DCS Ancillary Devices: Lessons Learned

[@TCann285]

One thing I really should have mentioned: Disk space As you get more modules, the size on disk requirement grows significantly. It's not a bad idea to have a dedicated DCS SSD to mitigate this. An older, smaller model would be fine.

[@mughug9616]

Already using 300Gb for DCS World and the number of DLC item is pretty small. Use a couple of maps and just a couple of aircraft, etc. I actually dedcated a 1Tb NVMe for MSFS (which is already 66% full) and I plan to do the same for DCS World at some point.

[@araynortassadore3056]

I used track IR with Arma 3 back in 2012 through 2015 and it is cheaply made but it was the best spatial visual device at the time. Track IR is very dated, I use Tobi eyetracker now and its seamless. It still uses infrared cameras to track your eye movements so if your cautious about infrared light then I can't recommend it, but I'm cautious about VR and have my own opinions and observations about it. We all are staring into some sort of synthetic lighting. LED screens, Infrared sensors and lights. Its all on user preferences and choices based on information at that time. I really like Tobi because I don't like wearable technology. You can see one of my videos trying to land in star citizen with it. It has dead zones but not as much as Track IR. VR would probably be the best experience but I'm still looking at alternatives.

[@TCann285]

@@araynortassadore3056 I only bring up infrared because you can't see it, but you're still absorbing the energy from it. In the Navy, we had to be very cautious about our fiber lines for that reason. They aren't just an LED like audio fiber lines, and looking down the end could blind you before you realized there was even invisible light coming out. At least with screens, your iris will adjust, though I agree that it's still not great for you.

[@faelwolf1177]

I went a similar but different route. I have DCS on my fastest (1TB M.2 on the motherboard along with the operating system and a few programs that also require best speed) drive, and my other, older games on a SATA SSD. Gave me the best speed for DCS without breaking the bank on the build. Maps are the biggest disk hog though, ouch!

[@mughug9616]

@@faelwolf1177 I use to be shocked at the size of my vast collection of payware FSX/PED/X-Plane terrain addons, etc that I accumulated over many years. But DCS World puts that into perspective when just Syria is 65.6GB. 😲

[@jamiereinig]

Nice video! I am just getting back into DCS after failing to make much progress back in 2020-ish due to wanting to fly in VR but my PC just wasn't up to the task back then. I've now got a 6800 XT GPU + 5900X CPU which gets the job done. Flying in VR with HOTAS and rudder pedals *chef's kiss*. Regarding OpenKneeboard, it's been a great help for me and can't recommend it enough for VR pilots. I just wanted to mention the Wacom Intuos Small tablet has (4) built-in buttons that can be used to cycle through the pages. This allows you to manage the kneeboard info with just one hand. The Wacom tablet probably costs a tad more, but IMHO it's worth it for the buttons. I got my wired Intuos Small from the Amazon Warehouse for ~$25 and it's a game changer, even as a new pilot. Thanks again, and happy flying!

[@EPiQ_cR]

Just chiming in to say I love my Tobii. No perceived latency, does an excellent job with tracking my head and eyes without any issue.

[@mughug9616]

After trying TrackIR and the Quest 2, I setted for a expanded triple screen setup with FaceTrackNoIR. I find it is a nice compremise as it means nothing to wear or get uncomfortable on my head. I am also blind (since birth) in my left eye. The FaceTrackNoIR allowes me to do the full head swivels nicely. And the setup provides pretty good situational awareness (for a sim) in not just my flight sims and many other sims and games. Just throwing it out there as a possible suggestion for some.

[@npatrcevic]

In your case (depth perception) it was most likely the best choice. I find that turning to trackIR now is looking in reverse as the future certainly lies in VR (imo).

[@mughug9616]

@@npatrcevic I also found issues with the resolution in my Quest 2. Maybe it was just me but could never feel comfortable playing anything with detailed graphics.

[@dw-xy9vm]

@@mughug9616 I agree, It's not quite for sims flying but I try to run Project Wingman with my Q2 and it really does not translate at all graphically. Very smudgy and hard to read.

[@npatrcevic]

@@mughug9616 I wanted to say that I'm quite unsure of the benefits of VR for you personally, as you have impaired depth perception (1 eye you wrote), and depth perception makes VR ultra-realistic for me. As for the graphics details, I usually set them lower than my VR (Valve Index) can support because spotting is much harder in comparison to screens - it gets better with decreased detail, resolution and AA off. We are only in the 1,5-st generation of VR helmets, let's see what comes out next.

[@mughug9616]

@@npatrcevic Clearly, even with current generation of VR, it is a benefit to many out there. I just posted to pass on my own unique experiences as you know that 'one size does not fit all'. Maybe it might help someone out there. But I agree with your train of thought that the future of VR is exciting and may be, even for me :)

[@alzeal]

I have a VR index setup as well and have a 2dOF motion rig (DIY home built). I use one of the controllers for motion compensation and just have a mouse for point and click. I can't play any other way for DCS. Being in the cockpit and actually feeling the motions is just the best. BTW a motion rig is very affordable if you DIY. Lots of forums like xsimulator which give step by step instructions. Its a game changer.

[@RJ-kr4bs]

Excellent choice of rudders; I love mine too. Also agree on stick extension for more precision and control as well as less resistance to movement.

[@GetOffMyyLawn]

I have been using sims since the early Microprose dos games. VR in MSFS, DCS, Flying Circus is a dream come true... it puts you in the pilots seat. I have ditched the Track-IR and Thrustmaster MFDs and just use a hotas and pedals with a mouse or vr controller to point and click. Things will only get better with eye tracking and foveated rendering down the road... but a Quest 2 has been the best purchase for flight sims that I have ever made.

