Dangers of Snatch Strap Recoveries - Destruction Testing

[@kylelaw7210]

Don't sell yourself short. Doing an expremiment and sharing your results is the definition of science.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks mate

[@SansVarnic]

Absolutley, Scientific process is not limited to just "Scientist". Science is questioning, theorizing, testing, proof of concept and results. This video has all that. Hello from America. :)

[@gzhang207]

It is wise to know one’s limitations.

[@Duke-le6vy]

@@MadMatt4WD Hey Matt, I saw a video of someone using a length of reasonably heavy chain, around 1.5m long, as a damper. It was clipped to the winch rope with carabiners. Are you willing to test this method of damping? For my mind it seems like a good idea, they had it at the mid-point, I'd like to see it at the heaviest point ie. At hook or shackle/failure point like a snatch fuse

[@MadMatt4WD]

@@Duke-le6vy I’ve heard of that idea but never tested it. I could look into it. The drawback is the chains weight.

[@huntersmith4115]

The fact that your still active in the comments section just shows how much you appreciate your community. I appreciate that

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks Hunter. It takes a lot of effort especially with some of the comments if you know what I mean.

[@huntersmith4115]

Oh I know the toxic sludge of KZbin comments

[@huntersmith4115]

Just remember that the people who appreciate you will let you know and the haters will just find the surface level things to tell you about

[@MadMatt4WD]

@@huntersmith4115 Thanks for the encourgment

[@kyles280]

I found your channel from Matt’s off-road recovery. I like tour channel and I’m in the US. I can’t wait to get another Jeep someday. Awesome videos! I’ve learned a lot from both of your channels! Stay safe out there

[@MadMatt4WD]

Awesome! Thank you!

[@kellyclark1877]

Hello from the USA, thank you for doing real world testing, i think more company's should do this kinda testing. thank you.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks for saying so

[@garyp.7501]

Pretty clear that the company didn't do this failure testing!

[@jjm5714]

@@MadMatt4WD hey Matt I don't do any driving except on dirt roads. I do pull vehicles out of the snow once in awhile. I have some tow straps light duty and heavy duty. How do I know if they are snap straps or just tow straps?

[@benhamilton4881]

This video has been incredibly helpful, have never even thought about how dangerous snatch recovery’s are so this was definitely an eye opener, keep up the great content Matt!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Glad to help theres a few other vids on the subject you may appreciate.

[@jeffwilkes3039]

They used the wrong gear and it was to an anchored object that was never going to move, of course strap would break. All they proved is that the strap breaks first at the fuse as it is far less rating to the soft shackle and rear hitch

[@autibrown]

This video has definitely saved at least one life. Thanks for making this information easily available.

[@GraemeGosse]

I enjoyed seeing these tests...I'm writing this after seeing your comparison with Yankem Recovery Ropes on . Matt's Off-road Recovery in Utah. I was impressed with that comparison too

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks mate. We're just trying to help and it's pleasing when we do.

[@HappyJ]

Have had a failed strap go whizzing by my head. Scared the bagebees out of me. Now use small Kevlar sling and two long chains. Never had an issue after using the chains and Kevlar sling.

[@motorvatorv888]

Me too. I still think MattUSA should be using dampers, especially when recovering cross overs and rental vehicles. I have a suspicion that a few of them have gone back with slightly bent suspension. That said, many of his recoveries would not approach a wood filled big hole for anchor effect.

[@johngurney7180]

I Had never heard of the tether, however i love the idea, as an Engineer, its totally the better approach, im pleased to see you guys working with who ever produced it to refine same, its far better than any ballast hung over the snatch strap, which could easily be misused, the tether just needs to ba a bit longer and slightly elastic, the idea being when the snatch fails, its long enough that no serious pulling load transfers to the tether only the load of the failed snatch strap, great work guys, John Gurney

[@MadMatt4WD]

Hey John. The company didn’t take on any of my recommendations. I think a form of fall arrest system is what would work.

[@ateamoffroad1179]

Great information, so glad I found you off Matt's off-road. This is great stuff. I have been wanting to keep my recovery stuff simple safe but most efficient. Without having tons off equipment

[@MadMatt4WD]

I’m glad to help

[@ateamoffroad1179]

You have, my wife and I watch your channel all the time. It helps us out a lot one what to buy. And being very safe. We love to have fun out jeeping. But always want to have the right and safe equipment.

[@tomseim]

This is, by far, the best video I have seen on snatch recoveries and, more importantly, the dangers involved. THANK YOU for doing this video!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks mate

[@jimclark6978]

Matt, real interesting concept, if you look at the free fall on a safety lanyard for working at heights this is folded and stitched in a concertina this allows for a longer length of safety strap and more likely control of the recoil

[@johnlatsch9720]

Exactly what I was thinking

[@RaggedsEdge]

The stitching isn’t just to shorten the tether, the stitches act as energy sinks as they blow apart when it’s stretched.

[@freda5344]

tether to a bag of dirt/gravel attached with easily failed string to vehicle

[@davidnorthrup3674]

Hello, I found your channel through a link in Matt's Off Road Recovery which I watch a lot. Thank you for the video, I did learn a bit from it which is why I watch these videos of course. One thing that I have always done which may or may not help some of your viewers. When I am pulling something out it tends to be a small tree or a fence post and I am using a basic tow strap. What I have always done is to put the rope through the canter of my spare tire fairly close to the end where my target is. This way if the rope comes loose from the tree or post, it tends to get wrapped around the tire instead of flying at my truck. By the way my truck does have a dual coil spring mount for the hitch which absorbs the sudden impact of a tow. Thanks again!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thats an interesting idea.

