Cyberpunk 2077 - DON'T SAVE TAKEMURA! Here's Why...

[@maxmax9673]

I was so disoriented in the Arasaka raid that I didn't even realize that I COULD or had to save Takemura. I was expecting him to make it out on his own and very busy running around in circles in the dark while being shot at. He would have been disappointed in me anyway.

[@unclemikeyplays]

I'm pretty sure that's deliberate design on their part. The first time through that run, it's all smoke and noise and violence, and it's still early enough in the game (unless you're playing things way out of order) that you can be forgiven being totally confused in the moment. That also feels very realistic to me, which is why it also makes sense that rescuing Takemura is optional and doesn't block progress. It's almost an easter-egg that it's POSSIBLE to save him.

[@braeduin]

Same here. I had no idea that saving Takemura was an option. I saw this video come up in my recommendations and felt really bad that I left him to die. Now, that I've finished my first play-through and watched this video, I don't feel as bad any more.

[@SirFlooberis]

@@unclemikeyplaysI had the mod that give you the ability to double jump. So I was curious if you could go back up the hole you fail through. And there I found him, I killed the guards and escaped with him

[@neandrewthal]

@@unclemikeyplays "(unless you're playing things way out of order)" I feel personally attacked lol. When Takemura called me to set up Gimme Danger he said do not keep me waiting. So naturally, I completed all gigs, side quests and random encounters and came back having been already capped at level 50 for a while :P

[@skell6134]

@@neandrewthal Well,i been doing side quests in moment when takemura is busy most of time and when quest happens to be on my way too

[@IchbinX]

Goro's opinion of you is much like a Samurai. No matter what, he'll kill you if it's his duty. The only difference is whether he honors you, or not, while doing it.

[@AresSG]

Exactly. Plus if he fails and is still alive, then he'll feel disgraced and be furious. Which is what happens in other endings. It's even implied he commits seppuku.

[@dmp_dini965]

good insight my brother

[@TipoIrritable]

Yep. I did save him in my second playthrough But I noticed that the indole of each of his words was with disappointment not only with us, but with the same. He considered Saburo and Hanako honorable, but he lost them and could not do anything about it.

[@lordrefrigeratorintercoole288]

thats why i let him die and kill Oda. which i think arasaka dont kill him anyway for honor

[@zelsha]

I see him the same. You own him your life, and that by definition, mean something. When you go and save him, you don't own him anymore. At this point this is about kinship/friendship, and Goro's loyalty will always be with Asaka. That when, if, you get again on opposite sides.

[@nexusprotocol3692]

Keep in mind when talking to takemura after scouting out the arasaka compound, when discussing him becoming a nomad and leaving the corporate life he says “one cannot teach an old dog new tricks” and that line I think defines takemura as a whole.

[@ohauss]

Which is funny, given that he seems to think himself a medical expert...

[@nexusprotocol3692]

@@ohauss No, he just believes everything arasaka tells him, if they tell him your soul will be safe, his blind loyalty believes that.

[@ohauss]

@@nexusprotocol3692 Why would they discuss the effects of the chip in such detail with him?

[@legomikey]

@@ohauss bro you just raided arasaka basically solo and killed Adam Smasher while almost dead, you can be of value in the future so they want Goro to get you to sign yourself over to them

[@haxacodex3784]

Yeah it’s interesting he said he often thinks about becoming a Nomad. Yet, if V joins Panam and becomes a nomad he gets pissy like he didn’t have the same idea

[@falkenvir]

Takemura becomes a street dog with you but when he's back with Arasaka, he became his masters dog again

[@Animategrey]

yep, exactly. He's the type of guy to get you to come along with him to do shit that's gonna fuck up your own life, but because he's on the same "level" as you, meaning he's also being hunted by Arasaka and is a disgraced corpo-rat, you think he will actually end up helping you and taking you along with him on his rise back up to the top and save your life, but ends up immediately stabbing you in the back the second he gets back in the good graces of his overlords. It's like a guy who convinces you to rob a store with him, and because you are both poor and without hope, you agree to it thinking that even if it goes bad you will still be together and find a solution, but the minute you get caught he snitches and pins the whole thing on you and gets offered a position to be a cop because he has friends in high places. Then when your sitting in the jail cell he comes in, a free man, to try and get you to confess and make a plea deal that will have you in prison for the foreseeable future.

[@lonetrap]

@@Animategrey spot on

[@wilder11]

Yep. Johnny was right: "CLINK." The sound of Arasaka's leash.

[@jax0235]

​@@Animategreyvs life was already fucked up

[@minidiamantl5462]

as a great man once said "You can take the corpo out of the rat but not the rat out of the corpo".

[@PrattlingPyre]

He saved me. I gotta save him. No matter how our stories end.

[@mysticsoul7284]

Johnny saved you. Takamura probably didn't kill Dex for V...he did it for Arasaka because they wanted V for Soul KIller.

[@tylersperry9164]

Did Goro actually save you, though? If Dex and Goro hadn't appeared, the construct would have kept repairing its new host. You would have been able to contact Del or Vik directly for help. Besides, Goro only "saves" your life so he can hand you over to Yorinobu per his assignment. And without your Del/Vik connection he would have died, so any life debt is already paid. Plus according to Hanako the SOB planted a tracker on you while you were recovering at Vik's. You owe him nothing. I only save Goro after the parade because it's a fun battle. Well, it's also fun to hear him cursing me later in a message for indirectly letting Yorinobu triumph by choosing the Panam ending. But then I'm the kind of guy who likes to make him say "Better buckle up!" outside the pachinko parlor.

[@BGomez-tk7lu]

He saves us because we are his only way to restore his honor, because he needs us. Yes, we can be friendly and all but in the end he wouldn't hesitate to put a bullet in our heads if the Arasaka higher-ups ordered him to do it. The first rule of Nightcity is to trust no one

[@Youreamess]

He saved you because he needed to save his own ass. He would have just as easily killed you

[@zettour.]

@@mysticsoul7284 No. Takemura saved V to expose the truth and take down Yorinobu. Arasaka wanted V to recover the relic, not Soul Killer which they've had ever since they used it in Alt.

[@libertylemonz7145]

I do think Goro does see himself as your friend, there's more than enough friendly interactions between him and V that support this, I just think he's so utterly dedicated to Arasaka that it doesn't matter.

[@edwindrawz]

He even messages quotes to you

[@edge1247]

He's more of a Good Companion untill the Journey is over. Classic case of bonding through a mutual goal then it going either way when the goal is reached.

[@meldmagic]

🤠 Ply any Japanese man with sake & he'll eventually be your best friend.

[@christiansantamaria7233]

@@edwindrawz yes the message he sent with this emoji “^._.^” made me laugh I can’t picture a serious man using that ever and for that reason alone he deserves salvation

[@blunthonesty8633]

I have to agree. I thought of him as just another corpo rat at first. But he grew on me a bit. But when he kidnapped Hanako and shit hit the fan I didn't even wonder if I could save him. I could see his blind loyalty on display throughout the story. Honestly I think there should have been a way to save him and then say "You saved my life, I saved yours. We're even now." I kind of grew to like him, but his loyalty to the corporation meant I wouldn't risk my life for him in that scenario.

[@zymethamp6596]

In the devil ending, he visits you on the spaceship to offer you the secure your soul program. He no longer calls Hanako "sama", probably as a sign of contempt by letting you down. And by this, felt like HE let you down since he promised Hanako can help. If you declined the contract he looks down and couldn't look you in the eye. He genuinely felt like he betrayed you and let you down. His goal of working for the benefit of Arasaka was not out of malice to you, just his blind loyalty and honor. He was a true friend to V.

[@zymethamp6596]

You also weren't forced to take exams nor being held prisoner at the spaceship. You just basically had brain surgery and were testing your brain functions. V can't solve the cube and bad physical exam results so obviously they can't let him out yet. If you chose not to make a tantrum, V would solve the cube and Takemura would still appear the next day. It's not the tantrum that triggers it, but the results of your performance.

[@marcelzx1]

Exactly

[@BrutalAthas]

I think takemura world was crumbled too with all of this he know arasaka is peace of shit in that moment but he is afraid to do something else, he was thinking to be nomad in some moment

[@OLDirty_Kungfu]

Lest we forget, V is one of a few people who know that Saburo possessed his son...that's a loose end worth tying when old Saburo can just have more kids and implant himself in his ideal host for eternity.

[@AugustSchroif]

@@zymethamp6596 dude, I have two bach degrees and iq of 129 according to mensa, yet I can't do a fucking cube, what do you want from me ((

[@kayn9651]

I would like to clarify, when Takemura finds you in the dump, he is still working for Arasaka. - Yorinobu sent him to find you because you were witness to Yorinobu killing Saburo. - Then because Takemura was skeptic and very loyal to Saburo, Yorinobu sent Arasaka ninjas to assassinate both you and Takemura, and it was only at that point, when you wake up in the high speed car chase, that Takemura comes around.

[@wilder11]

Yep, I only realized that on my second playthrough. But that's the only way those cutscenes make sense.

[@kayn9651]

@@wilder11 Aye, the whole sequence goes by in a flash so it's not very obvious unless you stop to think about it. But you got some clues there, like the fact Takemura slaps you unconscious the first time you see him, as you're crawling out of the dump. - But then during the car chase he tosses you a healing stim. It also plays out similar to how the Corpo start does, where Arasaka waits for the agent to be out in the field before sending in the squad to "deal with them", rather than just busting them down in the office. They're very under-handed about it, and you don't know you're being set up until you're already there in the thick of it, distracted with something else and susceptible to being ambushed. Plus if they had succeeded in killing you and Takemura, they could've justified it as a cyber-psycho attack. Since you survived, they can just say Takemura betrayed the company to save your skin. And outside of it being a set-up, there's little reason to send a high ranking personal bodyguard out on a petty mission like corpse retrieval. They could've directly sent the assassin ninjas. - Or if you wanna argue Takemura was being demoted for failing to protect Saburo, he wouldn't be entrusted something as risky as evidence disposal, especially knowing he was skeptical of the whole situation. He even starts to question that poisoning wouldn't be possible and that something fishy is afoot in the penthouse, until Arasaka Jr cuts him short and goes "At-ta-ta-ta-ta..! He's dead, so I'm the boss now. I blame you. Now shoo, get from here. Before you learn too much."

[@shadowkiller4000]

I'll still save him, but I wont help him further his goals. He saved V once, V saves Goro once. Debt fulfilled, honor restored.

[@TheBebe2006]

Is that possible or do you have to help him

[@shadowkiller4000]

@@TheBebe2006 nah, you can choose to save him from death and then not continue with his ending (the devil ending)

[@gregorysilas6329]

They is my view on it. Favor for a favor.

[@lkpcarvalho]

Seems fair enough for me too.

[@HollowedInside]

Same. I really like Goro, but he is still an Arasaka dog. He saves me, I'll save him back. Now we're even, now I don't owe it to him to do the devil ending. If he chooses to be my enemy after that, *so be it.*

[@ScytheNoire]

Yorinobu wasn't wrong to kill his father. Saburo just wants to take over his body. Thanks dad.

[@StoriesByDighe]

Yeah, exactly! 😊

[@AlexanderTheGoodEnough]

a good father is a benevolent tyrant. saburo, wasn't benevolent.

[@spaghettiupseti9990]

@@AlexanderTheGoodEnough thats a contradictory statement, a tyrant is described as cruel and oppressive or exercising power in an unreasonable and arbitrary way. that is oxford dictionary's definition. benevolent is defined as well meaning and kind. How can you be well meaning and kind while also being oppressive or cruel?

[@constantintofan2346]

@@spaghettiupseti9990 the oxford dictionary isn't using actual political science for definitions, but refers to the associations made in common speech. A tyrant is anybody who has unilateral decision rights. Any society (a family even) has its decisions made either by one (tyrant), some (oligarchy) or all (democracy). The concept of benevolent tyrant means somebody makes decisions for you in your interest, which still qualifies as oppressive. A tyrant - conceptionally - doesn't have to be cruel, the reason why we associate them to being that in common speech is because - practically - they always are.

[@artcorbeau]

Technically, Saburo doesn't want to take over Yorinobu's body, he wants to put a copy of his "soul" in it. The real Saburo is still dead.

[@cane6074]

I was shocked by how he ultimate turned out in the end but not surprised by it. He never lied to you and was always up front about what he believed and wanted, that he was loyal to Arasaka and would always be so, the ending just made you realize what that level of loyalty entailed. He was your friend, its just you will always 2nd place, he deeply regrets everything, but wont do anything about it and he cant. Its no surprise if you look at his background, he came from poverty and Arasaka housed, fed, clothed and educated him. The trained him into elite commando and bodyguard and gave him high paying job, and made high ranking member of the Corporation. They also gave him something more important that ever man wants, a meaning and a purpose. The company gave him everything and made him into the man he is. The totalitarian nature of Arasaka indoctrinated and conditioned him from an from a young age to think and behave like this, for him the arasaka is family. Which is a shame because he has the potential to be a good person in spite of what he has done and what he Serves. It shows how evil Arasaka really is, that they can warp a person into this something like, which its tragic.

