Custom E-bike Build: Specialized Roll w/ CYC Photon Mid Drive overview. Top Speed and Hill Climbing

[@markkus1134]

John a great guy to do business with I bought my BBSHD setup from him still going strong almost 1000 trouble free miles !!!! I built a custom 29er

[@michelleevans9869]

Holy cow that build looks like a sleeper but that hill climb was crazy from a flat stop. Great build and review.

[@BakedAndAwakePodcast]

I see a notification from JNO, I press “play”. Don’t even matter what it is

[@hindesite]

I did a Photon conversion on a 148 Boost HT back in April, and I'm impressed. Chainline with 34T is perfect and no other system I know of can even fit that frame correctly.

[@jamesgibson3242]

I think Johnny likes The Roll because it rolls just fine.

[@traviseller3770]

Being one of the other guys at the shop were talking yesterday about how good the role would be as a platform to build a custom electric. We have sold the crap out of these bikes at my shop, and they are definitely a great form to build upon.

[@TheBigmore66]

I love it and I want one for my Giant. I also have a specialized Turbo S 2016. Pedal assist to 45 km which i love

[@rogermoody1]

I want to set up my 29” specialized rockhopper will have to spec it out for the proton ,big battery 38 or 42 lots of hills large display all ready have hydraulic brakes

[@Tony-v9c7s]

I have a 36v 350w bafang. It hits 28mph pas only. Im interested in making it also throttle.

[@dsp4392]

"You need a monitor for your desktop to work" *Headless computer has joined the chat*

[@glennr9669]

Johnny how about a to seven comparison? I heard they are good too.

[@3niknicholson]

Thanks for a great vid. You come across as a guy who knows his subject matter and knows how to say it. Subbed. You said fatter tyres are less efficient; I thought that too before I watched Jones and he says wider have less rolling resistance than narrower, when inflated to the same pressure. I google this and find other people agree although it kind of goes against intuition. Maybe it's because fat tyres on mtb's are run at low pressure?

[@84imreplica]

High Voltage video mentioned a problem with the non drive side axle bearing. Seems this could be a problem with the motor. Hopefully, CYC will have a quick fix for this problem.

[@C-A-F]

Awesome.

[@ddawg1956]

Awesome person to deal with ... worth considering.

[@bebeandjohnnotsonomadiclif5287]

Very nice! Thank you.

[@davidkeifert19]

love it, thanks

[@bujin5455]

Do you happen to have the CYC light kit available? Looks sold out on your site, but I'd prefer to buy it through you if possible.

[@bobkrueger194]

Can you do the photon on a Roll Low entry? That frame is kind of funky. Wasn't sure if the motor could fit in the brace space.

[@marcopolo-e7h]

If I had a bicycle that I liked I definitely would 'convert' it into a mid-drive electric. However, the bike that I have I don't like because it's too uncomfortable (it's a road/gravel with drop-down handlebars). Have been binge-watching your videos, and for someone who is just getting into the ebike scene, they have been hugely educational.

[@SofiaisSunshine]

Probably could swap the bars and possibly fork and make it a hybrid. Might be worth it if its a quality bike vs buying a new quality bike and converting it to mid drive

[@brittweir8844]

Jonny you're so funny, I'm only watching because of the cool shorts 😅😅😅

[@MumfordJim]

Nice build. I’m waiting on the ToSeven DM02. Do you think you will carry them?

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

Yes I will. They are on order 😀

[@zackl4551]

I am building an ebike. But i want to do a pedal delete. Got a 48v 1800watt Brushless motor. Running 11t on motor 44t on wheel. 26” wheel. Did torque calculation and it says 10.9 ft.lbs. i know a honda grom has 7.7ft.lbs. or do I need to install a dual strand idle sprocket to increase torque. I would like your thoughts. Please and thank you for your time.

[@MHH3180]

The Bluetooth is in the speed sensor. The larger display has a lot more easily accessible information.

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

Ya the ds103 is nicer, but the sw102 is no slouch 😀

[@retireditguy9493]

You have a great channel. I don’t see any trike conversions in your videos. Are you considering doing any?

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

I’ve done a few. Just not many requests 🤔 bring yours down so we can make it a feature!

