@keep7smiling]

Yeah I couldn't watch the prof video. To me he seems like a very negative person, only seeing the bad things and complaining.

[@bluntWeapon99]

@@keep7smiling Professor is really upset with wizards and it shows. I couldn't watch it either.

[@adriendelplace8755]

1st time I actually watch an episode of commander clash (I only watch Seth's content usually) and it was funny. Especially the mind censor on vamp 😁 I should check the other episodes now.

[@PalPlays]

This was a fantastic game of cEDH. I built Queen Marchesa stax to prey on a meta of Gitrog Frog, Blood Pod, Urza, and Kess Storm. I don't have all the pieces yet, but it has been performing exceedingly well.

[@siivamander8460]

Dylan knew what he was doing with the hand cam 😏

[@Alikaoz]

Nice! I've yet to watch stuff from PWP but the format's more interesting than the last one.

[@BroBdoubleE]

Flash is the better ban choice. Cause 2 mana instant speed can happen turn 1 instant speed and beyond.

[@hugodiazroa]

Why not both?

[@PalPlays]

@@hugodiazroa Because Flash was the problem and Oracle doesn't have a terrible effect on the game. Oracle is perfectly fine.

[@hugodiazroa]

@@PalPlays 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@keep7smiling]

Tomer start reading cards. Seriously. You don't need to take 2 dmg from boseiju to pay for rhystic study when there is a narset on the bf...

[@jacksunflare]

I'm so glad y'all play cEDH every now and then and I think this game really demystified it for a lot of people. All forms of commander can be fun!

[@dougfile6644]

A quick note on Obsuring Haze; it stops ALL damage your opponent's creatures would deal that turn, not just COMBAT damage. Not that relevant to cEDH Oracle wins, but it will stop things like Ashling / Hallar damage.

[@abheekpandya8717]

Why wouldn't seth counter back to basics? I'm so confused - he didn't counter so he wouldn't time walk himself and then couldn't do anything on that turn anyways.

[@paultobler3540]

Yeah that was very weird, you can really see that Seth and Tomer aren't used to cEDH (countering that rhystic with force pitching force for example which was a misplay imo).

[@mystdreamy739]

I absolutely love seth's commitment to not paying for rhystic, only being convinced when there is literally no excuse not to.

[@SilverAlex92]

and even then, having just a single extra treasure would have changed the outcome. Silence before the counterspell would have stopped Cameron from having the win. Paying that rhystic lost him the game xD

[@T_Peazy]

Cameron was so happy to see tomer cast force of will pitching force of negation while he has a flusterstorm in hand.

[@munsulight721]

I just dont understand the hate in the comments. The game had still some of the normal banter of commander clash, some commander clash missplays, tomer hating that seth is drawing more cards and being spiteful. This season is all about inviting content creators to play game of commander at differents level, them having fun with them and also trying to support/showcase these content creators. What if they invite JLK and Jimmy and the game goes in High power casual ? Will people in the comments be mad at them for not playing the usual more jank cards ? WHen they will probably invite Vince, will people be mad at vince for playing "stax" or "mean cards" ? If they invite a budget commander creator like Mitch, will people cry on why they arent playing X cards.. ? etc... I think I will love this season because it will showcase how the commander community is growing and that there is a lot of contents for different people. People should just be open minded about them wanting to do something different and accepting that this season is gonna be quite different for the worse or for the better Sure you can dislike the gamestyle that gonna happen on these different weeks, but if you dont like the content creators they invite, just skip the week . I loved this game quite a lot . I know you wont repeat that experience, but thanks for showcasing that this isnt all about fast combo. From a fan of both casual and cEDH that would love to see toxic people in both communities just stop being so negative. Be positive :)

[@RyanMclain]

sure... but after being a huge fan from the beginning, every ep, every season for 8 seasons its no biggie honesty. that wont hurt commander clash any, its fine and nothing new in the least. commander clash, each season after the first, has drawn hate for the change, what's new, what's different, what isnt just like it was before even if the same person hated it last season. never once since Jake left...tom,Seth/richard gone,jen,Vince,crim...does not matter; if its changed its hated (tbh tho, I would have to hate too if tomer was missing -but I likely would cope- but c'mon its his baby after all and our main tomer dose of too) it will draw hate until there is something new to hate (and then we get the bonus: they hate that this season(which they hated) is over too, yey!)