[@adubs.]

This is immensely useful for me getting into DCS just a couple weeks ago. I got a winwing orion 2 setup and had an index already so your tips directly help me.

[@TCann285]

Good to hear it!

[@adubs.]

@@TCann285 It would be amazing if you could go over your VR settings too. I find conflicting information about how to get a more performant experience without sacrificing resolution outright. Not sure what settings matter most here.

[@TCann285]

@@adubs. good idea It might be a bit before I do a video since I need to do some more research, but if you join the discord I can explain my settings and rationale real quick discord.gg/q2qaqqHDx9

[@jeffreybuchanan287]

Great tip about laminating checklist and using a grease pencil. You can also use that methodology for the data mission card. I currently use my iPad for both, but will migrate to this. Thank you. 👏

[@butangviber]

Go NAVY!!! Lets goooo! You have a sub.

[@gameboy41944]

Great information and a great video! My personal recommendation for head tracking if VR is not for you would be Grass Monkey Simulations. They have a wireless solution, the camera is just a receiver as you wear ir lights that are tracked.

[@peterfagan3587]

I agree with you about the build quality of the TrackIR Pro. I snapped one of the arms within a week of buying it - incredibly flimsy for something at that price! However, as a functional device, once I'd repaired it, I found it excellent, and was having a great time playing DCS on my 65 inch TV before catching the VR bug. The only minor downside to this was it meant having to have a table with Hotas etc mounted on it which was rolled over into position in front of the TV whenever I wanted to play. My most recent hardware purchase was a Razer Tartarus keypad - saw one in another DCS KZbin video - and that has proved very useful. It's far more compact than my main keyboard, and programmable, so a really useful addition to my set-up. I'm also using it in my working life. It's a useful way of storing links to webpages which I want to bring to the attention of customers when writing emails.

[@TCann285]

Oh man, I used to love my old Saitek keypad! Similar concept, but much worse build quality lol I just got a Stream Deck XL after making this video and it fills a similar role, though it lacks ergonomics and analog control. I didn't get it for DCS, but I've been using it by peeking from under the gasket when in VR.

[@nategoodwin3329]

The sound powered telephone tangent made me crack up. Former Lincoln below decker here. This video is a great resource and exactly what I was looking for. 🤙 Ps. If you can, get some fpv goggles and try a tiny whoop to get your feet wet. I was a part 107 that used race drones. I think you'd like it.

[@TCann285]

There's more bubbleheads on the discord if you wanna discord.gg/q2qaqqHDx9

[@bassemb]

Awesome setup. Glad to see VR being leveraged too. And that you play H3VR.

[@bkpickell]

I have trackIr with pro clip and the only issue I have is finding a place to put the camera. I play on a 55" TV and putting the camera on top of the TV doesn't work it's too high and too far away. If I put it on the desk it's too low. I ended up zip tieing it to the handle of my job sight tool box roller. And just position it just to the left of the tv and between me and the tv. It's not ideal, but it works. As far as the pro clip wire goes, I create some slack and run the wire between my back and the chair and it stays out of my way and doesn't pull, but you have to pull enough slack so it doesn't pull. I use a usb extender on it.

[@4ndroidG]

Thank you for sharing. From my experience, I'd like to add something regarding rudder pedals. Buy good expensive rudder pedals or stick to twist-stick. The cheap plastic pedals are in no way near real-world pedals and can cause a lot of issues. Maneuvering with a twist stick is way easier than with some flimsy plastic rudder pedals. It also depends on what kind of airplane you are flying in the sim. For example, the F-14 needs a lot of work with the rudders to keep coordinated flight or to fly single engine. In that case, good pedals become more critical.

[@Indyplumber]

I have the wireless TrackIR clip and it works great. Charge last a long time and the build quality is much better than the one from TrackIR. Was well worth the investment for when I fly IR vs VR. Also, I love the digital notepad idea. I'm looking into this now. Thanks for the advice.

[@Javier-ov3hj]

That usb hub is a great idea, I recently tried playing sekiro and found that my joystick had to be unplugged to play it with a controller. Thanks for the tip!

[@sharpknifetv]

You can make list files and add them to your knee board in game. Good vid mate

[@TCann285]

Yeah, I use the in-game ones that are LUA generated when I absolutely have to, but the built-in kneeboard is awkward in VR compared to Open Kneeboard. Open Kneeboard doesn't support the LUA files like the M2000C's INS stuff, for example.

[@MACE1-1]

Good deal. Love to hear about the old school flight sims. I grew up with DOS, IBM XT, System 36 etc and cut teeth on CY Flight Simulator ...Good times!

[@Frozander]

I recently tried a few phone based tracking software paired with freetrack and also my own webcam. I haven't noticed delays but my current pc placement (and shitty curtains) make it so that there is a massive glare coming from my windows that obstruct about quarter of my left face. so tracking was glitchy sometimes. My camera is on a laptop that's 45 degrees angled to me so it probably also played a role in inaccuracies but I was happy with app based trackers a lot. One issue I had is that I have a normal office chair with wheels so if I move the chair as I play, the tracking gets worse so I would need to recalibrate the software. But that's an issue with my own setup. I am incredibly impressed by the dozens of tracking options on Freetrack. I am looking into printing ARUCO markers since they seem pretty simple and accurate as well.