[@darrenbradbury8667]

Hi, great video. I love watching other people break stuff. I thought that tether looked a little short. I’m wondering if you or the manufacturers have discussed using a suppressor similar to that used in a lanyard for fall suppression when working at height. Picture this, the tether is 3m long, 1.5m of the tether is folded upon its self until the length is only 1.5m. The bundled tether is then stitched together in a fashion that is weaker than that of the anchor stitching and placed in a protective cover. The idea being that the tether is long enough that the snatch strap has returned to its static length before the tether loads up. Then if there is still enough energy, it will be dissipated when the suppressor stitching fails, leaving the tether intact. Keep up the good work!

[@MadMatt4WD]

I’ve discussed that concept with manufacturers and they couldn’t care less. Very disappointing.

[@darrenbradbury8667]

Sad.

[@darrenbradbury8667]

What part of The country are you in? We visit every 10 years, 2022 is the next planned trip. Could pop by and say Hi if we are near by.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Sydney

[@percyfaith11]

@@MadMatt4WD They might if they are sued for knowing about a weakness and doing nothing to correct it, if a tragedy occurs.

[@irafael8080]

Beginner here, great example breaking the tow strap, Bro. Thanks very much! I definitely got a recovery rope and your work did improve my experience and illustrate that towing IS something very, very serious.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I’m really pleased to hear that. I think you’ll find a lot of helpful content on the channel

[@JohnSluderPhoto]

Suggestion, have the tethers sewn up with a "zipper" style the treads are designed to "peel" apart in layers to absorb the energy

[@MadMatt4WD]

yes

[@rusty78yak]

Agree, same concept as a shock absorber in fall arrest systems.

[@dachet10]

Or do it like fall arresters so they break in stages, each absorbing part of the force.

[@markbutland7478]

Working at height stuff from petzl has shock absorber zip stitched stuff in

[@taktisk2158]

I appreciate the emphasis you put on safety. Well done. Subscribed.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks mate. I'm always amazed at the number of people who just don't care.

[@14DFASniper]

I learned a great deal watching this. Thanks guys! This is fantastic.

[@robertpepper9034]

Thanks!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Welcome! and thanks

[@MrErViLi]

The group I wheel with uses a second snatch strap as a tether. We attach it at about 3/4 the length of the main snatch strap. I've seen a fail twice and the secondary snatch strap acted as a much stronger tether than the red ones and stopped the fly back.

[@MadMatt4WD]

That’s interesting.

[@CurmudgeonExtraordinaire]

MANY years ago, we did not have tow straps (much less *snatch straps*) and we used chains for towing a disabled vehicle or for pulling it out of the mud if it was stuck. As such, if you took up the slack too abruptly, you ended up with quite a bit of jerk, possibly damaging both vehicles. I've seen an old tire used as a shock absorber of sorts, kind of like how they use one between the cable of a crane and a wrecking ball during building demolition. Chain has no give to it, so if you are towing someone and they don't constantly keep up the slack in the chain, you end up with a lot of jerking every time the slack gets taken up. With a tire added to it, you don't get jerked as much. Of course, the tires that were being used were a lot narrower than what you see on most off-road vehicles these days.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I have seen that. But yes there is a big difference between a tow and a kinetic recovery

[@CurmudgeonExtraordinaire]

@@MadMatt4WD -- Yeah, back then we didn't even have the concept of kinetic recovery straps / ropes. Vehicles that had winches tended to be ones that had PTOs instead of electric winches. Of course, there was always plenty of trees that you could use as an anchor point along with a farm jack and sufficient length of chain. Things have changed a lot over the last 50+ years...

[@MadMatt4WD]

That they have

[@shanevonharten3100]

The tether is a great idea it just wasn't thought out properly. With hindsight it needs to be stronger to withstand the forces stored in the recovery strap and much longer to allow ample room to be affective. Look forward to seeing the updated version.👍

[@mretou]

The tether was never meant for kinetic recovery. It works great on a winch line.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I would appreciate you watching the FULL video but there are skip points in the description if there is a section you want to check out!

[@budget4wheeling641]

Hi Matt, good to see someone doing shock load test instead of bench test. How come you used soft shackle instead of bow shackle ? 4wd "SAFETY" is a large can of worms. Doesn't matter how safe the equipment is there will be those that don't use it correctly. There's a video of people snatch/towing a newish Prado out of water with hooked on the bull bar not tow/recovery point. If tow balls are so prone to breaking when used in recoveries, why did Ronny Dahl have to cut them and still took several attempts to break them off ? Also what's the point of "RATED" recovery points when what they bolt to isn't that strong ?

[@MadMatt4WD]

No real reason to use soft over bow. Both are good and safe. Yes it is a can of worms and yes I saw the prado vid and just shook my head. Towballs are a single shear item rather than double shear this is the reason they're dangerous. Just because it took a few goes to get one to fail doesn't meant they don't fail. There are numerous vids of towballs failing. Totally agree with you. This whole rated recovery thing is not that helpful and provides a false sense of safety IMO. Unless the complete recovery solution is tested it's just one item thats rated. IMO to call it a rated recovery point it needs to be tested as fitted to a chassis. I'm sure some are but not all. I prefer to use the term suitable which is more vague but removes the false safety element.

[@budget4wheeling641]

As for improving these tethered straps, first should the tether be of the same rating as the strap and maybe a Joey pouch to hold a few metres of the tether so the driver has time to react.

[@budget4wheeling641]

@Low Range 4wd WA I have my moments. The problem is the end user, will they use it correctly ?