[@Snarkknight5]

I mean, there *is* something laudable about Takemura's absolute loyalty to Saburo Arasaka. You can't buy him off - he'd kill you for the insult. You can't intimidate him, for as long as he's physically capable of protecting his master's interests, he'll keep coming after you, with the tenacity of a hound. Even deceiving him will only work for so long, and as soon as he cottons on to the deception, he'll be back on you, and with a renewed fury to boot. For writing a tabletop rpg campaign, Goro Takemura is actually a great template for a Lawful Good antagonist, a devoted and loyal warrior in service to a dangerous and conniving lord.

[@happyninja42]

Actually he does lie to you at least once, at the very end. When he's trying to sell V on the Secure Your Soul project. He first says that Hanako has already forgotten about V, and then later says that Hanako is the reason he is on the station to talk to you. Those 2 statements are pretty opposite and mutually exclusive. He can't be there on her behalf, AND her not remember who V is. And given that point shifts based on how he's trying to convince V, I'd say he is being deceitful there. I'm sure there are some other parts where he is deceptive in the game, if you deep dive his dialogue.

[@a.g.m8790]

@@Snarkknight5 I don’t think there’s anything laudable about being a leashed dog for someone

[@0HOLSTER]

He's a samurai following the samurai code. Watch 47 samurai and he's essentially doing the same thing as them.

[@spika5872]

to be fiar to him, Alaska is his family. Ask yourself a question. If you have to choose between your own family and a friend, who would you put as the 1st priority? I don;t think he is a dog to Arasaka. Perhaps from the outlook of it is true. However, think about it, many parents gave birth to children for labor and for the sake of having someone to take care of them when they get old. So some parents are "using' their children and their children are also some kind of "loyal dogs" to them. What's the difference? In this world, someone is always using someone for various purposes.

[@Softpaw1996]

i honestly felt that Takemura "lost" himself in the end. at first he just needed you for his own agenda, a mutually beneficial partnership. but he grew to trust you (depending on dialogue) and eventually becoming slight friends. But after being separated and him being in the company of hanako, i felt a change in him. he became much more corpo again. its like when he was exiled you saw him as an actual friend and person. But the moment he got back with Arasaka he was back to being cold. Subtle, sure. But definitely didn't recognize him in the corpo ending. He talked differently and was generally just cold. The only comment he made that felt like his old self was when i signed the contract and he told me to seek him out in japan and he would serve me real food.

[@csmith7404]

Much like many people in real life. Sticking together when times are bad and they need you. After that, it’s “adios, kuso-ama”

[@someblackguy7371]

@@csmith7404 honestly,i don't hate people for doing that either. Ever tried saving people who are mental and refuse to be saved? it's exhausting.

[@NA-nz9lv]

people can be double-faced like that though, when they're with you it will feel like they like you and want to be friends, and maybe they even do but the moment they have a chance at something better they revert to treating you like garbage.

[@OhSoTiredMan]

you can kick a rat out of the corpo but you cant kick the corpo out of the rat.

[@NA-nz9lv]

@@gaelmus592 a game can have morally ambiguous characters, I wouldn't call it an error. The ending just shows that a loyal dog will never be more than that, Takemura's a good person and he's clearly not evil but he's obedient to a fault and can't think for himself.

[@liboud22]

I save Goro every time not because I'm delusional about his friendship, but because Johnny tells me to leave him to die. One thing that hasn't failed me is my motto - "Do opposite of what Johnny would do."

[@DavZeugme]

Seems fair.

[@anotherrandom1]

Thats some wise stuff

[@Snipergoat1]

And so you destroy Delamane? You Bastard!

[@DavZeugme]

@@Snipergoat1 Funnily, I almost did for that exact reason. But in the end, my (almost) unconditional love for Delamain's weird new personality prevailed.

[@magni5648]

Doing that means deactivating the Bartmoss Collective fortune teller machine. You absolute monster.

[@dtdang0309]

You save Goro because you value his companionship. I save Goro to make him watch I destroy his beloved Arasaka. We're not the same. P/s: thanks

[@ktm19981]

Kinda cringe

[@damnbrosky]

I hope in DLC we will have chance to destroy them for good

[@thepackable]

I failed to save takemura because ima gonk that thought he would get out on his own. Watched my brother play through. He is literally just standing there when you come to save him. I feel bad but I didn't even know he was dead till 3 real life days later lmao. I was like. "Why hasn't this scopmuncher called me?"

[@commentdouchery2838]

I don't save Goro because he leaves a bitch message in every ending that doesn't involve working with Arasaka, which is the worst possible ending.

[@ktm19981]

@@commentdouchery2838 I saved him and I was so nice but I went for the Johnny ending and buddy still talking smack even after you save him

[@lokdog257]

I never thought he betrayed Arasaka, it was Yorinobu that betrays him. Goro goes on a mission to find Saburo's killer and finds V. I always assumed that Yorinobu took the opportunity to kill 2 birds with 1 stone, the last witness to his crime, and a suspicious bodyguard of questionable loyalty. The attempted hit convinced Goro that his instincts were correct and that Yorinobu was behind Saburo's death. If it wasn't for that attempted assassination, Goro would have happily brought V to Yorinobu.

[@GrimK77]

... and funny thing is, Yorinobu is completely justified, considering what he knows about Saburo plans. Yorinobu knew very well what he wanted to prevent by stealing custom relic and Silverhand's engram.

[@lokdog257]

@@GrimK77 I doubt the original plan was for Saburo to take his son's body. However, that changed with Saburo's murder, and how poorly Yorinobu handled the company for the time he is in charge

[@GrimK77]

@@lokdog257 I don't mean take over of his body. Yorinobu was repulsed by whole idea of controlling the humanity. Game provides enough clues and info. On top of that the phonecall with Hellman that Evelyn recorded, is not subtle at all.

[@michaelrandolph6373]

@@lokdog257 Yorinobu didn’t handle the company poorly. He was outright sabotaging it cuz his goal is to destroy the company and expose their and his father’s evil plans for America and the world.

[@CodeeXD]

@@lokdog257 not the body snatching it's arasaka as a whole he doesn't agree with. The reason Maiko lived a sheltered life is because when saburo tells yorunobu his plans for arasaka and the human race he's horrified and disgusted and leaves the family starting the first tyger claws, I forget the actual name, to try and run interference with arasaka. Also if you read the paper you sign for making your own relic to put in a new body it says they're just gonna hit you with soul killer then delete your engram. Never trust a corpo or one of their rats

[@nickelakon5369]

I genuinely think that Takemura is doing what he thinks is best for you, its just that his bias for arasaka clouds his judgement. You have to keep in mind that Arasaka is Takemura's life. Even when he gets put on their hit list his goal isnt "save myself" its "save arasaka"

[@hidan407]

Yeah, he probably thinks that if Arasaka could save him in the past, then they may be able to save V too and Tbh I think arasaka not able to save V the normal way ia another lie that even he isnt aware of. We killed adam Smashee by ourselves, the 2nd most dangerous person in arasaka behind takemura ( Ill explain later) and if they healed us, they would be hopeless against us in the future. So I think they lied about it, so that if we accept being a engram, they can out us into a body that they created and got 100% control of.

[@dogf421]

exactly. i think it makes him an extremely tragic character. never really had a chance to think for himself, was snatched up as a kid and turned into a corporate soldier for life.

[@honkhonk8009]

Accurate. Hes Japanese and in the cyberpunk universe, they probably are striaght up WW2 tier japanese. He wont change but hes a good person with good personality traits that make him valuable. Shame such men are wasted with Arasaka.

[@ZrodyApo]

Takemura's perspective on things slighlty change by the end of the game though, for starter he didn't know about Saburo's return until the meeting with the Arasaka board members and even then had a hard time believing it because throughout the game he tells you how close he was with his master, or at least how close he thought he was. And during the last conversation you learn from him that he's been transfered to Japan and most likely will not be Saburo's body guard anymore. And a small but meaningful detail I noticed, when he was Saburo's bodyguard he wears a black suit but as soon as he's under Hanako's direct order he wears a white suit which means he's in Hanako's faction. But in the end he's back to wearing a black suit so it's most likely mean that he returned to his former master allegiance.

[@nevermind5733]

And there is that dialog while they are watching the Arasaka warehouse, one COULD inspire some doubt in him and he speaks about how nice it could be to live with nomads, free from all this but heis of course not able to go through with it or even talk about it more.

[@Olis4897]

@@nevermind5733 that’s a good point. I think you have to be a nomad to unlock that piece of dialogue, I wonder what would happen if you were a corpo.

[@jchen3]

@@Olis4897 you do not. And you can reply that he doesn't know anything about nomad culture, even if you're not a nomad as well.

[@j.f.fisher5318]

His body language at the end feels like he's a bit disillusioned, assuming thats accurate characterization.

[@ZrodyApo]

@@nevermind5733 as he told V during that scene "you can't teach an old dog new tricks"

[@MelDSnow]

the reason Takemura is on the Arasaka hitlist isn't *exactly* because he saved you. He implied that he was following Yorinobu's orders to retrieve your body because it has the Relic. Then Yorinobu put the hit on him to tie up loose ends. I mean, it's awfully suspicious that Yorinobu was left alone with his father after they were beefing and then his father was "poisoned". Takemura finds your body thanks to Dex, and then tells someone (assumedly Yorinobu) on the phone that he has you. THEN the agents come to assassinate Takemura. If he was going against orders to save you, why would he call in that he's secured your body? Makes no sense

[@monotonemoe]

probably bad writing

[@syjay]

exactly!! i didn't care enough about takemura that i didn't even know that it was possible to go back and save him i just left, mainly because i always knew that his plan was to give you back to arasaka , that whole ride with him when he first "saved you" i thought that we were going back to arasaka because of the phone call he made , until the agents came and started shooting..

[@ancorey25]

@@monotonemoe wrong, when Yorinobu found out you were alive he sent his troops to kill you and Goro because he knew there was a possibility you told Goro what happened. If you were found dead nothing would have happened. If Goro had planned to help you he would not have told Yorinobu that he had you.

[@doctorroach1680]

Is this written anywhere in the game? This is interesting.

[@jaydeleon8094]

@@doctorroach1680 I think it’s a book? Yorinobo was actually indoctrinated by the deeds of silver hand, he planned to “become” the bomb and destroy Arasaka from the inside out. He’s not clean, but there’s a reason NetWatch is basically the only corpo unit we see not always being assholes and just doing their jobs.

[@bloodydior6871]

(Spoiler) man I grew to like goro His and V’s relationship was almost like true friends to me. It felt like they were both teaching each other and both grew as people. I saved him with no question. I had double jump and hopped up through the hole in each story lol. Then he sent a selfie in a weird angle like it was his first time taking a selfie; saying “I would not be able to send this if you haven’t come for me” man that warmed my heart. Then later in the end credits he shattered it when he told me to go to hell :/

[@Tempehhhh]

He's one of my favorite fictional characters of all time. But yeah, that bit hurts. I understand it from Goro's perspective tho. His childhood was horrible beyond imagination and got saved by Arasaka. He spend his whole life in Arasaka, surrounded by people who were saved by Arasaka as well. He genuinely thinks Arasaka brings the best to the world. During the rooftop conversation he says something like "not everyone can be saved" when V points out that even tho Arasaka is all high and mighty, people are still suffering. He knows the world will always be flawed but at least thanks to corporations, there will still be millions that get a chance to live a good life, and he's blind to see the damage they do. Now he goes out to find V, for Arasaka, just to get betrayed by Yorinobu. He will save V, hoping that V is willing to help him avenge Saburo. He'll work with you, even get a bit more personal with you. Hell, on the rooftop he tells you he trusts you now! And then you go out an destroy Arasaka. Goro will never get his life back and you destroyed what he was so loyal to. He thought saving your life would save Arasaka, yet he brought doom to it. As much as it hurts, he has all the right in the world to hate V's guts. Saving V resulted in Goro losing everything, leaving him with no reason to live left. What I don't understand tho is that he gives you this dialogue in the devil ending? When you choose to not join the secure your soul program. I think that was just lazy on the Dev's side

[@bluecloud4652]

​@@Tempehhhhwait he still gives this dialogue when you don't choose the secure your soul ending? That seems like a mistake

[@Tempehhhh]

@@bluecloud4652 I think he was supposed to have a different reply there, but he doesn't because. Cut content. Lol. It makes no sense as why would he commit suicide in that ending, he got the job back. You also see him wear his old outfit again, even tho he's back at Arasaka. It's definitely a mistake

[@bluecloud4652]

@@Tempehhhh that seems like a major enough mistake for them to try and fix, so it might be possible with the new dlc

[@MrRavmoor]

@@bluecloud4652 I didn't get that message with the Devil ending at all.- Only with the ones that actually fuck him over.

