Dave Meltzer's Agenda vs. Actual Facts Of Vince Russo's WCW Run

Vince Russo and Jeff Lane watch a clip of Dave Meltzer's incorrect recollection of WCW's ratings during the period of the Russo/Ferrara era of WCW! Russo's Brand Producer Jeff Lane pulls out factual data to prove Meltzer wrong!
Watch the full CASTRATING THE MARKS episode only at / russotwc !
MUSIC: "I'm Still Standin', Bro" by Jim Johnston
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[@bb-gc2tx]

never forget dave meltzer is a 65 year old man who was getting emotional in argument about whether a Z level female wrestler was playing a heel in her match. guy is a WEIRDO🤣

[@mattleee]

Did you see the top of his hair / bald head when his Dog pulled off his headset? 😂

[@NiccoloMachiavelliJr]

These are the same guys that jump for joy whenever AEW viewers go up by 1%

[@neilsun2521]

Good point! The hypocrisy knows no bounds with circus shills like Dave n Bryan.

[@gregsullivan5267]

An entertaining show far outweighs a "wrestling" show in my opinion.

[@neilsun2521]

The wrestling part should only be used to settle a conflict between 2 characters. A wrestling match with no backstory is a circus act.

[@Shaunspa]

Not a particular fan of Russo but denying his influence on the Attitude Era is crazy. Foley makes a point several times in his books to shout out his impact.

[@SeanzViewEnt]

imagine if AEW got CLOSE to the Ratings of 2's.......

[@BisonNews1]

The closest was the 1.4M during the debut 5 years ago

[@JMFSpike]

@@BisonNews1 Yep, and the only reason it was so high is because people were curious. It's common for the very first episode of a show to do a decent number before declining, but if a show is good the ratings should start increasing again and eventually overtake those first show numbers. That didn't happen with AEW. Instead, 800k - 900k was the norm for a long time. Then CM Punk came in and 1.0m became the norm for a short time, but when he left it dropped back down to 800k. At least it was a very consistent 800k, but in just the last few months we've seen it suddenly decline to the point where the norm is now under 700k.

[@michaelmansini2307]

True

[@neilsun2521]

It's amazing Meltzer and Alvarez have made a career out of working their own people; their fellow marks. Dave and Alvarez are like the snake oil cult leaders of the geeks.

[@mattleee]

Bischoff and Meltzer are both top level frauds

[@fu102]

Not only is and up a big deal, but it was a miracle to simply stabilize even away from the down of the WCW product.

[@alfiehickson8440]

The children/indy cosplay wrestlers at AEW all looking upto Meltzer and including him reminds me of that guy at school who has no friends his age so hangs around with little kids so they look upto him!

[@neilsun2521]

Like the man in Dazed & Confused who hangs around school to bang the chicks: "I get older, they stay the same age".

[@BIPOCShakur]

As oppose to the children/indy cosplay wrestlers at WWE all looking up to HBK and Paul Levesque? Gotcha 👍🏿

[@user-rx2hw8up2j]

At least Paul had a highly successful career in the ring ​@@BIPOCShakur

[@alfiehickson8440]

@@BIPOCShakur Atleast they were actually IN the wrestling industry and at the highest level! If Meltzer was ever In a locker room he'd be whistling stranger in paradise!

[@neilsun2521]

Kinda like Matthew McConaughey's character in Dazed n Confused..

[@KingOfAssyria_IIVI]

The focus on entertainment made me watch. Loved that.

[@D4NK1]

Meltzer wishes his ideas were never put into practise at AEW and exposing those ideas for being totally unable to keep an audience. At least before he could say 'well if someone did what I said they would be successful "

[@StanTheMan450]

“Go ahead Jeff….”

[@alenton81]

1:23 Jeff Lane spitting THE TRUTH there. It is easily forgotten. Those 2 marks are just idiots.

[@davidj5910]

umm Meltzer when was the last time AEW did 3 point ANYTHING??

