Dear SHORT FORM video creators

If you publish to TikTok, Reels or Shorts, this is important. You're putting in SO much work into something that I'm worried will not pay off for you. ​
Check out @raffitimedia video about the fall of shortform: • The fall of shortform ...
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[@Mr.Speechy]

Shorts are your Ads, not to build a community. I just learned that from experience. This guy is RIGHT!!

[@evancoaching]

Time is precious. Long gone those days where I will click on a 5 mins video unless it is exactly what im desperated for. My spontaneous moments are on short videos.

[@scottsimnz]

I’ve always enjoyed your perspective and content Pat. I’m a photographer and commercial filmmaker for my profession, but share my experiences in both short and long form formats. I will say that I’ve gotten so much more fulfillment creating the long form content and I believe the long form has helped me develop deeper relationships. I almost see short form content (photo & video) as a way to let your community / audience into different, less polished areas of your work and life. I think short form is fun to make, but definitely discouraging. I also think those who are succeeding all recycle the same thing that “works” then try to sell you a preset pack or LUT. For me, and this doesn’t mean all short form content does this, but it all feels like recycled content and it’s hard to come by originality. Thanks for making this video. Love what you’ve been doing on your second channel. It’s very cool to view from a testing perspective as well. 💯

[@ChanpreetSpeaks]

Beautiful video! Thank you n yes m feeling full, a sense of being served some valuable info like frm a fav teacher! Definitely there is a deeper connection we have with those giving us long form content. I knw a sprinkle of short form content is imp to get new eyeballs bt i will be honest it kept me stuck for a long time like i was not making any content at all for last 3 months!! I have been re-Strategizing my content n m soo happy I found this video! Thank You Pat❤

[@TheBossPodcast]

Thats why i used clips from long form content and that seems to be working ok for me. I continue to focus on long form video. Great video man!

[@zebadamercede]

This was an excellent watch & I totally enjoyed this meal 😀 Loved how you edit your content.

[@medalprose]

Short form content can actually help in exposing your channel, but not to make money per se. Video ads obviously would not work on shorts, but a graphics-based ad would work well. Social media platforms should wisen up.

[@MarceloKramer1]

Da man!! Well needed, Pat! Thank you so much! 👏🏽✨🙂

[@dralmalood]

Great content and advice as usual Pat .

[@CaelanTierney]

This is straight facts. Great video. Needed to hear this.

[@annikalind4920]

I think the main issue is attention span... have you tried talking to a teenager or 20-something year old lately? They can't live a minute without their phones and they constantly need to be entertained - but not for too long on one thing. Therein lies the problem.

[@PokeSerg]

Thank you Pat! Awesome video

[@derryXDINES]

I started watching this having some opinions on what you said in the first minute, but you addressed that later in the video, so I'll move onto my actual concern: what are you supposed to do with a bowl of spaghetti with giant chunks of mozzarella scattered on top? 😂 For me, Shorts (tiktok, reels, etc) has become more or less my testing ground. First, it's helped me learn how to condense ideas into something more concise, which translates to measurable skill improvement for long form editing. For storytelling, it makes me more conscious to weave a story within and between shorts. I hit a realization over the last 2 years with my content. I was spending 3-8 hours editing a 5-10 minute restaurant review that would get maybe 200-300 views. I can tell the same story in 4-5 under 30 second shorts that take me 1 hour to edit total and reach a total of 50k pairs of eyes across multiple platforms. Are those viewers as sticky, absolutely not, but if this math starts to not work out, I still gained some skills out of it. I haven't abandoned long form at all. I'm learning multiple formats because I think that's going to be important to understand what audience distractions we're up against.

[@showtale8325]

Well said. It's just another avenue. I also think making shorts than at least pop a thousand views on KZbin and 3 thousand on Facebook another thousand on Instagram reels is worth the time. I'm not anywhere near you tube monetization on shorts or long. But since I started adding a short or two daily. I see my reach overall has expanded exponentially. At least I can say to potential sponsors or affiliated that I can reach x number of eyeballs daily. The real money comes from an expanded footprint overall in social media as a creator

[@ozarkmixdj]

Time yourself again. Be honest. I GUARANTEE it takes you longer to edit them than 1 hour. Folks, Pat is 💯 correct here. Play the long game.

[@showtale8325]

@@ozarkmixdj there's no way I'm spending more than 30 minutes to an hour editing a 30 seconds shorts. You must just believe whatever you're told

[@showtale8325]

@@ozarkmixdj the point is he is telling you to ignore 80 % of the action on you tube because you don't have a few minutes to chop a piece of long form content into little nuggets?.