[@munsulight721]

@@RyanMclain Im 100% with you on that, I just find it bad to see so many hateful comments below :( and yeah they did get a lot of hate well before these kind of episodes. I remember few last episodes of last season when Tomer player Siona and similar decks , some people in the comments were saying : There he goes again. Combo again. There he goes again having better decks even on budget, etc. Just let them have their fun :( It is nice to see someone that is not butthurt when they try something new :)

[@RyanMclain]

@@munsulight721 oh 100% right. I definitely agree in principal. the best possible is if it did go that way. ... but that is a big if, and a big if that will not happen. people suck. Magic players more than most. and I know whereof I speak: im a magic playing person. so if something is good, and people are shitty n not enjoying it for what it is and how it could be then ill say to hell with everyone and and not waste energy trying to make seen what is deliberately obscured. ill enjoy what is enjoyable without distraction and to boot get to feel superior (which tbh I likely would either way, even if it unwarranted, whatever the case. ya know business as usual- BC remember: i suck. you might not be worse than i, but im better than you! bam Unassailable lol basically- if ya can't be the solution, the problem isnt yours. I have enough of my own, people aren't queuing to fix mine... aka fuck it

[@thuggishcone1392]

Same wincon different gameplan is one of my favourite things about Commander.

[@AhranMaoDante]

If card draw is all that matters, then would you accept a Tempt with Reflections, targeting a Parcelbeast mutated over Edric?

[@jewpcabra666]

listening to tomer die at 1:33:00 because you told him you drew it off the mystic was the best part of the video hands down

[@MrDevastator96]

Hi, I'm here to mention the missing hand cam. That is all. Good day

[@bigwig8657]

Tomer doing the good deed and showing how vamp is a bad tutor and demonic is so so much better.

[@SilverAlex92]

Seth, im heartbroken, paying the rhystic lost you the game. Another treasure to silence before the counterspell would have changed the outcome

[@boogie798]

This episode was better than the professor's episode and i found a new channel to watch

[@PalPlays]

The Professor made a terrible first impression on MtGGoldfish. I unsubscribed from him after that video. He was unprofessional and immature.

[@boogie798]

@@PalPlays once he got some success he became a more public whiner/complainer over non important stuff like it was important

[@PalPlays]

@@boogie798 and now it has become a corrosive habit.

[@boogie798]

@@PalPlays some say toxic

[@GunbladeKnight]

I just want to point out, the green free spell is NOT just combat damage, but all damage.

[@eatmoretidepods2499]

Love the collab

[@jeffreyhafner9214]

I like how you guys are on top of saying you missed showcasing a starting hand but can you please tell me why you F6 again?

[@PalPlays]

Where's Tom when you need him?

[@joshuaritter9747]

I’m missing having a person for a whole season. Are we going to be getting ikoria/ commander 20 soon

[@PalPlays]

These were great guests though...

[@mostlyholy6301]

Tomer tutoring for a tutor so he can tutor for another tutor, classic big brain plays.

[@richardadams429]

Cameron sounds like what Crim's gonna sound like after puberty..

[@CodenameJD]

Countering Rhystic Study... if you're using Force of Will and Force of Negation, you should be using Negation... it saves you a life and it exiles the offending card.

[@nicholasrolo886]

Hey Fishbowl Fam, I need some help choosing a new mono colour edh deck! Choices are..... White: Nahiri, the Lithomancer Blue: Thassa, Deep-Dwelling Black: Vilis, broker of blood Red: Drakuseth, maw of flames Green: Freyalise, Llanowars fury Keep in mind that my budget is around $200 and below. My playgroup is pretty casual, with a couple of spiky decks (8.5 tails, GE kefnet)

[@PalPlays]

Can I weigh in on this?

[@nicholasrolo886]

@@PalPlays sure

[@PalPlays]

@@nicholasrolo886 I think that Thassa is the clear winner of that list. She is going to be generating card advantage without doing anything too broken providing you don't build your deck that way. Might I recommend Etali, Primal Storm for red? Drakuseth often ends up just being a big ole beater, which can get old once you play a bunch of games with him. Every game with Etali will be different, as you are beating down while casting your opponents' cards to pull ahead.

[@rustybrown4665]

so you were talking about Ashiok, Dream Render why couldnt a urza deck run it

[@NMS127]

Even though you can cast it with only blue mana, its color ID is blue and black.

