Kill Protocol Remastered | Hammer & Bolter Breakdown | Episode 7

[@Briselance]

10:48 "Flesh fails and rots" "Aye, and metal corrodes and breaks too." "... confirmed."

[@IAMTHESWORDtheLAMBHASDIED]

gawd I loved it tho. lol. straight up illogical actions taken by those whom worship logic... (sorry I still can't write...well. long covid, almost 2 years... lol have to try tho amiright?)

[@dalel3608]

That little "dun-da" the gamma pistol made when reloading successfully made me laugh.

[@nullnotnull]

"Us Orks neva lose a battle. If we win, we win. If we die, we die fightin', so it don't count. If we runs fer it we don't lose neither, 'coz we can come back fer annuva go, see?"

[@MrGustavevil]

This particular story is an excellent distillation of what's fantastic about 40k: human moments in an inhuman universe, in this case exhibited by a character who actively seeks to excise their own humanity.

[@Counterpoints]

All the horrors of the galaxy against the indominitable human spirit. Its why i'll always come back to it even if it goes a little woke.

[@anthony-zq8yz]

« woke » you are so weak

[@Counterpoints]

@@anthony-zq8yz what’s lame is having 70% female representation in a field that is 90% men and a consumer audience of 90% men. It’s cringe

[@Iyforthis]

@@Counterpointsaw you lost my support writing up those weird ahh statistics. Have some shame buddy.

[@Counterpoints]

@@Iyforthis cringe

[@ryanhampson673]

(Computer blue screen of death) Me: Spirt of the machine heed my will!!!

[@Shattered3582]

from now on I am going to call AI the machine spirit 😂

[@Ave_Christus_Rex3777]

Other Sci-fi: If we want to fix the spaceship we must use the QUANTUM computer to calculate how much energy the FLUX ENGINE and PARTICLE ACCELERATOR will need to stabilize the HYPERSPACE DRIVE to reach LIGHT SPEED and across the TIME VORTEX. 40k: If we want to fix the Void Ship we must please the Machine Spirit with sacred oil. Gosh I love Warhammer.

[@Counterpoints]

Me too.

[@claudiaborges8406]

Either praise the omnissiah or learn to cook without the ancient relic of radiation-induced cooking on a spinning plate

[@rolandedricksantos]

"We must give the sacred machine spirit an oil margarita or we will get ACCESS. DENIED."

[@Mugthraka]

WHen you think about it "does kinda" make sens. Have you ever been like "Come on don't do this to me baby" when your car has a hard time starting up in winter? Or when you computer lags or act up "Oh not now please" and you're begging for it to work properly? Inadvertely you where "appealing to the Machine Spirit" Now apply such behavior on top of thousands of years of Isolation and put a sprinkle of Religious Zealotery and fanatisme, cause well irionicly it was the only way to make sure that Knowledge would survive the Ages, by being revered as Gospel and transmitted by Oral Traditions and Ceremonies, cause your Tech was basicly gone to shit after the Huge AI vs Humans War. And you get the AdMech.

[@skipperg4436]

That's what I liked about Andre Norton books: she never went into nuances of how technology works, but rather described limitations / use cases instead. On the other hand, Heinlein introduced me to a lot of concepts of orbital mechanics lol.

[@kensaiix]

1:50 distance in feet... i'm very sure the mechaniucum uses the metric system, despite being an imperium

[@alwombat7]

Freedom fractions forever baby.

[@DCPTF2]

one thing to note which you left out was that at the end the Kastelan actually replies to what the Cybernetica Datasmith is saying which to me implies that it's possible that the Kastelan wasn't just repaired but restored to it's DAOT status and could have possibly made it's onboard AI work at the level of a DAOT AI

[@RolandEdrickSantos-jz7yp]

What does DAOT mean

[@DCPTF2]

@@RolandEdrickSantos-jz7yp Dark age of Technology

[@RolandEdrickSantos-jz7yp]

@@DCPTF2 ohhhhhhhh I see thanks

[@mykelengieza7057]

ALGORITHM Love how The Imperium is still using emperical measurements 1:38

[@guillercuastico]

If they were using metric they wouldnt be on the defense

[@ERIK-457]

And i expected it so much to be meters, about to say "woah that's a long distance, it'll take a while to get there" but then heard feet and went "nah i can run that in a couple minutes then"

[@tyedrichill8097]

Imperial??