[@ArthurMorgan_Gaming]

Takemura is a man of great loyalty and devotion, it's just a shame it's misplaced

[@backstabber3537]

Blind loyalty

[@ThatGuy-tx4vm]

He isn't a kid. I hate the terms misplaced loyalty etc... The truth is far simpler. He accepts to do evil because he values Saburo and himself more than innocents... Therefore he is evil and does not deserve to live.

[@impaugjuldivmax]

same as agent Reed is, both are dumb

[@honkhonk8009]

@@ThatGuy-tx4vm Yea thats litterally the textbook definition of Loyalty. No shit he values the life of who hes loyal to, over anybody else. Litterally what else would you expect?

[@ThatGuy-tx4vm]

@@honkhonk8009 loyalty to evil simply means that the person is evil too. Nothing more nothing less.

[@Lurkily_Esh]

It's possible that Takemura is trying to do his best to save V, and that his manipulations are an honest attempt to convince V to take the path that saves a friend's life. Even if Arasaka does have ill intent, Takemura, the loyal company man, doesn't necessarily know that.

[@matfax]

I think one reason why he's so distraught during the ending and even hateful towards V is different from what's apparent. Takemura cares about V. If he didn't care, he'd just forget her the corpo way. I think he grew hate because he, for himself, made a deal for Mikoshi. He trusts Arasaka blindly, unconditionally. He assumed that they would meet in Mikoshi. But V declined. Takemura considers this a denial of their friendship, which lacks honor in his mind.

[@matfax]

Another theory is that his own deal for Mikoshi even depends on his successful sale to V. It was his option to restore his own honor with Arasaka. But he failed at that, which only leaves him one option and that's why he's been reading these poems.

[@zDemoGODz]

@@matfax trust me his honor is restored. If you dont count the players actions (because the player always influences the world more than realistically possible) he kinda single handedly saved Arasaka.

[@matfax]

@@zDemoGODz Japanese honor depends on completion. Either everything or nothing. It's possible that V is the final part that has to be dealt of. V is also a friend, so she has to do it willingly.

[@TheLikenessOfNormal]

@@matfax Not just that, Japanese honor also makes his actions make more sense. Him not visiting you in the clinic? Japanese honor because he doesn't want you to be seen in your state of weakness, at a low point. Him claiming Hanako wanted to help you? A lie, he got you into the SYS program but Japanese honor dictates that when you help a friend you claim the help came from another source so that they are not indebted to you, making your relationship and friendship unequal. It's a weird thing that's hard to really pick up on and the only reason I did is because of several videos here on YT where they have Japanese ex-Yakuza and a modern Samurai who practices bushido and swordsmanship go over a bunch of cultural movies and video games and explain those things explicitly. And what's funny is that this video is just evidence of something that happened historically of people mistaking the rigid politeness and stoicism as being cold or unfriendly.

[@williambigbills-9665]

I always saved Goro as a due paid as he saved V. Him killing himself at the end is similar to the choice that Hellman gives V, it lets Goro decide his fate rather than another person deciding it for you. But then I remember that Goro didn’t actually save our life he just didn’t kill us, cause it was actually Johnny who saved us from death.

[@TheBluePhantom]

Without the treatment from Vik, V surely would've flatlined chip or no chip, without goro taking V there v would've just died

[@maxpeul5944]

@@TheBluePhantom he could have called vic to go there?

[@CarrotConsumer]

If he hadn't went to find you another Arasaka stooge would have. So yeah I think he saved your life.

[@ezezezez5300]

@@maxpeul5944 he didn’t have the strength to until takemura gave him an airhypo

[@AtlisDe]

I still don't feel like suicide is definitive. He alludes to what samurais would do, but then adds he's not a samurai.

[@neo304]

Respect to the people who saved him just to do the solo ending 😂

[@bilelcousineau715]

you need to save him for the secret ending ?

[@RaphaelAmbrosiusCosteau51]

@@bilelcousineau715 no you don’t

[@neo304]

@@bilelcousineau715 nah just to see him watch Arasaka fall lol the most pettiest shit to do 😂

[@Petruhahamster]

He’s like bla bla bla burn in hell, yeah choom.. fk u too 😂

[@Rankbaajin]

Yeah....

[@genuinejustin6269]

Takemura is the Samurai in movies we all end up liking. And Takemura didn't exactly, "save" V. V came back to life thanks to Johnny and Takemura happened to be there while Dex showed him the location of his body.

[@فهميكتاني]

Yeah but without someone to deliver him to vik he would have died

[@EpisodeAceholla2011]

My sentiments exactly

[@janetlim]

@@فهميكتانيProbably not caused the assassin is going for Takemura. V is already being partially fixed by the relic in dumpster.

[@Cptn.Viridian]

I think Takemaru is genuine in his interactions with V. At first out of an indifference as a means to an end, (V is nothing more than evidence to him), but as he works with V, he begins to build a genuine bond with V, seeing his honorable and trustworthy side. I think by the ending, Takemaru is being completely honest with V, atleast as far as his perspective. While Goro knows Arasaka has done crimes, he also believes Arasaka has helped the world, like they have helped him, and in some roundabout messed up ways, Arasaka has. Takemaru's undying loyalty to Arasaka is not borne out of ignorance or malice, but out of a genuine belief that inspite of the atrocities committed, Arasaka is helping the world, as it has helped him, and as he believes it will help V.

[@krishnav5122]

I have a different take. When Takemura is on the run, he's not employed anymore. His sole goal is to return to Arasaka, prove his loyalty and get back to the arms of proverbial family. So he's so focused on it and since V is helping him get back, he's honest. Once he regained employment, his goal is to serve Arasaka and their interests. As a company man, he puts their interests above all else - including his. So, I believe he believes Arasaka lies OR if Hanaka told him that it's best for V to land in Mikoshi (as V couldnt tell anyone that Saburo is in Yorinobu body) - he didn't question it. He's NOT a friend because he doesn't ask questions to save V. Think about it, as soon as he realized Yorinobu might have killed Saburo (as the assassins attack them), his plan is to get back to Arasaka by any means. He interrrogated Anders Hellman, he finds so many people and so many things on his own in his pursuit to get back. But when it comes to try saving V, he doesn't ask Arasaka any questions and just blindly feeds the narrative to V. If he's a friend, he would be angry and questioning left and right - like how he behaved when he figured out Saburo was murdered.

[@justicebrown1077]

@@krishnav5122 Saburo wasnt his friend tho. Saburo was his *savior*. Cyberpunk has a lot of themes about savior complexes in the background. Saburo saving Takemura from the slums, Johnny being anti copro to "save" Night City from Arasaka, "Alt" saving the ghosts from Mikoshi, Yorinobu trying to "save" the world from Arasaka by destroying it from the inside, hell your entire story revolves around the themes of accepting death, and being saved from it, with the Devil ending being the one where V is "saved" by being trapped in Mikoshi. By and large though, these "saviors" are never actually saviors. They each have their own intentions, and motives. Johnny fought for Militech in the Corpo Wars instilling a deep hate for Arasaka and corps in general, Alt wants more ghosts likely to boost processing and prep for whatever the hell its planning next (like taking on NetWatch), Yorinobu would cause another Corpo War taking endless lives just to take down his fathers enterprise. None of these are good people, and none of their Crusades would have good outcomes in the short term. Maybe Arasaka (company) finally falling would be good for the short term of Night City but their absence would create a power vacuum for Militech, NightCorp or Biotechnica to take over, leading to another Master at the top. Alt getting a bunch of engrams would likely lead her to further establishing Ghost World or even take down the Blackwall, the latter being enough to cause another DataKrash. We know Johnny's nuke plan led to the Night City Holocaust, so instead of freeing Night City he just hurt its infrastructure badly while doing minimal damage to Arasaka. Anyways, I say all this because those who are saved by someone with a savior complex, tend to show more gratitude and dedication. I think its reasonable to say Takemura was our friend, to some degree, but he owes his life to Saburo. Thats a debt he will not, and can not ever repay. His dedication to Saburo overshadows any kinship or friendship Takemura will ever make. He's cognitively a corpo slave, and it should be read that way from the very beginning imo

[@JJokerMoreau]

@@krishnav5122 I disagree. If anything, he's proven himself to be an honorable person. In a medieval sense of the word of course, but there nonetheless.

[@deckkid101]

​@@krishnav5122we have more content from takemura, he was loyal to the bitter end

[@deckkid101]

​@@justicebrown1077you were 100% right, did you play the dlc yet?

[@RomeoEchoDelta]

I love how this game presents its characters and the events that happen. Yorinobu killing Saburo is an absolute positive for the world framed like a brutal injustice. In the lore for the table top games Yorinobu is more or less depicted as the Japanese/Arasaka equivalent to Johnny Silverhand. He actively tries to sabotage Arasaka interests once he finds out Saburo's intentions for him as an heir and for the world in general. Him killing Saburo, while not necessarily an altruistic act, could be considered the potential beginning of a redemption ark for the company, but V and Takemura can completely stop that in its tracks and return the dystopian status quo to its original state, and it's even presented as a positive outcome rather than the tragedy it is. It's brilliant writing all the way down and Takemura is an excellent part of that misdirection.

[@txbased1752]

This Is a very interesting view on it, great observation brother. That moment is like a tragedy that needed to happen for Arasaka to turn a new leaf possibly

[@fish4814]

Holy shit. Never had the thought cross my mind. Might have a point.

[@CircusofPython]

From what I remember it’s heavily implied that Yorinobu wasn’t a bad guy and was just trying to reform the company when you confront him in Hanako’s ending

[@Masochistickoala]

yeah in Hanako's ending he mentions something about himself being a kamikaze to take down Arasaka.

[@gerhardaryawardana72]

​​@@CircusofPython Not really reform, Yorinobu wants to kill Arasaka. The only reason he rejoined Arasaka was because he saw that even Johnny's nukes couldn't kill Arasaka. His conclusion was that Arasaka could only be killed by an insider. That's why he constantly poked Militech and NUSA government publicly as soon as he lead Arasaka, accusing them of killing Saburo. He was trying to start a war when Arasaka is in disarray to stack the deck against Arasaka. Unlucky for him, Militech and NUSA didn't take the bait. On top of that other changes he made while leading were intended to be bad for business and eventually kill Arasaka. Given time, Yorinobu would've succeeded. One way or another. Which is why in the Devil ending, once Saburo took Yorinobu's body, the first thing he did was to undo ALL changes made by Yorinobu, made peace with Militech, made peace with NUSA, and forged an alliance with NUSA. Yorinobu was the biggest threat Arasaka ever faced. Not Militech, not Morgan Blackhand, not Johnny Silverhand, not V. They can and did deal heavy blows to Arasaka through their separate actions. But none of them could kill deliver a killing blow. Not even V. Even after attacking Arasaka tower and destroying Mikoshi AND causing more political and financial damage to Arasaka than anyone ever had, V didn't manage to straight up kill Arasaka. It was in shambles and significantly weaker than ever, sure. But it's not dead, meaning it could eventually recover. Hanako's death might even change Yorinobu's mind, stopping him from going through with killing Arasaka. If not, V still didn't kill Arasaka. They just sped up/contributed to Yorinobu's overall plan. Yorinobu's original plans, if completed, would actually kill Arasaka. Nobody can stop it since the guy at the helm is the guy wanting to kill Arasaka. Plus, it wouldn't need the mass deaths of Arasaka employees that happen in any of V's non-sudoku ending. Sure, they would lose their jobs but they wouldn't get mass murdered by Alt and/or V.

[@Cornberry]

I wish there were an ending where Takemura could be made to see that there's more to life than Arasaka, but it also makes sense that that's the only life he CAN see. He was basically saved from destitution by Arasaka, so he has unbending loyalty to them. It's a sad fate. I really liked seeing him in Night City talking to the civilians. The comedian bit was so funny. My V will always save him, because he was a friend. I'm not mad that he tells me to rot in hell, I'm just sad he decides to take his own life for a corp.

[@TheLikenessOfNormal]

He doesn't commit seppuku in the DOFTR ending. I think part of the reason why is because that's not a betrayal. It's you doing the best action you can to save your life and he can't begrudge you for that, your not bringing anyone with you who has any motive about ruining Arasaka or doing more damage to them. And blame Mikoshi being destroyed on you? They can't, that was Alt you had nothing to do with it ;)

[@void-creature]

It's as he himself put it: "Can't teach an old dog new tricks"

[@Meowblivion]

@draiven730 I’m actually glad he isn’t. He’s old as shit

[@JuffBeezos]

Correction: There is no life without Arasaka. Filthy pleb.