[@natemcdivitt6087]

How can he play dovins veto without any white in the commander identitiy

[@zachariahmcgovern5465]

me and my friends that live out of state have been playing over Skype for a couple years, if you angle the cameras right and don't gain control of to many of their permanents than it is practically the same

10:52 This is why cedh is awesome; in a casual game, that remora would have gone around the table at least twice

[@CL32582]

I think you mean, "this is why cEDH is terrible; it encourages people to tryhard"

[@simpleb645]

Please more of this!

[@RumpledNutskin]

Seth could have won there through Cameron's combo. He could have let Cameron mill him out, then in his own upkeep, cast silence to make sure his spells resolve, then angel's Grace to not lose due to drawing from an empty library, then cast thassa's oracle to win. I understand they didn't want to make Cameron go through all of the clicks, but that is a line that Seth could have taken, and at least explained to say that he was not dead

[@jlawsl]

Competitive commander just seems like,"Everyone play the same deck". Something like a Carnage Tyrant would wreck those decks for the simple fact that none of the decks were made to do anything but counter/bounce and combo. I wasn't really a fan of the decks because they all had the same answers and the same spells. The decks are designed to win and prevent combos so much that there is almost nothing to threaten large creatures or planeswalkers. A bird token almost got one of them that shaved almost 30 life for drawing too much off of a Sylvan Library.

[@Kestral287]

There's no such thing as drawing too much off Sylvan Library! In honesty though, yes that's true and it's a point that was discussed. cEDH is kind of like Legacy is that you can jam a lot of nonsense into your decks and find weird ways to generate cards and value, but there are also a lot of boxes that you absolutely have to tick. In a format that powerful you just have to play cards of a certain power threshold to keep up. There's probably a couple actions the rules committee could take to fix the most egregious problems of the format and help diversify it, and they wouldn't affect the more casual decks in the least. They took one good step in that direction already with the Flash ban so... we'll see how things go in the future. That said, it is probably worth noting that a Carnage Tyrant would be completely irrelevant against cEDH decks more often than it would matter. Putting aside that it is, legitimately, a turn four to five format most of the time and CarnieT is a six drop, it's also just... very slow. Even if Tomer had jammed a Tyrant on turn five or six, it probably wouldn't have given him the game. Keep in mind that for a good chunk of the game there was an absolutely massive construct floating around and its relevance was pretty limited to killing planeswalkers. The biggest way large creatures are threatened is just "win before they have time to matter".

[@bluntWeapon99]

I agree. The game itself was really boring, also i will probably never play cEDH (mostly because i'm not rich, also for the "dumbness" of the format).

[@ikrena4701]

A 6 mana card that does nothing the turn it comes down and then continues to not win the game for several turns after you play it would do nothing but ensure you have no responses when another player tries to combo off

[@jameslaux2970]

Seth should have sat through the combo. With both Angel’s Grace and Thassa’s Oracle in hand he could have cast the Grace on his upkeep with split second and then cast Oracle to win...

[@Kristjan0209]

I'm surprised he didn't notion thief the library for all those cards

[@bigwig8657]

@budgetcommander pretty sure doomsday should be way easier to do now with lurrus.

[@Jonathan-qk5ed]

?

[@RyanMclain]

hmm

[@hugodiazroa]

Nop

[@weak0216]

It's really nice seeing seth and tomer antagonize each other more in the game now that andrew or crim are no longer regulars.

[@charlieburzynski603]

When he killed them all out at the end couldn't Seth have angels graced and then cast thassa's oracle

[@PrisOwner16]

Seth, didn't have white mana anymore.

[@MemoryLaneWizard]

yeah, not really a fan of cEDH - but alas, good guests!

[@PalPlays]

You have to admit, this was a nice back-and-forth game.

[@Shoogo1337]

I really enjoyed this episode, it’s always a blast seeing the crew play CEHD decks, and watching Seth or tomer try to do the smart thug but stick to their roots!

[@swiftcubone1199]

Was there a way to blow up Seths artifacts? Because I believe he could have won if not...he had angels grace and I believe he had the mana to cast the grace and then on his main cast the oracle to win.