[@bruticus1496]

Well it is The Imperium of mankind, not the parliament of man

[@jamesperkins2552]

sometimes you beat the orks. sometimes the orks kill you. sometimes your own forces abandon you on the surface of a ruined world still infested with orks. These are the fates of the astro militarum. Sometimes.....just sometimes....you get a sexy robot girlfriend in the bargain.....but usually she's a fuggly mechanicus tentacle monster instead. Believe it or not this is actually one of the better lives you can live within the emperium.

[@JUST_SOME_SHY_GUY]

Game is game I guess

[@cid76]

@@JUST_SOME_SHY_GUY Ciaphas cain (hero of the imperium) managed to bang on Perlia during an Ork invasion a hot adeptus mechanicus having only a mechandrite at the lower back of spinal cord (ahd how he discovered, well....privilege of commisar plus redacted comment from jeaolous Ordo Xenos blonde Inquisitor)

[@JUST_SOME_SHY_GUY]

@@cid76 Nah Cain really is that guy 💀

[@valentusdolor3742]

7:14: Orcs do actually have a brain?? No way 😅

[@justinisp9361]

I love how this episode show the hypocrisy of the mecanicum. They believe themselves superior to other humans due to the fact that they are all emotional with weak, dying flesh unlike them, and yet every one of the techpriest is, at their heart, human with fears, ambitions, and emotions aplenty. They talk of how the flesh is weak and yet they still need the flesh to connect all their various machine parts, and all techpriest still have some form of flesh left on their person be it an arm, leg or in Magos belisarius cawl's case his upper jaw and face. Also, to quote Arthur C. Clarke, “Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic” so there ya go for the explanation for super tech that was displayed.

[@simpleman3898]

I like how you said it 👍. You still human dudes

[@oldeskul]

We need the Xbox achievement sound effect and a little pop-up that reads, "The Data Smith has achieved the Power of Friendship".

[@misterjei]

1:44 You know that you're in the grimdark, when even the scientific members of the Adeptus Mechanicus still refer to the ancient Albion (British) Imperial measurements, for reference rather than to the Metric measurement. Or has the Metric system been deemed heretical?

[@foodeater1236]

The use of the Metric system ushered in the Dark Age of Technology, thus it was banned by the Emperor. He then introduced a "new" system of measurement called the Imperial system, which was to be used by all the people in the Imperium.

[@justinanderson9126]

I'm so glad your channel didn't get taken down.

[@saintsinner6195]

I mean.....she could have just taken his arm and left him alive.

[@zombiebonegaming]

It was the emperor's mercy.

[@randomrealistictone2231]

He was dying. She had to kill him.

[@EldenBeastTheWatchfullEye]

Timesaving

[@mizu7662]

He wasn't going to survive the ork infested wasteland with only one arm given how bad a shape he was already in. If she was going to take the arm then giving him a quick and painless death was the closest thing to a moral act she could perform since she was sentencing him to death.

[@DeadMeat991]

And then Imperials wonder why they get so many traitors.

[@TenebrousFilms]

Bad Moonz are my favourite orks because yellow goes best with green... but also, da teef.

[@missingno11]

Normal sci-fi: We use BS science to go FTL Warhammer: We travel through literal hell

[@samueldacruz989]

8:05 I mean you no IMMEDIATE harm 😂

[@amdintelxsniperx]

also one part you missed is when the robot asked why she killed the guardsmen CO . it wasnt on board with his death

[@chrislatam5423]

The robot is def a IA

[@AndrewsArachnids]

Fuck yeah Kill Protocol is awesome. One of the best shorts. Those freaking bots the mechanicum uses are beastly!

[@Counterpoints]

Well since GW took down the old one we need to get all the old ones redone. Small victories to review this content again.

[@AndrewsArachnids]

@Counterpoints wait GW took down the 1st iterations of these?! What the actual fuck I thought you guys had come to a magnanimous agreement for you?! Assholes. With this and their delusional SMM I would say GW stocks are circling the drain.