[@ozarkmixdj]

@@showtale8325 Nope, that's not what he is saying at all. He's saying you can't depend on short form content to drive long term results. I'm saying if you are only focusing on short form and editing them well, thinking through scripting, etc instead of chopping up long form, you'll spend alot more time than you think and waste time.

[@CraigsTechTalk]

I really appreciate your point of view on shorts. I have struggled to get into any kind shorts groove. But I really like and prefer long form. Thanks for sharing this.

[@Frestidi]

Pat, thanks for the clear analogy and talking about shorts. On my YT channels shorts have lowest ROI. Ignoring RPM’s. It seems the typical shorts enthusiast is wildly volatile especially when compared to other viewer groups (example: live stream & video engagement).

[@HowardWimshurst]

What do you think about using short form as a gateway to get viewers into the long form version of the video? I've been trying to put up a yt short at the same time as I upload a full video

[@WillChousThoughts]

Thanks Pat. Watched the whole thing. I've been doing a lot of short form on two of my channels. I see how fast people go from 0 to 1M followers so been doing a lot of almost daily short form since I am basically not getting views anyways so might as well build. I think I may just resume some more long-form for what the reasons mentioned. Wont quit short form though

[@Lifebyclairevlogs]

Well said Pat. Finally people are starting to say what I’ve been thinking since the start!

[@tonsepai]

brilliant - needed to hear that today @pat

[@JoanMBlake]

Thank you Pat. This is exactly where I am going now.

[@TheMentalHealthToolbox]

Solid! As always. Thanks Pat! 🙏

[@CoolWorldVideo]

Agreed! I will focus on long videos more’ thanks for sharing

[@pokematteus2514]

Very insightful Pat (As usual). I am definitely always disappointed and frustrated with shorts. Now it makes sense. I think it is messing up our society as a whole in general. Good ok microwave society, consuming fast food, fast content, fast (fill in the blank) and then we wonder why we have absolutely no attention span, and need everything now now now.

[@End.Mass-Incarceration.Project]

Valid points Pat. I agree.

[@iamlashawnda]

Thank you! I have been trying to tell people this. Long Form is the way to go!

[@LesterDiaz]

I did an experiment on this, posted 30 consecutive shorts for 30 days after posting only long-form for years. The results were disappointing to say the least.

[@BackyardMaine]

I agree with you Pat. I started creating shorts for discovery and to drive traffic to my long form content and although I have gained millions of views and thousands of subscribers, I don't see the conversion working very well at all. I also think that when my shorts a gaining 100k + views a day my long form content suffers. I think I'm done with shorts for now and I'll focus on long form only. I may still make 1-2 minute videos on TikTok because they pay out much better than the shorts there as well.

[@thermant8452]

Interesting stuff right here. I'm not a youchube creator (yet), but I do consume a lot and I've actually found shorts to be extremely useful and entertaining, but not something that drives me to subscribe. I subscribe to really helpful, non-short creators/content. To Pat's point, the shorts definitely feel like door-to-door Halloween candy.

[@chaiandcoaching]

So good. Thanks for the insights Pat! 🙌☕️

[@jjbones]

Great video. Thanks Pat.

[@leonahussey]

I link the food analogy. 🙂

[@KevinCrowe]

That snack/meal analogy is fantastic.

[@ruthohams]

I absolutely enjoyed watching this video. And I 💯 agree with you

[@CaliLifeTCG]

It’s facts I see a lot of short video content creators with 1mill subs or like 200k subs going live and having only 30 20 people in that live ima gonna grind the live streams as much as I can fam bam 💥 thanks pat for the advice

[@barbiefigueroa]

I totally see short form as the Costco Lady that gives you a sample… most people take the sample and walk away to the next free sample. Occasionally some will take her coupon and go down the aisle to buy the full box. Very rarely have I ever scrolled through shorts and have gone to subscribe to the main channel… And then sometimes, I noticed, that you’ll never see that short form creator again because of the way the way the algorithm works and I end up forgetting about them. And sometimes in a weird way… I feel I’m being trained to only consume the short and then don’t have the patience to watch a full video from the same creator… If I do go to their channel and they have long form videos But I’ll watch 15-30 minute videos from long form content creators like no big deal. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out moving forward. I do feel strongly that it’s about building loyalty and long term relationships and our investment of time into a persons content is one of those ways to do that. Great video. I’m glad I’m not the only one who feels this way. 🙏

[@MarioBekes]

Very well said!

[@MarkSavant]

Epic thumbnail bro! Love the message!