[@budget4wheeling641]

@Low Range 4wd WA IMO there is to much focus on numbers IE how many KG's something can hold pull extra. What's the point of a 5000kg "recovery point" when what it's bolted to isn't rated. How many 4wd have a tow rating of 5000kg on the front ? How people actually know what swl or wll means or what the percentage factor means or what the difference is between them and breaking point. When I learnt, I don't remember hearing about people being hurt, but back then we also learnt from doing it with our elders and it was a privilege to do it due to the cost. Unlike today, most items are a lot cheaper and people just do it without any form of training or knowledge.

[@DnaKGames]

one hell of a professional production. solid stuff bud

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks mate

[@anthonylongdon1649]

Hi watching this in my view & I'm sure you must have taken this into account the fuse link should be on the tether with the weighted air bags attached to that so when it does fail it's ground to the weight reducing it's energy

[@MadMatt4WD]

I can't see the tether having enough weight to cause a problem.

[@marclemoullec7997]

What if you shortened the tether point too much using the bow shackle instead of an other soft shackle. It needs a longer tether point!

[@MadMatt4WD]

I don’t think that would have made any difference at alll.

[@willierule3744]

It looks to me that by the time the strap fails it has already stretched to the point where when it does fail you don't have to travel any further to make that other safety strap snap my thought would be if you add another 5 or 6 ft to the little safety strap then your big strap isn't stretch far enough for it to run right through that little safety strap I think a good 8 to 10 ft would be sufficient amount of length to stop the strap from coiling off the vehicle and smashing into a vehicle being pulled

[@MadMatt4WD]

That's what we're thinking as well.

[@brentbridston]

MadMatt, Did they ever come out with a safety tether snatch strap that works?

[@willierule3744]

@Jason Bowman you would think that they would you know because there is recommended strength and then failure strength so totally agree

[@neitzsche5150]

Excellent video, Matt. Your test confirms why it is vitally important to load the KERR slowly, allowing the rope to gradually absorb the high levels of kinetic energy associated with this procedure. Also, you did a great job detailing the proper tow hitches to use. Many people are unaware of the dangers of using tow hooks or even attaching ropes to their bumpers!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks mate. I can but try.

[@brianhamilton7581]

Mile Marker Recovery Rope in 2" receiver with hitch Pin No problems!

[@dachet10]

I have seen a towbar become a very nasty missile when it broke free from its mountings.

[@jesusisalive3227]

I use my hitch pin also, I've never had a problem and the strap never falls off.

[@UpNorthOutWest]

Until the hitch pin is bent in your receiver and cant get it out....lol

[@georgesimmons2946]

Well, the moral of this test for me is the 9000kg snatch strap is far to light. I know you guys said use items rated for your vehicle, but after watching this test 9000kg strap is not up to the loads. My snatch strap kit is rated to 13,000kg and I only have done 3 recoveries, my heavy recovery took 2 goes, so still good for another 6 recoveries. I had to snatch out a heavy 79 series LC and first go hit it very hard, and it just sprung my back, not damage to the strap, second go out it came, so higher rated snatch strap is for me the way to go.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Interesting but you have not understood how a snatch strap works when doing a Kinetic energy recovery. Also the purpose of this video is not to teach the finer points of a snatch recovery but to highlight the dangers.

[@fmmrz5]

This would be an AMAZING video to collaborate with the slow mo guys KZbin channel to get some serious slomo shots of the strap breaking

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes

[@TheChillBison]

I was thinking the same thing, like @HowRidiculous

[@papablista627]

My first thought when I watched that strap break was the tether wasn't long enough , It really never gave you time to stop or really slow your ute. Another great video. Oh BTW , I subbed when I first found your channel .

[@MadMatt4WD]

Cheers. Yeah I never had hope in the tether working either.

[@russellhembrow4196]

What about 2 snatch-straps one a meter or so longer with some loops around both so the failing snatch-strap clings to the back up strap?

[@MadMatt4WD]

Apparently that can work

[@ridermak4111]

Russell Hembrow That is a very good idea. 🤔 🤜🤛 Much simpler than mine. I wrote a whole book in my “idea” 😳

[@oldterm6978]

I also agree the tether should be shock absorbing. ? If it should be tied or anchored separate from the two anchor points as a better catch (since you can't stop fast enough to keep from breaking it). Climbers use it (second anchor) for static climbs. With a moving vehicle that energy has to absorbed somewhere (when strap fails). Appreciate the demo. Has me thinking more on it.

[@MadMatt4WD]

pleasure

[@ppx4243]

Be worth testing a longer very elastic tether

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes

[@Rx7man]

I think the tether would perform far better if it was elastic.. if your main snatch strap has a stretch of 2m, I think you need a tether that stretches to at least that, and probably double that would make it most effective

[@dachet10]

The big risk is usually bits coming adrift during snatch strap recovery. I have had a recovery point come off a vehicle and hit bull bar then plough through the grille and radiator. The safest recovery is not winching as the steel rope is also elastic and can cut legs, arms or even bodies in half. Safest is chain as no stretch. If it breaks it will just fall to the ground. Best thing to happen in this arena in many years is the soft shackle!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Bang on but rather than chain we use synthetic rope. It light strong and falls to the ground as well.

[@Bread996]

I’ve never seen any evidence of anybody being “cut in half” by a steel winch rope. It will bruise, but not cut flesh. It’s a myth.

[@SeppoVataja]

The tether should have a shock absorber similar to a Fall Arrest Lanyard

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes i should.

[@dr_tate]

I work in a JLG 600AJ Boom Lift.. that was what I was thinking too

[@jasonforrest9833]

Thanks for all the research you have done on recovery ropes and straps. Awesome vid.