[@くウルソピ牙]

Yeah this episode made me a adeptus mechanicus lover

[@IAMTHESWORDtheLAMBHASDIED]

Haha, 100,000% the same, I love it. Flesh is weak machines are eternal' lol, god I'm so happy this all is getting popular again!!!!! (played in the 90's)

[@くウルソピ牙]

@@IAMTHESWORDtheLAMBHASDIED nice

[@kazzackthuul]

She could have saved the machine and the device is she stayed and helped fight. but ninjas priorities loot to the detriment of the party.

[@simpleman3898]

How could she have save the machine?

[@kazmark_gl8652]

​@@simpleman3898 she had a fairly effective sidearm and melee weapon. although she probably had limited ammo, she could have bashed an ork or two with her stick.

[@Izzyduude]

Why is a tech priest running and breathing heavy? Didn’t think they had lungs seeing flesh is considered a weakness.

[@Counterpoints]

You'd think but she hasn't gotten there yet i guess.

[@tessa63627]

Next upgrade for certain

[@THELYONSDENPODCAST2023]

Mmm yess the new Lung Lungs 3.5s

[@samueldacruz989]

15:50 you can’t tell me she’s not a fan of Pokémon and Yu-Gi-Oh!

[@PCFixer]

THIS WAS AMAZING! I adore the mechanicus so much!

[@VultureXV]

I like how you can legitimately follow a sort of "coding language" when it comes to the AdMech's canticle.

[@redcell2852]

Why didn't they save the archio tech for the emperor's failing throne? LoL

[@geonoto8865]

Also why only one tech priest to recover an stc?

[@lukasbjornendermann9944]

​@@geonoto8865 any why sacrifice it to repair that one machine guardian?

[@geonoto8865]

@@lukasbjornendermann9944 The tech priest explains why he used it at 20:18 which is very hypocritical in my opinion but that's 40k for you :)

[@BaeBunni]

@@geonoto8865 Yea is the point, the priest isn't a machine. Afraid, alone and lonely without the Kastelan. The priest won't admit that it's human side is why it needed to save the robot and will simply use "logic" to why it needed it's protector and likely the closest thing they have to a friend.

[@redv1i]

Pistol malfunction in year 40,000 is , next level

[@SilvaDreams]

Malfunction? No. Out of ammo, yes.

[@michaelkrueger8554]

The scene before the orcs come up is sooo epic i loved it

[@TheEyez187]

TBF to the Tech-Priest, Guardsman, you were warned shit was going to go down, just because you didn't pick up on it! "I wish you no immediate harm".... The cost of success and survival in this mission will cost an arm and a leg. My Castellan's leg.... and your bionic arm! Though in my head, if he'd asked for the arm, the guard wanting to live and leave would gladly have given it up, and keeping him alive, even with limited combat capabilities would help in the archeo-tech search; the guard would not complain to his one means of leaving the planet Though I'd rather deal with this tech-priest, than the one in the audio-short "Abomination" (Vox in the Void). The Servitorization process - (how does it go): Hell No, to the No, No, No!!

[@kingofwhispers]

A thousand of that machine can take out a thousand space Marines for sure

[@varun009]

This is one of the stories I love most. A sort of self-contained thriller and an introspective into what it means to be "human" in the 41st millennium. There are many stories in 40k where things are uncovered that could turn the tide in favor of the imperium. Obviously for narrative reasons they can't have these things come to pass, but it's those stakes that make the story so much more compelling. Here you have a datasmith who is supposed to not only despise abominable intelligence and pursue knowledge with righteous dispassion, an endeavor that is necessarily self-less sacrifices a game-changer to save her "friend". Her humanity held her back in the end and yet none of us could blame her. Life gets lonely. Who do we have?

[@jacobrobison7088]

It bowed to her the last time she gave it a command . It also questioned her logic in using the device.

[@Ayvengo21]

When your opponent in dawn of war invested heavily in t1 units and you have t3. Mechanicus is my favorite fraction in W40K sooner or latter we may came to situation when there is a technology so advanced that no one really know how does it work but will have some sort of incomplete manual and users that barely understand how does it works in detail so they just follow some rituals to make it work as required. We already have some stuff like that in ITER, LHC and many nuclear stations.

[@xisigma]

Why would the archeotech be one time use only, especially an auto-regeneration one? The castellan contains the tech and is functionally immortal now. She just needs to study and replicate it now. She made the right call, but I think titans already use time reversal regeneration.

[@juddbtch2394]

0:01 where is this clip from??

