The Forgotten Tomb Kings, Broken Race - Total War: Warhammer 3 Immortal Empires

[@Costin_Gaming]

Or how CA needs to make some updates for races from game 2 to 3.

[@CapybaraConnoisseur89]

NOw that you said that, I have the same feeling so many Races feel outdated and play terribly in WH 3 than 2. Tomb Kings are okay but yeah they didn't get ANY love at all, Khatep has terrible Climates majority is in Orange like Frozen which is what Naggaorth is mostly, TK have got slow building, replenishment and growth and Orange makes it worse. Next Vampire Coast, awful they play really badly I did eveything I could as Noctilus, tried Donut conquest, tried sailing around got chased by AI everywhere, tried settling next to Mazdamundi economy is garbage Yuan Bao beats the crap out of you, turn 50 I got one and half stack, three regions and income is barely 2000 gold, even tho I have tech and reduced upkeep, I still can barely afford units. Vampire Counts insanely powerful, good economy however they feel dated and aside from OP old mechanics they feel like WH1 Race. Almost all Vanilla WH1, WH2 Lords are just mehh like Tyrion, Malekith, Mazdamundi, Kroq Gar, Vlad, Bretonnia as whole, The Empire and Dawi are getting DLC so no mention to them.

[@goblin8670]

I don't know if its just me being still new to Warhammer but I constantly feel like wh3 is built where enemies that should be at war with each other always priotize attacking me first, like greenskins are the worst culprit of this, as Settra ill be attacked by Wurzag way before they try to fight the dwarfs.

[@MarkoFTW]

AntiPlayer Bias is real and very irritating in WH3

[@djn6962]

@@MarkoFTWin all warhammers to be real, but yeah, as bad as it ever was haha

[@CacneaMain]

Something which in my experience greatly contributes to being "focused" by the AI is if the player themselves is in a (or multiple) wars. I think the AI tends to attack you more the less wars you are already in (which is kinda odd and backwards, but I that's what it feels like). Idk if that is applicable to your situation, but maybe try to always be in atleast one war which you feel comfortable winning to avoid being attacked so much.

[@Saltytoxico]

The lands of the tomb kings should be a nightmare for other races to enter. It should be so full of dead well sanded bone creatures that they just don’t bother.

[@armed_but_blind2768]

It does feel like all the AI makes their way towards the player. Just let me turtle up in peace!

[@marcpaulus6291]

I hate when people say Tomb Kings are fine. Thats not the point. As a Tomb King player i also want some cool new units, lords and especially new campaign mechanics now that other races also are on the hunt for the Book. Khalida need better Archer, at leats Tomb Guard Archers, an please just get the Screaming skull catapullt out of the Charriot Tree. I dont want to build tier 3 to get to my Catapults when i dont want to use those clumsy charriots. Some races have had multiple dlc and flc till now and the TK none! Its really a shame.

[@ThatsOk83]

Every time I come back to warhammer I always want to start with Tomb Kings

[@Xrono666]

Which faction/race has great early game (first 30-50 turns)? I've been binging Costin's videos lately but I honestly fail to understand what does he expect from WH3 early game? Early Game is supposed to be challenging, no matter the difficulty. What's the point being able to spam armies early game? Steam rolling from the turn 5? What's the point being able to rush research/make a lot of cash/obtain unique racial resource in abundance very early?

[@Xrono666]

For Tomb Kings specifically, Would I want a new content drop for them? Sure! Are they in the dire need of it? Hell no. Do they have issues? Yes, like EVERY OTHER RACE. Calling it a broken race is such a stretch and click bait. I also don't get the notion: "Ooo, Old World mod offers slower, more strategical and thoughtful campaign experience. It is so much better than IE" but when Tomb Kings are a slower race when compared to others -that's a BIG ISSUE MAN. WTF? How does that co-exist in 1 head?

[@Xrono666]

Also, I don't get his gripe with Beastmen's dread. It is one the best system game has. Of course everything (excluding items) costs dread! Armies don't have gold/favour costs whastsoever. It is literally a different take on Tomb Kings unit caps. You have to MANAGE THE RESOURCE. Do I make another trash army or do I get another gorebull and a few stronger units? Do I increase the level of my heardstones or do I invest in heroes more? Canopic Jars income can be increased with Landmarks too..Which are in abundance in the lands of the dead anyway. Like, may be he shouldn't play certain races or something? While certain points I agree on, the majority is just could be summarized " I don't like the race playstyle."