[@MadMatt4WD]

My pleasure!

[@JJ-si4qh]

I'm glad that there are so many others that care about the well-being of the tree.

[@MadMatt4WD]

the tree is just fine thank you

[@adamg7270]

Safety tether should be 1/3 the length of the snatch strap, with folded loops held together with zip ties. -Lessons learned from high power rocket recovery. You want that energy dissipation stretched out over time through the series of zip ties snapping, before loading what's left into the tether.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Very cool idea

[@thequickbrownfox7289]

Have you considered 2 tethers, each midway between the ends and the center, and anchored or weighted to the ground?

[@MadMatt4WD]

no i hadn't

[@craigquann]

Thats an idea. Basically built in sand bags....

[@stevenmorrell9414]

I’m glad I watched this 😂 I just had the air damper on and never filled it 😂😂 thanks 🇬🇧from the East

[@ikesquirrel]

I wonder what kind of energy wave goes through the frame when one of those straps lets go.

[@MadMatt4WD]

big ones????

[@Birdgyver]

Hi. I'm not an engineer and I don't have a degree or anything, and I have never done a recovery, but I am a safety freak. When I first seen this video and what you wanted to accomplish, I immediately knew what was going to happened. I think that the safety strap sould be ?x more than the recovery rope/strap. The same concept that you had when you connected the strap to your vehicle. So if the rope/strap fails at 9,000 units, then the safety should fail at 11,000 units, and for it to be long enough for you/the driver, knows when it fails so that they can stop in time. This is just my own opinion.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yeah when I first saw the design I didn’t think it would work either. I think a fall arrest type design is what’s needed.

[@patrickmatthews9779]

Can you do some videos featuring kenectic rope and the pros and cons on using them?

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes

[@michaelmcdonald1620]

subbed! found you from MORR.. thanks for the quality content!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Pleasure and welcome

[@JeffZaiham]

Great video Matt, I'm a 4x4 enthusiast and trainer I'm Malaysia and I'm constantly searching for better methods of safe recovery. My comment on the test itself relates back to the product being tested. Yes the tether failed due to flaws in design and the loads overlooked. In retrospect, the test due load the products beyond the limits of the ratings, but that is often try with every recovery scenario. Looking at the weakest point along the whole chain, the strap itself proved to be that as per intended and designed. I was looking for methods to secure the recovery points and accessories attached as they are the potential missiles that can hurt someone. Would you have any ideas on that, like using a briddle to halve the loads of recovery points, bridle line as fuse etc. Great job on this BTW.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Hi Jeff. i like bridles for sure and i also like suitable recovery points. I'm a little cautious around the idea of rated recovery points in that the can provide a false sense of security. It comes down to a rated point has to be fitted to a non rated chassis so my question is what is rated? Is the the complete recovery system or just the bit of steel that gets bolted to the chassis. Search my playlists for other work I've done that you may find helpful and interesting. I'm happy for you to use this content in your training if it's helpful.

[@dezzad1998]

Hi Matt and Jeff. Firstly great vid very informative I'm new to off roading however I'm owner operator of a tilt tray aassisted with installing wire rope barriers on the freeways in Perth. Which gives me an idea for a tether on the wire rope system they feed the 20mm wire through a swaged loop in 10mm wire which is anchored the concrete footing. The theory is that the larger wire gets tangled by the looped wire slowing and sometimes stopping the highly tensioned larger from being missile. So I wonder if attaching a spare strap either snatch or tow of a shorter length or double through shackle, giving us 2 loops to work with 1 close and 2nd towards the middle and still use a damper or 2. I hope this helps.

[@bobgrauer]

Almost 50 years ago we didn't have the ropes you have today, but we did do something quite similar. We used 2 chains and a car tire. We could pullout farm tractors and combines with a standard 4 wheel drive P/U.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yeah wow. I might have heard of that idea before.

[@kayakuprising5914]

Awesome. That strap needs a stronger, and longer, failure strap. At least longer than the anticipated 20% stretch of the main strap.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Bang on. Did you watch the debriefing video

[@rockymountboy]

@@MadMatt4WD Shouldn't it be heavy duty shock cord?

[@thisoldjeepcj5]

Snatch straps, kinetic ropes, winch cables, tow straps, chains, etc. are all potentially dangerous. Thanks for sharing the information to help us be safer.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Pleasure mate

[@silverrunner8687]

This! ⬆️

[@rthinds]

The breaking of the snatch strap is shock-loading the tether. None of the tether joints (sewing) were made for shock-loading, especially with the forces depicted in the video. Listen to the sound of that thing breaking at 10:30. Wow!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yeah the tether never had a chance.

[@idadho]

Matt, Saw you on Matt Winder's channel. There are a variety of zipper types of tether designs that will work.

[@MadMatt4WD]

could you send my some links please

[@kadmow]

Assuming you are meaning something like this: shop.heightdynamics.com.au/products/protecta-lanyards-personal?variant=12402466717796&gclid=Cj0KCQjwhvf6BRCkARIsAGl1GGjalXU6MHOwOzr9zoK_WH-XnqDhvDQ0928BGFUgEx1KaboIdiplqtUaAjd4EALw_wcB (If it had ?? half- to length extension capacity - basically another strap in a bundle at either end now we at three straps to make one safe.??)

[@jackfourbee3609]

Wow. I always grab the snatch strap first. Been the only 80 amongst hiluxes and Gqs. I bet I’m not the only one that has pulled a small tether over a good snatch. 😁. Awesome vid. Keep up the good work Matt.

[@coptotermes]

You also mention that there’s no way a bow shackle will break in a 4wd recovery. I would say we expect the same from a snatch block.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I would agree except there's some on the market that are failing. I've had one fail and seen a umber of others that failed.