[@jakespacepiratee3740]

@draiven730 why did they remove all the best stuff from this game lol

[@oceanbytez847]

I think the worst part of that ending is also that your choice doesn't really matter. They already have V, and they still can make an engram after death. They could also just force you as well. In the end V will join the secure your soul program with or without his consent.

[@garwynrosser8907]

I think takamura was lying about hanako forgetting V. If you reject the contract Hanako contacts you directly in the credits. It feels like a bluff to get V to sign up to Arasaka willingly.

[@cristinamaurras9184]

I'm not sure. I always thought that the sentence, was a little mistake made by developers due a little time they had to finish the game. ;)

[@CaidicusProductions]

@@cristinamaurras9184 I thought of it more like a figure of speech, like "an ex-girlfriend moving on from a boyfriend" sort of thing. She, of course, remembers and or knows who you are, overseas the formalities of your "treatment", etc, but she doesn't have any special feeling of gratitude or hate towards you. You're a blip in her otherwise ridiculously busy schedule. I also think that Goro DOES in fact care about V. Why not visit, during the time you're on the station? Why not call? I'm not sure why it would be hard to imagine. He was and is likely VERY busy as the current state of Arasaka, not to mention his roles within it, are likely extremely hectic and busy right now. There might be so much that we, the player, don't see about Goro's current state of life which could explain him not coming to us sooner.

[@twinodoom]

V's became nothing more than the Relic to her

[@CarrotConsumer]

​@@CaidicusProductions Plus V is on a space station. Not exactly a convenient visit.

[@3vilSuperman]

Yep, they want V to be the new and improved Adam Smasher. That's why they want V to sign paperwork that makes V their property, so they can own V like they own Smasher.

[@totalishnc]

I never even considered that saving Takemura was a possibility. I thought he either was already dead or he would be able to survive on his own.

[@kevmatteo]

Same for me, I would’ve saved him if I knew

[@lifeimitatingdeath3608]

Same

[@Madmanpapak]

It’s amazing how much game this game has in it. If you jump back up to the third floor you can save him. I did that on my second play through because I also didn’t know I could save him on the first!

[@ThatGuy-tx4vm]

it isn't a big loss ultimately. Takemura is an evil man and deserves death.

[@blackhand9581]

The problem with Takemura is exactly why people like him: He is loyal. Extremely loyal. Brought about by him growing up with Arasaka giving him everything he needed to survive. Loyal to the point that if Saburo told him to burn an orphanage with the kids still inside and gut the ones that survived, he would do it and wouldn't bat an eye. Because he firmly believes in the man that runs the company that gave him a better life. He is the textbook definition of what a fanatic, having been told that Arasaka is good and can do no wrong from such a young age, and you don't need a deep analysis to know that. He will and always will be Arasaka's faithful, loyal, obedient b!tch.

[@JohnSmith-ls3um]

Tywin: What killed your father? Arya: Loyalty.

[@harlowethrombey7665]

Reed and Takemura are a lot alike.

[@Just-A-Gamer1524]

Idk, when in the space station and V points out about Saburo coming back in the body of his son, Takemura hesitates before giving a lame excuse of not judging them. While I do think he follows orders without much complaint, if any at all, I also think he does know the morally bad choices Arasaka makes.

[@harlowethrombey7665]

@@Just-A-Gamer1524That’s true. And I think there’s a parallel with Reed and SongBird. He knows the way SongBird is used by the President is wrong, but he goes along with it.

[@atomskthepirateking2776]

He is extremely loyal to Saburo to the point he makes morally questionable choices but to say he would burn down a school of children without batting an eye is just plain wrong.

[@-V-_-V-]

6:50 these statements don't necessarily show conflicting stories. It could have gone this way: Arasaka Dept calls Goro and says "V is dying" He calls Hanako and says something to the effect of "hey Hanako I gave this guy my word we could help him" and also learns at this point she doesn't remember him. She says "okay Goro I'll do you a favor put him in mikoshi."

[@GILl3ERTO]

A little advice. If you want all the ending achievements in one playthrough save him

[@grumpyitcushmeta4riaproduc189]

Exactly what I was thinking.

[@GILl3ERTO]

@@grumpyitcushmeta4riaproduc189 lol I learned the hard way

[@SenorBigDong69]

Ah yes, my preferred way to play a story driven RPG. Following a list of all the choices I have to make to optimize for achievements, then cruise controlling through the rest of the game.

[@josecmch98]

@@SenorBigDong69 that’s why he said “IF” read carefully next time before you rant

[@grismatics]

@@SenorBigDong69 idk man let them play it however they want... it ain't hurting any of us that they play the game in a way that we find undesirable

[@ZephyrusAsmodeus]

It really sucks but it's true, Goro was a surprisingly good character through the whole story on my initial run, I remember speaking about a cat we saw while waiting on a building construction site, we talked about how it could have been a cat demon, an omen, at the time. We talked about where he came from, we got pizza despite his initial distaste of the idea, and Johnny laid back and listened until he couldn't take any more and cast himself off the building. Goro texted me about it later; a picture and s message, closed with a cat emote ^o.o^ I defended him when Johnny talked shit, I told either Judy or Panam he was an exception of what suit types were. I liked his weird code he talked in and the way he spoke of things in a cool and nuanced way, citing history, culture, and people of the past. That ending credit remark was such a punch in the gut, a reminder that even when you grow close to someone, know them, beleive they know you, value you and your perspective on things, when you know that you've made a mark on someone, some core ideals, some fundamental part of them, no matter how much you might beleive otherwise, sometimes can never be changed. Night City is a forge fueled by unmet potentials, hopes and dreams, a crucible, and no matter what shape someone takes in it, it's the core that remains no matter how chipped and warped the blade may become. Goro will always be a company man because it is the company that forged his core. I can't help but wonder whether his sudden outburst and turning on me wasn't a form of coping mechanism, too. How much easier would it be to deal with the death of a newfound friend if you convince yourself, goad yourself to be angry with them, see their agency as betrayal so you can live with losing them when they soon die. Maybe my death would come softer as an example, rather than another glimpse of hope snuffed out. I don't know.

[@xYOMOMA65x]

It really fucking sucks, I think this way in real life - never had a friend "circle", and usually keep new friends at an arms length. I'd rather smoke at home and be with my girl and my games. Fuck this planet.

[@antonioc.5778]

Bro it's a game, there's no "we" I know you are role-playing but it's so cringe lol

[@sindri1447]

@@antonioc.5778 nah you're cringe. Allow people to live vicariously through stories. It literally has no effect on you. "What is a man, but the sum of his memories? We are the stories we live, the tales we tell ourselves." -Words that I live by. TLDR: fork off

[@G59METH]

​@@antonioc.5778he's saying we because you control V and everyone choses different dialogue options

[@WamHamClam]

@@antonioc.5778ur so wrong

[@civil-.7407]

I actually listened to Johnny my first play through and just assumed you couldn’t save him lol

[@MrTomcus1234]

There is an email next to second sniper during parade mission detailing how "secure your soul" has only 50% success rate.

[@suntzu4607]

In my first playthrough, I didn't know I can save him since I kinda panicked when the building was ambushed and just ran for my life thinking he will get out with Hanako.

[@bc1176]

Same here

[@DJMarcO138]

Same...also since I had fallen 2 or 3 floors down, I didn't even know that you COULD get to him, much less tried to.

[@bc1176]

@@DJMarcO138 it was that paired with Johnny saying to leave him he's already dead that made me think it wasn't even an option. There really should've been an indicator there

[@dillonkeller4477]

I ended up saving him because I was just curious if the game would let me jump back up through the hole lol

[@davidmink6686]

Same....I saved em on the next go around.

[@Fixti0n]

I always save Goro, he may be a corpo dog, but he is loyal and honorable, and he did save our live after the heist. I agree that he is only doing it to further his own goals, but how much of that are we doing as well? We only go down into that BD den to save Evelyn because she knows who hired us to grab the chip, we only help Panam get her car back because she will help us get the guy who made said chip, V is also only helping Goro get to Hanako because of our own self interest, to say that we are so much better then Goro is hypocrisy unless we act better then him, saving his ass when we have nothing to gain from it, just because we are chooms who went trough some shit together, that is how we truly become better then him, not by doing the exact same thing he would have done.

[@zarenboug5410]

I disagree and believe nobody in Arasaka can be trusted except for maybe Yorinobu, because he's trying to destroy Arasaka corp from within. Goro is a brainwashed fool doing nothing without the permission of his masters. He'd betray us in a second if Saburo orderd it. I also disagree about V being the same as Goro, because he actually helps his friends during the sidequests, apart from the main mission.

[@EveeV9]

@@zarenboug5410 I agree your statement. I'd say there's a pretty big gap between the two's approach towards assisting and acquiring assistance from others

[@jenc2513]

I do it to get XP

[@Olis4897]

Tbh ya I save him, but only really because I pity him and hope he gets the chance to free himself from mental slavery. Also it’s because of his original loyalty that V cannot trust him to open his eyes to the things Arasaka is capable of, like bringing Saburo back in Yorinobu’s body. Also as far as judging V. This is a more complex topic because V is what we make of them. The choices we make as players if the game. If we don’t help people then ya you’re right it’s hypocritical, but we have many opportunities to be loyal and generous with many characters.

[@dergraf9718]

@@Olis4897 doesn't he just kills himself at the end?

[@awashington8447]

I have no illusions about Goro, but I always saved him because he's such a likable character lol However, to be fair, I also *Never* side with Hanako either. He "helped" me, so Im always willing to help him to a point. After I get him back in good graces with Hanako my life debt is repaid, so he's on his own after that 🤷🏾‍♂️

[@srsgoblin]

I'm with you. Saving Takemura is the thing I do for my own soul and morality. It speaks to my choices as a human.

[@burniejarvis9298]

That's my method. I always prefer to burn everything to the ground in my revenge then give Johnny the body.

[@lokith1562]

It's fair to go either way with this. You saved him 'in theory' by shooting at the guys on the bikes, then you save him again by 'knowing' a ripper doc you can count on, then you save him yet again, by getting ahold of Del the AI cab driver, to get a way from point A to point B. Goro owes you at this point... and let's not forget that he robs us of the satisfaction of removing Dex from the equation yourself, while using you to achieve his own form of 'revenge' which is also ill-fated. I don't know, I think it can go either way and karmically you're in the clear.

[@mar.c1]

So is there any ending in this game where Arasaka DOESNT win? Side with Hanako and her dad gets his sons body and is immortal, in other endings the son just stays reigning the corporation or?

[@BGomez-tk7lu]

@@mar.c1 Corpos always win in the end. Johnny and his team nuked Arasaka just for him to be 'revived' years later to find out the tower had been rebuilt.

[@net_spider]

As far as I know the man doesn't betray you and even if he's hiding stuff from you, the guy's honest to his word. In Night City, I think thats worth something at least. Even with the sketchyness of his ending, I think he truly believes this would be the best way to help you... making you the property of his employer is just a bonus.

[@lionchamp777]

What's interesting as well is the "certainty" that Arasaka gives that V is definitely a definitely going to die, down to describing how they'll spend their last moments. What's been clear throughout the game is that nothing like this has ever happened to anyone on record. So their foreknowledge about V's ultimate fate is also extremely suspect

[@AndrooUK]

Well, they have experience of chips and skulljacking and whatever. It's not unreasonable that they could extrapolate an outcome, especially with supercomputers and extremely advanced AI, plus the death V already had, and selfdiagnostics and whatever from the biochip.

[@Yorushima]

The circumstances may be somewhat unique to V but if you think of it, the diagnosis isn't too different from cases of organ mismatch in modern times, when a transplanted organ isn't compatible with your body. I'm not a well-versed medical expert on this end, but it is possible that the symptom description isn't too far off from the rejection process in such a case. What makes it suspicious isn't the "how could you possibly know?", it's the "why are you telling me this?". Pragmatically, if V had no value remaining post-op, Arasaka would be better off saying "you're cured, grats, we're done, here's a shuttle back home" and then ghost V when the deadly aftereffects do occur. Them not doing so means there is a benefit to keeping V under Arasaka's control, which is self-explanatory. On that note, I do remember that if you opt to go home instead of sign up for SYS, Hanako sends a message in the end credits asking if you'd be interested in doing jobs for her. It's possible that even after saying no, Arasaka still remains interested in acquiring you.

[@yuyaplays9311]

I agree that Arasaka really wants v's engram not just for research purposes. V shows incrediple skill beyond all of their ow cybernetically enchanced warriors even the best of the best in Goro,Oda and Adam smasher. If they every find a way to bring V back that would give them a combat asset unlike any they had before. Keeping V not only helps their engram research but also gives them a soldier they could call up whenever they wanted (once they found a suitable body that is) that could likely complete almost any assignment given to them.

