Should you buy a 3F UL GEAR QiDian Pro ultralight backpack?❔

[@eXWoLL]

Frameless backpacks have to be packed in a different way from the regular framed ones! Packing all the heavy stuff at the bottom isn't the way to go with these ones. One has to "give structure" to the whole load, rather than just place the stuff according to their weight and density. People basically hiked with these types of backpacks for centuries with no issues, then the frame come into play making the packing process a lot more forgiving, and everyone just forgot about the right way of packing :).

[@AndyWragg]

I have the old version of this bag, and have a video on it on my channel. The 2 x 1" straps you had round the front/mesh pocket, which you described as compression straps are actually meant to secure the ends of the roll top. I also found the pack makes your back sweaty, but every bag I've ever carried has done this. I carried a full Z matt on my tests and found it reasonably comfy, but then I was brought up on metal framed military rucksacks YMMV. Sadly I've never used the bag "for real" as that video was the last time I actually went for a hike with a decent pack weight due to the state of my ankles. It's a budget ultralight pack meant for "thru hikers" so the comfort features that you'd normally expect are sacrificed for loss in weight. ATB Mate.

[@daleyoutdoors]

Cheers Andy, I think I need to try it out with a 'full' sleep mat in there rather than my cut-off 👍Will just take some getting used to I think.

[@AndyWragg]

@@daleyoutdoors Have a look at my video for my thoughts. I did 8 miles with what I'd carry for a couple of nights less food. I remember the pack being a bit long for me and sitting on the top of my glues. It wasn't a problem just felt a bit odd.

[@wr1120]

I just bought this bugger today just to be able to get into an air plane with only hand bagage. You can't fold backpacks like the Osprey kestrel 48 into the hand luggage sizes. And on what I save by not having to check in 23 kilos I can use to buy whatever the next shiny camping gear comes next.

[@pauliusmielinis]

I have this backpack and I use pods to pack stuff. I don't use folding pad either and I rarely have the backpack resting on my back. I find it to be one of the most comfortable packs I have tried. I tried Deuter, Zpacks before.

[@daleyoutdoors]

What do you use to keep it off your back?

[@pauliusmielinis]

@@daleyoutdoors I put some EVA foam to the mesh pocket at the bottom. That is it. And also smart packing so the whole structure ends up little curved

[@daleyoutdoors]

@@pauliusmielinis ah I see. I might give that a go 👍

[@maidenwigan]

Ey up Ben,I’ve only recently subscribed to your channel and find your videos well worth a watch,im also subscribed to a few others i.e Haze outdoors,Paul messner,East anglian bushcraft,Andrew beavers,TA outdoors,Andy Wardle,the fell wanderer,Summit or nothing to name a few,sorry for missing anyone. None of these channels have done a review on a small british firm called Station 13. I’m soon to be in the market for a new 1 man tent with a budget of £250 and I don’t want to leave any stone unturned or have my pants pulled down.There is one review on KZbin but it isn’t in depth enough for my liking and it’s the wrong tent. It’s the glencoe 1 that needs reviewing, great vid by the way can’t wait for the next one.👍

[@daleyoutdoors]

The glencoe 1 is just a rebranded geertop topwind. It looks like there are a few reviews if you search for that one 👍

[@Memesmcgee23]

The video quality of these videos are 10/10. Keep it up!

[@daleyoutdoors]

Thanks Tom, will do!

[@jonathanthompson6783]

I just bought one used it once so far and was great and seems like a great pack.

[@daleyoutdoors]

It seems really well made, I think I just need to revisit the straps etc and get it sitting right. Gonna try it a few more times and do a long term verdict 👍

[@johnho2006]

yes you should buy the bag, for £82 delivered to your door , its a great bag and has many features

[@camperlists7090]

Good honest review. Thank you👍

[@TheAdventureGeek]

Great honest review.