[@douglasmaso5756]

@@MadMatt4WD Which ones specifically have you seen that have failed? I think that is valuable safety information...

[@seankelly353]

My 2 cents on kinetic straps and safely using them . Now commen sense IS Required! At times of sketchy recoverys I have attached a second strap looped a bit loosely around the center of snatch strap being used and anchored to a tree/ other vehicle what have you that way you can catch any failed strap or flying vehicle parts. Anyhow great video awsome information!! Stay safe out there and enjoy!!!

[@pcbmale]

fold the tether and sew it together, like a shok cord for climbing, it takes so much force to break the threads, that would absorb energy, then the strap taking the load and breaking would absorb the rest

[@MadMatt4WD]

I agree

[@thomaskiger6960]

I was a test engineer in the forklift industry. Have experience using load cell.. it takes expensive equipment to do that kind of testing. I agree they should have a three meter tether with folds sown in to make it about a meter long. Wonder if some kind of parachute attached after fuse would slow down strap.

[@wirebrush]

My thought exactly. Tether should be just like the tethers used for fall arresting harnesses. It should be engineered to absorb a lot of energy quickly.

[@johnbodnar3720]

Good on you mate, guys like you make everything better and easier for us

[@garyp.7501]

Wow! Way cool! Thank you for doing this!... Nice to see that the bow shackle held and that I should use more than one air drag and weight it. If they really wanted that strap to stop the end from hitting the other end, you'd length it. As the strap breaks at the hitch, you'd want enough strap that the broken piece can get almost back to the anchor (the tree) at which point the catch strap would start to pull it back forward. But when you continue driving forward, it breaks, but this time the amount of energy is way less. You'd only need enough strength to survive the pull forward as the main strap changes direction, but not as much as the original strap because we are going to load it back up, and we want the catch strap to break without a huge load on it. Still though that would be a lot of lose strap hanging around as you would need this amount of strap on both ends. And in a successful recovery you are going to be dragging the strap along the ground. The solution is probably to sew the catch strap to the main strap really lightly. With these stitches expected to fail as the truck moves forward and the main strap moves back to the tree. PS I just ordered a second ARB recovery damper. While 3 may be perfect, two seemed to do close enough to what I need.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Great comment.

[@garyp.7501]

@@MadMatt4WD oh yeah, you'd want to sew loops of the catch strap to the main strap so under normal stretch, the stitching wouldn't be stressed.

[@ExploreAnywhere]

I’m all about safety. Love wheeling and have been buying gear based on others experience and recommendations, not on whats trending like a snatch rope for example. Although I may still get one for my gear as a winch extension, I have learned how to use it safely and how water affects it and how the rope drys up eventually. Thanks

[@MadMatt4WD]

The ropes are a better piece of kit than the strap imo.

[@MeetingManagement]

They need to sow the tether to the snatch strap the other direction when sowing it to the body side of the snatch strap. That way when the snatch strap breaks, the part of the snatch strap that is flying backwords will work against the stitching. And also, you are correct. The tether needs to be a little longer.

[@sceneanuerebelrebel9244]

What I've done is use a small --3"--barge tow line braided into a 20' loop as a recovery device ,class 2 hitches,moderation of the right foot helps.An appropriate rated strap or rope and no full on runs to the end .

[@MadMatt4WD]

Sounds good. I imagine there’s not a lot of stretch with a 3” rope though.

[@mongerz4732]

I'm very new to 4wd...so thank you so much for this video...

[@MadMatt4WD]

Happy to help!

[@WM-jy9dz]

Amen to this! 👍👍👍 everyone who intends to use snatch straps should watch this - and should learn how to use a winch!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes Yes yes.

[@jblookonimages6749]

Found your channel from matts recovery. Interesting to look at your test and conclusions

[@MadMatt4WD]

Welcome

[@r1chardarcher]

The need is to dissipate the energy of the strap. The tether will have done a little bit of that as it tore through the stitching, but obviously not enough. Your talk about the free length of the tether is definitely true, where the strap has extended 1.5m, there needs to be an ability to capture that 1.5m, as well as the number of metres the vehicle will have travelled once the strap has failed. My thoughts are that the energy dissipation could be achieved by something a bit like a fall arrest strap used for working at heights. Quite a number of folds of the tether material stitched together so that the tearing of the stitching assists in dissipating the energy. As we are generally talking of attachment points failing rather than the strap itself as per these tests, the tether can be through the eye of the strap rather than stitched to the strap, as that stitching is what failed. The folded and stitched part of the energy dissipation pack also allows for more tether length in a compact package. Hmmm

[@MadMatt4WD]

good thoughts there

[@member369240sx]

As a design engineer the tether missed the 30% factor... The max stretch of the snatch strap +30% more (~1.5meters + 30%+ 1.94 meters roughly) so the tether should be around 1.9meters. Keep in mind this is not accounting for the power of the recoil. Over all good idea of the tether but falls short in design. Good video. You got me from Matts Offroad recovery channel

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks and welcome. I agree it’s a poor design

[@CooterTravenport]

That’s why if I’m getting pulled out of a hole I always open the hood ( it’s what we call the bonnet in the states) I’ve seen hitches fail and go back through the front window.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I know that theory and it's certainly fine to do I just don't like not being able to see so I ensure I'm hooked safely

[@CooterTravenport]

MadMatt 4WD where I live in the states we don’t have the gnarly hill climbed we just have mud holes so you just get on the brakes when you feel it pop out of the hole

[@carlmenzel8744]

I never go full noise when useing a snatch strap in river sand for example I just go a steady speed not much off idle and let the touque do the work if I don't get it the 1st time I just back up and try again it usually at most if hard 2 to 3 gos there out having said that my trucks a 6 not a 4 more force is required with a lesser car.