[@kobecollects]

Pat i haven't been "not busy" for 3 years. I had the realization that my life is only going to get busier.. so im doing something wrong with my organization and planning. Could you please share a video on day planning, organizing and general things to make things more stream lined?

[@MetaMM]

Well put. Taking this msg as a divine intervention as just 2 weeks ago, I gave up long video.

[@JoeGoeMotorcycleAdventures]

Well said brother. Short form is a good entrance to get people on your channel. You just can't connect with people through short form. I feel more satisfied when I can keep someone watching 5 or 10 minutes on a long form videos.

[@crumpetsbuttered]

Great content as always, I notice your links dont show the equipment your using. What is the Microphone your using?

[@TheRajivShow]

This is quite insightful thanks Pat!

[@VIVIDTCG]

This is so true. Eventhough shorts helped me get subscribers I ultimately would like to have long form viewership.

[@woodforklaw1529]

Finally! an expert creator makes a definitive statement about short-form videos. It's hard to find an expert who doesn't hedge their expert advice on the subject of short-form effectiveness.

[@carlospetitgaitan6541]

Many many many thanks!

[@NuriaHidalgo]

I absolutely agree 👍🏼

[@MoBarclay]

You do it to build and scale your brand. Not everything you do is to make money in that exact moment. You need to do both eventually, but don't exclude the platform and length Gen Z loves.

[@goatmotivationquotes]

thanks much Mr Pat

[@wafa7817]

Totally agree with you

[@sidehustle_socialHeather]

Great information here Pat as always! I do wonder though that many say if they were to start over today they'd start on TikTok -- I find it is easy to get burnt out there. Do you think starting on YT is a better plan than TT in todays environment?

[@monsieurbbq]

I agree !!!

[@elizabethadahl]

I like to think of short form content as marketing for the creator's long form content!

[@Amilcardelvillar]

Thanks for this.

[@CoachKotseba]

snack vs meal - what a wonderful metaphor! 👏

[@8bitrich849]

The most frustrating part of short form is you can't fast forward to get to the point. So many pointless videos that make me never want to follow. The quality of short form videos is lacking for the most part and each one (at least Instagram and Facebook reels) seems to be a copy of some other short with no added value. I normally skip or leave after 10-15 secs if it doesn't seem worth the time.

[@kylecervantes5111]

ya i agry

[@GeologyDude]

Many short form videos have low quality information. I know it will never pay by KZbin. But it brings new subscribers to new channels-which is important. Also, vertical video is the dominant venue for cell phones and foreign countries. That’s 80% of my audience. Therefore it is important to me at this point in my new channel-focused on growth

[@SaroDogTraining]

As a creator and educator, I feel that I can't provide proper information or content using shorts. In my industry (dog training) a short video is like here is a quick tip which I am completely against it because a dog and a dog owner don't learn things quickly. It takes time to learn something and a long-form video can help with that. I don't enjoy creating shorts but I was doing it because of peer presure. Everybody is doing it and is saying to do it so I've been making shorts. Now, I am going to stop it because what you shared makes so much sense. Thank you.

[@scottsimnz]

I wouldn’t stop it completely! I would create a strategy to help you simplify your short form creation process and try to help drive that traffic to your long form. There’s opportunity in short form and sometimes you will get a lucky pop, which could gain you a few hundred (or thousand even) long form viewership.

[@SaroDogTraining]

@@scottsimnz Thank you. I will. Once a week, I make few shorts for the week and upload one a day. I have a massive library of long-form videos which I use to make teh shorts.

[@StevetheBartender_]

I appreciate this video! 😍

[@MadisonPhillipsOfficial]

I believe it can be smart depending on the reason for doing shorts. It has different reasons. Mine are to get subscribers of people that would like to get some inspiration. Getting subs gets me closer for one step closer to my goals.

[@HyerLearning]

Excellent analogy … Halloween candy vs favorite meal at the best restaurant 😊

[@jollyjames30]

The problem with long form content is that I'm watching a bunch of fluff that's primarily to fill out a video for the sake of getting as many possible ad views. 90% of the time, a person can easily get to the point within a matter of 1 or 2 minutes but instead they just extend the video because it pays more. I don't always feel like sitting there watching a 20 minute video which is mostly filler content. And if we're using our data plan, who wants to waste it from watching long videos?

[@patflynn]

What if the videos you create were worth watching 🤯

[@patflynn]

But yeah, your point is valid but as a creator, don’t make the long video that’s long just to make it long, make it worth watching even if it is long.

[@mrjohnbaseley]

Depth of field F1.2 video. Love it.