[@shabingly]

Sorry dude, I'm probably about to go full-on wall of text here; only because I use this pack for section hiking, not because I disagree. The last pack I used before this was a metal-framed behemoth in about 1997. I chose this a year or 2 back when I decided to start backpacking again after many years off, and watched some KZbin videos and discovered you didn't need to carry 15kg of metal anymore. I use it with a 3/4 length exped mat for the support, also tried it with a small sitpad off Amazon. It doesn't work. Not enough structural support, and not long enough to take the weight onto the hip belt from your shoulder straps. None of the different material versions they make (uhmoweha or whatever, X-Pac) are truly waterproof as they don't seal the seams. TBF, I don't think osprey do that either, they just include a "free" rain cover. I don't use a cover with this pack. Funnily enough, I bought an osprey pack liner and use that 😂 It has a ton of adjustments to it, but not torso size like some fixed frame packs; but I believe you can get it in different torso sizes (but I could be wrong there, I think maybe I am. Best check.) I also use the pad-frame as a really posh full size sitpad during the day. There's no airflow for your back. Absolutely none. It's gonna be sweaty. However, while I've never used a pack for proper hiking with supposed airflow, I have used many day packs that have "airflow" to allow "your back to breath". They've never stopped me being sweaty when day hiking. Someone else's milage may vary, though. But imo, your doing exercise. You sweat if your hot. I guess the most worthwhile comment I can say; I've done a fair amount of 3-4 day hikes with this pack loaded up to 11kg, and loads of 1-2 nighters up to 9 or 10 (yes, I have an 800g pack but do not go ultralight, I am cheap). I've never felt like I wanted to throw the pack away and immediately spend money on a new pack during the hike. Got back Tuesday from doing 30 miles over 2 days (I know, I'm fat and old) in the Dales, and I'm not 100% if throwing an extra ton at my pack would've made it more enjoyable or not. I will say I have looked at other packs, and have thought maybe the extra couple of hundred grams and maybe another ton of money on top of the 65 quid for this might make my hiking more enjoyable. Who knows? Well. Let's wait and see what you think. Cheers mush.

[@daleyoutdoors]

Cheers Andy, great to hear from someone who’s given the pack some use 👍 I was wondering if using half a cut up Karrimor mat wasn’t helping 😁 I’ll see if I can get hold of a new sleep mat and give that a go. I need to play around with all the adjustments as well and get it fitting better. Thanks for watching mate 👍

[@shabingly]

@@daleyoutdoors curse you! I am now looking at Exos 48/58's lol

[@shabingly]

@@daleyoutdoors bought an Exos 58. Did 3 nights out with it last week in the Dales, carrying 11.5/12kg wet with food & gas, only 15 mile days though. Absolutely more comfortable than carrying the same weight in the 3f-UL pack. 100 quid (RRP) more comfortable is debatable, but definitely more comfortable. I dispell my curse on you 😂

[@stephen4600]

Looks like a good pack , I have a similar style I pack my fleece and soft bits at the pressure point , I'd prefer to use my old 46 litre from the forces , on another note who needs to leave England look how beautiful it is . Nice one !👍👍👍

[@daleyoutdoors]

Cheers mate, I need to try and master packing it I think. Totally agree though, why go anywhere else 😍

[@ramblingracheltrailtales]

I was considering this pack but doubt it will fit someone with a shorter stature. The ducks were cute ☺️

[@theoutdoordogandhikinggirl]

I have a video on my channel about a pack like this and I am short as well. Maybe it will be helpfull to you.

[@marksadventures3889]

"All the ducks are swimming in the water"...just sprung to my head then.

[@justinsaint6786]

Ay up Ben 😎 Nice honest review. I like the colour coordination and the price is pretty good. I've not tried a frameless bag before and think you'd have to be conscious in how you pack your kit. Look forward to a further review 👍

[@daleyoutdoors]

Cheers mate, I hope I can get it fitting/working right cos it looks cool 😎😄

[@jimmys60ny]

The stuff you use for the back support could be slightly hacked so that you have an air channel running up the middle of the support from top to bottom? Other backpacks use this method of ventilation, built into the design. I use an Exos, done loads of long distance multi day hikes, it suits my long back and carries what I want easily. I think your back support system could be improved, I have one idea in response to a comment earlier.