[@JoLe1991]

i generally install a 10 speed transmission, because that's the least amount of gears you can get with a wide range (11-50t) with a shimano derailleur (SL-M4100 + RD-M5100). I use chinese 11-50t cassettes, no 50t available from shimano, but the chinese ones work just fine. 10s is still fairly cheap and robust

[@diver___]

I have this bike and would love to mimic the setup here. Would you be able to share the motor config needed for this same bike as requested in the form on the JNO website (BB size, crank arm length) ? You mention the build maybe being more "torquy" if we get a 34T chainring, but you seem happy with the 38T, I was wondering if after riding it for a few miles you would have a recommendation between the two? Thanks for the inspiration, looking forward to building this!

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

Links are in description, you will have to select from the drop-down menu unfortunately ☹️ You can also call or email us through the website and we can build you an invoice if you don’t want to go to page by page and adding stuff to the cart. I still like the 38t. I would probably go 42 if I had to do it all over again, but it’s not worth it to change it.

[@diver___]

Thanks!@@JohnnyNerdOut I was able to figure it out, I have a 68mm BB and crank arms are easy to measure. I think I'll be able to order from the website, also to take advantage of that sweet Paypal financing... Interesting to hear that you would go with a 42T chainring if you had to redo it. I assume it is because you found yourself unable to keep up with the pedaling at higher speeds? Thanks for for feedback, my setup would have numerous steep hills to overcome, but looking at your "throttle-only" tests in this video, it sounds like hills shouldn't be a problem even with the higher chainring size. Will definitely give you a ring to ask about availability on certain parts in the shop for this build. Cannot wait to build my first e-bike! Thanks again for all the education you provide here.

[@ferguson8143]

​@@diver___if you have a lot of hills in your bike ride inwould go for more torque over top end and if you want the most torque possible then you need to go with a gear ratio of 1 to 1 meaning if you have a 32 tooth in rear then put a 32 tooth on the front

[@garymcafoose7612]

Hello John. Would you custom build the e-bike in your video or similar e-bike and ship it out ? If so can we discuss price ?

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

Yes we ship bikes. Please call the shop to get more info 😀check the bottom of our home page for contact info 👍

[@marcricci7298]

Hi...keep up the awesome work. I have purchased a gazelle ebike with impulse motor (not working). The bike is as new condition. Is it possible to install a bafang ultra or cyc motor using some frame adapter plates or similar...thanks for reading.

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

I’m sure you can find a motor that will fit with the right adapter. I’m only a little familiar with that bike.

[@marcricci7298]

@@JohnnyNerdOut thanks...do you have any ideas of where to source an adapter? I have scoured the internet and can only find a mount for the bafang ultra that needs to be aluminium welded after the old mount is cut off the bike, chain alignment would seem an issue with this method....thanks for your input

[@scotttownsend4405]

Can you service this motor? I understand from High Voltages' review of the CYC Photon that this motor need to be serviced periodically and must be sent in to do so.

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

As a dealer I can. But we will see how it is for customers in be future…

[@mickp10]

Thank you for your helpful videos. I have a Giant ATX , and am wanting to convert to a CYC Photon, but the bike is internally cable routed with cables coming out of the bottom of the bottom bracket, and will also convert to hydraulic brakes. Will this work ok regarding bottom bracket space ? Thanks

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

In general, yes you should be fine. We deal with that stuff all the time. Worst case is you may need to run the cabling externally ☹️

[@WAUCE7]

What brake handles are those where you don't need to glue on the BS magnets? (I have a BBSHD)

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

www.johnnynerdout.com/product-page/hydraulic-brake-set-mtb-ebike-hydraulic-disc-brake-for-bafang-bbs

[@DanielDinsmore-i3l]

I have the BBS02 and I was more interested in the mounting , the 02 ha a make shift plumbers tape mount for motor twist.

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

Do you have the triangular mount installed? If not the motor will break itself off

[@DanielDinsmore-i3l]

@@JohnnyNerdOut Yes, Inaddition I added another attachment point to stop the swiveling of the motor from the torque, it holds the motor tight to the frame and prevents it from swiveling down.

[@Gyllbonus]

Hey Johnny... Would this be worth it to setup with a 3 speed internal geared hub? Also is there a 104 bcd adaptor... I'm coming from a gates belt drive bike...thnx

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

I’d want more than just 3 speeds. Maybe a 5 speed with a wide enough gear ratio. I have some chainring adapters on my site. Can’t remember off the top if they are 104 though.

[@MHH3180]

@@JohnnyNerdOut they are not. Only the factory chain rings will work. Supposedly they have a belt drive version coming out, but that was supposed to be released three months ago. This thing, with a belt drive, would be amazing as the alignment would be so awesome. It would have enough torque to pull stumps, but like Johnny intimated, you'd never really utilize its potential as commuter with the available Gates belt or cogs. I recently built a belt drive Momentum with a TSDZ2. It is quite remarkable. It was 104 so I was able to just swap factory for factory. You'd probably want to get an OSF programmed version as only EUNORAU is not using really weak factory programming right now and they are having some issues (had to return 6 of their motors).