[@PhantomDragonX]

one thing a lot don't think about (even I, a former helo pilot) those office chairs are bad with rudder pedals-- they can cause pretty bad cramps after long time use) something to do with Newton's 3rd law - Right pedal - Right chair swing

[@WhiteEagleTube]

I have previously gone through a similar history as you with the TM warthog. Installing an extension and needed to re grease which I did and also installed the stronger spring. However with the stronger spring you immediately notice the warthogs main flaw which is when the spring is trying to push the stick back to center it doesn't travel linear it spirals back to the centre, following the spring. Very annoying if you are trying to do precision flying like AAR. Eg you get unwanted roll when pitching. So I went ahead and bought a dual cam/spring stick like Virpil and wish I had done it sooner, night and day difference between the two.

[@TCann285]

Yeah I regreased after I made this video and I've run into all of that. One of the plastic pieces has also cracked in four places, so I'm definitely getting a new base, though I was considering the VKB Gunfighter Mk. III.

[@theflyingfool]

Specifically regarding your worry about the USB connection on the MFG Crosswinds I've bought a cheap, short extension cable that is permanently plugged into the pedals and gently coiled around the plug section out to one of the arms, so I can replace that instead of wear out the MFG kit. Works well...

[@TCann285]

Great idea! Like a bubba strain reliever

[@AIRWARFAREGROUP]

I made a bracket and used Zipties to secure the MFG USB connection. ~Juice

[@TCann285]

Someone mentioned elsewhere in the comments that you can buy a replacement for the connector, as well

[@BlackMatt2k]

For OpenTrack I used to use a PS3Eye camera with the red+blue film from 3d glasses layered over the lens to block visible light, and IR LEDs on a baseball cap wired to a USB cable with a few resistors. The cameras were dirt cheap but would push 120fps, so no latency. The whole setup cost 25 bucks, in the before times.

[@TCann285]

I tried the PS3 Eye with face track and it was horrible. Never heard of the 3D film trick; neat concept. I personally wouldn't like having a ball call on at the computer, but a good solution for people that don't mind.

[@virgo47]

I found both the rough part of the video and the rent part of it quite useful and informative.

[@GridDelinquent]

You can get FPV goggles that connect to a motion camera in the RC cockpit, though they seem pricey.

[@AetherialAustin]

I've seen some people in the comments recommend OpenTrack and can confirm it works pretty well after adjusting the tracking curves (even with a crappy webcam). I do have a button bound to re-center it every once in a while though.

[@DFASixMarbles]

We are hardware brothers :D I am using MFG Crosswind and a Warthog with stick extension also... but my extension is made of PVC pipe and a garden hose adapter. A bit ghetto but it works. I mount my extension 2 inches beneath my chair and it bends in an L shape like a cyclic. I used an S-video cable with one pin pulled out and the plastic key snapped off to connect the stick to the base.

[@onezerotwo]

video is excellent, only thing I am missing is order… like if I can only buy 1 item from this list per month, what’s the order? stick, pedals, VR, desk clamps, extender, kneeboard touchpad, … ? This is great, thanks so much for shooting this for us!

[@TCann285]

HOTAS first: if you get one without a twist then you need to get sticks at the same time, otherwise it can wait. Desk clamps and extender next (I got mine in a bundle with the dust covers) If you only plan on getting VR for DCS, it's questionable if it will be worth it for you. I play about half DCS, half "traditional" VR games. Try it if you know a friend with it first, but at any rate I can't make the decision for you. The drawing tablet is only really useful if you have VR, though it technically would work otherwise. I would only buy a new one if you have VR, though. I'm not a great resource on what stick to buy, since there are plenty of people out there that have bought just about everything on the market.

[@wasatchpiper]

I don't think FreeTrack is maintained anymore. I've been using OpenTrack and it works pretty well. I haven't used TrackIR, but from watching lots of vids, I think OpenTrack comes pretty close. It does require good lighting though.

[@HarryVoyager]

Very interesting. I am going to have to try OpenKneeboards. That sounds like one of the really handy things for VR DCS. On the lasers, they're going to be eye safe, so even though they're invisible (especially because they are invisible) they're going to be required to have a low enough energy output that you can stare at it indefinitely without doing eye damage. That said, I've discovered the hard way, that the lighthouses need to be very rigidly mounted and should be set to sleep mode when you're not using them anyways for their own longevity. If they're on one of those floor mounted pole mounts, they've got enough flex at the end that they'll shake themselves apart, and the spinning motor will eventually fail. Sleeping them spins down the motor so they last longer. Also, kudos to HTC for replacing mine so quickly when they failed.

[@roastedpotato1487]

I have a tobii and only use it for head tracking. I would say it's great to just less than great. The only issue I have with it is that you get some deviation in position based on your facial expression. It's great for flying, but lacks a little bit when manipulating controls.

[@fa-ajn9881]

Amazing thank you. I started flying ED sims in 2012 on flat screen obviously. I made the transition to VR 2 years ago and I've never played less. Initially very cool just all the little things became big annoyances for me. My wife has a wacom tablet sitting around in going to put to good use now!

[@thatguy7085]

Crusty stick… that was the problem I had with rudder peddles. Anything dirt gets into… bad

[@purplepenguin43]

the other major problem with track ir is its an infrared camera which means if you have an infrared light source like a window or lightbulb behind you it just looses all tracking. this is espeshily problimatic becasue i live in alaska where we dont get that much sun and we we do i like to open the window. but if i need to use track ir i have to use blackout blinds because the camera cannont reject the light coming in the window at all. i've also had problems with the tracked position drifting if you use "True" mode which calibrates the software to account for head size and where the clip is placed, so i turned that off, but with true mode off, now when you turn you head left it also zooms in and when you turn right it zooms out. i just dont recomend track ir or any 3 point ir camera based setup. start with a webcam or phone app based face tracking to try it out. and then get somthing with either multi point tracking using multipule cameras like vr or Tobii

[@TCann285]

Not too mention anything that reflects IR The barracks in nuke school had a full length one on the wall that caused TrackIR to go ape shit

[@pwilliamssa]

They make stiffer springs for the stick with extensions (actually I may have an extra...). Be very careful with your throttle powering it on and off and do not plug it into a USB 3.0. Lot's of them are bricking due to over voltage. I modified mine with a buck converter that drops the voltage down. Former AF crew chief... Yep, grease pencils great for simming.