[@MovementDrifter]

I've got something similar to this. I don't think you will get enough airflow with the pad Mods, sweating is pretty common among ultralight packs. The exos is in a league of its own as far as ventilation

[@colinhalpin2076]

Good honest review. Seen other reviews where they have had similar experiences. Will be interested to see if you come up with any hacks to improve it.

[@kevinharding1181]

Thanks for the review! I'm considering this (or the 3FUL Yue which has a frame) for the weight saving over my current packs. UHMWPE is Dyneema for those not aware. Oh it's pronounced 'Chee Dee-En' (25 yrs living in China) 😀

[@gregmarcus3064]

Is it called UHMWPE because Dyneema is patented by another backpack company?

[@kevinharding1181]

@@gregmarcus3064 Yes exactly Marcus - however most of us know it as Dyneema. It seems the company that developed Cuben Fiber was bought out by DSM who renamed it Dyneema so I guess unless you buy it from them then you have to use the generic term UHMWPE.

[@gregmarcus3064]

@@kevinharding1181 thanks that's it, I'm getting one.

[@purplecloud822]

How’s living in China? You are right about the pronunciation, and that means “starting point”. The other bag “Yue” means mountain. I am also considering buying one of the two and that’s why I am here. Which one did you buy at the end and how is it?

[@kevinharding1181]

@@purplecloud822 I've actually loved living in China (until the introduction of this bloody stupid 'Zero Covid' policy which is making travel near impossible or ridiculously expensive). Obviously it depends a lot on where you are based, I lived in Hong Kong for 3 years before moving to Shanghai and this is one awesome, and extremely safe, city combining the ultra modern (it makes Tokyo jealous - and yes I've been there 3 times, it's a short flight from Shanghai) and the historic with the numerous water towns in the environs a lovely addition to it's charm. Yue means mountain? I didn't know that. I only know of 'Shan' for mountain(s) or 'Qiuling' for hills :) I ended up buying the Gossamer Gear Mariposa, a more expensive bag but better suited to my uses. Good luck in your choice !

[@Flexaret]

The pack looks good and the price is very good for a pack of that style, I bought a ULA Conduit back in 2010 and it was pretty expensive once import duty was factored in. My observtions on having only seen the 3F UL Gear pack in your video. Well the weight you were carrying is pretty heavy for a frameless pack however the pack is simply too large capacity to be frameless, my base weight was around 5-6kg for the Conduit which is around 50-55l Also I always placed my roll mat vertically inside the pack, loosely rolled and packed my gear inside the resulting tube, that adds a bit of rigidity to the pack, better I feel than simply folding the mat into the pocket of the outside. Finally I don't know if the pack you have comes in different back lengths, the ULA Conduit did, your pack looks too short, the point where the shoulder straps attach to the pack are way below the top of your shoulder so the weight is basically pulling down on your shoulders, on a framed pack the attachment point isn't so critical as the load lifters can help take some weight off your shoulders. The bottom line with frameless packs is that although they're light and the weight saving is tempting they should be the last element when trying to reduce your trail weight, only when everything else is as light as possible can you reasonably expect to use a sub 1kg frameless pack comfortably. FWIW the ULA Conduit weighed 550g but my base weight was round 5kg. Frameless packs aren't everyones cup of tea but I switched from a Gregory Z55 to the ULA Conduit with no regrets. Regarding the pack being waterproof, unless it's seam sealed it won't be waterproof, it'll leak through the stitching, water resistant is probably more accurate.