[@jimmydean123123]

I recently bought a 2014 fatboy expert with an e*thirteen pf30 bottom bracket. Can I use the bbshd with a pf30 adapter? Or do you suggest something different?

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

Yes you can, get the 120mm bbshd. There are a few pf30 adapters out there. The Lekkie one works but is designed for a 68mm so it’s not perfect/ideal.

[@jimmydean123123]

@@JohnnyNerdOut How many spacers do you recommend to clear the chainstay

[@scooble]

Is it possible to configure the throttle to give you power when you are not pedaling? This would be useful for popping out of ruts

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

Yes. Pretty much every conversion kit offers that feature. At least the mid drives do.

[@capt.lennymiller6524]

Hey Johnny, always enjoy your videos! Trying to help my cousin-in-law research torque sensing motors for his future build. Just wondering if service work would need to be done on a Photon, are you an authorized repair facility or does it get sent back to Hong Kong?

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

Yes I am a CYC repair facility 😀

[@BenSabersTV]

If I where to buy one of these what sort of cost would you expect it to be?

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

All in about $2300 including bike

[@BenSabersTV]

@@JohnnyNerdOut oh wow that's much better than I thought thank you

[@lindaacoleman5657]

Have you ever converted an 2018 Electra townie go 8i ladies 8:40 26”.. 8:42

[@waltersmithat70]

I ride 12+ mph average.commuting,touring shopping. I am going to upgrade from hub to mid drive. Low gear 1to1is great.

[@noe616]

I have a CYC Photon kit on a Motobecane X2 gravel bike. I kept it stock amps. I'm using the 50 tooth chainring because I ride on flat land. I'm impressed with it and it's super quiet.

[@MHH3180]

Yes, the new king of quiet

[@TheAgentAssassin]

Nice.

[@joehiatt1992]

Whats top speed with ur setup ?

[@davidvillemure847]

How is it in cold ? I'm in Wisconsin

[@Mstgkillr]

I have a 2018 Specialized Roll Comp (XL). I've gained a few pounds over the last few years (300-390 lbs). Would it be worth it (and safe) to convert my Roll to an E-bike copying this build, or should I just go with Himiway Zebra for $1800? I assume I could get a few bucks for the Roll (it looks brand new). How much did this build cost? Performance between the two?

[@Mstgkillr]

I'm also 6'8", so that could come into play.

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

You may want to check out day6 bikes or zize bikes and converting one if performance, customization and price are important. If you prefer something to be assembled shipped to you the himiway may be the better option.

[@Mstgkillr]

Damn, I was hoping you’d say to go with the Roll… and give me some ammo to convince the wife. I love my Roll and have high hopes of getting back down under 300 lbs.

[@DarElBarka]

I'm 6'6". I would like you to build for me a bike like this for commuting to work.

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

Call the shop😀

[@DarElBarka]

@@JohnnyNerdOut I DMed you on Instangram

[@JRP3]

Why were your feet off the pedals on the hill climb but not when going down the street?

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

So show I wasn’t pedaling.

[@JRP3]

@@JohnnyNerdOut It didn't look like you were pedaling on the street either. Is there a freewheel on the front gear so you don't need to pedal when using the throttle?

[@MrDearCandy]

@@JRP3 Of course yes, you can put your feet on the pedals and throttle without pedaling, or use both etc. Only thing about this system is the chain only goes forward so when lubing chains you have to lift bike and pedal forward. When spinning pedals opposite way, the free wheel spins and chain stays in place.

[@JRP3]

@@MrDearCandy That's what I thought and why I was confused that he had his feet off the pedal for the hill climb. It would be obvious that his feet weren't moving if he just kept them on the pedals and used them as foot pegs.

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

@@JRP3 yes. All mid drives have a freewheeling crank

[@rondi524]

Great review as always. What is the weight of your build with battery? And not to be personal--about how much do you weigh?

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

Great questions I always mean to include that info but forgot. Even went and bought a bike scale! I’m 180# bike with battery is about 55#

[@4u2h8on]

I have the same bike how much is it going to cost me to do the same setup on my bike?

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

~$1500

[@georgekrpan3181]

To go 34mph on throttle only is impressive. I calculate you'd need a 60t chainring to keep from ghost pedaling at 34mph. The trouble is, almost no bikes have the clearance for 60t chainrings. The Troxus Explorer does.