[@davinhunt7558]

awesome, the thing that turned me away from VR flying is not being able to do majority of regular tasks needed like looking at a list or video checlist

[@NDSpodcast]

Awesomeness! 🔥 🔥 🔥

[@crimson-rk6di]

as far as i know you can get the replacement board for the MFG pedals if you are having usb connection issues. you just take the stack apart and the board just sits in there.

[@TCann285]

Yeah some of the other comments mentioned that, but it's out of stock

[@rickmasseur2008]

Something to be aware of regarding the Warthog HOTAS and powered USB hubs: sometimes it will cause problems with the PCB boards. I had to get the one in my throttle replaced because my throttle was bricked. After doing a ton of research, some folks on the DCS forum told me this is a known issue between the two. Nothing has ever happened with the stick.

[@TCann285]

I use smaller unpowered hubs, but powered hubs should be safe as long as they don't exceed 5VDC Do you have a link to that post? I'd be interested in finding out the root cause

[@rickmasseur2008]

@@TCann285 I don't, but I will look for it and post.

[@TAZZZZMAN]

if you set the curvs right with the puck it turns right and not cheap like track ir

[@MrTuhascvbouwq]

Man what a nice video. Do you also see the little vr camera live feed at the top right or is that an obs thing? I would love to use that in my reverb g2

[@TCann285]

I added that; it only shows in OBS. You can have it show in VR, there just aren't many times where I find it useful. If your HMD has a camera, OBS can have it added as a source.

[@MrTuhascvbouwq]

Wooo could you tell me wich software i should use to have it show in my own headset?

[@TCann285]

@@MrTuhascvbouwq 1. SteamVR will let you show the camera in multiple modes, but they take over your entire view 2. OVRToolkit allows you to pin windows from your computer anywhere in your view, locked to the world, a controller, or the HMD. You need to get the camera footage to display on your desktop, such as with an OBS preview, then you can display it with whatever settings you want, like position/size/opacity

[@MrTuhascvbouwq]

@@TCann285 thanks mate. I've been Bing watching your videos and really enjoyed them. Subbed :)))

[@TCann285]

@@MrTuhascvbouwq Awesome, thanks! More in the works, but expect it to come slowly. This isn't my job so I have to do all my editing in my free time.

[@downshift1391]

I zip tied my Track IR Pro Clío to an old pair of sunglasses. The cable is still a little annoying but it’s a nice to not have to wear over the ear headphones and/or a hat

[@TCann285]

Hey, if it works, it works

[@jimmydesouza4375]

Mentioning headtracking in ARMA. Have you tried playing it through your VR headset using Virtual Desktop and having opentrack transfer your headset's movement into trackIR output so you can move your head? Seen videos of people doing it and it looks like it works well, but I am never going to play Arma again after all that dodgy stuff with the DLC.

[@TCann285]

Arma performance is already bad enough, so I won't do that And what dodgy stuff? CSLA?

[@jimmydesouza4375]

@@TCann285 "And what dodgy stuff?" They released the DLC that had the advanced marksman rifles and the MGs (can't remember the acronym for them) that have large rounds and can shoot through walls so that people would have a massive advantage in PVP and basically broke PVP. This is scummy, but it's understandable to a point. Then they released the APEX DLC which didn't have any ostensibly OP guns in it to lure in the pay to win guys, so they stealthily gave the AK's better performance than they should have had (they had the same accuracy and ballistics as the 7.62x51 DMRs but had higher penetration than those as well so they could one shot through MRAP windows). Now this is kind of screwey, but then they removed these ridiculous advantages in a patch a month after releasing the DLC but made no mention of the changes. Meaning they were intentionally OP to give people playing APEX guns an advantage to try to manipulate others into then buying APEX. At least when something like ED releases an OP mod they're just simulating something that's OP, or the 3rd party that made it is (ie the Jeff), but what Bohemia did is just unforgivable.

[@TCann285]

@@jimmydesouza4375 "Never attribute to malice what you can to incompetence" I think you're reaching very far lol But idk, I have never thought of Arma as a PvP game and never will

[@jimmydesouza4375]

@@TCann285 That idiom is wrong. It is more detrimental to you to assume incompetence when there is malice to assume malice when it is simply incompetence. That being said it's the way they didn't announce that the AK's ballistics had been wrong and were now fixed that is the real giveaway. There's no reason not to do that if you accidentally set a few incorrect variables or what have you. The only reason you wouldn't mention it is if you did it intentionally but want as few people as possible to know.