[@Kestral287]

Chain of Vapors was still in deck, as was Time Spiral to shuffle back Rift and Blast Zone. Time Spiral + Narset also solves that problem and is something that, played perfectly, the Urza player definitely does at some point - there are a couple theoretical three- or -four card combinations that could beat him in upkeep (and Silence/Grace/Oracle is certainly one) but basically zero one-card interactions, and he had every counterspell left in his deck to fight with if they drew anything that was useful immediately.

[@michaelsander2878]

I absolutely loved this. I hope you do more cEDH commander clash. During the Ashiok conversation i thought about Vince (PK) and his stance on hybrid mana and how much more awesome Urza would be if it could run Ashiok. I love that this game went so long, as it does show off how these t1/t2 formats (EDH, Legacy, Vintage) are only thought of as Turn 1 or Turn 2 formats, but are balanced in such a way that many of these formats go on for as many (or more) turns as standard games. cEDH is fun to watch.

[@faceoctopus4571]

I think there was sometimes there was an echo. It was annoying.

[@PalPlays]

I barely noticed.

[@peterklein3354]

Tomer and cEDH sounds like corona and woodstock

[@cinco_de_la_tarde]

For me part of the issue with cEDH and why it gets misconceptions among lots of players is that it's cost for entry is REALLY high and budget replacements (especially on things like hate pieces and interaction like Force of Will) aren't very good. In addition, it's a high skill ceiling format and when you are trying to learn, you can often lose games where you don't know how or why you lost which makes it harder to get better. Additionally, IMO the "everyone can win out of nowhere" can both be fun and extremely frustrating to play a bunch of. I agree with the sentiment in this video that casual EDH is better for just hanging out and unwinding and all those things combined is why I think a lot of people choose not to play cEDH. Glad they banned Flash and I'm not a fan of Thassa's Oracle as a card (Lab man was annoying but at least you could use spot removal on it. There is no reason Thassa's Oracle should win the game with its trigger) My group plays a restricted budget EDH league and we've also had problems with cedh play patterns (especially prior to Flash ban) and it did not make for fun games when we usually try to play 100-200 games over the course of our 8 week league. I really wish there was a more diligent effort to give a better way to divide up the power of commander decks as I have not really enjoyed a game of commander with random commander players in a long time because social contract be damned, someone is often on a different power level to the rest of the table. That said, if you find a small local group that can come together to agree on structure and power level, commander is a blast.

[@evankouba3211]

at about 21 minutes, power move by tomer

[@zurran00]

aven mindsensor lost everyone the game, wasting mana , just to show spite

[@luke53285]

YOU'RE MISSING A HAND CAM!!!!

[@MrMarclax]

7:38

[@dankurach5340]

Reading is hard

[@luke53285]

@@dankurach5340 whoosh

[@WushuTaz]

Enjoyed your last cEDH video and really enjoyed this one! Great idea inviting some cEDH content creators. It was hilarious watching Tomer and Seth go at each other just out of spite. You don't see that in cEDH games often since they typically go for the most "optimal" play but it really made this extra entertaining to watch.

[@sparklesandrainbows5514]

I love how the moral of the story is that you should never pay for Mystic Remora or Rhystic Study, because paying the mana will cost you the game.

[@denzellwright305]

Tomer didnt use this opportunity to play edric woah!!!!

[@warninja288]

Sweet vid guys!

[@binksee]

How about instead of banning rhystic study you speculate on it until it costs more than $100 and then it can't be played ;)

[@PalPlays]

Of course...interesting maneuver...

[@eatmoretidepods2499]

Sweet!

[@gustavosolano4615]

I come to watch seth torture tomer in any given way lol.

[@Someone-lg6di]

Red free spell with command the dread horde

[@PalPlays]

Either give them nothing or kill them with it. I like the way you think!

[@esrohm6460]

I think it's a pointless argument to complain about every deck in cedh being a lab man deck (or now thassas oracle). It's like complaining that most decks in standard win through reducing the live to zero. As long as its not just this one deck that gets the win con that is so much better than anything else to the point you hav to play it to win a average amount of times ist just like it's a game rule that you win though this way. Also you can basically make anything work if you know how to deck build. I got a 9-10 tatyova deck that tries to win by playing infinite land with tatyova on board and because its land based you can play a lot of stax cards that tax decks for playing artifacts, creatures or non basics which is like all the decks and its also fun to just play 100 lands turn 4 and win with a way that is so absurd that people really need to think what even helps agains this.

