COMPARING MLB SLIDERS: Gyro vs. Sweeping

Sliders are one of the hardest pitches to nail down when you first begin diving into pitch design. To help alleviate some of the confusion around this pitch we are going to dive deep into two different types of sliders, gyro and sweeping. We will cover spin efficiency, gyro degree and a ton more!
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Relevant Videos:
What is Gyrospin? - • EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO...
Spin Efficiency - • EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO...
Slider Pitch Design - • SLIDER PITCH DESIGN: C...
More Info:
Ottavino Baseball Savant - baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant...
Castillo Baseball Savant - baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant...
Castillo Video:
MVPFLF - • Luis Castillo's Pitchi...
Palmer on Pittsburgh - • Video
Ottavino Video:
Yankee Blue - • New York Yankees Highl...
Pitch Release GIF’s (Pitching Ninja):
Fastball - www.dropbox.com/sh/qw77db1loc...
Slider - www.dropbox.com/sh/qw77db1loc...
Other Videos:
Pitch Design Tutorial - • IN-DEPTH PITCH DESIGN ...
Pitching Technology - • PLAYER DEVELOPMENT TOO...
Intro to Tunneling - • PITCH TUNNELING: Why H...
Spin Axis Explained - • SPIN AXIS EXPLAINED: A...
Why do Pitches Move? - • PITCH MOVEMENT EXPLAIN...
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[@tekimpo]

Great video I love this stuff

[@bombersbeat1470]

I though this was a great explanation of an advanced topic. I learned about this in the Driveline pitch design course and this video made it much easier to comprehend. As a Yankee fan, the Ottavino slider seemed to be less effective in certain situations given the lack of vertical break. Ottavino lives on vertical movement on all pitches so maybe an arsenal of pitches that have great vertical and horizontal movement could create an elite pitcher.

[@SimpleSabermetrics]

Appreciate the kind words as always! I haven’t personally taken the Driveline course myself (yet), but glad you saw some value in this version of that topic! Ottavino’s slider is one of the best sweeping sliders in the game. IMO the lack of induced VB makes it great. Thanks for the comment!

[@ytar33]

Great video comparisons. Love them. Use of video of MLB pitchers helps visualize and makes it easier to understand. Thanks

[@SimpleSabermetrics]

Good to see you back in the comments, Yitz! Been having a lot of fun making videos on the pros. Glad you enjoyed!

[@YohanceCapili]

Haha yeah I don't really understand it much I just look at the MLB clips shown here

[@YohanceCapili]

Here's some mlb clips shown in the video : 3:16 Release of 4 Seam Fastball 3:28 Release of Gyro Slider 4:21 Luis Castillo Gyro Slide 4:43 Adamottavino Sweeping slider 5:23 Luis Castillo and Adamottavino ( difference of sweeper and gyro )

[@IvanYamilLopez]

Hi, thanks for the amazing video as always. Which of these do you think tunnels best with a 4S Fastball?

[@SimpleSabermetrics]

Great question! For a true 4S FB I recommend tunneling a gyro slider typically. But it’s going to depend on a case by case basis. If an athlete has a high spin rate, throwing up in the zone is important - so most likely their best secondary pitch would be a 12-6 CB paired with their 4S. To split the difference a gyro slider would be better when referring to tunneling. But that’s only one specific situation. If an athlete has a good Sweeping Slider that has been working for them, you may be interested in swapping the 4S with a 2S to better match the movement profiles together. Kind of a convoluted answer - but hope this helps!

[@gabrielrodriguez3463]

I really want to understand the movement of the gyro slider. I’ve done the research and it says that the Vertical movement is only -4 but to the human eye looks like is breaking about a feet. Do we take our Vertical movement on a fastball and subtract? Let’s say theres a pitcher with a Vertical movement of 10 on his FB but only has -2 on his Gyro slider did the ball dropped 12 inches or is this not the correct way to mature this pitch?

[@SimpleSabermetrics]

Great question, Gabriel! This is something that is very tough to wrap your mind around. When we talk about Vertical and Horizontal movement, 99% of the time we’re talking about spin induced movement. The Gyro slider is different, because the way the pitch is spinning does not directly affect the movement of the pitch. To my understanding, nobody has quantified how much these pitches actually move - but it definitely moves gloveside much more than a fastball does even though our movement may be (0,0). The over simplified explanation I’ve received is the axis slowly tilts down as the pitch gets nearer to the plate, once it does that ups the spin efficiency and the pitch takes off late. At this point it’s nearly impossible to measure that, but at least that might give a simple answer to a sneakily complex physics question. Thanks for the comment!

[@choiyatlam2552]

@@SimpleSabermetrics to my understanding, knuckleball would have close to 0,0 in terms of spin induced movement. But because of the orientations of the seams that created turbulence, the ball moves in all sorts of funny ways. Am I right?

[@redsballer1904]

@@choiyatlam2552 idk if you’re right but it sounds like it makes sense

[@samuelwhitman8705]

I see them everywhere I go I’m going crazy

[@aldrichsalentes2113]

#gyroball

[@johnnywholestaff4909]

Second

[@ryanfay4684]

First

[@KingsRevenge]

Jus wasted 5 mins