[@Asghaad]

pretty much this, V at that point is literally capable of walking in the front door of Arasaka tower, wipe the floor with an army of goons AND the best of the best they can muster - something NOONE else could do - then bit*hslap a LEGENDARY warrior killing machine Adam Smasher like a toddler all the while basically having a stroke ... true essence of "one man army" LEGEND its very much doubtful that Arasakas would fail to realize the potential of such an asset and fail to secure the loyalty and services of an individual that capable. also one thing i kinda see a problem with is that they all focus way too much on ORGANIC body ... once the consciousness is transferred to a relic it should be relatively easy to be put into a completely mechanical body - an AI driving a mech would be SO much easier to accomplish although so should be cloning a new body copy from the originals DNA, this part of story is not very well thought out because if Saburo could just take over his sons body just because "DNA compatibility" a complete body clone would be no problem... just tell V to wait in "storage" for the clone to mature (or put his Relic into a mech for the time being - basically Adam Smasher 2.0 with less psychotic tendencies and MUCH more capable)

[@Sorain1]

There is a horrifying future possibility of Arasaka's latest prototype program being 'Type V' assault cyborgs. Which everyone outside the program assumes means type five, and we the audience know better. Considering just how omnidisplinary V can be, that really is horrifying to contemplate. To the tune of 'One Corp, One Type V.'

[@yuyaplays9311]

@@Sorain1 For sure there is a very high possibility that with V's relic Arasaka has the means to create the ultimate army to fight for it. I am sure they could find a way to only take the parts of V they need from the engram such as their combat experience and so on while removing all of her original memories. How effective such a soldier would be without those memories is questionable because it is part of those memories that drives V forward. However once the clone or copy of V starts getting its own memories it will obtain its own motivations.

[@nautdead3197]

My head canon is the they do eventually bring V back and V becomes a new Arasaka boogeyman. Fuck with saka they'll send V

[@di_kid00]

And like what that Arasaka agent talking to Lizzy’s beau, they can adjust personality, clip traits, add them. And to say V is nothing makes it seem like he’s lucky to be in this program. Like Dan said. Even as a fan of Takemura, he is brainwashed and was trained by the Arasakas since he was a child. It would have been best for him to die by the hands that fed him.

[@extrageneity]

I agree that V should never take Arasaka's offer. I disagree that V should abandon Takamura. Takamura is an honorable man working for an honorless (not even dishonorable, simply incapable of evaluating things in terms of honor and dishonor) corporation. Saving him, then refusing his offer and then turning on his employer in the course of dying for greater principles, is an act of heroism. Principled but doomed heroism, as a form of iterative feedback against the crushing corruption of late stage capitalism, is the greatest thing anyone can achieve in Cyberpunk, and Takemura is the man best equipped to witness it. He hates you in the ending credits because he knows that, in your way, you are more of a samurai than he is. Making him live with that knowledge is the single most deeply moral decision the game lets you make.

[@jackieclan815]

​@@alternativeschool7431yeah for real

[@OeM61]

i agree

[@Sean-ur4cb]

Well said, never thought of the ending in that way

[@jackieclan815]

@@alternativeschool7431 exactly

[@xxkildarxx]

@@alternativeschool7431 Fingers is scum and I kill him every play through but you can't pretend that killing him is not going to create worse outcomes for the people that have no other ripperdoc who they can work with. It is likely that I create far more suffering then I solve when I kill him.

[@ph-1012]

with the revelation that surgical intervention is possible to remove the relic in the tower ending (and the fact that arasaka made it so it should be even easier to remove for them) there's a fair chance they deliberately wanted to take V's engram for themselves for some reason rather then save his body, maybe use him as a new enforcer on a leash like smasher was or just for research purposes.

[@Shauny7488]

to be fair, the surgical intervention was only possible thanks to a shackled AI, which Arasaka dont have

[@Matt-bg5wg]

The whole save Goro thing reminded me a lot of the save Paul Denton part of Deus Ex. The game actually tries to push you towards running and leaving them to die, but if you stay and fight they survive and remain in the game.

[@garwynrosser8907]

Same with the crashed vita bird. If you stay you can save the pilot.

[@monkeycat451]

@@garwynrosser8907 You mean Malik in Human Revolution, right?

[@batmanpop0031]

I never knew you could save goro until like a month ago

[@ReplicatorFifth]

Same in Human Revolution. You can stay and fight to save the pilot Malik but the game gives no hint that’s an option pushing you to run

[@LordButtsauce]

@Maurizio Corradi all you have to do is get to 0 hp before paul can and he'll survive. it's a bit harder than it sounds so it's not a bad idea to make a save right before entering the hotel

[@6thhistory]

You are on some kind of hot take rampage right now!

[@somerandom6883]

And we here for it.

[@everett818]

They may be hot takes, but they're right

[@magnificumdominum4229]

@@everett818 no

[@Deathball9999]

This is amazing. I didn't even know you could save him. 4 playthroughs later and every time I just left him there.

[@heychrisfox]

Just as an aside, you don't have to go crazy and throw a tantrum in The Devil ending. If you don't react to any of the aggressive prompts at the end, you see that the testing on you is successful rather than a failure. It doesn't change much by the time Takemura/Hellman show up, but it's a thing more people probably don't notice since they're inclined to click buttons when a prompt comes on the screen rather than being patient and following directions.

[@dillonkeller4477]

Yeah for my first playthrough I'm triggering all optional dialogue, and next time I'm gonna do none of it

[@xanatricebass2741]

But what does the successful testing mean

[@heychrisfox]

@@xanatricebass2741 They're testing you in the scene to see if they successfully got the engram out of you. This involves various psych studies. If you react patiently instead of aggressively, you eventually solve the Rubik's cube, suggesting that their efforts to make sure your mind is healthy worked.

[@trevalyan006]

What I love is that the success can be interpreted two ways. The negative way is that V loves Big Brother, fully submitting to corporate control of life and prosperity in exchange for maybe getting crumbs. The good interpretation is V Interrupted, where V stops being a thieving rebel and simply works to become a better and more focused person.

[@futuza]

@@trevalyan006 I'd argue there's also a 3rd option, V had just learned to be sneaky and mask who they really are from Corps.

[@ssilentmedia]

About the whole "slip of a tongue". I honestly do not think it was a slip. Both things he said can be true at the same time. The way I see it is that the clinic contacted him and when he heard about what happened she went to Hanako, but Hanako basically already forgot about V and if not for Takemura to remind her, she would have not remembered. Please note that he said that Hanako agreed to V entering the program. If it was really a slip up, he would have said that Hanako proposed that. If she had to agree, then it means someone else must have proposed it to her and the someone else most likely must have been Takemura. To recap things. Clinic calls Takemura > Takemura goes to Hanako but Hanako already forgot V > Takemura makes the proposition > Hanako agrees > Takemura comes to visit V Also, as for the whole "not buying it" when it comes to Takemura reasoning that V is a nobody for the Arasakas I honestly do not think it makes sense 'cuz if Arasaka wanted V's engram, they could have gotten it at any time by force. Heck, not even by force. They could have put V to sleep without us knowing and plugged us into the machine while we were sleeping. There was no need to go through all of this. And please remember that if V wants to leave the station and die on earth, V can. If V's engram was so important to them, they would have never let V leave the station.

[@Deadhessian]

With V's engram unimportant to Arasaka and the "uniqueness" of V since the Relic Chip, chances rise for Mikoshi beeing ultimately prison forever for V-->bad deal.

[@buyhighselllow9305]

Imo, the whole charade of keeping you on the station, testing you and keeping you isolated was a plan by the Hanako and maybe Saburo to make V willingly give themselves to the relic program. Maybe so they can use a V engram to replace a now defeated Adam Smasher. It's noted that in the Lizzy Wizzy quest that Arasaka can't completely rewrite a person's psych, so turning V into an engram just after saving Arasaka would make V feel betrayed and unwilling to work with them. Both Takemura and Hellman say "Hanako has forgotten you," but with Takemura's slip up, and if you reject the deal to be an engram, Hanako calls you up to offer you work, it's most likely a strategy to isolate V, to make them feel as they have no choice but to become an engram.

[@ssilentmedia]

@@buyhighselllow9305 then why in that slip Takemura said that she agreed? If it was her idea she wouldn't have had to agree with her. Then that means the idea came from someone else. Also, how about the fact that they let you leave the station without any strings attached? Ok, they failed getting V onto their side but do you really think Arasak would let such an important piece of technology leave? They could have gotten it by force and use it for tests and experiments. The very fact that they actually let you leave disapproves the theory that it was a trap/prison.

[@buyhighselllow9305]

@@ssilentmedia Sure they let you leave no strings attached, but then in the eyes of Arasaka you'll become a none issue in about 6 months so it's no lose to them. You could forcibly imprison V for experimentation but what would you discover? R&D takes time, and locking the most dangerous solo in NC isn't going to speed things up in the short 6 month window. It's just safer to let V go and die somewhere that's out of Arasakas hair. Also as I forgot to say, that Arasaka didn't know that V's body was rejecting them, non of the endings do. When Hanako agrees to let V into the relic program, it probably wasn't their plan A on securing V as an Arasaka asset, but this was a very helpful tool for them to isolate V and make them feel that this is the only option for survival. And regardless of who visits you in the devil ending, the contract will always say that you'll become the property of Hellman, the lead researcher behind the relic program and a now ally to Hanako.

[@ssilentmedia]

​@@buyhighselllow9305 oh boy. i don't even know where to start. 1. do you really think Arasaka would have let V leave without any string attached? We are talking about the same company who said it would nuke the city of anything happened to Johnny's engram. I'm asking you again, do you really think they would let that unique piece of technology just walk out the door? 2. do you really think Arasaka couldn't get their hands on V if they wanted? yes, an alive body would have been nice for tests to see how the engram affects the body in real time but if they really wanted that, they would have kept V alive for as much as possible on the station (after feeding V lies). They wouldn't have taken V directly to the soul killer machine as soon as V agreed. But that's considering the fact they wouldn't outright kill V, use soul killer on V against V's will (like they did with Jonny) and then study the body and the engram. They don't really need V alive for that so your argument of them trying to imprison V for 6 months is nothing. 3. How can you say stuff like "Arasaka didn't know that V's body was rejecting them" when they clearly say the fact that V can't be saved because the engram modified V's body too much? They literally tell you the same the same thing. Because V's body was modified too much by the engram, V can't stay in her body and quickly finding a new body for V would also be hard 'cuz V has no relatives. I really don't understand why you would say that when it was clearly stated in both this video and the game. 4. Do you really think Arasaka wouldn't offer the same contract to EVERYONE? After all, why wouldn't they want to have powerful and influential people on their side? 5. I really don't understand your logic. you claim that Arasaka would do all these evil things just to get V because they are utterly evil and can't be trusted BUT you ignore all the other MORE evil things they could have done to get V. If Arasaka wanted V, they would have already gotten her. Truth is, Arasaka could have done much more evil things to get V, but they didn't and let V go without any string attached. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not defending Arasaka and I agree, they are Evil as fuck but if you really think they wouldn't have taken V by force while she was out in space and they wouldn't give her the same contract as they give to everyone then my friend, I'm sorry to say this but you are really really naive.

[@lotllady]

Takemura's send-off in the other endings make sense when you consider (spoiler alert) in both endings you ruin Arasaka. In the suicide ending, at least, Delamain can tell you the company is floundering and will likely go under. Considering you are either entirely or partly responsible for the destruction of everything he spent his whole life reaching for, it's understandable he'd be pissed at you.

[@Zayphar]

This video completely changed the way I deal with Takamura. I hang around in order to scrape up some XP by wacking minions, but I don't actually go into the room to save the guy.

[@machopi]

'don't do this, don't do that' you ain't my mom, i'll do what i want!

[@augustomatt]

Wow...what a grown up you are...

[@pancake4061]

I feel like Takemura might have been lied to in the ending, because he's very open and honest with his intentions and loyal, but I think he's misguided. Of course he'll hate you if you destroy everything that he stood for, but it's entirely possible that Arasaka told him your engram would be protected and he was just telling you what he thought was the truth.

[@Mode-Selektor]

Something that makes me think that Arasaka isn't just out to imprison V is that if you decide to not sign the contract, you can actually just leave. If Arasaka really wanted V, they could just make an engram forcibly.

[@davidmcguire6043]

No, everything is exactly as he says it is there are no hidden tricks here if arasaka wanted V there's nothing that we could do to stop them. They would not be offering options or trying to trick him. They would just strap him down, suck his soul out and be done with it.

[@porkcutlet3920]

@@Mode-Selektor Exactly, there's no point in giving V the choice at all. If they want to deal with V, they could easily not treat them or just use soul killer.