[@daleyoutdoors]

Thanks mate, some good info there 👍 they claim it is suitable to hold up to 12kg which would be WAY too much. It’s one size only but I think you can adjust the strap connections. I’ll have a play and use it a couple more times before doing a final verdict 👍

[@Flexaret]

@@daleyoutdoors I think it'll help if you can move the strap attachment up a bit, to level or close to level with the top of your shoulder. I definitely suggest trying it with a roll mat inside the pack if you have one, seems to me that it takes a lot of the sag out of the pack, it did on the ULA Conduit. That said, if you're used to a pack that sits way off your back like I think the Osprey does (the Gregory Z55 was similar) then frameless packs might not be for you. There's no right or wrong, just preferences :-)

[@garycasey7986]

When you were taking the pack off the waist belt seemed to have large pockets but you did not mention them, are they of any use? Additionally, you demoed the straps on the pack but did not show the adjustments available to the fit of the pack on your back, were they any use/help?

[@daleyoutdoors]

Yes the hip belt pockets are a decent size. Adjustments are the standard - strap length, load pulleys, hip belt and sternum strap. I'll show them in more detail in my long-term review after a few more uses. Hopefully by then I'll have found a way to get it fitting me right 😊

[@francoistexier5487]

add 300g for the mat and you have a 1.2kg backpack. I would go for the Decathlon Ultralight 50+10 L - MT900 UL and sleep on a real mat instead.

[@SSchithFoo]

I guess this is the issue with any frameless bag unless very well engineered. My Nelson Rigg waterproof backpack kills me even at 1 mile with less than 10 kilos even with both waist and chest straps tightened. Worse is it costs like 2 or more times more than this. Straps just cut into the shoulders and a simple fix would have been to have tapered straps that are much wider on contact areas and thin on others. Back ventilation is horrible so I sweat even in winter. It is designed as a motorcycle backpack that straps to the bike too but anyone buying this would be a someone who wants to park the bike and take a hike so it defeats the purpose.

[@eXWoLL]

You are probably packing it incorrectly! I would suggest to look a couple of videos about how to structure the load correctly in a frameless backpack, since it has to be done in a specific way for it to distribute the weight along your back and onto your hips. This video is the one I based myself on: kzbin.info/www/bejne/b4CXdXh3fLmcoZI As for the straps killing you: there is a strapping order that fixes most of these issues; where if I remember it correctly , you have to start adjusting the waist placement and belt, and from there move up till you finish with the top adjustment straps. Edit: Found the video that did it for me kzbin.info/www/bejne/aqnRfGZ6eZ2gm9U

[@bannister-lifeoutdoors8004]

I picked one up over a year ago and never used it yet !

[@cmcg1190]

Very helpful, thanks... Try packing your heaviest gear toward the middle of your back so the burden is on your shoulders and not your lower back.

[@daleyoutdoors]

Cheers Chris i'll give that a go next time 👍

[@alias8125]

isn't that basics when preparing your backpack? i wonder why this guy makes reviews..

[@AnthonyJohnson1]

Looks like it’s modelled on the Atom Packs bags so I think that looks a really smart rucksack. I always thought frameless rucksacks aren’t meant for carrying heavy loads? Really helpful review though Ben. I’m sure it will appeal to some

[@daleyoutdoors]

They recommend it for loads up to 12kg which would be waaaaaay too much. It’s massive as well so I’ve no idea what it’s designed for - transporting helium balloons maybe? 😂 It does look good and the build quality seems great. Will see how it performs over time 👍

[@AnthonyJohnson1]

@@daleyoutdoors haha. It did look on the big side. You could carry me along the Pennine Way in it 😆

[@daleyoutdoors]

@@AnthonyJohnson1 😂

[@everyoneknowsadave3580]

looked at this pack myself but always thought that the way they use the sleep mat to give the pack structure is a bit hokey …. and frankly you have confirmed my fears about that …from the look of it materials and build quality are excellent which is what you would expect from 3F UL but they may have missed the mark a bit on design …. i’ll be interested in what happens when you redistribute the load and try it again … good video thanks … atb Dave Mc

