Damar tells Weyoun 7 that they will have to Destroy the Runabout

Star Trek Deep Space Nine Season 7 Episode 06 Treachery, Faith and the Great River

[@alisondale979]

Love the acting. Two actors in costume, no flashy effects, just great dialogue and acting. Do miss DS9.

[@rbrtpongo]

what station was voyager and deep space nine on for you in New Mexico it was upn 50 and Kasa fox 2 in New Mexico? if i may ask.

[@faded9581]

This scene always stuck with me, because it demonstrated that Weyoun is not that incorruptible loyalist he pretends to be. He acts like his critical thinking capacity just deactivates when it comes to the Founders, but it shows he is capable of using reasoning to circumvent his highest programmed Directive. And of course, the amazing symbolism at the end, Damar trying to ceremonize Weyoun's corruption from loyalist to self-serving pragmatist with a Cardassian drink. To me, this indicates that Weyoun 6 is not defective at all, but the Founders' control over the Vorta is merely an illusion, and each Vorta has the free will to follow them or not, and each Weyoun made their choice.

[@samfisk4848]

You also see this with the Jem Hadar. They have a culture of absolute obedience, but they can and do choose how to execute their orders. See “I cannot beat this Klingon, only kill him, and that no longer holds my interest.”

[@faded9581]

@@samfisk4848 Exactly. I loved the old shows for reasons like these, there's so much being said in the subtext. DS9 deconstructed every piece of lore in the franchise, the Klingons use honor as an excuse to further their self-interest, Ferengi profit obsession is ultimately self-defeating, and the Federation and the Dominion are mirrors of each, but none of it needs to be said outright. Not to bash the new shows unnecessrily, but even the best of them, SNW, tends to infantilize the audience imo. We don't need help knowing identifying a philosophical problem everytime something not clear cut happens, that is why we are here.

[@RetroActiveGM]

In an episode about defective clones, it could be considered that Weyoun 7 was also defective since killing Odo would be considered treason by Weyoun 5.

[@DanRaidersWarriorsSharksGiants]

Damar OPENLY drinks on the job and was generally quite a functional drunk at that.

[@SirMangler]

He really wasn't, several episodes showed his 'alcoholism' was out of control, including Weyoun having to personally wake him up for ignoring his comms and oversleeping after a long night drinking, which after being criticised leads to him going back to drinking something nasty, not even a minute after being awake.

[@DanRaidersWarriorsSharksGiants]

@@SirMangler That was one of the only examples I remember of it ever being a problem. You would think you could give me dozens of examples.

[@SirMangler]

@@DanRaidersWarriorsSharksGiantsThere's a completely seperate episode where Weyoun commented that Damar was drinking really early "even for you". Damar was a background until literally the last half of the last season where he became the leader of Cardassia, and only later into the Dominion war where he realised how badly Cardassia was screwed over did his drinking become problematic, and nearly every scene after that point showed he was a complete mess. So yeah, it's not surprising there aren't a ton of scenes of a side character who only became relevant literally at the very end of the series, but of all the scenes he was in throughout the entire show, nearly all of them showed him drinking.

[@DanRaidersWarriorsSharksGiants]

@@SirMangler He still functioned really well for the amount he did. If the worst thing he did was sleep in once that is quite minor.

[@SirMangler]

@@DanRaidersWarriorsSharksGiantsYou may have missed the part where Damar was just a figurehead, the Dominion took over the entirety of Cardassia after Dukat was removed. Literally every scene where he tried to give an order he was completely shutdown, this was spoken about a lot in the show and in the run-up to Damar's redemption. Pretty easy to function in a job where you're basically not even needed. Note when he was woken up by Weyoun it's because he was being ordered to go somewhere. The leader of Cardassia, being ordered around. They literally only needed him so that he could appear friendly with the Dominion to keep Cardassian obedience. If you've seen the show before, you really should rewatch it. This is one of the best arcs in the show.

[@Th0ughtf0rce]

The fact that this Weyoun could even consider killing Odo and lying about it proves that his programming and conditioning weren't perfect either

[@christopherg2347]

"Who is going to tell?" "Weyoun 8 might. Not like it is his life on the line."

[@richardseverin1603]

I just saw the acter that plays Weyoun play a Ferengi on Starship Enterprise and on Voyager he operated a MMA type of contests that had Seven of Nine as a contestant, against 'The Rock'.

[@lskulski]

He’s also Liquidator Brunt and a number of bit parts in DS9. The actor, Jeffery Combs, is in many Star Trek properties including 3 of the series, several video games, and animated projects like the Lower Decks.

[@JasonCliftJones]

He's also Shran on Enterprise.