[@satishmaharaj6768]

Thank u

[@Michiganfan105]

0.3 would be an excellent rating by current AEW standards!

[@alfiehickson8440]

I've watched wrestling since the early 80's. It was never more popular or culturally relevant than when Russo was writing the tv! Being from the uk I was the only Wrestling fan I knew upto about 1997! I remember being at my friends house with about 12 lads and we voted to watch Raw for Austin Mcmahon and The Rock over Match of the day ( a football highlights show that was like a religion especially back then) The idea of that happening today is laughable! These dirt sheet guys are the minority and they're killing the business.

[@neilsun2521]

It became acceptable to admit you watched wrestling when Russo was writing the shows back then. Many people came out of the closet! Many people started watching for the first time cos it spoke to '90s pop culture. (Rather than '70s pop culture when Corny was writing...)

[@thepubknight6144]

The mental gymnastics Meltzer and his marks do to dismiss Vince Russo's positive impact on Pro wrestling business is completely delusional

[@michaelmansini2307]

I grew up in Australia RAW was always 2 weeks delayed. Then when Austin got popular it went to 1 week, then 1 day, then live with another replay at night since live was like 5am in the morning

[@seangalvin4582]

Rating for falling shows rarely go back up once a downward decline starts. It's very difficult.

[@mattleee]

Russo would know, he took the WWF from a 3 to a 8 rating 😂

[@ChrisCash720]

Meanwhile aew has never seen a number close to WCW

[@SchlomoNosengreensteinberg]

It was hilarious listening to dave try to defend 502k

[@alfiehickson8440]

Aew would kill for those numbers today! 😅

[@TheRealdealbay]

😂😂😂😂😂 Not if tooney khan has anything too do with it he would be afraid for his life 😂😂😂😂

[@analiysanchez9949]

So would wwe

[@satishmaharaj6768]

Oh an Jeff ain’t lying they did thank Russo on wwf attitude for the ps1 I had it it’s in the credits

[@thepubknight6144]

Russo is responsible for the attitude era and the TNA knockouts division Definitely gonna give him his flowers

[@alfiehickson8440]

Meltzer and these guys are obsessed fans. You just KNOW even at 60 years old Dave puts a replica wrestling belt over his Pajamas when hes home alone!

[@user-rx2hw8up2j]

I think Dave wears the belt when he's watching the ppvs ...and only the belt

[@alfiehickson8440]

@@user-rx2hw8up2j 🤢 😆

[@bb-gc2tx]

ive said could dave hang out with group people his age 65 who know nothing about wrestling and hold a normal conversation with nothing to do with wrestling ?🤣

[@rubenarriaga3029]

The IWGP belt

[@thepubknight6144]

​@@bb-gc2tx Peaked in high school movie trope in real life

[@ElAssoWipe-o]

Russo was credited in one of the WWF games back in the 90's? I didn't know that and I played those games.

[@thepubknight6144]

Yes and He also is the creator of the TNA knockouts division

[@Lakers-rj2gw]

Dave is a disgrace

[@mattleee]

100% accurate, Dave the Disgrace

[@PersonalAcc1989]

It’s amazing that Russo gets treated this way. You catch these people at P Diddys house or something?

[@danielburger1775]

What is pathetic is that even while spewing lies about Vince Russo, Meltzer Magoo still has to attack Hulk Hogan as well. So, in Meltzer's deranged mind Russo had a negative impact on wrestling. Hulk Hogan had a negative impact on wrestling. But Strong Style has been great for wrestling. And having guys who look like 15-year-olds winning World Heavyweight Championships has been great for wrestling.

