Crafting Going Away is GOOD for the Game. These Are the Reasons Why. [Destiny 2: The Final Shape]

[@skintxisu]

If I had my way everything would be crafteable.

[@ItzTheDubGaming]

I Personally wouldn’t like that but I respect your opinion

[@raiou5010]

Unfortunately people love gambling

[@JinougaProductions]

@@raiou5010 Did you ever play D1, go for the non-craftable Seasonal weapons, or any other game on the market with a loot chase?

[@raiou5010]

@@JinougaProductions do you like not getting the weapon roll you want regardless of how much time you put in? I played ItL and never got a Cascade BnS Edge Transit and have well over a 100 clears of legend Onslaught. Crafting is better, they just need to remove enhanced perks from crafted rolls. If you think the community actually wants less determinism or would be better off without it, you're wrong. Just look at the way Dungeons are and Exotic class items, no one farms them at all due to getting what you want being completely up to RNG. No one likes wasting their time.

[@JinougaProductions]

@@raiou5010 Right, but stagnation is not what people want, either - both extremes are bad, and finding the balance is key; I brought up the examples I did because they got it right, it had growing pains, but it happened. D2 is NOT in the sweet spot ATM, which is why a return to more MEANINGFUL grind is needed (the grind that exists is checklist-y, including the crafted weapons from the Seasons). A Season to test new things isn't the death of anybody, and they even said in the TWID and Stream this week that there would be ways to focus on traits you want. If you wanna wait a season to craft, go for it.

[@RhoHerculis]

One point is right, it does affect replay-ability. Once I get the set I’ll tap out. No need to waste my time to get the 5x drops for all the weapons I was chasing every season. The monotony of “the chase” never kept me engaged in the game. The powerful aspects did. If I can expect everything will be a struggle with 90% watered down weapons, it’s 100% less engaging.

[@gibster9624]

Crafting doesn't eliminate any of those things. What did was the drop rate. Crafting was supposed to eliminate several main issues like bad RNG. Since getting a god roll would be more predictable, it gave a guaranteed way to get a god roll in case RNG was trash... spoilers RNG was still trash. The other issue that Bungie still hasn't addressed is the issue of nerfs and buffs to specific perks and no one having a god roll(or losing a god roll) or not enough players having one so farming for one later becomes a crap shoot just because they nerfed or buffed something. An example is lingering dread. Having an autoloading chill clip version is hard to get and in my small clan Im the only one who has one. Fortunately its not super duper vital but Ive had enough people say how strong it is and wished they had one but dont want to farm Gahlran anymore. The last thing crafting was supposed to fix was overbloated vaults because players just held on to 8 different versions of the same weapon. Crafting could have solved this issue, but... well... yeah it wasn't implemented well at all but it helped a good amount.

[@ItzTheDubGaming]

@@gibster9624 While I still hold the opinion that the way crafting is now does eliminate the things I mentioned, I really appreciate your comment. The reality is, crafting will probably stay in the game, so talking about ways we can improve that system is probably the best course of action. I don’t think crafting should have enhanceable perks. I agree that it is good for managing vault bloat. But also, I listed some ways I think the rng grind for rolls could be more forgiving and player friendly, which I think would be helpful in a world with or without crafting. Overall, yeah, thank you for your comment!

[@nathanroyster1324]

all of this. I do not want to have to go back to holding 3 or more of every weapon because I don't know if I'm going to get a better roll to drop or I need different rolls for pve vs pvp. God forbid you build craft. Sometimes I have crafted weapons with very specific perks for a very specific build. Frankly I could care less about grinding. I want the weapon so I can play the game the way I want. Being at the will of RNG for every weapon, with the size of some of these perk pools and limited vault space sounds like a pain in the ass. I don't get it. Why do gamers need their hands held. If you want to grind, by all means do so. Just because you unlock a pattern does not mean you have to go craft it.

[@ItzTheDubGaming]

@@nathanroyster1324 Hey thanks for your comment. I just want to respond to your last point, “Just because you unlock a pattern does not mean you have to craft it”. It is natural for people and gamers to take the easiest presented path, even if there is technically the option to not do so. It is up to the developers to properly make these systems and essentially make the decisions for players on what they’re meant to do. This is different than very skillful players wanting to solo a raid to challenge themselves.