[@weepo2651]

True I mean they pretty much did that to Johnny so who’s to say if Arasaka really wanted that they could of done it

[@gurugeorge]

Yeah I agree with what people are saying here. Contrary to Big Dan's point, it's highly likely that the Arasaka offer is just as it appears, because there would be absolutely no point in offering the option of a contract or leaving if they had the secret intention of using his engram, making him a test subject, etc. - they could have just done that anyway. What would be the point of the contract/offer song and dance? There is none, unless it's genuinely what it appears to be.

[@kayinoue2497]

NGL I love this. While Takemura is one of my favorite characters, I really think it's useful (AND IMPORTANT) to unmask how some of these characters manipulate us, the player, in the moment. A LOT of RPG characters and companions do this (think Anders in Dragon Age 2 as a prime example). The more we interact with these situations in games clear-eyed, I think the better prepared we will be to examine our real life (albeit less extreme) relationships and connections with people when weighing "why are they saying this, is this actually true, and what are their motivations".

[@LynxNGB]

Johnny included even though he had a change in mind he was still living through v

[@NightDocs]

Something ominous you missed during the part where he says “I will show you real food” is the beginning where V asks if they’ll see each other again, Takemura replies with a very neutral sounding “I believe that we will.” Now weigh that with the fact that we discover that Arasaka recovered Jackie’s engram after his death… 👀

[@juanmccoy3066]

They created Jackie's engram (not recovered it. Soul killer doesent download ur "soul". It creates a 70% realistic copy of you.) They created the engram for the same reason they created the johnny and the alt engram. So they could interrogate them.

[@HikaruKatayamma]

Takamura didn't defy Arasaka. He reported that he found the murderer and was outlawed by Oda to hide the truth of Saboro's death. Ultimately he was following his duty as honor demanded in protecting his boss by catching his killer. The ending where he says to rot in hell is due to V destroying Arasaka, which is his home and family. You'd probably feel the same way if someone destroyed your home and life.

[@majorkusanagi2406]

Oda? It was Yurinobu.

[@HikaruKatayamma]

@@majorkusanagi2406 Thanks for the correction. That's what happens when I post something while half asleep. :D

[@RyANWaLlEt]

Yeah, Arasaka is Takemura's life. They picked him out of the slums and made him an actual human being in the world, gave him a full set of body modifications for his loyalty and rewarded him even further for it. I can't imagine it's easy to turn your back on the people who made you who you are, for better or worse, and Takemura- despite Yorinobu- never loses his loyalty for Arasaka and the people in it who made him who he is

[@yeetnessthegreater1298]

It’s not home or life if they tried killing you and casting you out

[@genkureshima9834]

He's a fanatic, that's the long and the short of it. I didn't know I could save Takemura in my first and recently completed playthrough, will definitely save him in the second but not to help him. He "saves" V's life, V saves his. Debt repaid, even if his intention was to use V from the start, kind of like John Wick 4 when talking about debts which don't lie only in formalities like the "markers" used in-universe.

[@zaxreg6418]

To me the paths where you save takemura but don't really associate with him after are best, simply because v gets to repay him for saving his/her life and all debts to each other are cleared and both can move forward in their own paths separate of each other

[@getmoneygamer9540]

Naw, I'll would of left him to die. Fuck paying him back.

[@elwiwi4638]

then he kills himself

[@FentonGib]

You return him saving your life by saving his - and you repay him smacking you when you first asked him for help by burning Arasaka down around him. Very gratifying. Yes, I held that grudge. lol

[@blunthonesty8633]

That's what I think. "You saved my life. I saved yours. That makes us even Takemura." He kind of grew on me but when I saw his attitude towards Hanako I felt that he would always put Arasaka first. No matter whet the situation.

[@FentonGib]

@@blunthonesty8633 agreed. His advice to you about bowing your head to one of greater status indicates he'll never change. Whilst I do think he gets to care about V in his own way, he is unable to change from being anything other than an Arasaka loyalist for a usurped faction.

[@CosmicOwlChild]

Having him talk to me at the station. Had me actually going crazy. I felt the tension the suspension and the full blown anxiety. It was wild. Loved it

[@ninaa4192]

The only reason I followed through with the Arasaka story was Goro. When he talked to V about signing up for Secure Your Soul, my V did because Goro said he'd be there when she woke up: When V asks if she'll see him again, he says "I believe so. Visit me in Kugawa and I will show you what real food is." Regardless of how their relationship started, by the end of the Arasaka story I genuinely think Goro came to care for V and vice versa.

[@JosieJOK]

I never save him anymore, much as I love the character. It was great to save him when I did The Devil ending, but in all other endings it’s not worth it: you don’t get to work with him anymore, and he hates you.

[@Azaghal1988]

He hates you and kills himself at the end, so it's a wasted effort.

[@SuperMurray2009]

@@Azaghal1988 wym he kills himself?

[@Kounnah]

@@SuperMurray2009 he alludes to doing so, As in his final call he talks about how Disgraced Samurais would write a poem before commiting seppuku (ritual suicide to retain honor in death). Then instead of vowing for revenge for destroying Arasaka he just tells you to go to hell. Heavily paraphrased but I hope I got most of the key points right

[@januszkurahenowski2860]

@@SuperMurray2009 Maybe he thinks so because he is talking about Sepukku in that ending speech? He describes what Samurais did when commiting seppuku and how they would write those death poems but since he is not a samurai he will just say "burn in hell whore" to V as his "death poem". Tbh it makes some sense that he'd do so since it's a great shame for him as Saburo's personal bodyguard to let V attack Arasaka, kill hundreds of their men and not complete the plan of bringing Saburo back to life. He is commiting seppuku like a samurai who has failed to protect his master

[@MShazarul]

@@SuperMurray2009 He spoke about jisei, a death poem prior to samurai suicide insinuating he will commit seppuku. His death poem follows 'Rot in hell"

[@stevengucum]

It is worth noting that from Goro's perspective this programm might actually seem good for V. He believes in Arasaka, it is the only thing he got after all. Moreover, there is nothing else he can do to save V

[@dillonkeller4477]

Yeah when he was like 'I believe Arasaka will take care of you' I was like... what about the past few weeks/months would possibly lead you to that conclusion

[@generik7414]

In a way, he's similar to Alt, who knows V in their own body WILL die if returned to their own body, but Johnny won't. Johnny, of course, disagrees, probably both because he wanted to go with her himself but more likely because he either knows or thinks he knows what's beyond the blackwall

[@magni5648]

@@generik7414 Johnny doesn't wanna keep Vs body at that point because all of this was to give V his/her life back and it'd feel like a betrayal to him. Remember the motel scene in Pacifica, when Johnny tells V he'll take the bullet for them? It's him staying true to that.

[@ohauss]

@@generik7414 The whole issue of V dying in their own body makes no sense whatsoever. It was just about the worst idea the writers could come up with, and the fact that we here have a bodyguard lecturing V on what the issue will do to his body is just about the level of idiocy this plot device is at - someone with no biomedical training whatsoever pretending they can assess the issue. There's no way even for the body itself to do what they claim it does, guided by a chip or not, nor is there a necessity to do that simply for storing another personality. It's a writer not understanding the difference between immunological self and personality.

[@Hifuutorian]

@@ohauss First of all, we have absolutely no idea where someone's personality and consciousness comes from or the specifics of how Soulkiller and engrams even work. Second of all, even 'hard' sci-fi is full of shit. Its all made-up bullshit in the end. Its a perfectly fine idea that makes sense within the universe and poses interesting philosophical questions that encourage introspection about the nature of your own existence and what it truly means to be yourself. Is Johnny-the-engram still Johnny-the-person from all that time ago? If he's changed and isn't the same as he was, whether its because of Arasaka meddling with his mind or because of his presence in V's, is he still himself despite that? Or is he just a very fancy computer program, and there is a fundamental difference between that and true human consciousness? Do you believe you're killing two people if you commit suicide, like Misty says you would be? Is V even still truly themselves, given what the engram did to their mind already? What choice would you make if you thought you had a way to 'fix it'? If V and Johnny ARE different, are they still not themselves regardless? Would you play it safe and sell your soul, betraying everything you believe in and those who are close to you? Do you risk it all, including the people you care about in a desperate last-ditch effort, and if so, whose loved ones do you put on the line? Or do you choose to accept your own death(s, if you believe Johnny is still his own person), believing that it would be better to choose it for yourself and being truly at peace and accepting of it? There's tons and tons of deep questions to think about, that even with how flawed the game is, still poses to you. The only idiocy comes from certain people who are way too up their own ass that they mistake what is actually fucking important in a story because they can't see the forest through the trees of how much they think they know. Whether that be details about a purely fictitious world, or what they think they know about the real one.

[@TheFsalazar23]

i didn't even know that saving him was an option lol... once i saw the rubble land on him and johnny says "forget it that guy is toast".. I agreed and bounced :D

[@BR-bd1nv]

Goro only having interest in V to further his own interest is no different than most characters in game. Even V’s assistance at times is linked to personal interest. It’s not like the fixers or even Johnny help out because they value V. As for tricks to get V to sign the contract seem’s kinda subtle for Arasaka. They have full access to an unarmed V seems as if they could just send a team in and just take what they want. Even something a less aggressive like doing it during one of those routine test without telling V at all.

[@Snipergoat1]

See that's what OP seems to overlook. It's dog eat dog. Goro may not be a friend but he shares many of the same enemies. In Night City sharing enemies makes someone a friend, for a time anyway.

[@TheoRae8289]

I mean that's what happened with both Johnny and Alt. Arasaka took their souls by force: Johnny with turning him into an engram, and Alt when they soul killed her outright and she became one with the Net.

[@lostseeker88]

@@TheoRae8289 Alt died because Johnny pulled the plug while she was in the net. In the source material for the game it explains it more she was in the middle of making her escape had stolen money from arasaka wiped her files from their servers and taken out most of the techs in the area and was about to pull out and make an escape leave the country and get a face swap. Johnnys rescue ended up being her demise.

[@TheoRae8289]

@@lostseeker88 Oh shit. Thank you so much for CP2020 explanation!

[@MrRavmoor]

The only reason I tried to save him the first time is because I remembered Deus Ex where JC Denton can save his brother even though the game tells you otherwise. For some reason it reminded me of that situation and I was so excited when I realized it worked :) Edit: Also, this theory makes little sense since if they wanted to engram V they could just do it when they were out. Nothing stopping them from forcing it but they just respect V's decision when they want to leave. Why bother convincing them? It makes no sense. The contract doesn't matter, they do illegal shit all the time. I don't buy this.

[@cryofever]

Literally

[@EdgeSky]

I'd say it is out of considerate from hanako and takemura, you save them, and although they wanted to use you, they still give you the choice whether to dance along with their wicked plan or not. and as mentioned, at the ending where takemura calls you, he regrets not convince you enough to go along with corporate plan and telling you to go fxck yourself.

[@franciscop1192]

Ooihh man of culture!!!!

[@NeoCreo1]

There are actually some dialogue trees in the Devil ending where you get through to him on some extent about how fucked Arakawa is, but he decides to stick with them out of loyalty despite that. There's even quite a bit of sad recognition of the situation in his response. I also don't blame him for his reaction in non-Devil endings, as every other ending has you screwing the company over royally and causing them SERIOUS damage. I'd say he does have a right to be pissed after saving you, even if he had his own reasons for it. I always let him die if not doing Devil, as letting him live just means he gets to see the company he's done everything for take a mortal blow from someone he assisted. Better for him to go out in a blaze of glory believing he's fighting to save the company.