[@TCann285]

@@jimmydesouza4375 it's not about what's detrimental to me; that would be selfish It's about what's detrimental to others Life is too short for me to hold onto something so minor that may or may not have happened nearly a decade ago But if you don't want to play it over that, that's on you Good luck finding a dev that does less scumbaggery, though

[@valuedhumanoid6574]

I have the Oculus VR set and Track IR, I prefer the Track IR. The VR is cool, but there's just too many things wrong with it, cockpit interaction being the most difficult. And I got the Thrustmaster throttle, stick and pedal bundle for $180. I would consider that bottom level minimum for DCS. I have another stick with the twist Z axis for controlling the rudders, just isn't there. But the Thrustmaster pedals are the slider type, which is horrible for fine control. I am upgrading to metal push/pull type to mimic what aircraft actually use. And my hard drive is almost maxed. With all the other flight sims I have there's just no room left. I have a 2 TB on order. But I found a way to transfer the maps to a separate disk so it doesn't affect the main drive. Be trying that too.

[@Itzo_]

I'll recommend pointctrl for VR aswell, the creator has a long delivery time but worth the wait completely.

[@simultaneous2246]

Dude rotate your stick. The F16 version is straight as a side stick, in the A10 it is rotated to the left to fit your hand. Can’t be comfortable trying to use a centre stick with side-stick straight rotation.

[@TCann285]

I've played with angling it since making this video, but I'm having problems keeping it tightened when it's not completely straight. It will suddenly come loose during play, so I need to take some time and get it lined up perfectly.

[@jacobhogue9503]

Great video. Thanks

[@TCann285]

Glad you liked it!

[@igotgaijined9309]

Were you subs? Mention Connecticut any recommendations for active duty due to set up time and price?

[@TCann285]

Yeah, I was on the USS Minnesota out of Rotten Groton When I was active duty and in Charleston for training, I bought the TM Warthog and it was too much. I ended up getting the CH Pro Fighterstick due to how light it is, but I don't really recommend it due to the price and the fact it lacks a twist for rudder. If you are moving around a lot, you may not want to lug pedals. Check the T16000M out or the X56. I used to use the X52 and loved it, and the X56 is just a better version.

[@Fuzzball047]

Love the video!

[@joseph.icerebro]

RJSimtech makes a TrackIR Pro clip substitute that's wireless and pretty good. Holds a nice charge, and it's relatively affordable (I think 70-ish before taxes).

[@TCann285]

Interesting that a real manufacturer is making one and not just some DIY thing that you don't know if it'll work. 70 is a bit too high for me considering that I mainly use VR, but I'm sure for someone without an HMD that would be a no-brainer!

[@npatrcevic]

@4:30 You don't need a hardware solution for this, there is a free program called HidHide where you can hide controllers from windows. Works like a charm. In IL-2 it is (unfortunately and to the shame of the developers) essential, as you need joystick gremlin to get good hotas setups working with it. If you do get problems with joysticks or hotas glitching out because of current supply issues you might need a POWERED usb hub. Before you get one (assuming you have enough usb ports in your computer) make sure you turn power management for all your HOTAS/Pedals/Sticks off and make sure you OS can not shut them down to save power.

[@TCann285]

HidHide has caused me a ton of problems in the past, so I don't use it anymore I personally don't need gremlin for Il-2; everything just works fine for me Good to note for someone else that those might work for, though This type of hardware and software is often very finicky and one solution will not fit all

[@Skauber]

I used TrackIR for many years. It works really well, but it is really annoying to use. That is the best way I can describe it. I always hated to use a baseball cap with those reflectors, I don't think the IR blasters are strong enough to affect your eyes too much, the IR LEDs they use are fairly low powered. You can also adjust the IR strength in the application. I upgraded to that clip, hated that thing as well. I don't use headset when flying, I have a nice surround sound system which I enjoy using instead so having to strap something on my head was a huge annoyance. I tried the free head tracking solutions, with various webcams and what not, but just couldn't get them to work as well as TrackIR does so was kinda stuck with it.. I recently bought the Tobii Eyetracker thing when it was on sale, 20-25% off or something like that. It's the first head tracking solution I have been happy with other than TrackIR, and it doesn't require you to wear anything! A huge plus! But it's far from perfect, it has its own annoyances. The biggest annoyance is to set it up. Initial setup is super easy, which gets it up and running. But then dialing it in for head tracking in game is a bit fiddly. The Eyetracking feature is cool, but it is a bit difficult to get it stable in DCS. Other games with native support seem to work better, but it takes a bit of getting used to. Luckily you can turn off the eye tracking and just do head tracking, which is working quite well. I even find it to keep center position way better than TrackIR which tends to drift and require you to hit a button to recenter it all the time.

[@jadeybaby166]

How did you set up/ where did you find the controls template pages at 21:31

[@TCann285]

I just type the aircraft name followed by checklist in Google. They're on the DCS user downloads site somewhere. I pretty much always just go with the first result.

[@jadeybaby166]

@@TCann285 I meant the controls templates

[@TCann285]

Sorry, I'm working. I also just searched for those, and I can't remember what I typed exactly.

[@jadeybaby166]

@@TCann285 Thanks for the reply.

[@TCann285]

@@jadeybaby166 www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3307097/ Found it

[@felixnelson4359]

Thank you for this info! really helped.

[@RigstersJourney]

great video and suggestions on the various hardware. i have personally used delean clip with wired setup for the head tracking. they have an option of an all in one kit using open track software which though takes time to fiddle with was quite happy with fine tuning. interesting on the rudder pedals, i guess i will have to bulk up and pay a higher cost rudder pedals because i heard too many bad reviews on the thurst master and non saitek rudder pedals.

[@TCann285]

Saving up for MFG Crosswinds was one of the best decisions I made when I was on my poor enlisted salary! Saiteks are perfectly fine, though. A bit too stiff for me. Delean is an interesting solution. How is the latency?