[@nathanroyster1324]

@@ItzTheDubGaming lots of things are natural, that doesn't mean you have to do them. Sounds like an impulse control issue to me. I would also say that you should probably evaluate what you say you want and if that is true. If you want to grind but do the opposite did you actually want to grind? Probably not. Actions speak louder than words. If I say I want to lose weight but eat big macs everyday do I actually want to lose weight? Forcing people to grind content they no longer actually want to play to get a weapon they want is same same but different. Look at dual destiny. It's a grinders wet dream but A LOT of people hated it because rng in this game is horrendous. In what way is it different than soloing a raid? If you want the challenge you have the option. You also have the option of getting 5 buddies and making the raid substantially easier.

[@ItzTheDubGaming]

@@nathanroyster1324 Well when it comes to Dual Destiny, that really is extreme levels of ridiculous rng. With the way that exotic works, that would be the same as if 64 individual rng exotics could only be acquired from the same activity. No one would want to do that. But with pale heart drops, xur, and focusing soon, it won’t be too bad. And I still don’t mind sprinkling in some farming for class items every week. I’m not saying the grind should be extreme, just that it should be there. That’s why I advocated for buffing loot drops in all activities and other solutions, so that you get more chances at your desired roll. I will still believe that as long as a weapon is craftable, it is then deeply rooted in the weapons’ nature to be not as exciting as it could be if it wasn’t craftable. Even if I could just choose not to craft it.

[@Xwing11]

I enjoyed listening to your point of view and you present it very well. First I have to point out that I have been playing 3-6 days a week since last Christmas and I still only have about 60% of craftable weapons…craftable. So, I have felt plenty of grind for even the red boarder weapons. I personally do not get anything out of weapon grinding as far as entertainment. The fun of the game for me is putting together teams to compete in content and complete the missions. Often I have used weapons I like with low rated rolls because after 70-80 drops nothing considered a “god roll” materialized and I just made due. Crafting was more realistic. I could acquire a weapon visit a gunsmith and modify the weapon to fit my strengths and weaknesses. At this time in the game I spend about 2.5 hours a week, on average, just sorting through undesirable rolls on weapons in my vault. I really don’t need to spend any more time on cleaning out junk. On top of that, there are PVP rolls, PVE Rolls, Ad clear rolls, DPS Rolls, build rolls, etc. Not enough vault space to house them all. Crafting makes it so that I can adjust the weapon if I change my play style without 50 more runs of onslaught, battlegrounds, coil, etc. I never stopped playing those modes because I got everything I needed. I stoped playing them because I had run them so many times hunting the RNG that I burned out on them. The game tends to offer events for a short time with RNG promises and you run the modes back to back until you never want to see them again. Players will play NBA games and run back and forth across the court over and over and over with no rewards offered, no rng drops. It is because they like matching their skills against an opponent and varying their methods to achieve success. Grinding is a necessary requirement to develop skills and equipment to get the ball in the hoop. It is not the game.

[@VictarionO]

IMO they should have never made it possible to enhance crafted weapons. It should have been exclusive to random drops. ALL enhancements should also be actually good, not this +10 handling crap that some perks have. Imagine if normal BnS was 8 secs and enhanced was like 15. It would make getting the random roll worth it even if you have the crafted version.

[@ItzTheDubGaming]

@@VictarionO Preach

[@LittleCrowYT]

two issues I have are with enhanced perks and multi-perk weapons. I'm fine with sacrificing multiple perks in a column for enhanced perks, and vice versa. What I'm not fine with is getting a godroll on a weapon that is craftable, only to have to wait until I get all 5 red borders and waste resources to get another version of the weapon I already got. other than that, the game really does need to be more plentiful with loot. like the one ghost mod, either that should apply to any and all weekly activities, or give us multiple mods for different activities like raids & dungeons.

[@yazcona13]

Counter argument. Limited vault space and fomo. Fix. Bungie stops fomo money plans and give us more vault space

[@ItzTheDubGaming]

Here we go! Your voice matters just as much as mine, so let's hear your opinions in the comments! Let's all be respectful as always, and, have a good day!

[@nathanroyster1324]

Here's what I dont understand. Why are we taking away options? If someone wants to grind they can. Simply DON'T CRAFT THE WEAPON! lol I truly dont get it. Do we as gamers need our hands held so badly that we cannot stop ourselves? What about all the players that dont want their vaults full of 5 different versions of the same weapons because you need one for pve and another for pvp. What about people who buildcraft? I have to put my builds in the hands of RNG? That doesn't sound fun at all. Also, rng does not add replayability. Just because you are replaying something to get the perfect roll doesn't mean you're having fun. FUN creates replayability. People arent having fun because the content is too predictable. The seasonal model is exactly the same every season. Bungie stopped innovating. Craftable weapons are not the problem

[@crocodilehole]

Bungie played too fast and too loose with weapon crafting. I like weapon crafting, but I only ever use about 1/4 of the red border weapons.