[@bobandjima]

Bro this content is 99% negative, I didn’t come back to WH3 for so long seing this type of content, just draining your mind with is shit is shit is shit, then last night y said fked I’m just going to play… had the time of my life man, freaking love WH3 there’s no other game like it, we always talking negatives and never positives, yo now how hard is to program a game like this with the infinite amount of data, it’s massive is fun each race have its own thing

[@travwinner2]

All tomb king lords and heros can produce jars per turn leveling them up, so I'm not sure what he meant by no other way to get jars lol. I always have more jars than I know what to do with.

[@Costin_Gaming]

At like turn 60+ sure. But at that point it doesn't matter. It matters early on.

[@spiffygonzales5160]

They're okay. Me and another guy had a multi campaign and we basically stalemated each other with me as Ghorst forming a massive group of alliances and him as Setra basically just yeeting his enemies left and right.

[@attackmuffin8141]

The whole attacking people simply because I want a book really bothers me. The early game issues are more forgivable considering the end game but how the books work is such a huge over sight that could easily be fixed with diplomatic solutions.

[@oldomen3788]

Tomb Kings is my favorite faction in multiplayer and campaign. I would of course like some slight tweaks. Maybe a nagash faction.

[@jjoohhnn6065]

We got Arkan but he is kinda half assed, I wish he had a unique collection of spells sespifaclly related to see thy and nagash

[@oldomen3788]

@@jjoohhnn6065maybe when Nagash is added. We'll get that

[@thehonestaspy102]

It's rare that I don't fully agree with you Costin but this is going to be one of those times. I completely agree Khatep needs to be moved, and somewhere in the dark lands for example might be better. I also do think they could do with a few more units/generic characters such as a generic caster lord and a melee bone giant. That being said I actually like the initial struggle and challenge of a Tomb King Campaign and the genuine sense of achievement you feel when you start steamrolling the world as the true lords of undeath. Settra is genuinely one of my favorite campaigns to play and feels thematic and fun and it's also very achievable as I recently managed to complete a VH campaign with the Long Victory and CHORFS Endgame scenario. Regardless that's just my take, and thank you for keeping these videos coming.

[@AtillaBleicher]

Yepp, I went through all of this recently. Units caps were ok for me, bc I like a challenge, but the whole campaign was about gathering jars in an obsessed manner so I could field armies and heroes. Then I had to go on attacking neutrals and friendly races, because war was the easiest and safest way to get the books. Donut was full Saphery when I arrived, which again, was a beelining for 5-10 turns to the White Tower, then a needless destruction of the elven race so I coud get... another book. I find it the saddest that I like to roleplay/make up random goals, but this campaign seems the same for everyone. What I got too bored to find out was the Jar cap, because allegedly, the Jar cost of a new army goes above the max limit of jars which is 5k, so you can only field a total of 15 armies after all bonuses reached and army slots unlocked. I had 15 then quit, gathering another 5k wouldve been tedious.

[@kentpoos]

The journey home is fun. I play almost exclusively khatep these days. He can level heroes and build cities cheaply, comboing with third dynasty king, you can have high tier cities, fast without breaking the bank. Necrotect at level 20 10s of turns faster than other legendary lords. And the sheer variety of races you fight/ally on your way home nets new campaign outcomes everytime. Mort cult is cheaper on khatep as well. The most important mechanic for TK...

[@Faravid829]

I think increasing the army cap, or massively buff their garrisons so you don’t have to babysit them would be great. For example have them start with an extra army, improve the research rate, or make it so any recruitment building also add those units to the garrison. A rework of the books would be awesome, being able to gain to them through alliance would be great, they could also make their bonus better, like what if each book also increase your army capacity by 1 that would easily offset the annoyance of have to go to war with an ally.

[@Noctani]

My TK fixes: Setra: Take out Alliance buff < -10% construction cost. GHK: Capacity for Liche Priest +4 Priest, Rite Cost -50%, Mortuary Crafting Cost -50%, - 25% for advanced military buildings, +50% duration to restless dead, & 20%+ longer rites. Khalida: Add 50+% allegiance points produced, no limit on allied recruitment. Arkhan: Add 20%+ Spell mastery for liche priests/Arkhan. Tomb Kings: For every building hitting max level increase canopic jars by +1 per turn. Reduce Canopic Jar base cost for science/cult by 20%. Increase Tier 3 settlement buildings by 50 gold per turn. Start GKH with a Heirotitan. I know CA got away from it purposefully so, but like Imrik it's a great boom to a very difficult start, surround by largely inhospitable land and many enemies.

[@AkaRystik]

I think the biggest issue tomb kings have in 3 is the bottleneck on lords. Having ~15 turns before you can usually get your second army is insane and its almost impossible to just hold your ground let alone actually push in on enemies, of which you have no shortage of. Even though you can eventually get to the point where you can make more faster it just takes far too long when the first 30 turns are basically what decides a game and tomb kings likely wont have their third army by then while fighting orcs with waaagh stacks or vampires where every lord has their groupie army of zombies following them around.