[@thepubknight6144]

Adam Blampeid, WrestleLamia, What culture, top ten wrestling and Simon Miller are all his cult followers and have said the same nonsense for years

[@satishmaharaj6768]

Jeff is spitting facts tho I mean a up is a up come on ppl

[@microsofttechsupport3622]

It’s crazy that WCW beat WWF 84 weeks straight but when the ratings go down at AEW he always has some type of excuse about it. But sure he’s not being biased

[@jamesb1988]

The thing that I loved most about Vince Russo's WWF run as head writer is the way he incorporated the entire roster into the show. Everybody from the main eventers to the curtain jerkers had something going on, and that's why if you watch anything from back then nowdays you will see guys like Crash Holly & Billy Gunn & Al Snow getting MONSTER pops. People can deny it all they want, but the facts are the facts: The Architect of the Attitude Era who was responsible for the highest ratings the WWF ever had is Vince Russo.

[@justinodell5407]

That's a big no yeet bro

[@maxcombo3448]

let's have Russo Jeff Cornette Meltzer Brian Last and Alvarez have a debate with each other get them all in a room and have at it

[@ElAssoWipe-o]

Cornette is a wuss he would never debate Russo

[@thepubknight6144]

Russo and Cornette agree on Meltzer and Alvarez but it will be fun to see Russo and Cornette roasting both of them

[@Ziomaletto]

Cornette is too much of a bitch to face Russo.

[@ffvffv5709]

I think at this point the only quibble is just the amount of input Russo had. There is no doubt having Rock/Austin would help prop up any schlock pitched, but there is also no denying that the shot in the arm Russo gave was necessary at the most stagnant time in WWE's history up until that point.

[@Steven-rp8zo]

I'm pretty sure Alvarez is wearing a hair piece. Just sayin'

[@MerryOlSoulGigglesmith]

Meltzer is a proven liar , hes having a disaster of a year. Oh and all Meltzer ideas for AEW are failures. Meltzer might just be jealousn of russo .

[@jaggersingh7043]

Numbers may have gone up but Siegal did say Russo's writing was not "advertiser friendly."

[@mattleee]

Friendly enough to make WWF a multi billion $ company

[@toddburnett9563]

Uncle Dave dont know shit

[@dmanentertament125]

You deserved longer than 3months bro no pun intended, but ratings did go up, and you're very 1st nitro got a 4.0 according to Wikipedia, and the next 3 months it was still 1.0 to 1.1 higher with a 3.6 3.7 compared to when you leave it goes to 3.0 and 2.6 which is a loss when you are gone. Meltzer and Alvarez dont know anything about the business and it proves everytime something of there's gets read.

[@Elhulkamania]

Russo may of been wrong but it's nothing compared to these two clowns.

[@jesterr7133]

I was watching when all of this happened, and I remember it fondly. Vince played a big part in the Attitude Era, but he also played a big part in his own downfall in WCW. In reality, Vince's success in WWE was greatly aided by the fact that he inherited an unprecedented number of young stars that were all rising and peaking at the same time. Though all but Kane were established before Vince got there, to this day, Vince claims that he is solely responsible for the Attitude Era. At the time, I believed it just like everyone else did. Vince did such a great job promoting himself that everyone believed the hype, including the people at AOL/Time Warner. By making everyone believe that he was solely responsible for the Attitude Era, Vince put unreasonable expectations on himself and doomed himself to failure. Everyone expected Vince to be able to replicate the Attitude Era in WCW. The problem was that he didn't have Shawn Michaels, HHH, Undertaker, Kurt Angle, Steve Austin, the Rock, Mick Foley, and others. Without the talent and gimmicks that he inherited in WWE, it was impossible to replicate that success. Vince had a solid foundation to build on when he started in WWE, but he had to start from scratch in WCW, and it was an unmitigated disaster.

[@SteveOGlo]

But Aew is fine and hasn't gone up at all in 5 years. But it's Nothing that russo brought ratings up in any way during wcw? And nobody says anything about Russos TNA run which The marks Loved TNA then. Up until hogan and Eric came in while TNA was at its best then wanted to get cocky and go against RAW then everything went down from there and Russo left. Then just like wcw they tried switching everything and removed TNA then called it Impact Wrestling and made the whole theme a bunch of Blue and shortly after nobody cared about TNA. Wcw with russo would have been TNA in The 2000s.