[@PalPlays]

I have a Queen Marchesa hardcore stax list that has been putting up good results in my meta. People don't seem to get that people play Oracle because it is a tight combo package, not because it is not interactive. I'm glad to see that at least someone uses their brain around here lol.

[@LaserfaceJones]

[[Carnivorous Death Parrot]]

[@matiasrochaix2234]

Tomer is such a postive guy, but no there is no variance in cEDH, this game is an example of how the card pool is so restrictive. And no it was not considered fun to have access to flash, that was the point of the ban, which of course isnt enough to balance cEDH since the goals of the format are opposite to the casual spirit of EDH.

[@thesp1r1tdragon55]

Great episode, I'd love to see another cedh match now in the post flash meta

[@weldernick3750]

The comment about weird decks that people don’t understand how they win in cedh reminds me of my Rasputin dream weaver kinda cedh with the main win being willing Balista combos with Heliod and my commander making infinite combos

[@dragonmast3r21]

DIMIR SIGNET IN MONO BLUE COMMANDER ? THAT NOT ALLOWED

[@bluntWeapon99]

it was a copy artifact.

[@PalPlays]

You literally cannot break the commander rules in MTGO.

[@commanderpower99]

There is a hand cam missing

[@RyanMclain]

...by chance do you mean Cameron's, that's shown, but who sounds very similar to (excepting multi-laughter per min.) crim who doesn't happen to be playing?

[@endermeap6488]

This really proves how insanely busted and hard to interact with Thassa’s oracle is that it’s one of the primary win cons in every deck.

[@PalPlays]

Eh? It's more that it is just a tight package that is easy to fit in. Decks are four or more colors (with exceptions like Urza) so most of them can run it. Everyone runs countermagic, so your argument really just falls apart. It's also sorcery-speed. The power of Flash was that it was difficult to interact with BECAUSE it was instant-speed. No one wanted to combo off with Hulk for fear of someone else doing it in response. To reiterate, Oracle isn't busted. It is simply a tight package in two of the best colors in EDH. Why not run it? Does that make it unhealthy? No. You can interact with it with Rule of Law effects and taxes. You just got to gear your deck away from beating Flash and towards beating Oracle and counters.

[@endermeap6488]

I don’t mean just in EDH, I mean the fact that when anyone in almost any format reaches for the easiest, hardest to interact with win con in a combo deck, it’s almost always Thassa’s oracle.

[@PalPlays]

​@@endermeap6488 Modern's Ad Nauseam already ran Laboratory Maniac and existed before Oracle. It does not count. Pioneer's Lotus Breach runs it as its competition is terrible. Jace costs four mana because he is costed to stay on the battlefield for a while. Pioneer also has Inverter of Truth, which was its go-to first. Currently people are playing around with that list, trying to find out if it benefits from companions, so it has fallen down the meta a bit. It hasn't touched Legacy It hasn't touched Vintage It is worth noting that it has not warped the metagame of any format it is in. Commander already ran Sultai plus splash, as Sultai base is simply the best combination in the format. There are other combo decks in every format that Oracle sees play, so your statement does not quite hold up.

[@PalPlays]

@@endermeap6488 Except I literally just displayed that it isn't.

[@JonathanHecht]

Dylan: (casts Vial smasher) "lets cast that boi" People who read Tarkir's story: 🤦‍♂️

[@m-hcv]

It's a goblin, who gives a fuck lol

[@m-hcv]

@@CL32582 I wan't intending to come over toxic. The simple fact is that goblins, aside from their race, are all little hairy, ugly devils, and virtually indistinguishable in terms of gender. As a broader point, though, I don't know why we care at all what the gender of fantasy creatures is. For the same sake goblins would reproduce asexually, or simply have no gender in the first place (I know that isn't the case in mtg lore, but it perfectly could be - it's literally made up). I don't see what comes from forcing heterosexual norms/stereotypes onto fantasy creatures anyway. So when someone comments about the fact that someone misgendered a *goblin*, I really don't think I, or anyone, should care, and I really don't feel like I'm the backwards one here.

[@drakeconsumerofsoulsandche4303]

@@m-hcv you don't understand, goblin gender issues have plagued their race for years, and honestly deserves more attention. I can't believe what an ignoramus you are for neglecting them in this manner. Jerk.

[@matejkotz6059]

@@CL32582 He is not being toxic. He actually has a point, plus it was a funny response. I also don't know why should you care if the goblin has penis or vagina.