Crab Claw Sail on a Catamaran?

[@375dash]

Very interesting. Always enjoy watching your experiments.

[@ExtraordinaryHorizons]

Love this 😍 Were on rebuilding our 65' power catamaran and were so excited about what awaits us after were done!

[@ZarzyckiRoSSY]

Great summary, really informative. I am using two CC sails on my 4m long dinghy in various combination 😊😊😊 Sail safe and hello from Poland 🇵🇱

[@adrianbaker9804]

Very interesting thanks

[@RommelCart]

Hey man..after reading g an article in cruising helmsman about hanns kkaars warram,back in 98...I messed about with claw rigs for some years..started off with cedar 1m trimaran....I regularly did 4 plus knots,,,next had a 25ft outrigger called Pleasure,,did get 11 knots out of that with really crap claw sail on it...ended up putting Clawsail on Vayu(38 ft Skip Johnson trimaran)sailed from Auckland to Russell...had to gybe it...I met Klaar,,interesting character,,,his sails whistled when you were sailing...big curves in the open leach is important for the vortex development ...fullness nearer the tack is important as well...I always wondered what an inflatable claws would be like,,,anyways,nice video..cheers Chris

[@dominictarrsailing]

wow that sounds amazing! actually someone was telling me about someone who had a crab claw rigged trimaran in the bay of islands, just the other day! With bamboo spars? what did you do to preserve the bamboo I am looking for tips in that regard. What was your sail area on the big tri?

[@brucedrake8645]

Very interesting, thanks for the info and glad to see you got your hat back.

[@pescaprimitiva2176]

Velas Latina muito velocidade

[@svprimitiva]

Love it!!

[@scruffy2629]

Very cool, im currently deep diving on wharrams and ontong java, this was really interesting ! Theres an abandoned wharram where i live, but i think its too far gone for rescuing ,maybe, one day......😊

[@dominictarrsailing]

Interesting! it's a lot of work to restore a wharram... I certainly wouldn't recommend it as a first boat project! if you are new to sailing I think it's much better to start with a boat that's ready to sail... so that you just have to learn to sail not figure out how to set up a boat also. If you a drawn to catamarans, you can get a beach cat ready to go with a trailer even for ~$1000 nzd. And building a dinghy or small cat or outrigger would be a better way to learn boat building than restoring something big. At least would give you a bit of an idea what it's meant to be like and whether you can chew what you just bit off!

[@scruffy2629]

@@dominictarrsailing yeah, I don't think it's for me, it's pretty big, and we're not in a place we can pour money and time into a bottomless pit. It's just a shame to see it unfinished,someone's dream laying there. We're toying with the idea of selling up in a few years and sailing up to Japan, but there's a lot to learn and do before then, :)

[@zackariasthepirate]

Those beach cats look so much better with the crab claw sail than the Bermuda rig. Cool comparison.. Ive always thought that the Viking ships sailed much the same as Jibe only not tacking. Also the boom is fully clear of the crew, always a win. I have a new steering oar setup im working on that Im really excited about. I need to test it out. I like being trying to micro adjust steering and rig to maximize the ability for the boat to hold a course longer.

[@dominictarrsailing]

haha thanks, yes square riggers would definitely easier to gybe than tack! like in this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eKmmfHqJlMd_gas it is possible to tack but conditions have to be just right. the Dhow is another one that gybes rather than tacks. A dipping lug sail is another interesting case, it seems there are several different ways to get the yard to the other side, I'm not sure about tacking or gybing though, from the footage that I've seen. Looks like it would be slightly easier if you gybed I think with traditional craft, it's probably gonna be gybing more often than not

[@zackariasthepirate]

@@dominictarrsailing Funny.. Ive actually been on that boat. My home town is San Diego CA. I live far from there now, but visit occasionally. I believe it is one of the last few remaining, original Cape Horn Sailing cargo vessels.

[@dominictarrsailing]

@@zackariasthepirate wow amazing! yeah it looks like one of those!