[@carlmenzel8744]

@@lastbhatalive yeh someone times you have to put the foot down just last resort

[@jvalentine8376]

The thing that strikes me with many 4x4 owners is you see someone ripping away with a snatch strap until it breaks putting a lot of stress on their vehicle and the other vehicle also , when all along they had a big fat winch under the bull bar . Yeah , "it's quick an easy until it fails quickly and easily ". To make the strap safer add air brakes . Small parachutes attached along the strap .

[@MadMatt4WD]

I totally agree. Way to fast to grab the snatchy.

[@jaymanxxxx]

I use 18,000. lbs. snatch straps for my jeep (jeep wt.5,000lbs) and anytime I use one, I stretch it out about 3 ft. then slow to a stop that is best for the strap. I use 20-30 ft. straps with a recommended 5% stretch. the reason I stop is because if the truck i'm pulling is in fact hung up snap!

[@jesusisalive3227]

I do the same, I never hit the strap unless it's the last option.

[@SarasotaTim]

At the end of the video talking about walking around in the big hole hahaha In a situation where your stuck you just do what you can. But try and be calm and think logically. Then go slow even if you have to snatch 4-5 times. NEVER floor it on the first time. Great information in the video 🤙 😎 Cheers from south Florida USA 🇺🇸

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yep. :)

[@kingstonsean]

You talked about not connecting the bow shackle to the hitch receiver became of the stress on the welds, but you have that Factor 55 thing in the receiver. What's the difference?

[@MadMatt4WD]

I'm talking about the weld where the flat plate that holds the towball is welded to the receiver.

[@kingstonsean]

@@MadMatt4WD Now I understand. Semantics. I call that assembly (7:08) the "ball mount and draw bar assembly" (usually just "ball mount"). The "hitch receiver" for me is the square tube on the truck-frame mounted hitch that accepts the "ball mount". I purchased a "receiver mounted d-ring shackle" for my Frontier that slides into the hitch receiver (in place of the ball mount) and is secured by the hitch pin. So when I heard you say we shouldn't use the receiver as part of your recovery set up I thought you were referring to the hitch receiver tube!

[@radracer4011]

My suggestion, combine the 2. Use the weighted bag, but tether it to the vehicle. One at each end at about the 3rd points, with some weight to help absorb the recoil. It'll weigh down the strap, and, being tethered to the vehicle, won't go flying back to the other end as a projectile. And since it isn't "fixed" it'll hopefully slide along the strap some if you reach the end of the tether.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thats an interesting idea.

[@oneshot1984]

I have always placed a blanket over the anchor end of snatch strap about 1/2 length, if/when it breaks the blanket is a huge brake in the strap recoil.........

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes a blanket can work.

[@q07906]

Very informative video, as always! Keep up the good work mate!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Cheers

[@russellwolter5153]

My opinion is slightly different than yours of the tether. I think the tether is there to reduce to slingshot effect upon failure. If you do the experiment with and without the tether and focus your results on the speed of snap back. Great content Matt.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I see what your saying. I don't think this tether did much to remove any energy of consequence from the situation.

[@DependableAutoTruck]

when i am looking for a new product i have never used i do just what i am doing now i go the the You tube online college such good information

[@MadMatt4WD]

I’m glad we can help. I work hard to give good info.

[@alexandercrawley5750]

With the rise of soft shackles and the sort what are your thoughts on recovery ropes instead of a snatch strap?

[@jaymanxxxx]

bubba rope comes to mind for me, if that's what your talking about my thoughts are ropes are stronger due to the compacting of fibers when stretched.

[@alexandercrawley5750]

Bubba rope is one that comes to mind for me to but with so many out there now I'm just curious if anyone has done a side by side test with a rope and snatch strap to see what breaks first and at what loads

[@ridestreet20]

@Alexander Crawley I can't say I've done a side by side but I have bought and broken a lot of straps through the years. Straps are cheap and good for towing. Recovery ropes are expensive and good for recovery. That is all there is to it.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Alex this is something I would like to explore.

[@robertnewman4105]

Snatch strap ... is that what they normally call a "kinetic recovery rope?" or do you mean a regular pull strap that is not made to stretch ?

[@PatrickKQ4HBD]

A kinetic recovery strap stretches a lot. A tow strap stretches as little as possible. Towing with one feels like using a steel chain. I prefer to tow with an elastic recovery strap or rope. The only difference between the two is the round vs flat cross section.

[@robertnewman4105]

@@PatrickKQ4HBD OK so I guess the lesson is try to uses a kinetic rope, and not a snatch strap when in these situations.

[@PatrickKQ4HBD]

@@robertnewman4105 Not really. They're the same thing, in that they are designed to soak up the forward momentum of the recovery vehicle, to give the stuck vehicle some help getting out. They're different SHAPES, but they do the same JOB. The proper way to use them is to begin with very gentle tugs, back up, give it a little more, back up, give it a little bit more, and so on until the stuck vehicle is able to drive out of the hole. Key point! This guys went right to full throttle specifically to break the straps, not to demonstrate how to use them in a recovery. Don't laugh, some people will gas it right away. TL;DR, use a stretchy recovery/snatch rope/strap, not a tow strap or chain. ⛓️

[@MadMatt4WD]

Excellent comment thanks Patrick

[@PatrickKQ4HBD]

@@MadMatt4WD Excellent channel, MadMatt! I've subscribed.