[@TerryWadeThompson]

Great video Pat. Long form video is where it's at. Some of the biggest creators are reaching more people with longer videos that are even upwards of 3-4 hours.

[@froknowsphoto]

EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@solomomstalktv]

Best advice, bar none❤❤

[@mattbertolino]

Both is the way

[@AliWall]

In my second channel I have posted short videos every day for about two months and I still post long videos. I can say that none of those shorts viewers are going to watch long videos. I really planing to give up on shorts and post more long videos.

[@TheRecipeWorldwide]

This is what everyone who hates short form wants to hear. Get with the program and do both.

[@kathycoleman4648]

I'm doing anime season coverage. I have 5 shows I do six to ten minute videos for each week, and 5 more that are getting "Five Quick Thought" shorts since I want to say something, but can't cover ten shows in long form properly. I'm doing my stuff as a hobby, so this may apply differently.

[@normchristopherson5799]

Pat, we miss your videos. Hope you are well.

[@nicolehernandez11]

As someone who is new to creating content on KZbin. I’m working on creating more long form and short content that converts to long form. The higher views on the shorts keep me motivated. Not looking at the shorts for the $, but I get subs from the shorts and keeps me going as I learn how to better my long form.

[@palabrasdesanidad]

I am doing the same, die to the fact I have not 1000 subs yet.

[@jjbones]

@@palabrasdesanidad Me too but I would like KZbin to let us know that we can "sample" short content to make long content. The algorithm doesn't seem to like duplicate video footage. Plus they have only encouraged long format creators to "sample" content to make shorts. Y'all ask the creator support team...I ask too!

[@palabrasdesanidad]

@@jjbones good point ✅ I'll do it. Thanks 🙏

[@maturityinc]

Great Info!!!

[@MichaelWilliams-lo3ix]

True Pat

[@AQ-uc4bb]

Sounds great.,

[@dankelly]

For business minded creators, the primary reason to use Shorts is to drive viewers to long form videos.

[@emanuelturis4132]

Or to website/landing page.

[@ChanpreetSpeaks]

I agree

[@scottsimnz]

Couldn’t agree more. I think there’s opportunity to gain trust with short form, but I believe people are chasing views and no building relationships with their viewers.

[@Eddierath]

Yes very true.

[@AshtonJoe]

I agree, but at the same time, how many people who are watching something on short-form - searching for quick dopamine hits - are actually committing themselves to then go watch a 15-minute video on KZbin? I know these people exist bc I’m one of them, but for the majority, I think the whole “repurpose to drive traffic to longer form” approach is difficult.

[@UrbanNoizeMusic]

Aaryn also has long form content on KZbin as well. But good point made

[@shaunjbaird1]

I agree on the long form, but surely all these new things that crop up can be utilised to attract new audiences then those folks start do watch your long form

[@patflynn]

When you watch random shorts that pop up on your feed, do you feel the desire to click their profile and then watch a 20 minute video of theirs, or swipe up to the next short video?

[@shaunjbaird1]

@@patflynn admittedly I swipe. Good point.. did notice an optical in subscribers recently after doing 1a day. Thanks for the reply

[@AliexFolgueira]

100% agreed

[@BlackNoteStudios]

Never liked short form video. I’d rather go deeper and develop a relationship with my audience. Much love Pat.

[@BlackNoteStudios]

@Pat Flynn No. What you are doing is not making this world a better place to live in, quite the opposite. You can do better with you life than scamming. You are being used.

[@Bobert-Rob]

Funny, when it comes to views, I'm having the exact opposite effect. I've been on KZbin for 16 years, and for 15 of those years, I've been struggling. Well, 13 really, because the first couple years I was doing well. Then I struggled, lost my audience, and I've been trying to build back interest in my content. I'm an animator, it was difficult to produce quality content fast enough. Long story short, I've been experimenting with producing shorts heavily since last fall and I've actually grown more of an audience doing that than I did from 15 years of doing long-form content. I will admit that the audience is pretty hit or miss, especially since barely any of them will go on to watch the long-form videos. I've seen an increase in long-form views compared to what it was, but it's generally still incredibly low. I'm lucky to get anywhere near what you'd expect a channel with my sub-count to get. Also, I have absolutely NO long-form video that brings in regular money, whereas I have at least 5 shorts that regularly get tens of thousands of views a day. They only earn one or two dollars at best, but still, a majority of whatever little money I earn is currently using short-form content. I'd love it if they'd watch the longer form content, especially since my shortform work is just the longer cartoons chopped up in 15 - 20 second segments. They usually consist of one or two individual jokes from the cartoon as a sort of advertisement for the longer content. Links posted everywhere in the video. But I can't force anyone to do anything, and simply making long-form only will only result in me continuing to be ignored. Shortform may not be the best content to make solely, but I honestly feel these days the best strategy is to do both. It's too easy for long-form videos to be buried if they don't immediately do well.