[@Counterpoints]

Astartes 2 trailer

[@juddbtch2394]

@@Counterpoints thank you man!

[@gamingduck09-lm8vk]

I know 2 maybe 3 chapters of space marines that would drop everything if admech told them to

[@christmasham4312]

This was my favourite episode

[@Jcarroz]

Thanks for another great episode 👍

[@forestjohnson7474]

15:56 my 2nd favorite scene

[@rcarmashelt8528]

Great work as always

[@Dusto-qz1hz]

That was pretty stupid. So she sacrificed him to get it, gets it and sacrifices the codex to get him back… if he meant that much shouldn’t you have turned back the first time??

[@mikoajkeler1042]

it's strange that admech does not see the power of reproduction, the body rots but is reborn more perfect and thanks to this process called evolution it can survive and adapt and what is important, it only needs water, carbon dioxide and sunlight to perform this task, can there be something more perfect

[@simpleman3898]

Maybe they don't believe in that

[@bruticus1496]

Flesh is weak, metal is strong. Flesh decays, metal endures. You can’t replace bad flesh with new flesh, metal parts can be replaced. Metal can crush what flesh can not. Praise the Omnissia

[@NathanRichards-e2x]

its the SUS bots from amongus now as space marines

[@Reroll_ones]

What video is the opening clip of the space marine punching the orks from?

[@Counterpoints]

Astartes 2 trailer

[@Pay-No-Mind]

40K, where even the nerdiest of nerds can not only throw down HARD, but are often in possession of the coolest, oldest, and deadliest tech imagininable and held in high regard. while holding considerable power, and sway in politics (Some say too much?? 🤔) For all the ire and ribs (in hushed tones of course) spoken about them (Which is laughable considering the absolutely intense improvement of abilities, resolution, range and acquity of their hearing, sight etc.) so they've heard absolutely every word, breath, stutter and chuckle you made, collated and catalogued it and added it's entry to their ever growing shitlist 😂

[@alexshank1414]

I’m new to Warhammer 40k, but am really allured and fascinated by it’s lore and theme. Question. Is the Mechanicus envious(if able to have that emotion anymore) of the Necrons, because of their complete non-biological form?

[@Counterpoints]

@@alexshank1414 yes but they view them as abominations because they don’t have souls

[@alexshank1414]

@@Counterpoints Interesting. Mechanicus are trying to remove not just the flesh in favor of metal, but also the soul(if there is one)?

[@alexshank1414]

@@Counterpoints Thanks for answering.

[@Counterpoints]

@@alexshank1414 in 40K, there’s definitely a soul. Psykers can get possessed through their souls. People can make pacts with dark gods for their souls. A few people make it scientific so they can keep being atheists but honestly it’s just cope at this point.

[@alexshank1414]

@@Counterpoints So, I need a even more detailed and layered history than I thought. Wow.

[@blackbearbuilds3104]

My struggle cause these are two of my favorite factions lol

[@tHeWasTeDYouTh]

episode 5, 6 and 7 are my favorite so far. I wish GW had actually paid for more frames. people are paying them to watch this but they cheaped out.

[@angryvaultguy]

You'd think considering how expensive it is to buy their little plastic men they would at least have the resources to produce better quality animation 😅

[@tHeWasTeDYouTh]

@@angryvaultguy agree

[@simonredcsgo]

That mouse and Keyboard has seen better days

[@carmagadon11]

The Techpriest voice sounds like Sylvanas Windrunner, from World Of Warcraft.

[@simpleman3898]

The cool thing is this is a sci fi story so the mechanism is actually unique

[@DeadMeat991]

I like how the Imperials treat their own like expendable trash and then act surprised when they go traitor.

[@christophermiller1595]

Yo man. Where is that video from in the beginning. ? You always use it and I have no idea where it's from...

[@Counterpoints]

Astartes 2 trailer

[@kamijouteitoku9126]

Woah...wasn't really gonna build a Mechanicus army since I don't like to follow the meta bandwagon, but this might be the cog that changes my mind.