[@glennj6465]

Hi guys have ya thought of extending the red strap by 2-3 m and fold it into a shrink wrapped sleeves like on a safety drop harness people wear ??? That will then have more length to absorb the recoil and keep it out of the way until it’s needed ? Be safe 👍🏻

[@MadMatt4WD]

I have thought of that and have even tried to get it made.

[@hitchpost5822]

I guess you make some good points, the tether need to be redesigned but I have never seen anyone use a strap with that much vehicle acceleration seems like operator error to me.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Go into facebook and look I the page called "i got stuck at inskip point" then come back to me.

[@MartinsGarage97]

I am learning as much as I can before I go offroading. I really wanna go but I don't have friends that have rigs. And being an excursion I don't wanna sit out there waiting for a veichle big enough to move me with their equipment. So I fixed up my rig steering new wheels and tires and regular work. I just bought rhino USA strap hitch hard shackle and a soft shackle. I am in Oregon so snow plow ice breaker chains already for all 4 and I have 430s. I wish we had someone like you here. Tired of trying to ask shops stuff and try to price gouge me

[@MadMatt4WD]

I’m glad to help

[@marxtuf]

Take yourself a look at the system used for fall arrest lanyards on industrial personnel harnessing. The lanyard is considerably longer but sewn up in layers to gradually fail and absorb the initial impact.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yeah that’s what I think would work here. No one want to do it though

[@kengartner6659]

What if you used a 20ft kinetic recovery strap for the recovery with a 30ft strap loosly spiraled around the 20ft strap both being atached to the vehicles. The second longer strap or rope should keep broken 20ft strap controled and down low?? Would be interested in seeing a load cell or scale device in the rigging to record the actual force or load that was applied Here.

[@MadMatt4WD]

That’s kinda what ditch witch did with their design. It worked well.

[@motorvatorv888]

Fascinating stuff. I also have seen enough pictures of pierced 4x4s to find snatch recoveries scary. Much of the military forbids them unless the vehicles are armoured. Even then, winching is always preferred. Back to the tether; it’s only going to work if it’s a similar strength to the original strap. My thinking: kinetic energy from vehicle->potential energy in strap as vehicle extends strap. Fuse fails. The potential energy is released becoming kinetic energy of the free end strap. It’s the same amount of energy. So to capture free end and store its energy, you need another 9T strap. And you’ve got a tow vehicle that’s still moving to deal with too. The only way to get out of this bind is to create big losses, ie create a good damper/s that dissipates as much energy as possible from the flying strap. And we’re back at the first part of the video.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Great comment. I’ve thought some type of fall arrest design with layered stitching. But yes kinetic recovery is my last resort.

[@Governor_William_J_Lepetomane]

Great video. The safety tethers would perform much better if they were kinetic in design like a kinetic recovery rope. All they need to do is reduce the amount of force in the tow strap before the tether fails, and that would be enough to ensure that the tow strap doesn't kill anyone.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Maybe that would work. It might just make the strap bounce as such.

[@commando2583]

Found you through Matt's off road recovery. Never have used a snach strap. Awolys used chains or cable with multi heavy wool blankets And slow pulls. Where I tie to the vehicle is a chain looped through the center of the receiver.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Welcome. In your case you are not performing a kinetic recovery but rather a tow recovery, 2 very different proceedures.

[@Gator75dka]

So, what failed at your truck for the bow shackle to detach and hit the tree? (1:30) I would guess that, not wanting to destroy something at your truck (going against a large tree) you sacrificed something.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes I developed a fuse using multiple small ropes. Started with one and kept adding till it got the effect

[@steveg219]

Thanks Matt for all the great content!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks for the thanks.

[@steveg219]

@@MadMatt4WD thanks for thanks thanks Mate!! 😂

[@MadMatt4WD]

😂😂😂😂

[@ericperry5998]

First off great video lots of useful info. Secondly I’ve seen these bow shackles fail mostly due to the fact they improperly used or have just been mistreated. (Another video idea if not already done.) I no longer leave bow shackles on the exterior of my vehicle to get abused on rocks and so forth after seeing some of these issues. Actually I leave none except for the winch line and hook outside of the vehicle. As far as the tethered strap goes I like the idea another viewer had on using the idea of a shock absorber from a safety lanyard. Those things are designed for up to 5k lbs or 2267 kgs.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Great points Thanks

[@jase1911]

I know that this is a older video but over here in the US 🇺🇸 we use snatch "ropes" rather than a strap huge difference...check out "yankum ropes" from Idaho, plus you can yank these hundreds of times vs the straps

[@MadMatt4WD]

I have some videos on here with Matt from Winder Towing using the ropes.

[@ridermak4111]

Another idea for a safety tether that would need testing. This could be added to any snatch strap or even maybe to a winch cable. A length of rope or strap that is about 40’ longer than the snatch strap, that is, 20’ extra length for each end that is held in a Z-folded bunch by a Velcro loop, the end secured to a different spot on the vehicle than the snatch strap. After one end is attached, the rest is spiraled around the snatch strap 8 or 10 or 12 times along the full length and then secured to the other vehicle. Granted, it would not be super quick to set up, but being wrapped around many times I believe would entangle and arrest the speed and distance of a broken strap/hard parts. The extra 20’ (or maybe just 10’) would deploy from the Velcro loop with enough slack to not get broken itself but short enough to catch the flying parts. ........ I hope this description isn’t totally confusing but I think the spiral entanglement has merit. PS I don’t think the recoil of the broken snatch strap broke the tether of the original design/video. I think the rapidly moving vehicle reached the end of the short tether.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I think Ditch Hitch has a system as you describe. We didn't have great slow mo but it wasn't the vehicle speed that broke it when we watched it back frame by frame. kzbin.info/www/bejne/fqbSmZxjbsipbpI

[@jakeapplegate8943]

Great video 👍I appreciate the time and effort put into this!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks Jake

[@rtarrant1]

Great advice. Do you still use bow shackles… and how many would you recommend to travel with .