[@RigstersJourney]

@@TCann285 hm mfg crosswinds i ll look into that because that the vkb or the lower end vipril is kind of where id like to be cost wise for rudder pedals. for the delean clip it depends on the axis. for pitch and yaw with ought tunning the open track is quite good but i found some methods to make it better . its also important that the steps for installing the ps3 eye cam are followed if you dont the laser will not work well as it will look at noise.

[@toddsichveland9756]

Thanks for doing video

[@MiaReiFilms]

ngl the best peripheral I've ever bought for dcs is the thrustmaster MFDs. they gotta be velcro'd down or mounted in some way and you might need to mark the middle buttons with a piece of velcro or something on the inside edge if you're in VR but out of all of my upgrades so far including my stick and throttle by far the most impactful peripherals have been the MFDs. beware tho, it may lead you down a cockpit rabit hole.

[@TCann285]

I like the MFDs ok, but I always struggle to find a good place for them. BUT you just changed the game for me in a big way with that velcro idea for the middle buttons. I will definitely try to mount them on my tiny desk whenever I make a follow-up video and I'll have to remember to credit you for that.

[@bill8791]

On the MFG USB problem - they sell the circuit with the port on it. Cheap fix.

[@TCann285]

Awesome! Once mine goes on the fritz again, I'll replace it and put it in the follow-up video to this one

[@Steezicus]

Grass Monkey for head tracking. Much cheaper than Track IR. Twice the resolution (240hz vs 120hz) of Track IR and wireless using just one single AA battery. The head mount I just stuck some thing rubbery cushion material so that it grips my head and stays comfortable.

[@TCann285]

Seeing lots of comments about their Puck. Sounds promising; might get one when Arma 4 comes out if there's nothing better by that point.

[@Steezicus]

@@TCann285 I just can't think of any real negatives with it other than I wished it came with that grippy rubber even though I already had some laying around. I guess for some people it might make it too tight. The quality of the 3D print is really quit good.

[@PebelWasTaken]

If you don't have track ir: try smooth track. It's very very good. Works through your phone.

[@TCann285]

Just looked it up, and wow the latency is super low. That definitely looks better than FreeTrack was when I last tried it!

[@baikal3925]

Thanks for the recommendation, I'll have to take a look at it!

[@PebelWasTaken]

@@baikal3925 make sure you turn up the smoothing in open track when you set it up

[@Swagtoph]

Thank you very much for the inputs! Been using the valve Index for a while now aswell, have you got any more advice for vr combined with sims like dcs. Because what i find a bit difficult sometimes, if you wanna use your keayboard for some shortcuts and/or button/switcehs/knobs on your throttle base - with track ir it was easy, as you can see whats on your desk or around it but it with the goggles on it is quite the challenge, especially in stressful situations.

[@TCann285]

Reality Mixer is promising, but the Index cameras seem a bit too low res for it. I like the Stream Deck XL so far, but I can easily peek through the gasket. Another commenter suggested getting TM MFDs and adding tactile "reminders" to the middle buttons, and I will definitely be doing that once I get my MFDs out of storage. You can also try hanging one of your controllers next to your setup and letting go of the throttle to pick it up and use it to interact with the cockpit. Cumbersome, so I didn't like it, but it's worth a shot.

[@jediknight4316]

Nice video! Spinning character... Valheim?

[@Gargoyle11]

I've had Tobii for the past year, I would NOT recommend it at all. The head tracking is inaccurate and has high latency, the eye tracking is cool the first time you use it but its very disorienting and I ended up turning off eye tracking all together and just using head tracking. The eye tracking doesn't fully turn off however, even if you disable it in the settings. All around the thought of head tracking without the Track IR proclip strapped to me with wires sounded like a blessing but it ended up being not a good experience. I just sold my Tobii on ebay and went back to using Track IR which is much much MUCH more accurate and responsive, even at the downside of having to wear the clip. I looked into getting the wireless headclip but like you said, it's expensive and I dont feel like spending that money on something so simple but maybe its worth it. Great video!

[@TCann285]

Thanks, and the mixed reaction to the Tobii has definitely made me want to try-before-buy. At least one person in the comments said it was great, so I appreciate the dissenting opinion. I think a lot of people are going to read these and make purchasing decisions.

[@Gargoyle11]

@@TCann285 I saw that comment, believe me when I say I have messed with every single setting dozens of times, watched countless videos and tried other peoples profiles and never found anything that was remotely as good as track ir. for a casual helo pilot or casual flight simmer playing MFS it would be fine, but atleast for me when i’m playing in an f-16 or hornet or any dogfight and I can’t even turn my head around far enough to see the the opponent it makes no sense and is pretty frustrating to say the least. With The latency is horrible, also the accuracy. If you look in a direction and keep your head perfectly still, it will shutter and move around even when you’re not moving your head. Forget trying to use a helmet mounted sight in the apache or f-16/f-18.

[@TCann285]

@@Gargoyle11 yeah I could never go to a high latency solution after using VR and TrackIR for this long

[@cardona54321]

Have you checked out delanclip before? They look pretty good and are substantially cheaper than track ir, I've just ordered a wireless one too try, there are a few reviews on KZbin for it too

[@TCann285]

@@cardona54321 saw it mentioned in a few other comments, but I think the Grass Monkey looks more like something I would use when not in VR

[@thomsonb]

Nice vid dude! I would really recommend upgrade the original warthog stick base to Virpil WarBRD, massive improvement to accuracy and feel, especially with that extension 👍🏻

[@TCann285]

What about VKB Gunfighter Mk. III? It's also a cam system and I'm about to pull the trigger on it, maybe next month. You're the third commenter to suggest Virpil though, so you have me second guessing.