[@jjoohhnn6065]

This is why Arkan better

[@mindmonsterxx]

i love tomb kings, settra is the only campaign i could play for the 100th time and still have fun !

[@saschaganser9671]

The issue is the supply lines. It was a really good mechanic to make you switch to less but more qualitative armies and it was nicely designed for example with VC, who could stack chaff for free. Now it`s that factions that can field multiple large armies are unstopable. Skaven, Greenskins, Chaos, Vampires, basically everyone that`s not relying on regular recruitment. Besides the vampire coast, which is just BS because their early game units are broken crap. As HE you field mass armies of spears and bows and you can go all campaign. DE use Darkshards and corsairs. And so on. Of course development and building is gone, and early game is so much more important than late game, that factions that shine there are good.

[@CacneaMain]

Maybe one small fix could be removing unit caps from some more basic units (similar to the chaos dwarfs). I'm thinking additionally the Archers and basic horsemen could lose their caps (the latter are utter crap anyways).

[@artemshvets2068]

Unlimited archers might transform Khalida to a S tier monster from very campaign start.

[@CacneaMain]

@@artemshvets2068 Considering how downright insultingly bad her campaign start is (esp if you are going in blind) I feel this would be deserved xD Also in a perfect Fantasy world I additionally suggest nerfing the regular archers a little (in return taking away the caps) and introducing a new more Elite archer unit at Tier 3 or 4, so Khalida especially can get some more endgame (she is supposed to be the ranged lord afterall).

[@artemshvets2068]

​@@CacneaMain But She already is. Ushebti with Great Bows combined with Khalida's "Blessing of Asaph" aura and Poison might easily win every battle. The same effect works for every missile units, you just need to keep as much missile units as possible inside Khalida's aura.

[@CacneaMain]

@@artemshvets2068 Yeah that's true. I just wish she gave more general buffs outside the aura to missile units (apart from the Skeleton Archers which she buffs like crazy). Having her buff bone giants would be hilarious xD

[@artemshvets2068]

​@@CacneaMainSure, it would be nice to have a Tomb Kings hero similar to a Dwarven/Skaven engineer.

[@Deerygccawwetthjbgde]

Realm of souls mechanics is another “bonus points for losing” thing they fixed for Nurgle. So I think they will fix Tomb Kings army ability as well?

[@magnussthered]

That be cool if they some better rites. Maybe one can mega boost their research rate and growth.. I really like how mobile they are.. The boosts they get w/ the building, necrotecs and w/e else they be moving. My fav race I want to see them get some love!

[@Noctani]

I agree that canopic jar rewards needs to be changed, as does some of it's hero, army, and crafting costs. I disagree that the tomb kings have a particular issue with steam rolling or early battles. There is a Warhammer 3 AI problem no doubt. I think Grand Hierophant Khatep needs an update to better handle his issue, but I'd also say it's nice to see CA having factions with different starting strengths. Arkhan in A tier, Setra B, Khalida C, and Khatep D. I don't want the different tomb kings to feel the same in difficulty. I don't find the army limitations of the Tomb Kings to be an issue. Tomb kings have turns of strength if played correctly, and invariably turns of weakness. I have no issue with your change to a alliance giving a book of Nagash, but I don't have an issue having to take it through War. It's not like a faction would you give a book of Nagash unless they were forced to. I would argue a military alliance is far easier than taking it by force especially those far away from the start position. The diplomacy system needs to be far most robost, vast, and I'd argue only a permanent alliance would grant a Book of Nagash.

[@aaronjenkins2135]

For some reason on the old World mod the tomb kings dominate? I can’t figure out why Arkhan got 20 settlement on turn 40

[@Costin_Gaming]

Arkhan is a powerhouse because he breaks the rules. He has both an extra starting army and unique units that he can get a lot of early on. In IE what holds his AI back is he inevitably ends up in a war with everyone else, but it should be telling he very rarely loses that war.

[@tobydorman3998]

I disagree, they're in a great place (excluding Khatep, his position is shit indeed). I really wish they could confederate each other, though

[@artemshvets2068]

Khatep is only have a bad campaign design in terms of finishing it, it's have a still nice start position overall. But Settra have a problems with surviving from very start.

[@TheRxNick]

Settra campaign had been my favorite campaign for years, but it could use some improvements

[@artemshvets2068]

I don't completely agree with you. In my opinion, the Tomb Kings are quite nice overall. Only Settra have significant issues in his campaign ( most of all because of starting position), and that's mainly limited to the first 30 turns. And It's only Settra that needs to be fixed. Other Tomb King lords don't feel the same way due to their better starting positions and armies and much more better battle bonuses (poison, extra army, etc).