[@maximuswedgie5149]

Where can I watch this? Looks awesome

[@Counterpoints]

Warhammer TV

[@robkey4487]

Hold on. There is a trust issue within the Mechanicus? Anyone know the lore to explain that? I thought that would be “illogical”

[@arcdecibel9986]

The Mechanicus does not share knowledge freely because it is still human and is aware of the threat other humans might pose. You need only look at Chaos to see that. Only the most proven and sanctified members are permitted to exchange knowledge of devices that could destroy stars. Even then, we are kept separate so no conglomeration of Magi can accidentally bring another hell to this universe, as out ancestors did with the Men of Iron, or as Omnid Torquora did when he inadvertently spread the Warp into Realspace. Instead, we are divided into Forge Worlds and sects, always competing against each other in a race for the ultimate knowledge of the Omnissiah, but NEVER unified. We agree on basic tenets of the faith, certainly, we all serve mankind, but we are not to be trusted, even with our own knowledge. That way, the prosperity of good knowledge, successful devices, and even new inventions is tested, whilst limiting the harm of the bad, or those who stray form the Omnissiahs path.

[@shafiqali7051]

​@@arcdecibel9986Quite logical tech priest.. although through some herertical picture sent by some unknown resources there was a picture of many people try to grab the shiny silvery ancient archeotech that also included a callidus !!!!??? Can you imagine that tech priest......a shape fitting assassin that doesn't have any wanting to something with the precious archeotech but also want to grab it...... what thing the callidus temple want with it....ohh on the other side me with some strange energy xenos entity with silver and red color choose me to be his host is on the run cause I'm practically " not mocking" inquisition with their big exterminatus button while pissing off the assasinorum temples because I'm calling them an off brand chaos cult..... Let's just say I'm literally not mocking the callidus calling their temple just a slaneeshi pleasure cult with their own shape shifting ability just the branch of daemonette ability of seduction or literally saying that eversor temples should just joined the blood god cult......or maybe painting the vindicare exodus rifle with pink colour .....oppss..😹😹😹😝😝😝😝

[@squirrel6687]

Red blood and pink brains on Orks that are refined fungus?

[@Counterpoints]

It'd be sweet if they had clorophyl blood

[@clavididk1236]

This puts red eye to shame 😆

[@DharricRolyat]

Which version of Windows was the Gamma pistol loading sound from?

[@diegocamilopenaramirez6101]

The voice of tech priest sound familiar, they use the same actress?

[@dgondavies1472]

have they stopped adding episode i thought they would make more but there hasn't been anything new in months. what happened to all they had planned some arnt even finished.

[@gonran4661]

grind relic but no upgrade?

[@saintblackwater7213]

What exactly did GW say was new policy as it relates to you?

[@Counterpoints]

Take down all the old reactions that don’t cut out/don’t cut out enough of the episode.

[@saintblackwater7213]

@Counterpoints Understood, appreciate you taking time out to respond.

[@armandobaia6804]

That intro, is there an entire show for it?

[@Counterpoints]

Astartes 2 trailer

[@armandobaia6804]

@@Counterpoints thank you

[@zakaryloreto6526]

If it weren’t for the plot armor the skittari would have been dead, way to many orks.

[@beastofchaospureanarchie]

Do the adeptus mechanicus like the necrons?🤔

[@randomrealistictone2231]

No. Necrons don't have souls.

[@zakaryloreto6526]

Very small but it bothers me, she has 5 normal fingers but her robot hand has 4. Just why?

[@Tampenismall]

Why the reload sound so happy?

[@foodeater1236]

Ikr? It sounded like something from an upbeat TV commercial

[@happykal11]

Is the tech priest Explorator Talin Sherax?

[@exterminans]

I can't believe she wasted the archaeotech to revive that dumb robot

[@professorbland]

where is that intro from

[@Counterpoints]

Astartes 2 trailer

[@robkey4487]

Love this episode

[@elitemook4234]

It's funny to think that device may have restored the bots AI.

[@mervzillan7070]

Curious to hear your thoughts on the new custodes changes.

[@SoonGone]

Wait, they remastered it?

[@Counterpoints]

No bro, they asked me to take down the old reaction and make it more transformative so we’re redoing it in a better way.

[@SoonGone]

@@Counterpoints Ahh ok 👍

[@sonicx059]

Thank you for the video

[@Counterpoints]

You bet!

[@frogger2011ify]

Oh man they should have saved that for the golden throne

[@memorobles7857]

> Tech priest > "feet" "miles"

[@EduardoAgustinVega]

Not sure you still look here, but a link or clarification on how a machine is allowed to excist is not I fully grasp, is this still 40k or 38 or..??