[@jesterr7133]

Vince can take credit for the Attitude Era all day long, but it doesn't change the timeline. Stone Cold, Rock, Shawn Michaels, HHH, Mick Foley, Undertaker, Chris Jericho, and Kurt Angle were all established in the gimmicks that made them famous before Russo joined the creative team. Kane was the only major star that was established after Russo got there, and other people assisted in creating that character. I will give Vince enormous credit where it is due. Vince had an amazing talent for finding a way to use everyone on the roster and put them in something meaningful. Vince did a masterful job of elevating the lower card guys. That made every second of the show a must watch. I give him full credit for that. I just wish he would learn a little humility and be more honest about the things that took place.

[@Ziomaletto]

>Stone Cold, Rock, Shawn Michaels, HHH, Mick Foley, Undertaker, Chris Jericho, and Kurt Angle were all established in the gimmicks LMAO. Stone Cold was still stuck in midcard with Ringmaster/Stunning SA/directionless Stone Cold gimmicks before he got into feud with Vinny Mac and got launched into legendary status he currently has. The Rock was still a sh,itty babyface "Rocky Maivia" who fans HATED before Vince pitched the idea that he should turned on fans. HBK was barely present for most of AE. "Hunter Hearst Hamsley" had a PIMP gimmick before Russo put him back on track with DX. Undertaker was reduced to mere nuisance before feuding with Kane. Also, if you really KNEW TIMELINE, you'd know Russo credits other people rather than himself. Why, there's entire damn rebuttal about it. youtube_com / watch?v=fA4OrN8MCVI

[@JMFSpike]

It's a valid argument, but about a month before Russo they were getting numbers equal to what Russo got during his time. There were even two episodes at the end of the Bischoff era that got into the 4's which is far better then anything Russo managed to get. That said, I don't think anybody could have done better then Russo at that point. He came in at a time when it was already too late, and he did what he could to the best of his ability. Whether you liked his booking or hated it, I think he did what he believed was best. He gets a LOT of shit for what he did in WCW, but opinions are like assholes as they say. You can't please everyone. Bischoff actually made an excellent point on his podcast once by saying that "Everyone is a genius in hindsight." It's easy to say something was a bad or good idea in hindsight and look smart, because you know what the end result was.

[@enriquebravo83]

Idk

[@GerryCostanza]

L cole bro said your a sell out

[@VTM_isawesome]

Guys, it's 2024. 20 24.

[@juanel589]

So what is russo saying???.. He would have led w c w to a comeback ?😂😂😂😂

[@ElAssoWipe-o]

What part of ratings going up don't you understand little boy?

[@psyopticprodigy2427]

that writer is getting raise after raise after raise. Russo got sent home LMAO.

[@jesterr7133]

Steve Austin created Stone Cold. Dwayne Johnson created the Rock. Mick Foley created 2 of his gimmicks, and assisted McMahon in creating the third. Kurt Angle and Shawn Michaels were basically themselves. McMahon created Undertaker. Jericho was established and heating up before he even came to WWE. HHH was established years before Russo got there. Who is responsible for the Attitude Era again?

[@Drollpanther]

No one cares about action figures

[@russellcampbell3500]

Dave still talking about you but your talking about him. 🤷

[@mattleee]

No, he's talking about Meltzer talking about him...

[@russellcampbell3500]

@@mattleee not all the time he doesn’t. He calls Dave out all the time without Dave mentioning his name. Let’s be honest with ourselves. You watch as much as I do be legit bro I’m a fan not someone who is bashing just stating facts.

[@rodneykendall2022]

​@@russellcampbell3500cornette loves russo though.

[@russellcampbell3500]

@@rodneykendall2022 and that has what to do with the convo m o r o n

[@elliottharrison6399]

For the love of god Jeff. Stop blowing Vince every 5 minutes. I get he's paying you but for f*** sake have some dignity.