[@daleyoutdoors]

Cheers Dave, I might see if I can find a full sleep mat and try that instead of my hacked up one :)

[@andrewgreen7996]

Looks like a quality bag only down side is its frame lass .I'm sure it's mainly for lightweight hiking whitch to be honest is what I try doing mate but it all comes down too cost it's cheaper then I thought it would be iv looked at alot off gear when it comes too minimalistic hiking and it seems that lighter the gear more expensive it is I could be wrong but that's what iv experience when I go to outdoor shops.great video as all ways 😀

[@daleyoutdoors]

Cheers mate, yes I think this would be great for real lightweight kit. They advertise it as suitable for up to 12kg, I had 9kg but I think 6kg would be spot on for it.

[@kevinharding1181]

Andrew you could take a look at the 3FUL Yue 45+10L which has a frame and can take 18 - 22 kgs. It comes in 3 different materials (UHMWPE or Dyneema, XPAC or LS21) and the weight is from just under 1,100g to 1,150g depending on the material (descriptions on the 3F website).

[@michaellaing2067]

Great video Ben

[@daleyoutdoors]

Thanks Michael! 😊

[@Hayyothhakodesh]

I'm not an ultralight backpacker. I rock kifaru and other tactical or technical packs. I truly believe ultralight ull get a light pack but the comfort u sacrifice is not understandable. I use a heavier pack but it rides like a Cadillac and performs like a Ferrari. I own 29 packs now and I use em all. I've never felt good about ultralight. I wud never put down anyone's choice of gear but ultralighters constantly diss people for carrying heavier things. Hike ur own hike is the saying that shud be universal. But we get slack for carrying heavier loads. However I'm never uncomfortable. And my packs r large and heavily crafted for durability . I do own an osprey 105liter and a mountain hardwear 109 liter as well for my civilian typical backpacker packs. I don't know why people sacrifice comfort for lightweight. It seems like a double negative. I think I'm saying this right..but truly ur experience with this pack seems typical for frameless packs etc.

[@ufonut]

The back pack was not fitted properly it looked to low down your back

[@jimmys60ny]

I agree, that was my first thought too. Does the pack not have lifters?

[@johnmccarron]

I put my sleeping mat folded up on the inside of my pack against my back, nothing on the outside against my back.

[@onlycompetitions5083]

Just a thought…. Would the pack be any easier to tote if you wore it back-to-front? I have seen people doing it although it does look really odd.

[@daleyoutdoors]

No idea, might give it a go though 😁

[@waynewayoaveyard9397]

I went from eurohike pack to a osprey talon 22 (what was too small for my needs) to a ultra lightweight backpack i found on wish that looked like this i think it was called a 3f lu ultalight weight pack hiking... or something it didnt have a name. but it was horrible! my back sweat all the time and after a day hiking a 3 day trail the pack and my back started chaving, if you have a roll up pad and/or use a inflatable mat the "back padding" isnt good at all and a pain to get right, sholders was in pain due to taking most of the weight and i contantly felt off ballance even after using all straps and fitting the pack correctly. i then sold all packs at a massive loss and got a osprey stratos 36. there is no comparison betweet an osprey stratos and the other packs and i would highly recomment anyone to just bite the bullet and get a mid/top end pack for their needs. youll end up buying and buying to then finally realise you should have just bought a good pack at the start and saved money. because by time youve realised this, you would spent on a number of packs that will add up to a mid/top end one. event tho you are spending £140+ you are getting a pack that perfectly fits you due to the back adjustment and different sizes, the osprey warranty and the anti gravity system they make claim to honestly really works, and the pack doesnt even touch your back to sweat. honestly was a game changer for me.