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes I do and at least two.

[@donhappel9928]

late to the party, but aside from the fall arresting set-ups many have suggested, perhaps using something akin to a rappelling brake rack? Secure it to the vehicle and run the tether through it with a free end. In a failure the drag of the broken strap pulling the tether through the rack would slow it over time and you don't have to worry about the vehicle running on and breaking the tether. Not sure if this would work based on the energy involved or how practical it would be in actual use but could potentially work.

[@MadMatt4WD]

could you please link a video with this system.

[@donhappel9928]

@@MadMatt4WD kzbin.info/www/bejne/gaTPZ4ibZ8uKjdk You wouldn't need all the features of a rappelling rack, but as you can see the friction to slow the rope is simply caused by weaving through the bars. As they slide they get tighter and bind, bringing the rope to a full stop. For a tether strap I'd picture it more as a non-sliding set of bars that still open to make it easy to insert the tether through them. The rack is anchored to the truck and the loose end of the tether fed through it with only enough slack to allow for the stretch of the recovery strap and the remainder left free. In a failure the strap snaps back but has to pull the free end of the tether through the rack where the friction slows it. Would take some testing to ensure the tether was sewn well enough to the strap that it didn't just tear off and that there was enough length to the tether to slow the strap before it pulled all the way through. You would still get some snap back from the strap from the drag of the rack on the tether but substantially less than it simply parting. And having the free end pull out of the rack means you don't have to worry about trying to stop the vehicle in a short distance as the tether would simple pull through at a fixed resistance. Could it be designed to provide enough resistance to slow a broken strap without being too cumbersome or expensive to use? Not sure. Just an idea that would need more exploring to really verify.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks Don, That's interesting. I wonder if heat would be an issue?

[@lovemypajero]

Very informative video. With the recovery strap with the tether I think it would be better that the tether is the same size as the main strap 3m in length but folded in the last meter and a little stitch or something similar to keep it there. If your strap breaks at the fuse and recoils you have the 3m extra with 9t load to pull up in. You will either feel or hear it break so you have the length to stop saving a lot of damage.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I think this sort of idea is the solution. It’s how a fall arrest system works

[@ridermak4111]

I’m pausing the video at 11:00 minutes to comment so I might be too hasty but .... I didn’t understand your description at first, then when I saw it I thought it was a brilliant idea but why isn’t the tether about 80% or 90% as long as the strap and accordion folded under a Velcro loop ? Wait..... I have a big roll of 2” wide industrial Velcro. What about the whole length and width of the tether, Z-folded against Velcro. The inertia of the strap is lightweight enough the Velcro would slow it down some before it completely unfolded. It could even be made as an add-on kit for existing straps. Maybe the forward end of the tether “system” should be attached to a separate spot on the vehicle just in case the failure is forward of the strap fuse.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Lol. Champion comment. You have some great thoughts there and I certainly would like to explore some different solutions

[@ridermak4111]

MadMatt 4WD You and I both responded to Russell Hembrow’s suggestion of 2 unequal length yank straps joined loosely every few feet with loops. It just dawned on me that if the tether needs to be a lot longer anyway, exchange Russell’s 2 nd strap idea for just one super long tether attached to both vehicles, with plenty of extra length accordion folded at each end. Along the length Russell’s idea of loose retainer loops is 👌

[@marceld6061]

This is an older video at this point but my thought is this: The tether should be elastic. 1) When the strap breaks, the elastic will stretch to absorb the energy from the broken strap. 2) it should have enough stretch to allow the tow vehicle to come to a stop before breaking. Your thoughts?

[@MadMatt4WD]

I’ve wondered the same and would love to see it tested out. I don’t have the ability to do that.

[@profesonalantagonist]

For the safety tether replace the solid strap with something like a fall arrest lanyard. Get one that can extend out to maybe 3 meters or more with no solid connection at the anchored end. This way the recoiling strap will pull the arrest lanyard breaking the safety stitching as designed and that will consume the recoil energy of the strap so that when it finally completes its separation there is not enough energy left to create any substantial hazard.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Interesting

[@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259]

I use a heavy furniture blanket over the recovery strap but I never try snatching or jerking the load, I just pull the strap, stretching it then stop and hold with my brakes, till the load overcomes friction and begins to move.

[@MadMatt4WD]

That sounds like you do a tow recovery. Which is excellent.

[@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259]

@@MadMatt4WD It's good to know the proper term, thanks.

[@jimfrancis]

I fully believe that you'd have a completely different reaction to the strap, if the tether were attached to the strap at the 1/3rd mark. It seems that the danger spot is at the fuse point, when it breaks, and the original tether didn't change that spot. Moving the tether attach point back to the 1/3rd mark would add much more stopping power to the tether, rather than being so close to the initial break point inertia. Use a whip for example, the shorter the whip, the less inertia at the tip, lengthen the tether to shorten the whip length from 9meters to 3meters, the failed strap should have less inertia (and danger).

[@MadMatt4WD]

thats an idea worth exploring

[@bmd1825]

@ Jim Francis - Ditto....failure repeatedly occurs at the fused/ stitched point. Great point to move down 1/3 of the distance and see the results.

[@gold5th]

Downside to that is typically stitching doesn't stretch.. so you'd have a 4-5" section that has no stretch in the mid working section of the strap and after repeated hits you might start popping stitches.