[@borjaordinana1865]

Havent tried VKB, but i dont think it is possible that it get better than VIRPIL,

[@rubberonasphalt]

@@TCann285 VKB Gunfighter owner here, and I highly rate it. Metal build and just feels premium (VKB NXT is plastic & feels less premium). I'm no pilot, but just touching & feeling the weight in it's movement, makes me feel like I'm using a real fighter jet controls. Its legit, & I haven't found anyone who says its not worth the money

[@Tome4kkkk]

If I had 5 seconds to live I'd say: 1. smooth transition through neutral (no center snap) on controls! 2. Use curvatures IF YOU HAVE TO, but no deadzones. 3. Lower your fucking gamma and FOV!

[@thorrior1786]

I agree that the TrackIR clip is garbage. It breaks so easily, it's just not worth the money. So I'm using the wireless LukeClip with TrackIR. You can only get it when you contact the guy who makes it on Facebook. I attached it with magnets to my headset. When I play DCS or other flight sims, I just attach it to my headset and when I don't need it anymore I take it of. It works like a charm. I also own a Valve Index, but I get motion sick in VR, so this is not an option for me.

[@johnnefaulkner5685]

I’ve found that a stream deck is very useful to have

[@TCann285]

Mine came in right after I made this video, and I agree wholeheartedly!

[@AGenericAccount]

what i've recently learned in my VR dcs experience is that scratchpads go right out the window lol

[@TCann285]

Definitely give Open Kneeboard a try! It's about 80% as good as real pen and paper at first, and it gets better as you practice with it.

[@HeroOfTheDay16]

Whats up with your camera? It feels like im on an acid trip or something

[@TCann285]

Didn't have my GoPro at the time. It's a OnePlus N10 phone camera, and the stabilizer software is really horrible. Never intended for this video to get more than a dozen views, so...

[@HeroOfTheDay16]

@@TCann285 ah okay lol thanks for the vid im glad its blowing up man

[@GlazSh0tJFK]

Ha that’s funny I live right next to a Navy base in CT. Pretty sure it’s for submarines

[@TCann285]

Yeah, I used to be stationed there! I lived right across from the middle school in Groton, in a townhouse.

[@SuperKittyPancake]

Submarine bros rise up

[@TCann285]

you would fit in very well on the discord discord.gg/q2qaqqHDx9

[@kibbleofdoom]

"THERE ARE LITERALLY DOZENS OF US!" -tobias funke- Submarin bros

[@jimmydesouza4375]

Is your camera drunk or something? Crazy amount of afterimage on it.

[@TCann285]

It's just a really bad phone camera I borrow my roommate's DSLR whenever I shoot anything now lol

[@araynortassadore3056]

Like the damn video you weebs, the man shared some valuable information and tips.

[@TheCrash1983]

DELANCLiP is good for trackir no cables, you mite like a stream deck for button box, and voice attack on the software front mite interest you. tobii is great at looking behind you

[@TCann285]

Yeah I got a Stream Deck XL right after I made this video and it works great! Somewhat awkward in DCS VR, though I got it for editing and other uses. Anyone playing pancake should definitely consider it, though! I used voice attack a long time ago and it does exactly what it's supposed to do, but I always feel too awkward talking to computers lol I always disable the voice typing on new phones as soon as I get one

[@TheCrash1983]

@@TCann285 one thing I got that not a lot of people use is a jetseat with simshaker software wouldn't fly with out it now buttkicker would also work, give you the feel for when the plane is about to stall in a fight makes it a lot easier to push the aircraft to the edge you would be unstoppable with that and VR

[@TCann285]

@@TheCrash1983 oooo I've been wanting to do that for a while. Waiting until I have my own house, though

[@TheCrash1983]

@@TCann285 this hobby has no end of cool stuff for it I'm currently saving for a PC that can run VR

[@jackjewell6926]

To be fair the I've had my proclip for like 6 years. It's never let me down.

[@BrownHornet68]

Try the Tobii eye tracker 5 It gets a bad rap because it’s a pain to setup but once you get it Nirvana Also Navy Vet I heard you say submariner…… last duty station Point Loma Sub base USS Dixon AS-37

[@TCann285]

I was on SSN 783 USS Minnesota out of Rotten Groton. A friend from my Navy days just got a Tobii and I really want to try it, but he lives on the other side of the country now, unfortunately. I don't need it for DCS since I'm just not interested in playing in pancake, but I'll need something for Arma 4 wherever that comes out.

[@Yurisminator-RC]

Im on a 4790k and a 1080ti, seeing someone play with vr in dcs not in 720p and aa is amazing.. Witchcraft.. Im really only using my vr for dcs and assetto corsa these days because i feel the added feel of the wheel and the stick is adding alot to the immersion and Im too lazy to stand up and play games now a days haha 🤣

[@TCann285]

I was on a mobile 1080 just a few weeks ago, so I know your pain very well My old desktop had a 4790k with an og 980, and it was even worse lol

[@Yurisminator-RC]

@@TCann285 some day ill build a new pc.. Some day 😁 good video alot of nice points especially made me think of the hub and covers.. Maybe storing my hotas in the box when Im not using it 👍 ill stay for the dcs content 😁 Im also reversing and going back to arma, none of my friends play plane games but they do like mil Sims so now I get to helicopter them around 😎

[@TCann285]

@@Yurisminator-RC you should consider joining the Discord discord.gg/q2qaqqHDx9 We're going to do group DCS stuff and eventually some Arma as well One of my long term goals is to build a network of smaller milsim groups that can each organize into their own teams for mass ops, like company level stuff in Arma

[@Yurisminator-RC]

@@TCann285 just joined 🤟 Im a couple of time ones over so I might be limited that way but sounds really cool 👍

[@MuscleMan38K]

Hello! What is the length of your extension?