[@Lou_Mansfield]

Interesting perspective. I agree because your channel is more entertainment than education, so the attention span is completely opposite than Pat's audience. Unfortunately you're competing with Netflix and video games, and they are on the same content hamster wheel as you.

[@xavermooshammer4816]

Makes a lot of sense. My favorite KZbinr doing this "right" is _keyush, the stuntdog_. Now, any recent take on "long" as in this one (7 min) vs "long" as in 30 min++? Me, I seem to have that "sounds interesting but too long for now. maybe later" reaction to anything over 15min. 20 maybe...

[@lelanacroft]

I prefer long form for information and short for entertainment. When I’m using KZbin or any video searching for information on a topic I don’t bother with short form. I want information and lots of it. But if I just want to laugh or come down from TOO MUCH information I’ll do some shorts like kitties just to get some fun into my day

[@SalmaJafri]

Wow, that's quite the position Pat. Using Shorts for business ultimately needs to be tied to a business and income strategy (and Im not talking about adsense) Although I do have to challenge one thing you said in this video: about shorts disappearing after publishing. I'm seeing views on my shorts coming in from Search, and they've been very consistent the last 6 months. I too was surprised to see the staying power of certain shorts. I will be continuing to create both long form videos and continue experimenting with shorts. I'm also launching a shorts only channel (in a different niche) with an income plan that doesn't revolve around adsense. We'll see what happens :)

[@oneeyedphotographer]

There's at least one Chrome extension that blocks shorts. To me, that says there's a lot of people that don't like them. Me? I'm autistic. They are just annoying. I think I have watched maybe three.

[@patflynn]

Thanks Salma! I appreciate your take on this. Search is something that is new to short form and I’m glad there’s some more staying power there, and I do hope I’m wrong with some of this but I just have a gut feeling about the LTV and ROI with work put in that short form is def going to change and it doesn’t point to for the better. Again, this video is meant to start this discussion and allow us to share our opinions together, so I appreciate your side of it too.

[@TopFlightFamily]

So timely. I def feel like short form content bubble is about to burst. I give it another 6-12 months. Also did you see the Nas Daily tweet about how little he makes from the platforms despite his massive views? Yes, part of that is he has a large proportion of non-US viewers. But also, it’s that he (as far as I know) exclusively makes short-form content.

[@maricelp116]

If you want to create awareness or promotions short form videos are helpful

[@thedanielbudai]

Interesting perspective

[@goingsocial]

interesting perspective.

[@seanblackwellbipolar]

Whew! Thank you for confirming my suspicions! While everyone is telling me that shorts are where it's at, my first few experiences were like, "All this effort, for what?"

[@claired3038]

OMG How I missed watching your videos...

[@LaviniaLathamJD]

As a small KZbinr, I feel confused with what to focus on. KZbin shorts make sense for increased views and maybe even subscribers, but long-form will always work the best! Here's my question Pat, should we stop making short-form content if we want to build a community? 🤔

[@sexymary]

Create a long-form, then repurpose/chop 'em into a bunch of shorts.

[@orestes1984]

I love Leon the lobster.

[@ShaferScott]

Ya I’ve had bad experiences with shorts. Almost none of the subscribers from shorts would ever watch any if the long form content. So they appear as uninterested viewers of my normal content and confuse the algorithm

[@mrswagg22music]

I want to get baack to long form tho esp being a singer i like to sing the whole damn song!!

[@ResaleRenegade]

And that's the last we ever heard from Pat.....

[@darrensurrey]

Yep, I'm only doing shorts through a lens of how it can help my business by helping my viewers. But then I'm not doing entertaining stuff.

[@pokebronxakaunclerico]

Amazing always thumbs up 👍 happy Easter 🐰🐣🐇 everyone around the world 🌎 🙏🏼 DPM 4 life ❤

[@BilvaskBornholm]

If You do b2b it can be a succes! Image how many buisnesses that dont have short content, and make a visible to customers

[@kk-by9wq]

The difference is that you can make many more than long form

[@melanieklarofficial]

Doesn't short form lead people to your long form videos if you put links to long form videos in the comments? If you just make quick shorts and aren't spending much time on it then it doesn't hurt right?