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

The 50t might keep up at 34mph. My 38t is good up to about 27-28 @90 rpm

[@georgekrpan3181]

@@JohnnyNerdOut Sheldon Brown's Gear Calculator says 25.6mph at 90rpm for your bike assuming you have an 11 tooth cog. A 60t chainring would be good for 40.4mph at 90rpm. 52x11 would be good for 35mph @ 90rpm.

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

@@georgekrpan3181 I’m assuming you got the correct tire size in there too? That sounds about right though

[@georgekrpan3181]

@@JohnnyNerdOut I think I assumed 2 inch tires. Cheers JNO!

[@sr20detized]

@@georgekrpan3181 that's very close to what I'm seeing with a 26-2.4, 11t low gear, 34t photon at about 90rpm cadence. I'm really smoking myself out to pedal over 30mph. I've hit 31 on pedal with assist and My old knees were doing everything they could... no idea the cadence at that point. Near 40mph on throttle, working the gears a bit at 1500w. I sorta wish I'd have gone for about a 40t. I think on a 29er a 34-36 would be perfect.

[@MumfordJim]

How do you feel about a build of a mid drive with a torque sensor without brake cutoff? With or without throttle. I believe many of the bikes I have ridden in Europe do not have brake cutoffs. I know they don’t have a throttle. I would think if I did not have a throttle they would be safe. What do you think? Also I notice no gear sensor on this build.

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

I always suggest using brake cutoffs and a gear shift sensor on any build if at all possible.

[@sr20detized]

My experience so far is that I have no need for a brake sensor. I've a tendency (thanks to motorsports) to just barely ride the brake lever. Which was giving me cut out problems the first week or so with the Photon before I figured out I was even doing it. It'd be better if you could set the range or sensitivity on the brake sensors. But I only have a mil or two of clearance and just barely touching the lever set the sensor off. That along with the delay in motor "ramp" made it surge a bit. But, it's nice you can just turn off the sensors when you're riding it via app, and maybe turn it back on for a newb riding it. I've considered running just the front brake lever sensor and killing the rear. But currently, no need to re-engage after a few weeks riding without.

[@Barefoot-Bob]

If the gears are actually a useable function with the mid drive. Why can you not achieve a higher speed on the throttle ? like 40mph

[@JohnnyNerdOut]

When the conditions are right, 40mph is achievable.

[@realeyesrealizereallies6828]

If your watching this in 2064 your probably biking through a mad max hell scape..

[@noe616]

Ebikes will be killed for.

[@shTree]

Bush in 2008 be like: 2:53

[@onshore1ft]

Great bike but that rear mudguard is triggering me

[@MTBPerspective]

Wish this had been out when I built a couple of tongsheng ebike conversions last year. Even with mild greenway riding they get hot, then noisy, then short out requiring a new motor and likely a new controller. I also have a Giant Trance E+ mtb - just crossed over 500 miles on it and did a riding reveiw, also starts off by showing how to easily load ebikes on a platform rack: kzbin.info/www/bejne/o4u3opSnhKl3oqs

[@vibs1614]

I ride a tongsheng 500w in Phoenix ambient Temps over 110 average speeds around 15 to 20 and never overheat...plus at 240 I'm no lightweight. What gives?

[@MTBPerspective]

I'm suspicious of the open source firmware ours are setup with - I've dialed back the amps/watts settings way below the osf recommendations so will see if that keeps them from burning up. @@vibs1614

[@gepardtilly]

That is a very old myth and not true anymore that narrower tyres are faster. Actually, due to better cushioning, and less bouncing from the road, resulting and better riding for the rider, wider tyres are often faster.

[@ChrisBFerguson]

Basically get this if you want Torque over candace sensing.

[@MHH3180]

It os 50% lighter than The BBSHD (hamdling)handling, is quieter, fits more unique frames and allows for a perfect chain line on commuter, road and many gravel frames. Because it is torque sensing, there is no need for a shift or brake sensor, so it makes for a much, much cleaner, easier, faster install. My biggest complaint with Bafang are all those little extras and the fact that they respond so absurdly slow. I have a customer with a 12 speed Rosco (about $3k before the motor). It shifts close to stock and there is little perceptible run on (in these two things The TSDZ2's torque sensor is superior).

[@jamesloghry8083]

Ring the bell be well. 👉🙏🙏🙏👈ty

[@pipito588]

so where is climbing in this video???

[@One_-_Man-_-Clan]

That bike sucks. lol (so does the Photon)