[@TCann285]

100mm I plan to go to 200mm sometime in the next few months, and I'll do an update video whenever I do, because it will come with a lot of other changes.

[@katt1woman]

What VR headset do you use

[@TCann285]

Valve Index

[@surplus2720]

and then there is me...who spend all his budget for as much as dcs modules i can buy and a good hotas... and yeah i can play ez whitout trackIR and oculus ... offcourse there is no comparsion whit my setup ( high-end pc) and the vid set up or other ... the most tricky thing whitout trackIR or VR is look around whitout leave the hand on the stick .... my solution was easy ... lots of hotas stick have analog pads ... mine have 1 on the left side of the stick ( so it can be used whit the right thumb) and 2 on the throttle ... i simply binded the analog pad of the stick on the X-Y axis of the mouse and voila u can look freely around while doing your things...if u want i can even put the view transpose by pressing the pad whit my hotas ... but i left the transpose to the mouse . p.s. the other 2 pads are dedicated to TDC usually but depend what im flying p.p.s. your pc struggle whit FPS ? put all the shadows options OFF ... p.p.p.s the Cannon comment on disk space is GOLD ... defacto i need to swap some games i dont play anymore like arma3 and all its modules ...

[@TAZZZZMAN]

o my god dude i have over 200 planes lol you ant kidding lotd of hd space

[@911canihelpu]

i use a ps5 controller with rewasd and vr. thats all you need.

[@911canihelpu]

yea, reverb g2 and a ps5 controller was all i needed. the dpad (up, down, left, right, up right, up left, down right, down left) act as modifiers and i gotta tell ya, they work wonders

[@TCann285]

@@911canihelpu you would get along with my friend He plays with a knock off Xbox one controller

[@911canihelpu]

@@TCann285probably, especially because xbox's back pedals (on the elite) are 4 extra programable buttons. but ps5 (dualsense) is a whole different beast, especially coz of its adaptive triggers, you can have 2 stage triggers, and the touchpad can act as a mouse when need be, its mindlessly versatile to a point where i wonder why xbox is not adding anything to its controllers

[@911canihelpu]

and then theres the gyro, its just really good, downside is that theres a bit of a learning curve in terms of the controller and its programming.. in terms of learning the mappings, you can keep it fairly standard, like i use the dpad left as a modifier for the throttle coz its naturally to my left and so on

[@MikoMuru]

I recommend you ditch your amd gpu due to dlss coming in. Amd has been quite disappointing anyways for the past few years in the gpu market. Also i dont recommend table mounts. A dedicated monstertech chair is much better than your setup

[@TCann285]

I rent that room alone, so no, a dedicated mount is not better in this situation. Maybe once it's a buyer's market around here. Also, I just bought that GPU and it's been great. I have no interest in DLSS based on previous experience, though I do understand why most people like it.

[@Gentamoru]

Is this Matt Wagner? sure sounds like him lol

[@TCann285]

No, this is Patrick

[@nathanhapek6617]

move the pc to the side, ill have more legroom.

[@TCann285]

My legs don't come out of me sideways

[@Tattlebot]

I quit DCS due to the TM TWCS slew button. The reason I got into it was that I got the A-10C on DVD 11 years ago, and the key was valid. The A-10C is so slew heavy that the deplorable TWCS slew just doesn't work right, and everyone who buys this is going to find out the hard way. I don't know where they got the component from, because the N64 analog stick is an improvement. Because of this, I have an intense dislike of youtube PR agents doing work for TM. The value of the 16000 combo is far, far less than what it costs. On the upside, the $90 brown box trackir from ebay works perfectly.

[@TCann285]

The slew is not as bad as the ones on the X52s and CH Pro, but it is still unacceptable for the price. What I consider far more egregious is how unreliable all the buttons are. The red pinkie button on the throttle stopped working for me many years ago, and I can tell several other buttons are going to go out. The replacements are stupidly expensive for something that should last a lifetime. Definitely switching to VKB or Virpil as soon as I can. I'm no HOTAS expert, but I might do a video covering this stuff whenever I upgrade.

[@Tattlebot]

@@TCann285 Yeah the button switches are horrendous. Matter of fact, the only thing not horrendous is the stick movement, but I know for a fact that even the stick action has a limited lifespan of about 8 years depending on its use. Unfortunately integrated yaw is bad for DCS because it can be transmitted unintentionally, while it's too uncontrollable to assist in strafing.

[@countzero7]

played for years just with gamepad and trackir, never see need for all that hardware waist of money and space, even ww2 sims like GB where you need better precision (extended stick vs gamepads mushrom) are not a ig problem... ppl pay too mutch effort to extra stuff that is not needed. More ppl would play this type of games if they know they can be no les competitive even online just with simple stuff that is used in any other game they have.

[@TCann285]

I totally agree it's unnecessary for a competitive advantage, but I think the important part of the extra devices is the added immersion. Obviously less important to some and more important to others. I'm firmly in the "I need immersion" category, personally. I also started with flight sims on Windows 95 with very old hardware and ancient graphics, so I like to think of it as my taste just becoming more refined.

[@BVDPNV]

AM I FRIGGEN TRIPPEN OR WAT DA FAK IS THAT CAMERA

[@Topper_Harley68]

Don't buy Saitek, worst junk ever made.

[@tswdev]

I use the tablet-mi-lcd-writing-13.5 (search that, so its easy to find). I'd prefer a smaller one but this one works great too