[@Counterpoints]

These are sanctioned automata who have been severely dumbed down and cannot operate without a cybernetic datasmith to guide them. Otherwise they would be prohibited. This is 40k

[@Nekros-t9e]

My favorite thing about hammer and bolter is how each episode is so cheaply made that it has 5 frames of animation per minute

[@zacleblanc2519]

Hey Connor, do you have an opinion on the retcon from GW? Maybe a little video?

[@Counterpoints]

I dislike it, but not enough to do anything about it. We’ll have a livestream debate next week.

[@zacleblanc2519]

@@Counterpoints Roger that

[@Ctag304]

Sorry to hear about that

[@karliemorris7318]

Comment For The Comment Gods, thanks Conor

[@Counterpoints]

07

[@juzliano]

Admec using feet as MU I'm telling the inquisition

[@atom_bomb_77]

…she literally just wasted tech that could make all technology eternally better… she literally could have called a ship, studied the tech, and made an immortal robot army… I don’t know much about 40k, but I feel she’d probably die if she returned to Mars with that story

[@mikayelalikhanyan1587]

some nerve caring for her robot over the guy she cared

[@conor1406]

Comment for the comment gods

[@Repossessedurass]

Likes for the likes throne!

[@Zennsunni]

Why would you have to take videos down ? I don’t understand

[@Counterpoints]

Because games workshop copyright claimed them for being insufficiently transformative.

[@Zennsunni]

@@Counterpoints wouldnt the appropriate response to these videos be gratitude, the whole reason I am interested in the game now is because of your videos, what harm did they say you are doing, this is nonsense

[@Counterpoints]

@@Zennsunni it’s stealing money from people who would have signed up for their poorly advertised pay walled service.

[@kerchooosteoporosis1363]

Update for future videos; is your presence necessary on screen? You go full screen to talk. Why not full screen clip, full screen recap.

[@Counterpoints]

@@kerchooosteoporosis1363 copyright

[@DreadFox_official]

What if I use 40K lore for programming my ai agents? If I build skynet, I'm not sorry.

[@johncostello6006]

16:10 why is she running out of breath? Lol She has no nose, no mouth, and I'm sure she's had her lungs replaced with something more mechanical and "efficient".

[@randomrealistictone2231]

I'm guessing she hasn't done that yet

[@johncostello6006]

@@randomrealistictone2231 if she has no mouth or nose... It's most likely already done lol

[@azarot_542]

two strong female characters, crushing mushroom orcs. although considering that half of the adeptus mechanicus are no longer people, and the orcs are men only in appearance, then the damage to cesgender is critical only by 0.1%. the commissar could have distracted the orcs with his fire in the other direction, if he quietly threw it. it is strange that the mechanicus did not send Tit and three of his men as usual for a rare artifact, but limited themselves to a female combat magus, apparently they learned the wrong mistakes or learned the mistakes in a perverted way.

[@LetHimRead]

Get outside and socialise with real people.

[@azarot_542]

@@LetHimRead similarly, the world is not as you see it. Are you sure you are a psychologist to give any recommendations to strangers? my social circle will be very unpleasant to you if you are a softie, and I did not choose it. you also have to be careful with plots in books and films, people watch them without choosing, but something remains in their memory. you will have to forgive me, but I have to tell it like it is, the truth. it happened that way, I can practically do nothing about it. so you better think about whether I am right and whether I can't see beyond my nose, unlike many.

[@LetHimRead]

@@azarot_542 You say some partial truths in there but you come across as a schizophrenic in the middle of an episode - I am not trying to be condescending but your comments seriously come acrosss like that.

[@azarot_542]

@@LetHimRead who so sirious? serious stuff and warhammer? god forbid, emperor save

[@BladeSnake-ob8nh]

Artificial intelligence isn't evil.. just humanity

[@MeinloserfilterM]

this telemetry is deemed tainted by the inquisition.

[@mrpilkington9710]

I always thought it was just boring grimdark that she killed the guardsman instead of just taking the arm

[@PeterPan-cy7oy]

ther are orks custodes also........ iam done with GW i buy 3d printerstocks

[@johndoeyedoe]

Cog girl should have replaced her lungs.

[@HotZetiGer]

that machine is an idiot - must help the bigger machine first 17:10 - then get the relic