[@MrDibara]

​@@JasonCliftJones _Love that pissed off fellah!_ 😂

[@joecolman1968]

I would have loved am episode where all his characters met

[@MaxxyBee]

oops, all jeffrey combs!

[@emdee8840]

Good scene choice, Paul. Thank you.

[@April-dv2pb]

I am glad that you enjoyed it. You're welcome emdee8840.

[@gohibniugoh1668]

great acting.

[@michaelvargas5144]

Damar Drinking OPENLY On The Job Is As Explain In Several Episodes Later Because He Sees How The Cardassians Keep Dying Day After Day In The War By The Hundreds If Not Thousands And The Dominion Does Little Or Nothing To Help Them

[@mell3749]

i wonder if the writers knew/know what power they had in manifesting this kind of reality. interesting isnt it

[@rbrtpongo]

I remember watching this when I was in 7th grade at jefferson middle school in new mexico me and my brothers and my dad was watching Voyager and Deep Space Nine back to back I like how they had voyager and deep space nine on wednesday nights on upn and Kasa fox 2. i do have a question what station was voyager and deep space nine on for you guys for us it was UPN 50 and Kasa fox 2 in New Mexico?

[@user-zt4mw1ei3i]

Shakespearean

[@chissstardestroyer]

"He lacked your apatite for cruelty." Well, Legate Damar; you yourself have just given just about the *best quality* rebuke of state-worship and atheism- as it does tend to engineer psychopaths- you see, your state is something we on Earth are really *very* familiar with, very familiar with indeed- including its dysfunctions intrinsic to the system of governance that your state has.

[@chissstardestroyer]

"Tretchery, Faith, and the Great River" really gets deep into the profound disagreements inside the Cardassian/Dominin/Breen alliance in a lot of ways; incuding the *radically* different belief systems: the Dominion really is the *worst* case of a theocracy in terms of its governance; the Cardassian Union is, simply put; a "Space USSR", unbelievably Marxist in their concepts, and the Breen are basically something else entirely. Given that the Cardassian Union has fundamentally become truly Atheistic at its core; there'd be very great rifts within the mindsets of the men in that HQ.

[@chissstardestroyer]

I mean, upon coming back to this: I truly do enjoy this: the elements of the malfunctions intrinsic to atheism in Cardassian society (ironically, it was one of their "state religion priests"/NKVD who served to reset their society, at least according to the books: Elim Garak, former commissar of the Obsidian Order at that), but the propensity for alchoholism and lust present inside the Cardassian Military (though, given the extreme socialism in their economic model: it does make sense they'd turn to the military to provide for their state: the civilians really were crushed under their own state's jackboot and given that no productivity generally resulted: they had to turn to all manner of abusive malfunctions in terms of labor); come to think of it, if a certain Mr. Washington, George, were to have observed this; he'd stress that while Weyoun is truly and distinctly a pagan; he's actually the more stable of these two men. Plus, Damar is actually pressuring Weyoun to engage in something that to him would come across as a perverse mix of murder and sacreledge: he's being convinced to order the *murder* of one of his "gods". Yet said "god" of his is a load of a LOT closer to the real thing than any he's familiar with, in terms of lifestyle choices and career! Not the real thing, but a load of a lot *closer* to the real thing! Odo's far from the real thing, but he's a load of a lot more sanely masculine than the rest of his people! I mean: states and people that embrace atheism really are prone to things like drug abuse, alchoholism and lust, and theft and murder, as well as slavery- these should be seen, as a social commentary on what to watch out for!

[@ShannonFreng]

Combs' left eye looks weird, until 1:22.

[@chissstardestroyer]

The concept he's dealing with in that room is not even a wolf; let alone a society of timber wolves- because those're basically mindless predators: here he's dealing with a bad coworker; when Damar tells him that the soldiers he's directing don't even need to know he's on board- this's, in their state's perverse mentality: coersion to commit a war-crime in the eyes of Weyoun's bosses; something that could get his whole line ended for treason! Yet Damar himself has no idea that his state's pseudo-religion's monster, the "nameless traitor" is the one whispering to him emphasizing the things necessary to serve the state. Their literature does have goodness in it: the tale "the Nevereding Sacrifice" itself defines "Neighbor" as the same thing as "the state" in terms of conduct- it glorifies manly community defense; which has its right place. Yet their state's "nameless traitor" is the one who's whispered to him that this has to be done- as is any time at all that the state murders any innocent: at that moment it signs a treaty giving away its freedom to the Red Tsar of Hell and its politburo: the same monster as they call "The Nameless Traitor" and the Ferengi dub "the Smiling Partner". And the psychology of that vile alien being matches to a T that it would do that kind of stunt! This itself opens up an interesting concept: man's only held accountable for acting on what he is feasibly able to be aware of, which actually opens up a gate of hope for these 'space-men' at that, if they should exist.