[@daleyoutdoors]

Yeah I have an Osprey Kestrel 48 and I do love it 👍

[@waynewayoaveyard9397]

​@@daleyoutdoors Kestrel 48 are way to big for my needs i was looking at the aether 55 first but more space is just an excuse to bring more stuff including the kitchen sink haha. but if i was ever in need for a bigger pack i would 100% stay with the osprey family. two things ive learnt the hard way... dont buy cheat packs or footwear. they make a massive difference to moral and the enjoyment. osprey pack and gor tex trail runners for anyone whose doing 3 season camping trail hiking

[@leonstancliff7218]

Sorry, but I can not take this as a review. Seriously, when it is 1.8 miles of use and we can still hear the kids on the playground it is not a hard use test of durability, only a guess.

[@daleyoutdoors]

As I said… it was a short 6 mile walk for an initial review and look at the bag and I’ll be using it a few more times before doing a final review.

[@cky3396]

Will you be posting a long term review? How has it performed for you? I see there was some helpful comments posted previously - curious how its held up. Cheers

[@daleyoutdoors]

I got rid of it a while ago as I didn’t get on with it. Lots of people do though. It’s all about personal fit really as these all come on one size.

[@cky3396]

@@daleyoutdoors copy, thanks for the response. appreciate your content, thank you

[@daleyoutdoors]

@@cky3396 no prob 👍

[@warren7949]

Great review. The problem with bags are the zips and/or entry points. Materials can be waterproof but water will always get in unless they’re covered. I think even then I would want dry bags involved.

[@daleyoutdoors]

Cheers mate 👍I think this would hold up well with the roll over too but as you day it still won’t be fully waterproof. Dry bags all the way for me 😊

[@kenmorrison1725]

Can't be doing with frameless. I find they move around too much. Might be worth putting the mat inside the pack and see has that goes for you!. 😂😂Going to try it when we're back in big coats! That's next week then!? Good vid as always 👍keep up the good work.

[@daleyoutdoors]

It’s looking like next week yes 😂 Cheers Ken, Thanks for watching as always 👍

[@shabingly]

Lots of "proper through-hikers" (lol) with sub 4kg base-weights do this, from what I've seen.

[@Yorkshiremadmick]

Interesting that you compare this to the Osprey @ £81 delivered. How many features are worth the difference? I’m sure you would have sweated with another bag

[@daleyoutdoors]

I compared it with the Osprey as that's the other bag I have. It was £99 so not a massive difference. All bags will make you sweat but this one is the worst I've tried as the foam mat is always directly on your back by design. I'll see if I can find any ways to improve it on future outings 👍

[@drug2]

Did you weight you bag? Cause mine is heavier than 880g. 939g in total. Thats 60g more

[@daleyoutdoors]

Nope. Or at least if I did I can’t remember.

[@JackKlumpass]

You sure they’re waterproof and not water resistant/shower proof?

[@daleyoutdoors]

They claim waterproof but it’s unlikely. Probably resistant. I need some rain to test it out 😊

[@kitl552]

Is it waterproof, looks it? Would use a Bergen liner anyway but asking anyway!

[@daleyoutdoors]

It claims to bd but I haven’t tested it out in any heavy rain yet

[@scentybeast9531]

Really tempted to try the LIM35 from Hagloffs because it has an air suspension and is only 980g. Do you miss having the frame or airflow? I'd imagine it gets a bit too sweaty and rides a bit low on the back pulling shoulders back but I might be wrong

[@daleyoutdoors]

I did a separate review video on it - check it out 👍

[@scentybeast9531]

@@daleyoutdoors oh dang - couldn't find it, do you have a link?

[@daleyoutdoors]

@@scentybeast9531 Should you buy a 3F UL GEAR QiDian Pro ultralight backpack?❔ kzbin.info/www/bejne/l5DNe3x6ich9j5Y

[@davidharrison1346]

Mmmm?, im not convinced. It doesnt look like it offers any support for your back and shoulders and on multi day hikes its essential you have that. Currently using a technicals tibet 50. Its light, cheap and really comfortable.