[@francescodg22]

Stating facts is not blowing somebody pal.

[@elliottharrison6399]

@@francescodg22 there's a reason why this guy hasn't worked for a major wrestling promotion in 12 years. And I hate to break it to you but it's not politics.

[@francescodg22]

@@elliottharrison6399 I don't give a rat's ass where/if he's worked the last 12 years. Facts are facts and the fact is Meltzer lied.

[@mattleee]

​@@elliottharrison6399yes, because he quit tna and the only other major promotion was WWE. And Russo is a 63 year old man....

[@rodneykendall2022]

​@@elliottharrison6399he was a consultant for tna not too long ago.

[@vman075]

Jeff keeps talking about a narrative when he clearly has one lol. From May-September (2 weeks before Russo came in) the rating were consistently mid 3s to low 4s. They were in the 4s just 5 weeks before he started. The week he came in from were literally the 2 lowest weeks and those are the ones he is comparing them to. I'm not a meltzer guy but what is meltzer lying about here? Other than that 2.6 week, which is an anomoly, the ratings were exactly the same under russo as they had been for months. At one point meltzer says they were higher before the 2.6 and Jeff goes "no he's wrong" and then lists all the higher ratings before the 2.6.

[@pauldodge1975]

Vince get on K100 podcast like Eric is doing.......stop playing the victim.

[@V1LL1N]

Why? Eric is a narcissist who can only toot his own horn, how is Russo playing the victim?? Russo IS being attacked by a lot of idiots and still doesnt retaliate. Someone can defend themself. Why would he care what Eric is doing?

[@mattleee]

Bischoff is a sleazy 80s salesman. Literally.

[@pauldodge1975]

What makes Eric a narcissist precisely?

[@pauldodge1975]

​@@mattleeethen he sold fake ass fights pretty good.

[@V1LL1N]

@@pauldodge1975 if you need an example because you dont know to recognize it yourself, Eric will in some situations revert to word soup, he has a living anger, lack of empathy, zero accountabliity while playing the victim, wishing harm to others, being cold and unapologetically triangulates others against peopole by publically badmouthing them, claiming others are wrong for things that he his doing himself...and this is all very evident in the Russo discussion he had with Conrad, but he always acts like this, its just easier to tell a narc when theyre upset and go campaigning against someone. Look it up and stop asking people to do the work for you. Narcs can be super charismatic, I bet a lot of the people you think are cool are actually quite the opposite. Its the same for everyone. Its wrestling - ha do not be decieved.

[@hiwdy1]

Both are lies but which lier is closest to the truth

[@danielsims916]

The problem is Russo kept saying that the ratings went up exponentially in the first three months and people started to fact check him and he had to back track and say it went up slightly. I can care less about uncle Dave and his bias towards aew and Japanese wrestling

[@neilsun2521]

When did Russo say that exactly?

[@fu102]

depends on how math works. first "exponentially" is hyperbole and that's the way he speaks, its not meant to be literal (everyone does it to certain extents). so to the math, for example: if wcw was losing 100k viewers every 1mo, and at the end of 3mo russo brought it UP by 100k from when he started, then projections without russo would be -300k, but with russo was actually +400k (first the stabilization, then the slow crawl back). Only an example, I dont know the real numbers.

[@danielsims916]

@@neilsun2521 he always been saying that he says go look at the numbers wcw went up the first three months I was there

[@mattleee]

​@@danielsims916the numbers DID go up. Show us where he uses the word 'exponentially', or quit your trolling.

[@danielsims916]

@@mattleee it went up slightly, not the way Russo claims . I don’t need to troll, Russo was a great offensive coordinator but a terrible head coach. He is still living off 2 years of success he had in wwe and it’s going on 27 years. If it did go up like that then he shouldn’t have went home after 3 months , trying to put the title on tank Abbott. The dark side of the ring and who killed wcw didn’t do Russo any favors but reinforced why Russo gets the heat from people