[@Your-Least-Favorite-Stranger]

I would say put yourself in Goro's shoes: Arasaka saves you from a life of poverty and squalor, raises you, feeds you, teaches you, instills a sense of morals and morality, gives you purpose. You go your whole life believing they're good - then something happens to shatter that. You think it's your fault, you failed and thats why this thing happened - then you hear a ludicrous story that further insults the company you've looked to as greater than a family your entire life. Through multiple experiences and confirmations you realize that yeah, this company that saved you is really shady - they did right by you and you owe everything to them, but you sold your life to them so long ago you'd basically lose everything if you abandoned them. You could function in the larger world using what you've been taught, but it would be hollow - Arasaka isnt just employment, but stability and the comfort of acting without the full weight of responsibility which going solo brings. So long as Arasaka does it or condones it, then it's right - having been stripped of Arasaka for a time, Goro had a chance to taste his own humanity again. He met a two-bit thief who turned out to be a much bigger player than he ever realized; he saw the resilience of people struggling to get by yet still preferring that over Arasaka, he tasted horrible food that reaffirmed the quality of life Arasaka provides, and on some level he refuses to directly face he did warm up to V. There's a schism going on in Goro that I don't think gets enough attention: he's in way too deep and he knows it, he says himself that you cant teach an old dog new tricks. If he started over fresh outside Arasaka, he'd be miserable; he knows he isn't adaptable to the outside world despite his general adaptability (you can adapt to a situation knowing you don't have to stay there forever - leaving Arasaka though, he'd never know those comforts again). He'd have V, have the Nomads, maybe even be able to get back to Japan and find halfway decent food he can stomach - but it would be a life without purpose. A life where his every action is his own to suffer the consequences, where having to think and be considerate of others takes more precedence over completing the task at hand then returning to his daily duties (it's a lot easier to do a routine job you know in and out than deal with constantly changing variables, especially human variables). Goro requires routine, a standard to break himself against, a purpose, quality of life and above all else stability - life outside of Arasaka offers none of that despite his realization that Arasaka is shady. He goes with the bet he knows because, for him: that's the safe option. He can return to his daily routine, eat good food, have something to strive for, turn off his brain, and be content in being a tool - he doesn't have the courage or capacity to be anything but a tool at the end of the day because that's what he was molded to be, and he knows it. He knows it isn't right, he knows V deserves better, he knows had he the power to control the outcome: He would have honored his promises to V, but he put his trust in the company he keeps telling himself is right, good, honorable in everything it does. Takemura is blinded by his dedication and it tears him up inside every time they fail to uphold the basics he had drilled into him from early on - maybe even in the end he won't be able to enjoy his time back at Arasaka. He wants to remain friends with V despite everything because he feels guilty all the work to save his life was for nothing - he can only resign himself to what Arasaka promises him and hope that this time they actually are going to follow through (if they don't, he has years to go on believing V is ok while not actually facing them. He can take peace in knowing V at least isnt dead and he's the one who convinced them to do the engram path,so he in a way did save them despite Arasaka's failings. He, Goro, made good on his word and brought honor to the company). As far as him telling V to rot in hell in the end credits: Anything where Arasaka suffers or he's unable to regain his old life, he feels you've betrayed him. He refuses to adapt to the outside world, its unfathomable, so he'd rather just kill himself and be done with it all - you've killed him after he put his trust in you (trusting him). So understandably he's upset; its short-sighted as he has no way of understanding you didn't know his internal world (think culture shock: he has very specific codes of conduct he follows and everyone around him follows without having to think about them; there are very specific outcomes to every occasion, everyone knows them. People outside Arasaka dont have these, so they have no idea what Arasaka company people think or do - its an entirely different world with different rules, he has no idea the extent to which you don't even know what is/was at stake for him), but in his mind he's the injured party. Tl;dr: there's a lot going on internally for Takemura, but it boils down to this whole situation has opened his eyes. The Devil outcome is the only one that might allow Takemura to regain internal peace because you did become his friend, but due to numerous factors of his life up to that point: he can't survive without a stable Arasaka presence in his life. I don't think he's fake so much as his life is riding on your every move and he's terrified of what you might do if he can't convince you one way or another; he wants to be different, but he's too deep in his lifestyle and he knows death is the only way he'll ever be able to leave it.

[@tenshik3769]

@@Your-Least-Favorite-Stranger I completely agree with your summary. It is still sad though.. I did the Nomads ending first because it is meant to be the 'best' ending. But that voicemail from Goro at the end.. I hated it. I felt guilty. So I went back and did the Devil ending as well. Both of them left a real sour taste in my mouth. I had planned on doing all the endings this week but I am just not sure I can now. I haven't been this emotionally invested in characters since Mass Effect. At least with the Paragon/Renegade system you CAN save people and change their minds to seemingly immovable points of view and save them by having them fight for YOUR cause by gaining their loyalty. Cyberpunk just feels too rigid in comparison and makes a lot of the 'loyalty' related stuff we do feel empty and hollow.

[@angelavalon8972]

I was all about doing the honorable thing and saving the guy who saved me. Even if he began an enemy. But you are absolutely correct sir. The hidden lies. The contradictions. The slip-ups. Not visiting you at all until commanded... The "go to hell" during the end credits after everything. He truly was never your friend. As much as I grew to like him and wanted him to be. But his final message may give clue to another subtle fact/possibility. Arasaka forced him to commit seppuku for not convincing V to sign the contract and stay. Thus, his speech about death notes and samurai suicide... also explains his hostility toward you at the end. 😬

[@burritodoge8450]

You could say the same for most characters you meet in the game. They only want to use V for personal reasons but soon develop a relationship as they do more missions together. Takemura saved V because he needed him to take down Yorinobu but also promised to help V with the chip so it's kind of like a give-and-take relationship. Judy for example only uses V to exact her revenge so is there any other reason to help her after completing your goal of finding out who hired Evelyn? At first, she doesn't even wanna help you track down Evelyn until you beg her, even though you both have the same goal. The only time she warms up to V is when nobody, even the Mox, wants to help her take down the people who run clouds.

[@Evanz111]

Yeah, this was a very weird moral argument the video maker is trying to make. By their definitions of who is worth letting live, then V should be left for dead by basically everyone who knows them. Night City is full of users, everyone is out for themselves, some just have more honour than others.

[@Patrickf5087]

​@Evanz111 not all to different than modern cites if you ask me

[@GonzoGonzoGonzo]

"Judy for example only uses V to exact her revenge" - Judy's cause is an actual noble one and you end up being able to develop a romantic relationship/deep friendship with her. The point Big Dan makes is that Takemura is a corporate shill from start to finish.

[@Patrickf5087]

Honestly, I think he would honor V death as the warrior V was and then move on they aren't chooms

[@GonzoGonzoGonzo]

@@Patrickf5087 did you watch the whole video or? Option 1: you don't do what Takemura recommends and he curses you out in the holo; Option 2: he tries to coerce you into giving your soul to Arasaka; Option 3: you don't save him in the first place.

[@RokkitGrrl]

I think it was in Arasaka's best interest to convert V into an ingram simply because V knew too much. Not only that, but V took down Adam Smasher and has the capacity to take down Arasaka either alone or by working with one of Arasaka's competitors. They're not taking chances and because ingrams aren't legally people, it's the simplest way to keep V a prisoner without getting in trouble with the law. V disappears quietly and Arasaka's competitors will only learn about V's potency only far too late.

[@blunthonesty8633]

Mostly agree. But corpos in Cyberpunk often break the law. Then an anonymous donation to the police and the entire incident is forgotten by the authorities. So I doubt they'd be worried about open murder of a merc.

[@Fyre0]

Arasaka doesn't need V to sign anything, they could have just taken him by force at any point after the final mission concludes. They didn't need Johnny's permission to zap him, they certainly don't need V's to do the same. They simply didn't care enough about V, because if they did, they certainly wouldn't have let him stroll out of there alive. Johnny didnt.

[@monkeykingyo6359]

You think Arasaka give 2 shits about the Law 🤣🤣, they literally gave smasher the green light to destroy everything and kill Everyone he wants (woman and children included) anytime he goes on a mission, Saburo was gonna nuke night city till hanako convinced him Not to, I think they definitely couldn't care about the Law

[@TheAverageMountainMan]

I saved him because he got burned by the people he is a slave to. He is such a solid character and I genuinely wished an ending with Goro would have better.

[@saigyl9149]

7:10 alternative deduction, the clinic's request for someone V knows to talk to V triggered Takemura to talk to Hanako before going to the space station which is how he knew Hanako had forgotten about V

[@gltterati]

I think it was obvious from the getgo Takemura wanted you alive because you were a courtcase evidence, nothing more nothing less. That is why it was endearing that he naturally developed a small-lived buddy cop* combo with V. I never trusted him in a buddy buddy sense but I saved him because it was another life that somehow still sorta saved our ass and our only (initial/direct) hope inside of Arasaka. That's how I played V anyway. I saved him but still went with Panam.

[@DongleJohnson]

While I would agree V can't trust Arasaka (or any corp for that matter) if Arasaka wanted to, it seems like they could have easily made the choice for him. They had him secured in their own facility. They could drug one of his meals, put him under, perform the engram operation, and at that point, it wouldn't matter if he consented or not.

[@SuperMurray2009]

Yo Dan. This.... Is a BANGER! I love how you explained why Goro was very manipulative to Vs decision to sign over his soul. I never thought it about in the way you describe

[@omgIoIwtf]

dudes running out of content tf you talking about. lame video all the way around

[@michaelrandolph6373]

I didn’t see it as him manipulating V and more as him just being deluded about Arasaka to believe what he’s saying.

[@Snipergoat1]

I just don't see it as anything out of character for him. V makes deals and works for people far worse than him all the time. (I also don't like metagaming to excuse RP decisions. V makes a choice based on what he knows at the time just like you on the first playthrough)

[@dallaskitchen980]

he didn't betray Arasaka, they betrayed him. He called them saying he found the killer and they sent hitmen to take them both out

[@Ata.TeaGargler]

I'd say spare him. Sure, he's loyal to Arasaka, but how can he not? He's been with them for probably near a century. But only a few weeks with V. He's honorable and loyal. Those values themselves make him worthy to continue living. And although he saved V from death not as an ally, he saved V, regardless. Remember, V is a criminal. And those are just the consequences of V's actions that Takemura spared him from. Whereas Takemura is a hardworking employee.

[@derekdrake8706]

Spoken like a true corpo-rat.

[@Lc-Anders]

A hardworking employee to one of the most corrupt organizations to exist. Yeah he’s honorable and loyal to literally evil so that’s why I now no longer save him. He doesn’t care about anything as long as Arasaka is ok in the end and that’s why he’s gotta go

[@JavierGomezX]

Exactly, just save his life, like he saved yours. My V was not, and will never be a honorless bastard. A life for a life is a fair exchange, what he does with his life is none of my concern afterwards, but I would not betray my principles due to Gojo's poor decision making.

[@endemiczed]

He isn't honorable or loyal. He follows a megacorporation like a dog because they threw him a bone when he was like 10. Would you say that German soldiers in WW2 deserve to live because they were loyal to Hitler? Nah, they were evil people too.

[@MichaelDeNicola]

This message is Arasaka approved

[@SlowV6Mustang]

Spoiler warning, when I saved him and got the secret “Don’t fear the reaper” ending I was not expecting the response I got from his voicemail. Him pretty much telling us to go to hell sent chills down my spine, especially since I wasn’t expecting any anger from him. Thought he might thank me for saving his ass instead.

[@Wojtekoa]

If you back the corpo ending he ends up siding with you and fighting against arasaka.

[@aragorn4242]

@@Wojtekoa only to help Arasaka get better leader

[@Wojtekoa]

@aragorn4242 nah he talks about how arasaka was actually the very thing he should sought to destroy.

[@missybees1104]

This ending could have been more bittersweet if Goro was a romance option. Would have made his plea more earnest and his promise to see you again heartfelt. He even could have reassured V that he would protect them while in the program as “property of Araska”

[@heyfell4301]

100% agree.

[@PayneWewton]

Gross.

[@Fairyhell]

I think the beauty of the game is to make decision to what you feel right on the spot and live with the consequences.

[@zehnatu]

Enjoyed this take, thought it was interesting. I don't really think it holds up to scrutiny though. If Arasaka was hell-bent on uploading V's mind to Mikoshi, they simply would have done it without his consent (they've done that sort of thing in the past to others). The fact that you can refuse and Arasaka just lets you walk away is simply a direct counterpoint to a lot of what was said in this video. Arasaka may be a cold-hearted corp but it's canonically true in the game itself that they will let you go if you prefer, no strings attached. I also disagree about your thoughts that Takemura doesn't develop some sort of emotional bond with V throughout the story. He's not the type to gush over his feeling but I could see that a bond was forming between the two (that's more subjective than objective though to be fair). Anyway, I enjoy your videos, I like that they make me think over my feelings and reconsider them (even if I don't always change my mind).

[@MrBMMaster]

Also, in the devil ending he calls V, V san. Which shows his respect to V

[@michaelyang838]

There may be a bond but it doesn’t stop the guy from killing you if he had a chance. If anything him dying in that mission suits his values better. He died for his cause, instead he will commit sepaku and die in disgrace. For his values and our self interest, better that he dies

[@tendopain2291]

@Connor Lonergan wanted to say the same thing. why would saburo / arasaka not reward v. sure arasaka is not exactly "good" but just because they work through deceit etc. doesnt mean they are evil in every way. it makes perfect sense for them to actually reward v, because - as takemura mentioned when talking about his past - they tend to do reward those that aid them. why would anyone wanna work for them if they didnt?

[@michaelrandolph6373]

@@tendopain2291 you’re half right. Arasaka and Saburo definitely are evil but they do reward loyalty although with a lot of strings attached. If you sign the contract they’re basically rewarding you for serving them with immortality at the cost of slavery. You just have to hope they don’t abuse their ownership of you but we all know they will. I heard in the TTRPG it’s possible for you to get a full borg character like Adam Smasher but the problem is you’ll be chained to a Corp and people will see you as a machine.