[@daleyoutdoors]

Me either, I just don’t want to write it off too soon. Worth a couple more trials I think 👍

[@kendavies7933]

FWIW it's pronounced Kwai Dee Anne. It means quick in Chinese. It's aboput £60 delivered on Ali ($63+tax), but only in grey. Thiking of pressing the buy button.

[@daleyoutdoors]

Cheers Ken 👍Definitely worth a lol at £60, might be worth checking there aren’t any taxes to pay on delivery though just to be sure. If you do go for it let me know what you think 😊

[@pault5947]

So basically its a 1.4kg bag that makes your back sweaty 😂

[@daleyoutdoors]

It’s 900g… But yes it does make you sweat 😁

[@mauricewal]

Would you advice it over an kestrel 48? I have 2 kestrels and doubt to buy this one.

[@daleyoutdoors]

Did you watch the video?

[@mauricewal]

@@daleyoutdoors yes, I mean after a year? You said I need to give it a couple of goes and maybe the winter season. So I was hoping if you no longer use it now or just winter? (I should have said that in my first comment sorry for that).

[@daleyoutdoors]

@@mauricewal Ok. You passed the test. I don’t have the QiDian bag any more, I just couldn’t get in with it. For me I’d definitely stick with the Kestrel. I’ve just bought a 68l one to go with my 48 👌

[@mauricewal]

@@daleyoutdoors haha Thanks ;) I have the same kestrels. And I think I will stick with them then. Thanks for answering

[@seaslugseaslug3550]

How can you possibly do a fair review when you haven't bothered to set the rucksack up properly with the full mat in the back support as it's designed, Like having no insoles in your boots and saying they hurt your feet.

[@daleyoutdoors]

I tried the full mat as well. Doesn’t make a difference to how the straps fit. It’s not a bad pack just not for me.

[@renan3916]

what is your verdict on this bag after some months?

[@daleyoutdoors]

I haven't tested it enough for a verdict yet. Still waiting for the cold and wet weather.

[@kenkl5204]

James at camp u list???? Can't tell what you're saying. List the sight.

[@daleyoutdoors]

It’s in the video description…….

[@craoutdoors6827]

Took me 5 mins to just pronounce that backpack 😂

[@daleyoutdoors]

Me too! 😁

[@2laughandlaugh]

Short answer...no. The Zpacks Nero is much better and only costs 200 bucks U.S. And its made from Dyneema.

[@daleyoutdoors]

I’ll look into that one. I think we get stung for shopping on Zpacks kit to the UK but I’ll check it out 👍

[@mezmerya5130]

you had 1 more kilo than is possible to comfortably carry in frameless. i would never carry more than 7 kilo in one. just nature of the game. and even with the lightest load you can completly damn your hike with uneven weight distribution 3f ul has awesome framed packs that rival american ones, trajectory 35 and 55, and yue 45.

[@daleyoutdoors]

I had a lot less than 3F UL GEAR recommend for the pack. I know they're fine for a lot of people, best to try them out and see what works for you 👍

[@mezmerya5130]

@@daleyoutdoors ratings for frameless pack show what load wont damage the pack. What every person deems comfortable or healthy is up to individual.

[@daleyoutdoors]

@@mezmerya5130 that’s what I said

[@philferguson7469]

🎖 🤣

[@daleyoutdoors]

Boom! 😂

[@philferguson7469]

running out of chest again!!

[@tourcheverybridge]

@@wvo2m i honestly don’t sit there waiting… for some odd reason I seem to just pick phone up and … BINGO..it’s says posted 3 mins ago….

[@howardpotts5763]

Just buy it you tight git 🤣

[@sdfaasf7574]

i bout one and its totaly fooly sh___t. Without rain cover. Didnt have any metal or good back. Material after 3-4 radial sorties into the mountains began to let water through. Threw it out

[@DazzyOutdoors]

I have Osprey Kestrel 48L too. And use it for all my trips. Interested to see how this lighter pack holds up long term. Looks good though!