[@milanmarinkovic3016]

As of number of ways to rig a crab sail on the cat - I saw one more - there is video from Fiji somewhere on the YT. They built a fleet of Gary Dierking's Waapa's, few years ago - some are in catamaran configuration, with a crab sail rigged and boat manouvered in exactly the same way as proa. I think their traditional boats were probably ndrua type proa, so it was quite natural for them to sail catamaran in the same way. I was also intrigued by Hans Klaar's sail on the Ontong Java II. That rig is common on Haiti. I think that main advantage is probably, that low quality spars could be used. Mast doesn't have to be very straight and it is quite short for the size of the rig. Spars also don't have to be straight and can be made from shorter pieces, connected by tree nails and lashings. Sail can be reefed in conventional manner. Quite important on the boat of that size.

[@dominictarrsailing]

Oh yes, but if it has equal size hulls and sails both ways it's a proa in my books, just a proa with a big ama. You are correct, ndura are from fiji. Thanks for the tip about Haiti! I just did a google image search for it and see lots of rigs that look just like the one on Ontong Java! www.passagemaker.com/technical/history-of-haitian-sloop With a gaff rig you can also scandalize the main, drop the peak haliyard and basically instantly cut the sail area in half. (although on the haitain proportions the hight to the gaff is so short that you'd loose nearly all the sail area! However I have seen footage of ontong java where they seem to be doing that (I think they were doing an atlantic crossing)

[@milanmarinkovic3016]

@@dominictarrsailing " .. video Ontong Java scandaliseing the main....." Yes, I saw it to. Hans made a number of crab(ish) sails over the years, with different proportions. Dating to at least Tehini days. Older ones were conventional crab, with "gaff" and "boom" connected. No gaff throat to grip the mast. Later he moved in the direction of gaff, with a sail luff between the gaff and boom like Haitian boats

[@dominictarrsailing]

@@milanmarinkovic3016 yes my understanding is that he started with a tehini sailed it some place then rerigged it as a stub mast ketch. Then the haitain sloop rig came with ontong java... oh yes I found a photo from 2009 of ontong java without the gaff jaws, but with quite a tall stub mast and a jib www.latitude38.com/lectronic/more-stone-age-than-manu-rere/

[@milanmarinkovic3016]

@@dominictarrsailing Nice find! Pity that Hans and Glenn don't have more presence on the Net. I find them both, (and you too, and Kiana and... ), thoroughly inspirational. In these days of much to complicated and expensive production boats. Showing other ways.

[@BalkanShipyards]

Gybe ho my friend.... Nice vid! I had a PVC pipe cat with a sprit rig, I too could only gybe, my Proa can only Shunt, therefore I see no problem, gybing is more reliable on multies anyway... Keep Gybing, Balkan Shipyards

[@dominictarrsailing]

Thanks Rael!

[@bryrensexton4618]

🤘!!!awesome

[@crapisnice]

Looks like a wind funnel sail to catch more wind with short masts, chevalier has some good drawings of oceania proas design

[@dominictarrsailing]

I don't recognise that name, how do I find these drawings?

[@garymalm]

One hand for the sheet, one for the tiller and one for the hat. I wonder how the aesthetically unpleasing sloop rig would have fared?

[@crapisnice]

Use hemp if you can, also woven palm leaves can make rigid sails

[@dominictarrsailing]

Haha I think i'll stick to modern materials for now. I met the weavers who are working on this project: teraa.co.nz/ it's an incredible amount of work to make a traditional sail (similar effort to building the hulls) and it's gonna be heavier and weaker than a polytarp. In NZ we use harakeke www.doc.govt.nz/nature/native-plants/harakeke-flax although they are still using traditional woven sails in santa cruz www.vaka.org/post/tepuke-from-taumako-arrives-in-santa-cruz

[@cesarmuttio506]

This type of gibe is use in windsurfing too .

[@dominictarrsailing]

yes great point!

[@ChristianNally]

@5:09 bye bye hat.

[@ChristianNally]

@5:36 Hello again hat!

[@dominictarrsailing]

@@ChristianNally i didnt realize i had lost it until i saw it in the water!

[@crapisnice]

A claw sail could be made self-furling with simple mechanism and wouldn't break the mast

[@dominictarrsailing]

it looks like that jukung furling requires quite bendy spars and furls from the tack down... will require some experiments