[@tendopain2291]

@@michaelrandolph6373 Huh, interesting point. thing is tho, what would they gain from abusing the ownership, and what would that be like. I cant really recall if johnny ever said anything regarding that topic but as far as i know he never conciously experienced anything likewise - and arasaka *definetely* hated him. if they want data to improve the technology, fine but that would also aid v. and i cant really see a way where that would be painful or sth. i mean we take ct scans its probably not that different. takemura also mentions that there are aleady some customers, politicians movie stars and the like, and if they plan to have customers i dont see how you would be bound to arasaka in a way that is actually harmful to you. if they want a puppet they can control, i think there can be way cheaper ways than a groundbreaking invention which probably cost a metric shit ton to develop and is reserved for an extremely small amount of people.

[@lumare]

Playing as a corpo, Takemura and I became close homies, I always have to rescue him

[@xdgameon8454]

I see Takemura as a friend, despite he try to kill me at first, he has save V life and help V through out the story even if it for Arasaka, and in the mission that V saved him, we could see that he is mad at V coming back for him and showing us that he do care about V

[@lordjaraxxus5418]

The devil ending also reveals that save your soul does not have to klil the participant or it can be done after death (not sure which, most likely after death based on if you send jackey to vick's place after the heist). So in a way, it does not matter what V chooses in the later option, Arasaka could just send people to collect his body after death and leave a death switch in him to tell them were he is upon death. If it is the former, it would also show how dark Arasaka is in general by saying "this process would leave you without a body" when it does not have to.

[@Flameville]

Add to the fact that if you play the ending he realizes that he’s been lied to and STILL remains a puppet as V tries to tell him to just leave the corp after they clearly deceived him. He’s a lap dog in the end and it’s such a shame because those rooftop conversations you have with him are some of the best heart to heart moments in the game where their friendship is established. He refused to truly be honorable and reject saka after being free from them. Hanging his head low and telling you how he’ll be waiting for you as he sends you to die in a data prison. Or hanging his head low as he watches you leave having had false hope implemented by him. He feels shame but I doubt V dying is enough to bring him to leave saka in the end. He isn’t an honorable samurai, he’s just a loyal lapdog happy to be used no matter who he betrays.

[@NikkiC30]

Exactly! The hypocrisy is staggering. All that talk about honor and V being a thief as if the atrocities he’s no doubt committed are somehow better.

[@Flameville]

@@NikkiC30 and it sucks because that rooftop conversion and all the talks throughout make it seem as if he will be a lifelong partner to V (wish he was a romance option too considering how much time you spend with him) but it is what it is.

[@Flameville]

Sorry know I repeated myself

[@NikkiC30]

@@Flameville no problem. Honestly I guess it depends on what path you take but I knew from the beginning nothing he wanted to do was gonna help V, I just wanted to keep my options open. I knew V wouldn’t side with the Corpos so I feel like everything V does at that point is gratitude for him saving their life, no matter the circumstances. For him to then call at the end of the game when ultimately V did him a solid of freeing him from a devil he could not free himself of infuriated me. I don’t think gratitude could be expected but did he ever understand V at all? What else did he think was gonna happen.

[@Flameville]

@@NikkiC30 he liked his cage

[@IneptPotato]

Regardless of why he did it he still saved my life. I save him because he saved me simple as that. I like to pay back debts

[@omgIoIwtf]

this.

[@Ghost_420]

He saved V because he needed V alive because he was the only living person to see the death of Saburo. If it wasn't for that he wouldn't give a damn about V

[@IneptPotato]

@@Ghost_420 Again. Regardless of the WHY he still did it. He gave me a second chance at living. You can save his life and just not choose the devil ending. I do it all the time. I just repayed my life he saved by saving his as well

[@Ghost_420]

@@IneptPotato just my theory but if V raid's saka tower and he is alive there might be a chance that he will want to hunt V down after this

[@IneptPotato]

@@Ghost_420 what happens after I save his life doesn't matter. Once I've paid back the life I owe him I have no quarrel about killing him 😂

[@JC0676]

I think goro is the epitome of a samurai in cyberpunk world, he is his own person with likes and dislikes and has no illusion about arasaka being corrupt but is loyal to his master as any samurai would be. Even when a samurai or warrior knows their master is corrupt or doesn't agree with all of their decisions they still follow out of honor, I believe goro does in fact like v and sees them as a friend but he is bound by honor and debt to arasaka.

[@sgg3586]

Goro is probably the only person who is straight forward with V and never has an ulterior motives. Tells you right from the start what his goals are. Plus he keeps his word. Meanwhile Johnny at this point has been canonically proven to be a fake Engram and not even the real memories of Silverhand (not even a theory, the games/books/TTRPG are all canon, and there is clear contradictions that basically prove that like 50% of Johnny's memories are just fabricated by Arasaka editing the engram).

[@DestroyerApollyon]

I actually see Goro giving V a choice as a sign of good will, if it was truly ulterior I feel Arasaka wouldn’t have given V a choice.

[@About641Ninjas]

And to Takemura, V giving his soul to Arasaka is not a bad thing, he has already sold his own soul to them in a way. From that perspective I don’t even think him making the offer is malicious, someone like Takemura likely legitimately believes it is the best path for V

[@pinnacleevolution1634]

I mean he lies to you if you chose to leave the station Hanako calls you to go back and work for her so much for the "Hanako has already forgotten about you" part. It's quite fascinating how people will turn into pretzels trying to paint Takemura as a good guy and your friend, yet one of the PL characters gets vilified for things she didn't even do. He's also the one that puts a tracker on V when they are half dead at Viktor's and never tells you this, Hanako does.... Arasaka knew all along where V was all the time and that Yorinobu killed Saburo they were just waiting for the oportunity to benefit from it.

[@ryugaroxas]

@@pinnacleevolution1634 lol , lilbro just trying to edgy , edgerunners much ? How any of the things you said are bad ? This is a war , in a city filled with crimes and lying mtfks every square. You think this is a kindergarten where if " you wear the same shirt as me , then we are friends ! " . lilbro sure is living under a rock, good luck surviving in life with that mindset

[@robertonome2448]

@@About641Ninjas yea, i always saw it as a "be like me" type of situation. he always saw it and will still see it as the "one good path".

[@brainblessed5814]

It was an easy decision for me - I somehow managed to miss where I should go to save him

[@RbkARI]

It's easy to miss. I'm willing to bet most of us didn't save him on our first playthrough.

[@trysten9198]

No mission waypoint just go back up the hole in the floor you fell through

[@TheLastSainMan]

johnny said screw him hes already dead . I listen to johnny like as if he contrrols me

[@tickledpickle5671]

I see the relationship between Takemura and V to be, while a relationship born of necessity, something of a relationship of shaky, yet mutual respect. They both know what they're in it for, they both know (In a roundabout way) What's important to the other, and while in a perfect world, they could possibly be tenuous "friends", this is Night City. They both know what they want, what the other wants, and understand one of the most important things 2 people can understand of one another. *WHY* their loyalties/interests lie where they do. Takemura straight up tells V in their first interaction after the heist he wants revenge on Yorinobu. Because it's "Much more feasible here." Takemura also understands that V wants the chip gone, and their life saved. It's a working relationship built on two means to the same end. While V owes no real loyalty to Takemura, it makes sense that when the do or die choice comes, why V would show ANY interest in saving Takemura in the first place. Johnny, the anti-corpo 'conscience' is certainly right that saving him would likely not be worth the risk. Which leaves it down to the player. Do they listen to Johnny, bolt and save themselves, or do they risk their neck *again* to save a man who for all intents and purposes, was just using them. The interactions between the two really try to create a sneaky sort of kinship with Takemura. It may not be a 'bro's before ho's' level of kinship. But it does make you wonder. Or, at least it made ME wonder...

[@mhrefat9769]

He is a good fella I went back from the last mission to save him because didn't know I could save him in that mission

[@TonklinFallen]

I never realised saving him was an option. I thought he was another scripted death among a litany of scripted deaths that seem to befall your allies.

[@Tsumefan2]

but if you save him and not take out yorinobu with him he is mad and tells you to go to hell in the credits

[@leonake4194]

i believed the game was far more "scripted" and straight forward than it actually is. yesterday i spent an hour watching different ramifications of various archs i didnt even imagine you could follow, like betraying panam in the av mission wich results in the end of her arch, i didnt believed any mayor arch could be failed

[@NorFam]

I saved Goro. Before this quest, I knew from context in his sentences he is analyzing V. How his feelings towards V were altering, forging a friendship built on lead, and vengeance. when the time came to save Takemura. I did not hesitate.

[@M4jkelson]

Like some others said, number 1 reason I save him is that he saved me too, even though for his benefit. Number 2 reason is that the relationship was kinda businessy, you wanted to leave, he wanted revenge and no matter if you think he was lying or not, in the end Arasaka is the ONLY option here, every other ending still has you come to Mikoshi. Reason number 3, he is a corpo so he may not show it clearly, but in later stages of the game he definitely sympathizes with you, maybe even considers you a friend. Lastly, the biggest reason to be honest, I would rather get the ending with Takamura instead of Hellman, honestly fuck that guy, he's getting on my nerves all the time.

[@LuisRosa72]

I was always perfectly aware that Takemura's reasons for helping me were selfish in nature. But regardless of his motives, the man saved my life, and I felt incredibly bad for not returning the favor because I didn't even know he could be saved.

[@theactualmizu]

The Arasaka orbital station plays out the same way if you dont save him but in that case you speak to Anders Hellman instead of Takemura, but its worth saving him if you are wanting to do all the endings for achievements tbh

[@cyberlingbot3d896]

It's not about saving Goro, it's about saving yourself.

[@raulportela3039]

It's been fantastic having these videos come out as I do my new playthrough of the game.

[@Magikarp-4ever]

I THOUGHT he couldn't be saved because I saw Adam jump through the side of the building onto him and squashed him or quickly thereafter I didn't imagine he could live, oh well screw that guy that stupid parade mission was a headache lol

[@RedBarchettaYYZ]

Yeah i had no idea there was a option to save Takemura, i think i got confused the first time fighting the enemies and ended up unintentionally leaving the building, thinking that Takemura would meet us at some point.

[@ShaggyHair76]

I think I agree with your conclusion, but ultimately I have a different reasoning. Depending on how you interact with him, I think he does genuinely grow and comes to see you as a friend over the course of the story. In the Devil ending he does seem to try and force us into the contract, but I don't think it is pure arasaka loyalty. His loyalty leads him to believe in the corp, but him advocating for us to join I think comes from actual concern for V. He believes that this is truly the only way to save V, and so he goes to convince V both out of duty for the corp, but also out of duty to "help" his friend.

[@ShaggyHair76]

Ultimately though, most players probably agree the Devil ending is not the best choice for V. And by not choosing that ending Goro is left unable to enact his vengeance and therefore despises the friend who didn't show up when he needed him most. (Yeah that may seem selfish, but it's also human given the context). So to me the choice comes down to letting Goro die satisfied in pursuit of his ideals or to die bitter and as a failure in his own eyes. If there were more options, maybe there's a world where we can change Goro, but game as is: I think it is best to let our friend die in pursuit of his goal rather than to let him kill himself for failing to reach it.

[@GerblerM]

9:05 - Unfortunately, the big hole in your theory is assuming Arasaka would need to convince V to do anything. They can just take what they want from him. He's trapped on their space station and at the mercy of their doctors. If he really was valuable and/or a threat to them, they'd just turn him into an engram by force, like they did with Johnny. It's just as Goro said - V just isn't that important to Arasaka.

[@Fyre0]

100% this. It's not like Arasaka asked Johnny nicely to sign a contract before they sucked him up into Mikoshi. If Arasaka actually gave a fuck, V would've been treated just like Johnny from the get-go.

[@swannige]

Agree with you on this but I don't think in reality it makes a lot of sense for V to not be valuable. Smasher worked for Saka multiple times across decades including being their biggest merc of note and Yorinobu's personal bodyguard, as we know of only ever previously being beaten by Morgan Blackhand yet along comes V and kills him. Taking that in to account as well as everything else V accomplished, stealing the Relic etc. I'm not really sure why CDPR wrote it that way but I guess they needed an ending where the protagonist gets screwed over. Feel like replacing Smasher with V as another option would have made it better especially in the context of selling out but who am I to say.

[@GerblerM]

@@swannige The critical flaw in your reasoning is thinking Arasaka cares about Adam Smasher either. He's not special btw. He's just a slightly more cost effective version of a Saka hit squad. Remember, Arasaka is a several trillion dollar company - the "boogyman" of Night City only scares individuals and edgerunners. Corporations don't give a fuck about that sort of stuff because they can toss literal armies at whatever problem they want. One of these days, Adam Smasher was gonna lose. They already got their money's worth from him.

[@diego2112gaming]

@@GerblerM Exactly. The only real edge Smasher had was he was a functioning cyberpsycho, and that's what made him valuable.

[@GerblerM]

​@@diego2112gaming Nah, being a cyberpsycho doesn't confer any advantage to the person undergoing psychosis.