[@hootermang]

Tomb kings have always been my favorite in campaign.

[@LandofMert76]

without mods, I don't know how you'd even play them in the Old World.

[@Mrfrenzy1]

While you are obviously free to have your opinion I don't understand why people want to "win" a single a player game. I'm playing Arkhan right now and I'm having a lot of fun planning ahead and rebalancing and specializing my armies as I progress. I've sent an army north to help Aranessa against the dwarves and its fun. I think of tww like playing with toys. I want fun stories to unfold during my campaigns. It's not about seeing how fast you can become op and then letting the campaign die

[@Krethak]

About Thorek being able to get his artefacts through diplomacy. That is theoretically correct, but practically wrong ^^' I just recently watched a Twitch stream of somebody playing Thorek's campaign and he showed life on stream via allying with Kroq-Gar that he did NOT get the artifact from there ^^' So as usual, buggy mess from CA :x And while I can understand the approach that the TK and Beastmen need to have limited army accessability because all of their units are free of charge it still works better for the Beastmen because unlike the TK, they do not need to hold territory. One big Herdstone is enough for them, every else is inconsequential. I only ever played Khalida, but already with her it's a NIGHTMARE to try and chase down those stupid Silver Order Vampires and them looting/sacking even your starting town if you do not follow a very specific marching order >.< I honestly can't even imagine how Settra, who is in the middle of nowhere, surrounded by at least 3 hostile faction is supposed to hold on to his territory with just one army for at least the first 10 to 14 turns (depending on how much battles you fight you 'might' have enough jars before hitting turn 15 to buy a new army...) While I "can" understand why TK can't confederate each other (it would blow up the Army stacks a single faction is allowed to have) they could implement other options to do so like just pulling things out of my ass here: 1: You need to pay Gold and Jars that unlocking new armies would cost equivalent to the amount of armies the other faction has. 1b: You need to have as many army slots free as the other faction has armies. 2: Upon confederation the player is asked to disband armies until they're back to their army cap. And even considering that Dynasty Kings could potentially be doubled I don't think it would be THAT much of an issue, as those Dynasty Kings aren't particularly OP. Might be a bit of a hassle, but certainly possible.

[@ChristianEphraimson]

So if you're still playing w2 it's a good dlc?

[@Costin_Gaming]

It works a lot better in the context of 2 yes.

[@artemshvets2068]

It works well for WH 3 too, you need only survive first 30 turns and you'll be unstoppable.

[@lukedemler4421]

I dont agree with your opinions of coast or tomb kings, tomb king campaigns steamroll, albeit i play on vh/vh, repanse and smarbrand are a joke vs tomb kings... skarbrand gets merked by skeleton archers as he charges in, i just finished anothwr settra campaign turn 107, repanse and skarbrand out within 30 ish turns, consolidate the province, 25k income and 8 armies by turn 107 is above the economy and army count i have on any other race at that point, people really just dont understand tomb king playstyles honestly.

[@lukedemler4421]

I do agree with khateps placement as well

[@lukedemler4421]

Also you argue like your opinions are objective rather than subjective implying that nobody can argue your points and that you're the only player that understands the game? This game is extremely varied in playstyles even within the same factions you cannot imply that everyone doesn't understand that it's a different game rather that you seem incapable of acknowledging when you're wrong about something.

[@jackdan3208]

Most op faction in game.

[@godoforder1828]

Khatep SUCKS. There is not a single landmark for tomb kings in his vincity, his bonuses are nearly useless. Overall, one of the least fun experiences possible in the entire game

[@riccardo393e7]

They need a bit of glow up

[@slaviksaylor7526]

This was my favorite DLC in WH2 but in the third game, I just cannot play them. Books of Nagash, a really hard to get. I really liked the idea of receiving them if you are allied to a faction. Army limitation is also no good, they should fix that. Unfortunately, I doubt that we will receive an update for Tomb Kings in the near future. There are many problems and there are few people who can solve them, at least it seems so to me. I like Tomb Kings in SFO. Or should say, I like this mod is better because you can influence and customize your opponents, which gives you an advantage when playing as Tomb Kings. I really want to have such options in the vanilla.

[@vladokalaba2640]

CA build only DLCs because money and with every DLC there are more bugs and problems and they build bad DLCs! So for CA, fixing bugs and races is not good because they must give that for low price or free so they do not want to do that. P.S. CA can fix every faction in next two or three FLCs and they give one DLC lord for those two or three FLCsand they would be in +

[@Rocksteadyz1]

Dude, stop constantly moaning .